Are pepperoni balls unhealthy?!
Replies
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I don't think many people will be dragged across the line if they feel strongly for either of those statements.
They actually are.
IIFYM is really a grassroots thing. It wouldn't be nearly as popular as it is (considering the constant media barrage of good carbs/bad carbs, good fat/bad fat, this food is healthy and this food is unhealthy) if it didn't have an extremely compelling message and a history of producing real long-term results.
OK then.
How do you feel about the statistics of how many people die of heart disease annually?
I reject your implication that, within the confines of an active lifestyle and a calorie-controlled diet with appropriate nutrient intake, certain foods will make you "healthier" than others.
I really don't think you understand IIFYM actually.
Sidenote, I get my info mostly NIH, the most trusted source for medical research. IIFYM does not take into account carcinogens in foods (especially processed meats), trans fats (which NIH has shown can cause infertility, heart disease, and diabetes), or the importance of micronutrients in full body function.
I am no saint, and I don't know it all, not even close, but I think the convo is really big and it's silly of us to make it so small.0 -
Sidenote, I get my info mostly NIH, the most trusted source for medical research. IIFYM does not take into account carcinogens in foods (especially processed meats), trans fats (which NIH has shown can cause infertility, heart disease, and diabetes), or the importance of micronutrients in full body function.
I am no saint, and I don't know it all, not even close, but I think the condo is really big and it's silly of us to make it so small.
Just to note, NIH doesn't do an awful lot of primary research. They do, however, maintain PubMed, which is a search engine/repository for primary research that appears in peer-reviewed journals.
And you definitely don't understand IIFYM given what you said here.0 -
IndeedBut the amazing thing is that if you're fat and exercise and eat at a calorie deficit to become healthy, then it doesn't matter anymore does it
- and has MORE benefits past that too .
Actually, not all fats are the same. There are good and bad fats,
Actually, you'll probably get MORE micronutrients from white rice than brown. As far as macronutrition value, that's not true, of course.As far as white rice and white bread, they have pretty much zero nutritional value and are at the top end of the glycemic index. So if BG and insulin fluctuations are pleasant for you, then by all means…
I can eat a LOAD of sugar and be the same as if I eat a 'balanced meal' with complex carbs.
So; which fats are good and which are bad?
Why is that the case?
Actually, you're wrong. You don't get more micronutrients from white rice. One of the major consequences of the refining process of white rice (besides the high glycemic index) is the loss of fiber, vitamins, magnesium and other minerals. White rice is fortified with iron and SOME B vitamins but that's pretty much it.0 -
Sidenote, I get my info mostly NIH, the most trusted source for medical research. IIFYM does not take into account carcinogens in foods (especially processed meats), trans fats (which NIH has shown can cause infertility, heart disease, and diabetes), or the importance of micronutrients in full body function.
I am no saint, and I don't know it all, not even close, but I think the condo is really big and it's silly of us to make it so small.
Just to note, NIH doesn't do an awful lot of primary research. They do, however, maintain PubMed, which is a search engine/repository for primary research that appears in peer-reviewed journals.
And you definitely don't understand IIFYM given what you said here.
The fact that you have told me twice that I don't understand something I have researched is really not conductive to a conversation. It makes you appear as though you're not open. And I'm not interested in a dialogue with a closed person, so we can just agree to disagree.0 -
Sidenote, I get my info mostly NIH, the most trusted source for medical research. IIFYM does not take into account carcinogens in foods (especially processed meats), trans fats (which NIH has shown can cause infertility, heart disease, and diabetes), or the importance of micronutrients in full body function.
I am no saint, and I don't know it all, not even close, but I think the condo is really big and it's silly of us to make it so small.
Just to note, NIH doesn't do an awful lot of primary research. They do, however, maintain PubMed, which is a search engine/repository for primary research that appears in peer-reviewed journals.
And you definitely don't understand IIFYM given what you said here.
The fact that you have told me twice that I don't understand something I have researched is really not conductive to a conversation. It makes you appear as though you're not open. And I'm not interested in a dialogue with a closed person, so we can just agree to disagree.
Whatever you've researched, you don't get IIFYM if you say that it doesn't take into account a macronutrient (which trans fat is), or that it doesn't take into account micronutrients (it does).
