The Importance of Willpower for Weight Loss
Replies
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nickssweetheart wrote: »When I hear "discipline" I think that it implies a negative connotation about people who are struggling, as though it's something they are lacking that represents a flaw in them. It feels judgmental to me in a way that willpower doesn't.
I would rather use "habitual" for the definition of "does something without even thinking about it." And I think the optimal use of willpower is using it long enough for something to become habitual. Then you will have that willpower available in other areas. I very much agree with OP, though. Sometimes what someone really needs isn't more discipline or more willpower, what they need is help/reassessment of priorities, etc.
This has been an interesting and useful thread. Thank you, OP.
I don't know... to say that someone lacks willpower strikes me as judgmental as well
I love your statement "the optimal use of willpower is using it long enough for something to become habitual" (which I believe is just a more concise statement of what was said by the OP). It's a short-term tool, not a long-term solution.1 -
paperpudding wrote: »I really need a tl:dr version. I have no motivation to read all these words.
TL,DR - don't make it harder than you have to. Works better if you make it easier for yourself ..
Would you agree Aaron that this is your post in a nutshell?
I have said similar on here about logging - don't aim to do it perfectly, aim to do it as as lazily and easily as gets results for you.
Yeah. Don't make it harder than you have to, works better if you make it easier on yourself. Coupled with make sure you assess your priorities and realize that if you choose to prioritize weight loss in your life it likely means you have to deprioritize something else.1 -
nickssweetheart wrote: »When I hear "discipline" I think that it implies a negative connotation about people who are struggling, as though it's something they are lacking that represents a flaw in them. It feels judgmental to me in a way that willpower doesn't.
I would rather use "habitual" for the definition of "does something without even thinking about it." And I think the optimal use of willpower is using it long enough for something to become habitual. Then you will have that willpower available in other areas. I very much agree with OP, though. Sometimes what someone really needs isn't more discipline or more willpower, what they need is help/reassessment of priorities, etc.
This has been an interesting and useful thread. Thank you, OP.
I don't know... to say that someone lacks willpower strikes me as judgmental as well
I love your statement "the optimal use of willpower is using it long enough for something to become habitual" (which I believe is just a more concise statement of what was said by the OP). It's a short-term tool, not a long-term solution.
Yeah I think there is a certain willpower cost associated with doing something that does not feel routine. The more you do it though the more it will feel routine and therefore the less "cost" it will have. I don't think cost goes to zero though just gets smaller and by how much is hard to say.1 -
Aaron_K123 wrote: »CarvedTones wrote: »Aaron_K123 wrote: »sunfastrose wrote: »I love the OP. Too many times people fall into the trap of perfectionism - and a lot of the messaging in society encourages that idea. It's a false dichotomy of all McDonald's or all homegrown veggies, and there are so many people on this board that struggle with it because it feels like not doing everything "right" means that you are wrong and a failure. Making changes takes energy and figuring out what changes minimize energy utilized to maximize impact is really the way to go.
Thanks and yes I agree, there is an "all or nothing" attitude that seems pervasive. I think it comes from the culture embracing this "you can do whatever you set your mind to!" idea of "as long as you have a positive outlook you can do anything" that honestly is unrealistic. No, you can't do anything you set your mind to...you can only do so much, so think hard about what you want out of life and act accordingly.
With weight loss, as long as the goal isn't unreasonable I think it can be that binary. Either you're all in or you're not. You can make a single firm commitment or you can nurture your willpower everyday and accept that some days there just isn't enough to go around. It can easily turn in to a way to give yourself permission to stray from the path without accepting responsibility for it. This doesn't mean that you have to be rigid about never exceeding you calorie goal. You can give yourself permission to make an exception. But treating willpower like there is a finite amount seems like giving yourself permission to fail.
But....there is a finite amount. Since when is acknowledging reality the same as permission to fail? I don't think realism is the same as pessimism. I did not come to terms with not being able to do everything I'd ever want to do in life because I was depressed and was looking for a reason to quit, I did it because coming to terms with reality was a means of becoming actually effective in my planning. I do not find that depressing I find that empowering.
