Zero Carb eating

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  • Dante_80
    Dante_80 Posts: 480 Member
    russellholtslander1 wrote: »
    Today, I only lost 2/10ths of a lb. 255.

    I ate 4 XL eggs, with 3 Tbsp. salted butter. Lunch was leftover chicken. Yesterday I cooked up 4 thighs, and ate 2.5, including the skin from all 4 thighs.. planned for 2. So I had 1.5 thighs of shredded chicken, in a couple cups of broth. I drained all but maybe 2 Tbsp of the broth off, but left that, and added 3 Tbsp. of mayo, and stirred that up.. made the mayo into a creamy sauce.. it was delicious. Added 2 ozs. of extra sharp cheddar. Dinner is simple. Just 7 ozs. of GB.

    This is 1980 calories for the day, but I'm following some advice, and eating more calories early, and stopping meals at 6 p.m., then eat breakfast at 7 a.m. Breakfast was 660 calories, lunch was 833, and dinner is only 487.

    I put in Cronometer your input for that day as an experiment. Here is what I get, using the proper NCCDB/USDA entries. Went for 70% lean ground beef as an example.

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    Cheers..C:




  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    I think there is some variation, due to differences in food.. I can buy 73/27 GB, but most often, I get 80/20, and I drained off the 2 cups of broth, and only mixed 2 TBSP. with the mayo, to make it more of a creamy sauce.

    That may explain some of the extra calories, but also I am using the calories on the package, or MFP. Calories don't really matter, but 300 difference was noticeable. Probably the leaner GB, and removing the 100 calories of broth. That was actually interesting.. I wouldn't have considered broth to have calories, almost like water.. or think of nutrition in it, although that should be obvious.. but 2 Tbsp. would have a small effect.. in the end, maybe I probably lost some nutrition.

    This is one thing that I have been trying to do.. eat more meat. The nutrition is in the meat, and many of my fellow ZC'ers eat 3-4 lbs. I tend to eat about 2 lbs. max, plus my eggs. On this day, I was eating leftovers, and made up a lot of calories with added fat.. when i should be eating a lot more protein ( meat ).

    I have trouble eating more than 2.5 lbs. of meat a day. Supposedly, I'll adapt. most days I eat more meat, and less fat.. today, I am having 5 eggs with butter, 2 ozs. cheese with 1 lb. of Haddock. Then 12.54 ozs. of beef chunks. Still probably not enough meat for ZC, but on many vitamins and minerals, still plenty.

    Some of these are managed because I am a heart patient.. potassium I get, and I am on Coumadin, so I don't want a lot of Vitamin K.. if I don't get enough, it probably means I just cut my dose of Coumadin. Vitamin D can be got from sunlight. I walk outside a lot. That is something they measure, and I am fine. My brother is low. He eats moderate carb, with fruits, but his got so low, he started getting moody, and had to take huge pills to get back in range.. an issue living in northern climates. I'm OK though. I walk outside more. :)

    That leaves a few.. after I supplement with Magnesium. My one pill a day is about 60% of the RDA.

    So.. Thiamine, Folate, Vitamin E, and manganese are problems. A few others were low on this one day.. calcium and copper about 2/3rds..

    With thiamine, I will be low. I eat pork maybe once a week. Also a small amount of beef liver once a week for Vitamin A, but also has some thiamine.. but not that much. I may need to address that.

    Folate.. eggs and beef liver are my only sources.. so I will be low.

    Vitamin E.. I would need to eat a lot more fish, namely trout, which has quite a bit.

    manganese.. other than mussels, which I don't eat.. you get this from plants apparently.

    Calcium - I guess I could just eat more cheese, and some sardines, but I'm good at 68%.

    Last is copper.. a 4 oz. serving has 18x the RDA.. I eat a 3.2 oz portion once a week for lunch. I'd eat double that, but Vitamin A, and copper toxicities might become a problem.. the biggest problem with beef liver is that while it is rich in a LOT of vitamins and minerals, that would benefit a low carber.. these ones are so high, that they make eating a lot of the meat toxic, before they help with other nutrients. Every time I eat this beef liver, I get 14.4 days worth of copper, so I'm great. I got 67% on a day without beef liver..GB is roughly 15% of the RDA per 100 grams.. so I was about 30% from this small 7 oz. portion.. more likely to eat double that normally.

    So a few of these would improve, if I ate 3-4 lbs. of meat. This was only about a lb. max. Not very ZC. Even my normal 2 lbs. of meat most days, would up some of these.. including all the ones which are above 100% already.. they would go up 2-4x what they are now, for many of them.

    Other things to discuss/consider.. one job of Vitamin C is to help absorb the Iron from plant foods, which I don't eat.. I get my Iron mostly from meat, fish, and poultry. So I would need less Vitamin C than a person eating plants. I have NO idea how much is needed to do this, and how much Vitamin C is for other purposes.. my foods have trace amounts of Vitamin C, and long term ZC'ers say that it is enough. My doctor will let me know, but I find it interesting when someone has eaten this way for 10 years, and has no issues with Vitamin C.

    Lastly, as shown with the copper, variety over multiple days would fix several of these.. you are short one day, and higher on others. Which also would help avoid upper level toxicities on the ones I was pretty high on today. Most have large ranges though, so I am mostly worried about hitting minimums.

    I did go sign up at Cronometer.. I found this very interesting, and doing this over a week, might help me highlight the nutrients I am low on EVERY day, and would need to address with testing, done by my doctor.

    I do want to note that I have been on very low carb off and on for years, and HAVE been tested, and in range on all my nutrients. This WOE, is not that much different, but obviously, being able to have a few berries, non-starchy veggies, macadami nuts on top of what I eat now, would help several of these nutrients, and I simply can't meet the minimums now.. so it will be interesting to see if I see that when I get tested in a few months. Then I'll know definitively, and will supplement what I am low in.

    I do think that most people are low in as many areas as I am, on any diet. I'm always amazed at how much of some of these I get. Proteins are not a problem, as you would expect, but now I'm worried about eating more meat, since even with 1 lb. I am over 300% on some.. is 600% OK? Obviously, I know people who eat 4 lbs. every day. That makes the RDA's just numbers, like with my cholesterol, which I get 10x what I need, yet my Tchol is 100-125, and my tris, and LDL are low. My HDL is up, due to exercise. Niacin helps in that regard. I know some low carbers see big spikes in the lipid panel numbers.

    It will be interesting to see what numbers come out in coming days, because I am kind of settling on 2200-2400 calories right now, and normally I eat more meat, and less fat. So more nutrition. Butter and mayo aren't very nutrient-rich.

