My mistake with "Heavy Lifting"...
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I think the OP is right. There is a difference between moving weight, even with proper form, and moving the weight focusing in the muscles you are working on.
If you're skeptical, try it on your next workout. It really does work.
I am not skeptical, just baffled that people aren't doing this to begin with. How can you not focus on the muscles you are using? What are you focusing on?
Of course, that might explain why all those guys at the gym are looking skyward while squatting. They are not focusing on the muscles, they are praying to the Squat God to move the weight for them.
Huh, I should try that. Do I need a ritual sacrifice to the squat gods too?0 -
Not sure what's up with all the skepticism, I know exactly what you mean. Basically, in the past you were just worried about performing the task and not necessarily isolating your muscles when working out. I'm guilty of this and now realize when I'm just going through the motions instead of actually working my muscles. When you slow down and actually focus on the particular workout you are doing, you can pay more attention to specific muscles.0
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I get the impression they are separating the two as well. The problem I have with that is they are inherently linked. You can't have good form if you don't have controlled movements. If you aren't controlling the weight on its way down and its way up then you don't have good form. If you are then you do have good form. If you do have good form then you are hitting the appropriate muscles.
I think I may have figured part of it out... I think the OP and a few here are separating "good form" and "controlled movements".. maybe.
Moving weight is the method we use to force our muscles to work. If you have proper form and you are consistent with your workouts then you are doing both well. The formula is Good Diet, Consistent Workouts with good form, adequate rest. There are no other ingredients.
But I always thought 'controlled movements' IS part of me having good form.
Your muscles will work to lift weight and as you do this over time your muscles become conditioned to do the work and therefore they get better at it. If you have good form you don't really have any choice about whether or not you are using your muscles. This is so fundamental I can't believe there are actually people that disagree with it.0 -
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I am not skeptical, just baffled that people aren't doing this to begin with. How can you not focus on the muscles you are using? What are you focusing on?
Of course, that might explain why all those guys at the gym are looking skyward while squatting. They are not focusing on the muscles, they are praying to the Squat God to move the weight for them.
Compound lifts are a bit harder to think of this concept IMO. I have heard Ian McCarthy (I know he is easy to hate lol) talk about the original subject in terms of isolation exercises. Say something like a bicep curl, or if you hate curls think of a one arm dumbbell row. A lot of people will have perfect "form" but they will focus on their hands pulling the weight up. His contention is you should be thinking purely about the muscles you want activated.
I am sure for many people it is second nature to focus on the working muscles, but until I had heard the way he explained it I didn't think of it consciously.
I am VERY new to lifting, but I have to add to this. I think that the OP's point was why my trainer has me doing a "pre exhaustion" type work out. Several isolation exercises for a particular muscle group before going to the compound moves. The idea (according to him) being that you exhaust the smaller muscles, to force the larger to really engage when you do the compound move. It appears to be working very well for me! I've been at it a month, and while not really losing lbs, I am getting a lot of feedback on my shape changing quickly. So, there's my two cents.0 -
Yes! Sometimes lowering the weight (I think that's what you said you did) produces better muscle fiber recruitment. When we lift too heavy, we're not always activating the muscles, because the failsafe mechanism that prevents us from easily tearing muscles from tendons activates and reduces the tension/recruitment to keep shearing forces at bay.0
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The whole idea of being 'mindful' and focusing on the muscles is just a product of not having the proper form in the first place. The OP has said in this thread that she was doing the 'proper form' but just 'using whatever muscle to push the weight' - I'm paraphrasing here. In my opinion, that is actually not proper form at all. If this idea of being mindful of your muscle groups helps you to achieve proper form, then more power to you if that's what works for you. But it's not some kind of magical distinction, it's just semantics. You weren't using the proper form until you stopped thinking of the mechanics of keeping your butt out, chest out, etc. But does that mean those 3 years were a waste? No, because it taught you the mechanics and repetition and discipline that you needed.0
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"THINK ABOUT THE MUSCLES YOU ARE TRAINING" -Jillian Michaels. I think Jillian knows a thing or two. Sounds like you're doing the right thing : )0
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"THINK ABOUT THE MUSCLES YOU ARE TRAINING" -Jillian Michaels. I think Jillian knows a thing or two. Sounds like you're doing the right thing : )
Yes but Jillian Micheals has blatantly stated that it is psychological. She said that is people would just get out of their own way their bodies would be able to go so much further.0 -
Meh, I think for some of us, it doesn't come so naturally to think about the muscles. I tend to think about the weight. This thread was timely.0
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Perhaps that is what you are saying but that is not what everyone has been saying. Sure you do whatever you have to do to get in to the right mindset to get your workout done. But in reality diet,exercise with proper form and rest actually do matter regardless of what is going on in your head.
