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meal timing debate
Replies
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I really don't think it makes much of a difference. It might make a small difference somewhere along the time line, but I gotta believe that it's so small and insignificant that it's really not worth worrying about.
1st world problem, right?2 -
A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
https://examine.com/nutrition/does-eating-at-night-make-it-more-likely-to-gain-weight/ -- sources linked at the end
The studies that show differences are often due to the participants consuming less, not due to any physiological disadvantage of nighttime eating.
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It just doesn't even make sense.
Your body doesn't use the food you just that second ate for your energy.
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A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
Thanks
https://www.bodyrecomposition.com/research-review/meal-frequency-and-energy-balance-research-review.html/
A research review. It has the title of the study if you wish to read the full thing that Lyle McDonald is reviewing.1 -
Motorsheen wrote: »I really don't think it makes much of a difference. It might make a small difference somewhere along the time line, but I gotta believe that it's so small and insignificant that it's really not worth worrying about.
1st world problem, right?
Yeah, that's what I think too. Even if there were some small benefit to not eating after 6 pm or some such nonsense, it would be outweighed by the benefits of focusing on what is easier for you to manage as a lifestyle. For me, not having dinner would be, well, a lifestyle problem, I'd be less likely to stick to it, so I went for dinner when it worked for me.
That I lost faster than MFP predicted anyway further confirmed me in my view that it doesn't matter and that people flipping out about eating dinner super early are majoring in the minors. Obviously, if it affected my ability to sleep or caused digestion problems, I'd fix it.2 -
RuNaRoUnDaFiEld wrote: »A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
Thanks
https://www.bodyrecomposition.com/research-review/meal-frequency-and-energy-balance-research-review.html/
A research review. It has the title of the study if you wish to read the full thing that Lyle McDonald is reviewing.
Hmm well if I were looking for research about 6 meals a day vs. 3 or less this would be interesting. Not on point if the question is caloric uptake difference if digesting while asleep vs digesting when awake tho.3 -
fuzzylop72 wrote: »A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
https://examine.com/nutrition/does-eating-at-night-make-it-more-likely-to-gain-weight/ -- sources linked at the end
The studies that show differences are often due to the participants consuming less, not due to any physiological disadvantage of nighttime eating.
As I read that the article’s conclusion was based upon the peer reviewed studies that exist “It is pretty hard to reach any conclusions” and none of the cited studies addressed time of eating/bedtime - all cited were about the time of eating/clock time.
I’ll do some more research, but thus far I’ve not come across one study that specifically looks at whether sleep affects caloric intake - thus I don’t know that there is any peer reviewed scientific basis for a statement that it matters/doesn’t matter.
I’d love to know if there is any science pointing one direction or another, because if there is I can’t find it.2 -
Seattlegirl25 wrote: »I'm curious, are you drinking alcohol at all? Are you making sure you are drinking plenty of water? Are you making sure you stop eating before 7PM?
Have you tried exercising in the morning on an empty stomach? Just curious on all of these.
Also, are you mixing things up a little, like running / biking / etc?
I got crazy and drank 3.5 ounces of red wine last night. If I excerise on an empty belly I get REALLY dizzy. Because of my work schedule, my work hours are nutty. I try to finish consuming food before 9pm at the latest. I usually end up jogging in the evenings.
Gotcha. If you are eating regularly around 9PM, that could be part of the issue. But I guess this all depends when you go to bed and wake up.
Why does this matter??
What about people that work night shift?
They're doomed to be fat forever because they eat at night?
Read everything I asked before you quote my stuff. I did say it depends on when you go to bed and getup. Sheesh.
But It doesn't matter "when you go to bed and wake up". That's why they responded that way.
I disagree 100%. If you are eating dinner at 8PM and go to bed at 8:30PM, yes that does make a difference.
Sometimes I really wish it did. On those days I am fed up with eating, I could eat my cals right before bed to help me gain and not worry about the rest of the day. It doesn't work like that though.6 -
I don't think it's really fair to say that meal timing make no difference in weight loss. I think meal timing can make a pretty big difference. Not from a physiological standpoint, but weight loss is as much a mental game as a physiological one. And when you eat can affect how easy it is to stick to your calorie goals.
