HELP ME - WHAT AM I DOING WRONG??
Replies
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Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
I remember looking at a diary once where someone was logging a mozzarella-covered cheeseburger as only 250 calories, because he'd made really bad choices in which entry to take from the database. There is SO MUCH bad data in there.
I also remember people saying they only don't log beverages and asying their 2x/day lattes were "just coffee."
It's not lying to yourself, its the downstream problem of not always realizing some of the issues with the database and what you're actually logging.
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Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
Everyone in similar positions to yours always claims they log everything accurately. 90% of the time, when they open their diaries that turns out not to be the case.
You may be one of the other 10%, or you may not. I will be interested to know whether increasing your intake alone, without changing up anything else, results in weight loss.
@ceiswyn I don't claim I tell the truth, why would I lie to myself it makes no sense
I don't know you and you don't know me so your opinion of me is irrelevant to me but thank you for your input when I openly asked for advice
Feedback is a gift and I appreciate you sharing how you perceive me
I have upped my intake AND upped my training programme, I see the both go hand in hand and I took the advice from a PT face to face as I have stated in this thread
have you ever seen the show 'secret eaters' ? this is exactly what they said. it is really eye opening!13 -
Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
I remember looking at a diary once where someone was logging a mozzarella-covered cheeseburger as only 250 calories, because he'd made really bad choices in which entry to take from the database. There is SO MUCH bad data in there.
I also remember people saying they only don't log beverages and asying their 2x/day lattes were "just coffee."
It's not lying to yourself, its the downstream problem of not always realizing some of the issues with the database and what you're actually logging.
yeah I see this could happen and agree with you which is why I try and scan as much raw ingredient as possible, weight and log recipes
I don't pick when eating as I completely recognise anything that passes my lips (except maybe toothpaste I don't log that) as intake and log
I even log black coffee
I am pretty certain I am true to myself and as best as I can be with logging tbh
I don't weigh fruit that I snack on at work but that's like maybe 2 pieces and again I log on the upper side to what I think. Plus I am very conscious of nutrition and have read and read so much over the past 18 months I really do think I am more aware than most of calorific content of foods.
Anyhow I feel good at the minute with the changes I made last week, feel fitter in training and am noticing muscle in new places 16 -
Muscleflex79 wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
Everyone in similar positions to yours always claims they log everything accurately. 90% of the time, when they open their diaries that turns out not to be the case.
You may be one of the other 10%, or you may not. I will be interested to know whether increasing your intake alone, without changing up anything else, results in weight loss.
@ceiswyn I don't claim I tell the truth, why would I lie to myself it makes no sense
I don't know you and you don't know me so your opinion of me is irrelevant to me but thank you for your input when I openly asked for advice
Feedback is a gift and I appreciate you sharing how you perceive me
I have upped my intake AND upped my training programme, I see the both go hand in hand and I took the advice from a PT face to face as I have stated in this thread
have you ever seen the show 'secret eaters' ? this is exactly what they said. it is really eye opening!
yes I have and it actually annoys me hahaha
But I guess if you don't know you don't know.
I had a little row with my husband yesterday as he put a chicken breast in as 100g and I was like 'really' I made him weigh it and it was 225g - he was shocked. I certainly can see how people do it without realising6 -
Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
I remember looking at a diary once where someone was logging a mozzarella-covered cheeseburger as only 250 calories, because he'd made really bad choices in which entry to take from the database. There is SO MUCH bad data in there.
I also remember people saying they only don't log beverages and asying their 2x/day lattes were "just coffee."
It's not lying to yourself, its the downstream problem of not always realizing some of the issues with the database and what you're actually logging.
I always think of the poster who wasn't logging her cooking spray because the label lists a quarter second spray as zero calories. But she was going through a can of the stuff every 1-2 days and had something like 900 calories unaccounted for.
Or the poor people who get caught up trusting the bar code scanner and verified entries. Oof, some of those are waaay off.18 -
diannethegeek wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
I remember looking at a diary once where someone was logging a mozzarella-covered cheeseburger as only 250 calories, because he'd made really bad choices in which entry to take from the database. There is SO MUCH bad data in there.
I also remember people saying they only don't log beverages and asying their 2x/day lattes were "just coffee."
It's not lying to yourself, its the downstream problem of not always realizing some of the issues with the database and what you're actually logging.
I always think of the poster who wasn't logging her cooking spray because the label lists a quarter second spray as zero calories. But she was going through a can of the stuff every 1-2 days and had something like 900 calories unaccounted for.
Or the poor people who get caught up trusting the bar code scanner and verified entries. Oof, some of those are waaay off.
