Is calorie-counting different from dieting?
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If so how?
I've been lurking these forums for a few weeks and I constantly see people telling others, "don't diet! make it a lifestyle change!" But you're all counting your calories? Not to be judgmental but I don't see how it's different from a diet. Is this just a stepping stone to a healthier lifestyle? Or do you plan to count calories forever?
Ironically, most people talk a good talk about "lifestyle change" but pretty much miss the boat when it comes to actually implementing such a change. People who think that the act of calorie counting is the "lifestyle change"...they are missing that boat IMHO.
I'm in maintenance and have been for about 9 month now. When I was losing I counted calories...I used that method to teach myself to eat properly...to make better nutritional decisions...learn portion control and moderation...to better understand what it meant to eat a balanced diet. I do not count calories anymore in maintenance; I use the tools that I developed during my weight loss to help me successfully maintain.
The "lifestyle change" really comes down to making nutrition and fitness an intricate part of your life. Problem is that most people hit some arbitrary weight on the scale and think they've crossed the finish line...so they slack on their nutrition and they slack on their fitness. What they don't realize is that they haven't crossed the finish line...they've just arrived at the starting line...it is just the beginning and the real work starts in maintenance. Sadly, that is missed on the vast majority of people which is why only about 5% or so of people who've had weight issues will get them under control and keep them under control, regardless of the method used to lose weight.0 -
I use it to gain, lose, and maintain. It takes less time than brushing my teeth and showering and shaving.If so how?
I've been lurking these forums for a few weeks and I constantly see people telling others, "don't diet! make it a lifestyle change!" But you're all counting your calories? Not to be judgmental but I don't see how it's different from a diet. Is this just a stepping stone to a healthier lifestyle? Or do you plan to count calories forever?
I see it as a corrective measure like wearing glasses, because following my natural hunger signals does not give me the result I want.0 -
So why not just try to fix those bad eating habits directly? Why turn to counting calories if it's a crutch you'll have to rely on for the rest of your life in order to maintain a healthy weight?I will count calories as long as it has not become a natural way to live. I have to teach it to myself and it takes a very long time... it is a new way of life. I cannot count on myself doing it without a conscious effort. I have a lifetime of bad habits and bad choices to counterbalance...
Wouldn't it be easier to work on fixing the issues that cause you to overeat, and once those issues are addressed, continue eating a reasonable amount for the rest of your life & losing weight steadily that way?
For those with real food issues, 'fixing the issues' is a lot easier to say than do. Imagine telling a heroin addict that they had to keep using some heroin in order to stay alive, but not to use too much.... Food addiction really can be that way. There are times I wish my problem was alcohol or drugs. Cold turkey would be a lot easier.
Calorie counting is a tool that makes me mindful of what I eat. By logging everything I am more aware of what I'm eating and when I'm eating it. It is about trying to separate real hunger, my body's need for fuel, from the other emotions that have triggered my eating in the past. Calorie counting is part of fixing the issues, not a crutch.
Will I have to count calories the rest of my life? I hope not. However, once I reach my goal, I plan to slowly increase my calories until I find my maintenance level. Then I will count at that level for a while until I get a comfortable 'feel' for what that is like. I expect the entire process to take several years, so I am hopeful that I will have 'dealt' with the issues. However like an alcoholic, I will need to be aware of my issues and mindful of slipping into the old habits for the rest of my life.0 -
diet : the kinds of food that a person, animal, or community habitually eats.
eta: so yes, I am on a diet for life.0 -
So why not just try to fix those bad eating habits directly? Why turn to counting calories if it's a crutch you'll have to rely on for the rest of your life in order to maintain a healthy weight?I will count calories as long as it has not become a natural way to live. I have to teach it to myself and it takes a very long time... it is a new way of life. I cannot count on myself doing it without a conscious effort. I have a lifetime of bad habits and bad choices to counterbalance...