Eating at times that fit your personal schedule and lifestyle seems a really important thing to me. So while I understand that the gist of this thread is to refute that one should not eat just before bed or late at night, I think it is just as wrong to say meal timing doesn't matter at all.5 -
All this being said, Meal timing and "eating timing" are different and can contribute to weight loss.
Eating between dinner and bedtime can tend to be mindless, low nutrient, high calorie foods. And is generally advisable to avoid on a regular or habitual basis. Eating dinner at 2045 and going to sleep at 2100 on the other hand isn't going to affect your "metabolism".
Eating more, or eating too much will affect your CI, and thus trend towards weight gain. Particular timing matters not at all.2 -
Expert on it. It doesn't matter for weight loss. If it did, then how do international stewards and stewardesses stay lean? Or anybody that has to travel a lot who get time zones mixed up a lot?janejellyroll wrote: »Seattlegirl25 wrote: »I'm curious, are you drinking alcohol at all? Are you making sure you are drinking plenty of water? Are you making sure you stop eating before 7PM?
Have you tried exercising in the morning on an empty stomach? Just curious on all of these.
Also, are you mixing things up a little, like running / biking / etc?
I got crazy and drank 3.5 ounces of red wine last night. If I excerise on an empty belly I get REALLY dizzy. Because of my work schedule, my work hours are nutty. I try to finish consuming food before 9pm at the latest. I usually end up jogging in the evenings.
Gotcha. If you are eating regularly around 9PM, that could be part of the issue. But I guess this all depends when you go to bed and wake up.
Why does this matter??
What about people that work night shift?
They're doomed to be fat forever because they eat at night?
Read everything I asked before you quote my stuff. I did say it depends on when you go to bed and getup. Sheesh.
But It doesn't matter "when you go to bed and wake up". That's why they responded that way.
I disagree 100%. If you are eating dinner at 8PM and go to bed at 8:30PM, yes that does make a difference.
This is not true. Your body can digest food and use energy all day, even when you're sleeping.
I will give up on this post and good luck to the original poster. Many of you think you are experts when people ask general questions. Some of your responses are clueless.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
8 -
If you lived in many parts of Europe, then don't even start dinner till 9pm in many countries.fuzzylop72 wrote: »A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
https://examine.com/nutrition/does-eating-at-night-make-it-more-likely-to-gain-weight/ -- sources linked at the end
The studies that show differences are often due to the participants consuming less, not due to any physiological disadvantage of nighttime eating.
As I read that the article’s conclusion was based upon the peer reviewed studies that exist “It is pretty hard to reach any conclusions” and none of the cited studies addressed time of eating/bedtime - all cited were about the time of eating/clock time.
I’ll do some more research, but thus far I’ve not come across one study that specifically looks at whether sleep affects caloric intake - thus I don’t know that there is any peer reviewed scientific basis for a statement that it matters/doesn’t matter.
I’d love to know if there is any science pointing one direction or another, because if there is I can’t find it.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition 6 -
fuzzylop72 wrote: »A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
https://examine.com/nutrition/does-eating-at-night-make-it-more-likely-to-gain-weight/ -- sources linked at the end
The studies that show differences are often due to the participants consuming less, not due to any physiological disadvantage of nighttime eating.
As I read that the article’s conclusion was based upon the peer reviewed studies that exist “It is pretty hard to reach any conclusions” and none of the cited studies addressed time of eating/bedtime - all cited were about the time of eating/clock time.
I’ll do some more research, but thus far I’ve not come across one study that specifically looks at whether sleep affects caloric intake - thus I don’t know that there is any peer reviewed scientific basis for a statement that it matters/doesn’t matter.
Whether sleep affects caloric intake is a different question than from whether meal timing does.
I think lack of sleep or messed up circadian rhythms certainly tends to result in higher cal intake and perhaps more problems for weight loss than that accounts for, but that doesn't seem to have anything to do with meal timing, since everyone has said it doesn't matter UNLESS it affects sleep. Maybe you meant to say something else, but it seems you might be talking about something different?0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »I don't think it's really fair to say that meal timing make no difference in weight loss. I think meal timing can make a pretty big difference. Not from a physiological standpoint, but weight loss is as much a mental game as a physiological one. And when you eat can affect how easy it is to stick to your calorie goals.
