Why do people overeat and/or become obese? Is it harder than average for some to lose weight?

JaneSnowe

On different threads I've seen people saying that weight loss is more complex than CICO. I don't think they all mean that CICO doesn't work (though a few do); I suspect they're trying to say that, for them, either Calories In is harder to limit or that Calories Out is harder to achieve than for the average person.

On a recent thread this topic came to the forefront, but so as to not derail that thread --and also to give people with a different perspective on CICO than what is typical on MFP a chance to speak their minds-- I've decided to move the conversation here.

The post that sparked this thread is:

Why are they eating so much? What drives the desire and need to consume extra calories than needed? Casually pointing out that people who have trouble losing weight "are eating too much" isn't helping people identify why.

The topics up for discussion are exactly what's in the title.

Here is a link that one person provided to explain why "put down the fork" is overly simplistic advice for some people. I thought it would make a good starting point.

https://medium.com/@dannylennon/why-do-we-overeat-homeostatic-vs-non-homeostatic-eating-1d2e8e33ddce#.63y2auqhy

zyxst

I know when I eat too much, it's because food tastes good and I want to eat. I also prefer to do activities at my computer, aka sitting on my butt 16 hours a day.

Not sure if that's the answer the person wanted, but that's how it is with me.

ETA 12 "So"s. lel

sashayoung72

For me I have no "off" switch, and RARELY do I want to eat because I'm hungry. I want food because I desire the taste. I eat QUANTITY because it's there. If I go to a fast food joint it's always order the large. Large coke, large ice cream, large sandwich, it's like I have this fear that i might not get enough.
I belong to the clean plate club. EVEN NOW, if I figure up my calories by golly full or not i'm gonna EAT IT ALL. and even now, writing this KNOWING what I need to change, as I eat that food I forget everything I learned, though of, understand. I have eaten it all and it didn't click. Now the Losing part or calories out doesn't seem hard for me but I have to put alot of thought into it, and i'll never be someone at goal who just keeps it off without tracking.

paulgads82

Thousands of years of refining foods into something that is an incredible experience. Food is just too good in the 21st Century. Combine this with a biological urge to eat whenever we can.

SezxyStef

you will have as many answers as there are people.

and that is why it really does come down to CICO.

You figure out why you are overweight aka why do you overeat...you fix that...lose weight using CICO.

until you figure out why you eat to excess you can't lose the weight and maintain it...you can lose it but you will continue on the old patterns and regain it.

or

turn to something else that is as damaging.

mamadon

I think whether you lose, maintain or gain has everything to do with CICO purely from a physical standpoint. The "why" people either over or under eat is more complicated and I don't think it can be explained in a cookie cutter way. Some people develop eating disorders in part due to a distorted body image. Some people become over weight or obese, because they "eat their emotions" Some people simply don't understand CICO. Some people develop bad eating habits such as mindlessly eating while reading or watching tv. I don't necessarily feel it is harder for one person or another to lose weight. I just feel it depends on their knowledge of CICO and their own awareness of why they over eat in the first place and how ready and committed they are.

janejellyroll

I love large portions, I love calorie-dense food, I find it easy to eat when I am offered something appealing (even when I am not physically hungry).

None of these things make it physically harder for me to lose weight, although I find they do require some emotional attention. The combination of the three is how I wound up with extra weight (and why I think it would come back pretty quickly if I quit counting calories).

"Put down the fork" wasn't overly-simplistic for me. It was literally a description of what I needed to do. My general food guidelines -- plan meals the day before, no second helpings, consider carefully what tempting foods I bring into the house -- are designed to counter what caused my weight gain.

I don't think my experience is universal, but I think it is common.

alyssa_rest

I don't know if there is a right answer. One thing I've learned through my own struggle and research is that your body craves nutrients. When it feels as though it is lacking one, it demands more. When you have had what is required, you become full. That is why eating one chicken breast and steamed veggies will fill you up quicker and for a longer time period than indulging in an entire bag of chips. Doesn't mean it tastes better though, haha! CICO does work. It's scientifically proven and no one can argue that. I think that many people are totally unaware of how effective it is. And yes, you can eat "healthy foods" all you want. It is easy to even over-eat what's deemed as "healthy" as well. Those uneducated on CICO don't understand that. Or maybe they even don't WANT to understand.

sashayoung72

alyssa_rest wrote: »

