My Pointless Soapbox

jofjltncb6

Honestly, I have tried to refute your argument a few times now but keep stumbling. I think that you are, for the most part, correct. I have even tried to "soften my tone" when offering people advice on the forums and avoiding being overly critical. Except in the cases of someone who is promoting an unsafe method to another or telling another that X is the only way to do Y.


However, you have to understand the frustration that comes along with helping people on MFP. A small group of people here try to promote ways of eating that are backed by science and are constantly trying to educate those who are ignorant of nutrition. Because they are going against the "common wisdom" of dieting, they get a lot of unwarranted angst from people who call them rude, haters, and various other nasty names. Also, the same threads are posted over and over again, multiple times per day, with few users actually paying attention to the thread three lines down and instead posting an identical thread above it. And this is despite several excellent stickied threads that would have answered their questions.

It is frustrating, to say the least, to have to keep repeating the same information and refuting the same information over and over again to a user base who, largely, does not appreciate it or pass on what they have learned.

Well....^that was rude.

Bully.

wheird

Honestly, I have tried to refute your argument a few times now but keep stumbling. I think that you are, for the most part, correct. I have even tried to "soften my tone" when offering people advice on the forums and avoiding being overly critical. Except in the cases of someone who is promoting an unsafe method to another or telling another that X is the only way to do Y.


However, you have to understand the frustration that comes along with helping people on MFP. A small group of people here try to promote ways of eating that are backed by science and are constantly trying to educate those who are ignorant of nutrition. Because they are going against the "common wisdom" of dieting, they get a lot of unwarranted angst from people who call them rude, haters, and various other nasty names. Also, the same threads are posted over and over again, multiple times per day, with few users actually paying attention to the thread three lines down and instead posting an identical thread above it. And this is despite several excellent stickied threads that would have answered their questions.

It is frustrating, to say the least, to have to keep repeating the same information and refuting the same information over and over again to a user base who, largely, does not appreciate it or pass on what they have learned.

Well....^that was rude.

Bully.

And if someone actually says that in earnest, I wouldn't be even the least bit shocked.

thickerella

Have you had much success with this method of bending people to your will?

None at all. I knew it was pointless when I started, that's why I labeled it pointless.

However, if I suddenly started to grow some charisma and ability to influence people, I'd probably just use it for evil. Like convincing Spain that they should send me a pound of Manchego every month for free.

You hear me Spain!? I DEMAND CHEESE!

usmcmp

Honestly, I have tried to refute your argument a few times now but keep stumbling. I think that you are, for the most part, correct. I have even tried to "soften my tone" when offering people advice on the forums and avoiding being overly critical. Except in the cases of someone who is promoting an unsafe method to another or telling another that X is the only way to do Y.


However, you have to understand the frustration that comes along with helping people on MFP. A small group of people here try to promote ways of eating that are backed by science and are constantly trying to educate those who are ignorant of nutrition. Because they are going against the "common wisdom" of dieting, they get a lot of unwarranted angst from people who call them rude, haters, and various other nasty names. Also, the same threads are posted over and over again, multiple times per day, with few users actually paying attention to the thread three lines down and instead posting an identical thread above it. And this is despite several excellent stickied threads that would have answered their questions.

It is frustrating, to say the least, to have to keep repeating the same information and refuting the same information over and over again to a user base who, largely, does not appreciate it or pass on what they have learned.

Well....^that was rude.

Bully.

You need to be more supportive of my journey.

mmipanda

This is the internet
If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen
People are *kitten*, get over it

This, my friends, is a cop out. It is a way to justify letting out anger, disgust, frustration, and loathing on someone who has not done anything to truly deserve it, and to do so without consequence.

:drinker: well said

Mokey41

Most of an OP states some ridiculous fad diet they are going to do hoping that others will be doing the same ridiculous fad diet and bolster them up with how great it is. They get told that the ridiculous fad diet is a ridiculous fad diet and they get all bent out of shape because this site is for support and we're being mean. It usually breaks down from there. It isn't very often that the "meanies" come out until the OP starts trying to defend the ridiculous fad diet.

As for what brought you to this revelation in the first place, I to some extent agree with the other group you were in. Until you've spent 7 hours on an airplane with a huge man beside you that overflows into your seat you really can't appreciate that someone of that size should have been made to pay for the 1.5 seats he was taking up. I can add that he also smelled bad. The fact that you've allowed yourself to get too big to fit into average sized transportation doesn't mean the rest of the world has to make allowances for you. I'll admit I'm one of those meanies.

