Is chivalry really dead? :(
Replies
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A lot of men don't want to work these days. They want to stay home and play video games or World of Warcraft while drinking their beer and popping their pills or smoking their pot while the women they mistreat and never appreciate work 2 or more jobs just trying to keep the bills paid and a roof over your head. By all means it is socially accepted to be a sorry piece of crap these days go right ahead and join in. Women went from raising kids and taking care of the home to raising kids the best she can while holding down a couple of full time job, keep the house clean and make sure the hubby has plenty of beer and smokes so he wont have to leave the computer screen except to relieve him self or smack the "old lady" around a little. What ever makes everyone happy. :drinker:
Well it is nice to see women are still allowed to be horribly sexist, while I men so much as defend the notion of woman's equality we are yelled at. Way to take woman's suffrage back a few decades! I also love the way you added every negative stereotype you could think of for a stay home male figure, wonder what would be said if we did the same about the female gold digger stay home leech?
oh good gravy! could we dredge up any worse images of one another??
People are bringin' in a heapin' helpin' of strange in these parts! :noway:0 -
I suppose this is NOT the time to mention that the chivalry that is being talked about here is the romanticized version which came pretty much after all the wars were over and were mostly fictionalized from stories about King Arthur and the like. Actual chivalry was a pure warriors code telling Knights how they should behave, honor, and how to handle challenges. It was not till LATE middle ages that the "courty love" phase started to occur. So that said, this entire thread exists to continue to hold up a fictitious moral code that never really existed... much like Disney Princesses.
Semantics. Language is fluid and follows its speakers, and definitions change. An Epicure used to refer to someone who followed the philosophy of Epicurus, but over time it's evolved to mean someone with discriminating tastes. What I hear in your post is that you are essentially in here arguing that wine tasters aren't Epicures because they don't adhere to the philosophic principles of Epicurus.
In much the same way, Chivalry used to be a "Knights Code". More recently, the word means courteous behavior, especially (but not limited to) a mans behavior towards a woman. And courteous means more than "please" and "thank you" - its defined as a polished manner and gallantry.
No, no I really man not. This is basically the difference from Nosferatu vampires vs Twilight. The difference between the Disney classic and the version where the queen is put in red hot shoes and made to dance until she died. In the REAL world the code had NOTHING to do with anything with women or their treatment. It was protect anyone weaker than you in the Mid Middle Ages, which was a nice women/children/elderly, those too weak to protect themselves. It had nothing to do with respect or any other over glamorized princess model. The bulk of it was how to fight with honor, die with honor, retain your and your fellow nights honor, honor God, honor your king. Rules of accepting duels and other things like that were in there.
This, much later, became romanticized and the whole chivalry bit was changed into treating the ladies like Disney Princesses and a huge love story written around that. You can pretty much think of that as lady smut of their time, and this is oddly how we think things were. Ohh books, if only people read you.0 -
Can I ask the point of the whole "rising" when a woman enters thing? I'm just trying to understands its origins and possible symbolisms.
It used to be far more important as it symbolized a readiness to help, offer your seat should she need it, to act as an escort should she need it or just to draw some attention away from her and not feel like she's the only one standing up. Now, while still possible depending on where you are, it's far less likely that a woman would need an escort but the others are just as applicable.0 -
I am sooo gonna get some back lash on this but I don't really care. It is my opinion. Not saying it is fact or should be everyone's opinion but it is what i believe to be true as a Christian woman. I believe a woman's place is in the home. I believe she should be taking care of the home and raising the children while the man works. I believe that things spiraled downward and children got out of hand when the mother's left to home to work. I don't believe a woman is equal to a man. I don't believe a woman can do anything a man can do nor do I believe they should be in a man's position. There were far less problems with society when women knew their place and did their job. Sorry if this offends any of these women on a power trip out there. I don't mean be let your man mistreat you but don't complain about Chivalry being dead when when it was the women that wanted to be treated equal to men. You all just ruined it for the ones that know our place as women.
dafuq?
This is horribly offensive. I'm a man, I don't want to work.