    Thanks for sharing Dante_80, especially the way you did it, just posting it. If you have any ideas about it, which led you to post, I think that I do want to hear them.. were you simply being helpful, or did I miss you making a point? If so, be more blunt, and let me know you think it is dangerously high or low in something, or whatever else you wished to convey. I, of course, used it in a way which helps ME, and from my POV, but it's always nice to have another viewpoint when looking at this much data. A different way of looking at it, that I completely missed.
  • Dante_80
    Dante_80 Posts: 480 Member
    edited October 2021
    russellholtslander1 wrote: »
    Thanks for sharing Dante_80, especially the way you did it, just posting it. If you have any ideas about it, which led you to post, I think that I do want to hear them.. were you simply being helpful, or did I miss you making a point? If so, be more blunt, and let me know you think it is dangerously high or low in something, or whatever else you wished to convey. I, of course, used it in a way which helps ME, and from my POV, but it's always nice to have another viewpoint when looking at this much data. A different way of looking at it, that I completely missed.

    Many thanks for the breakdown. You guys were talking a few posts before about supplements (magnesium in particular) so I thought of plugging in one of your days in Cr0n as an experiment to see the micro analysis (this is a woe that differs a lot from mine, so I was interested to see the breakdown).

    Then, I thought of sharing the result here for reference. I cannot really offer any insight, your post above pretty much covers all the bases. Moreover, the RDAs, DRIs etc are not set in stone but really differ from one person to another, according to many factors (your example about Vit C intake is indicative). Given your analysis, if I could offer a suggestion it would be to add two supplements to the mix. A triple ca/mg/zn supplement (they are commonly sold as one pill) instead of the straight mg, and a vit C one.

    What I can say though is that objective data is a pretty good thing to have when following any structured WOE. This helps us inform our decisions going forward, and also provide a feedback loop to explain our progress...or lack thereof. I find tools like MFP and Cronometer very useful in that context. Cheers..C:

  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    I lost the weight I gained yesterday.. back down to 255.4, the same weight I was 2 days ago.. still up 4/10ths from my recent low.

    Today, I had 5 XL eggs, scrambled in 3 Tbsps. salted butter. Lunch is 16 ozs. of Haddock, cooked in a non-stick skillet, and 2 ozs. extra sharp cheddar on the side. Dinner is 12.54 ozs. of beef chunks, cooked in the crockpot. That was the sizes of the packages.

    So 1.75 lbs. of meat. According to MFP, that's 2,190 calories. 39% protein, 60% fat. 1% carbs ( 7 g ). Protein is 212 g. The fish drops the fat %. It's only 9-10% fat. I actually like it better swimming in butter, but then I tend to not be able to eat as much protein, because I feel full quicker.

    Hoping that by only eating butter with eggs, I start eating more actual meat, which is where all the nutrients are. Currently, i am hanging on to my buttery eggs in the morning. I switched to Haddock, instead of cod, even though it is twice as expensive, because it has 20% of the sodium. Wouldn't be an issue, if I bought fresh cod, but the packaged stuff is very salty, compared to other packaged fish for some reason. So I am at 1,564 mg of Na.

    I do use some spices.. on the fish, I added an 1/4th of a tsp. of salt, and a dash of garlic powder, and black pepper. Fish isn't my favorite, and I know the garlic, and pepper aren't strict ZC, but I use them a little. I use salt mostly, and add it on days when I am low. I try to stay at or a bit above 1800.. maybe 2,300 tops, because like Magnesium, and Potassium, I lose electrolytes from the diuretics, and diuretic effect of this diet. I supplement the other 2, but a little bit of Na, is easier to add back in.. you don't need much to up it quite a bit. This adds 590 mg, to the 1,564 mg, for 2,154 mg.. still less than the RDA, and it makes my food tastes good, and hopefully replaces enough Na, that i may be losing. To be honest, when I ate Keto, I salted more actually, which is why I am concerned about dropping too low.. I probably did 3,000 mg most days, and my Na was in range.. not sure half of that is enough. Maybe it is not a real problem, but I worry, that's what heart patients do. :D

    Today is supposed to be 72 and mostly sunny. Nice day for a bike ride. I am borrowing one from a friend. If I like it, maybe in the spring, I'll buy myself a bike, but I haven't ridden one in 10 years. I wasn't riding in 2001, when I was diagnosed with congestive heart failure. I worked 80 hours a week, and was 361 lbs. Either one could be the reason. It took me about a decade to get off oxygen, get through 3 surgeries for a gallbladder, burst appendix, and hernia, and build up enough cardiovascular health to do exercise, to where I wanted to ride a bike again. My second pacemaker/defibrillator in 2010 helped with my breathing, even though I was still 330 lbs. So I bought a mountain bike. I hadn't ridden since maybe 1995.. 15 years, and I struggled a bit, around the neighborhood. After a month or so, I decided to go on a long ride with several friends, and my brothers, so we met up, and left. Along the way, a driver got too close, and I veered off the road to avoid them, and went into the ditch. I was a bit embarrassed, having so much trouble getting up off the ground, but that wasn't half as bad as what my weight did to the bike. Several other drove into the ditch, with no ill effects to their bikes.. I bent the wheel in half.. and mine was a sturdier bike, since I knew I was heavy. I never even fixed the bike.. sold it cheap after removing the wheel, and sold it as is.. got $100. Almost brand new, so I lost $500 in value, but I wanted it out of my sight. That is one reason i discovered Atkins. After 10 years of being a 330 heart patient, I realized I hadn't done a thing to lose weight.. and make it easier on me. I only did the meds, tests, and surgeries, and that kept me pretty busy. No doctor did more than say yes, I should lose some weight. They were a lot more concerned about my health from my bad heart, and diabetes, and ignored my weight most of the time.

    So I'm 255. I think I will be able to bike 10 miles or so, and hoping for no issues. Since I am short, I fit her bike, and I was worried it wouldn't be sturdy enough, but it seems to be. It's red, but at least it isn't pink, and I would be OK if it was, but better that it isn't.

    I have to go eat lunch soon, then plan on doing the ride, so I can get home, and watch some U-M football, and my beef chunks should be done by then.

  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    OK. New weight loss.. 254.6, down 26 lbs. in 29 days.

    Last night, I started cooking my beef chunks too late in the crockpot, so I pulled out 10 ozs. of filet mignon, and ate that instead. I have 6 " steaks " totaling just over 2 lbs.. so split it into 3 packs of 2 steaks.. I ate 2 last night, gave my brother another 10 ozs., and will have another meal of filet mignon later in the week.

    The problem I have is the beef chunks for that got flipped to today, were left to cook in the crockpot. After watching some of the game, I decided to go do the workout I forgot yesterday, then came home, got ready for bed, and zonked out. I woke about 2 a.m. to use the bathroom, and I could still smell what I thought was dinner.. really made the house smell good. My brother woke at 4 a.m., and turned off the crockpot, after the water had evaporated, and the meat was charcoal. So I don't have dinner for today. My brother simply gave me back the filet mignon I gave him.

