Anyone cutting after a bulk?
Replies
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Thanks @hesn92 !
Well to be honest I can't always get through it in one go. I will do a few exercises, then take a break if needed to tend to the baby or kids. Then finish the rest later. Sometimes I have to skip an exercise if I don't have time.
It is very similar to SC, follows a similar template so far.. but each month (at least the one I am doing) it puts emphasis on a different exercise. So month 1 starts with hip thrusts more, then deadlifts, squats etc.
It takes me about 45min total (plus a 5 min warmup) but I also superset the last two exercises to save time. It is very easy to modify with the equipment you have, at least the beginner and intermediate programs.
If you are buying the book just for the programs, well, to be honest SC is probably more than enough. It is basically an encyclopedia about everything glutes. If that interests you then go for it!
Hope all is well on your end
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Unsurprisingly I am not yet 130 pounds. I say these things and never manage them.cupcakesandproteinshakes wrote: »cupcakesandproteinshakes wrote: »Bumping this post to remind me that I do actually need to lose a bit more fat if I’m ever gonna be lean enough to bulk.
Just got back from an all inclusive free for all in turkey. Delicious food.
4 pounds up the day after I got back. 140 pounds. This mornings weigh in was a new low of 135.8. Yey for unintentional diet breaks.
Aiming for 130 by the end of November. This might be wildly optimistic.
Think I’m back on track after the holiday. 134.2 today is a new low. I plan to try and see 132 in the scale and then start bulking slowly for as long as I can. Aiming to gain around 10-14 pounds. Bye bye abs.
I have seen 133 on the scale a few times though so I’m getting closer. I can’t drop my calories below 1800 else I turn into a monster and I can’t fit any more time in for more cardio. Well unless I give up work or some sleep time.
I’m planning to continue losing till party season and then start bulking whatever I weigh.
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@cupcakesandproteinshakes, have you ever thought about trying IF/time-restricted eating? I don't love it but I do find when I stick to it my overall adherence comes easier and sustaining a slightly lower deficit is tolerable. Twice this year I've come within spitting distance of my low-enough-to-start-a-bulk number (mid 172s with a target of 170). The first was in April while trying IF again and the second was August when I was eating throughout the day.
March/April loss: Dropped 4 lbs on rolling average weight in 18 days with 83% adherence (below TDEE) averaging 2178/day for a 372 cal/day deficit (-14.6%)
July/August loss: Dropped 5 lbs on rolling average weight in 54 days with 72% adherence averaging 2396/day for a 154 cal/day deficit (-6%)
My biggest concern with trying IF long-term in the past has been muscle loss but I believe there was a recent study (which I currently cannot find) that suggested this wasn't an issue as along as adequate protein is consumed. As it well documented on this thread, I'm historically incapable of getting properly lean enough to bulk so I'm back to trying IF as something that's been at least mildly more effective for me in the past.
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@cupcakesandproteinshakes, have you ever thought about trying IF/time-restricted eating? I don't love it but I do find when I stick to it my overall adherence comes easier and sustaining a slightly lower deficit is tolerable. Twice this year I've come within spitting distance of my low-enough-to-start-a-bulk number (mid 172s with a target of 170). The first was in April while trying IF again and the second was August when I was eating throughout the day.
March/April loss: Dropped 4 lbs on rolling average weight in 18 days with 83% adherence (below TDEE) averaging 2178/day for a 372 cal/day deficit (-14.6%)
July/August loss: Dropped 5 lbs on rolling average weight in 54 days with 72% adherence averaging 2396/day for a 154 cal/day deficit (-6%)
My biggest concern with trying IF long-term in the past has been muscle loss but I believe there was a recent study (which I currently cannot find) that suggested this wasn't an issue as along as adequate protein is consumed. As it well documented on this thread, I'm historically incapable of getting properly lean enough to bulk so I'm back to trying IF as something that's been at least mildly more effective for me in the past.
I haven’t tried IF. I’m ravenous first thing when I wake up so always need breakfast. I guess I could try and stop eating early evening. I do that anyway as I’ve usually run out of calories.