We will have to agree to disagree on that point. To me, willpower is the backbone to stand by your convictions or decisions. "I would have stayed faithful but she offered herself to me 11 times and I ran out of willpower after 10." - see how far that gets you. Maybe what we think of as willpower are different things.0 -
CarvedTones wrote: »Aaron_K123 wrote: »CarvedTones wrote: »Aaron_K123 wrote: »sunfastrose wrote: »I love the OP. Too many times people fall into the trap of perfectionism - and a lot of the messaging in society encourages that idea. It's a false dichotomy of all McDonald's or all homegrown veggies, and there are so many people on this board that struggle with it because it feels like not doing everything "right" means that you are wrong and a failure. Making changes takes energy and figuring out what changes minimize energy utilized to maximize impact is really the way to go.
Thanks and yes I agree, there is an "all or nothing" attitude that seems pervasive. I think it comes from the culture embracing this "you can do whatever you set your mind to!" idea of "as long as you have a positive outlook you can do anything" that honestly is unrealistic. No, you can't do anything you set your mind to...you can only do so much, so think hard about what you want out of life and act accordingly.
With weight loss, as long as the goal isn't unreasonable I think it can be that binary. Either you're all in or you're not. You can make a single firm commitment or you can nurture your willpower everyday and accept that some days there just isn't enough to go around. It can easily turn in to a way to give yourself permission to stray from the path without accepting responsibility for it. This doesn't mean that you have to be rigid about never exceeding you calorie goal. You can give yourself permission to make an exception. But treating willpower like there is a finite amount seems like giving yourself permission to fail.
But....there is a finite amount. Since when is acknowledging reality the same as permission to fail? I don't think realism is the same as pessimism. I did not come to terms with not being able to do everything I'd ever want to do in life because I was depressed and was looking for a reason to quit, I did it because coming to terms with reality was a means of becoming actually effective in my planning. I do not find that depressing I find that empowering.
We will have to agree to disagree on that point. To me, willpower is the backbone to stand by your convictions or decisions. "I would have stayed faithful but she offered herself to me 11 times and I ran out of willpower after 10." - see how far that gets you. Maybe what we think of as willpower are different things.
The way I am using willpower I am saying it is the energy required to carry out an action. Your example is a decision to not act and although the decision itself might take a bit of willpower the act of not acting doesn't. I fully admit whenever one chooses to use a word other people will assume things about your meaning that you dont mean because of how they use that word. I'd just encourage you to not rely on your definition but rather see how I defined it. If you want to call it someting other than willpower sure.
For your analogy to fit my definition that I was using it would be more like you decided to not be faithful and promised to have sex 11 times in a row but ran out of energy after 10 times and gave up because you over-committed to something you did not have enough in the tank to perform.
The act of counting calories, the act of getting yourself to drink a glass of water when you normally wouldn't, the act of meal planning, the act of exercising all require energy I am referring to as willpower. That resource is limited, you cannot do everything at somepoint you will run out of energy to do actions. Call it "energy" then. Honestly I think most people just call it "time". Oh I don't have "time" to do that.
What you are defining I'd probably called discipline. You use some will to make the decision but then you rely on discipline to stick to your conviction since the conviction itself doesn't require any actual action. Would being repeatedly tempted require more and more will? I don't know maybe, I guess I could see that. I agree with you though it seems unlikely you would cave just by being asked over and over again so I think at somepoint discipline takes over and it becomes automatic.1 -
I do think of willpower and discipline as synonyms; not exact ones but pretty close. But I think sticking to the diet is a matter of discipline also.0
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CarvedTones wrote: »I do think of willpower and discipline as synonyms; not exact ones but pretty close. But I think sticking to the diet is a matter of discipline also.
Yeah I mean you raised some good points. In my own example I talked about not wasting energy on avoiding drinking diet soda which would be me claiming you spend willpower avoiding something. Your point regarding a scenario of infidelity about whether that means if someone repeatedly tempts you it will eventually wear you down is well made and I guess my answer is I'm not entirely sure. I mean to some degree I think it would wear you down, not if the person asked you 11 times in a row on the same day that would just be annoying but if it was repeated temptations over time I could see that how likely one was to succumb to temptation might very well be related to how overwhelmed one is with other activities. That doesn't make it an excuse, just an explanation. Yeah I guess I do think you can be worn down to the point of being more susceptible to failures in character.
