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Do you NEED to deadlift?
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As a 48 year old woman who just started lifting less than 2 years ago, I was doing deadlifts. I have set that aside for awhile. I had back surgery in April (bone spur on vertebrae that was compressing my sciatic nerve), and just got back in the gym in July. So for the moment, at least, I'm starting to incorporate rack pulls before I even think about doing deadlifts. I had only gotten up to 145lbs before I ended up out for 5 months. But even that, I'm not risking because a) I've just started to get close to how much weight I was lifting in general (not there yet) and b) I don't want to injure my back after having had surgery.
TL;DR rack pulls are an alternative that is easier on your lower back, therefore may be a good idea to at least start with for people who are my age and older.0 -
Please be extra careful. It's so easy to feel that your back is good enough to handle prior loads, but as someone who deals with older clients on a regular basis, the injury rate increases as one ages even if form is spot on and prior loads weren't an issue.As a 48 year old woman who just started lifting less than 2 years ago, I was doing deadlifts. I have set that aside for awhile. I had back surgery in April (bone spur on vertebrae that was compressing my sciatic nerve), and just got back in the gym in July. So for the moment, at least, I'm starting to incorporate rack pulls before I even think about doing deadlifts. I had only gotten up to 145lbs before I ended up out for 5 months. But even that, I'm not risking because a) I've just started to get close to how much weight I was lifting in general (not there yet) and b) I don't want to injure my back after having had surgery.
TL;DR rack pulls are an alternative that is easier on your lower back, therefore may be a good idea to at least start with for people who are my age and older.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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bump
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Uh, @ninerbuff you okay?’1
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He's just bumping the thread periodically so fresh eyes can see it.1
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Almost a year later, re-read this discussion (it's saved in my bookmarks). Thought I'd simultaneously bump it for new eyes to see, as well as post a quick personal update:
In almost 15 years of lifting, I've only had three extended periods of missed gym time (3+ weeks) due to a lifting injury; two of them were due to deadlifting off the ground. After the second occurrence last year, a PT friend of mine asked me to describe how the injury happened. He listened, determined both deadlifting injuries occurred during the first couple inches off the floor due to poor form, and recommended I do rack pulls instead, which basically are doing the top-half of a deadlift motion. (At the lowest point, the bar sits on the weight rack at- or just below-knee height. Hence, RACK pulls.)
Been doing them for about 9 months now, and not only has there been no injury (not even a twinge telling me I was close to one), but I'm pulling considerably heavier weights (for 5 reps) than I could with the full-range deadlift (for 2 reps).2 -
That’s genius and I am going to try that. Same issue here. Deadlifts pull my back out, even at light weights.
I find it interesting that the abs crunch machine is kind of the opposite motion and feels like a massage. I love that thing.0 -
If I do ANY deadlifts, it's rack dead lifts. What's exciting here is at the end of the month we're getting 6 deadlift/squat rack platforms to replace the old squat racks and mats here. Also adding a Tbar row machine, a new glute lift machine and 2 full racks of new dumbbells. I can't wait!!!!!Almost a year later, re-read this discussion (it's saved in my bookmarks). Thought I'd simultaneously bump it for new eyes to see, as well as post a quick personal update:
In almost 15 years of lifting, I've only had three extended periods of missed gym time (3+ weeks) due to a lifting injury; two of them were due to deadlifting off the ground. After the second occurrence last year, a PT friend of mine asked me to describe how the injury happened. He listened, determined both deadlifting injuries occurred during the first couple inches off the floor due to poor form, and recommended I do rack pulls instead, which basically are doing the top-half of a deadlift motion. (At the lowest point, the bar sits on the weight rack at- or just below-knee height. Hence, RACK pulls.)
Been doing them for about 9 months now, and not only has there been no injury (not even a twinge telling me I was close to one), but I'm pulling considerably heavier weights (for 5 reps) than I could with the full-range deadlift (for 2 reps).
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 35+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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I am 57 and restarted weight training after retiring. I never really deadlifted before and well some say I don't as I am using the trap bar with the high handles but I am enjoying it. It actually started after I was doing farmers carries with the dumbells and wanted more weight the gym owner said try the trap bar next thing I started doing deadlifts ish. I do my light sets with the low handles and will work up to the bar after a few months to let my body get used to heavier weights. Cons... I am very tired after the workout and generally will need a 10 minute power nap. I feel like its helping me1
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My advice is just to keep your ego in check. I can't tell you how many people I've had to rehab from lower back injury from just trying to lift weight off the floor who are over the age of 45. As I mentioned, while there is no need to deadlift heavy weights for most over a certain age, one can still do it if they are fit enough to handle the load and don't let their egos take over and lift PRs just to get an ego massage.Dontkillbill1509 wrote: »I am 57 and restarted weight training after retiring. I never really deadlifted before and well some say I don't as I am using the trap bar with the high handles but I am enjoying it. It actually started after I was doing farmers carries with the dumbells and wanted more weight the gym owner said try the trap bar next thing I started doing deadlifts ish. I do my light sets with the low handles and will work up to the bar after a few months to let my body get used to heavier weights. Cons... I am very tired after the workout and generally will need a 10 minute power nap. I feel like its helping me
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 35+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Training so many people of different age ranges in my clientele, I was asked one time by one of my older clients on why I don't have him deadlift in our program. He marvels at some of the younger ones deadlifting 315lbs + off the floor. Even girls are lifting 250lbs off the floor.
I mentioned to him that based on his goals and because I want to keep him safe and injury free as possible (he's in his 60's), I don't include deadlifts in the program, but we do a lot of back work with rows, pullups, etc.