Basically weight loss sucks for the last few pounds. And I’m bloody freezing cos of not much fat left. Except on my thighs.
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cupcakesandproteinshakes wrote: »@cupcakesandproteinshakes, have you ever thought about trying IF/time-restricted eating? I don't love it but I do find when I stick to it my overall adherence comes easier and sustaining a slightly lower deficit is tolerable. Twice this year I've come within spitting distance of my low-enough-to-start-a-bulk number (mid 172s with a target of 170). The first was in April while trying IF again and the second was August when I was eating throughout the day.
March/April loss: Dropped 4 lbs on rolling average weight in 18 days with 83% adherence (below TDEE) averaging 2178/day for a 372 cal/day deficit (-14.6%)
July/August loss: Dropped 5 lbs on rolling average weight in 54 days with 72% adherence averaging 2396/day for a 154 cal/day deficit (-6%)
My biggest concern with trying IF long-term in the past has been muscle loss but I believe there was a recent study (which I currently cannot find) that suggested this wasn't an issue as along as adequate protein is consumed. As it well documented on this thread, I'm historically incapable of getting properly lean enough to bulk so I'm back to trying IF as something that's been at least mildly more effective for me in the past.
I haven’t tried IF. I’m ravenous first thing when I wake up so always need breakfast. I guess I could try and stop eating early evening. I do that anyway as I’ve usually run out of calories.
Basically weight loss sucks for the last few pounds. And I’m bloody freezing cos of not much fat left. Except on my thighs.
I'm always surprised how quickly I'm able to adjust to skipping breakfast when I've dabbled with IF, but yes the last few pounds do suck. I've been working to get under 170 for multiple years now. I have one data point at 170.0 (1/20/2018) but otherwise it's been before I started lifting with any regularity in 2015 that I was in the 160s for any length of time. If my recent average BF% numbers are to be believed, best case is I hit 10% at 169.4, worst case it's 164.0. Came in at 178.0 this morning... so there's that.0 -
Hi all! I am brand new here but have been lifting consistently for almost 11 months. I am on day 3 of a cut. I gained ~20 pounds in the past year, 5 from eating too much and 15 from lifting and eating just enough to get through the day.
I am following my own workout heavily based on Strong Curves but with more upper body, all supersets. I am very pleased with my progress, mostly just proud of myself for going to the gym 4-5 days a week but also seeing muscles popping everywhere! So I am very excited for this cut, planning for 3 months and hope to lose 10-15 pounds (accounting for the loss of water weight). Despite the definition in my upper body and quads I have plenty of body fat to sacrifice.
I am eating lowish carb, around 50-75 net per day and starting with a deficit of ~500 and will adjust if my strength goes down. Dealing with sleeplessness these first few days has been difficult.
Anyway just wanted to say hi and that I’ll be sticking around for a bit - communities like this have helped me in the past.2 -
I’m pretty sure I’m always cutting after a bulk.7
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cupcakesandproteinshakes wrote: »@cupcakesandproteinshakes, have you ever thought about trying IF/time-restricted eating? I don't love it but I do find when I stick to it my overall adherence comes easier and sustaining a slightly lower deficit is tolerable. Twice this year I've come within spitting distance of my low-enough-to-start-a-bulk number (mid 172s with a target of 170). The first was in April while trying IF again and the second was August when I was eating throughout the day.
March/April loss: Dropped 4 lbs on rolling average weight in 18 days with 83% adherence (below TDEE) averaging 2178/day for a 372 cal/day deficit (-14.6%)
July/August loss: Dropped 5 lbs on rolling average weight in 54 days with 72% adherence averaging 2396/day for a 154 cal/day deficit (-6%)
My biggest concern with trying IF long-term in the past has been muscle loss but I believe there was a recent study (which I currently cannot find) that suggested this wasn't an issue as along as adequate protein is consumed. As it well documented on this thread, I'm historically incapable of getting properly lean enough to bulk so I'm back to trying IF as something that's been at least mildly more effective for me in the past.