I don't know if there is a right answer. One thing I've learned through my own struggle and research is that your body craves nutrients. When it feels as though it is lacking one, it demands more. When you have had what is required, you become full. That is why eating one chicken breast and steamed veggies will fill you up quicker and for a longer time period than indulging in an entire bag of chips. Doesn't mean it tastes better though, haha! CICO does work. It's scientifically proven and no one can argue that. I think that many people are totally unaware of how effective it is. And yes, you can eat "healthy foods" all you want. It is easy to even over-eat what's deemed as "healthy" as well. Those uneducated on CICO don't understand that. Or maybe they even don't WANT to understand.

see I beg to differ because I eat the healthier foods, I love veggies etc, WHAT I CRAVE is the complete opposite, i CRAVE the ice cream, the salty chips and other so called non-healthy food.

kommodevaran

I was brought up on large portions and second (and third) helpings; I was coaxed to eat myself stuffed and praised for doing so - only recently I remembered how tense the eating situation used to be (as in, my mother would get angry and sometimes even weep), until I started to get very full (she would pick up cues), and my mother was cheerful again. Kids were supposed to clean their plate, even if someone else had piled up.

In adolescence I figured out that I needed large portions, because I managed to eat large portions. Serving sizes on food packages was some wartime rationing hogwash. Oh, and I could never be slim/thin, because of my build.

As an adult, it never occoured to me that I could plan my meaIs, because I never knew how much I would "need". I imagined cooking smaller amounts would never work, it would just scorch, or something. So I always prepared a little extra. And because I hate throwing out food, I always ate more than I really wanted, past stuffed. (I still had to throw away a lot.)

That was food. Sweets and snacks was another story. My mother, being diabetic, was afraid of sugar, and tried to make us kids think that we didn't like sweet stuff. This just made it more desirable, of course, and started guilt-ridden quests to obtain it. Sneaking started in early adolescence. Regular overeating not until I was an adult.

Trying to lose weight with the usual high fiber, vegetable rich, low fat plans of the 90's. I was highly motivated and lost almost 50 pounds, but the tasteless food and rigid and arbitrary rules encouraged nothing but rebellion. I needed fat, taste and texture, and the colorful aisles in the grocery store had it all.

I really don't understand why I got only barely obese.

moe0303

I don't really see how this thread won't end up here anyway, so I'm going to go ahead and throw it out there:

In some (or many) cases, people are afflicted with a compulsion/addiction/condition/whatever-term-that-won't-cause-mental-anguish-to-people. I believe that there is both a physical and mental component to this.

The physical is that there is an abnormal reaction to the effects of certain behaviors and or experiences (such as overeating and/or eating highly palatable foods). This reaction manifests in a phenomenal craving. Once the craving is triggered, it cannot be satisfied.

The mental aspect is an obsession with the behavior or experience. They are inexplicably drawn to attempt normal consumption even if they have proven an inability to do so in the past. No matter their level of commitment or the seriousness of their situation (i.e. you'll have to get your leg amputated if you can't get this under control), they will trigger the craving again.

Basically it boils down to this, they can't stop once they've started and they can't stop themselves from starting.

ETA: @JaneSnowe let me know if you don't want the thread to be another addiction debate and I'll delete my comment.

SezxyStef

moe0303 wrote: »

I don't really see how this thread won't end up here anyway, so I'm going to go ahead and throw it out there:

In some (or many) cases, people are afflicted with a compulsion/addiction/condition/whatever-term-that-won't-cause-mental-anguish-to-people. I believe that there is both a physical and mental component to this.

The physical is that there is an abnormal reaction to the effects of certain behaviors and or experiences (such as overeating and/or eating highly palatable foods). This reaction manifests in a phenomenal craving. Once the craving is triggered, it cannot be satisfied.

The mental aspect is an obsession with the behavior or experience. They are inexplicably drawn to attempt normal consumption even if they have proven an inability to do so in the past. No matter their level of commitment or the seriousness of their situation (i.e. you'll have to get your leg amputated if you can't get this under control), they will trigger the craving again.

Basically it boils down to this, they can't stop once they've started and they can't stop themselves from starting.

I don't believe this for one second.