You made the point. Thank you. It's all mental. that's what were saying. Think about it.
Yes but Jillian Micheals has blatantly stated that it is psychological. She said that is people would just get out of their own way their bodies would be able to go so much further."THINK ABOUT THE MUSCLES YOU ARE TRAINING" -Jillian Michaels. I think Jillian knows a thing or two. Sounds like you're doing the right thing : )
In my mind it makes no sense to say that you can have proper form and not hit the proper muscles. If thinking about the muscle is a prerequisite for you to have proper form then more power to you I guess.0 -
I heard these type of things when I would do her DVD's. Her point was to go slow, control the muscle, not just flail about with the heaviest weight you can find. Of course you can't just think your muscles bigger..duh. If that's what people get out of this girls post then they are reading way to much into it. It's hard enough to stand in a gym in front of a mirror hoping that guys aren't judging your form (because none of your sacrifice form for weight...eye roll). At least she is admitting that she had made a mistake and is willing to correct it. I applaud her efforts.
Perhaps that is what you are saying but that is not what everyone has been saying. Sure you do whatever you have to do to get in to the right mindset to get your workout done. But in reality diet,exercise with proper form and rest actually do matter regardless of what is going on in your head.
You made the point. Thank you. It's all mental. that's what were saying. Think about it.
Yes but Jillian Micheals has blatantly stated that it is psychological. She said that is people would just get out of their own way their bodies would be able to go so much further."THINK ABOUT THE MUSCLES YOU ARE TRAINING" -Jillian Michaels. I think Jillian knows a thing or two. Sounds like you're doing the right thing : )
In my mind it makes no sense to say that you can have proper form and not hit the proper muscles. If thinking about the muscle is a prerequisite for you to have proper form then more power to you I guess.0 -
I think the OP is right. There is a difference between moving weight, even with proper form, and moving the weight focusing in the muscles you are working on.
If you're skeptical, try it on your next workout. It really does work.
Your right, this whole time squatting I was thinking about my biceps. My quads just grew 2 inches.0 -
I am VERY new to lifting, but I have to add to this. I think that the OP's point was why my trainer has me doing a "pre exhaustion" type work out. Several isolation exercises for a particular muscle group before going to the compound moves. The idea (according to him) being that you exhaust the smaller muscles, to force the larger to really engage when you do the compound move.
Your big compounds require the most energy and focus, why would you waste it on Isolating exercises first?
That would be like exhausting your shoulders and hips and then deciding to do some snatchs with tired shoulders and hips, it sounds dangerous and stupid.
And trust me all your larger muscles really are engaged when you do the lift. If there weren't you wouldn't be walking.0 -
So basically, you were lifting like a powerlifter versus lifting like a bodybuilder. That's all you had to say.
One focuses primarily on moving as much weight as possible and one focuses on aesthetics. Similar but different. All depends on your goals.
Thats not all she had to say
This thread wasn't for people who know everything about lifting, and that includes knowing the difference between powerlifting, and bodybuilding. I for example got a lot from the thread and wouldn't have if she had said just what you just did. So thanks to the OP for not assuming we already know everything
QFT :flowerforyou:0 -
When I lift, I am focused on form, breathing, and keeping my core tight. Focusing on my form IS focusing on my muscles.0
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I'm glad you figured it out, but the importance of thinking about what you're doing, keep tension at certain points of the movement, flexing, stretching, etc., is included in the instructions for exercises, as well as whether you should be moving slowing or pushing up or out with great speed (usually without locking your joints).0
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When I lift, I am focused on form, breathing, and keeping my core tight. Focusing on my form IS focusing on my muscles.
