It's NOT always as simple as a deficit
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This thread is still going? Ugh.
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: I was honestly just thinking the same thing. That is why I came in here.
this thing needs to stop or be derailed, or both...
LMAO! Honestly, the best solution to a thread that argues sematics and derails from the original point is CAT GIFs.0 -
+1I don' t think your average obese person is fretting about what the scale says; they are worried about their health, fitting into clothes, having mobility to lead a happy life, not being looked at or treated differently because of their physical size.
And all of these they can achieve. Through a calorie deficit.
/thread
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This thread is still going? Ugh.
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: I was honestly just thinking the same thing. That is why I came in here.
this thing needs to stop or be derailed, or both...
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
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paganstar - since you appear to have so much knowledge on this subject, I have a simple question for you. what would you recommend to a beginner the best way to lose weight?
Wait up, I have never said I have a lot of knowledge on the subject. I pointed out that a calorie is not a calorie in terms of weight loss and I stand by that.
TL;DR warning.
I have seen a lot of comments on this thread suggesting that the people who have lost the least weight surely know nothing about this topic which is untrue. Too many smug, judgemental people, IMO.
I have also seen other comments suggesting that snowflakes are looking for excuses for their failure. Well let me tell you my story (note I have changed my profile pic because I need to protect my privacy due to my profession).
The reason why I know it's not just about the calories is because back in 1999-2000, during and after the birth of my second child, I inexplicably lost all the extra weight I had carried during the previous 5-plus years, which was approx 50lbs. I didn't do anything different to previous, did not exercise or eat a different diet - it just fell off me. I didn't have a medical condition, which was one of the first concerns I had. My weight stayed stable for over a year, maybe 18 months and then unfortunately slowly went back on.
Then in 2008-2009 I started to suspect I might have PCOS due to my weight and a few other related conditions. I had blood tests, but nothing abnormal was detected. With a bit of research I decided to work at reducing my weight that would also apparently help with the other symptoms. I tracked carefully using another website - FatSecret and successfully lost the 50lbs of extra weight again. Yes it was hard work, but I did it. Unfortunately although my weight stayed quite stable again for over a year, slowly it all piled back on, until we get to 2011 when I had a health scare from the ticking time bomb of alcoholism.
For 20 years I had been a high functioning alcoholic - I didn't get as bad as some people end up, but I drank heavily every night, would drink secretly sometimes, not letting others including my husband know how much I craved alcohol. I justified my drinking as a reward for a good day, a bad day, stress, celebration, any excuse. I was always promising myself and my husband that I would moderate, save it for weekends, one day I might even give it up, but I really knew that this would never work.
One day I needed a blood test for something random and the doctor noticed low calcium levels. He asked me a few questions, such as how much alcohol I drank. I tried to be truthful, but I played it down out of shame. A follow up blood test confirmed I had elevated liver enzymes - I was wrecking my liver! Did I give up drinking then? No.
But this health issue obviously played on my mind over the following months, I tried to moderate again and failed, I realised I should give up totally but thought it was impossible. In my head I set an imaginary abstinence goal, "one day" and continued to drink in excess because after all I would soon be giving it up!
I started to research though, knowledge is power, I read loads and realised I was poisoning my body. Hell, if I gave up the drink I might even lose weight, that would be a great bonus!
And then I just stopped. It was wretched to begin with, real willpower beyond anything I had ever done. It only marginally seemed to get easier after 6 months, but the cravings were still there, just less intense and unbearably antsy. Even now, nearly 2 years later I still find my brain telling me it would be OK, I must be cured? I know though, I should never drink again - I just need to remember the 20 years of shame and guilt I suffered as an alcoholic to cement this in my brain. I am still shamed to this day that I let myself fall victim to this.
You know what? Despite my willpower and success giving up the drink I stayed fat, I even put on another 10lbs since being teetotal. I researched again and found a link between giving up alcohol and replacing it with sugar. I never had a sweet tooth before, always preferred savoury food, no sugar in coffee, etc. Since giving up alcohol I had started to binge whole bars of chocolate every day in the evening! I found sweet pastries such as pain au raisin or pecan and maple Danish pastry irresistible. Chocolate milk and fruit juices had replaced the wine! So of course I then researched sugar and I now have my diet plan that I can follow. If abstinence worked with alcohol, then drastically reducing added sugar in my diet will also work. I won't miss what I don't have, my taste for wholesome food has increased because it hasn't been deadened with meaningless sugar rewards to get me through each day. Another bonus is I don't have to give up anything else, I can eat bread, butter, full fat cheese, yoghurt and I can successfully diet without feeling hungry.