Overall though I think this is sort of a deep dive on focusing on word meanings when really all I am saying is "Hey, if you have had trouble in the past losing weight maybe take stock of what you are spending your time on and make sure you have provided enough to be able to make the life changes necessary for weight loss....don't try to do everything you could possible do all at once, just pick a few simple things and focus on consistency."2 -
Aaron_K123 wrote: »CarvedTones wrote: »I do think of willpower and discipline as synonyms; not exact ones but pretty close. But I think sticking to the diet is a matter of discipline also.
Overall though I think this is sort of a deep dive on focusing on word meanings when really all I am saying is "Hey, if you have had trouble in the past losing weight maybe take stock of what you are spending your time on and make sure you have provided enough to be able to make the life changes necessary for weight loss....don't try to do everything you could possible do all at once, just pick a few simple things and focus on consistency."
I already brought this out, but I do think it's inaccurate to equate time management & willpower. For many, prioritizing their time may well be the only issue, but as your original post detailed, the bigger cost generally comes from our attitude about a particular obligation, and that's very difficult to quantify. But again, I'm not disagreeing, I just think the two things are different, albeit related, issues.1 -
Aaron_K123 wrote: »CarvedTones wrote: »I do think of willpower and discipline as synonyms; not exact ones but pretty close. But I think sticking to the diet is a matter of discipline also.
Overall though I think this is sort of a deep dive on focusing on word meanings when really all I am saying is "Hey, if you have had trouble in the past losing weight maybe take stock of what you are spending your time on and make sure you have provided enough to be able to make the life changes necessary for weight loss....don't try to do everything you could possible do all at once, just pick a few simple things and focus on consistency."
I already brought this out, but I do think it's inaccurate to equate time management & willpower. For many, prioritizing their time may well be the only issue, but as your original post detailed, the bigger cost generally comes from our attitude about a particular obligation, and that's very difficult to quantify. But again, I'm not disagreeing, I just think the two things are different, albeit related, issues.
Yeah fair enough I guess I slipped into saying "time" myself. I think people use the word "time" when they really mean something more like willpower or energy. Honestly I don't think anyone spends literally every second of everyday doing nothing but productive activities so really there always is more "time" you could be doing something productive in. It is energy we run out of, not time....there is only so much we can do productively in a given day and I think the limit is the willpower and ability to focus not the clock.4 -
CarvedTones wrote: »Aaron_K123 wrote: »sunfastrose wrote: »I love the OP. Too many times people fall into the trap of perfectionism - and a lot of the messaging in society encourages that idea. It's a false dichotomy of all McDonald's or all homegrown veggies, and there are so many people on this board that struggle with it because it feels like not doing everything "right" means that you are wrong and a failure. Making changes takes energy and figuring out what changes minimize energy utilized to maximize impact is really the way to go.
Thanks and yes I agree, there is an "all or nothing" attitude that seems pervasive. I think it comes from the culture embracing this "you can do whatever you set your mind to!" idea of "as long as you have a positive outlook you can do anything" that honestly is unrealistic. No, you can't do anything you set your mind to...you can only do so much, so think hard about what you want out of life and act accordingly.
With weight loss, as long as the goal isn't unreasonable I think it can be that binary. Either you're all in or you're not. You can make a single firm commitment or you can nurture your willpower everyday and accept that some days there just isn't enough to go around. It can easily turn in to a way to give yourself permission to stray from the path without accepting responsibility for it. This doesn't mean that you have to be rigid about never exceeding you calorie goal. You can give yourself permission to make an exception. But treating willpower like there is a finite amount seems like giving yourself permission to fail.
You could take it as permission to fail. Or, you could look at it as insight, and then sweet yourself up to succeed, which involves knowing and mitigating your weaknesses.
I've lost about 70 pounds and kept it off a few years now. I'm not all or nothing about it.3 -
An example.
Last night I was craving salty savory crunchy junk food. But I don't keep the stuff in my house. And it was cold and rainy, so I didn't want to go out.
