TheFast Diet

ritchiedrama

I kept stating, 5:2 has no advantages for FAT LOSS.

...and it doesn't claim to, so why are you trumpeting about it?

I don't care about health issues, I do normal IF, I know about "health issues"

There is no 'normal IF' - there are many types of intermittent fasting. And of course you don't care about health issues, you're young and probably don't contemplate your own mortality that often...but as you get older and staring at yourself in a mirror starts to bore you, then health issues may start to interest you more. Getting closer to old age tends to do that.

The OP and many others do this for FAT LOSS and have no ideas about the health benefits for a start. I don't try and betlittle others, I try and make people create a better relationship with food.

1. "lmao at these people" and "I'm sorry there's something wrong with you" is 100% ridicule
2. Ever thought that, perhaps, your attempts to 'make people create a better relationship with food' don't delight others as much as they're obviously delighting yourself?

Because people are attempting 5:2 for fat loss. Just like the OP said in her post about her plateau.

Normal IF would be 16:8. That is the IF people SHOULD be doing, if any. I care about my health, sure, but these same people that care about their health are over weight, so logic is flawed.

Your third point is just pointl(less). So i'll ignore that one.

stefjc

Oh, and you really do need to read up on psychology and it effects on behaviour.

The Health Behaviour Model, the Transactional Model and many others would help explain how a belief in something makes it more effective - like a placebo. Also how intermittent restriction - the basis of ALL IF diets - is less onerous for some.

5:2 is just another of them. Eating windows are fine for some, big restrictions on 2 days a week are fine for others. Physiologically the result is the same. Psychologically the results are different. Hence no one diet fits all - that old chestnut!

And before you light into that, try thinking about it. You can restate your opinion. It is, as has been pointed out here, based on your not understanding something, or providing a fallacious argument that only you have made. You may be utterly sincere. But it is still just your opinion - and that opinion is not very well informed, nor is it likely to be whilst you continue to shout at people who don't agree with you!

pinkraynedropjacki

I have been doing 4:3 (a version of 5:2) for 3 weeks now. Tomorrow is my 8th fasting day. I have been going with 0calories those days & feel great. I only had 5kg I wanted to lose & I'm already half way (not much I know but the closer I get the harder it is to shift) but I have been losing size.

ritchiedrama

Oh, and you really do need to read up on psychology and it effects on behaviour.

The Health Behaviour Model, the Transactional Model and many others would help explain how a belief in something makes it more effective - like a placebo. Also how intermittent restriction - the basis of ALL IF diets - is less onerous for some.

5:2 is just another of them. Eating windows are fine for some, big restrictions on 2 days a week are fine for others. Physiologically the result is the same. Psychologically the results are different. Hence no one diet fits all - that old chestnut!

And before you light into that, try thinking about it. You can restate your opinion. It is, as has been pointed out here, based on your not understanding something, or providing a fallacious argument that only you have made. You may be utterly sincere. But it is still just your opinion - and that opinion is not very well informed, nor is it likely to be whilst you continue to shout at people who don't agree with you!

Eating 600 calories for 2 days a week is not beneficial to anyone, it is plain insanity.

There is a certain type of people who believe otherwise, but I won't get into that, but its funny how the really in shape people (even ones like myself who were heavily overweight) have never, and will never do these things and we _all_ disagree with it.

But hey what do I know, I guess I fell out of a tree and lost 65 lbs.

stefjc

I like how you disagree with me, but don't even attempt to give any reasoning as to why, you just tell me I have a poor attitude. My attitude is irrelevant.

Erm.... I think I did try to explain, and said here why I won't be doing it again. It is a pointless task as you don't read or listen. In fact you deride any science you haven't read - or consider to be too old. Which made me smile for so very many reasons. You also assigned to me a short list of misconceptions, none of which I had ever posted about. So you see, Richie, we have been there before and you were rude then too!

And for someone who claims to want to help people and to have real life clients attitude really does matter.

pinkraynedropjacki

Yes, Richie. As usual I took care to read what you said. I believe what you say EXCEPT that 5:2 is useless.

It is one way to achieve calorie deficit and achieve fat loss. Just one. One of many.

That it is one you personally choose to disregard does not make it useless.

I would point you toward some of the research studies, but last time that happened you lambasted me for reading old studies and believing in fairies, or some such nonsense I had never posted any opinion on.

You are posting an opinion. You are posting it in such a manner that you are being rude. All that is required is that you try to be less opinionated and a little more educated.

Lets put this out in clear terms.