Whatever you think IIFYM, it's not that.0 -
IndeedBut the amazing thing is that if you're fat and exercise and eat at a calorie deficit to become healthy, then it doesn't matter anymore does it - and has MORE benefits past that too .
Actually, not all fats are the same. There are good and bad fats,
Actually, you'll probably get MORE micronutrients from white rice than brown. As far as macronutrition value, that's not true, of course.As far as white rice and white bread, they have pretty much zero nutritional value and are at the top end of the glycemic index. So if BG and insulin fluctuations are pleasant for you, then by all means…
I can eat a LOAD of sugar and be the same as if I eat a 'balanced meal' with complex carbs.
So; which fats are good and which are bad?
Why is that the case?
Actually, you're wrong. You don't get more micronutrients from white rice. One of the major consequences of the refining process of white rice (besides the high glycemic index) is the loss of fiber, vitamins, magnesium and other minerals. White rice is fortified with iron and SOME B vitamins but that's pretty much it.
You know how you can say something that's true (white rice loses micronutrients when it's processed) and yet can still be wrong?
This is one of those time..0 -
Sidenote, I get my info mostly NIH, the most trusted source for medical research. IIFYM does not take into account carcinogens in foods (especially processed meats), trans fats (which NIH has shown can cause infertility, heart disease, and diabetes), or the importance of micronutrients in full body function.
I am no saint, and I don't know it all, not even close, but I think the condo is really big and it's silly of us to make it so small.
Just to note, NIH doesn't do an awful lot of primary research. They do, however, maintain PubMed, which is a search engine/repository for primary research that appears in peer-reviewed journals.
And you definitely don't understand IIFYM given what you said here.
The fact that you have told me twice that I don't understand something I have researched is really not conductive to a conversation. It makes you appear as though you're not open. And I'm not interested in a dialogue with a closed person, so we can just agree to disagree.
Whatever you've researched, you don't get IIFYM if you say that it doesn't take into account a macronutrient (which trans fat is), or that it doesn't take into account micronutrients (it does).
Whatever you think IIFYM, it's not that.
It seems to be the general consensus from within the IIFYM community (via bodybuilding sites mostly) that trans fat is just fat. And a calorie is just a calorie. And if it fits…..!(you know how it ends)
I don't believe that is true.
I also don't believe we can just eat whatever meat comes out of a factory because its a protein. Some of it is filled with hormones, and is fed garbage in a cage all it's life. That meat (TO ME) is not up to par, even if it fits my macros.
Thats my point.
IIFYM is too simplified for me.
I don't think it means being as healthy as possible, I think in means looking good mostly.0 -
My evidence.Actually, you're wrong. You don't get more micronutrients from white rice. One of the major consequences of the refining process of white rice (besides the high glycemic index) is the loss of fiber, vitamins, magnesium and other minerals. White rice is fortified with iron and SOME B vitamins but that's pretty much it.
Your play.The following is from Alan Aragon.
White rice actually has an equal or better nutritional yield & also has a better nitrogen-retentive effect than brown rice. This is because the fiber & phytate content of brown rice act as antinutrients, reducing the bioavailability of the micronutrients it contains. Since no one is reading the fricking link, I'll just lay things out here:
Comparison of the nutritional value between brown rice and white rice
Callegaro Mda D, Tirapegui J. Arq Gastroenterol. 1996 Oct-Dec;33(4):225-31.
Cereals are considered an important source of nutrients both in human and animal nourishment. In this paper nutritional value of brown rice is compared to that of white rice in relation to nutrients. Results show that despite higher nutrients contents of brown rice compared to white rice, experimental data does not provide evidence that the brown rice diet is better than the diet based on white rice. Possible antinutritional factors present in brown rice have adverse effects on bioavailability of this cereal nutrients.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9302338
Effects of brown rice on apparent digestibility and balance of nutrients in young men on low protein diets
J Nutr Sci Vitaminol (Tokyo). 1987 Jun;33(3):207-18. .Miyoshi H, Okuda T, Okuda K, Koishi H.