Now IF a client really wants to deadlift, I'll include it in a program, but max lifts aren't for anyone over a certain age IMO. The risk/satisfaction just isn't worth it since I've seen many a member doing them over a certain age get injured somehow and recovery is quite long.
Many clients over 50, I'll have do rack deadlifts if they want to have deadlifts in their program. It's rarely a few (I can count on one hand how many I've had in years over 50 years old) that do it from the floor.
But in reality, what does one apply a heavy deadlift to in everyday life? I mean even if say a box was 100lbs, I don't see many lifting it off the floor without assistance.
Thoughts?
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I just went to a gym and have been playing around with their weight. I read about RDL and have been going through that motion and getting a feel for it. Seems fun. As an oldster should I actively avoid it?0 -
chris_in_cal wrote: »Training so many people of different age ranges in my clientele, I was asked one time by one of my older clients on why I don't have him deadlift in our program. He marvels at some of the younger ones deadlifting 315lbs + off the floor. Even girls are lifting 250lbs off the floor.
I mentioned to him that based on his goals and because I want to keep him safe and injury free as possible (he's in his 60's), I don't include deadlifts in the program, but we do a lot of back work with rows, pullups, etc.
Now IF a client really wants to deadlift, I'll include it in a program, but max lifts aren't for anyone over a certain age IMO. The risk/satisfaction just isn't worth it since I've seen many a member doing them over a certain age get injured somehow and recovery is quite long.
Many clients over 50, I'll have do rack deadlifts if they want to have deadlifts in their program. It's rarely a few (I can count on one hand how many I've had in years over 50 years old) that do it from the floor.
But in reality, what does one apply a heavy deadlift to in everyday life? I mean even if say a box was 100lbs, I don't see many lifting it off the floor without assistance.
Thoughts?
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I just went to a gym and have been playing around with their weight. I read about RDL and have been going through that motion and getting a feel for it. Seems fun. As an oldster should I actively avoid it?
With any lifting it’s technique and weight tolerance which is important. I regularly do RDLs as I need to strengthen my posterior chain, but I won’t max out on them and I am an absolute stickler for form. If the gym has qualified PTs, it would be worth asking them to check your form and then increase in weight slowly - ego lifting is (I suspect) a significant cause of injury.
Also, if you’re new to them, make sure you programme in plenty or rest and recovery - back doms are evil.1 -
What she said.0
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I'm using the dreaded Smith Machine, and RDL is one of about five or six that are no-brainers for a beginner to use on that machine. Thanks.
Form/rest/doublecheck form/repeat got it0 -
chris_in_cal wrote: »I'm using the dreaded Smith Machine, and RDL is one of about five or six that are no-brainers for a beginner to use on that machine. Thanks.
Form/rest/doublecheck form/repeat got it
I’ve never actually used a smith machine (I train mostly in my garage) but I have heard they’re good for moderating the risk on some lifts.
A nice pairing is bent over rows, so you get the lower back, hammies and a bit of glutes, with the lats and upper back targeted by the rows.0 -
claireychn074 wrote: »chris_in_cal wrote: »I'm using the dreaded Smith Machine, and RDL is one of about five or six that are no-brainers for a beginner to use on that machine. Thanks.
Form/rest/doublecheck form/repeat got it
I’ve never actually used a smith machine (I train mostly in my garage) but I have heard they’re good for moderating the risk on some lifts.
A nice pairing is bent over rows, so you get the lower back, hammies and a bit of glutes, with the lats and upper back targeted by the rows.
Got it, thanks. I am going in later today, I'll try those two in a pair. I started about 3 times with just the bar, and the last 3 times with 10lbs plates.
Thanks.1 -
Let us know how it goes!chris_in_cal wrote: »claireychn074 wrote: »chris_in_cal wrote: »I'm using the dreaded Smith Machine, and RDL is one of about five or six that are no-brainers for a beginner to use on that machine. Thanks.
Form/rest/doublecheck form/repeat got it
I’ve never actually used a smith machine (I train mostly in my garage) but I have heard they’re good for moderating the risk on some lifts.
A nice pairing is bent over rows, so you get the lower back, hammies and a bit of glutes, with the lats and upper back targeted by the rows.
Got it, thanks. I am going in later today, I'll try those two in a pair. I started about 3 times with just the bar, and the last 3 times with 10lbs plates.
Thanks.
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Just an aside, weight “feels” very different in the Smith Machine versus free weights.
Once you switch over, don’t assume you can go straight from the weight you were doing in the Smith machine to the other.
Sorry, that’s just the mom in me stating the obvious, however, I’ve done some dumb *kitten* in gyms, and doesn’t hurt to share.3 -
Let us know how it goes!claireychn074 wrote: »chris_in_cal wrote: »A nice pairing is bent over rows, so you get the lower back, hammies and a bit of glutes, with the lats and upper back targeted by the rows.
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I did it. Awkward. I've done one handed bent over rows, with my knee on a bench before. Those worked, this one with both hands and standing up needs me to look at some more youtubes and work on the shape and form of it. I'll keep trying.
RDL are on point. Next time I'll try deadlifts.
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chris_in_cal wrote: »
Let us know how it goes!claireychn074 wrote: »chris_in_cal wrote: »A nice pairing is bent over rows, so you get the lower back, hammies and a bit of glutes, with the lats and upper back targeted by the rows.
I did it. Awkward. I've done one handed bent over rows, with my knee on a bench before. Those worked, this one with both hands and standing up needs me to look at some more youtubes and work on the shape and form of it. I'll keep trying.
RDL are on point. Next time I'll try deadlifts.
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Thinking about it, I’m not sure how easy bent over rows would be with a smith machine 🤔 this is a half decent vid
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UL8ZcK64KxA 0 -
Makes sense. You don't need to deadlift to keep hinge movements in the program...0
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