I scanned a bar code on some number like week and it recognised it as passata!
hahaha
1 -
diannethegeek wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
I remember looking at a diary once where someone was logging a mozzarella-covered cheeseburger as only 250 calories, because he'd made really bad choices in which entry to take from the database. There is SO MUCH bad data in there.
I also remember people saying they only don't log beverages and asying their 2x/day lattes were "just coffee."
It's not lying to yourself, its the downstream problem of not always realizing some of the issues with the database and what you're actually logging.
I always think of the poster who wasn't logging her cooking spray because the label lists a quarter second spray as zero calories. But she was going through a can of the stuff every 1-2 days and had something like 900 calories unaccounted for.
Or the poor people who get caught up trusting the bar code scanner and verified entries. Oof, some of those are waaay off.
And I think of the poor poster who only realised they'd been logging the dry weight of rice against the DB entry for cooked, after they'd been eating something they didn't like for a couple of years because they thought it was low calorie!17 -
Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
Everyone in similar positions to yours always claims they log everything accurately. 90% of the time, when they open their diaries that turns out not to be the case.
You may be one of the other 10%, or you may not. I will be interested to know whether increasing your intake alone, without changing up anything else, results in weight loss.
@ceiswyn I don't claim I tell the truth, why would I lie to myself it makes no sense
I don't know you and you don't know me so your opinion of me is irrelevant to me but thank you for your input when I openly asked for advice
Feedback is a gift and I appreciate you sharing how you perceive me
I have upped my intake AND upped my training programme, I see the both go hand in hand and I took the advice from a PT face to face as I have stated in this thread
Nobody is saying that anyone is lying to themselves or anyone else.
We see it on here fairly often and what is meant isn't that the person is lying to themselves or "cheating their diary" they're just wayyyy less accurate than they thought they were being.
No harm, no foul.
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Mexicangreensalsa wrote: »If you are very sure, why are you so hesitant to open the diary? People are just trying to help.
Interesting as my diary is open, I am not hesitant at all - please go look, it's my truth laid open
Either there's an issue and you tried to look and couldn't
or
you assumed
I asked for help and I value all opinions but please make sure that you express and opinion and not an assumption
https://www.myfitnesspal.com/food/diary/Tracie_Lord
Maybe the link will help, please let me know if you cannot view my diary as it is open to public and if there is an issue I shall like to let the site know3 -
Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
Everyone in similar positions to yours always claims they log everything accurately. 90% of the time, when they open their diaries that turns out not to be the case.
You may be one of the other 10%, or you may not. I will be interested to know whether increasing your intake alone, without changing up anything else, results in weight loss.
@ceiswyn I don't claim I tell the truth, why would I lie to myself it makes no sense
I don't know you and you don't know me so your opinion of me is irrelevant to me but thank you for your input when I openly asked for advice
Feedback is a gift and I appreciate you sharing how you perceive me
I have upped my intake AND upped my training programme, I see the both go hand in hand and I took the advice from a PT face to face as I have stated in this thread
Nobody is saying that anyone is lying to themselves or anyone else.
We see it on here fairly often and what is meant isn't that the person is lying to themselves or "cheating their diary" they're just wayyyy less accurate than they thought they were being.
No harm, no foul.
This poster was saying that - each post they have made has been a dig but that's ok everyone is different
My diary is open for all to see so please look and let me know where you think I can go better. I have taken advice and changed things up in the last 2 weeks.
It is funny though as I added a protein bar before workout (on advice) and literally the day after someone else suggested I stop the protein bars! hahaha
What I am doing (changed in the last 2 weeks) seems to be working for me so I'm carrying on down that road I think for a while
That does not mean I don't value everyone's opinion 6 -
Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
Everyone in similar positions to yours always claims they log everything accurately. 90% of the time, when they open their diaries that turns out not to be the case.
You may be one of the other 10%, or you may not. I will be interested to know whether increasing your intake alone, without changing up anything else, results in weight loss.
@ceiswyn I don't claim I tell the truth, why would I lie to myself it makes no sense
I don't know you and you don't know me so your opinion of me is irrelevant to me but thank you for your input when I openly asked for advice
Feedback is a gift and I appreciate you sharing how you perceive me
I have upped my intake AND upped my training programme, I see the both go hand in hand and I took the advice from a PT face to face as I have stated in this thread
Nobody is saying that anyone is lying to themselves or anyone else.
We see it on here fairly often and what is meant isn't that the person is lying to themselves or "cheating their diary" they're just wayyyy less accurate than they thought they were being.
No harm, no foul.