Lack of education.

lithezebra

If we're talking about personal experience, eating carbohydrates and sugar becomes a non-ending cycle for me. If I hit my protein and fiber macros and eat moderate amounts of fat, I forget to snack, and by the end of the day often don't want dinner.

seekingdaintiness

There's a lot of misinformation out there. One big piece of it is the oft repeated "2000 calories a day is a healthy diet". That isn't true for everyone. I gained steadily on an average of 2000 healthy calories a day. I do have PCOS, but even if I didn't, smaller women can have slower metabolisms and don't necessarily need that amount of food, especially as they age.
There's a perception that everyone who becomes very overweight does so by eating fast food 2-3 times a day or otherwise eating junk, but simply by having second helpings or one snack too many over enough time, you can gain an enormous amount of weight in just a few years. Accordingly it was a real shock when I had to finally face how strictly I had to diet in order to lose. I'm still bitter about it, especially when people continue to believe I spent years pigging out constantly. But I have given up on trying to change anyone's mind. They can believe I'm a hog who stuffs my face all they want - I know it was never true.

moe0303

SezxyStef wrote: »

moe0303 wrote: »

I don't really see how this thread won't end up here anyway, so I'm going to go ahead and throw it out there:

In some (or many) cases, people are afflicted with a compulsion/addiction/condition/whatever-term-that-won't-cause-mental-anguish-to-people. I believe that there is both a physical and mental component to this.

The physical is that there is an abnormal reaction to the effects of certain behaviors and or experiences (such as overeating and/or eating highly palatable foods). This reaction manifests in a phenomenal craving. Once the craving is triggered, it cannot be satisfied.

The mental aspect is an obsession with the behavior or experience. They are inexplicably drawn to attempt normal consumption even if they have proven an inability to do so in the past. No matter their level of commitment or the seriousness of their situation (i.e. you'll have to get your leg amputated if you can't get this under control), they will trigger the craving again.

Basically it boils down to this, they can't stop once they've started and they can't stop themselves from starting.

I don't believe this for one second.

Lack of education.

That's fine.

Are you saying I lack education or the people I am talking about lack education. What education is lacking?

Gamliela

We need to respect people here. Until you have walked a mile in another person's shoes, at least try to understand there may be those who have a compulsive eating dissorder. Even if you disagree, you may be better by listening, because its doubtful you can disprove it Sexysteph. This isn't meant to be rude, I hope you can follow it along without dismissing peoples experinces.

SezxyStef

moe0303 wrote: »

SezxyStef wrote: »

moe0303 wrote: »

I don't really see how this thread won't end up here anyway, so I'm going to go ahead and throw it out there:

In some (or many) cases, people are afflicted with a compulsion/addiction/condition/whatever-term-that-won't-cause-mental-anguish-to-people. I believe that there is both a physical and mental component to this.

The physical is that there is an abnormal reaction to the effects of certain behaviors and or experiences (such as overeating and/or eating highly palatable foods). This reaction manifests in a phenomenal craving. Once the craving is triggered, it cannot be satisfied.

The mental aspect is an obsession with the behavior or experience. They are inexplicably drawn to attempt normal consumption even if they have proven an inability to do so in the past. No matter their level of commitment or the seriousness of their situation (i.e. you'll have to get your leg amputated if you can't get this under control), they will trigger the craving again.

Basically it boils down to this, they can't stop once they've started and they can't stop themselves from starting.

I don't believe this for one second.

Lack of education.

That's fine.

Are you saying I lack education or the people I am talking about lack education. What education is lacking?

I think the majority of people who are overweight/obese lack education in anything food related.

I watched an episode of my 600lb life...the guy gained weight and the doctor was asking why? the patient said "I don't know I should be losing I switched out my white bread for whole wheat"....seriously.

And based on my own experience I knew about calories from being a teenager and having my mother diet all the time...but had no clue on how to lose weight and maintain...

I could lose like a demon...but gain it back.

diet books, diet websites, diet pills, diet programs aka WW etc...all teach people how to lose but not how to maintain...

and as adults if we weren't taught about nutrition and calories how do we teach our kids??????

AlabasterVerve

All of the customs and conventions surrounding food that worked to keep us healthy and retain a normal appetite are no longer in place. And even worse we don't think they matter. Anytime is a good time to eat. Anything is a good thing to eat.

Refined carbs/ultra processed foods and eating all of the time plays havock with our hormones and has ruined our appetites. People crave food, can't go longer than a few hours without eating or the feel ill, never feel physical hunger, never feel full, have uncontrollable eating - the list of what's wrong is endless and you'll hear people talk about it over and over on these forums. All of these things are common but none of them are normal.