LiftAllThePizzas

Good lord, people. There's a TL;DR at the bottom.

Why do people put the TLDR at the bottom? It should be at the top.

thickerella

This is my feeling on the subject. I don't post a lot, but I've been here more than 2 years and I've seen this scenario play out more times than I can count. A big thing that really annoys me is that people will post a topic with a half a$$ed, dangerous, scientifically debunked plan of losing 20lbs in 3 weeks or something and then say something like "supportive answers only! No negativity!" Or "I know it's not a good idea to eat 1000 calories of celery sticks and do 5 hours on the treadmill daily, but maybe it'll work for ME! What do you guys think?"

Support =/= hand holding, coddling, or enabling.
Support =/= a yes man who tell you what you want to hear regardless of whether it's true or not.

I never said that people who are doing unhealthy things should NOT be offered guidance, or that it is a bad thing to suggest another way.

Quite the opposite, you SHOULD tell people when they are choosing the bad path. Pulling someone out of the path of a speeding car (even if they, themselves, are the driver) is the MOST caring thing you can do for someone.

I just believe it is possible to do that without being intentionally cruel....and maybe they won't get out of the way of that speeding car, but while you may think they're stupid for standing in front of it, just keep in mind that it took a whole lot of pain to put them there in the first place. Adding to that isn't going to help.

magerum

Good lord, people. There's a TL;DR at the bottom.

Why do people put the TLDR at the bottom? It should be at the top.

Athijade

As for what brought you to this revelation in the first place, I to some extent agree with the other group you were in. Until you've spent 7 hours on an airplane with a huge man beside you that overflows into your seat you really can't appreciate that someone of that size should have been made to pay for the 1.5 seats he was taking up. I can add that he also smelled bad. The fact that you've allowed yourself to get too big to fit into average sized transportation doesn't mean the rest of the world has to make allowances for you. I'll admit I'm one of those meanies.

I agree 100%... and it wasn't that long ago that I was close to needing to pay for 2 seats on an airplane. If a person is so large that they can not fit into a single "spot", then they should pay for the extra room. It isn't fair to the person next to them who is losing space that THEY paid for.

wheird

This is my feeling on the subject. I don't post a lot, but I've been here more than 2 years and I've seen this scenario play out more times than I can count. A big thing that really annoys me is that people will post a topic with a half a$$ed, dangerous, scientifically debunked plan of losing 20lbs in 3 weeks or something and then say something like "supportive answers only! No negativity!" Or "I know it's not a good idea to eat 1000 calories of celery sticks and do 5 hours on the treadmill daily, but maybe it'll work for ME! What do you guys think?"

Support =/= hand holding, coddling, or enabling.
Support =/= a yes man who tell you what you want to hear regardless of whether it's true or not.

I never said that people who are doing unhealthy things should NOT be offered guidance, or that it is a bad thing to suggest another way.

Quite the opposite, you SHOULD tell people when they are choosing the bad path. Pulling someone out of the path of a speeding car (even if they, themselves, are the driver) is the MOST caring thing you can do for someone.

I just believe it is possible to do that without being intentionally cruel....and maybe they won't get out of the way of that speeding car, but while you may think they're stupid for standing in front of it, just keep in mind that it took a whole lot of pain to put them there in the first place. Adding to that isn't going to help.

A lot of the time the advice given is NOT intentionally cruel, it is just stated in a blunt, matter-of-fact manner that some people interpret as rude or demeaning.

magerum

This is my feeling on the subject. I don't post a lot, but I've been here more than 2 years and I've seen this scenario play out more times than I can count. A big thing that really annoys me is that people will post a topic with a half a$$ed, dangerous, scientifically debunked plan of losing 20lbs in 3 weeks or something and then say something like "supportive answers only! No negativity!" Or "I know it's not a good idea to eat 1000 calories of celery sticks and do 5 hours on the treadmill daily, but maybe it'll work for ME! What do you guys think?"

Support =/= hand holding, coddling, or enabling.
Support =/= a yes man who tell you what you want to hear regardless of whether it's true or not.

I never said that people who are doing unhealthy things should NOT be offered guidance, or that it is a bad thing to suggest another way.