This poster was saying that - each post they have made has been a dig but that's ok everyone is different
My diary is open for all to see so please look and let me know where you think I can go better. I have taken advice and changed things up in the last 2 weeks.
It is funny though as I added a protein bar before workout (on advice) and literally the day after someone else suggested I stop the protein bars! hahaha
What I am doing (changed in the last 2 weeks) seems to be working for me so I'm carrying on down that road I think for a while
That does not mean I don't value everyone's opinion
This poster was not saying that. RGv2's interpretation of my statements and my motives was 100% correct. But if thinking I'm a horrible person is helpful to you in some way, go for your life!
Thanks for opening your diary. If that's accurate, you're severely undereating. There are a couple of things I'd like to check; the '1 serving' of 'mushroom rice' and 'chicken satay' you had on Saturday? Are they your own recipe/entries? Did you really eat nothing after midmorning on Thursday? Otherwise, I have to agree that your logging looks pretty solid; certainly the things that you're not weighing aren't going to add up to a lot of extra calories (that would have to be one huge tangerine if so ) 10 -
Tracie - first I must congratulate you on your enduring politeness in thanking people for offering their advice and guidance even when you feel there is some criticism implied.
Had a quick look at your food diary - the mixture of measurements (cups, spoons and grams) is a slight concern.
Your exercise diary though does show some very, very high calorie burns - I would be extremely sceptical unless you have extraordinary levels of fitness, such as a competitive athlete.
Examples:
Stair-treadmill ergometer, general. Burning 16 cals/min is a rate few will achieve.
Treadmill, 10% gradient, 3.5mph walking. Even on an incline burning 10 cals/min I doubt is accurate for walking.
Elliptical Trainer. Over 13 cals/min is unlikely.
To get an idea of what your cardio calorie burn capabilities are I would suggest running on level ground for 20 minutes and using the net calorie formula bodyweight in pounds X distance in miles X 0.63 - while not of course transferable between different cardio exercises I think it would put some perspective on what you personally are likely to be capable of.18 -
Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
Everyone in similar positions to yours always claims they log everything accurately. 90% of the time, when they open their diaries that turns out not to be the case.
You may be one of the other 10%, or you may not. I will be interested to know whether increasing your intake alone, without changing up anything else, results in weight loss.
@ceiswyn I don't claim I tell the truth, why would I lie to myself it makes no sense
I don't know you and you don't know me so your opinion of me is irrelevant to me but thank you for your input when I openly asked for advice
Feedback is a gift and I appreciate you sharing how you perceive me
I have upped my intake AND upped my training programme, I see the both go hand in hand and I took the advice from a PT face to face as I have stated in this thread
Nobody is saying that anyone is lying to themselves or anyone else.
We see it on here fairly often and what is meant isn't that the person is lying to themselves or "cheating their diary" they're just wayyyy less accurate than they thought they were being.
No harm, no foul.
This poster was saying that - each post they have made has been a dig but that's ok everyone is different
My diary is open for all to see so please look and let me know where you think I can go better. I have taken advice and changed things up in the last 2 weeks.
It is funny though as I added a protein bar before workout (on advice) and literally the day after someone else suggested I stop the protein bars! hahaha
What I am doing (changed in the last 2 weeks) seems to be working for me so I'm carrying on down that road I think for a while
That does not mean I don't value everyone's opinion
This poster was not saying that. RGv2's interpretation of my statements and my motives was 100% correct. But if thinking I'm a horrible person is helpful to you in some way, go for your life!
Thanks for opening your diary. If that's accurate, you're severely undereating. There are a couple of things I'd like to check; the '1 serving' of 'mushroom rice' and 'chicken satay' you had on Saturday? Are they your own recipe/entries? Did you really eat nothing after midmorning on Thursday? Otherwise, I have to agree that your logging looks pretty solid; certainly the things that you're not weighing aren't going to add up to a lot of extra calories (that would have to be one huge tangerine if so )
I do not know you as a person and would not make judgement on you at all.
Yes they are my recipes that I have weighed all ingredients and portions out. Same with the 'quorn, mushroom and onion' as part of lunch yesterday. Thursday I am not sure what happened because I ate all day and need to check so thank you for alerting me to it.
In regards to the tangerines joking aside it bothers me as they are from my local farm and tiny - Like an inch and 1/2 at tops and I have no idea how to log them
My diary has always been open.
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Tracie - first I must congratulate you on your enduring politeness in thanking people for offering their advice and guidance even when you feel there is some criticism implied.
Had a quick look at your food diary - the mixture of measurements (cups, spoons and grams) is a slight concern.