    So I went to a restaurant, and ordered the special breakfast.. 2 eggs, 2 bacon, 2 sausage, and a 4 oz. chunk of ham, with hashed browns, and toast. I cancelled the hashed browns and toast, of course, but the waitress doubled the bacon, and cut the ham as well. When I asked about it, she brought me the ham. My brother got 5 sausages, so he gave me 2 of his.. plus I ordered 2 extra eggs.. so I had 4 eggs, 4 sausage, 4 bacon strips, and 4 ozs. of ham, along with water.. a BIG breakfast. Lunch will be 13.76 ozs. boneless, skinless chicken thighs, and dinner will be 10 ozs. of filet mignon.

    Today I am doing leg presses and biceps. Yesterday was back and triceps. Tuesday will be hamstrings, and shoulders, and Wednesday will be chest and calves.
  • russellholtslander
    russellholtslander Posts: 1 Member
    :)
  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    edited October 2021
    Had some trouble signing in. signing in using FB isn't the same acct., but I made it back in.

    I lost almost 2 lbs. yesterday. My BIG breakfast kind of kept me in the bathroom through the middle of the day. Not sure if it was just time for a big drop in weight, or if what I ate made me lose faster. Anyways, I am 252.8.. down 27.8 lbs. in 30 days. I do hope to get to 240 in the next 30 days.

    Today, I ate 6 XL eggs with just 2 Tbsp. salted butter. I probably don't need much butter, if any, since pans are non-stick. For lunch I am eating chicken thighs, and dinner is two 8 oz. packages of pork chops. I'm cooking up the chicken, and the goal is to eat all 8 thighs. ( 1.72 lbs. ). I was told to eat until full, but push it a little, so we'll see. Normally, I eat 4 of them. The reason is I feel full when I start my lunch. I'm supposed to eat more meat though, so I'll try.

    I went for a walk outside, along the river today, since it 75 and sunny. Getting some Vitamin D. Should be highs of 60 by the end of the week, and sun is not so strong most days, so I'll need more time outside in the winter, but today is one of those days where the sun feels like it is pressing on your head.. it was a nice walk. I may take one at the park later, as well.

    One thing which I guess people call a non-scale victory ( NSV ), is that my redness from mid-shin down, is almost gone. I have a small ring at the top of my socks, which is still red, but that's it. My feet are white again, and so is most of my leg. For about 10 years now, it has been the color of ground beef/raw sausage, and splotchy. Hopefully, it completely disappears in the near future. Wasn't a goal I was planning to see. I thought it was simply poor circulation, and was kind of with me for the long haul.
  • sarah7591
    sarah7591 Posts: 415 Member
    Wow....I am following your journey and it is so amazing since I am a vegetarian. I'm glad this is working for you.
  • age_is_just_a_number
    age_is_just_a_number Posts: 631 Member
    I don’t have experience with zero carb eating.
    Sounds too restrictive to me.
    Our bodies need vitamins and minerals that we get from vegetables and fruit.
    My personal view is: anything is moderation is ok AND variety is the spice of life.
    Good luck
  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    age_is_just... your statement is is false.. we don't need vitamins & minerals which we get from fruits and vegetables.. we need vitamins and minerals.

    Often, meat is a MUCH better source of these vitamins and mineral than plant sources.

    Every diet has some nutrients in which we are low in. A vegetarian, for example, has to worry about being low in vitamin B12, calcium, iron, and zinc. On Carnivore, I am low on Vit.C, manganese, and Folate.

    I explained that a huge reason the RDA of Vit. C is so high, is you need it to help absorb plant-based iron, which is poorly absorbed, compared to that in meat. So I do not know the RDA, if you are NOT eating plants, because you do not need Vit. C to help absorb the Iron in meat. It would be less though, and there is some Vitamin C in meats, especially raw meats. I like my food cooked, but my lunch, which is 1.5 lbs. of pork steak, has 4 mg of Vitamin C.. not a lot of the RDA.. just 4.44%, but if I don't need as much per day, then how much is enough? There is also small amounts in fresh beef, and more in beef liver. The test is whether you get scurvy though. This would take about 3 mos., if you had a deficiency to present problems, yet I know people who are past a decade without any fruits or veggies.. so we either need less on Carnivore, OR we get more than you think.. ENOUGH.. on this diet. If I get scurvy, trust me.. I will tell people, and go back on Keto. :D

    Sometimes a lack of nutrients is due to food preferences. Mussels are a good source of manganese. 251% of the RDA in 3 ozs. I am not a fan of seafood, other than fish. I eat a serving of liver once a week.. not enough to get an avg. of 2.3 g a day.. BUT, changes in diet change RDA's.. different food sources have different absorption rates. Sometimes the RDA is higher, if the source of the nutrient does not absorb well.. if you only get 25% absorption, you might need 4x as much, for example.. so let's not assume the RDA for a high plant/carbohydrate diet applies exactly, on an all animal source diet. There would be differences. Still, you could eat 3 ozs. of mussels, and get 2.5 days of the RDA, and 3.5 ozs of steak has about .2 mg of manganese. The RDA is 2.3 mg for an adult male, so if I eat 18 ozs. of beef.. a normal meal on Carnivore.. that's 1.2 mg., well over half your needs.

    Part of the problem is.. some of these nutrients don't have a lot, in a serving, so we hear another food, which is more dense, is a better source.. you usually get 10-20 sources.. so Folate, manganese, and Vitamin C don't list any food on a Carnivore diet, as a source of these nutrients, because we see a serving as 100 grams.. or 3.5 ozs. On Carnivore though, we eat meat in lbs.. so a small amount, adds up. So you can get over half he manganese from a poor source.. beef, but get a lot of servings at a meal.. 6-8. So you may be short on a daily basis, but then get 251% from eating mussels one day.. or you eat 6 ozs., and get 502%. Maybe you like mussels, and eat 5 servings at a time, like we do beef, and that is 12.5 days of the RDA. You could do this once every 10-12 days. One meal.

    I think Folate & Vitamin E is a major issue for me.. Vitamin C, and manganese I think have a lower RDA for someone on Carnivore.. but I think much of the problem is tracking, not actual amount we consume..

    With variety, and looking at a week, not one day.. we get MOST of our nutrients on average.. probably more so than the average person, because our diet IS more restrictive, and we constantly get reminded about nutrient deficiency, so we work to correct the problem.

    Meanwhile, you probably assume you are just fine with all your nutrients, and might be deficient in as many, if not MORE nutrients, but you won't ever check.. like most people, you will assume you are fine, until a doctor tells you otherwise.. after all, if there are no effects you can see, you probably think all is well. Everyone says you eat the right way, just like the majority, in a nation getting fatter, and sicker.

    I think a person on Carnivore, probably gets better nutrition, even using YOUR RDA's for YOUR diet.

    You might want to go take a class on nutrition, and learn about interactions of nutrients, and why some are needed to process others, and how they come up with RDA's. I'm not saying my diet does not have ANY deficiencies, but they are few, and no more than on other diets. The difference is I actually know about mine, and I don't sit around talking about the flaws on your diet, because unlike you.. I hope whatever you are doing works well for YOU. I am not looking to prove mine is better, or yours is not, and it always makes me wonder why people feel to talk about diets they know nothing about, as if they are nutrition experts, instead of simply people with an opinion, based on discussions they had with like-minded people on the internet.

