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Flu shots? For them or against ?

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  • GaleHawkins
    GaleHawkins Posts: 8,160 Member
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    TeacupsAndToning wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    perkymommy wrote: »
    KANGOOJUMPS wrote: »
    well for... of course. why put your life in any kind of sickness if you do not have to. no brainer really. I think the people that are against are just afraid of needles.

    I have no problem with needles. I have a problem with something foreign being put in to my body that I truly am not certain that's what it really is what they say it is.

    Why in the world do you think they are lying about what is in the vaccine?

    And I agree with other posters, you really should not be involved in the healthcare field with these tires of responses.

    John do you not understand the resistance to the flu shots is coming from within the healthcare profession not the unaware public in general.

    Gale do you not understand that most of your information is from quack websites

    Do you understand who you are addressing? :)
  • johnwelk
    johnwelk Posts: 396 Member
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    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    perkymommy wrote: »
    KANGOOJUMPS wrote: »
    well for... of course. why put your life in any kind of sickness if you do not have to. no brainer really. I think the people that are against are just afraid of needles.

    I have no problem with needles. I have a problem with something foreign being put in to my body that I truly am not certain that's what it really is what they say it is.

    Why in the world do you think they are lying about what is in the vaccine?

    And I agree with other posters, you really should not be involved in the healthcare field with these tires of responses.

    John do you not understand the resistance to the flu shots is coming from within the healthcare profession not the unaware public in general.

    No. It's. Not.

    Again, this is a logical fallacy, argument by assertion. Provide some proof.
  • CSARdiver
    CSARdiver Posts: 6,252 Member
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    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    nbcnews.com/id/44275043/ns/health-cold_and_flu/t/why-some-people-dont-get-flu/#.WZopsj6GPIU

    It seems those who do not get the flu really do get the flu.
    Huh???? What in the world are you getting at here?

    I was not trying to get at anything. The article stands on its on legs. Everyone gets the flu but the flu does not get everyone per the article. The status of one's immune system seems to be what decides the side effects of getting the flu.

    So spectacularly wrong. You really think that that is what the research says?

    Here is the original paper:

    http://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1002234
    Please point out where it says that in the original research article.

    Again, what in the world are you getting at here?

    John did you follow your posted link quoted in this post and read the below?

    journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article/comment?id=10.1371/annotation/b761db38-b594-44b3-b608-1743595d6ab7

    Vitamin D may explain some of the findings of this paper

    Cosmic rays may explain some of the findings of this paper.

    This is argumentation without causation. Something the supplement industry thrives on as by regulation supplements do not have to prove effectiveness. There are countless potential correlative values which may or may not contribute to a disease state, but there is no logical connection to assert that the concentration of vitamin D would impact the effectivity of a virus.
  • johnwelk
    johnwelk Posts: 396 Member
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    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    nbcnews.com/id/44275043/ns/health-cold_and_flu/t/why-some-people-dont-get-flu/#.WZopsj6GPIU

    It seems those who do not get the flu really do get the flu.
    Huh???? What in the world are you getting at here?

    I was not trying to get at anything. The article stands on its on legs. Everyone gets the flu but the flu does not get everyone per the article. The status of one's immune system seems to be what decides the side effects of getting the flu.

    So spectacularly wrong. You really think that that is what the research says?

    Here is the original paper:

    http://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1002234
    Please point out where it says that in the original research article.

    Again, what in the world are you getting at here?

    John did you follow your posted link quoted in this post and read the below?

    journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article/comment?id=10.1371/annotation/b761db38-b594-44b3-b608-1743595d6ab7

    Vitamin D may explain some of the findings of this paper

    No it doesn't. What you linked to is an opinion piece. I'm not going to chase down all the links. So instead how about you post what you believe to be the best evidence showing VitD has any effect on influenza or any URI for that matter.

    I did notice that that fluff piece you linked to referenced the garbage put out by Dr. JJ Canell. He's an Uber quack, a psychiatrist pretending to be an epidemiologist, and he's fails miserably at it.

    Seriously, learn how to vet your sources.
  • GaleHawkins
    GaleHawkins Posts: 8,160 Member
    Options
    CSARdiver wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    nbcnews.com/id/44275043/ns/health-cold_and_flu/t/why-some-people-dont-get-flu/#.WZopsj6GPIU

    It seems those who do not get the flu really do get the flu.
    Huh???? What in the world are you getting at here?

    I was not trying to get at anything. The article stands on its on legs. Everyone gets the flu but the flu does not get everyone per the article. The status of one's immune system seems to be what decides the side effects of getting the flu.

    So spectacularly wrong. You really think that that is what the research says?

    Here is the original paper:

    http://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1002234
    Please point out where it says that in the original research article.

    Again, what in the world are you getting at here?

    John did you follow your posted link quoted in this post and read the below?

    journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article/comment?id=10.1371/annotation/b761db38-b594-44b3-b608-1743595d6ab7

    Vitamin D may explain some of the findings of this paper

    Cosmic rays may explain some of the findings of this paper.

    This is argumentation without causation. Something the supplement industry thrives on as by regulation supplements do not have to prove effectiveness. There are countless potential correlative values which may or may not contribute to a disease state, but there is no logical connection to assert that the concentration of vitamin D would impact the effectivity of a virus.

    Since some 3000 genes have been found to have Vitamin D recepticals why are you surprised Vitamin D levels of 50-100 ng reduces human death from all causes?
  • CSARdiver
    CSARdiver Posts: 6,252 Member
    Options
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    CSARdiver wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    nbcnews.com/id/44275043/ns/health-cold_and_flu/t/why-some-people-dont-get-flu/#.WZopsj6GPIU

    It seems those who do not get the flu really do get the flu.
    Huh???? What in the world are you getting at here?