Eating at times that fit your personal schedule and lifestyle seems a really important thing to me. So while I understand that the gist of this thread is to refute that one should not eat just before bed or late at night, I think it is just as wrong to say meal timing doesn't matter at all.
But the point people have been making is just the same as the one you made. It makes no difference physiologically, but might psychologically (i.e., if not eating after a time helps you not overeat in the evening). That it matters only psychologically means that for some of us it's better to eat later (if that works with our lifestyles) vs. thinking that it's necessary to figure out a way to not eat after 6 or some crazy early time (as 6 pm would seem to me).
Acknowledging that it matters only for personal lifestyle or preference reasons allows you to find what works for you. You don't need to follow some rule (such as the person who started this gave).1 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »I don't think it's really fair to say that meal timing make no difference in weight loss. I think meal timing can make a pretty big difference. Not from a physiological standpoint, but weight loss is as much a mental game as a physiological one. And when you eat can affect how easy it is to stick to your calorie goals.
Eating at times that fit your personal schedule and lifestyle seems a really important thing to me. So while I understand that the gist of this thread is to refute that one should not eat just before bed or late at night, I think it is just as wrong to say meal timing doesn't matter at all.
But the point people have been making is just the same as the one you made. It makes no difference physiologically, but might psychologically (i.e., if not eating after a time helps you not overeat in the evening). That it matters only psychologically means that for some of us it's better to eat later (if that works with our lifestyles) vs. thinking that it's necessary to figure out a way to not eat after 6 or some crazy early time (as 6 pm would seem to me).
Acknowledging that it matters only for personal lifestyle or preference reasons allows you to find what works for you. You don't need to follow some rule (such as the person who started this gave).
Not everyone was saying that, or at least not clearly. There were posts that said nothing other than "it makes no difference" or something similar.1 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »fuzzylop72 wrote: »A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
https://examine.com/nutrition/does-eating-at-night-make-it-more-likely-to-gain-weight/ -- sources linked at the end
The studies that show differences are often due to the participants consuming less, not due to any physiological disadvantage of nighttime eating.
As I read that the article’s conclusion was based upon the peer reviewed studies that exist “It is pretty hard to reach any conclusions” and none of the cited studies addressed time of eating/bedtime - all cited were about the time of eating/clock time.
I’ll do some more research, but thus far I’ve not come across one study that specifically looks at whether sleep affects caloric intake - thus I don’t know that there is any peer reviewed scientific basis for a statement that it matters/doesn’t matter.
Whether sleep affects caloric intake is a different question than from whether meal timing does.
I think lack of sleep or messed up circadian rhythms certainly tends to result in higher cal intake and perhaps more problems for weight loss than that accounts for, but that doesn't seem to have anything to do with meal timing, since everyone has said it doesn't matter UNLESS it affects sleep. Maybe you meant to say something else, but it seems you might be talking about something different?
Yeah, my limited understanding is that different chemical processes occur in the body during sleep. Therefore I question whether a meal consumed right before sleep might result in a difference to the caloric uptake. I Question this, I am not saying it is true/false or even quantitatively relevant. I would just like to know if anyone has seen any reputable research addressing it.3 -
I personally prefer eating 3 hours before going to bed, since I've been suffering from gastritis for about 2 years now. If I go to sleep right after dinner, the next morning I feel bloated and "heavy". As a consequence, I may skip breakfast or drink a cup of tea or hot water with ginger, which is not enough for a good and healthy breakfast.
Your body can indeed digest food even when you're sleeping, but the best thing is to wait a couple of hours before going to bed. Also, you may still be able to lose weight, but you should also consider your overall health and not simply the scale.8 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »fuzzylop72 wrote: »A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
https://examine.com/nutrition/does-eating-at-night-make-it-more-likely-to-gain-weight/ -- sources linked at the end
The studies that show differences are often due to the participants consuming less, not due to any physiological disadvantage of nighttime eating.
As I read that the article’s conclusion was based upon the peer reviewed studies that exist “It is pretty hard to reach any conclusions” and none of the cited studies addressed time of eating/bedtime - all cited were about the time of eating/clock time.
I’ll do some more research, but thus far I’ve not come across one study that specifically looks at whether sleep affects caloric intake - thus I don’t know that there is any peer reviewed scientific basis for a statement that it matters/doesn’t matter.
Whether sleep affects caloric intake is a different question than from whether meal timing does.