    It's amusing that you have such conviction when you make these statements you think are fact, as if nutrition is not complicated, and is settled science, and that you know what you are talking about.

    I admit I know little about a " normal " diet. I don't study it, or care if it is healthy, since I don't eat it. I might be able to note where possible deficiencies might occur, and we have general guidelines, which I ight borrow, since they do apply to YOUR diet, if you are eating things in moderation, as you say, and assuming you are at least trying to eat a healthy diet, but blanket statements like you feel so confident making, would be just as wrong coming from me.

    Each diet, needs to be studied, and done in ways to get as much nutrition as possible. You think your diet is easier to do that with. Guess what, I do as well. I get most of my nutrients far beyond the RDA. Variety covers some of the ones we have a deficiency in on a daily menu, and we are left with a few we need to address, or at least think about, and discuss with our doctor.

    Yes, you have no experience with ZC eating. Yes, you find my diet too restrictive. No, you are wrong about sources of nutrition. there are MANY sources, many better than plant sources. Your personal is simply your opinion, and what you prefer.. enjoy what you want to. Moderation is often NOT OK, as we see. Moderation often leads to trigger foods, and overeating. Variety is good, but not completely.. some foods should not be eaten at all, because they lead to other problems. YOU may not have these problems, and that is wonderful, but apparently more than half of America, and most civilized countries get obese because when they add variety, which includes certain foods, moderation becomes impossible. That line ... everything in moderation.. is just a toss away line, which people say, but many times is VERY harmful.

    I hope in the future you think a bit more, before you say things which have no basis in reality, because they are simply your opinion, or something you heard a lot, so you think it is fact.

    I do want to say Thank You for wishing me Good Luck.. I hope you have much success as well, and get healthy, eating in a way you can stick with.
  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    Well, today, I lost another 1.2 lbs. I ate a lot more yesterday than normal. I don't know why, but I am finding it much easier to eat MORE. I no longer feel as if I a shoving 2 lbs. of meat down my throat. One thing is, I cut a lot of fat, and replaced it with meat, fish, and fowl.

    They say fat satiates, and maybe it was suppressing my appetite. Anyways, I ate 1.76 lbs of chicken for lunch yesterday, and 1 lb. of pork chops.

    Today, I cut up 3 sausage links, and cooked them in 3 Tbsp. butter, then tossed in 4 Jumbo eggs, and scrambled it all up.. and had 2 ozs. of extra sharp cheddar. Lunch will be 1.48 lbs. of pork steaks. That's 2 of them. The bone accounts for some weight, but well over a lb. Tonight, I have 1.23 lbs. of boneless, skinless chicken thighs ( 6 ). I bought some smaller packages, not 8 packs, so I can just eat 1 package per meal. I have several non-stick pans, so I do need to remove the bone from the pork steak, so no scratches, but it allows me to cook without butter.

    I removed 20% of the weight for bone, and it's about 3,138 calories, 206 g fat, 295 g protein. 5 g carbs. Yesterday was just 2,660 calories, so we'll see if the extra calories stop my weight loss, or slow me significantly.

    Going to the gym today, after I finish 2 loads of laundry. Then later, I plan on taking a 3 mile walk out to the lake, and back. Temps still around 73, so good walking weather. At the gym, I just have hamstrings, and shoulders. My legs are very strong, from carrying me around, plus they are only 26" long, so I can lift heavy. Upper body I do much lighter, especially around my heart.. 5 years ago, I pulled one of the leads from my pacemaker out of place, so it was just floating around doing nothing. So I will do 120 lb. hamstring curls, and 25 lb. dumbbell delt presses. Then a couple sets of side laterals with 10 lb. weights. My upper body exercises probably build no muscle.. almost like cardio, but I don't do enough repetitions.. just moving the muscles a little. I miss lifting heavy, but those are the consequences of decades of eating poorly. Good thing is, at 47, and being chubby, I have nothing to prove at the gym. I'm just the aging, fat guy, so lifting light looks normal. My form is probably better. :)

    Another lazy day. I'm off to cook some pork.
  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    So most people eat a diet of moderation, and the results are that they end up not being able to stick to it, and the final result is 70.2% are overweight or obese..

    Sure, moderation works, if you remove all the data proving otherwise. Moderation is not something most people can do, or else more people would be healthy.

    Are you suggesting that ALL the food on the recommended diet causes this overeating? I am saying that most people have trigger foods.. broccoli isn't causing overeating, surely, so something you eat is causing people to irrationally eat more of certain foods, which is why they gain weight, unless you think that is an opinion, too.

    If you start a healthy diet of moderation, and end up on an unhealthy diet of moderation, that is the end result of that diet. You can't say that the vast majority of people who eat a certain diet, eat like crap in the end, but that doesn't count.

    Imagine if low carb, resulted in 70.2% of people craving BACON, and for some reason, they ate lbs. of it. Far beyond what they needed, so much they gained weight. Would that not be the fault of the diet? Would we not count those as failures to make people healthy? Would we recommend bacon in moderation? Or would we say.. eat low carb, but for 70%, moderation of bacon does not work.. so maybe try bacon, but if it causes cravings, don't eat ANY bacon.

    Certain foods cause cravings. You may not like to admit that, but it's true, and you can't eat these foods in moderation. Now, you may never find some of these foods, and eat them, so you never have cravings, and overeat.. but by saying all things in moderation, you ignore reality.

    I think we can agree that most people try to follow the recommended diet, given by most doctors.. a diet of moderation.. set amounts of each, with nothing completely restricted. When we do that, something causes 70.2% to overeat enough to be overweight or obese. You think it is my opinion that the plan itself is the cause. So what do I think is the cause IN that plan? Is it eating moderate amounts of food? Variety? No. Even on ZC, I have varieties of meats, eggs, cheeses, fats, and I don't eat ANY to the exclusion of others.

    The problem is this idea that moderation or variety are always OK. It ignores the reality that many people have triggers which cause overeating. Moderation and variety are fine, up to a point, but if they eat a trigger food, moderation is no longer possible. They will overeat of that food, to the point of becoming overweight, and eventually obese. How do we know that? 70.2 % are obese or overweight. Certainly more than half, following this diet of moderation, can't maintain moderation, and overeat.

    If you actually read my sentence, it does NOT say moderation is impossible.. it says it is apparent that for more than half, it is impossible.

    Yes, that is most people's reality, unless you believe 70.2% of people choose to be overweight or obese, and sabotage themselves, despite moderation being possible.. or you disagree that 70.2% if more than half.

    When you add variety, you are more likely to hit a trigger food. Are you saying that NO food triggers cravings and overeating? If you admit these exist, then how does eating them in moderation work? You don't drink alcohol in moderation if you are an alcoholic, you refrain from it.. so why wouldn't the solution to a food, which compels you to eat, also not be something you stop consuming?