I haven’t tried IF. I’m ravenous first thing when I wake up so always need breakfast. I guess I could try and stop eating early evening. I do that anyway as I’ve usually run out of calories.
Basically weight loss sucks for the last few pounds. And I’m bloody freezing cos of not much fat left. Except on my thighs.
I'm always surprised how quickly I'm able to adjust to skipping breakfast when I've dabbled with IF, but yes the last few pounds do suck. I've been working to get under 170 for multiple years now. I have one data point at 170.0 (1/20/2018) but otherwise it's been before I started lifting with any regularity in 2015 that I was in the 160s for any length of time. If my recent average BF% numbers are to be believed, best case is I hit 10% at 169.4, worst case it's 164.0. Came in at 178.0 this morning... so there's that.
I was in your same camp. I never was able to get lean enough to properly bulk and was never able to get below 173. But i am kind of glad i stuck out ketogenic as its the first time i have been lower. Currently, sitting at 168.
I tried IF a few years back and it was a terrible experience. I am just a big breakfast eater and that caused me to have struggles and i could never adapt to not eating it.1 -
So I tried not to eat breakfast and failed.
I’m a breakfast person. The only time I’m not eating or thinking about eating is when I’m asleep. So I can IF when im asleep right?
I’m gonna stop winging now as I have to remember all this is my choice and I don’t need or have to do it other than because I’m vain.0 -
I can't do IF either, I am way too hungry in the morning and before bed and breakfast with my coffee is my special 5 min where I can usually sit and enjoy my food.
Instead I calorie cycle with large swings (not now though since I'm nursing). At the end of my last cut a few lbs from goal I would keep my low day calories at 1000-1200 (twice a week) basically mostly protein.. small meals and high protein snacks. This was a buffer which allowed me to relax on the other days. It worked well but obviously not something I could stick to long term, but great for getting very lean. Oh I miss being so lean.3 -
Hey all, it's been a long time.
Tagging onto the conversation upstairs... I'm not sure about a traditional IF protocol. What I have been doing for this recomp in the last 8 months or so is a protein shake (simple whey, no carbs) when I get up with my vitamins at 6am. A banana at 9am and a protein bar (zero sugar) at 10am. I'll eat a full lunch at 1pm and another protein shake and dinner around 7pm after the gym. Dinner tends to be relatively large - as I need to hit about 2.8-3K daily total with this meal. Another protein shake before bed. Workout days I sometimes supplement with a mass shake of some sort to add an additional 700 calories. Weekends are a free for all and I'll eat what I want. I've bounced between 210 and 205 eating like during this recomp experiment.
Anyhow - the recomp....
I know that I kept saying that I was done but I kept convincing myself to keep going (I'm stubborn). For those that don't somehow know... body recomposition is a glacially slow process - I do know and don't care about the few outliers or master photographers who populate other threads with their two month before and afters... let me tell you - it's SLOW. I was able to increase all my lifts, but I'm talking maybe 5-10 pounds in 8 months. Do I look better than I did at the start? Is my BF% lower? I don't know about "better" I can see differences. Chest is a little fuller at the edges, more vascularity, and mabye a couple or three percentage points lower. Is this worth it? For me, I'm going to say no. This was a failed experiment. Progress is molasses and now I'm a year behind certain strength goals. Is this worth it to others? Maybe - if you are pretty much near goal weight and hate the idea of getting fluffy or have issue cutting, it will eventually get you there (unless you are old as heck like me - time isn't my friend, lol).
I was also able to not log anything for the last 8 months... so there is that. I won't lie, being free from logging everything was exceptionally nice.
So, New Years Resolution = fluffy town here I come!
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Welcome @chickencereal! Best of luck on your cut Feel free to keep us updated on your progress!