Wouldn't it be easier to work on fixing the issues that cause you to overeat, and once those issues are addressed, continue eating a reasonable amount for the rest of your life & losing weight steadily that way?
For those with real food issues, 'fixing the issues' is a lot easier to say than do. Imagine telling a heroin addict that they had to keep using some heroin in order to stay alive, but not to use too much.... Food addiction really can be that way. There are times I wish my problem was alcohol or drugs. Cold turkey would be a lot easier.
Calorie counting is a tool that makes me mindful of what I eat. By logging everything I am more aware of what I'm eating and when I'm eating it. It is about trying to separate real hunger, my body's need for fuel, from the other emotions that have triggered my eating in the past. Calorie counting is part of fixing the issues, not a crutch.
Will I have to count calories the rest of my life? I hope not. However, once I reach my goal, I plan to slowly increase my calories until I find my maintenance level. Then I will count at that level for a while until I get a comfortable 'feel' for what that is like. I expect the entire process to take several years, so I am hopeful that I will have 'dealt' with the issues. However like an alcoholic, I will need to be aware of my issues and mindful of slipping into the old habits for the rest of my life.
I sympathise (I'm the same).
Sadly not everybody gets this - certainly not outside of their own little bubbles or belief system.0 -
OP - you're missing something - there is a global aspect to this...it's not JUST about food choices, or weighing food, or why we overeat in the first place. It's about all of this combined.
The original question "diet" vs. "lifestyle change". Most people on this site are either overweight or were overweight at some point. Which means that they have/had issues with food. How much to eat. Eating for the wrong reasons, etc...most of these people have tried "diets". The cabbage soup diet. The juice diet, the low carb diet. Keto. Paleo, raw foods, the 3-day-diet...the list goes on and on. These are temporary things. They're not incorporating a change into your life that you can do forever.
"Lifestyle change" means changing your habits. How you eat, what you eat, quantities, how much you exercise. And finding the balance there...something that you will be happy to be doing in ten years - long after you've reached your fitness goals.
When I count calories, I can eat whatever I want. Because I'm aiming for a total calorie goal. I can have chocolate, and pasta and donuts...whatever I want. I try to hit my macros every day, and I eat whatever I want within those parameters.
I'd say most people who have long term success are also addressing their food issues as they lose weight. I can't think of one person I know who has looked for the first time at what an actual serving of pasta is and not felt deprived. When you see how much you are eating versus how much you should be eating (to maintain)...it's usually a shock...which makes you ask the questions - why am I eating so much?
We address these issues - with the help of others here on MFP who have also struggled with the same. And hopefully the next time we're in a situation where we struggle, we're a bit wiser. Make mistakes less and less often until the new lifestyle is second nature.
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It seems the OP is under the impression that all humans are in possession of a system that produces hunger/full signals which, if followed faithfully, would result in everyone being at their ideal weight.0
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I have gained 12 lbs since I brought my baby home from the hospital. Yes, GAINED since having a baby.
I think my stomach has stretched due to my overeating...what used to satiate me no longer does.
For example- I used to be able to eat half a Chipotle burrito and feel satisfied. Now if I eat just half I don't feel "full" and I am hungry again a lot sooner than before.
So now I have to get used to feeling less full/actual hunger until my body is back to "normal" and everything regulates again.0 -
...why turn to calorie counting?
It's a tool to help learn more effective eating habits?
In the absence of any boundaries and context around the behaviours one needs to learn then success is neither assured nor understood.
By understanding how intake and output relate to one another one can make informed choices.
As an example, I now know broadly what'll give me a reasonable intake for a day, in the order of enough to maintain weight. I also know broadly how to compensate for a 90 minute run, a 30 minute run, a 60 minute run and I can forecast what I'll be needing to consume after a 120 minute run. In the absence of understanding the principles I'd be seeing random outcomes, with the risk of burning out when I'm training.0 -
Precisely.It seems the OP is under the impression that all humans are in possession of a system that produces hunger/full signals which, if followed faithfully, would result in everyone being at their ideal weight.