    If we can agree that there ARE trigger foods, then adding variety, would make it more likely you consumed one, and moderation wouldn't work at that point. Which as I said, is apparently true for the majority of Americans.

    That all being said, I didn't berate the previous poster for having an opinion.. I pointed out that her opinions were not facts. Yet she stated them as facts.. they did not say apparently something was true.. which IS an opinion, or even they thought something was true. You rightly pointed out the line was MY opinion. I do not disagree, but where you err, is in why I pointed out the error of the previous poster.. there is a difference between saying something is apparently true, which is an opinion, and saying something IS true.

    For example.. apparently more than half the days in the desert are sunny... is an opinion. You need sun every day to have a desert... is stated as a fact. There is a huge difference.

    The previous poster stated that you need to get certain nutrients from plants and fruit, or something like that, among other things.. something which is not a proven fact. It was a declarative sentence, not an opinion. There are people who don't eat any plant food for years, despite this idea that yo would develop symptoms of deficiencies, scurvy being an obvious one, bandied about as fact. You CAN develop scurvy, without enough Vitamin C, in 3 months, but the poster used this to say we need Vitamin C from plants and fruits.. ( my opinion ).. at least I think that would be one of the examples of what was stated as fact. Maybe they meant other nutrients, but Vitamin C is hard to get without eating plant food.. that is a fact. However, the statement is untrue, because 1) you can get some Vitamin C from animal foods, so fruits and vegetables are not the only source, and 2) the RDA is not based on what is needed on EVERY diet. Some amounts of nutrients require more of them, on certain diets, due to absorption, and an RDA is a range, which accounts for how people eat on the recommended diet of the country. For example, Vitamins A,D,E, and K are fat soluble, so by eating lower fat, you absorb them at a lesser rate, so you would need MORE in your RDA. Also, some nutrients are needed, like Vitamin C, to help absorb OTHER nutrients better if you get things like Iron from plant sources.. so get Iron from meat, and you need less Vitamin C. These are not opinions. So in theory, you might explain why people consuming no Vitamin C from plant sources, still does not have scurvy, after 10 years. Maybe it is less need of Vitamin C, maybe it is that you get enough from animal food sources.. that would require testing and studies, which will likely never happen, which is why so much of nutrition is opinion. For the majority of people, eating the recommended diet, the RDA's apply, based on if they sort of follow the guidelines in a general way. To reach THOSE RDA's, you probably have to consume some plants, but I don't believe those RDA's apply to people on different diets.. yes, that's an opinion.

    The difference is that the previous poster did not state their opinions as opinions, without any leeway to suggest these were their thoughts. They made declarative sentences, which I believe I rightly took as a statement of FACT, and THAT is what I objected to.

    So the problem is not that I criticized someone for stating an opinion, then did so myself. Probably half of what I say is opinion, and so are many of the responses. I love discussion, even with those who disagree. I can disagree, but when someone posts something in a way which seems to be stating a fact, that is far different.

    The problem is that you seem to be unable to differentiate between an opinion, and a declarative sentence, which I think most people would think is stating a fact.. declaring it, even.

    If you disagree, and think the previous poster's statement was in fact, NOT stated as fact, but WAS opinion, please correct me, and show me I was wrong believing that, and if true, then I will apologize to that person... but right now, what I hear is you suggesting that someone who has has an issue with someone stating opinions as facts, shouldn't have opinions. Sorry, I can. I just can't state them as facts, which I did not. You are simply equating 2 different things as the same thing.

    I am sure I fail at this sometimes, and DO state things as fact which are not, and I expect to be called out for it.. it's not berating, but in this case I was definitely stating an opinion, and I try as hard as I can to word things to make sure that what is my opinion, is obvious. I don't think the previous poster tried at all, and my opinion is that they did not do so, because they don't think their statement IS an opinion.. I think they would disagree with your defense of them, and possibly even object to you saying they had an opinion. I'm pretty sure they felt what they said was a FACT. They certainly did not come back, and say it was a misunderstanding, and they meant it to be an opinion.. you are suggesting that.

    It's the basis of your post.. that I criticized something, and then did the exact same thing.. so once it is noted that what they did and I did are NOT the same thing, you suddenly have no point.

    If we want to look for Irony, how about you defending a person stating opinion as fact, then doing the same YOURSELF.. That may be YOUR experience... IS an opinion.. and also a fact.. but the second half of that sentence.. " but it isnt most people's. ".... is not FACT, although it appears you are saying it as fact. I'm not even saying that maybe it " isn't " most people's experience.. who knows what most people's experience is.. That would be about 165 million at least, just in America. All I am saying is whether it is or isn't, is not a fact.. all we can give is opinions. I have an opinion, and so do you, but I rarely say something I experience is a fact. That would be foolish, since my experience is even less common than average. Also, because many facts in the area of nutrition, are not actually facts, or are at least in doubt. Are bananas good for you? What about eggs? Nutrition is a bit more complicated, which is why I strive to not state things in a way which lead others to believe they are facts, unless I am pretty sure it is a fact.

    Much of nutrition is still being debated, and the only place where it is not, is where everyone agrees on something, because there is data to prove it beyond a reasonable doubt. That ends debate, and I think that is the end goal of people stating opinions as fact.. to silence other opinions. Once something is fact, any other idea is wrong, and should not be said. So, if you do not want to hear different opinions, simply act as if your opinion is a fact, and once a majority agree, anyone saying otherwise, is deemed wrong, and someone no one should believe.

    That's what I would do, if I supported something which ended up making 70.2% of people overweight or obese, and caused obesity, diabetes, cancer and heart disease epidemics. I would try to silence others who suggested my diet was the cause, discredit their ideas, and blame those who failed on my awesome plan.

    But hey, that's just my opinion, right? ;) That wouldn't actually be done, would it? So all we are talking about is our opinions. I'm guessing you disagree, but that's the great thing about opinions.. what you think of my opinion is meaningless.

    Sometimes, it keeps me from getting bored though. Thanks.

  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    Another day done.. down to 251 lbs. I ate 3,138 calories yesterday, and lost 6/10ths of a lb. Did I burn off more calories? This is why people doubt CICO. Today, I'm only having 2,796 calories. Yesterday was pushing it a bit.

    I cut out the cheese this morning, and cut down to 2 Tbsp. butter to cook my eggs since the pan is non-stick. Lunch is 1.1 lbs. of ground beef. Still using up the 80/20 GB I have, then buying 73/27 GB from Aldi's so it has more fat. Same with boneless, skinless chicken thighs. Harder to track whole thighs, but I want to start eating the skin. Get my fat from the food, not as much added fat.

