Fat Positivity?
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The fat acceptance movement is fine in my opinion until they start using the term "glorify obesity". That's when you've lost me.
The fat acceptance movement DOES NOT use the term "glorify obesity"!!! That is a phrase thrown at them about what people THINK they are doing.
If they are bashing thin people and saying that they "love their beautiful fat bodies" then it's glorifying obesity. Case closed.
HOW DARE THEY LOVE & SEE BEAUTY IN THEIR FAT BODIES HOW DARE THEY!!!!!
YOU see their bodies as not beautiful or acceptable YOU see their bodies as something to be hidden , something to be ashamed of YOU see their love for their bodies as something wrong...because how dare someone love something you think is disgusting/ugly/gross/unhealthy how dare they be okay with themselves
think about how sad it is that it bothers you so much that someone can love themselves no matter what size...it bothers you soo much you cannot stand the thought of fat bodies being seen as acceptable, beautiful & deserving of respect .eh?
that is really reallllly sad0 -
The fat acceptance movement DOES NOT use the term "glorify obesity"!!! That is a phrase thrown at them about what people THINK they are doing.
If they are bashing thin people and saying that they "love their beautiful fat bodies" then it's glorifying obesity. Case closed.
I seriously feel sorry for any overweight person who ends up with you as their doctor (or nurse, or whatever it is you're studying to be).
Loving your body in any state that it's in is NOT glorifying that state. Loving yourself is so much more healthy than hating yourself, no matter what your size is.
The majority of people who support HAES/fat acceptance DO NOT hate on people with other body sizes. Much in the same way that most thin/average weight people DO NOT hate on fat people... though I would say the hatred/lack of respect towards people who are overweight VASTLY outnumbers any negativity toward thin/average size people.0 -
Nothing wrong with loving your body. Hell, I had to learn to love mine before I could even think about trying to lose weight. Have you ever tried cutting calories while you shudder every time you look in the mirror? Not only are you hungry, but it's hard to see the point in even trying to lose pounds when all you can think about is how ugly you look with those love handles and back fat. In my experience, it's much easier to press on when you are thinking: "Man, I am looking cute today! All curvy and *kitten*...I can't wait until I can look even better in my swimsuit in a couple months!"
Of course, when you start bashing skinny people, that's not good. But I think that is just a response from all the negativity overweight people get from others. Kind of like how bullies act out because they're actually being bullied at home...Just my thoughts anyway.0 -
I generally have a hard time with the 'fat acceptance' movement. I mean, I don't think being an *kitten* to overweight people is ok, but I have a hard time believing anyone who is so desperately screaming "I am happy!!! I DEMAND YOU RECOGNIZE MY HAPPINESS!!!!!" It always comes off kind of angry and weird and...something else I can't put my finger on.0
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I get it. It's hard to be fat. No one gives a **** about your character, they only care about your size. This is just people's way of fighting back. Do I think that it's okay to hate thin people? No, but everyone has their own journey that leads them to where they are. And to be honest, I am tired of living in a "have to be thin to be somebody" world.0
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And to be honest, I am tired of living in a "have to be thin to be somebody" world.
Other than hollywood I don't think you have to be thin to be someone. I am kinda thin (BMI 20)and I am constantly called names (biafrin, anorexic), told to eat a hamburger and people totally misjudge my strength (I am a heavy lifter and am much stronger than people think... everyone assumes I am weak!
I am all for body acceptance and I think everyone should love their body no matter their size (even though I am not happy with mine) but I hate how body acceptance trends tend to put people down like "real women have curves" (luckily I have hips so I am a "real woman" though I know plenty of lean people without curves who are women ) and that thin is gross and disgusting. That does not help the cause at all. I also hate the pro ana movement too for villianizing body fat but they are obviously seriously mentally ill0 -
And to be honest, I am tired of living in a "have to be thin to be somebody" world.
Other than hollywood I don't think you have to be thin to be someone. I am kinda thin (BMI 20)and I am constantly called names (biafrin, anorexic), told to eat a hamburger and people totally misjudge my strength (I am a heavy lifter and am much stronger than people think... everyone assumes I am weak!
I am all for body acceptance and I think everyone should love their body no matter their size (even though I am not happy with mine) but I hate how body acceptance trends tend to put people down like "real women have curves" (luckily I have hips so I am a "real woman" though I know plenty of lean people without curves who are women ) and that thin is gross and disgusting. That does not help the cause at all. I also hate the pro ana movement too for villianizing body fat but they are obviously seriously mentally ill
Thank you for saying this, as I have similar experiences and it really hurts my feelings. Surprise surprise, thin people have feelings too. One family member pushed me to tears with the things he said about me, and I'm constantly being bullied by my family even though I'm a normal weight.