Humans have been doing that since the dawn of time. People didn't even start caring about calories until like 50 years ago, and back then obesity rates were drastically lower than they are now. How do you think those people regulated their weights? How do you think people who don't struggle with their weight or diet even today, regulate their weight?
There's no reason to believe that some people just don't have hunger/fullness signals. Everyone has them. It's just a matter of knowing how to listen to them, which most people who struggle with their weight have long since forgotten how to do. And counting calories doesn't really fix that problem. It just perpetuates the (false) belief that you have no way of eating normal amounts of food without imposing external limitations.0 -
If your calorie counting causes you to eat less than you burn - then it's a diet in the sense of weight loss.
But diet is really just the way you eat.
Hence the reason many say make changes you can live with. Actually, many don't say that, they give out all these changes you should make to be "healthy" in their way.
And for far too many - that's not sustainable, during the diet or afterwards.
And yes, many will be calorie counting for a long time - they can't trust their bodies - never should anyway unless you are really knowledgeable about how it can fool you, and work around that.
It obviously was listened to for weight going up, and sadly studies have shown despite weight loss it usually want to go back up anyway, if sizeable loss anyway.
So they likely will need to count calories for a long time. And start getting good at portion control and estimates.
^^^^This0 -
Everyone is on a diet. Some folks are on a diet to lose weight. Some folks eat a vegetarian diet. Some folks limit salt in their diet... Everyone is on a diet. Yes, even the counters.
To me: there's no meaningful difference between counting/weighing/measuring/monitoring macros whatever and something like DASH, or something like Paleo/Prima, or something like South Beach, Mediterranean: You're focusing your attention on how you're eating and you're choosing to limit something in the hopes of being healthier and leaner. And you're likely (hopefully) hoping to learn something that will stick so that you can keep the weight off.
Some folks want to learn about portion size, so they count/weigh/measure, etc.
Some folks want to learn how certain foods affect them.
Some folks want to learn a different way of considering their eating.
And, when the weight loss period is over, those who succeed (success being defined as KEEPING the weight off), do so because they've made a meaningful, significant change to how they approach food. And they've done so in a well reasoned manner. After they've lost, do they now eyeball portions? Do they keep counting/weighing/measuring? Do they keep choosing not to eat something like white bread or added sugar? IT DOESN'T FECKING MATTER. What matters is: they've found out how to happily interact with food in the way that best works for them. Then THAT Becomes their diet. When you're at goal weight your diet is your lifestyle.
So yes, calorie counting is a diet. It's silly, imho, and actually counter productive for the long haul, to consider it anything else. I think considering diet a "four letter word" is absurd, actually.
:flowerforyou:0 -
If so how?
I've been lurking these forums for a few weeks and I constantly see people telling others, "don't diet! make it a lifestyle change!" But you're all counting your calories? Not to be judgmental but I don't see how it's different from a diet. Is this just a stepping stone to a healthier lifestyle? Or do you plan to count calories forever?
The word "diet" has negative connotations associated with it, plus there are many definitions. A lifestyle would incorporate something you do not have to change. If you eat the maintenance for your ideal weight, eventually you would be that weight and not have to change a single thing. That is the theory. Many say they will diet to lose weight. Then what? When they get to their ideal weight, go back to old eating habits? I'll probably count calories for life. That's just part of my new lifestyle.0 -
Fixing the issues is definitely harder than counting your calories but its surely not IMPOSSIBLE. You have to realize that you learned those bad food issues. You didn't always have them. You weren't born with them. That means you can un-learn them. Food addiction is a myth. It's completely psychological.
So why not just try to fix those bad eating habits directly? Why turn to counting calories if it's a crutch you'll have to rely on for the rest of your life in order to maintain a healthy weight?I will count calories as long as it has not become a natural way to live. I have to teach it to myself and it takes a very long time... it is a new way of life. I cannot count on myself doing it without a conscious effort. I have a lifetime of bad habits and bad choices to counterbalance...