A lot of men don't want to work these days. They want to stay home and play video games or World of Warcraft while drinking their beer and popping their pills or smoking their pot while the women they mistreat and never appreciate work 2 or more jobs just trying to keep the bills paid and a roof over your head. By all means it is socially accepted to be a sorry piece of crap these days go right ahead and join in. Women went from raising kids and taking care of the home to raising kids the best she can while holding down a couple of full time job, keep the house clean and make sure the hubby has plenty of beer and smokes so he wont have to leave the computer screen except to relieve him self or smack the "old lady" around a little. What ever makes everyone happy. :drinker:
I am sorry if that is the example you had growing up, but allow me to share mine.
My mother is a Christian woman. She left her "place" in the home and went to work full-time because my father was a poor cattle rancher and did not generate enough income to comfortably raise a family. (For the record, my dad does smoke, but he buys his own cigarettes. Video games aren't really his thing, nor is domestic violence.)
Despite my mom being all un-Christian-like and un-ladylike and daring to have a job outside the home, she also provided her husband and children with 3 meals a day, clean clothing, and a clean home to live in. She somehow managed to attend every game, every play, every recital, everything her kids ever participated in, and together, she and my dad raised three healthy, happy, respectable children who all graduated from high school and college and are now productive, law-abiding citizens who don't smoke, don't drink excessively, have never done drugs or been arrested for anything. How did that happen?
P.S. After all these years of hard work and sacrifice so her kids could have more, my mom now owns her own business. How do you think God is going to feel about that?0 -
I am sooo gonna get some back lash on this but I don't really care. It is my opinion. Not saying it is fact or should be everyone's opinion but it is what i believe to be true as a Christian woman. I believe a woman's place is in the home. I believe she should be taking care of the home and raising the children while the man works. I believe that things spiraled downward and children got out of hand when the mother's left to home to work. I don't believe a woman is equal to a man. I don't believe a woman can do anything a man can do nor do I believe they should be in a man's position. There were far less problems with society when women knew their place and did their job. Sorry if this offends any of these women on a power trip out there. I don't mean be let your man mistreat you but don't complain about Chivalry being dead when when it was the women that wanted to be treated equal to men. You all just ruined it for the ones that know our place as women.
I agree. I like women to remain in the kitchen so I can be upstairs shagging their husbands.0 -
I am sooo gonna get some back lash on this but I don't really care. It is my opinion. Not saying it is fact or should be everyone's opinion but it is what i believe to be true as a Christian woman. I believe a woman's place is in the home. I believe she should be taking care of the home and raising the children while the man works. I believe that things spiraled downward and children got out of hand when the mother's left to home to work. I don't believe a woman is equal to a man. I don't believe a woman can do anything a man can do nor do I believe they should be in a man's position. There were far less problems with society when women knew their place and did their job. Sorry if this offends any of these women on a power trip out there. I don't mean be let your man mistreat you but don't complain about Chivalry being dead when when it was the women that wanted to be treated equal to men. You all just ruined it for the ones that know our place as women.
Oh, you must go to one of THOSE churches.0 -
I am sooo gonna get some back lash on this but I don't really care. It is my opinion. Not saying it is fact or should be everyone's opinion but it is what i believe to be true as a Christian woman. I believe a woman's place is in the home. I believe she should be taking care of the home and raising the children while the man works. I believe that things spiraled downward and children got out of hand when the mother's left to home to work. I don't believe a woman is equal to a man. I don't believe a woman can do anything a man can do nor do I believe they should be in a man's position. There were far less problems with society when women knew their place and did their job. Sorry if this offends any of these women on a power trip out there. I don't mean be let your man mistreat you but don't complain about Chivalry being dead when when it was the women that wanted to be treated equal to men. You all just ruined it for the ones that know our place as women.
As you're divorced (a direct violation of God's word) and are planning on bringing foreign substances into your body (joint replacements), all I can say is: It's too late for you. While you might think your post preaching God's word of "women are inferior to men" will save you, the brimstone already has your name on it.