Not keeping high calorie junk food around is a strategy I use to avoid thoughtless evening binges.8 -
I "insightfulled" your post and I think it's very on point. If you have the stuff in the house, you have to use willpower every day. If you don't, you only have to exercise it once, in the store.5
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nickssweetheart wrote: »I "insightfulled" your post and I think it's very on point. If you have the stuff in the house, you have to use willpower every day. If you don't, you only have to exercise it once, in the store.
Yes, I was thinking about this too! We can set up our environment so as not to need so much willpower.5 -
CarvedTones wrote: »We will have to agree to disagree on that point. To me, willpower is the backbone to stand by your convictions or decisions. "I would have stayed faithful but she offered herself to me 11 times and I ran out of willpower after 10." - see how far that gets you. Maybe what we think of as willpower are different things.
I'll definitely have to agree to disagree, because no human on earth is perfectly capable of constantly refusing temptation 100% of the time, no matter the circumstances or the personal level of discipline. Fatigue sets in, physical, mental, and everyone reaches a breaking point, even in your analogy.
there's a reason why the Bible (and the wisdom books of pretty much any religion, for that matter) will tell you to flee temptation.....Aaron_K123 wrote: ».... This post is a counterpoint to the "just believe in yourself" or "just try harder" type of posts. I don't think that sort of advice is actually useful.
I agree completely there. Telling a kid that "anything they dream is possible if they just believe in themselves" is only setting them up for failure. I do believe in working hard, in perhaps dreaming beyond your circumstances, but reality has to be part of that equation. How many wannabe actors are there in Hollywood compared to those who actually make it big? How many wannabe football players compared to the number of true professionals? Sure, I know - the ones who made it would have never made it if they hadn't worked for their dream. But not everyone has the talent to make it big, or are willing to do all that is necessary to do so. Priorities, circumstances, personal talent or lack thereof are major components of what a person can and cannot achieve, and it doesn't hurt to teach a person to acknowledge their own limitations while still stretching what they CAN do to the best of their ability.
I'm an intermediate pianist. I love to play the piano. I know that I'd be a better pianist if I could practice more often. If I had time to practice 8 hours a day, I know I'd reach a level of expertise that I have never managed before. But even if I practiced 20 hours a day, I know my ability, and I know that I won't be the next Liberace. There's a limit to what I can do, that no amount of willpower or desire will overcome. Discipline will allow me to achieve the best of my ability, but discipline isn't going to take me beyond that personal limitation.
I'm all for doing your best, and acknowledge that sometimes you can surprise yourself with what you can achieve when you put your mind to it and work hard, but I do know that some dreams are just impossible - time, circumstances, and physical limitations have to be acknowledged.6 -
Aaron_K123 wrote: »Yeah fair enough I guess I slipped into saying "time" myself. I think people use the word "time" when they really mean something more like willpower or energy. Honestly I don't think anyone spends literally every second of everyday doing nothing but productive activities so really there always is more "time" you could be doing something productive in. It is energy we run out of, not time....there is only so much we can do productively in a given day and I think the limit is the willpower and ability to focus not the clock.
Besides, quality of life has to be taken into account. Those "nonproductive" activities may well be what we need to help reset our willpower and rejuvenate ourselves I know my life would be very dull and frankly horrible if all I did all the time was nothing but what was considered "productive". Shoot, I only work because I need money for the necessities of life and for the "fun" hobbies I like 
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Many points that have been discussed here were sounding familiar to me, and I finally remembered why. I read this great article last year on how to harness your habits and the 3 primary points were:
1) Be realistic. Recognize the limits on your time, energy, and resources and only pick one or two things to work on at a time. As OP has said, focus on what's most important to you.
2) Manage your environment (as was touched on above). Make it harder to do the wrong thing (don't keep ice cream in your freezer, if that is your weakness) and make it easier to do the right thing (if you want to work out in the morning, put your workout clothes right next to the bed). Limit contact with people who discourage you, and seek out those who help reinforce your good habits (if you're trying to quit smoking, don't hang out with the smokers on your break).
3) Have a long-range view. Don't view setbacks as permanent failure, and focus on your successes (and how to repeat them) rather than your setbacks.
Hope this wasn't a derail- I just thought it tied in really nicely. And thanks, OP, for creating the post that prompted me to go hunt it down! I needed it 12 -
Many points that have been discussed here were sounding familiar to me, and I finally remembered why. I read this great article last year on how to harness your habits and the 3 primary points were:
1) Be realistic. Recognize the limits on your time, energy, and resources and only pick one or two things to work on at a time. As OP has said, focus on what's most important to you.