Wouldn't it be easier to work on fixing the issues that cause you to overeat, and once those issues are addressed, continue eating a reasonable amount for the rest of your life & losing weight steadily that way?
For those with real food issues, 'fixing the issues' is a lot easier to say than do. Imagine telling a heroin addict that they had to keep using some heroin in order to stay alive, but not to use too much.... Food addiction really can be that way. There are times I wish my problem was alcohol or drugs. Cold turkey would be a lot easier.
Calorie counting is a tool that makes me mindful of what I eat. By logging everything I am more aware of what I'm eating and when I'm eating it. It is about trying to separate real hunger, my body's need for fuel, from the other emotions that have triggered my eating in the past. Calorie counting is part of fixing the issues, not a crutch.
Will I have to count calories the rest of my life? I hope not. However, once I reach my goal, I plan to slowly increase my calories until I find my maintenance level. Then I will count at that level for a while until I get a comfortable 'feel' for what that is like. I expect the entire process to take several years, so I am hopeful that I will have 'dealt' with the issues. However like an alcoholic, I will need to be aware of my issues and mindful of slipping into the old habits for the rest of my life.
Would you sell your house or car for a Mcdonald's meal or donuts? Heroine addicts have a physical addiction, their bodies can not function without the drug. Your body can (& wants to) function perfectly fine without excess food. But it's your learned behaviors & psychological urges toward food that make it feel impossible for you to eat normally.
If your emotional eating issues are what made you overweight, then THOSE should be your primary focus, not eating a certain number of calories per day. By controlling your calorie intake, you're only treating the symptom of those eating issues, and you will continue having to treat that symptom, by managing your calories externally and exercising willpower and self control every day for the rest of your life to ensure that you stay below that self-imposed limit. Whereas your emotional eating tendencies will continue to linger below the surface.
If your emotional eating issues went away today, and you were suddenly able to eat when you were hungry & stop when you were full, wouldn't you be able to get and remain at a healthy weight for the rest of your life without ever having to count a single calorie again?0 -
Your body can (& wants to) function perfectly fine without excess food. But it's your learned behaviors & psychological urges toward food that make it feel impossible for you to eat normally.
Ok, so let's hear it, how do you suggest that people unlearn their behaviours and gain the required understanding?0 -
And yes, many will be calorie counting for a long time - they can't trust their bodies - never should anyway unless you are really knowledgeable about how it can fool you, and work around that.
Can you explain more about why they shouldn't trust their bodies, & how it can fool them?
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Well, for example, I rarely feel satiated. I hardly ever have the sensation of fullness, even though I know I have eaten enough to fill my stomach. And even when I do actually feel full, my desire to eat is just as strong. It's probably why I come from a long line of fat women. Luckily, I decided early on that I wasn't going to become a fat woman, and have been conscious of what and how much I eat for decades.0 -
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Uh no. I know how that is regulated. When food is abundant more offspring survive and the population swells until starvation limits it.
Precisely.It seems the OP is under the impression that all humans are in possession of a system that produces hunger/full signals which, if followed faithfully, would result in everyone being at their ideal weight.
Humans have been doing that since the dawn of time. People didn't even start caring about calories until like 50 years ago, and back then obesity rates were drastically lower than they are now. How do you think those people regulated their weights? How do you think people who don't struggle with their weight or diet even today, regulate their weight?
There's no reason to believe that some people just don't have hunger/fullness signals. Everyone has them. It's just a matter of knowing how to listen to them, which most people who struggle with their weight have long since forgotten how to do. And counting calories doesn't really fix that problem. It just perpetuates the (false) belief that you have no way of eating normal amounts of food without imposing external limitations.
There is no reason to believe that any species has experienced long-term overabundance of food, and thus would ever have good reason to develop such a finely-tuned mechanism.