I think lack of sleep or messed up circadian rhythms certainly tends to result in higher cal intake and perhaps more problems for weight loss than that accounts for, but that doesn't seem to have anything to do with meal timing, since everyone has said it doesn't matter UNLESS it affects sleep. Maybe you meant to say something else, but it seems you might be talking about something different?
Yeah, my limited understanding is that different chemical processes occur in the body during sleep. Therefore I question whether a meal consumed right before sleep might result in a difference to the caloric uptake. I Question this, I am not saying it is true/false or even quantitatively relevant. I would just like to know if anyone has seen any reputable research addressing it.
I wonder about this too. Would I have lost weight more quickly if I'd eaten earlier in the day? Since I'm now in maintenance now it doesn't really matter, but I'm still a curious.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »fuzzylop72 wrote: »A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
https://examine.com/nutrition/does-eating-at-night-make-it-more-likely-to-gain-weight/ -- sources linked at the end
The studies that show differences are often due to the participants consuming less, not due to any physiological disadvantage of nighttime eating.
As I read that the article’s conclusion was based upon the peer reviewed studies that exist “It is pretty hard to reach any conclusions” and none of the cited studies addressed time of eating/bedtime - all cited were about the time of eating/clock time.
I’ll do some more research, but thus far I’ve not come across one study that specifically looks at whether sleep affects caloric intake - thus I don’t know that there is any peer reviewed scientific basis for a statement that it matters/doesn’t matter.
Whether sleep affects caloric intake is a different question than from whether meal timing does.
I think lack of sleep or messed up circadian rhythms certainly tends to result in higher cal intake and perhaps more problems for weight loss than that accounts for, but that doesn't seem to have anything to do with meal timing, since everyone has said it doesn't matter UNLESS it affects sleep. Maybe you meant to say something else, but it seems you might be talking about something different?
Yeah, my limited understanding is that different chemical processes occur in the body during sleep. Therefore I question whether a meal consumed right before sleep might result in a difference to the caloric uptake. I Question this, I am not saying it is true/false or even quantitatively relevant. I would just like to know if anyone has seen any reputable research addressing it.
I want you to think about this logically and critically.
Does it makes sense on a molecular level that a biological system would modify metabolic pathways?
Metabolic pathways are set and only react to stimulus - this being the presence of molecules (food). The miracle of life does not begin or end by sleeping/waking. Imagine the outcome if this had an impact? How would this impact people on differing sleep cycles - off shift workers & long shift workers. How would this impact people in a coma?
There are specific chemical processes that occur during sleep cycles, but these have almost no impact on metabolism. Now there is an impact when individuals are sleep deprived, but this is a matter of dramatic hormonal imbalance resulting *in increased water weight.
*edited11 -
i'll see if I can find some of the research I've looked for previously - but 2 studies that I remember reading
1) a snack before bed (higher protein) can help with lean muscle recovery in women
2) a carb-y snack can improve quality of sleep - I know that I sleep like the dead when I incorporate a bowl of cereal before bed and no issues with weight loss2 -
Even if there was a difference, I imagine it would probably be slight. For me, it's easier to adhere to a deficit when I eat when I want and that, for me, includes later dinners (8 PM or so). I feel the same way about alcohol. Maybe I would lose weight faster if I completely eliminated it, but that's a way of life that I'm not particularly interested in so I'll sometimes have a drink within my deficit. In both cases (eating late and sometimes drinking), I know that I'll still lose weight if I'm at a deficit and that's what matters to me.1
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lemurcat12 wrote: »fuzzylop72 wrote: »A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
https://examine.com/nutrition/does-eating-at-night-make-it-more-likely-to-gain-weight/ -- sources linked at the end
The studies that show differences are often due to the participants consuming less, not due to any physiological disadvantage of nighttime eating.
As I read that the article’s conclusion was based upon the peer reviewed studies that exist “It is pretty hard to reach any conclusions” and none of the cited studies addressed time of eating/bedtime - all cited were about the time of eating/clock time.
I’ll do some more research, but thus far I’ve not come across one study that specifically looks at whether sleep affects caloric intake - thus I don’t know that there is any peer reviewed scientific basis for a statement that it matters/doesn’t matter.
Whether sleep affects caloric intake is a different question than from whether meal timing does.