I'll pray for you.0 -
I am sooo gonna get some back lash on this but I don't really care. It is my opinion. Not saying it is fact or should be everyone's opinion but it is what i believe to be true as a Christian woman. I believe a woman's place is in the home. I believe she should be taking care of the home and raising the children while the man works. I believe that things spiraled downward and children got out of hand when the mother's left to home to work. I don't believe a woman is equal to a man. I don't believe a woman can do anything a man can do nor do I believe they should be in a man's position. There were far less problems with society when women knew their place and did their job. Sorry if this offends any of these women on a power trip out there. I don't mean be let your man mistreat you but don't complain about Chivalry being dead when when it was the women that wanted to be treated equal to men. You all just ruined it for the ones that know our place as women.
dafuq?
This is horribly offensive. I'm a man, I don't want to work.
A lot of men don't want to work these days. They want to stay home and play video games or World of Warcraft while drinking their beer and popping their pills or smoking their pot while the women they mistreat and never appreciate work 2 or more jobs just trying to keep the bills paid and a roof over your head. By all means it is socially accepted to be a sorry piece of crap these days go right ahead and join in. Women went from raising kids and taking care of the home to raising kids the best she can while holding down a couple of full time job, keep the house clean and make sure the hubby has plenty of beer and smokes so he wont have to leave the computer screen except to relieve him self or smack the "old lady" around a little. What ever makes everyone happy. :drinker:
I am sorry if that is the example you had growing up, but allow me to share mine.
My mother is a Christian woman. She left her "place" in the home and went to work full-time because my father was a poor cattle rancher and did not generate enough income to comfortably raise a family. (For the record, my dad does smoke, but he buys his own cigarettes. Video games aren't really his thing, nor is domestic violence.)
Despite my mom being all un-Christian-like and un-ladylike and daring to have a job outside the home, she also provided her husband and children with 3 meals a day, clean clothing, and a clean home to live in. She somehow managed to attend every game, every play, every recital, everything her kids ever participated in, and together, she and my dad raised three healthy, happy, respectable children who all graduated from high school and college and are now productive, law-abiding citizens who don't smoke, don't drink excessively, have never done drugs or been arrested for anything. How did that happen?
P.S. After all these years of hard work and sacrifice so her kids could have more, my mom now owns her own business. How do you think God is going to feel about that?
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Haha , I dont think so. My other half of 9 years still opens doors for me, pulls out my chair, waits for me to sit before he'll touch a bite of food, lifts something heavy.
He was taught by his dad to treat women just like he would treat his mother, because one day they may become the mother of his child, and his child will see this.
Its a two way street though. Women can be chivalrous (sp?) too. It cant just be all you do this for me and I do nothing!
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I am sooo gonna get some back lash on this but I don't really care. It is my opinion. Not saying it is fact or should be everyone's opinion but it is what i believe to be true as a Christian woman. I believe a woman's place is in the home. I believe she should be taking care of the home and raising the children while the man works. I believe that things spiraled downward and children got out of hand when the mother's left to home to work. I don't believe a woman is equal to a man. I don't believe a woman can do anything a man can do nor do I believe they should be in a man's position. There were far less problems with society when women knew their place and did their job. Sorry if this offends any of these women on a power trip out there. I don't mean be let your man mistreat you but don't complain about Chivalry being dead when when it was the women that wanted to be treated equal to men. You all just ruined it for the ones that know our place as women.
dafuq?
This is horribly offensive. I'm a man, I don't want to work.
