Suits
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That's a really great comparison, @leut_underpants - but I'm curious, why not buy a smaller waist pant instead of taking it in 2 inches? Also what is "suppressing the waist"? Making tucks or something?0
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Just have to say I LOVE the tailoring comparison. I have to get my clothes altered all the time. I am 6' tall and it is really hard to get things to fit right in length and waist/hips at same time. Good tailoring makes ALL the difference....and takes both pounds and years off of your appearance.1
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leut_underpants wrote: »sugaraddict4321 wrote: »That's a really great comparison, @leut_underpants - but I'm curious, why not buy a smaller waist pant instead of taking it in 2 inches? Also what is "suppressing the waist"? Making tucks or something?
@sugaraddict4321 About to get wordy, sorry about that.
Because in traditional suiting, you don't get a choice. Traditional suiting comes in a "drop" between jacket and pants, typically 6 inches. So 42L minus 6 = 36 pant. That may or may not work for the buyer, but it's typically close enough for alterations to not make the pant look crazy on them.
Big trouble comes when I need a 44L, which I do with most manufacturers. There's also a magic number between chest and shoulders that not many people know about. Around my shoulders I measure 51 inches. Around my chest is short of 42. So I have a nearly ten inch drop between those two numbers. It's exceedingly rare to see more than 7, and what that means is that I have to buy a bigger size than my chest number indicates, because the shoulders won't fit if I don't...and that's really what needs to fit, rather than the chest. Chest is the number it's sold by, shoulders are what actually matter, along with the lay of the lapels and collar on the chest and neck. Has little to do with chest at all, other than a convenient place for the math to work out most of the time.
This particular manufacturer makes this cut in such a way that it fits my shoulders really well using the lower size number.
There are such a thing as suit separates (pants sold on their own). When they're available, they're great for a guy like me. Just weren't an option in this case.
Suppressing the waist means taking it in along the seams that the manufacturer used in shaping it. There's usually 4 side seams and a back center seam. Cheaper tailors will take in excess via the center seam, which can lead to the jacket not looking right from behind if there's a lot to remove. Taking center can also leave less breadth across the back, and I need all of the room there.
A more expensive option is to take out a little from each of the side seams. The tailor won't be altering the entire lower part of the jacket, instead just "pinching" at the waist, like a corset without any structure. Again, my weird dimensions make tailoring hard, this is why suits get expensive for me; it's 30-40% tailoring cost. A more normal proportioned person has less altering to do.
This one is a better example of how it should all come together, eventually, and what good tailoring can do.
In another life you and I might get along quite well.
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leut_underpants wrote: »leut_underpants wrote: »sugaraddict4321 wrote: »That's a really great comparison, @leut_underpants - but I'm curious, why not buy a smaller waist pant instead of taking it in 2 inches? Also what is "suppressing the waist"? Making tucks or something?
@sugaraddict4321 About to get wordy, sorry about that.
Because in traditional suiting, you don't get a choice. Traditional suiting comes in a "drop" between jacket and pants, typically 6 inches. So 42L minus 6 = 36 pant. That may or may not work for the buyer, but it's typically close enough for alterations to not make the pant look crazy on them.
Big trouble comes when I need a 44L, which I do with most manufacturers. There's also a magic number between chest and shoulders that not many people know about. Around my shoulders I measure 51 inches. Around my chest is short of 42. So I have a nearly ten inch drop between those two numbers. It's exceedingly rare to see more than 7, and what that means is that I have to buy a bigger size than my chest number indicates, because the shoulders won't fit if I don't...and that's really what needs to fit, rather than the chest. Chest is the number it's sold by, shoulders are what actually matter, along with the lay of the lapels and collar on the chest and neck. Has little to do with chest at all, other than a convenient place for the math to work out most of the time.
This particular manufacturer makes this cut in such a way that it fits my shoulders really well using the lower size number.
There are such a thing as suit separates (pants sold on their own). When they're available, they're great for a guy like me. Just weren't an option in this case.
Suppressing the waist means taking it in along the seams that the manufacturer used in shaping it. There's usually 4 side seams and a back center seam. Cheaper tailors will take in excess via the center seam, which can lead to the jacket not looking right from behind if there's a lot to remove. Taking center can also leave less breadth across the back, and I need all of the room there.