The effect of brown rice with low protein intake was studied in five healthy young men. Feces were weighed, the digestibility of nutrients was determined, and blood tests were made. Each subject followed a diet consisting mainly of polished rice for 14 days and one consisting mainly of brown rice for 8 days. Both diets contained 0.5 g protein per kg of body weight. The brown rice diet had 3 times as much dietary fiber as the polished rice diet. On the brown rice diet, fecal weight increased, and apparent digestibility of energy, protein, and fat decreased, as did the absorption rates of Na, K, and P. The nitrogen balance was negative on both diets, but more negative on the brown rice diet. The phosphorus balance on the brown rice diet was significantly negative, but other minerals were not affected by the diet. The levels of cholesterol and minerals in the plasma were not significantly different on the polished rice diet and the brown rice diet. Comparing these results with data on standard protein intake (Miyoshi, H. et al (1986) J. Nutr. Sci. Vitaminol., 32, 581-589.), we concluded that brown rice reduced protein digestibility and nitrogen balance.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28228770 -
It seems to be the general consensus from within the IIFYM community (via bodybuilding sites mostly) that trans fat is just fat.
I have never seen this opinion among education IIFYM followers. But I don't get my information from bodybuilding message boards, I guess.0 -
It seems to be the general consensus from within the IIFYM community (via bodybuilding sites mostly) that trans fat is just fat.
I have never seen this opinion among education IIFYM followers. But I don't get my information from bodybuilding message boards, I guess.
Where would you suggest I find the most accurate outline of IIFYM and the educated community that adheres to the guidelines?
My research began at IIFYM.com which I thought was logical. But if there is something you can share with me, I am happy to take a look.
This seems to be some sort of IIFYM mission statement:
IIFYM doesn’t care if you eat pizza, or chicken breast.
IIFYM doesn’t shame you if you chose ice cream over oatmeal.
Nor does IIFYM care how often you eat, or how many meals you eat in a day.
Eat the foods you love, stay within your own personal macro nutrient range and burn fat without the pain that most people associate with dieting!
Notice I did not say “starve your self, and enjoy one slice of pizza per day”. This is because IIFYM is based on Science. Not on voodoo. a 15% reduction in calories is all that is needed to make your body a fat burning furnace.
That is the basic idea behind IIFYM.
There is more to it but it really is quite simple.
1. Know how many calories your body burns throughout an average day (your TDEE)
2. Eat 15-20% less calories every day than that number
3. Split those calories up between fat, protein and carbs in an ratio that is most beneficial for muscle preservation, fat loss, without a drop in daily energy.
For more details on how to get started with IIDYM, browse the other articles on this site and check out our proprietary Macro Calculator by then end of this hour, you can be on your way to eating foods you love, and burning fat while you do it!
I'm just saying….thats too simple for me.
You're telling me I don't get it.
I get it.
So unless you have something specific to share, we should agree to disagree, right?0 -
Where would you suggest I find the most accurate outline of IIFYM and the educated community that adheres to the guidelines?
My research began at IIFYM.com which I thought was logical. But if there is something you can share with me, I am happy to take a look.
MFP, actually. I'd also recommend the writings of Alan Aragon. Those two will keep you busy for a while.0 -
Where would you suggest I find the most accurate outline of IIFYM and the educated community that adheres to the guidelines?
My research began at IIFYM.com which I thought was logical. But if there is something you can share with me, I am happy to take a look.
MFP, actually. I'd also recommend the writings of Alan Aragon. Those two will keep you busy for a while.
Well, I've read a lot of the MFP threads on it, so that takes me to Alan Aragon! Will get on it.
I hope we can take the AWARENESS and accountability of looking at what we eat via trends like IIFYM, and add in some social responsibility. (such as more ethical farming practices and less hormones/additives/pesticides, education about whole foods, an end to certain bullsh*t subsidies) With a combination of these things, we can truly be healthier, not just "less fat"0 -
Yes, dangerous food additives get banned if they're found out to be dangerous. Why? Cause it's kinda hard to sell your stuff to dead people.
The things you mentioned that are able to cause heart disease etc. etc. have to be eaten so much in excess, it's impossible to eat them iifym and overeat on them. It just doesn't happen. Main reason why most people who die of heart disease and associated diseases, surprise surprise, are obese. These things are only dangerous to you if you overeat them. And not just for a little but for a long long time.