    I tracked my food a few days on another site, to see how MFP matched up, and just to get a more detailed nutrient makeup.. not something I plan to do much, MFP is great for my needs, BUT I do want to talk about something I discovered.. my eggs are from Eggland's Best. I entered generic Jumbo eggs, and I have trouble getting enough Vitamin E & D in my daily diet.. but when I did it on this other tracker, Eggland's Best popped up.. I never thought the brand mattered.. an egg is an egg. So when I look, my Vitamin D & E are 200-400% per day now. So I checked each food, thinking it was one day, and one food. It was the eggs. I eat 4 Jumbo eggs a day, which gets me 200% of my Vitamin D, and 168% of my Vitamin E. How is that possible. So I changed it to generic eggs, and it drops a bunch, I'm below the RDA again.

    Turns out, that like cereals and milk, they somehow can fortify eggs, and add nutrients. This brand is supposed to give you 6x as much Vit. D, and 10x as much Vit. E, as a normal egg. I'm a little conflicted, because they are altering the egg, but it solves the problem of getting D & E. I'm good for the day before 7 a.m.

    If I am OK with them adding nutrients not there in nature, then what else is OK.. we fortify cereals, bread, and milk, which makes them sources of nutrition. Usually we do this, because processing strips out some nutrition, but also, because we consider these foods staples of the American diet. A good healthy breakfast to start the day, and we know this, because we added the right amount of nutrients, to what we think is healthy food.

    So what foods can have nutrients added to them, what does it entail.. how do you do it? This is tricky, because I would eat a cow, which eats grass ( a plant ), and I am trying to stick to the intent of ZC, as I try this diet out.. so it appears that they add marigold, alfalfa and corn to increase lutein. It seems from skimming the article, that they alter the feed, and the mineral deposits on the ground, to up these nutrients.. the chicken eats things like rice bran, and sea kelp, and certain minerals in the soil, which I am sure need to be spread out for them to consume as they eat off the ground.. and their eggs are more nutritious.

    Basically, all the food that would make me overeat, and I avoid, which has these nutrients, can be gotten from the eggs, so I get it by eating eggs, not rice bran, or corn in my own diet.

    Other Carnivore people I speak to, who have done this for years, think I worry too much about RDA's of nutrients.. they are healthy, and the rest is just numbers.. maybe, but I like data, and with B vitamins I get excess amounts, so is getting more Vitamin D& E a problem, even if it isn't a necessity?.. If I can eat a grass fed cow, is a corn fed chicken, who has calcium carbonate in their diet from adding ground limestone in the diet counter to the diet I am following? This adds calcium.

    Beyond my personal ethical issues though, and if this process is OK.. suggesting that what the animal eats is not a problem, as long as *I* eat animal food sources, then can they add nutrients to beef? Is the chicken that laid the egg higher in nutrients? That sounds plausible, right?

    We add nutrients to cereal, bread and milk, so people who consume those products, get nutrition, so is it possible to do the same to lower carb foods? Maybe it costs too much to buy these types of feed for cows, versus a smaller chicken?

    If it is possible, that would remove this worry about people on low carb not getting enough nutrients, or at least give us peace of mind, knowing we at least hit all the minimum RDA's.

    One concern is which nutrients they add.. I get 300-1200% of the RDA for most B vitamins, which includes these eggs, but what if they added more B vitamins to beef and pork? I'm guessing Eggland's Best is not thinking of low carbers when they do this, but people in general, so you would have to be carful to not reach a toxic level. Luckily, B12, which I am having 1161% of the RDA in today, has NO upper limit, but theoretically, if not practically, could you tailor low carb/no carb foods to deliver all the nutrition you need? I would not have thought so, or considered it, if I hadn't discovered this about these eggs.

    Probably will never happen for some reason, but I find it interesting.
  • kshama2001
    kshama2001 Posts: 28,052 Member
    My mom struggles staying above Underweight, despite getting a ton of variety - but her variety is mostly plant based whole foods. My brother like to joke that her meals are seven vegetables and a small piece of chicken, a bit of an exaggeration, and I would actually label some of those vegetables "starches," but you get the point.

    She is moderate with calorie dense foods.
  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    Well, I'm stuck just above 250.. 251.6.. gained 6/10ths of a lb. in the past couple days. It was bound to happen eventually. I'm at 29 lbs. in 35 days, so still pretty good.

    I have been working out. Today I am doing half my body, and the other half tomorrow.. splitting it into 4 workouts, made them too small, and they only took 10-15 minutes. Now I'm doing 2 sets x 5 exercises, and resting every 3rd day.

    Blood sugars still in 70-110 range, and I did have 1 low blood sugar, but I ate 2 ozs. of extra sharp cheddar, as soon as my vision got blurry, and it went away 5 minutes later, and I didn't even get a headache from it, so probably not real low. I am off the basal Insulin, with permission from my doctor, but not the pills.. so the numbers are good, but pills still necessary to keep below 125 mg/dL most likely. Until the pills cause more low blood sugars, I'm stuck on them.. last time I got off the pills, I had low blood sugars 5-10 times a week for months, before they let me off the meds. Had to earn their trust, and it worked for 6 years, but I started eating high carb again, and got put back on meds in 2018, when my A1C crept back over 7.0 for 6 months. So I take the smallest dose of Glimiperide in the morning, and 50 mg of Januvia at night.. both smaller doses, but I think the next step is no pill, and that won't be something they do, just because I have 1 good A1C. I'm going to need to stay below 5.5 for a while.

    Good news is, at 35 days, I have had no cheats, no desire to cheat, and can't imagine doing so. I love the food. I always got appetite suppression from eating very low carb, but I think the difference is eating more calories.. more meat, really. This is a pretty high protein diet for me, unlike Keto, or Atkins.

    Today, my macro split is 32/68.. 3 grams of carbs from 4 Jumbo eggs. 217 grams of protein, and 207 grams of fat. I feel pretty good on 2/3 fat, instead of 80%. I ate 4 eggs, 3 sausage links, cooked in butter. Lunch is just 1.12 lbs.. and dinner is 12 ozs. of pork. It's not pork steak, but pre-cooked pork chops, sort of looking like ham steaks, circular, and exactly 4 ozs. a steak, but the ingredients are OK, and it says 0 grams of carbs, so I'm going to give it a try, since it's supposedly OK to just re-heat for 5 mins. We'll see if it bothers me after I eat it.

    One thing about this woe.. if you are just buying meat, and eggs, and cooking them, is it means you are cooking 3 meals every day, and doing the dishes a lot.. greasy dishes. The pans are non-stick, so they are easier, but there are a lot of them at the end of the day. I could go out to eat, especially breakfast, get eggs and sausage, but it's expensive. I spend about $60 this week on groceries for me.. butter, eggs, meat/fish/fowl. That covers 9 of my 14 lunches and dinner, and all my breakfasts for the week, with some leftovers. If I go buy 6 eggs, and 3 sausage links at a restaurant, it will be $10-11, and $15 with a tip. So I could pay for 4 meals versus 16 meals. I have some leftover beef liver, steak and tuna to cover my other 5 meals. So when someone says eating this way is expensive, it might be because they choose to eat at restaurants, so someone else is doing the cooking and cleaning for at least on meal. I'm cheap, but also like to cook my own food as much as possible. So I limit myself to one breakfast a week on Sunday mornings, at most.. skipping it tomorrow. I can use the $15 to buy a lb. of filet mignon next week.