Looking great @jseams1234 .. it's all a learning experience. I also dabbled in recomp in the past and it is just not for me, although I will be trying it again for 6-7 months until I can run another bulk next fall.3 -
@sardelsa thank you! I am a thicker than you but I think we might have a similar build and are following a similar plan so I hope my after pics resemble yours! And I will post them. Since I said it now I have to.
@jseams1234 You look fantastic Are you drinking protein shakes at night to help with muscle building or just to get enough in for the day?2 -
@chickencereal - thank you.
Shakes. I use them to hit my protein goals... which are high at 200-230g a day. It allows me to eat normal meals and not worry about tracking. During this recomp I haven’t logged anything. I typically will use about 6 scoops spread out through the day, so about 150g from shakes. The rest is food... I’m sure I’m way above target most days. However, when I bulk or cut everything is logged and weighed and I only use them to fill the gaps.
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jseams1234 wrote: »@chickencereal - thank you.
Shakes. I use them to hit my protein goals... which are high at 200-230g a day. It allows me to eat normal meals and not worry about tracking. During this recomp I haven’t logged anything. I typically will use about 6 scoops spread out through the day, so about 150g from shakes. The rest is food... I’m sure I’m way above target most days. However, when I bulk or cut everything is logged and weighed and I only use them to fill the gaps.
What kind of protein powder are you using? Also, do you run any other supplements?0 -
jseams1234 wrote: »@chickencereal - thank you.
Shakes. I use them to hit my protein goals... which are high at 200-230g a day. It allows me to eat normal meals and not worry about tracking. During this recomp I haven’t logged anything. I typically will use about 6 scoops spread out through the day, so about 150g from shakes. The rest is food... I’m sure I’m way above target most days. However, when I bulk or cut everything is logged and weighed and I only use them to fill the gaps.
What kind of protein powder are you using? Also, do you run any other supplements?
ON Gold Standard Whey mixed with water.
5g creatine maintenance daily, 4000iu D, 1000mcg B12, glucosamine/chondroitin/msm 1500/1200/1000, and a multi.
I have absorption issues with D and I’ve tested low in the past. The higher dose puts me in the 40-45 range.
I know my protein powder usage is a bit on the high side - maybe I’m just lazy and tired of chicken. 0 -
jseams1234 wrote: »jseams1234 wrote: »@chickencereal - thank you.
Shakes. I use them to hit my protein goals... which are high at 200-230g a day. It allows me to eat normal meals and not worry about tracking. During this recomp I haven’t logged anything. I typically will use about 6 scoops spread out through the day, so about 150g from shakes. The rest is food... I’m sure I’m way above target most days. However, when I bulk or cut everything is logged and weighed and I only use them to fill the gaps.
What kind of protein powder are you using? Also, do you run any other supplements?
ON Gold Standard Whey mixed with water.
5g creatine maintenance daily, 4000iu D, 1000mcg B12, glucosamine/chondroitin/msm 1500/1200/1000, and a multi.
I have absorption issues with D and I’ve tested low in the past. The higher dose puts me in the 40-45 range.
I know my protein powder usage is a bit on the high side - maybe I’m just lazy and tired of chicken.
Nice. I run L-Citrulline and BCAAs for recovery, use whey in my milkshakes and just picked up some Creatine Monohydrate. I am going to see if i respond this time. I believe some of my issues from CM was a poor quality version. Also use fish oil and magnesium as a buffer while on keto.3 -
If I’m already losing strength after 1 week of cutting, does that mean I need to increase my calories and by how much? Last week I averaged 30% below my TDEE, low carb (55-60g per day) definitely in ketosis. I know the cals are low, I thought I would start there and work my way up.
I’ve been lifting consistently for 10 months and was increasing reps or weight every week or two. Today I had to reduce all of my compound lifts by 10%. My balance and cardio suffered as well. I haven’t made any changes to my workout and I’m not totally gassed or anything just not as much energy as usual.
It could be related to my cycle and I know I need some time to adjust but still curious as to what others’ experiences have been.0 -
I wouldn’t make any decisions based on a week. Give it at least a month.0
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chickencereal wrote: »If I’m already losing strength after 1 week of cutting, does that mean I need to increase my calories and by how much? Last week I averaged 30% below my TDEE, low carb (55-60g per day) definitely in ketosis. I know the cals are low, I thought I would start there and work my way up.