And what did you get taught in chemistry class? "All things are a poison. Only the lethal dose varies."0 -
It seems to be the general consensus from within the IIFYM community (via bodybuilding sites mostly) that trans fat is just fat.
I have never seen this opinion among education IIFYM followers. But I don't get my information from bodybuilding message boards, I guess.
Where would you suggest I find the most accurate outline of IIFYM and the educated community that adheres to the guidelines?
My research began at IIFYM.com which I thought was logical. But if there is something you can share with me, I am happy to take a look.
This seems to be some sort of IIFYM mission statement:
IIFYM doesn’t care if you eat pizza, or chicken breast.
IIFYM doesn’t shame you if you chose ice cream over oatmeal.
Nor does IIFYM care how often you eat, or how many meals you eat in a day.
Eat the foods you love, stay within your own personal macro nutrient range and burn fat without the pain that most people associate with dieting!
Notice I did not say “starve your self, and enjoy one slice of pizza per day”. This is because IIFYM is based on Science. Not on voodoo. a 15% reduction in calories is all that is needed to make your body a fat burning furnace.
That is the basic idea behind IIFYM.
There is more to it but it really is quite simple.
1. Know how many calories your body burns throughout an average day (your TDEE)
2. Eat 15-20% less calories every day than that number
3. Split those calories up between fat, protein and carbs in an ratio that is most beneficial for muscle preservation, fat loss, without a drop in daily energy.
For more details on how to get started with IIDYM, browse the other articles on this site and check out our proprietary Macro Calculator by then end of this hour, you can be on your way to eating foods you love, and burning fat while you do it!
I'm just saying….thats too simple for me.
You're telling me I don't get it.
I get it.
So unless you have something specific to share, we should agree to disagree, right?
as opposed to a bunch of mumbo jumbo about "chemicals in food", restricting certain bad foods, fruit sugar is good, but added sugar is bad, these carbs are good, but these carbs are bad, and on and on ..
In my experience, the simplest answer is the correct one...so I will stick with simplicity and the benefits that come along with it.0 -
Yes, dangerous food additives get banned if they're found out to be dangerous. Why? Cause it's kinda hard to sell your stuff to dead people.
The things you mentioned that are able to cause heart disease etc. etc. have to be eaten so much in excess, it's impossible to eat them iifym and overeat on them. It just doesn't happen. Main reason why most people who die of heart disease and associated diseases, surprise surprise, are obese. These things are only dangerous to you if you overeat them. And not just for a little but for a long long time.
And what did you get taught in chemistry class? "All things are a poison. Only the lethal dose varies."
Or you can just give people enough poison to make them sick and sedentary, then you can take their money for medications. Thats where I fear we are headed as consumers.
I love the idea of changing the energy of the culture, and I want to keep the dialogue going about how that can happen. What I don't want is to sound like I don't respect other people choices. I love reading all of these opinions, it's helping me see many sides.0 -
Funny thing, we're neither sick nor sedentary here. It's almost as if counting your calories, getting off your *kitten* and living iifym foils the evil, mustache-twisting plan of the evil corporations. What a crappy plan if it can be foiled so easily.0
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Funny thing, we're neither sick nor sedentary here. It's almost as if counting your calories, getting off your *kitten* and living iifym foils the evil, mustache-twisting plan of the evil corporations. What a crappy plan if it can be foiled so easily.
Those kind of responses directed at an earnest conversation feel pretty negative so I think its time to bow out of the thread and keep it moving
::::wave::::0 -
Funny thing, we're neither sick nor sedentary here. It's almost as if counting your calories, getting off your *kitten* and living iifym foils the evil, mustache-twisting plan of the evil corporations. What a crappy plan if it can be foiled so easily.
Those kind of responses directed at an earnest conversation feel pretty negative so I think its time to bow out of the thread and keep it moving
::::wave::::
I think you just need to eat what you think is healthy for you...me...I am thinking about making those pepperoni balls the next time I want pizza.0 -
What kind of answers are you expecting when you're talking like a conspiracy theorist about companies kinda putting deadly stuff in their stuff but only just enough to make you sick without killing you? (Even though deadly doses would differ from person to person by height, age, weight etc.)