Me, too. I always find it funny when people who do exercises like Pilates act as if people who strength train do it mindlessly. It's hardly grunt grunt and drop the weight.0 -
When I lift, I am focused on form, breathing, and keeping my core tight. Focusing on my form IS focusing on my muscles.
Me, too. I always find it funny when people who do exercises like Pilates act as if people who strength train do it mindlessly. It's hardly grunt grunt and drop the weight.
OP here. Read my post and the other posts throught the thread.
My *form* was the same. What I was doing was focusing on doing the rep and moving the weight with said form. What I wasn't focusing on was intentionally contracting and using each muscle to its fullest.
Cheers! 0 -
When I lift, I am focused on form, breathing, and keeping my core tight. Focusing on my form IS focusing on my muscles.
Me, too. I always find it funny when people who do exercises like Pilates act as if people who strength train do it mindlessly. It's hardly grunt grunt and drop the weight.
OP here. Read my post and the other posts throught the thread.
My *form* was the same. What I was doing was focusing on doing the rep and moving the weight with said form. What I wasn't focusing on was intentionally contracting and using each muscle to its fullest.
Cheers!
I did read it your first post. I and others didn't understand what you meant. We tried to be helpful and respond to your question. No, I didn't have that problem.0 -
When I lift, I am focused on form, breathing, and keeping my core tight. Focusing on my form IS focusing on my muscles.
Me, too. I always find it funny when people who do exercises like Pilates act as if people who strength train do it mindlessly. It's hardly grunt grunt and drop the weight.
OP here. Read my post and the other posts throught the thread.
My *form* was the same. What I was doing was focusing on doing the rep and moving the weight with said form. What I wasn't focusing on was intentionally contracting and using each muscle to its fullest.
Cheers!
I did read it your first post. I and others didn't understand what you meant. We tried to be helpful and respond to your question. No, I didn't have that problem.
I was referring to my post on page 4. If you got nothing out of it, then it's whatever. To be clear I never said anything about "mind-muscle" connection, telepathic lifting and so on.0 -
I'm glad you figured it out, but the importance of thinking about what you're doing, keep tension at certain points of the movement, flexing, stretching, etc., is included in the instructions for exercises, as well as whether you should be moving slowing or pushing up or out with great speed (usually without locking your joints).
Yes, this is extremely helpful.0 -
When I lift, I am focused on form, breathing, and keeping my core tight. Focusing on my form IS focusing on my muscles.
When I do oblique twists on cable crossover machine, I'm paying attention to NOT swivel my hips. I don't even notice my obliques until DOMS, if at all.0 -
Thanks for posting this! I'm still pretty new to heavy listing and I'm sure this'll be helpful advice!0
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Bump.0
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"THINK ABOUT THE MUSCLES YOU ARE TRAINING" -Jillian Michaels. I think Jillian knows a thing or two. Sounds like you're doing the right thing : )
i stopped reading at jillian as she is full of hogwash ..with all due respect...0 -
BUMP0
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I'm glad you figured it out, but the importance of thinking about what you're doing, that is, keeping tension at certain points of the movement, flexing, stretching, etc., is included in the instructions for exercises, as well as whether you should be moving slowly or pushing up or out with great speed (usually without locking your joints).
Yes, this is extremely helpful.
I fixed the typos.0 -
When I lift, I am focused on form, breathing, and keeping my core tight. Focusing on my form IS focusing on my muscles.
Me, too. I always find it funny when people who do exercises like Pilates act as if people who strength train do it mindlessly. It's hardly grunt grunt and drop the weight.
OP here. Read my post and the other posts throught the thread.
My *form* was the same. What I was doing was focusing on doing the rep and moving the weight with said form. What I wasn't focusing on was intentionally contracting and using each muscle to its fullest.
Cheers!
I did read it your first post. I and others didn't understand what you meant. We tried to be helpful and respond to your question. No, I didn't have that problem.
I was referring to my post on page 4. If you got nothing out of it, then it's whatever. To be clear I never said anything about "mind-muscle" connection, telepathic lifting and so on.
I didn't use those terms either. With a six-page topic, I don't have time to read every page. I responded to your original post.0
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