I think lack of sleep or messed up circadian rhythms certainly tends to result in higher cal intake and perhaps more problems for weight loss than that accounts for, but that doesn't seem to have anything to do with meal timing, since everyone has said it doesn't matter UNLESS it affects sleep. Maybe you meant to say something else, but it seems you might be talking about something different?
Yeah, my limited understanding is that different chemical processes occur in the body during sleep. Therefore I question whether a meal consumed right before sleep might result in a difference to the caloric uptake. I Question this, I am not saying it is true/false or even quantitatively relevant. I would just like to know if anyone has seen any reputable research addressing it.
I want you to think about this logically and critically.
Does it makes sense on a molecular level that a biological system would modify metabolic pathways?
Metabolic pathways are set and only react to stimulus - this being the presence of molecules (food). The miracle of life does not begin or end by sleeping/waking. Imagine the outcome if this had an impact? How would this impact people on differing sleep cycles - off shift workers & long shift workers. How would this impact people in a coma?
There are specific chemical processes that occur during sleep cycles, but these have almost no impact on metabolism. Now there is an impact when individuals are sleep deprived, but this is a matter of dramatic hormonal imbalance resulting.
Exactly...and if things were this complicated, the human species would have died off eons ago...7 -
Maybe look at this from another angle. My BMR (Basal Metabolic Rate) / resting calories in a 24 hour period are about 2,100, or around 88 calories per hour. That is me doing nothing, essentially the calories burned if I lay still in bed. This happens around the clock, so if I eat my last meal at midnight and sleep for 8 hours, I'm burning around 700 calories, just like I generally will do during the 8 hours I spend sitting in a chair in my office in front of a computer. So whether I'm eating 700 calories as a midnight snack or for breakfast at 8am, all things remaining the same (ie, no exercise/active calories), those calories will not affect me any differently because of their timing.
7 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »fuzzylop72 wrote: »A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
https://examine.com/nutrition/does-eating-at-night-make-it-more-likely-to-gain-weight/ -- sources linked at the end
The studies that show differences are often due to the participants consuming less, not due to any physiological disadvantage of nighttime eating.
As I read that the article’s conclusion was based upon the peer reviewed studies that exist “It is pretty hard to reach any conclusions” and none of the cited studies addressed time of eating/bedtime - all cited were about the time of eating/clock time.
I’ll do some more research, but thus far I’ve not come across one study that specifically looks at whether sleep affects caloric intake - thus I don’t know that there is any peer reviewed scientific basis for a statement that it matters/doesn’t matter.
Whether sleep affects caloric intake is a different question than from whether meal timing does.
I think lack of sleep or messed up circadian rhythms certainly tends to result in higher cal intake and perhaps more problems for weight loss than that accounts for, but that doesn't seem to have anything to do with meal timing, since everyone has said it doesn't matter UNLESS it affects sleep. Maybe you meant to say something else, but it seems you might be talking about something different?
Yeah, my limited understanding is that different chemical processes occur in the body during sleep. Therefore I question whether a meal consumed right before sleep might result in a difference to the caloric uptake. I Question this, I am not saying it is true/false or even quantitatively relevant. I would just like to know if anyone has seen any reputable research addressing it.
I want you to think about this logically and critically.
Does it makes sense on a molecular level that a biological system would modify metabolic pathways?
Metabolic pathways are set and only react to stimulus - this being the presence of molecules (food). The miracle of life does not begin or end by sleeping/waking. Imagine the outcome if this had an impact? How would this impact people on differing sleep cycles - off shift workers & long shift workers. How would this impact people in a coma?
There are specific chemical processes that occur during sleep cycles, but these have almost no impact on metabolism. Now there is an impact when individuals are sleep deprived, but this is a matter of dramatic hormonal imbalance resulting.
Exactly...and if things were this complicated, the human species would have died off eons ago...
Really? From what?3 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »fuzzylop72 wrote: »A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
https://examine.com/nutrition/does-eating-at-night-make-it-more-likely-to-gain-weight/ -- sources linked at the end
The studies that show differences are often due to the participants consuming less, not due to any physiological disadvantage of nighttime eating.
As I read that the article’s conclusion was based upon the peer reviewed studies that exist “It is pretty hard to reach any conclusions” and none of the cited studies addressed time of eating/bedtime - all cited were about the time of eating/clock time.