I stated 5:2 works. Yes.

I stated it is unnecessary. Yes.



Why is it unnecessary? It is unnecessary because you can just eat the correct amount of calories each day, to achieve the same effect, rather than eating 600 calories for 2 days each, which no human should have to endure because it is RIDICULOUS.

Is there a fat loss advantage doing 5:2 over a normal caloric deficit: no.


My question to you is: why bother?

5:2 is ridiculous why? Why set yourself up like this for the entirety of your life? Why not create a better relationship with food and learn to control yourself and eat the correct amount of food rather than looking for stupid things to follow.
;
My job here is done.

You really have no clue do you? Do you not think that people on 5:2 know self control on their normal days? IS that why I'm currently 13000 calories UNDER net this week alone? Yeah cause I must not be able to control myself right?

If you knew anything about it (and clearly you do not) then you would know that it not only makes you want to eat less on your normal TDEE days, but you learn to eat only when HUNGRY & not when you are told you should eat or when you think you are hungry. You learn what hunger feels like & then use that to sustain yourself.


Go back to your weights & 16:8....... oh wait.... that's the one where you pig out for 8 hours. Self control...hows that working for ya?

ritchiedrama

I like how you disagree with me, but don't even attempt to give any reasoning as to why, you just tell me I have a poor attitude. My attitude is irrelevant.

Erm.... I think I did try to explain, and said here why I won't be doing it again. It is a pointless task as you don't read or listen. In fact you deride any science you haven't read - or consider to be too old. Which made me smile for so very many reasons. You also assigned to me a short list of misconceptions, none of which I had ever posted about. So you see, Richie, we have been there before and you were rude then too!

And for someone who claims to want to help people and to have real life clients attitude really does matter.

I watched the entire documentary Michael Mosley did, twice. You perceive me as rude, but you don't actually make any sense.

Now, answer this for me, if you will:

If I eat 15,000 calories over 7 days - 2142 calories a day for 7 days.

or

If I eat 15,000 calories over 5 days - 3000 calories for 5 days. (but do 5:2) so remove 1200 of those calories so i eat 600 twice a week.


Would fat loss be the same (providing that is the calories of a deficit)?

Ophidion

I have 5-10 pounds more to lose.

I don't think Ritchie was incorrect in the sense the OP was stating that their goal was weight loss, and science would dictate that a calorie deficit would be the ultimate reason for losing weight. Be it through IF or not, calorie deficit is the reason for a loss.

OP what ever works for you and try to think sustainable.

pinkraynedropjacki

As for the OP


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9Aj6hRYg4A



Watch this. Explains it better & don't listen to Ritchie. He's a 24yo who has 'clients' even though he has no qualifications in anything (apart from playing games) and thinks that people like Doctors, Professors & real teachers with real qualifications know less than him.

stefjc

Eating 600 calories for 2 days a week is not beneficial to anyone, it is plain insanity.

Again, your opinion. Where is your evidence?

There is a certain type of people who believe otherwise, but I won't get into that, but its funny how the really in shape people (even ones like myself who were heavily overweight) have never, and will never do these things and we _all_ disagree with it.

Ignoring the appalling grammar. You don't know me or many other posters here. So how do you know you all disagree with 'it'?

You are being silly, provocative but silly.

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ritchiedrama

You really have no clue do you? Do you not think that people on 5:2 know self control on their normal days? IS that why I'm currently 13000 calories UNDER net this week alone? Yeah cause I must not be able to control myself right?

If you knew anything about it (and clearly you do not) then you would know that it not only makes you want to eat less on your normal TDEE days, but you learn to eat only when HUNGRY & not when you are told you should eat or when you think you are hungry. You learn what hunger feels like & then use that to sustain yourself.


Go back to your weights & 16:8....... oh wait.... that's the one where you pig out for 8 hours. Self control...hows that working for ya?

You obviously can't control yourself, no, otherwise you'd be eating the same 7 days a week and not being ridiculous.

16:8 removes all hunger pangs as it is, if you need anymore you have a mental issue with food.

Self control working out for me? Yep, I'm in fairly good shape, I was down to 4 days a week of 1350 calories a day whilst having raised calories 3x a week, and managed to get down to 10% bodyfat - when you can come even CLOSE to that, we can probably continue a conversation.

ritchiedrama

As for the OP


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9Aj6hRYg4A



Watch this. Explains it better & don't listen to Ritchie. He's a 24yo who has 'clients' even though he has no qualifications in anything (apart from playing games) and thinks that people like Doctors, Professors & real teachers with real qualifications know less than him.