Your exercise diary though does show some very, very high calorie burns - I would be extremely sceptical unless you have extraordinary levels of fitness, such as a competitive athlete.
Examples:
Stair-treadmill ergometer, general. Burning 16 cals/min is a rate few will achieve.
Treadmill, 10% gradient, 3.5mph walking. Even on an incline burning 10 cals/min I doubt is accurate for walking.
Elliptical Trainer. Over 13 cals/min is unlikely.
To get an idea of what your cardio calorie burn capabilities are I would suggest running on level ground for 20 minutes and using the net calorie formula bodyweight in pounds X distance in miles X 0.63 - while not of course transferable between different cardio exercises I think it would put some perspective on what you personally are likely to be capable of.
Thank you - I asked for advice and I need to allow myself to be open to it good or bad Its the assumptions that bother me but everyone is different I guess.
I amend these figures, rather than MFP database from what the machines at my gym tell me as they are programmes with my height, weight etc and all what I do is interval and HIIT so I find the nearest 'exercise' on the MFP database and amend the calories as per my machine data. My PT seems pretty certain they are correct. Thank you for pointing it out though and maybe I should push on this. Thought about a fitbit too and may help more with control.
Where is your calculation from please and what is it based on? That certainly may help me.3 -
Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie - first I must congratulate you on your enduring politeness in thanking people for offering their advice and guidance even when you feel there is some criticism implied.
Had a quick look at your food diary - the mixture of measurements (cups, spoons and grams) is a slight concern.
Your exercise diary though does show some very, very high calorie burns - I would be extremely sceptical unless you have extraordinary levels of fitness, such as a competitive athlete.
Examples:
Stair-treadmill ergometer, general. Burning 16 cals/min is a rate few will achieve.
Treadmill, 10% gradient, 3.5mph walking. Even on an incline burning 10 cals/min I doubt is accurate for walking.
Elliptical Trainer. Over 13 cals/min is unlikely.
To get an idea of what your cardio calorie burn capabilities are I would suggest running on level ground for 20 minutes and using the net calorie formula bodyweight in pounds X distance in miles X 0.63 - while not of course transferable between different cardio exercises I think it would put some perspective on what you personally are likely to be capable of.
Thank you - I asked for advice and I need to allow myself to be open to it good or bad Its the assumptions that bother me but everyone is different I guess.
I amend these figures, rather than MFP database from what the machines at my gym tell me as they are programmes with my height, weight etc and all what I do is interval and HIIT so I find the nearest 'exercise' on the MFP database and amend the calories as per my machine data. My PT seems pretty certain they are correct. Thank you for pointing it out though and maybe I should push on this. Thought about a fitbit too and may help more with control.
Where is your calculation from please and what is it based on? That certainly may help me.
Your PT's faith in machine's calorie estimates is badly misplaced!
There are some machines that are more accurate but ellipticals and stairs climbers are frequently badly over-stated. If there is an exercise bike that displays watts that can give very accurate numbers (average watts for an hour X 3.6 gives net cals).
Most machines estimate gross calorie not net, many are influenced by marketing departments rather than science ("use our machines and burn more calories!").
The running formula comes from scientific studies (Runnersworld website has a good write up on it). There isn't much variation in net calorie burns between different people of the same weight covering the same distance, the efficiency ratio (0.63) doesn't vary much. It's really using the physics of mass moved over distance to estimate the energy used.
HIIT isn't a high calorie burner, it's typically lower average than moderate intensity steady state as the recovery periods drag the average down. It just feels hard - energy however doesn't have feelings!
I can kill myself for an hour of really intense intervals on my bike trainer and my average comes out to what would simply be a brisk steady ride.
Fitbit may or may not be any better, can be good for steps, if using HR that is enormously varied between individuals and a really poor way to estimate calories for interval training.17 -
Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie - first I must congratulate you on your enduring politeness in thanking people for offering their advice and guidance even when you feel there is some criticism implied.
Had a quick look at your food diary - the mixture of measurements (cups, spoons and grams) is a slight concern.
Your exercise diary though does show some very, very high calorie burns - I would be extremely sceptical unless you have extraordinary levels of fitness, such as a competitive athlete.
Examples:
Stair-treadmill ergometer, general. Burning 16 cals/min is a rate few will achieve.
Treadmill, 10% gradient, 3.5mph walking. Even on an incline burning 10 cals/min I doubt is accurate for walking.
Elliptical Trainer. Over 13 cals/min is unlikely.
To get an idea of what your cardio calorie burn capabilities are I would suggest running on level ground for 20 minutes and using the net calorie formula bodyweight in pounds X distance in miles X 0.63 - while not of course transferable between different cardio exercises I think it would put some perspective on what you personally are likely to be capable of.