A more expensive option is to take out a little from each of the side seams. The tailor won't be altering the entire lower part of the jacket, instead just "pinching" at the waist, like a corset without any structure. Again, my weird dimensions make tailoring hard, this is why suits get expensive for me; it's 30-40% tailoring cost. A more normal proportioned person has less altering to do.
This one is a better example of how it should all come together, eventually, and what good tailoring can do.
In another life you and I might get along quite well.
I was unaware we weren't getting along now. Good to know. :ohwell:
"quite well"
Please stop making me feel like a grammarian? :flowerforyou:0 -
UrBaconMeCr8zy wrote: »leut_underpants wrote: »
Same size and model of suit. Light gray is out of the box. Obviously doesn't look great, but that's the point. Most guys would get the pants hemmed and call it good. Here's what actually needs to happen to this suit to make it look right.
Take in waist on pants 2"
Take in seat on pants a bit
Hem pants to top of shoes
Suppress waist in jacket about 3"
Take up sleeves 1.5"
Drop collar 1/2"
The charcoal suit has had all of these alterations done, and looks pretty good. The unaltered suit jacket makes me look about 30 pounds heavier...not good. It's really boxy and unflattering, despite being a fairly trim cut of suit. Whatever size you are, get it to fit you.
@Avocado_AS5
@UrBaconMeCr8zy
I'm glad you posted a before tailoring pic!
I love that you posted the comparison. I like a guy in a perfect fitted suit. This proves the point how much better it looks. Adds more class too. Untailored just looks frumpy.
I think because of you and this thread, I go around paying a lot more attention to guys in suits and how they are wearing them...not just if they look good in it or not.1 -
leut_underpants wrote: »sugaraddict4321 wrote: »That's a really great comparison, @leut_underpants - but I'm curious, why not buy a smaller waist pant instead of taking it in 2 inches? Also what is "suppressing the waist"? Making tucks or something?
@sugaraddict4321 About to get wordy, sorry about that.
Because in traditional suiting, you don't get a choice. Traditional suiting comes in a "drop" between jacket and pants, typically 6 inches. So 42L minus 6 = 36 pant. That may or may not work for the buyer, but it's typically close enough for alterations to not make the pant look crazy on them.
Big trouble comes when I need a 44L, which I do with most manufacturers. There's also a magic number between chest and shoulders that not many people know about. Around my shoulders I measure 51 inches. Around my chest is short of 42. So I have a nearly ten inch drop between those two numbers. It's exceedingly rare to see more than 7, and what that means is that I have to buy a bigger size than my chest number indicates, because the shoulders won't fit if I don't...and that's really what needs to fit, rather than the chest. Chest is the number it's sold by, shoulders are what actually matter, along with the lay of the lapels and collar on the chest and neck. Has little to do with chest at all, other than a convenient place for the math to work out most of the time.
This particular manufacturer makes this cut in such a way that it fits my shoulders really well using the lower size number.
There are such a thing as suit separates (pants sold on their own). When they're available, they're great for a guy like me. Just weren't an option in this case.
Suppressing the waist means taking it in along the seams that the manufacturer used in shaping it. There's usually 4 side seams and a back center seam. Cheaper tailors will take in excess via the center seam, which can lead to the jacket not looking right from behind if there's a lot to remove. Taking center can also leave less breadth across the back, and I need all of the room there.
A more expensive option is to take out a little from each of the side seams. The tailor won't be altering the entire lower part of the jacket, instead just "pinching" at the waist, like a corset without any structure. Again, my weird dimensions make tailoring hard, this is why suits get expensive for me; it's 30-40% tailoring cost. A more normal proportioned person has less altering to do.
This one is a better example of how it should all come together, eventually, and what good tailoring can do.
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just bought my first suit yesterday for the biggest interview of my life next month, i will post a pic when i get it back from being altered2
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leut_underpants wrote: »
This is seriously messing with my head. Everything about this picture reminds me of my Lover. Especially the eyes.
The tailoring, discussion around it, and smirk don't help either.
*kitten*.
Don't smile. It's not you.5 -
leut_underpants wrote: »sugaraddict4321 wrote: »That's a really great comparison, @leut_underpants - but I'm curious, why not buy a smaller waist pant instead of taking it in 2 inches? Also what is "suppressing the waist"? Making tucks or something?