Not seen the amount of people complaining about their doctors, nutrionists etc lately? You should go over to the "Why do you guys over-complicate everything" thread - you'd fit in well there.

ritchiedrama

I have 5-10 pounds more to lose.

I don't think Ritchie was incorrect in the sense the OP was stating that their goal was weight loss, and science would dictate that a calorie deficit would be the ultimate reason for losing weight. Be it through IF or not, calorie deficit is the reason for a loss.

OP what ever works for you and try to think sustainable.

Finally, someone with sense appears.

stefjc

Now, answer this for me, if you will:

If I eat 15,000 calories over 7 days - 2142 calories a day for 7 days.

or

If I eat 15,000 calories over 5 days - 3000 calories for 5 days. (but do 5:2) so remove 1200 of those calories so i eat 600 twice a week.


Would fat loss be the same (providing that is the calories of a deficit)?

What? Do you really expect a meaningful answer? In short I cannot know as I have no baseline data, no bodpod measure etc etc.

5:2 numbers don't go like that, so that is an invalid assumption for a start.

The question is meaningless and unanswerable without a science lab, a meaningful cohort etc.

ritchiedrama

Now, answer this for me, if you will:

If I eat 15,000 calories over 7 days - 2142 calories a day for 7 days.

or

If I eat 15,000 calories over 5 days - 3000 calories for 5 days. (but do 5:2) so remove 1200 of those calories so i eat 600 twice a week.


Would fat loss be the same (providing that is the calories of a deficit)?

What? Do you really expect a meaningful answer? In short I cannot know as I have no baseline data, no bodpod measure etc etc.

5:2 numbers don't go like that, so that is an invalid assumption for a start.

The question is meaningless and unanswerable without a science lab, a meaningful cohort etc.

The answer is no, the fat loss will be the same.

The calories taken in is the same.

Bye.

stefjc

And if you truly believe that you have only shown that you lack a lot of information and have a very poor understanding of physiology.

Nice dismissal but your grammar still undermines your point!

ritchiedrama

And if you truly believe that you have only shown that you lack a lot of information and have a very poor understanding of physiology.

Nice dismisaal though!

You can't even be serious anymore, you must be trolling.

pinkraynedropjacki

You really have no clue do you? Do you not think that people on 5:2 know self control on their normal days? IS that why I'm currently 13000 calories UNDER net this week alone? Yeah cause I must not be able to control myself right?

If you knew anything about it (and clearly you do not) then you would know that it not only makes you want to eat less on your normal TDEE days, but you learn to eat only when HUNGRY & not when you are told you should eat or when you think you are hungry. You learn what hunger feels like & then use that to sustain yourself.


Go back to your weights & 16:8....... oh wait.... that's the one where you pig out for 8 hours. Self control...hows that working for ya?

You obviously can't control yourself, no, otherwise you'd be eating the same 7 days a week and not being ridiculous.

16:8 removes all hunger pangs as it is, if you need anymore you have a mental issue with food.

Self control working out for me? Yep, I'm in fairly good shape, I was down to 4 days a week of 1350 calories a day whilst having raised calories 3x a week, and managed to get down to 10% bodyfat - when you can come even CLOSE to that, we can probably continue a conversation.

Wait....let me tell you a few things.

1. 1200 calories for 7 months.... not one calorie over. Lost 30kg
2. 1300 calories to stay there...lost another 5kg without trying
3. eat the same thing EVERY SINGLE DAY for the last 560 days in a row. Not once have I gone over in calories.
4. Since starting here on the 8th Feb 2012 I have lost all the weight I planned & then some. All without having to worry about going over cause I have some damn fine self control & a damn fine attitude towards food & working out.
5. Workout every single day despite having a back injury, bad knees & a few other things like shin splints and a nice achillies tendon tear..... yeah I run 10km with all that & more.
6. I got fat cause I was lazy & drank my calories in the form of Coke..... not from over eating or lack of control. Plus a back injury that didn't help.
7. 4:3 (eat normal TDEE 1800 4 days a week) and then reduce it to 0 calories 3 days a week....cause THAT is how much self control I have..... is nothing. It's not hard & hunger pangs are welcome...it teaches you to LEARN what hunger is like.

Try eating when hungry, not because you have an 8 hour window to pig out. You have no idea what hunger pangs are like. Even on 600 calories you would not. I'm 4 days a week of your calories all the time.....because I can never make it to NET. I'm just not hungry enough to force it.