Thank you - I asked for advice and I need to allow myself to be open to it good or bad Its the assumptions that bother me but everyone is different I guess.
I amend these figures, rather than MFP database from what the machines at my gym tell me as they are programmes with my height, weight etc and all what I do is interval and HIIT so I find the nearest 'exercise' on the MFP database and amend the calories as per my machine data. My PT seems pretty certain they are correct. Thank you for pointing it out though and maybe I should push on this. Thought about a fitbit too and may help more with control.
Where is your calculation from please and what is it based on? That certainly may help me.
Your PT's faith in machine's calorie estimates is badly misplaced!
There are some machines that are more accurate but ellipticals and stairs climbers are frequently badly over-stated. If there is an exercise bike that displays watts that can give very accurate numbers (average watts for an hour X 3.6 gives net cals).
Most machines estimate gross calorie not net, many are influenced by marketing departments rather than science ("use our machines and burn more calories!").
The running formula comes from scientific studies (Runnersworld website has a good write up on it). There isn't much variation in net calorie burns between different people of the same weight covering the same distance, the efficiency ratio (0.63) doesn't vary much. It's really using the physics of mass moved over distance to estimate the energy used.
HIIT isn't a high calorie burner, it's typically lower average than moderate intensity steady state as the recovery periods drag the average down. It just feels hard - energy however doesn't have feelings!
I can kill myself for an hour of really intense intervals on my bike trainer and my average comes out to what would simply be a brisk steady ride.
Fitbit may or may not be any better, can be good for steps, if using HR that is enormously varied between individuals and a really poor way to estimate calories for interval training.
thanks for the insight
My mind is a little of a mush at the minute with all the conflicting information5 -
Just an insight with the exercise, my elliptical (set to my height and weight) says I burn 1000 calories in 90 minutes, yet according to my apple watch, I only burn 450. I've found pretty much all machines set to my height and weight show almost double what I actually burn.5
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Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie - first I must congratulate you on your enduring politeness in thanking people for offering their advice and guidance even when you feel there is some criticism implied.
Had a quick look at your food diary - the mixture of measurements (cups, spoons and grams) is a slight concern.
Your exercise diary though does show some very, very high calorie burns - I would be extremely sceptical unless you have extraordinary levels of fitness, such as a competitive athlete.
Examples:
Stair-treadmill ergometer, general. Burning 16 cals/min is a rate few will achieve.
Treadmill, 10% gradient, 3.5mph walking. Even on an incline burning 10 cals/min I doubt is accurate for walking.
Elliptical Trainer. Over 13 cals/min is unlikely.
To get an idea of what your cardio calorie burn capabilities are I would suggest running on level ground for 20 minutes and using the net calorie formula bodyweight in pounds X distance in miles X 0.63 - while not of course transferable between different cardio exercises I think it would put some perspective on what you personally are likely to be capable of.
Thank you - I asked for advice and I need to allow myself to be open to it good or bad Its the assumptions that bother me but everyone is different I guess.
I amend these figures, rather than MFP database from what the machines at my gym tell me as they are programmes with my height, weight etc and all what I do is interval and HIIT so I find the nearest 'exercise' on the MFP database and amend the calories as per my machine data. My PT seems pretty certain they are correct. Thank you for pointing it out though and maybe I should push on this. Thought about a fitbit too and may help more with control.
Where is your calculation from please and what is it based on? That certainly may help me.
Your PT's faith in machine's calorie estimates is badly misplaced!
There are some machines that are more accurate but ellipticals and stairs climbers are frequently badly over-stated. If there is an exercise bike that displays watts that can give very accurate numbers (average watts for an hour X 3.6 gives net cals).
Most machines estimate gross calorie not net, many are influenced by marketing departments rather than science ("use our machines and burn more calories!").
The running formula comes from scientific studies (Runnersworld website has a good write up on it). There isn't much variation in net calorie burns between different people of the same weight covering the same distance, the efficiency ratio (0.63) doesn't vary much. It's really using the physics of mass moved over distance to estimate the energy used.
HIIT isn't a high calorie burner, it's typically lower average than moderate intensity steady state as the recovery periods drag the average down. It just feels hard - energy however doesn't have feelings!
I can kill myself for an hour of really intense intervals on my bike trainer and my average comes out to what would simply be a brisk steady ride.