2) Manage your environment (as was touched on above). Make it harder to do the wrong thing (don't keep ice cream in your freezer, if that is your weakness) and make it easier to do the right thing (if you want to work out in the morning, put your workout clothes right next to the bed). Limit contact with people who discourage you, and seek out those who help reinforce your good habits (if you're trying to quit smoking, don't hang out with the smokers on your break).
3) Have a long-range view. Don't view setbacks as permanent failure, and focus on your successes (and how to repeat them) rather than your setbacks.
Hope this wasn't a derail- I just thought it tied in really nicely. And thanks, OP, for creating the post that prompted me to go hunt it down! I needed it
I'm not sure I've ever "inspiring"-ed something before, but the way you summed that up really spoke to me. I've recently been working on getting my family's finances in order, and realized that I've been treating saving money and getting out of debt much the same way I was treating weight loss a couple of years ago - I figured it was such a huge task, and fixing it would take so many unpleasant changes, that I was pretty much guaranteed to fail. So I give up before I begin, the problem gets worse, and so on and so forth.1 -
NorthCascades wrote: »An example.
Last night I was craving salty savory crunchy junk food. But I don't keep the stuff in my house. And it was cold and rainy, so I didn't want to go out.
Not keeping high calorie junk food around is a strategy I use to avoid thoughtless evening binges.
I know yours is an example but it is one where I have to use willpower/discipline instead of that strategy. I have a family that includes teenagers. There are probably 3 or 4 kinds of chips and a couple of kinds of cookies in the pantry. There are some Snickers ice cream bars and some Klondike bars in the freezer. The menu changes, but there are just about always snacks like that in the house. There are donuts in the breakroom at work some days; afternoon parties with chips and dips and beers (a temptation I have to avoid for more reasons than caloric content). I have to be able to withstand a constant barrage of temptation. I even do it to myself. I have squirreled away milestone rewards in my desk drawer. 4 more pounds and I get to have a white chocolate chunk macadamia nut cookie. There are a bunch of fun size candy bars in there also. It's been weeks since I last had one at a previous milestone. No one but me knows exactly what's in there. I don't eat any of that stuff because I am not supposed to and because losing the weight is more important to me than a quick junk food fix, or at least it is right now. I am standing firm behind my decision and it isn't more taxing on donut days.3 -
Bravo. I agree that a good talk about how to invest our energy is very much needed. I also found success by making small achievable changes.
Something we talked about in our eating therapy group is the "all or nothing" mentality.
http://cogbtherapy.com/cbt-blog/cognitive-distortions-all-or-nothing-thinking
Eating resolutions are easily derailed if the dieter has to be perfect, every single day. When I switched my perspective to "eh, it's just one day/doughnut", I recovered much more quickly and got back on track right away.
Long term success.1 -
I never use the word "willpower" because for some reason I have some very, very negative associations with it. When I hear the word I think of someone gritting her teeth, sitting on her hands to keep from jumping up and shoving food into her mouth in desperation. I think of effort against something every fiber of her body is begging the person to do.
So I usually just don't call it this. I do think of it as making new habits, because (this is just me, now, bear that in mind), I feel I had gotten used to A LOT of food, I mean an excessive amount as being "normal," and I thought of being full to the point of "I can't stuff anything else in" as normal, too. So by comparison, of course eating less was going to feel, initially, like deprivation. I had to get into the habit of eating non-water-buffallo-size quantities of food.2 -
MegaMooseEsq wrote: »Many points that have been discussed here were sounding familiar to me, and I finally remembered why. I read this great article last year on how to harness your habits and the 3 primary points were:
1) Be realistic. Recognize the limits on your time, energy, and resources and only pick one or two things to work on at a time. As OP has said, focus on what's most important to you.
2) Manage your environment (as was touched on above). Make it harder to do the wrong thing (don't keep ice cream in your freezer, if that is your weakness) and make it easier to do the right thing (if you want to work out in the morning, put your workout clothes right next to the bed). Limit contact with people who discourage you, and seek out those who help reinforce your good habits (if you're trying to quit smoking, don't hang out with the smokers on your break).
