1200 calories, exercise, but no weight loss!!

wheird

Don't eat processed foods, gluten or cheese, look how much sodium you have. I weighted 185 now 120 also with a low thyroid. Get you some fresh veggies and good protein!

Aren't all those Advocare meal replacements and supplements you're taking, processed?

Processed into something that isn't even recognizable as food anymore. :laugh:

Mr_Knight

While I do believe that proteins and possibly certain carbohydrates take more energy to digest, I'm not sure of the actual percentage difference to state whether or not it is even worth mentioning.

The numbers I've seen put TEF at ~5% at one extreme (eating nothing but butter and sugar) to 30% (eating nothing but chewable protein). Using a balanced diet as the baseline, the effect of moving to either extreme is lower than the margin of error in estimating the calories contained in the food or burned in exercise.

It's just not going to be a meaningful issue for someone unless they're living their entire life inside a calorimeter.

There are also complications in that TEF won't be constant in a person over an extended period of time.

Sarauk2sf

How much weight have you lost in total and over what period of time?

Over a period of about 2 years I gained 10 lbs. A year ago I decided to start working out and lost 3 lbs between Nov 2012 and Feb 2013. No weight loss since, even though I have increased my workouts!

To clarify:

- You have remained the same weight, give or take a few lbs, for 2 years

- You added exercise and lost 3lbs a year ago, and nothing since

- You weigh your food unless pre-portioned.

- You log everything here, and before 'here' in a written journal

- You have averaged less than 1,200 calories that whole 2 years.

Qski

>> This is nonsense <<

Pretty opinionated for a guy who doesn't know what he's talking about, and offers no proof to the contrary other than his assertion. The fact that protein requires more calories to metabolize is well established:

- http://www.livestrong.com/article/299424-calories-burned-digesting-protein/
- http://www.fitday.com/fitness-articles/fitness/10-fat-burning-foods-you-should-be-eating.html
- http://www.rd.com/health/fitness/5-fitness-myths-you-need-to-forget/
- Feinman RD, Fine EJ. “A calorie is a calorie” violates the second law of thermodynamics. Nutr J. 2004 Jul 28;3:9. PubMed PMID: 15282028; PubMed Central PMCID: PMC506782.
- Halton TL, Hu FB. The effects of high protein diets on thermogenesis, satiety and weight loss: a critical review. J Am Coll Nutr. 2004 Oct;23(5):373-85. Review. PubMed PMID: 15466943.
- Johnston CS, Day CS, Swan PD. Postprandial thermogenesis is increased 100% on a high-protein, low-fat diet versus a high-carbohydrate, low-fat diet in healthy, young women. J Am Coll Nutr. 2002 Feb;21(1):55-61. PubMed PMID: 11838888.

But who are you going to believe, the experts or the guy with a cat on his shoulder?

The difference is simply not significant within the confines of a normal diet. If you ate all your calories from protein vs all your calories from carbs, then there would be a measurable difference. But within reasonable, human macronutrient partitions? Not so much.

You won't suddenly start losing weight by maintaining the same calorie intake but getting an extra 10-15% of your calories from protein.

That's not what I suggested. What I did suggest was that more protein, fiber, and complex carbohydrates and fewer high-glycemic carbohydrates could have a positive metabolic effect, and while that's not a guarantee, it's amply backed by scientific research. But you apparently think that, for weight loss, 1200 calories of chocolate donuts is the same thing as 1200 calories of protein, complex carbohydrates and a moderate amount of healthy fat. So, I guess on that point, we agree to disagree.

pretty much all of said responses posted equates to this poster not reading the original post correctly, pedantically taking small pieces of the post out of context and way too literally and then shoving it back as erroneous.

So even though all of the posts people are putting forward could be useful for anyone who is struggling to lose, the only thing that said poster has against them is purportedly that he didn't say it.

I guess the actions could imply a troll.

But the OP is also only cherry picking advice that fits with their stated negativity toward eating in general, so anything else would probably not help.

jonnythan

But you apparently think that, for weight loss, 1200 calories of chocolate donuts is the same thing as 1200 calories of protein, complex carbohydrates and a moderate amount of healthy fat. So, I guess on that point, we agree to disagree.

Strong reading comprehension, as well as a strong sense of what is practical and reasonable.

MrGonzo05

I'm not going to tell you to eat more. I'm going to tell you to accurately track what you eat. And to be patient.

jonnythan

pretty much all of said responses posted equates to this poster not reading the original post correctly, pedantically taking small pieces of the post out of context and way too literally and then shoving it back as erroneous.

So even though all of the posts people are putting forward could be useful for anyone who is struggling to lose, the only thing that said poster has against them is purportedly that he didn't say it.