@sugaraddict4321 About to get wordy, sorry about that.
Because in traditional suiting, you don't get a choice. Traditional suiting comes in a "drop" between jacket and pants, typically 6 inches. So 42L minus 6 = 36 pant. That may or may not work for the buyer, but it's typically close enough for alterations to not make the pant look crazy on them.
Big trouble comes when I need a 44L, which I do with most manufacturers. There's also a magic number between chest and shoulders that not many people know about. Around my shoulders I measure 51 inches. Around my chest is short of 42. So I have a nearly ten inch drop between those two numbers. It's exceedingly rare to see more than 7, and what that means is that I have to buy a bigger size than my chest number indicates, because the shoulders won't fit if I don't...and that's really what needs to fit, rather than the chest. Chest is the number it's sold by, shoulders are what actually matter, along with the lay of the lapels and collar on the chest and neck. Has little to do with chest at all, other than a convenient place for the math to work out most of the time.
This particular manufacturer makes this cut in such a way that it fits my shoulders really well using the lower size number.
There are such a thing as suit separates (pants sold on their own). When they're available, they're great for a guy like me. Just weren't an option in this case.
Suppressing the waist means taking it in along the seams that the manufacturer used in shaping it. There's usually 4 side seams and a back center seam. Cheaper tailors will take in excess via the center seam, which can lead to the jacket not looking right from behind if there's a lot to remove. Taking center can also leave less breadth across the back, and I need all of the room there.
A more expensive option is to take out a little from each of the side seams. The tailor won't be altering the entire lower part of the jacket, instead just "pinching" at the waist, like a corset without any structure. Again, my weird dimensions make tailoring hard, this is why suits get expensive for me; it's 30-40% tailoring cost. A more normal proportioned person has less altering to do.
This one is a better example of how it should all come together, eventually, and what good tailoring can do.
Great explanation, and picture comparisons. I'm one who cannot buy off the shelf suits, as they all need to be tailored due to my body type. It's rare to find a longer length suit jacket, and they have to hem the pants legs quite a bit. Reminds me, I should check my suits to make sure they still fit.0 -
By the way, thank you for this thread!
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Unrelated but related. Bumble.
I just can't do it. Sometimes running and spinning aren't enough.
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Also,`I bought the last guy I was dating a Varvatos shirt because his taste was horrible. If I had known how horrible I probably would have never....
Whatever. It was what it was. He told me he couldn't accept a shirt that cost $250 and that he couldn't wear it. It was NYE.
I didn't yell. I never yell. I calmly disagreed but accepted. He knew something was wrong. He apologized profusely over the next two hours. It was NYE and he was a rail-thin hair from starting the New Year freshly single.8 -
Also,`I bought the last guy I was dating a Varvatos shirt because his taste was horrible. If I had known how horrible I probably would have never....
Whatever. It was what it was. He told me he couldn't accept a shirt that cost $250 and that he couldn't wear it. It was NYE.
I didn't yell. I never yell. I calmly disagreed but accepted. He knew something was wrong. He apologized profusely over the next two hours. It was NYE and he was a rail-thin hair from starting the New Year freshly single.
I've never even heard of this brand before. My jobs rarely require me to dress up more than business casual. Except in special occasions, such as meeting with the big brass. Or, special occasion for the FD, then I have to wear my class A's.
Given that, in a way, I can agree with ihm. Other times, one just needs to STFU and accept the gift.1 -
xFunctionalStrengthx wrote: »Also,`I bought the last guy I was dating a Varvatos shirt because his taste was horrible. If I had known how horrible I probably would have never....
Whatever. It was what it was. He told me he couldn't accept a shirt that cost $250 and that he couldn't wear it. It was NYE.
I didn't yell. I never yell. I calmly disagreed but accepted. He knew something was wrong. He apologized profusely over the next two hours. It was NYE and he was a rail-thin hair from starting the New Year freshly single.
I've never even heard of this brand before. My jobs rarely require me to dress up more than business casual. Except in special occasions, such as meeting with the big brass. Or, special occasion for the FD, then I have to wear my class A's.
Given that, in a way, I can agree with ihm. Other times, one just needs to STFU and accept the gift.