You need to learn more about more things rather than thinking you are always right. You are young.... you have no clue. Go back and play minecraft or something.... you can learn about hunger pangs there your hearts go down.


My job is done. I'm off to bed cause I got a hunger to enjoy tomorrow.

stefjc

No Richie I am not trolling.

I despair of you ever understanding that you have a limited viewpoint and a general misunderstanding. Life is not as simple as you choose to state it. The human body is not as simple either. You cannot reduce life to a computer code of 'is' or 'is not'. You have the basics but not the details.

Then again, I should know better. You have infinitely more patience and time to repeat yourself than I have.

ritchiedrama

You really have no clue do you? Do you not think that people on 5:2 know self control on their normal days? IS that why I'm currently 13000 calories UNDER net this week alone? Yeah cause I must not be able to control myself right?

If you knew anything about it (and clearly you do not) then you would know that it not only makes you want to eat less on your normal TDEE days, but you learn to eat only when HUNGRY & not when you are told you should eat or when you think you are hungry. You learn what hunger feels like & then use that to sustain yourself.


Go back to your weights & 16:8....... oh wait.... that's the one where you pig out for 8 hours. Self control...hows that working for ya?

You obviously can't control yourself, no, otherwise you'd be eating the same 7 days a week and not being ridiculous.

16:8 removes all hunger pangs as it is, if you need anymore you have a mental issue with food.

Self control working out for me? Yep, I'm in fairly good shape, I was down to 4 days a week of 1350 calories a day whilst having raised calories 3x a week, and managed to get down to 10% bodyfat - when you can come even CLOSE to that, we can probably continue a conversation.

Wait....let me tell you a few things.

1. 1200 calories for 7 months.... not one calorie over. Lost 30kg
2. 1300 calories to stay there...lost another 5kg without trying
3. eat the same thing EVERY SINGLE DAY for the last 560 days in a row. Not once have I gone over in calories.
4. Since starting here on the 8th Feb 2012 I have lost all the weight I planned & then some. All without having to worry about going over cause I have some damn fine self control & a damn fine attitude towards food & working out.
5. Workout every single day despite having a back injury, bad knees & a few other things like shin splints and a nice achillies tendon tear..... yeah I run 10km with all that & more.
6. I got fat cause I was lazy & drank my calories in the form of Coke..... not from over eating or lack of control. Plus a back injury that didn't help.
7. 4:3 (eat normal TDEE 1800 4 days a week) and then reduce it to 0 calories 3 days a week....cause THAT is how much self control I have..... is nothing. It's not hard & hunger pangs are welcome...it teaches you to LEARN what hunger is like.

Try eating when hungry, not because you have an 8 hour window to pig out. You have no idea what hunger pangs are like. Even on 600 calories you would not. I'm 4 days a week of your calories all the time.....because I can never make it to NET. I'm just not hungry enough to force it.


You need to learn more about more things rather than thinking you are always right. You are young.... you have no clue. Go back and play minecraft or something.... you can learn about hunger pangs there your hearts go down.


My job is done. I'm off to bed cause I got a hunger to enjoy tomorrow.

The majority of those steps you have listed just show even more ridiculous behaviour, like

5. Workout every single day despite having a back injury, bad knees & a few other things like shin splints and a nice achillies tendon tear..... yeah I run 10km with all that & more.

7. 4:3 (eat normal TDEE 1800 4 days a week) and then reduce it to 0 calories 3 days a week....cause THAT is how much self control I have..... is nothing. It's not hard & hunger pangs are welcome...it teaches you to LEARN what hunger is like

Just ridiculous, it's not even worth me talking about it, be real please.


"Try eating when hungry, not because you have an 8 hour window to pig out. You have no idea what hunger pangs are like. Even on 600 calories you would not. I'm 4 days a week of your calories all the time.....because I can never make it to NET. I'm just not hungry enough to force it."

Actually, my window is custom - I chose 6 hours,, does that make me more of a pig?

I eat 2550 calories in 2 meals, and I enjoy it. I also understand that I could eat those 2550 calories over 6 meals and it would have the same FAT effect. This is where you are being silly, again.

I eat two meals because its simple, I don't have fasting days because its unnecessary. You still haven't given me a reason as to why you'd do it, why does anyone NEED to feel hunger? What a stupid thing to say.. lol.

You're just silly, your avi shows that too, weird behavior. Whatever you did (drink coke or eat) you consumed too many calories, that's lack of control.