I guess the actions could imply a troll.

But the OP is also only cherry picking advice that fits with their stated negativity toward eating in general, so anything else would probably not help.

Someone sounds a little upset that her "starvation mode is the reason you've maintained the same weight all year" theory has been shot down.

Ugh.

jofjltncb6

>> This is nonsense <<

Pretty opinionated for a guy who doesn't know what he's talking about, and offers no proof to the contrary other than his assertion. The fact that protein requires more calories to metabolize is well established:

- http://www.livestrong.com/article/299424-calories-burned-digesting-protein/
- http://www.fitday.com/fitness-articles/fitness/10-fat-burning-foods-you-should-be-eating.html
- http://www.rd.com/health/fitness/5-fitness-myths-you-need-to-forget/
- Feinman RD, Fine EJ. “A calorie is a calorie” violates the second law of thermodynamics. Nutr J. 2004 Jul 28;3:9. PubMed PMID: 15282028; PubMed Central PMCID: PMC506782.
- Halton TL, Hu FB. The effects of high protein diets on thermogenesis, satiety and weight loss: a critical review. J Am Coll Nutr. 2004 Oct;23(5):373-85. Review. PubMed PMID: 15466943.
- Johnston CS, Day CS, Swan PD. Postprandial thermogenesis is increased 100% on a high-protein, low-fat diet versus a high-carbohydrate, low-fat diet in healthy, young women. J Am Coll Nutr. 2002 Feb;21(1):55-61. PubMed PMID: 11838888.

But who are you going to believe, the experts or the guy with a cat on his shoulder?

The difference is simply not significant within the confines of a normal diet. If you ate all your calories from protein vs all your calories from carbs, then there would be a measurable difference. But within reasonable, human macronutrient partitions? Not so much.

You won't suddenly start losing weight by maintaining the same calorie intake but getting an extra 10-15% of your calories from protein.

That's not what I suggested. What I did suggest was that more protein, fiber, and complex carbohydrates and fewer high-glycemic carbohydrates could have a positive metabolic effect, and while that's not a guarantee, it's amply backed by scientific research. But you apparently think that, for weight loss, 1200 calories of chocolate donuts is the same thing as 1200 calories of protein, complex carbohydrates and a moderate amount of healthy fat. So, I guess on that point, we agree to disagree.

pretty much all of said responses posted equates to this poster not reading the original post correctly, pedantically taking small pieces of the post out of context and way too literally and then shoving it back as erroneous.

So even though all of the posts people are putting forward could be useful for anyone who is struggling to lose, the only thing that said poster has against them is purportedly that he didn't say it.

I guess the actions could imply a troll.

But the OP is also only cherry picking advice that fits with their stated negativity toward eating in general, so anything else would probably not help.

Is there some kind of personal history between you and jonnythan that I don't know about? You've made what seems to me to be a leap in your analysis of him that isn't likely borne out in just the posts of this thread.

jonnythan

Is there some kind of personal history between you and jonnythan that I don't know about? You've made what seems to me to be a leap in your analysis of him that isn't likely borne out in just the posts of this thread.

Not that I'm aware of.

wheird

>> This is nonsense <<

Pretty opinionated for a guy who doesn't know what he's talking about, and offers no proof to the contrary other than his assertion. The fact that protein requires more calories to metabolize is well established:

- http://www.livestrong.com/article/299424-calories-burned-digesting-protein/
- http://www.fitday.com/fitness-articles/fitness/10-fat-burning-foods-you-should-be-eating.html
- http://www.rd.com/health/fitness/5-fitness-myths-you-need-to-forget/
- Feinman RD, Fine EJ. “A calorie is a calorie” violates the second law of thermodynamics. Nutr J. 2004 Jul 28;3:9. PubMed PMID: 15282028; PubMed Central PMCID: PMC506782.
- Halton TL, Hu FB. The effects of high protein diets on thermogenesis, satiety and weight loss: a critical review. J Am Coll Nutr. 2004 Oct;23(5):373-85. Review. PubMed PMID: 15466943.
- Johnston CS, Day CS, Swan PD. Postprandial thermogenesis is increased 100% on a high-protein, low-fat diet versus a high-carbohydrate, low-fat diet in healthy, young women. J Am Coll Nutr. 2002 Feb;21(1):55-61. PubMed PMID: 11838888.

But who are you going to believe, the experts or the guy with a cat on his shoulder?

The difference is simply not significant within the confines of a normal diet. If you ate all your calories from protein vs all your calories from carbs, then there would be a measurable difference. But within reasonable, human macronutrient partitions? Not so much.