Something able to make a grown person "sick and sedentary" would outright kill children a lot of times. How many dead children dying of "Coca Cola overdose" would there be?0 -
I'd rather hope that if claims of intentional poisoning were in an 'earnest' conversation, they would be backed up with decent evidence. So not surprised you got the (rather tame) response you did.Those kind of responses directed at an earnest conversation feel pretty negative so I think its time to bow out of the thread and keep it moving
::::wave::::
As it goes, I don't think there is a specific definition of 'IIFYM'. Sadly, a bit like 'clean eating'. But most people I've seen that "follow" it don't take it as the ONLY principal in choosing their nutrition, as many who 'clean' seem to.
The way I and most people I've seen that 'use' the principal is just not to get overly worried about what their macros are made of.0 -
I'd rather hope that if claims of intentional poisoning were in an 'earnest' conversation, they would be backed up with decent evidence. So not surprised you got the (rather tame) response you did.Those kind of responses directed at an earnest conversation feel pretty negative so I think its time to bow out of the thread and keep it moving
::::wave::::
As it goes, I don't think there is a specific definition of 'IIFYM'. Sadly, a bit like 'clean eating'. But most people I've seen that "follow" it don't take it as the ONLY principal in choosing their nutrition, as many who 'clean' seem to.
The way I and most people I've seen that 'use' the principal is just not to get overly worried about what their macros are made of.
Just taking a guess that you didn't read the link I posted about govt. and subsidies. If you're interested take a look, if not then we are on different pages and there's no need to move forward.
I don't kowtow the idea on MFP or any other internet forum that 'tame' responses should be applauded. I don't think we should give passes because people don't lose their miiiiiinds with anger or argument every 3 seconds. I strive for a little more than that if I'm gonna get into a convo.
My opinion is that corporations and govts want the masses (especially those in poverty) to remain subservient to avoid revolutionary change. This can be achieved in many ways, and what is available to eat is part of it. That doesn't mean you need to agree but it also doesn't immediately call for sarcasm or judgement.0 -
Lacking cat gifs0
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The subject line made me click. After a while, I no longer cared about the original post and found myself looking at all of the hot lady selfies in their profiles. Carry on.0
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I just did. Your link doesn't mention poison. It does have a link to show that junk food might be addictive to mice - I'll be certain to be careful giving such food to mice. Me, I find Melon is addictive - I can't have just one slice, I always end up having the entire thing. Sometimes two.Just taking a guess that you didn't read the link I posted about govt. and subsidies. If you're interested take a look, if not then we are on different pages and there's no need to move forward.
I am very sceptical of so many conspiracy theories on an Occam's Razor / general logic basis. It's rare governments manage to not mess up basic stuff, with all sorts of bad stuff that happens getting out - so when NOTHING concrete in relation to such conspiracies gets out, it suggests it doesn't really exist. You'd think they'd use the same people and techniques on a lot of the stuff they consider more important!0 -
Lacking cat gifs
That cat is not a clean eater...I think he leans more toward the...if it fits...0 -
Just cus it's low in calories don't mean it's healthy, but doesn't mean it's unhealthy either. However, I think you know the answer to this. Pepperoni is fatty unless it's turkey pepperoni, white bread is not good for you, it's a bad carb, however it's ok to have something like this once in awhile, so don't beat yourself up.
there is nothing wrong with fat, and fats should compose about 30 percent of your diet…
and white bread is bad…please? As opposed to other bread that is "good"….
I never said you shouldn't eat fat, but there is good fats and bad fats.
White bread and white rice are made from refined white flour containing several unwholesome constituents and very little in the way of nutrients and dietary fiber, essential for a healthy digestive system and a stable metabolism. This is why:
eh…fat is fat ….eat in a deficit, consume fats, you will be fine…
there is nothing wrong with white rice, or white bread….I would be interested to read the peer reviewed studies that you have access to backing up these claims...
Actually, not all fats are the same. There are good and bad fats,
As far as white rice and white bread, they have pretty much zero nutritional value and are at the top end of the glycemic index. So if BG and insulin fluctuations are pleasant for you, then by all means…
i would be interested to read the studies that prove there is bad fat and good fat…
where are the bad fats, in jail?0
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