I’ve been lifting consistently for 10 months and was increasing reps or weight every week or two. Today I had to reduce all of my compound lifts by 10%. My balance and cardio suffered as well. I haven’t made any changes to my workout and I’m not totally gassed or anything just not as much energy as usual.
It could be related to my cycle and I know I need some time to adjust but still curious as to what others’ experiences have been.
It could be the drop in calories or keto, it could take time to get used to it. @psuLemon is running keto on his cut he might have some advice on lifting and keeping strength up2 -
Can I just take some valuable space on this thread to say how much it sucks cutting during the holidays? Okay, maybe I should say trying to cut during the holidays. Egg nog with lots of rum is SOOO delicious!
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Can I just take some valuable space on this thread to say how much it sucks cutting during the holidays? Okay, maybe I should say trying to cut during the holidays. Egg nog with lots of rum is SOOO delicious!
Haha yea it does. Normally I would not be cutting right now but baby weight knows no season
Speaking of cutting, I was thinking of losing another 5lbs or so, when I am somewhat happy with my physique and less squishy, then transitioning into recomp. Which I will do for about 6-7 months. I always say I am going to do this, then I never stick with it.
I know it works but honestly I don't know if I have the patience for it. I don't want to run a full on bulk until I get a proper home gym set up which is probably going to be end of summer 2020. 3 -
chickencereal wrote: »If I’m already losing strength after 1 week of cutting, does that mean I need to increase my calories and by how much? Last week I averaged 30% below my TDEE, low carb (55-60g per day) definitely in ketosis. I know the cals are low, I thought I would start there and work my way up.
I’ve been lifting consistently for 10 months and was increasing reps or weight every week or two. Today I had to reduce all of my compound lifts by 10%. My balance and cardio suffered as well. I haven’t made any changes to my workout and I’m not totally gassed or anything just not as much energy as usual.
It could be related to my cycle and I know I need some time to adjust but still curious as to what others’ experiences have been.
What do you mean by "reducing all of my compound lifts by 10%"?
Take this as you will as this is my n=1 but it is based on research - I've had some extreme cuts before - dropped 60 pounds in less than four months at one point doing a modified RFL. I didn't lose any appreciable muscle or strength - but one of the things I did lose and rather quickly was endurance - or the amount of volume and frequency I could handle at the same intensity (weight on the bar).
I often see lifters doing the opposite - they increase volume and lower the weight on the bar when they cut. It's an old idea and a great way to lose muscle. You should try as hard as possible to keep the weight on the bar the same. Just decrease volume and frequency if needed. A measure of strength isn't how many sets or reps you can knock out but your 1RM.
Midway through my cuts I decrease volume. Near the end I decrease frequency. I was only lifting about twice a week full-body at the end of my last cut but intensity remained the same. After a few weeks of maintenance and into bulking again everything returned to normal and I didn't have months of playing catch-up again.
https://bodyrecomposition.com/training/weight-training-for-fat-loss-part-2.html/2 -
chickencereal wrote: »If I’m already losing strength after 1 week of cutting, does that mean I need to increase my calories and by how much? Last week I averaged 30% below my TDEE, low carb (55-60g per day) definitely in ketosis. I know the cals are low, I thought I would start there and work my way up.
I’ve been lifting consistently for 10 months and was increasing reps or weight every week or two. Today I had to reduce all of my compound lifts by 10%. My balance and cardio suffered as well. I haven’t made any changes to my workout and I’m not totally gassed or anything just not as much energy as usual.
It could be related to my cycle and I know I need some time to adjust but still curious as to what others’ experiences have been.
In my own personal experience...
It's rather normal, I don't think our bodies are as finite about calorie consumption as we'd like to think... I can't tell you how many times I've hit the gym after a weekend of being in a surplus and lifted less and have gone in at a deficit and lifted better...