You won't suddenly start losing weight by maintaining the same calorie intake but getting an extra 10-15% of your calories from protein.

That's not what I suggested. What I did suggest was that more protein, fiber, and complex carbohydrates and fewer high-glycemic carbohydrates could have a positive metabolic effect, and while that's not a guarantee, it's amply backed by scientific research. But you apparently think that, for weight loss, 1200 calories of chocolate donuts is the same thing as 1200 calories of protein, complex carbohydrates and a moderate amount of healthy fat. So, I guess on that point, we agree to disagree.

pretty much all of said responses posted equates to this poster not reading the original post correctly, pedantically taking small pieces of the post out of context and way too literally and then shoving it back as erroneous.

So even though all of the posts people are putting forward could be useful for anyone who is struggling to lose, the only thing that said poster has against them is purportedly that he didn't say it.

I guess the actions could imply a troll.

But the OP is also only cherry picking advice that fits with their stated negativity toward eating in general, so anything else would probably not help.

Well, when discussing science, being pedantic is important. Taking bits of posts and analyzing them is an important part of the process of weight management issues. You can tell someone exactly what to do, but showing them why they need to do it, and subsequently why another thing is wrong or incorrect, is a better method.

And I am pretty sure there has been no trolling in this thread thus far.

jofjltncb6

Is there some kind of personal history between you and jonnythan that I don't know about? You've made what seems to me to be a leap in your analysis of him that isn't likely borne out in just the posts of this thread.

Not that I'm aware of.

Hmmm. I probably just missed (or misread) the posts that led her to dislike you so much.

jonnythan

Is there some kind of personal history between you and jonnythan that I don't know about? You've made what seems to me to be a leap in your analysis of him that isn't likely borne out in just the posts of this thread.

Not that I'm aware of.

Hmmm. I probably just missed (or misread) the posts that led her to dislike you so much.

She basically said starvation mode can make you stop losing weight, and linked to a podcast to prove it. Several of us told her that's not true and asked her to prove it. She said the podcast proves it but she can't tell us why exactly because she can't listen to the podcast.

That's about it.

gigglesinthesun

How much weight have you lost in total and over what period of time?

Over a period of about 2 years I gained 10 lbs. A year ago I decided to start working out and lost 3 lbs between Nov 2012 and Feb 2013. No weight loss since, even though I have increased my workouts!

The only conclusion I can come to is that you have been, and possibly still are, eating much more than you think you are.

yep, that would be my guess as well. It's actually quite hard to work out every day and do your daily life and just take in 1000 calories, because whilst that might work short term, the resulting lethargy would make your activities incredibly hard to sustain.

I am still perplexed over your pizza entries, just how small a slice are you having? Are you drinking any calories (juice/alcohol/supplements).

wheird

Is there some kind of personal history between you and jonnythan that I don't know about? You've made what seems to me to be a leap in your analysis of him that isn't likely borne out in just the posts of this thread.

Not that I'm aware of.

Hmmm. I probably just missed (or misread) the posts that led her to dislike you so much.

Some people don't need a reason. A newer member messaged me yesterday to "resolve our differences" and ended up blocking me because she thought I deleted a post I had made the day prior before I could explain that users cannot delete their posts and link her to the proper thread.

Crazy people.

jofjltncb6

Is there some kind of personal history between you and jonnythan that I don't know about? You've made what seems to me to be a leap in your analysis of him that isn't likely borne out in just the posts of this thread.

Not that I'm aware of.

Hmmm. I probably just missed (or misread) the posts that led her to dislike you so much.

Some people don't need a reason. A newer member messaged me yesterday to "resolve our differences" and ended up blocking me because she thought I deleted a post I had made the day prior before I could explain that users cannot delete their posts and link her to the proper thread.

Crazy people.

Honestly, if she had just said, "hey, look, jonnythan, I don't like you...just because" I get that. But it seems to be unduly affecting the discourse here.

jjplato

>> This is nonsense <<

Pretty opinionated for a guy who doesn't know what he's talking about, and offers no proof to the contrary other than his assertion. The fact that protein requires more calories to metabolize is well established:

- http://www.livestrong.com/article/299424-calories-burned-digesting-protein/
- http://www.fitday.com/fitness-articles/fitness/10-fat-burning-foods-you-should-be-eating.html
- http://www.rd.com/health/fitness/5-fitness-myths-you-need-to-forget/
- Feinman RD, Fine EJ. “A calorie is a calorie” violates the second law of thermodynamics. Nutr J. 2004 Jul 28;3:9. PubMed PMID: 15282028; PubMed Central PMCID: PMC506782.
- Halton TL, Hu FB. The effects of high protein diets on thermogenesis, satiety and weight loss: a critical review. J Am Coll Nutr. 2004 Oct;23(5):373-85. Review. PubMed PMID: 15466943.
- Johnston CS, Day CS, Swan PD. Postprandial thermogenesis is increased 100% on a high-protein, low-fat diet versus a high-carbohydrate, low-fat diet in healthy, young women. J Am Coll Nutr. 2002 Feb;21(1):55-61. PubMed PMID: 11838888.