3) Have a long-range view. Don't view setbacks as permanent failure, and focus on your successes (and how to repeat them) rather than your setbacks.
Hope this wasn't a derail- I just thought it tied in really nicely. And thanks, OP, for creating the post that prompted me to go hunt it down! I needed it
I'm not sure I've ever "inspiring"-ed something before, but the way you summed that up really spoke to me. I've recently been working on getting my family's finances in order, and realized that I've been treating saving money and getting out of debt much the same way I was treating weight loss a couple of years ago - I figured it was such a huge task, and fixing it would take so many unpleasant changes, that I was pretty much guaranteed to fail. So I give up before I begin, the problem gets worse, and so on and so forth.
I can't take credit for the info, but I'm glad it could be of help to both of us
Your experience made me think of when I made my MFP account several years ago... I was actually grumbling out loud about how miserable I was going to be. But I just focused on the math and it was fine.3 -
On the one hand, this makes a lot of sense to me, and I readily see some ways to implement it. But it concerns me as well. Does this mean it's hopeless for those whose daily life pretty much uses up all of their willpower (I'm thinking work & family issues they cannot change, health problems, depression, etc.) to be successful at weight loss or achieving fitness?
In terms of the OP, we all need to use our available stores of energy efficiently.
Some people have less stress / less working hours, so can do more exercise (for example).
Some people barely have energy to feed themselves. That's where accurate logging/weighing food is a priority. They don't need to do massive food preps or fancy home-cooked meals. They can prepare whatever they can manage in the proportions that give them a calorie deficit.
Lots of successful people on MFP still have health problems.
Using our energy ("willpower" / "habits") efficiently results in longer term success.
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I was thinking about this thread last night and this morning, and I think one important element to consider when thinking about willpower (or whatever you want to call the mental effort of doing something difficult) is the idea of reward. A number of times in the past I’ve tried to start an exercise regimen only to quit when I wasn’t percieving any payoff for my efforts, or the payoff wasn’t worth the effort expended (in my mind at least, which really is the only thing that matters when we’re talking willpower, right?). I suspect that many people who embark on dramatic dietary changes for weight loss get frustrated by lack of perceived reward as well, especially since a dramatic effort should yield dramatic results, right?
This to me lends support for the slow and steady method, although I’ve seen people criticize it for exactly that reason - that the results are too slow and small to provide enough reward, aka motivation, to keep going. I think there are two missed points here though: first, slow and steady requires much less change (willpower) so doesn’t require as dramatic of rewards to maintain. And second is the idea of reframing expections. When I started here at MFP, my goal wasn’t to lose two pounds a week, it was to track every bit of food I was eating as accurately as possible. The reward was information and the effort required really wasn’t that bad. My second goal was to stop gaining weight, which genuinely was a modest dietary change for fairly clear and easy rewards.
Speaking to the OP (which I did not reread before posting, my apologies), I think reward helps lighten the effort required to exert willpower. If something is difficult to do and you don’t see any gains in doing it other than it being what you’re “supposed” to do, then it’s always going to be more difficult than doing somewhere with a predictable and proportionate reward. When you’re talking long-term projects like weight loss or fitness, it’s extra challenging because the primary rewards aren’t generally quick to materialize. The trick, then, is to figure out more immediate rewards sufficient to keep you personally motivated.
Brought to you by a second problematic word - motivation - and from my NordicTrack. I’m not a big fan of stationary biking, but I am a fan of 1) closing my exercise and move rings on my Apple Watch, and 2) being able to fill in my fitness spreadsheet instead of leaving it blank for the day. Also, not being outside in 12 degree weather is its own reward.4 -
MegaMooseEsq wrote: »I was thinking about this thread last night and this morning, and I think one important element to consider when thinking about willpower (or whatever you want to call the mental effort of doing something difficult) is the idea of reward. A number of times in the past I’ve tried to start an exercise regimen only to quit when I wasn’t percieving any payoff for my efforts, or the payoff wasn’t worth the effort expended (in my mind at least, which really is the only thing that matters when we’re talking willpower, right?). I suspect that many people who embark on dramatic dietary changes for weight loss get frustrated by lack of perceived reward as well, especially since a dramatic effort should yield dramatic results, right?