I’ll do some more research, but thus far I’ve not come across one study that specifically looks at whether sleep affects caloric intake - thus I don’t know that there is any peer reviewed scientific basis for a statement that it matters/doesn’t matter.
Whether sleep affects caloric intake is a different question than from whether meal timing does.
I think lack of sleep or messed up circadian rhythms certainly tends to result in higher cal intake and perhaps more problems for weight loss than that accounts for, but that doesn't seem to have anything to do with meal timing, since everyone has said it doesn't matter UNLESS it affects sleep. Maybe you meant to say something else, but it seems you might be talking about something different?
Yeah, my limited understanding is that different chemical processes occur in the body during sleep. Therefore I question whether a meal consumed right before sleep might result in a difference to the caloric uptake. I Question this, I am not saying it is true/false or even quantitatively relevant. I would just like to know if anyone has seen any reputable research addressing it.
I want you to think about this logically and critically.
Does it makes sense on a molecular level that a biological system would modify metabolic pathways?
Metabolic pathways are set and only react to stimulus - this being the presence of molecules (food). The miracle of life does not begin or end by sleeping/waking. Imagine the outcome if this had an impact? How would this impact people on differing sleep cycles - off shift workers & long shift workers. How would this impact people in a coma?
There are specific chemical processes that occur during sleep cycles, but these have almost no impact on metabolism. Now there is an impact when individuals are sleep deprived, but this is a matter of dramatic hormonal imbalance resulting *in increased water weight.
*edited
Interesting but digestion is affected by sleep and body position (horizontal) isn’t it? Insulin is released shortly before one wakes up in the morning if one adheres to a regular schedule, isn’t that true? I believe cortisol also has a daily/nightly routine release. And Melatonin too, yes?
I might have those things wrong- but If those are true, then Yes, it does logically make sense (to me) that metabolic systems might also be also affected.
I don’t know, and that is why I wondered if there was any reputable research on the subject that I have been unable to find that someone else might know about.8 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »fuzzylop72 wrote: »A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
https://examine.com/nutrition/does-eating-at-night-make-it-more-likely-to-gain-weight/ -- sources linked at the end
The studies that show differences are often due to the participants consuming less, not due to any physiological disadvantage of nighttime eating.
As I read that the article’s conclusion was based upon the peer reviewed studies that exist “It is pretty hard to reach any conclusions” and none of the cited studies addressed time of eating/bedtime - all cited were about the time of eating/clock time.
I’ll do some more research, but thus far I’ve not come across one study that specifically looks at whether sleep affects caloric intake - thus I don’t know that there is any peer reviewed scientific basis for a statement that it matters/doesn’t matter.
Whether sleep affects caloric intake is a different question than from whether meal timing does.
I think lack of sleep or messed up circadian rhythms certainly tends to result in higher cal intake and perhaps more problems for weight loss than that accounts for, but that doesn't seem to have anything to do with meal timing, since everyone has said it doesn't matter UNLESS it affects sleep. Maybe you meant to say something else, but it seems you might be talking about something different?
Yeah, my limited understanding is that different chemical processes occur in the body during sleep. Therefore I question whether a meal consumed right before sleep might result in a difference to the caloric uptake. I Question this, I am not saying it is true/false or even quantitatively relevant. I would just like to know if anyone has seen any reputable research addressing it.
I want you to think about this logically and critically.
Does it makes sense on a molecular level that a biological system would modify metabolic pathways?
Metabolic pathways are set and only react to stimulus - this being the presence of molecules (food). The miracle of life does not begin or end by sleeping/waking. Imagine the outcome if this had an impact? How would this impact people on differing sleep cycles - off shift workers & long shift workers. How would this impact people in a coma?
There are specific chemical processes that occur during sleep cycles, but these have almost no impact on metabolism. Now there is an impact when individuals are sleep deprived, but this is a matter of dramatic hormonal imbalance resulting *in increased water weight.
*edited
Interesting but digestion is affected by sleep and body position (horizontal) isn’t it? Insulin is released shortly before one wakes up in the morning if one adheres to a regular schedule, isn’t that true? I believe cortisol also has a daily/nightly routine release. And Melatonin too, yes?