But who are you going to believe, the experts or the guy with a cat on his shoulder?

The difference is simply not significant within the confines of a normal diet. If you ate all your calories from protein vs all your calories from carbs, then there would be a measurable difference. But within reasonable, human macronutrient partitions? Not so much.

You won't suddenly start losing weight by maintaining the same calorie intake but getting an extra 10-15% of your calories from protein.

That's not what I suggested. What I did suggest was that more protein, fiber, and complex carbohydrates and fewer high-glycemic carbohydrates could have a positive metabolic effect, and while that's not a guarantee, it's amply backed by scientific research. But you apparently think that, for weight loss, 1200 calories of chocolate donuts is the same thing as 1200 calories of protein, complex carbohydrates and a moderate amount of healthy fat. So, I guess on that point, we agree to disagree.

While I do believe that proteins and possibly certain carbohydrates take more energy to digest, I'm not sure of the actual percentage difference to state whether or not it is even worth mentioning.

I certainly don't think it's a magic bullet. There definitely is a positive thermogenic effect (how large is still a subject of debate) and there's a secondary effect on satiation -- people on higher-protein diets tend to consume about 10% fewer calories overall. However, I believe that avoiding the high-glycemic carbs (esp. things like high-fructose corn syrup) is even more significant that protein intake. I'm not an advocate for high-protein diets per se; I just think that substituting a pizza crust for a chicken breast and steamed broccoli is likely to produce better weight-loss results, calories notwithstanding. The worst-case scenario is you get a more nutritious diet.

wheird

*snip*

I certainly don't think it's a magic bullet. There definitely is a positive thermogenic effect (how large is still a subject of debate) and there's a secondary effect on satiation -- people on higher-protein diets tend to consume about 10% fewer calories overall. However, I believe that avoiding the high-glycemic carbs (esp. things like high-fructose corn syrup) is even more significant that protein intake. I'm not an advocate for high-protein diets per se; I just think that substituting a pizza crust for a chicken breast and steamed broccoli is likely to produce better weight-loss results, calories notwithstanding. The worst-case scenario is you get a more nutritious diet.

I don't doubt that the people on a high-protein diet would tend to consume less than a person on a low-protein diet, but we're mainly talking about people who are shooting for a calorie goal rather than people who are "listening to their body". I disagree with the second part about that sort of substitute producing a meaningfully better result in terms of weight loss. But yes, I do catch your drift about it being more nutritious. Though, pizza is probably a poor comparison as it is fairly healthy depending on the ingredients used.

mschf3

Calorie counting isn't the answer. What you are eating is important. I suggest you read the book "Why We Get Fat and What to Do About it" to start. I've increased my calories, decreased the amount of exercise, and I have trimmed down to where I'm darned happy with myself. I'm 53 - so I don't have the luxury of a youthful metabolism. I am a personal trainer and group fitness instructor. I've seen too many people do the calorie thing and fail and it's NOT their fault.

Do some research. Don't read magazines for the answer. Take the time to do it right and you'll find a whole new way of being happy with yourself. Feel free to PM me. Best wishes to you.

sillysquirrel68

How much weight have you lost in total and over what period of time?

Over a period of about 2 years I gained 10 lbs. A year ago I decided to start working out and lost 3 lbs between Nov 2012 and Feb 2013. No weight loss since, even though I have increased my workouts!

To clarify:

- You have remained the same weight, give or take a few lbs, for 2 years

- You added exercise and lost 3lbs a year ago, and nothing since

- You weigh your food unless pre-portioned.

- You log everything here, and before 'here' in a written journal

- You have averaged less than 1,200 calories that whole 2 years.

No, I am sure that my calories were higher up until this summer when I cut way back on breads and sweets. I wasn't counting before that. But I have never had to eat much to be full. I can guarantee that prior to those cutbacks I was definitely over 1200, but probably still low compared to what some are saying I should be eating in a day.

TemikaThompson

I expect you're eating more than you think you are. Are you logging every single thing you eat, including snacks, drinks, condiments, etc.?

my thoughts also

any cheat days?
a cheat day can wipe out 6 days of caloric deficit

Tell me about it! Don't I know that from experience. Had to make a change and it worked! Great thoughts!