    I did locate a Carnivore team, which is pretty inactive, but from previous posts I read, I think I am more strict than others. I tend to lean towards just plain meat, eggs, fats, and water.. and think maybe pre-packed, pre-cooked pork chops are a worry.. same with mayo. I'm switching back to whole chicken thighs, because I want to get whatever nutrition is in the skin. It's single digit amount of the RDA,, like 9% of Niacin, or 2% Vit. A ( skin from 1 lb. chicken ). Seems a lot of people just eat any meat, even if it is a hot dog. One carnivore guy on YouTube says it's OK to eat processed lunch meat and Spam, and maybe it is.. I don't have any issue when I eat tuna and mayo, or ham, which has carbs. So this pre-cooked pork chops shouldn't be an issue, but if I gain weight tomorrow, I'll probably never eat them again. :D

    I'm thinking that since I am more strict, my foods that I consider risky.. add black pepper, since it does come from plants.. that these few items, are being done by a lot of ZC people, who are succeeding on this WOE, so since I haven't seen any issues so far, after 35 days, I pretty much have a set menu, if these pork chops don't cause any reaction for me. If they do, I'll just use pork steaks.

    Pork/sausage, fish, chicken, steak/beef/GB, eggs, butter, mayo, water, and water, with garlic powder, black pepper, and salt, when desired. Just eat until full, which is about 2,800 calories these days.

    Today, I am going to enjoy one of the benefits of losing 29 lbs., which is an event in the downtown of the nearest city.. they shut it down, and you can park, and walk around to visit the hundreds of tables.. vendors and people marketing different causes. I wouldn't have been able to walk this a month ago.

    One thing I have not spoken about, which I wonder if anyone else experiences, is runny noses when I go in/out of ketosis. I spent hours blowing my nose, and spitting phlegm up, when I started ZC.. after several days of much higher carb, between doing Keto, and starting this WOE.. it happens every time. It isn't like a cold, not that insistent.. but every minute or so, in the morning, I would blow my nose, and have to clear my throat for a few hours, and it was worse the first day or 2 of this.. then it simply disappeared.. might be due to excess water retention? Anyways, it really has cleared up my breathing, for about a month now, and no more runny nose every morning.

    I'm off to go to the library for some books, then spend a couple hours in downtown, then home for lunch, and college football.. and tonight I will go do my workout at the gym. I like it later, when there are less people there. Since I only do 5 exercises, waiting for others to finish on the machine, is more of an issue. Especially if it is my last exercise. I like to lift, and get out of there. Luckily, 3 exercises are with free weights, which no one at this gym seems to touch. They love the machines. I find them useful on the heavier lifts. I don't want to have a lot of weight on me, if I suddenly start having heart issues. This allows me to drop everything immediately, not something you can do with a free weight bench press, or squat, for example.
  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    Day 37, and I am down 30.2 lbs. Just 6/10ths of a lb. in the past 5 days though. I am getting pretty close to 250 however, which will be a big milestone.

    Light day today, I had 4 Jumbo eggs, and 3 sausage links cooked in 3 Tbsp. salted butter. Lunch will be 1.35 lbs. of chicken thighs, and dinner is just 2 cans of tuna in water, and 3 Tbsp. mayonnaise.. just 2,191 calories. My macros are 36/1/63, and my protein is only 195 grams today, but when I woke up, I wasn't feeling like eating as much. I eat a big breakfast every morning, because my goal is to get food early, and have a smaller dinner. Originally, I had GB for lunch, and the chicken for dinner, since it is only 921 calories, but some days you wake up and just don't like the sound of what you have planned. I have some pork steaks ready to go, if I get done with dinner, and decide I could have another lb. of meat.

    Going to work at the office for half a day, then hit the gym, and do Back, shoulders, and triceps. I try to stick to 12 sets a day, since I wear out faster on low carb, but that fits with my lifting style anyways. I can't do powerlifting exercises any more, in the way I used to, but even now, I lift heavy ( relatively ), and low rep. Six reps is normal for me. I will do 6 slow reps for lat pulldowns now, then rows, then delt presses, and laterals, and finally tri presses, and pressdowns. I use a lot more machines, mostly because of the type of gym I go to.. not a lot of free weights. I do 8 reps for the last 3 exercises, because they work smaller muscles. The goal is to stress the muscles, do the rest of my body, and take a rest day.. so the next time I do these exercises is 3 days from now. Hopefully, that allows me to grow a little muscle, while I lose the fat. I can't imagine doing 90 minute workouts, like I did in my 20's.. age is a factor, but while I have more energy in my daily life, it rapidly disappears after about 30 minutes at the gym. I can lift as heavy, just not for as long. I am slowly making gains though.

    Then I plan to go home, eat my lunch, and cook my brother's dinner in the crockpot, since he works all day, and I don't.. he has beef chunks and a can of mixed veggies. At least it isn't macaroni & cheese, or something like that. He is doing moderate carb. He had tuna for lunch, and added celery.. still pretty low carb, and veggies don't tempt me. I will be smelling the beef chunks for 6 hours.. the only thing it might do, is make me eat a pork steak, and pop me over 3000 calories today. My afternoon I plan to spend reading a book. Not a very exciting day, but should be relaxing.
  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    Had a nice drop yesterday. down 1.2 lbs., to 249.2. Below 250 for the first time in a few years!

    This morning, I had a 109 BG reading, and then ate 4 Jumbo eggs/3 Tbsp. butter, and then 4 ozs. of cheese. I only planned 2 ozs., but I cut 8 oz. bricks of cheese in 4 pcs., and I had 2 left, so I decided to have the other..before lunch, my BG was 124.. above where I want them.. I prefer 70-110, and would rather be LOW, than above 120. I think cheese is an item I have minor issues with, and that by consuming it, I am actually slowing down my weight loss, even though it is hard to notice, since I am losing quickly, because I am not yet 40 days into Carnivore, AND more importantly, it is keeping my BG levels elevated. It would become a major issue as my weight loss slows naturally, when I get closer to goal.. I might still lose 100 lbs., but at 180, will this cheese prevent weight loss, and be more noticeable, because I probably wouldn't be losing 1.2 lbs., ANY day of the week. I think I am going to try not eating any cheese for the next month.

    I bought some 73/27 GB.. highest fat I can find. I cut down to only using salt, and stopped using garlic powder & black pepper. Lunch was 1.25 lbs. a quarter of the 5 lb. package of GB.. it adds 350 calories versus 80/20 GB. Dinner is a 1 lb. pork steak.. package was 4.00 lbs, and there are 4 steaks. I subtracted 20% for the bone, and so it's 12.8 ozs. of pork steak for dinner. I was going to eat 2 of them, but that pushed my calories to 4,583. That's when I noticed the extra 350 calories for lunch ( 1750 ), and that breakfast was up to 1105, due to the extra cheese, and 2 pork steaks added 1,728 calories.