Fitbit may or may not be any better, can be good for steps, if using HR that is enormously varied between individuals and a really poor way to estimate calories for interval training.
thanks for the insight
My mind is a little of a mush at the minute with all the conflicting information
I agree with Sijomial's advice here about calorie burns, machines, HIIT vs. moderate steady state, etc. . . . with pretty much the whole thing. There are some folks around here who are careful and knowledgeable advisors about specific topics, and this set of posts was about an area where he's very knowledgeable.
What he's saying is consistent with my personal experience of more than a decade of being very active and training/competing as a masters athlete; and consistent with my coaching education (rowing coaching education, in my case) as well.
On other threads, he's posted detailed analyses that support many of his points on this thread.
IMO, you should listen to him about exercise calorie expenditure . . . bizarrely, I'd say to pay attention to him as a serious amateur over a lot of trainers, who are often overly influenced by trendy fitness stars and blogs, and not as tuned into the underlying science.20 -
Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
Everyone in similar positions to yours always claims they log everything accurately. 90% of the time, when they open their diaries that turns out not to be the case.
You may be one of the other 10%, or you may not. I will be interested to know whether increasing your intake alone, without changing up anything else, results in weight loss.
@ceiswyn I don't claim I tell the truth, why would I lie to myself it makes no sense
I don't know you and you don't know me so your opinion of me is irrelevant to me but thank you for your input when I openly asked for advice
Feedback is a gift and I appreciate you sharing how you perceive me
I have upped my intake AND upped my training programme, I see the both go hand in hand and I took the advice from a PT face to face as I have stated in this thread
Nobody is saying that anyone is lying to themselves or anyone else.
We see it on here fairly often and what is meant isn't that the person is lying to themselves or "cheating their diary" they're just wayyyy less accurate than they thought they were being.
No harm, no foul.
This poster was saying that - each post they have made has been a dig but that's ok everyone is different
My diary is open for all to see so please look and let me know where you think I can go better. I have taken advice and changed things up in the last 2 weeks.
It is funny though as I added a protein bar before workout (on advice) and literally the day after someone else suggested I stop the protein bars! hahaha
What I am doing (changed in the last 2 weeks) seems to be working for me so I'm carrying on down that road I think for a while
That does not mean I don't value everyone's opinion
This poster was not saying that. RGv2's interpretation of my statements and my motives was 100% correct. But if thinking I'm a horrible person is helpful to you in some way, go for your life!
Thanks for opening your diary. If that's accurate, you're severely undereating. There are a couple of things I'd like to check; the '1 serving' of 'mushroom rice' and 'chicken satay' you had on Saturday? Are they your own recipe/entries? Did you really eat nothing after midmorning on Thursday? Otherwise, I have to agree that your logging looks pretty solid; certainly the things that you're not weighing aren't going to add up to a lot of extra calories (that would have to be one huge tangerine if so )
I do not know you as a person and would not make judgement on you at all.
Yes they are my recipes that I have weighed all ingredients and portions out. Same with the 'quorn, mushroom and onion' as part of lunch yesterday. Thursday I am not sure what happened because I ate all day and need to check so thank you for alerting me to it.
In regards to the tangerines joking aside it bothers me as they are from my local farm and tiny - Like an inch and 1/2 at tops and I have no idea how to log them
My diary has always been open.
Use "Tangerines, (mandarin oranges), raw" and you will get the admin entry which includes options for weight.
Unfortunately, the "verified" green check marks in the MFP database are used for both user-created entries and admin-created entries that MFP pulled from the USDA database. To find admin entries for whole foods, I get the syntax from the USDA database and paste that into MFP.
For packaged foods, I verify the label against what I find in MFP. (Unfortunately, we cannot just scan and assume what you get is correct.)5 -
Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie - first I must congratulate you on your enduring politeness in thanking people for offering their advice and guidance even when you feel there is some criticism implied.
Had a quick look at your food diary - the mixture of measurements (cups, spoons and grams) is a slight concern.
Your exercise diary though does show some very, very high calorie burns - I would be extremely sceptical unless you have extraordinary levels of fitness, such as a competitive athlete.
Examples:
Stair-treadmill ergometer, general. Burning 16 cals/min is a rate few will achieve.
Treadmill, 10% gradient, 3.5mph walking. Even on an incline burning 10 cals/min I doubt is accurate for walking.
Elliptical Trainer. Over 13 cals/min is unlikely.
To get an idea of what your cardio calorie burn capabilities are I would suggest running on level ground for 20 minutes and using the net calorie formula bodyweight in pounds X distance in miles X 0.63 - while not of course transferable between different cardio exercises I think it would put some perspective on what you personally are likely to be capable of.
Thank you - I asked for advice and I need to allow myself to be open to it good or bad Its the assumptions that bother me but everyone is different I guess.