This to me lends support for the slow and steady method, although I’ve seen people criticize it for exactly that reason - that the results are too slow and small to provide enough reward, aka motivation, to keep going. I think there are two missed points here though: first, slow and steady requires much less change (willpower) so doesn’t require as dramatic of rewards to maintain. And second is the idea of reframing expections. When I started here at MFP, my goal wasn’t to lose two pounds a week, it was to track every bit of food I was eating as accurately as possible. The reward was information and the effort required really wasn’t that bad. My second goal was to stop gaining weight, which genuinely was a modest dietary change for fairly clear and easy rewards.
Speaking to the OP (which I did not reread before posting, my apologies), I think reward helps lighten the effort required to exert willpower. If something is difficult to do and you don’t see any gains in doing it other than it being what you’re “supposed” to do, then it’s always going to be more difficult than doing somewhere with a predictable and proportionate reward. When you’re talking long-term projects like weight loss or fitness, it’s extra challenging because the primary rewards aren’t generally quick to materialize. The trick, then, is to figure out more immediate rewards sufficient to keep you personally motivated.
Brought to you by a second problematic word - motivation - and from my NordicTrack. I’m not a big fan of stationary biking, but I am a fan of 1) closing my exercise and move rings on my Apple Watch, and 2) being able to fill in my fitness spreadsheet instead of leaving it blank for the day. Also, not being outside in 12 degree weather is its own reward.
Good points, yeah I would agree that seeing progress helps mitigate willpower costs as you feel validated in your efforts. That it is important to have realistic expectations of results so that you are not discouraged simply because you expected more than was feasible or likely to happen.1 -
On the one hand, this makes a lot of sense to me, and I readily see some ways to implement it. But it concerns me as well. Does this mean it's hopeless for those whose daily life pretty much uses up all of their willpower (I'm thinking work & family issues they cannot change, health problems, depression, etc.) to be successful at weight loss or achieving fitness?
In terms of the OP, we all need to use our available stores of energy efficiently.
Some people have less stress / less working hours, so can do more exercise (for example).
Some people barely have energy to feed themselves. That's where accurate logging/weighing food is a priority. They don't need to do massive food preps or fancy home-cooked meals. They can prepare whatever they can manage in the proportions that give them a calorie deficit.
Lots of successful people on MFP still have health problems.
Using our energy ("willpower" / "habits") efficiently results in longer term success.
I never personally felt that it was hopeless for people; I was just reacting to the idea of willpower being finite. I think the discussion has since mentioned some nice strategies to free up more of a person's resources that apply to the vast majority of people (myself included). Realistically, I think there are times in life when the best a person can aim for is to maintain his/her current weight/fitness/good habits, but to continue to be on the lookout for ways to buy out more resources.0 -
Aaron, thanks for the post. Another tool in my kit.0
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Brilliant post my friend. This deserves to be stickied.
In short this is an application of the Pareto principle and an excellent, detailed approach on how you implemented this in your life to achieve a goal.
Another tool I use to help motivation is acknowledging that there are 168 hours/week. This causes me to pause whenever I make the statement "I don't have time", when the truth is I do have time, but I have de-prioritized the activity.3 -
Brilliant post my friend. This deserves to be stickied.
In short this is an application of the Pareto principle and an excellent, detailed approach on how you implemented this in your life to achieve a goal.
Another tool I use to help motivation is acknowledging that there are 168 hours/week. This causes me to pause whenever I make the statement "I don't have time", when the truth is I do have time, but I have de-prioritized the activity.
Thanks. I'm not familiar with the Pareto principle but I certainly have no claim of originality. I came up with this on my own but I'm sure there are many many published examples of basically the same approach or concept that are likely more detailed, fleshed out and use better and more accurate word choices.0 -
I use the Pareto principle all the time. 80% of my profits come from 20% of my effort. The rest of my freaking valuable time (80%) !! is taken up with time-sucking, demanding, princesses. For only a 20% return.
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/p/paretoprinciple.asp
Wal-mart only has to closely watch the pricing few hundred items that consumers also watch closely. The rest of their products fly under the consumers' radar.4
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