It also allows me to eat calorie-dense foods that I enjoy while maintaining a healthy weight. There's nothing false about that. You seem to think that counting is such hard work or requires vast amounts of time and energy. It's just counting.0 -
I don't have any problem using the word "diet." A diet is a way of eating--any way of eating. It can be the Standard American diet, Vegetarian diet, Mediterranean Diet, etc.
However, I am "on a diet." I am counting calories so I can lose weight. If I could trust my body to tell me when I am full, I wouldn't need to be on a diet. If I could trust my body to tell me when to stop eating, I wouldn't need to take off more than 100 lbs.
Once I get to my goal weight, I will need to maintain my goal weight for the rest of my life. That means watching what I eat, making healthy choices, and not taking second portions. If that means I still need to count calories, so be it. The reason people put lost weight back on is because they stop watching what they eat. I don't want to make that mistake.0 -
Your body can (& wants to) function perfectly fine without excess food. But it's your learned behaviors & psychological urges toward food that make it feel impossible for you to eat normally.
Ok, so let's hear it, how do you suggest that people unlearn their behaviours and gain the required understanding?
Yeah, I have a feeling someone is trying to "teach" us something. :ohwell:0 -
OP, you're a smug young thing, aren't you? You've got all the answers. It's neat that you've been able to analyze the entire community of MFP users in order to formulate this perfect method for weight loss. Maybe you should write a diet book.
I don't eat for any reason other than I like to eat (and I eat a healthy diet). I also like to drink wine (a lot) and I wasn't exercising, so I found myself in need of some good old-fashioned reducing. I don't need to explore my relationship with food, I need to eat less of it for a while and learn what a portion looks like. (Do you know how easy it is to pour out two tablespoons of oil instead of one when you're cooking?) I look at more than just calories because I want optimal nutrition, and without logging it I wouldn't know if I'm getting it. I've learned that I need to up my protein and fiber, so I've been able to try some new stuff that helps me do that.
Edited to add: The word DIET doesn't bother me at all. It's just a word.0 -
Just curious, do you listen to your body when it tells you that this picture is moving?There's no reason to believe that some people just don't have hunger/fullness signals. Everyone has them. It's just a matter of knowing how to listen to them, which most people who struggle with their weight have long since forgotten how to do.
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OP, you're a smug young thing, aren't you? You've got all the answers. It's neat that you've been able to analyze the entire community of MFP users in order to formulate this perfect method for weight loss. Maybe you should write a diet book.
I don't eat for any reason other than I like to eat (and I eat a healthy diet). I also like to drink wine (a lot) and I wasn't exercising, so I found myself in need of some good old-fashioned reducing. I don't need to explore my relationship with food, I need to eat less of it for a while and learn what a portion looks like. (Do you know how easy it is to pour out two tablespoons of oil instead of one when you're cooking?) I look at more than just calories because I want optimal nutrition, and without logging it I wouldn't know if I'm getting it. I've learned that I need to up my protein and fiber, so I've been able to try some new stuff that helps me do that.
This 100%0 -
It's completely different to me. I haven't cut out anything from my diet. I eat sugar, fat, carbs, salt, and even some junk food here and there. I make sure to budget my calories and macros. I don't feel like I'm dieting. Yeah, sometimes I want to reach for crap and grab some carrots instead, but that's just the way it is. I firmly believe that eating what makes you happy *in moderation* is the most enjoyable way to live. I'm not dieting whatsoever. I'm changing my eating habits for life.0
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Next thread by OP: Hey all you color-blind people, stop faking it and just listen to your eyes when they tell you the difference between red and green!OP, you're a smug young thing, aren't you? You've got all the answers. It's neat that you've been able to analyze the entire community of MFP users in order to formulate this perfect method for weight loss. Maybe you should write a diet book.