I amend these figures, rather than MFP database from what the machines at my gym tell me as they are programmes with my height, weight etc and all what I do is interval and HIIT so I find the nearest 'exercise' on the MFP database and amend the calories as per my machine data. My PT seems pretty certain they are correct. Thank you for pointing it out though and maybe I should push on this. Thought about a fitbit too and may help more with control.
Where is your calculation from please and what is it based on? That certainly may help me.
Your PT's faith in machine's calorie estimates is badly misplaced!
There are some machines that are more accurate but ellipticals and stairs climbers are frequently badly over-stated. If there is an exercise bike that displays watts that can give very accurate numbers (average watts for an hour X 3.6 gives net cals).
Most machines estimate gross calorie not net, many are influenced by marketing departments rather than science ("use our machines and burn more calories!").
The running formula comes from scientific studies (Runnersworld website has a good write up on it). There isn't much variation in net calorie burns between different people of the same weight covering the same distance, the efficiency ratio (0.63) doesn't vary much. It's really using the physics of mass moved over distance to estimate the energy used.
HIIT isn't a high calorie burner, it's typically lower average than moderate intensity steady state as the recovery periods drag the average down. It just feels hard - energy however doesn't have feelings!
I can kill myself for an hour of really intense intervals on my bike trainer and my average comes out to what would simply be a brisk steady ride.
Fitbit may or may not be any better, can be good for steps, if using HR that is enormously varied between individuals and a really poor way to estimate calories for interval training.
thanks for the insight
My mind is a little of a mush at the minute with all the conflicting information
I agree with Sijomial's advice here about calorie burns, machines, HIIT vs. moderate steady state, etc. . . . with pretty much the whole thing. There are some folks around here who are careful and knowledgeable advisors about specific topics, and this set of posts was about an area where he's very knowledgeable.
What he's saying is consistent with my personal experience of more than a decade of being very active and training/competing as a masters athlete; and consistent with my coaching education (rowing coaching education, in my case) as well.
On other threads, he's posted detailed analyses that support many of his points on this thread.
IMO, you should listen to him about exercise calorie expenditure . . . bizarrely, I'd say to pay attention to him as a serious amateur over a lot of trainers, who are often overly influenced by trendy fitness stars and blogs, and not as tuned into the underlying science.
Thank you and I absolutely have taken in all his advice and will run his calculations. Also going to invest in a fitbit and see if that helps.
Honestly so long as I am working hard and getting nutrition I am not overly bothered about the numbers at the moment but as I get further along the line it's definitely going to be more important to understand the science and the correct calculations1 -
kshama2001 wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »Tracie_Lord wrote: »If you are consistently gaining weight or plateauing, then you are by definition not in a calorie deficit.
I can't remember whether you said how you're logging your food and choosing your DB entries?
I log everything and am very careful - always over log if I am unsure on anything
I also once thought as you did but the truth is I don't think it is that simple and I say that from experience.
Everyone is different.
Thanks for the input though
Everyone in similar positions to yours always claims they log everything accurately. 90% of the time, when they open their diaries that turns out not to be the case.
You may be one of the other 10%, or you may not. I will be interested to know whether increasing your intake alone, without changing up anything else, results in weight loss.
@ceiswyn I don't claim I tell the truth, why would I lie to myself it makes no sense
I don't know you and you don't know me so your opinion of me is irrelevant to me but thank you for your input when I openly asked for advice
Feedback is a gift and I appreciate you sharing how you perceive me
I have upped my intake AND upped my training programme, I see the both go hand in hand and I took the advice from a PT face to face as I have stated in this thread
Nobody is saying that anyone is lying to themselves or anyone else.
We see it on here fairly often and what is meant isn't that the person is lying to themselves or "cheating their diary" they're just wayyyy less accurate than they thought they were being.
No harm, no foul.
This poster was saying that - each post they have made has been a dig but that's ok everyone is different
My diary is open for all to see so please look and let me know where you think I can go better. I have taken advice and changed things up in the last 2 weeks.
It is funny though as I added a protein bar before workout (on advice) and literally the day after someone else suggested I stop the protein bars! hahaha
What I am doing (changed in the last 2 weeks) seems to be working for me so I'm carrying on down that road I think for a while
That does not mean I don't value everyone's opinion
This poster was not saying that. RGv2's interpretation of my statements and my motives was 100% correct. But if thinking I'm a horrible person is helpful to you in some way, go for your life!