Snacking ruins your appetite. Cleaning your plate was encouraged because if you didn't you'd be hungry - you ate until you were full and couldn't/didn't want to eat any more. But if you were hungry that was ok. You didn't bring emergency food with you outside of the house and kids were sent to bed without dinner as a punishment. Which was absolutely fine when your appetite is working correctly and your blood sugar and hormones aren't out of whack.

Of course today that's all nonsense. Everyone one knows calories in, calories out is how you manage your weight. What you eat and when you eat doesn't matter.

moe0303

SezxyStef wrote: »

moe0303 wrote: »

SezxyStef wrote: »

moe0303 wrote: »

I don't really see how this thread won't end up here anyway, so I'm going to go ahead and throw it out there:

In some (or many) cases, people are afflicted with a compulsion/addiction/condition/whatever-term-that-won't-cause-mental-anguish-to-people. I believe that there is both a physical and mental component to this.

The physical is that there is an abnormal reaction to the effects of certain behaviors and or experiences (such as overeating and/or eating highly palatable foods). This reaction manifests in a phenomenal craving. Once the craving is triggered, it cannot be satisfied.

The mental aspect is an obsession with the behavior or experience. They are inexplicably drawn to attempt normal consumption even if they have proven an inability to do so in the past. No matter their level of commitment or the seriousness of their situation (i.e. you'll have to get your leg amputated if you can't get this under control), they will trigger the craving again.

Basically it boils down to this, they can't stop once they've started and they can't stop themselves from starting.

I don't believe this for one second.

Lack of education.

That's fine.

Are you saying I lack education or the people I am talking about lack education. What education is lacking?

I think the majority of people who are overweight/obese lack education in anything food related.

I watched an episode of my 600lb life...the guy gained weight and the doctor was asking why? the patient said "I don't know I should be losing I switched out my white bread for whole wheat"....seriously.

And based on my own experience I knew about calories from being a teenager and having my mother diet all the time...but had no clue on how to lose weight and maintain...

I could lose like a demon...but gain it back.

diet books, diet websites, diet pills, diet programs aka WW etc...all teach people how to lose but not how to maintain...

and as adults if we weren't taught about nutrition and calories how do we teach our kids??????

So, you're basically saying people with weight problems do not know lack education on how to maintain?

JaneSnowe

moe0303 wrote: »

I don't really see how this thread won't end up here anyway, so I'm going to go ahead and throw it out there:

In some (or many) cases, people are afflicted with a compulsion/addiction/condition/whatever-term-that-won't-cause-mental-anguish-to-people. I believe that there is both a physical and mental component to this.

The physical is that there is an abnormal reaction to the effects of certain behaviors and or experiences (such as overeating and/or eating highly palatable foods). This reaction manifests in a phenomenal craving. Once the craving is triggered, it cannot be satisfied.

The mental aspect is an obsession with the behavior or experience. They are inexplicably drawn to attempt normal consumption even if they have proven an inability to do so in the past. No matter their level of commitment or the seriousness of their situation (i.e. you'll have to get your leg amputated if you can't get this under control), they will trigger the craving again.

Basically it boils down to this, they can't stop once they've started and they can't stop themselves from starting.

ETA: @JaneSnowe let me know if you don't want the thread to be another addiction debate and I'll delete my comment.

I think there are people out there who believe that this happens to them and feel that it's out of their control. I think it's valid to bring this up and I'd like to hear from anyone who feels this way. I'm curious what they think would help them if CICO seems out of their control.

2essie

I have said all along that overeating has nothing to do with hunger. I think it is all in the mind. So many dieticians are saying 'drink water' to help you feel full. If you are going to a party, eat before you go. Feeling full has nothing to do with how much some people eat either on a normal day or when they go out. I could have had a meal and if someone then asked me out for another meal, I would go. Or if someone brought me a bar of chocolate, I would eat it. Nothing at all to do with being hungry or feeling full. It has nothing to do with being hungry, greedy or anything else. Until I, or someone else sorts out my brain, I will not lose weight and keep it off.

My husband is tall and slim, but if I bought him chocolate after eating a meal, he wouldn't want it. Me, on the other hand cannot reax until I have eaten it. Full or not. So, I have come to the conclusion that my brain is wired differently to my husbands. So many times he says 'No I don't want it. I'm not hungry'. That never happens to me. I crave it until I get it.

I have, by the way, lost over 30lbs but it has been very hard work and if my guard is down I slip back occasionally.