I see that others have great success here and I applaud you all! However, I don't want to track calories forever, I know that it is possible for the body to self-manage - remember, for some reason my body did it before. I also have no desire to lift weights or exercise, particularly at the moment. However, I know that when I am a healthy weight I naturally am more energised and suddenly find it fun to run around! I doubt I will suddenly find the hours to devote to myself for weight training even though I know the benefits. I'm also not likely to be able to eat a lot of protein being a pescatarian and would find it a very boring diet if I tried. I will be more than happy to just reach a healthy sustainable weight and look good wearing clothes.
So yeah, I get a little pissed off when in previous threads posters try to preach to me about addiction as if I know nothing about it, or slam someone else for trying to find a sustainable method for weight loss, or preach that people need to learn some willpower and just learn to moderate. Or suggest I am a failure because I have only lost 8lb, that I'm just a beginner who knows nothing and an excuse-making snowflake. Basically if you think this, you can kiss my *kitten*!
So to finish I will answer your question. My advice to anyone starting out is to find your own way, everyone is different and don't let anyone tell you that you are a failure or shout your efforts down with 'science'. Yes you will need to eat at calorie deficit, but it might not be straight forward. Dieting takes a long time and it needs to be sustainable for YOU - so find what will make it sustainable and ignore the gob****es who invest so much time and effort trying to get an ice cream to fit their macros so they can shove it in your face! I do however want to thank everyone for these discussions, part of knowing who you want to be is identifying who you don't want to be :laugh:0 -
So anyhow...where were we?
Oh yeah, I remember:
Losing weight for 99.44% of people is and always will be as simple as a caloric deficit over time. There are numerous factors that can affect the calories out side of the equation, and accurately measuring the calories in can be tricky because of measurement error (or entire lack of measurement) and bad labeling, but it is still just a math equation.
So are we all good here now?0 -
Where do you think the rest of the calories 'went'?The reason why I know it's not just about the calories is because back in 1999-2000, during and after the birth of my second child, I inexplicably lost all the extra weight I had carried during the previous 5-plus years, which was approx 50lbs. I didn't do anything different to previous, did not exercise or eat a different diet - it just fell off me. I didn't have a medical condition, which was one of the first concerns I had. My weight stayed stable for over a year, maybe 18 months and then unfortunately slowly went back on.
Did you ever have your BMR tested in both situations?
Did you actually measure your food?
If not, could it be that post-child birth your body changed for whatever reason and was burning more calories?0 -
Where do you think the rest of the calories 'went'?The reason why I know it's not just about the calories is because back in 1999-2000, during and after the birth of my second child, I inexplicably lost all the extra weight I had carried during the previous 5-plus years, which was approx 50lbs. I didn't do anything different to previous, did not exercise or eat a different diet - it just fell off me. I didn't have a medical condition, which was one of the first concerns I had. My weight stayed stable for over a year, maybe 18 months and then unfortunately slowly went back on.
Did you ever have your BMR tested in both situations?
Did you actually measure your food?
If not, could it be that post-child birth your body changed for whatever reason and was burning more calories?
Like I said it was a mystery, I wasn't on a diet so didn't weigh food. When I was pregnant they found ketones in my urine and I was tested for gestational diabetes, but it came back negative. Basically I lost weight without trying. It's like my body reset to 'normal' for a while :huh:0 -
Where do you think the rest of the calories 'went'?The reason why I know it's not just about the calories is because back in 1999-2000, during and after the birth of my second child, I inexplicably lost all the extra weight I had carried during the previous 5-plus years, which was approx 50lbs. I didn't do anything different to previous, did not exercise or eat a different diet - it just fell off me. I didn't have a medical condition, which was one of the first concerns I had. My weight stayed stable for over a year, maybe 18 months and then unfortunately slowly went back on.
Did you ever have your BMR tested in both situations?
Did you actually measure your food?
If not, could it be that post-child birth your body changed for whatever reason and was burning more calories?
Like I said it was a mystery, I wasn't on a diet so didn't weigh food. When I was pregnant they found ketones in my urine and I was tested for gestational diabetes, but it came back negative. Basically I lost weight without trying. It's like my body reset to 'normal' for a while :huh:
Mystery most likely solved.0 -
Where do you think the rest of the calories 'went'?The reason why I know it's not just about the calories is because back in 1999-2000, during and after the birth of my second child, I inexplicably lost all the extra weight I had carried during the previous 5-plus years, which was approx 50lbs. I didn't do anything different to previous, did not exercise or eat a different diet - it just fell off me. I didn't have a medical condition, which was one of the first concerns I had. My weight stayed stable for over a year, maybe 18 months and then unfortunately slowly went back on.