Quite the opposite, you SHOULD tell people when they are choosing the bad path. Pulling someone out of the path of a speeding car (even if they, themselves, are the driver) is the MOST caring thing you can do for someone.

I just believe it is possible to do that without being intentionally cruel....and maybe they won't get out of the way of that speeding car, but while you may think they're stupid for standing in front of it, just keep in mind that it took a whole lot of pain to put them there in the first place. Adding to that isn't going to help.

A lot of the time the advice given is NOT intentionally cruel, it is just stated in a blunt, matter-of-fact manner that some people interpret as rude or demeaning.

Agreed. The level of over sensitivity is shocking. As shown time and again by the, "don't disagree with me or it's rude", "don't say anything I don't want to hear or it's bullying", & the participation trophies for everyone crowd. I fear for society in general. We're almost to the point that a herd of my little ponies can run over us.

thickerella

As for what brought you to this revelation in the first place, I to some extent agree with the other group you were in. Until you've spent 7 hours on an airplane with a huge man beside you that overflows into your seat you really can't appreciate that someone of that size should have been made to pay for the 1.5 seats he was taking up. I can add that he also smelled bad. The fact that you've allowed yourself to get too big to fit into average sized transportation doesn't mean the rest of the world has to make allowances for you. I'll admit I'm one of those meanies.

I was not even bothered by the opinion that obese people should pay more for transportation. It is the persistent and often repeated belief that every fat person is a lazy, useless frack who can't be bothered to do anything for themselves other than shoving endless amounts of food in their fat mouths that gets to me. There is a fat-hate post on that site almost daily.

Do you know how many fat people I know who genuinely DON'T care? Let's just say very few. Most are trying, and failing, and trying, and failing, and sometimes succeeding and then failing again and needing to start over. Lord knows that's been me several times.

People don't do the Master Cleanse because they think it sounds like fun. They do it because they are DESPERATE for something that will help them change. You know it won't work. *I* know it won't work...but they cling to that hope because they need to believe that SOMETHING will work for them and they don't believe in themselves enough to take the steps to make a more lasting change.

thickerella

A lot of the time the advice given is NOT intentionally cruel, it is just stated in a blunt, matter-of-fact manner that some people interpret as rude or demeaning.

And you know what? That's fine. However, I see words like stupid, idiotic, useless, etc thrown around here on a daily basis. Being blunt is not a bad thing. There is a difference between being blunt and being a jerk.

wheird

As for what brought you to this revelation in the first place, I to some extent agree with the other group you were in. Until you've spent 7 hours on an airplane with a huge man beside you that overflows into your seat you really can't appreciate that someone of that size should have been made to pay for the 1.5 seats he was taking up. I can add that he also smelled bad. The fact that you've allowed yourself to get too big to fit into average sized transportation doesn't mean the rest of the world has to make allowances for you. I'll admit I'm one of those meanies.

I was not even bothered by the opinion that obese people should pay more for transportation. It is the persistent and often repeated belief that every fat person is a lazy, useless frack who can't be bothered to do anything for themselves other than shoving endless amounts of food in their fat mouths that gets to me. There is a fat-hate post on that site almost daily.

Do you know how many fat people I know who genuinely DON'T care? Let's just say very few. Most are trying, and failing, and trying, and failing, and sometimes succeeding and then failing again and needing to start over. Lord knows that's been me several times.

People don't do the Master Cleanse because they think it sounds like fun. They do it because they are DESPERATE for something that will help them change. You know it won't work. *I* know it won't work...but they cling to that hope because they need to believe that SOMETHING will work for them and they don't believe in themselves enough to take the steps to make a more lasting change.

Very few of them have tried the calorie counting method because they feel it is too restrictive or they set their target far too low, in an attempt to lose as much weight as fast as possible, and end up in a binge cycle. They aren't doing the Master Cleanse because they feel nothing else will, they are doing it so they don't need to put in the diligence.

wheird

A lot of the time the advice given is NOT intentionally cruel, it is just stated in a blunt, matter-of-fact manner that some people interpret as rude or demeaning.

And you know what? That's fine. However, I see words like stupid, idiotic, useless, etc thrown around here on a daily basis. Being blunt is not a bad thing. There is a difference between being blunt and being a jerk.

Typically when I see or use one of those words, it is in response to something so obscenely ridiculous that there are few other words to describe it.

thickerella

Why do people put the TLDR at the bottom? It should be at the top.

Good point. I will do that next time.