A lot of men don't want to work these days. They want to stay home and play video games or World of Warcraft while drinking their beer and popping their pills or smoking their pot while the women they mistreat and never appreciate work 2 or more jobs just trying to keep the bills paid and a roof over your head. By all means it is socially accepted to be a sorry piece of crap these days go right ahead and join in. Women went from raising kids and taking care of the home to raising kids the best she can while holding down a couple of full time job, keep the house clean and make sure the hubby has plenty of beer and smokes so he wont have to leave the computer screen except to relieve him self or smack the "old lady" around a little. What ever makes everyone happy. :drinker:
this is embarassing for you...but i doubt you even realize it
It is my story, It was my life for so long. I got out of it and now I am a happily divorced single mom of 2. I'm not being sexist or stereotypical. Just my experience. I was a good wife. I was just still trying to live with the same values I was raised with. I'm just saying I feel that women believing they should be equal has in turn lessened the respect men have for their women now. We chose it so we have no one to blame but ourselves. I don't have to argue this point. Look back through history and see how things were then see what has changed to make things the way they are now. It doesn't take a very smart person to see what 's different.0 -
I suppose this is NOT the time to mention that the chivalry that is being talked about here is the romanticized version which came pretty much after all the wars were over and were mostly fictionalized from stories about King Arthur and the like. Actual chivalry was a pure warriors code telling Knights how they should behave, honor, and how to handle challenges. It was not till LATE middle ages that the "courty love" phase started to occur. So that said, this entire thread exists to continue to hold up a fictitious moral code that never really existed... much like Disney Princesses.
Semantics. Language is fluid and follows its speakers, and definitions change. An Epicure used to refer to someone who followed the philosophy of Epicurus, but over time it's evolved to mean someone with discriminating tastes. What I hear in your post is that you are essentially in here arguing that wine tasters aren't Epicures because they don't adhere to the philosophic principles of Epicurus.
In much the same way, Chivalry used to be a "Knights Code". More recently, the word means courteous behavior, especially (but not limited to) a mans behavior towards a woman. And courteous means more than "please" and "thank you" - its defined as a polished manner and gallantry.
No, no I really man not. This is basically the difference from Nosferatu vampires vs Twilight. The difference between the Disney classic and the version where the queen is put in red hot shoes and made to dance until she died. In the REAL world the code had NOTHING to do with anything with women or their treatment. It was protect anyone weaker than you in the Mid Middle Ages, which was a nice women/children/elderly, those too weak to protect themselves. It had nothing to do with respect or any other over glamorized princess model. The bulk of it was how to fight with honor, die with honor, retain your and your fellow nights honor, honor God, honor your king. Rules of accepting duels and other things like that were in there.
This, much later, became romanticized and the whole chivalry bit was changed into treating the ladies like Disney Princesses and a huge love story written around that. You can pretty much think of that as lady smut of their time, and this is oddly how we think things were. Ohh books, if only people read you.
"Treating ladies like Disney Princesses"?
Dude, you're doing it wrong.
Or you're jealous.0 -
It is my story, It was my life for so long. I got out of it and now I am a happily divorced single mom of 2. I'm not being sexist or stereotypical. Just my experience. I was a good wife. I was just still trying to live with the same values I was raised with. I'm just saying I feel that women believing they should be equal has in turn lessened the respect men have for their women now. We chose it so we have no one to blame but ourselves. I don't have to argue this point. Look back through history and see how things were then see what has changed to make things the way they are now. It doesn't take a very smart person to see what 's different.
Oh I get it. It's because the alternative is that it was just you.0 -
I open my car door for almost any woman that’s riding with me and I actually help with their seatbelt before I shut the door. If the seatbelt is connected and they are still talking I like to shut the door on them, It has led to many funny conversations
If someone likes having the doors to a buildings opened for them like I will do then don’t walk so fast to the door because I’m not running to the door. 0 -
Not in my house it isn't.0
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I am sooo gonna get some back lash on this but I don't really care. It is my opinion. Not saying it is fact or should be everyone's opinion but it is what i believe to be true as a Christian woman. I believe a woman's place is in the home. I believe she should be taking care of the home and raising the children while the man works. I believe that things spiraled downward and children got out of hand when the mother's left to home to work. I don't believe a woman is equal to a man. I don't believe a woman can do anything a man can do nor do I believe they should be in a man's position. There were far less problems with society when women knew their place and did their job. Sorry if this offends any of these women on a power trip out there. I don't mean be let your man mistreat you but don't complain about Chivalry being dead when when it was the women that wanted to be treated equal to men. You all just ruined it for the ones that know our place as women.
dafuq?