Did you ever have your BMR tested in both situations?
Did you actually measure your food?
If not, could it be that post-child birth your body changed for whatever reason and was burning more calories?
Like I said it was a mystery, I wasn't on a diet so didn't weigh food. When I was pregnant they found ketones in my urine and I was tested for gestational diabetes, but it came back negative. Basically I lost weight without trying. It's like my body reset to 'normal' for a while :huh:
Mystery most likely solved.
No the mystery is not solved, how did I lose weight without trying? Why would not weighing food make me lose weight?0 -
Where do you think the rest of the calories 'went'?The reason why I know it's not just about the calories is because back in 1999-2000, during and after the birth of my second child, I inexplicably lost all the extra weight I had carried during the previous 5-plus years, which was approx 50lbs. I didn't do anything different to previous, did not exercise or eat a different diet - it just fell off me. I didn't have a medical condition, which was one of the first concerns I had. My weight stayed stable for over a year, maybe 18 months and then unfortunately slowly went back on.
Did you ever have your BMR tested in both situations?
Did you actually measure your food?
If not, could it be that post-child birth your body changed for whatever reason and was burning more calories?
Like I said it was a mystery, I wasn't on a diet so didn't weigh food. When I was pregnant they found ketones in my urine and I was tested for gestational diabetes, but it came back negative. Basically I lost weight without trying. It's like my body reset to 'normal' for a while :huh:
Mystery most likely solved.
No the mystery is not solved, how did I lose weight without trying? Why would not weighing food make me lose weight?
Because you weren't weighing/measuring/tracking your food, you have no idea how much you were eating. Obviously, it was less than you needed to maintain weight. It really isn't a mystery - it's really quite simple.0 -
Where do you think the rest of the calories 'went'?The reason why I know it's not just about the calories is because back in 1999-2000, during and after the birth of my second child, I inexplicably lost all the extra weight I had carried during the previous 5-plus years, which was approx 50lbs. I didn't do anything different to previous, did not exercise or eat a different diet - it just fell off me. I didn't have a medical condition, which was one of the first concerns I had. My weight stayed stable for over a year, maybe 18 months and then unfortunately slowly went back on.
Did you ever have your BMR tested in both situations?
Did you actually measure your food?
If not, could it be that post-child birth your body changed for whatever reason and was burning more calories?
Like I said it was a mystery, I wasn't on a diet so didn't weigh food. When I was pregnant they found ketones in my urine and I was tested for gestational diabetes, but it came back negative. Basically I lost weight without trying. It's like my body reset to 'normal' for a while :huh:
Mystery most likely solved.
No the mystery is not solved, how did I lose weight without trying? Why would not weighing food make me lose weight?
you ate less than you needed to....
I eat less than I need to lots of times- i get busy so I forget to eat. It's not that hard to lose weight or gain weight without trying- it's easy- eat more or less than you need.
It's not really a mystery.0 -
Where do you think the rest of the calories 'went'?The reason why I know it's not just about the calories is because back in 1999-2000, during and after the birth of my second child, I inexplicably lost all the extra weight I had carried during the previous 5-plus years, which was approx 50lbs. I didn't do anything different to previous, did not exercise or eat a different diet - it just fell off me. I didn't have a medical condition, which was one of the first concerns I had. My weight stayed stable for over a year, maybe 18 months and then unfortunately slowly went back on.
Did you ever have your BMR tested in both situations?
Did you actually measure your food?
If not, could it be that post-child birth your body changed for whatever reason and was burning more calories?
Like I said it was a mystery, I wasn't on a diet so didn't weigh food. When I was pregnant they found ketones in my urine and I was tested for gestational diabetes, but it came back negative. Basically I lost weight without trying. It's like my body reset to 'normal' for a while :huh:
Mystery most likely solved.
No the mystery is not solved, how did I lose weight without trying? Why would not weighing food make me lose weight?
Because you weren't weighing/measuring/tracking your food, you have no idea how much you were eating. Obviously, it was less than you needed to maintain weight. It really isn't a mystery - it's really quite simple.
I really can't believe people are latching onto this part of my story. I wasn't weighing my food when I lost the weight on this occasion, but I also wasn't weighing my food when I put weight on all the other times.