    I was not trying to get at anything. The article stands on its on legs. Everyone gets the flu but the flu does not get everyone per the article. The status of one's immune system seems to be what decides the side effects of getting the flu.

    So spectacularly wrong. You really think that that is what the research says?

    Here is the original paper:

    http://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1002234
    Please point out where it says that in the original research article.

    Again, what in the world are you getting at here?

    John did you follow your posted link quoted in this post and read the below?

    journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article/comment?id=10.1371/annotation/b761db38-b594-44b3-b608-1743595d6ab7

    Vitamin D may explain some of the findings of this paper

    Cosmic rays may explain some of the findings of this paper.

    This is argumentation without causation. Something the supplement industry thrives on as by regulation supplements do not have to prove effectiveness. There are countless potential correlative values which may or may not contribute to a disease state, but there is no logical connection to assert that the concentration of vitamin D would impact the effectivity of a virus.

    Since some 3000 genes have been found to have Vitamin D recepticals why are you surprised Vitamin D levels of 50-100 ng reduces human death from all causes?

    Well to start with...the lack of objective evidence.

  • johnwelk
    johnwelk Posts: 396 Member
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    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    CSARdiver wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    nbcnews.com/id/44275043/ns/health-cold_and_flu/t/why-some-people-dont-get-flu/#.WZopsj6GPIU

    It seems those who do not get the flu really do get the flu.
    Huh???? What in the world are you getting at here?

    I was not trying to get at anything. The article stands on its on legs. Everyone gets the flu but the flu does not get everyone per the article. The status of one's immune system seems to be what decides the side effects of getting the flu.

    So spectacularly wrong. You really think that that is what the research says?

    Here is the original paper:

    http://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1002234
    Please point out where it says that in the original research article.

    Again, what in the world are you getting at here?

    John did you follow your posted link quoted in this post and read the below?

    journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article/comment?id=10.1371/annotation/b761db38-b594-44b3-b608-1743595d6ab7

    Vitamin D may explain some of the findings of this paper

    Cosmic rays may explain some of the findings of this paper.

    This is argumentation without causation. Something the supplement industry thrives on as by regulation supplements do not have to prove effectiveness. There are countless potential correlative values which may or may not contribute to a disease state, but there is no logical connection to assert that the concentration of vitamin D would impact the effectivity of a virus.

    Since some 3000 genes have been found to have Vitamin D recepticals why are you surprised Vitamin D levels of 50-100 ng reduces human death from all causes?

    What in the world are you blathering on about now???

    This is red herring, you have nothing to support your mindless assertions so you figure you'll change the subject, got it.
  • TR0berts
    TR0berts Posts: 7,739 Member
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    Ever since stanmann (apparently successfully) noted the Turing bot, I've been wondering if Gale might be one, too.
  • GaleHawkins
    GaleHawkins Posts: 8,160 Member
    Options
    johnwelk wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    perkymommy wrote: »
    KANGOOJUMPS wrote: »
    well for... of course. why put your life in any kind of sickness if you do not have to. no brainer really. I think the people that are against are just afraid of needles.

    I have no problem with needles. I have a problem with something foreign being put in to my body that I truly am not certain that's what it really is what they say it is.

    Why in the world do you think they are lying about what is in the vaccine?

    And I agree with other posters, you really should not be involved in the healthcare field with these tires of responses.

    John do you not understand the resistance to the flu shots is coming from within the healthcare profession not the unaware public in general.

    No. It's. Not.

    Again, this is a logical fallacy, argument by assertion. Provide some proof.

    John how many people with earned terminal degrees in healthcare do you talk with weekly? There is no logical fallacy on my part. :)
  • unparalleledAF
    unparalleledAF Posts: 45 Member
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    I get the flu once a decade. My record was 15 years. I don't get the shot.

    I would consider it if someone in my close circle was immunocompromised.
  • GaleHawkins
    GaleHawkins Posts: 8,160 Member
    Options
    CSARdiver wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    johnwelk wrote: »
    perkymommy wrote: »
    KANGOOJUMPS wrote: »
    well for... of course. why put your life in any kind of sickness if you do not have to. no brainer really. I think the people that are against are just afraid of needles.

    I have no problem with needles. I have a problem with something foreign being put in to my body that I truly am not certain that's what it really is what they say it is.

    Why in the world do you think they are lying about what is in the vaccine?

    And I agree with other posters, you really should not be involved in the healthcare field with these tires of responses.

    John do you not understand the resistance to the flu shots is coming from within the healthcare profession not the unaware public in general.

    No. It's. Not.

    Again, this is a logical fallacy, argument by assertion. Provide some proof.

    John how many people with earned terminal degrees in healthcare do you talk with weekly? There is no logical fallacy on my part. :)

    As one of my favorite FDA auditors once said "With all due respect, I do not care how many letters you have behind your name. Show me the data."

    Bingo!
  • GaleHawkins
    GaleHawkins Posts: 8,160 Member
    Options
    unparalleledAF wrote: »
    I get the flu once a decade. My record was 15 years. I don't get the shot.

    I would consider it if someone in my close circle was immunocompromised.

    @unparalleledAF where we develop flu symptoms or not seems to be influenced by our own genes based on the article below.

    https://livescience.com/35834-asymptomatic-flu-transmitters-genes-activated.html

    "....Nine of the volunteers came down with mild to severe flu, even though the blood tests confirmed that all 17 were infected and making antibodies against the virus .

    The symptom-free volunteers showed activity in genes performing antioxidant and anti-inflammatory functions, but their bodies' acute inflammatory responses were not active, said Alfred Hero, a co-author of the paper.

    Meanwhile, blood samples from the sick volunteers showed different, or even opposite, gene activity, Hero said...."
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