This is horribly offensive. I'm a man, I don't want to work.
A lot of men don't want to work these days. They want to stay home and play video games or World of Warcraft while drinking their beer and popping their pills or smoking their pot while the women they mistreat and never appreciate work 2 or more jobs just trying to keep the bills paid and a roof over your head. By all means it is socially accepted to be a sorry piece of crap these days go right ahead and join in. Women went from raising kids and taking care of the home to raising kids the best she can while holding down a couple of full time job, keep the house clean and make sure the hubby has plenty of beer and smokes so he wont have to leave the computer screen except to relieve him self or smack the "old lady" around a little. What ever makes everyone happy. :drinker:
this is embarassing for you...but i doubt you even realize it
It is my story, It was my life for so long. I got out of it and now I am a happily divorced single mom of 2. I'm not being sexist or stereotypical. Just my experience. I was a good wife. I was just still trying to live with the same values I was raised with. I'm just saying I feel that women believing they should be equal has in turn lessened the respect men have for their women now. We chose it so we have no one to blame but ourselves. I don't have to argue this point. Look back through history and see how things were then see what has changed to make things the way they are now. It doesn't take a very smart person to see what 's different.
You clearly weren't a good wife. If you were, the sin that is divorce wouldn't have befallen you. Women's place is as a subservient, helpful spouse. You failed.0 -
Can I ask the point of the whole "rising" when a woman enters thing? I'm just trying to understands its origins and possible symbolisms.
It used to be far more important as it symbolized a readiness to help, offer your seat should she need it, to act as an escort should she need it or just to draw some attention away from her and not feel like she's the only one standing up. Now, while still possible depending on where you are, it's far less likely that a woman would need an escort but the others are just as applicable.
I guess there's my problem. I don't do well with symbolisms in general. I also have issues understanding when people use sarcasm or speak in metaphors. I tend to only get literal and logical. I do not appreciate or understand gestures that may mean something, nor do I give them when they do not have a practical application. I open the door for somebody because it has practical value. Rising, I don't see a practical value to it. Giving your seat up to somebody, I see a practical value in some applications, but in others, not. Even as a kid I only ever saw the practical value of things. I don't keep pictures of anything, I don't own anything decorative, and nothing I own holds sentimental value to me. It's all about practical application. That's why I don't see the point of all these symbolisms and why the holes in it are so glaringly visible to me.0 -
Inquality:
It's Chivalry when women like it, and Sexism when they don't.
Chivalry is an inherently sexist idea that implies women are worth more than men simply for being women. It's a sexist idea that implies men should help women based on the fact that they are women.
Chivalry should be dead.0 -
It annoys me that there is no key hol eon the passanger side of my car and i don't have remote keyless entry. So i cant open my girlfriends door when i drive unless i go to the driver side unlock it, reach in and then push the all doors unlock button and then go back to the passanger side and open her door.0
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I am sooo gonna get some back lash on this but I don't really care. It is my opinion. Not saying it is fact or should be everyone's opinion but it is what i believe to be true as a Christian woman. I believe a woman's place is in the home. I believe she should be taking care of the home and raising the children while the man works. I believe that things spiraled downward and children got out of hand when the mother's left to home to work. I don't believe a woman is equal to a man. I don't believe a woman can do anything a man can do nor do I believe they should be in a man's position. There were far less problems with society when women knew their place and did their job. Sorry if this offends any of these women on a power trip out there. I don't mean be let your man mistreat you but don't complain about Chivalry being dead when when it was the women that wanted to be treated equal to men. You all just ruined it for the ones that know our place as women.
dafuq?
This is horribly offensive. I'm a man, I don't want to work.