I also hate it when people speak so cruelly of thin people, words like, "rail-thin, body like a boy, real men like curves, boys don't like bones, etc.". You know, most women who become thin do so for themselves and don't give a rats *kitten* about "boys". And what about those women who are naturally thin? They must feel awful constantly reading that...
I know there's a lot more bullying of overweight people, but the attitude people take lately is that it's okay to thin-bash because they're thin so who cares? Bullying is never okay! No matter what
Don't forget: you never know what people are going through so don't say mean things because they could already be in a very bad place. Some times your "advice" could make things worse. 0 -
The thin bashing in this thread is appalling.0
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So much raging against strangers' thoughts that almost certainly don't even exist.
Here's something to consider: random people care far less about every single one of you (regardless of size) than you think they do. I know that realization probably scares some of you, but it's the truth.
But if this is the boogeyman you need to get through your day, then who am I to point out that he doesn't exist?0 -
So much raging against strangers' thoughts that almost certainly don't even exist.
Here's something to consider: random people care far less about every single one of you (regardless of size) than you think they do. I know that realization probably scares some of you, but it's the truth.
But if this is the boogeyman you need to get through your day, then who am I to point out that he doesn't exist?
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I am considered OBESE in my BMI category. I love who I am, but am losing weight to better my health and be able to not worry about busting a chair in half again. YES, My fat butt broke a chair and everyone felt sorry for me and tried to comfort me by saying it was the chair and not me...UM NO, I am WAY overweight and the chair wasn't made for my big butt. Doesn't make me hate myself, just made me realize I need to change a lot in my life or my poor husband would be aging on without me and enjoying life without me, which breaks my heart now as we can't do certain things he would like to do, because my body couldn't handle it.0
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And to be honest, I am tired of living in a "have to be thin to be somebody" world.
Other than hollywood I don't think you have to be thin to be someone. I am kinda thin (BMI 20)and I am constantly called names (biafrin, anorexic), told to eat a hamburger and people totally misjudge my strength (I am a heavy lifter and am much stronger than people think... everyone assumes I am weak!
I am all for body acceptance and I think everyone should love their body no matter their size (even though I am not happy with mine) but I hate how body acceptance trends tend to put people down like "real women have curves" (luckily I have hips so I am a "real woman" though I know plenty of lean people without curves who are women ) and that thin is gross and disgusting. That does not help the cause at all. I also hate the pro ana movement too for villianizing body fat but they are obviously seriously mentally ill
Thank you for saying this, as I have similar experiences and it really hurts my feelings. Surprise surprise, thin people have feelings too. One family member pushed me to tears with the things he said about me, and I'm constantly being bullied by my family even though I'm a normal weight.
I also hate it when people speak so cruelly of thin people, words like, "rail-thin, body like a boy, real men like curves, boys don't like bones, etc.". You know, most women who become thin do so for themselves and don't give a rats *kitten* about "boys". And what about those women who are naturally thin? They must feel awful constantly reading that...
I know there's a lot more bullying of overweight people, but the attitude people take lately is that it's okay to thin-bash because they're thin so who cares? Bullying is never okay! No matter what Don't forget: you never know what people are going through so don't say mean things because they could already be in a very bad place. Some times your "advice" could make things worse.
Really, because I can tell you that I walk into interviews with my business professional suit on with a more impressive resume than the majority of my peers and I can't tell you how many times the interview ended as soon as I walked in the room and it wasn't anything I said or did, it was my size. How many times do you see an overweight woman in a position of authority in the business world?
Not to mention how long it took me to even find a business suit in my size and how much more I had to pay for it compared to a "normal" size person.
I mean seriously, even to make someone pay extra on an airline because of their size.0 -
I must have missed the part that makes it OK to bash on someone because of their size?And to be honest, I am tired of living in a "have to be thin to be somebody" world.
Other than hollywood I don't think you have to be thin to be someone. I am kinda thin (BMI 20)and I am constantly called names (biafrin, anorexic), told to eat a hamburger and people totally misjudge my strength (I am a heavy lifter and am much stronger than people think... everyone assumes I am weak!
I am all for body acceptance and I think everyone should love their body no matter their size (even though I am not happy with mine) but I hate how body acceptance trends tend to put people down like "real women have curves" (luckily I have hips so I am a "real woman" though I know plenty of lean people without curves who are women ) and that thin is gross and disgusting. That does not help the cause at all. I also hate the pro ana movement too for villianizing body fat but they are obviously seriously mentally ill
Thank you for saying this, as I have similar experiences and it really hurts my feelings. Surprise surprise, thin people have feelings too. One family member pushed me to tears with the things he said about me, and I'm constantly being bullied by my family even though I'm a normal weight.