I don't eat for any reason other than I like to eat (and I eat a healthy diet). I also like to drink wine (a lot) and I wasn't exercising, so I found myself in need of some good old-fashioned reducing. I don't need to explore my relationship with food, I need to eat less of it for a while and learn what a portion looks like. (Do you know how easy it is to pour out two tablespoons of oil instead of one when you're cooking?) I look at more than just calories because I want optimal nutrition, and without logging it I wouldn't know if I'm getting it. I've learned that I need to up my protein and fiber, so I've been able to try some new stuff that helps me do that.
This 100%0 -
I really don't understand the hostility I'm getting here. Are you telling me then, that everyone who lives in an abundance of food will become fat if they don't count and track their calories? Everyone who enjoys food will become fat if they don't impose limitations that will force themselves to eat less?
If so, then why isn't everyone in every developed country fat? Why do many people remain thin while still in abundance of food, WITHOUT counting calories? Surely they aren't special snowflakes. We are all humans. We all have the same anatomy. Just because you've forgotten what it feels like to eat when you're hungry & stop when you're full (which every human knew how to do when they were babies) doesn't mean those signals don't exist. And just because you've replaced that natural mechanism with counting calories doesn't mean that original mechanism is invalid. It just means you've lost touch with how to use it.0 -
Ok.
Next thread by OP: Hey all you color-blind people, stop faking it and just listen to your eyes when they tell you the difference between red and green!OP, you're a smug young thing, aren't you? You've got all the answers. It's neat that you've been able to analyze the entire community of MFP users in order to formulate this perfect method for weight loss. Maybe you should write a diet book.
I don't eat for any reason other than I like to eat (and I eat a healthy diet). I also like to drink wine (a lot) and I wasn't exercising, so I found myself in need of some good old-fashioned reducing. I don't need to explore my relationship with food, I need to eat less of it for a while and learn what a portion looks like. (Do you know how easy it is to pour out two tablespoons of oil instead of one when you're cooking?) I look at more than just calories because I want optimal nutrition, and without logging it I wouldn't know if I'm getting it. I've learned that I need to up my protein and fiber, so I've been able to try some new stuff that helps me do that.
This 100%0 -
I really don't understand the hostility I'm getting here. Are you telling me then, that everyone who lives in an abundance of food will become fat if they don't count and track their calories?
If so, then why isn't everyone in every developed country fat? Why do many people remain thin while still in abundance of food, WITHOUT counting calories? Surely they aren't special snowflakes. We are all humans.
I'm certainly not telling you that everyone will. I'm telling you that I did. Not a problem for you, really, so I'll go about my merry way. Ta Ta!0 -
If so how?
I've been lurking these forums for a few weeks and I constantly see people telling others, "don't diet! make it a lifestyle change!" But you're all counting your calories? Not to be judgmental but I don't see how it's different from a diet. Is this just a stepping stone to a healthier lifestyle? Or do you plan to count calories forever?
TL/DR
The isssue at the heart of the "don't diet, make it a lifestyel change" generally deals with the way many people tend to view "diets" as a temporary fix. Such "diets" can range from restricting certain foods, to eating only at certain periods of the day, to restricting and counting calories. The problem is that they "diet" until they reach their goal, then they stop and, often, they fall back into old habits and the weight comes back. Sometimes, the "diet" is so restrictive they can't stick with it. They relied on a temporary fix rather than doing something that can more easily last a lifetime.
Calorie counting, in my opinion, is one of the easiest ways to make the change in your eating habits a true lifestyle change. It's annoying to have to do it consistently for the rest of your life, but it offers the option of eating anything- no more "I can't have my favorite food becasue I'm on a diet".0 -
That's not at all what I'm saying. I'm saying that peoples' hunger/full mechanisms are not all tuned to the exact same amount, because the situation we are dealing with in first world countries (overabundance of calorie-dense foods) is not something our genes have been had to deal with through long-term exposure. Why is this so difficult for you to understand?I really don't understand the hostility I'm getting here. Are you telling me then, that everyone who lives in an abundance of food will become fat if they don't count and track their calories? Everyone who enjoys food will become fat if they don't impose limitations that will force themselves to eat less?0
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