I have already said I don't wish to track calories all my life - the point is, why did my body naturally balance my intake for 18 months. Weighing food has nothing to do with it, I'm not saying I wasn't eating less calories, the mystery is how it happened without me trying!0 -
I really can't believe people are latching onto this part of my story. I wasn't weighing my food when I lost the weight on this occasion, but I also wasn't weighing my food when I put weight on all the other times.
I have already said I don't wish to track calories all my life - the point is, why did my body naturally balance my intake for 18 months. Weighing food has nothing to do with it, I'm not saying I wasn't eating less calories, the mystery is how it happened without me trying!
Most likely you ate at a level that got you to that weight and continued to eat that amount of food so you stayed around that weight...
All of these 'reasons' are not the point. I know it is possible to maintain a healthy weight without weighing food and tracking calories, I've done it before which was out of character and other people can do it too and have never needed to diet. If I was eating less, I didn't feel like I was. THIS IS THE POINT! This is my goal.0 -
Where do you think the rest of the calories 'went'?The reason why I know it's not just about the calories is because back in 1999-2000, during and after the birth of my second child, I inexplicably lost all the extra weight I had carried during the previous 5-plus years, which was approx 50lbs. I didn't do anything different to previous, did not exercise or eat a different diet - it just fell off me. I didn't have a medical condition, which was one of the first concerns I had. My weight stayed stable for over a year, maybe 18 months and then unfortunately slowly went back on.
Did you ever have your BMR tested in both situations?
Did you actually measure your food?
If not, could it be that post-child birth your body changed for whatever reason and was burning more calories?
Like I said it was a mystery, I wasn't on a diet so didn't weigh food. When I was pregnant they found ketones in my urine and I was tested for gestational diabetes, but it came back negative. Basically I lost weight without trying. It's like my body reset to 'normal' for a while :huh:
Mystery most likely solved.
No the mystery is not solved, how did I lose weight without trying? Why would not weighing food make me lose weight?
Oh, a bunch of reasons - post partum depression, oxytocin, prolactin and LH, breastfeeding, alcohol ketoacidosis, a variety of hidden diseases or infections can lead to ketoacidosis ... take your choice. Or watch House.0 -
Lets say it took a total of two year to lose 50lb. That would be an average deficit of 240 calories a day.
You had just had a second kid, so reasonable you might be being more active. Also, I believe some weight tends to come off anyway from straight after birth to a few months later.
If it was exactly a year, that would still only be 480.
But, working on 240 - say you ate the equivalent of two jaffa cakes less a day (not something that's that easy to notice unless you're counting) and at the same time had an extra 30 minutes walking a day (chasing up two kids). Bingo - that's a 239 calorie deficit with just that.
So with a barely noticeable change in diet and a very slightly increased activity level, 50lb CAN just disappear.
Now sure, maybe it was shorter than that - but if parents are to believed, especially those with two kids - there's probably a good bit MORE energy spent that the equivalent of 30 minutes walking in looking after them. And could you have say, not noticed you didn't have so much time to sort your own food out?0 -
Oh, a bunch of reasons - post partum depression, oxytocin, prolactin and LH, breastfeeding, alcohol ketoacidosis, a variety of hidden diseases or infections can lead to ketoacidosis ... take your choice. Or watch House.
Maybe it was lupus
So I must have had an illness or hidden abnormality to be able to lose weight without weighing and purposely restricting my food?
Is it really so bizarre to have successful weight loss without being a slave to the scale? What a negative viewpoint!0 -
Lets say it took a total of two year to lose 50lb. That would be an average deficit of 240 calories a day.
You had just had a second kid, so reasonable you might be being more active. Also, I believe some weight tends to come off anyway from straight after birth to a few months later.
If it was exactly a year, that would still only be 480.
But, working on 240 - say you ate the equivalent of two jaffa cakes less a day (not something that's that easy to notice unless you're counting) and at the same time had an extra 30 minutes walking a day (chasing up two kids). Bingo - that's a 239 calorie deficit with just that.
So with a barely noticeable change in diet and a very slightly increased activity level, 50lb CAN just disappear.
Now sure, maybe it was shorter than that - but if parents are to believed, especially those with two kids - there's probably a good bit MORE energy spent that the equivalent of 30 minutes walking in looking after them. And could you have say, not noticed you didn't have so much time to sort your own food out?
I lost the weight in around a year and a half. Surely my calorific intake would have increased, not decreased if I was exercising more.
Whatever, the point is why can dieting be such a battle if it so damned easy to lose significant weight without noticing? I'm pretty certain that many people signed up to MFP do not consider it easy to drop 50lb!0
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