Thanks for opening your diary. If that's accurate, you're severely undereating. There are a couple of things I'd like to check; the '1 serving' of 'mushroom rice' and 'chicken satay' you had on Saturday? Are they your own recipe/entries? Did you really eat nothing after midmorning on Thursday? Otherwise, I have to agree that your logging looks pretty solid; certainly the things that you're not weighing aren't going to add up to a lot of extra calories (that would have to be one huge tangerine if so )
I do not know you as a person and would not make judgement on you at all.
Yes they are my recipes that I have weighed all ingredients and portions out. Same with the 'quorn, mushroom and onion' as part of lunch yesterday. Thursday I am not sure what happened because I ate all day and need to check so thank you for alerting me to it.
In regards to the tangerines joking aside it bothers me as they are from my local farm and tiny - Like an inch and 1/2 at tops and I have no idea how to log them
My diary has always been open.
Use "Tangerines, (mandarin oranges), raw" and you will get the admin entry which includes options for weight.
Unfortunately, the "verified" green check marks in the MFP database are used for both user-created entries and admin-created entries that MFP pulled from the USDA database. To find admin entries for whole foods, I get the syntax from the USDA database and paste that into MFP.
For packaged foods, I verify the label against what I find in MFP. (Unfortunately, we cannot just scan and assume what you get is correct.)
Thanks I will try that 1 -
For all those that commented on my post, again thank you.
I have really stepped up with the help of my PT, invested in a fit bit and down to 30.7% body fat so keeping going.
The high protein, watching my macros and the new training regime works for me.
To those stuck on your journey, listen to your body - I get told do this, don't do that, you don't eat enough, you don't track right etc etc but I must be doing something right as I am 110lbs down and probably happier and fitter and more educated that I have been possibly ever.4 -
Noreenmarie1234 wrote: »Just an insight with the exercise, my elliptical (set to my height and weight) says I burn 1000 calories in 90 minutes, yet according to my apple watch, I only burn 450. I've found pretty much all machines set to my height and weight show almost double what I actually burn.
Yep, and even fitness watches can be off by a lot if the wearer's heartrate deviates too much from the bleh equation 220-age. If you happen to have a faster maximum heart rate (it's genetic) then you might get crazy fake burns from just walking briskly through a supermarket. For running, 0.63*distance*weight really is a fantastic equivalent, for walking 0.3*distance*weight (see how running burns more than twice as much?), and for cycling use watts.0 -
Noreenmarie1234 wrote: »Just an insight with the exercise, my elliptical (set to my height and weight) says I burn 1000 calories in 90 minutes, yet according to my apple watch, I only burn 450. I've found pretty much all machines set to my height and weight show almost double what I actually burn.
Yep, and even fitness watches can be off by a lot if the wearer's heartrate deviates too much from the bleh equation 220-age. If you happen to have a faster maximum heart rate (it's genetic) then you might get crazy fake burns from just walking briskly through a supermarket. For running, 0.63*distance*weight really is a fantastic equivalent, for walking 0.3*distance*weight (see how running burns more than twice as much?), and for cycling use watts.
That'd be weight in pounds, distance in miles, right? 1 -
Noreenmarie1234 wrote: »Just an insight with the exercise, my elliptical (set to my height and weight) says I burn 1000 calories in 90 minutes, yet according to my apple watch, I only burn 450. I've found pretty much all machines set to my height and weight show almost double what I actually burn.
Yep, and even fitness watches can be off by a lot if the wearer's heartrate deviates too much from the bleh equation 220-age. If you happen to have a faster maximum heart rate (it's genetic) then you might get crazy fake burns from just walking briskly through a supermarket. For running, 0.63*distance*weight really is a fantastic equivalent, for walking 0.3*distance*weight (see how running burns more than twice as much?), and for cycling use watts.
That'd be weight in pounds, distance in miles, right?
Sorry, yes. I converted it to kg and km once, but can't find it anymore.
Ok,
Running: 0.86*kg*km
Walking: 0.41*kg*km1 -
Hello OP - just wanted to say well done on the mega weight loss ! I also encourage you to listen to your body and remember there is no harm in tweaking what you do one way or the other ! If it works, great, if it doesnt, tweak it again and find what does works for you.
To add, I think there are plenty of people here who just eat back half the exercise calories calculated by anything - I sometimes just cap what I eat back to 400 calories no matter what I have been doing ! I am glad your new regime has kickstarted things for you AND you are feeling good - brava !
Btw, I thought some of you diary entries looked lovely as well - its encouraged me to shake mine up a bit !2 -
@OooohToast you are so right, we are all different and need to find out niche!
Not sure what entries inspired you tbh
I just like good food 😂😂
I no longer log any workouts on this platform as I sync my food entries to my fit bit and that helps me
Thanks for your lovely comments0
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