A lot of men don't want to work these days. They want to stay home and play video games or World of Warcraft while drinking their beer and popping their pills or smoking their pot while the women they mistreat and never appreciate work 2 or more jobs just trying to keep the bills paid and a roof over your head. By all means it is socially accepted to be a sorry piece of crap these days go right ahead and join in. Women went from raising kids and taking care of the home to raising kids the best she can while holding down a couple of full time job, keep the house clean and make sure the hubby has plenty of beer and smokes so he wont have to leave the computer screen except to relieve him self or smack the "old lady" around a little. What ever makes everyone happy. :drinker:
I am sorry if that is the example you had growing up, but allow me to share mine.
My mother is a Christian woman. She left her "place" in the home and went to work full-time because my father was a poor cattle rancher and did not generate enough income to comfortably raise a family. (For the record, my dad does smoke, but he buys his own cigarettes. Video games aren't really his thing, nor is domestic violence.)
Despite my mom being all un-Christian-like and un-ladylike and daring to have a job outside the home, she also provided her husband and children with 3 meals a day, clean clothing, and a clean home to live in. She somehow managed to attend every game, every play, every recital, everything her kids ever participated in, and together, she and my dad raised three healthy, happy, respectable children who all graduated from high school and college and are now productive, law-abiding citizens who don't smoke, don't drink excessively, have never done drugs or been arrested for anything. How did that happen?
P.S. After all these years of hard work and sacrifice so her kids could have more, my mom now owns her own business. How do you think God is going to feel about that?
This has nothing to do with the examples I had growing up. I had two of the most wonderful parents in the world. My dad was the definition of Chivalry and they both made sure I had everything I needed and most of all had all the love that I needed. I had a wonderful childhood. I was not spoiled with material things but actual love. I know how a marriage should be. I know how a man should treat his wife and how a wife should treat her husband because I saw it everyday with my parents. Sure they had their little fusses from time to time but nothing ever major, not in front of the kids at least. I wish everyone in this world could have had the child hood and the parents I had. I couldn't have wished for a better dad or mom. My dad passed in April and its like a piece of us died with him. My mom lost her best friend as did I. I wish I could find half the happiness that my mom and dad had together. They were as close to an epic love story as reality can get. I just didn't chose my husband so wisely.0 -
I like videogames, beer, and sandwiches.
Any takers?0 -
I guess there's my problem. I don't do well with symbolisms in general. I also have issues understanding when people use sarcasm or speak in metaphors. I tend to only get literal and logical. I do not appreciate or understand gestures that may mean something, nor do I give them when they do not have a practical application. I open the door for somebody because it has practical value. Rising, I don't see a practical value to it. Giving your seat up to somebody, I see a practical value in some applications, but in others, not. Even as a kid I only ever saw the practical value of things. I don't keep pictures of anything, I don't own anything decorative, and nothing I own holds sentimental value to me. It's all about practical application. That's why I don't see the point of all these symbolisms and why the holes in it are so glaringly visible to me.
That's unfortunate, some of the highest praise can come in the form of a small symbolic gesture given quietly.0 -
hai0
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maybe0
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do I?0
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I like videogames, beer, and sandwiches.
Any takers?
SLORE0 -
Did this thread really roll? Oh mfp.0
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I guess there's my problem. I don't do well with symbolisms in general. I also have issues understanding when people use sarcasm or speak in metaphors. I tend to only get literal and logical. I do not appreciate or understand gestures that may mean something, nor do I give them when they do not have a practical application. I open the door for somebody because it has practical value. Rising, I don't see a practical value to it. Giving your seat up to somebody, I see a practical value in some applications, but in others, not. Even as a kid I only ever saw the practical value of things. I don't keep pictures of anything, I don't own anything decorative, and nothing I own holds sentimental value to me. It's all about practical application. That's why I don't see the point of all these symbolisms and why the holes in it are so glaringly visible to me.
That's unfortunate, some of the highest praise can come in the form of a small symbolic gesture given quietly.
I wouldn't say unfortunate. Just different. Different perspective. Comes with benefits too.0 -
I have 98 games on my Steam account. Sup ladies?0
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I have 98 games on my Steam account. Sup ladies?
That's it?0 -
I have 98 games on my Steam account. Sup ladies?
That's it?
You have that beat?0
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