    I already ate the breakfast and lunch, so I decided to only eat 1 pork steak. This puts me at 3,719 calories today, which is way more than my usual. I did eat a bit less than normal yesterday.. 2,191.. I have been eating around 3000 most days, so maybe this is making up some ground.. 700 less than normal yesterday, 700 extra today. I had no problem eating breakfast and lunch, other than the high BG number. I hope a 1 lb. pork steak is enough, but I may end up eating the second one, and that worries me some. 4500 calories isn't supposed to matter on Carnivore, but it just sounds like a lot of energy to burn off. I'll have to see what I eat tonight, and then what happens tomorrow.

    I went to the gym, and did 12 sets of chest, biceps, and legs.. and going for a 3.6 mile walk at 5 p.m. out to the lake and back. It's 70 degrees and sunny. Today and tommorrow are the last warm days.. highs in the 50's by the weekend. I have a lot of energy, but if I am going for a walk at 50 degrees, I'm going to need warmer clothes. Time to admit summer is over.

  • sarah7591
    sarah7591 Posts: 415 Member
    Wow....great job! How come you gave up the garlic powder and black pepper? Just the taste or did you feel it was effecting your diet?
  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    These spices come from plant-based foods sarah.. garlic & peppercorns.

    I am just being picky.. so down to salt, but after 40 days, I taste the meat a lot more.. not even using that much salt.

    I also gave up cheese, and considering giving up butter, and buying some lard or beef tallow.. so non-dairy fat. I have some issues with dairy, and have always limited it.. no milk for decades, for example.. it makes me bloat, and cough up phlegm for hours. I LOVE cheese, so I was trying to slide just a little in, but probably best if I just quit cheese.. I never thought about butter as dairy, which now seems stupid, since I get it in the dairy. :D

    Just trying to stick to the strictest interpretation of this WOE, so if I eventually decide this is not something I plan to stick to for good, that it isn't because I didn't give it a fair shot.

    I gained some weight. Still 249.6, so not too much. I feel great. Going to gym soon, then taking a walk later. I am doing 3.6 miles out to the lake, but can't imagine walking farther.. this takes just over an hour. Also plan on stopping the walk to the lake, simply because the temp is dropping, and it feels colder by the lake. Poured this morning, but is dry now, so I can do a walk. 63 for a high, so not too cold yet.

    This morning I had my PT/INR test today ( every 4-6 weeks ).. and my blood was a bit thin.. 3.3 when 2-3 is the desired range.. above 3 is thinner, and below 2 is thicker. since not eating any salad, and not consuming any mayo lately, I get very little Vitamin K, which thickens the blood and helps with clotting.. so Coumadin works against it, to thin the blood. So if I eat greens or soy, it counteracts the Vitamin K, and I need more Coumadin.

    I always kept pretty steady, and in range.. 1 salad a week, and some mayo, and there is some Vit. K in chicken. Now I get the Vit K. in chicken, and from beef liver which I eat once every 1-2 weeks.. but not as much.. SO.. they REDUCED the amount of Coumadin I have to take! A nice side benefit. Basically it removes 2 half-pills I take twice a week.. now just 1 pill a day.

  • russellholtslander1
    russellholtslander1 Posts: 285 Member
    I am down to 248.8. Breakfast today was 5 sausage links, and 4 Jumbo eggs cooked in 2 Tbsp. butter. Lunch was the other half of my rack of ribs for lunch, and tonight I am having 5 lamb chops.

    I have noticed that my sodium intake is up, which isn't causing any issues, like breathing poorly, or high BP.. my BP was 96/63 this morning.. BUT I am drinking more water, and since I don't get rid of fluids easily, this could cause weight gain, and if it adds up enough, it could cause breathing issues, and worse.. I am supposed to only drink 2 liters of fluid a day.. so paying attention to that today.. I have two 2 liter bottles. I can tell i have been drinking at least 3 liters a day lately, based on how little water this seems to be. I remeber when they put me on 2 liters.. I probably drank 1.5 gallons a day back then, and 2 liters seemed like it was impossible. I got used to it pretty quickly though, but lately, it has been wandering UPwards.. I stuck to 2 liters yesterday, and lost 8/10ths of a lb. Hopefully, it explains the recent slow weight loss. It isn' that slow, and not a big deal if it is just an adjustment period, but if it is just extra water consumption, I should see some decent weight loss over the next week.

    Went to gym today, and plan to take a walk tonight, before dinner.. not much else going on, except going to buy a few groceries and pick up pills, right after I leave the office. Just finished the next week of meals for my brother and I, and do not need a lot of groceries. Mostly, fruit, vegetables, and salad/dressing for him.. he is eating moderate carb.. 40-80 g a day. My habit of going to the store for special meals, means I had a lot of meat in the freezer, so I only need to buy steak for one meal.

    I am planning to switch to 2 meals a day. 6 a.m., and then at 3 p.m. My breakfasts will be less calories, simply because I really don't need butter, so 4 Jumbo eggs, with either 4 sausage links, or 6 slices of bacon. My portions of meat will be larger, and my " lunch " will be closer to 1800 calories, but what I am cutting is butter.. dropping me from 2800, to 2400 calories a day.

    Lunch has always been something I struggle with. I love breakfast, and I love cooking dinner, but then I have this entire OTHER meal to make, in the middle of the day, when I am busy. I find myself trying to come up with something other than what I am having for dinner.. I have never found a LC lunch option.. it is usually some other dish, which is also a dinner. I forget lunch a lot, because I am busy, and not hungry, so I eat at 3 p.m. many days already, and then I have to push dinner back to 8 p.m. or later. The only reason I eat 3 meals a day, is because that is " normal ".. it was fine when I would eat a salad, or a sandwich.. something different.. but I'm eating meat, and all it does is make me come up with 14 meal ideas. With 7 meals, I can have a menu, where I rarely eat the same thing more than twice in a week. Plus less dishes to clean.
  • sarah7591
    sarah7591 Posts: 415 Member
    You are doing great ! I imagine eating 2 meals a day will help with your blood sugar too.
  • Mpalamar
    Mpalamar Posts: 33 Member
    edited October 2021
    Sounds like the EMC diet (eggs, meat, chess) which is a wonderful way to shed some pounds and it will balance out blood sugar levels and lower LDL and triglycerides, but it's not meant as a long term solution, typically after 30 days you should begin incorporating veggies back into your diet, and expanding from there. There is nothing wrong with keeping your carbs between 50g-100g per day. Fiber is important for heart heart too. What (if any) supplements are you taking? You won't find much selenium or Vitamin E in just meats, these guys are big in fighting against cancer, among other things.

    What is your goal? To lose weight or to be healthy? They are not synonymous. You can be healthy and not be super skinny and you can be super skinny and be very unhealthy.

    [edited by MFP Mods]

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