BTW, there's a huge caveat with what I mentioned....It was more about *him* and how kind of quickly we moved along, and less about the style. He put so much effort into working out his body for aesthetic purposes, and spent (what I considered, in a nonjudgmental way) extravagant amounts of money in other areas. If he couldn't afford it, that would be one thing. But it was his intrinsic value set and perspective....and, honestly, he was willing to learn. I just never saw it as a LT thing.
(Not to mention, after running around prepping all day for the NYE party, I literally arrived at his doorstep with Veuve [for him to gift to our hosts], Four Roses Single Barrel [separate gift from me], and a Varvatos bag with top and dark washed jeans. His immediate reaction was, "I can't accept this.")
There's this guy I really like now. A friend, actually. I've known him for a couple of years. And he'd never go to Varvatos and spend money on a shirt like that (actually, he might, but he'd say all day long that he wouldn't). And I *kitten* love him for it. Because he's brilliant, kind, empathic, and although he can afford the toys, I understand his set of values and how they no longer align with material goods. And I respect him. I didn't respect the other guy.
So, of course....It's more about the man inside the suit.
One dresses for their lifestyle, I suppose, right? I rarely wear makeup anymore. I can make myself look like a 9/10 but most of the time it's 6/7. It's a reflection of priorities. But it's nice having the tools available if you do decide on that special night out.....
Off topic. Sorry! Ranting. Run now. Bye.5 -
xFunctionalStrengthx wrote: »Also,`I bought the last guy I was dating a Varvatos shirt because his taste was horrible. If I had known how horrible I probably would have never....
Whatever. It was what it was. He told me he couldn't accept a shirt that cost $250 and that he couldn't wear it. It was NYE.
I didn't yell. I never yell. I calmly disagreed but accepted. He knew something was wrong. He apologized profusely over the next two hours. It was NYE and he was a rail-thin hair from starting the New Year freshly single.
I've never even heard of this brand before. My jobs rarely require me to dress up more than business casual. Except in special occasions, such as meeting with the big brass. Or, special occasion for the FD, then I have to wear my class A's.
Given that, in a way, I can agree with ihm. Other times, one just needs to STFU and accept the gift.
BTW, there's a huge caveat with what I mentioned....It was more about *him* and how kind of quickly we moved along, and less about the style. He put so much effort into working out his body for aesthetic purposes, and spent (what I considered, in a nonjudgmental way) extravagant amounts of money in other areas. If he couldn't afford it, that would be one thing. But it was his intrinsic value set and perspective....and, honestly, he was willing to learn. I just never saw it as a LT thing.
There's this guy I really like now. A friend, actually. I've known him for a couple of years. And he'd never go to Varvatos and spend money on a shirt like that (actually, he might, but he'd say all day long that he wouldn't). And I *kitten* love him for it. Because he's brilliant, kind, empathic, and although he can afford the toys, I understand his set of values and how they no longer align with material goods. And I respect him. I didn't respect the other guy.
So, of course....It's more about the man inside the suit.
One dresses for their lifestyle, I suppose, right? I rarely wear makeup anymore. I can make myself look like a 9/10 but most of the time it's 6/7. It's a reflection of priorities. But it's nice having the tools available if you do decide on that special night out.....
Off topic. Sorry! Ranting. Run now. Bye.
Ahh, makes sense then and I agree it's about priorities and values we place on ourselves and within our lives. You're definitely far above a 6/7 I'd say. What's inside tends to reflect outwardly as well.1 -
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leut_underpants wrote: »
Ohhhh I love him so much0 -
leut_underpants wrote: »caco_ethes wrote: »leut_underpants wrote: »
Ohhhh I love him so much
Andrew Scott can wear the hell out of dressed up.
And he can Moriarty like no one else0 -
leut_underpants wrote: »caco_ethes wrote: »leut_underpants wrote: »caco_ethes wrote: »leut_underpants wrote: »
Ohhhh I love him so much
Andrew Scott can wear the hell out of dressed up.
And he can Moriarty like no one else
True. I don't know enough of his acting to say how he plays other characters, but I get the impression that he has a lot of range.
He’s such a beautiful blend of crazy and entertaining. I love how he envisioned the character.1
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