I think our own psychosomatic effects on our bodies have more to do with gym performance than increasing or decreasing a 100 calories... That's nothing really, probably within the margin of error for most people tracking, because honestly there's no real way to track what you've burned in a given day...
Anyhow, getting back to the point... It's normal, this happens to me within the first few weeks of a cut... Again I think it is partly psychosomatic and partly my muscles readjusting to the decrease in energy stores...
I bounced back within a few weeks... Cut for about 5 months, nice and slow about 15lbs (0.75lbs/week). Within this time I lost about 10lbs off my bench, maybe a few reps off the biceps curls, not much else... And that's probably more so do to muscle depletion rather than tissue loss
Although it was anything but linear, I will admit.
I weighed food in the beginning to get an idea of what I was consuming, then just kinda eyeballed it.1 -
jseams1234 wrote: »What do you mean by "reducing all of my compound lifts by 10%"?
/
In # of reps except the deadlift, I reduced the weight on that because I wasn't sure if I could do it with proper form. That said, I had previously deadlifted the same weight to get into position for another exercise so I guess I haven't lost strength, just endurance. Thanks for asking me that so I was forced to look back! I don't plan on reducing weight, but will decrease reps if needed and add more rest in between sets. I was doing multiple pairs of supersets which is taxing to begin with and lifting without a rack is another energy suck too.Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »It's normal, this happens to me within the first few weeks of a cut... Again I think it is partly psychosomatic and partly my muscles readjusting to the decrease in energy stores...
Yeah I think you are right. Thanks for sharing your experience too that helps.3 -
Can I just take some valuable space on this thread to say how much it sucks cutting during the holidays? Okay, maybe I should say trying to cut during the holidays. Egg nog with lots of rum is SOOO delicious!
And to think i thought i was the only idiot cutting during the holidays. Welcome to the club!!!3 -
chickencereal wrote: »If I’m already losing strength after 1 week of cutting, does that mean I need to increase my calories and by how much? Last week I averaged 30% below my TDEE, low carb (55-60g per day) definitely in ketosis. I know the cals are low, I thought I would start there and work my way up.
I’ve been lifting consistently for 10 months and was increasing reps or weight every week or two. Today I had to reduce all of my compound lifts by 10%. My balance and cardio suffered as well. I haven’t made any changes to my workout and I’m not totally gassed or anything just not as much energy as usual.
It could be related to my cycle and I know I need some time to adjust but still curious as to what others’ experiences have been.
Its normal especially if you went from a more moderate carb diet to a keto diet. I have been on it for several months and my lifts haven't caught back up to where i was when i was eating 300g of carbs. Even with increased sodium, keto is going to cause a detriment... And is compounded with cutting.2 -
Can I just take some valuable space on this thread to say how much it sucks cutting during the holidays? Okay, maybe I should say trying to cut during the holidays. Egg nog with lots of rum is SOOO delicious!
And to think i thought i was the only idiot cutting during the holidays. Welcome to the club!!!
Nope, I’m the third idiot.3 -
cupcakesandproteinshakes wrote: »Can I just take some valuable space on this thread to say how much it sucks cutting during the holidays? Okay, maybe I should say trying to cut during the holidays. Egg nog with lots of rum is SOOO delicious!
And to think i thought i was the only idiot cutting during the holidays. Welcome to the club!!!
Nope, I’m the third idiot.
Fourth over here3 -
Can I just take some valuable space on this thread to say how much it sucks cutting during the holidays? Okay, maybe I should say trying to cut during the holidays. Egg nog with lots of rum is SOOO delicious!
And to think i thought i was the only idiot cutting during the holidays. Welcome to the club!!!
Please don't get the wrong impression, I said I was trying to cut during the holidays! My weight has flatlined the last two weeks because of Thanksgiving and a Christmas party this past weekend.
A note to those concerned about privacy and going on a cut, make sure nobody has access to your weigh-in data. You can see every f'ing vacation and party I went to on mine!
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