I might have those things wrong- but If those are true, then Yes, it does logically make sense (to me) that metabolic systems might also be also affected.
I don’t know, and that is why I wondered if there was any reputable research on the subject that I have been unable to find that someone else might know about.
No. How do coma patients stay alive? How do bed ridden patients stay alive? How do astronauts stay alive? Your orientation to gravity is irrelevant.
Insulin is not on a strict time-released schedule and reactionary to stimulus, not sleep. The impact of cortisol on metabolism is <1%. Same with melatonin.
I'm sure you can find peer reviewed articles that cherry pick data, but focus on the degree of influence. Statistically speaking there is none.7 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »fuzzylop72 wrote: »A question- I see a lot of posts on MFP which state meal timing makes no difference to weight loss. Does anyone have the cites for the peer reviewed research to back this up?
I’m particularly interested in reading anything where they control tested meal timing in relation to bed time, not time of day.
https://examine.com/nutrition/does-eating-at-night-make-it-more-likely-to-gain-weight/ -- sources linked at the end
The studies that show differences are often due to the participants consuming less, not due to any physiological disadvantage of nighttime eating.
As I read that the article’s conclusion was based upon the peer reviewed studies that exist “It is pretty hard to reach any conclusions” and none of the cited studies addressed time of eating/bedtime - all cited were about the time of eating/clock time.
I’ll do some more research, but thus far I’ve not come across one study that specifically looks at whether sleep affects caloric intake - thus I don’t know that there is any peer reviewed scientific basis for a statement that it matters/doesn’t matter.
Whether sleep affects caloric intake is a different question than from whether meal timing does.
I think lack of sleep or messed up circadian rhythms certainly tends to result in higher cal intake and perhaps more problems for weight loss than that accounts for, but that doesn't seem to have anything to do with meal timing, since everyone has said it doesn't matter UNLESS it affects sleep. Maybe you meant to say something else, but it seems you might be talking about something different?
Yeah, my limited understanding is that different chemical processes occur in the body during sleep. Therefore I question whether a meal consumed right before sleep might result in a difference to the caloric uptake. I Question this, I am not saying it is true/false or even quantitatively relevant. I would just like to know if anyone has seen any reputable research addressing it.
I want you to think about this logically and critically.
Does it makes sense on a molecular level that a biological system would modify metabolic pathways?
Metabolic pathways are set and only react to stimulus - this being the presence of molecules (food). The miracle of life does not begin or end by sleeping/waking. Imagine the outcome if this had an impact? How would this impact people on differing sleep cycles - off shift workers & long shift workers. How would this impact people in a coma?
There are specific chemical processes that occur during sleep cycles, but these have almost no impact on metabolism. Now there is an impact when individuals are sleep deprived, but this is a matter of dramatic hormonal imbalance resulting.
Exactly...and if things were this complicated, the human species would have died off eons ago...
Really? From what?
From turning into a gremlin eating anything after 6...it would be an utter evolutionary failure if things were this complicated to be healthy and functional or maintain a healthy weight, etc.7 -
One thing I've always wondered is who are these people who can have their last meal at 6 or whatever...and what do they do? I don't remember the last time I was home from work anytime before 6...sometimes I'm just leaving the office.7
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cwolfman13 wrote: »One thing I've always wondered is who are these people who can have their last meal at 6 or whatever...and what do they do? I don't remember the last time I was home from work anytime before 6...sometimes I'm just leaving the office.
Yeah, I had a 4 hour daily commute for more than 14 years and rarely ate dinner before 7:00 and was in bed by 8:00 - 8:30. The last year I was working I lost almost 40 lbs. without changing anything except the number of calories I was eating.6 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »One thing I've always wondered is who are these people who can have their last meal at 6 or whatever...and what do they do? I don't remember the last time I was home from work anytime before 6...sometimes I'm just leaving the office.
Yeah, I had a 4 hour daily commute for more than 14 years and rarely ate dinner before 7:00 and was in bed by 8:00 - 8:30. The last year I was working I lost almost 40 lbs. without changing anything except the number of calories I was eating.
Yikes...4 hours would suck. Mine is typically 2 hours...sometimes 2.5 hours round trip if traffic is extra bad...but yeah, 6 PM is generally the earliest I get home. If I go to lift after work I'm not usually home until 7:30 or later.4
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