I also hate it when people speak so cruelly of thin people, words like, "rail-thin, body like a boy, real men like curves, boys don't like bones, etc.". You know, most women who become thin do so for themselves and don't give a rats *kitten* about "boys". And what about those women who are naturally thin? They must feel awful constantly reading that...
I know there's a lot more bullying of overweight people, but the attitude people take lately is that it's okay to thin-bash because they're thin so who cares? Bullying is never okay! No matter what Don't forget: you never know what people are going through so don't say mean things because they could already be in a very bad place. Some times your "advice" could make things worse.
Really, because I can tell you that I walk into interviews with my business professional suit on with a more impressive resume than the majority of my peers and I can't tell you how many times the interview ended as soon as I walked in the room and it wasn't anything I said or did, it was my size. How many times do you see an overweight woman in a position of authority in the business world?
Not to mention how long it took me to even find a business suit in my size and how much more I had to pay for it compared to a "normal" size person.
I mean seriously, even to make someone pay extra on an airline because of their size.0 -
And to be honest, I am tired of living in a "have to be thin to be somebody" world.
Other than hollywood I don't think you have to be thin to be someone. I am kinda thin (BMI 20)and I am constantly called names (biafrin, anorexic), told to eat a hamburger and people totally misjudge my strength (I am a heavy lifter and am much stronger than people think... everyone assumes I am weak!
I am all for body acceptance and I think everyone should love their body no matter their size (even though I am not happy with mine) but I hate how body acceptance trends tend to put people down like "real women have curves" (luckily I have hips so I am a "real woman" though I know plenty of lean people without curves who are women ) and that thin is gross and disgusting. That does not help the cause at all. I also hate the pro ana movement too for villianizing body fat but they are obviously seriously mentally ill
Thank you for saying this, as I have similar experiences and it really hurts my feelings. Surprise surprise, thin people have feelings too. One family member pushed me to tears with the things he said about me, and I'm constantly being bullied by my family even though I'm a normal weight.
I also hate it when people speak so cruelly of thin people, words like, "rail-thin, body like a boy, real men like curves, boys don't like bones, etc.". You know, most women who become thin do so for themselves and don't give a rats *kitten* about "boys". And what about those women who are naturally thin? They must feel awful constantly reading that...
I know there's a lot more bullying of overweight people, but the attitude people take lately is that it's okay to thin-bash because they're thin so who cares? Bullying is never okay! No matter what Don't forget: you never know what people are going through so don't say mean things because they could already be in a very bad place. Some times your "advice" could make things worse.
Really, because I can tell you that I walk into interviews with my business professional suit on with a more impressive resume than the majority of my peers and I can't tell you how many times the interview ended as soon as I walked in the room and it wasn't anything I said or did, it was my size. How many times do you see an overweight woman in a position of authority in the business world?
Not to mention how long it took me to even find a business suit in my size and how much more I had to pay for it compared to a "normal" size person.
I mean seriously, even to make someone pay extra on an airline because of their size.
You know what everyone's resumes are like? Weird.
Its not even remotely possible that somewhere, in the field of all applicants, someone might have more experience/better qualifications than you?
Also, even if all of this stuff is due solely to your weight and not anything else, why do you think it excuses the bullying of thin people? Is it some kind of twisted 'pay it forward' scenario?0 -
I am all for body acceptance and I think everyone should love their body no matter their size (even though I am not happy with mine) but I hate how body acceptance trends tend to put people down like "real women have curves" (luckily I have hips so I am a "real woman" though I know plenty of lean people without curves who are women ) and that thin is gross and disgusting. That does not help the cause at all. I also hate the pro ana movement too for villianizing body fat but they are obviously seriously mentally ill
I also hate real women have curves because I think it's code for be voluptuous (ie big breast, big hips, smaller waist) but not fat. So it's a phrase that advocates for a specific body type and not for overall acceptance.
I do think that what body positivity and fat acceptance people are advocating for is more than just individuals loving themselves, but a societal shift that stops demonizing people for their bodies. People can love their bodies, or they can not think about their bodies, but all bodies should be treated with dignity in society.The thin bashing in this thread is appalling.
I'm not seeing any thin bashing. Have they been removed or am I missing something?0 -
And to be honest, I am tired of living in a "have to be thin to be somebody" world.
Other than hollywood I don't think you have to be thin to be someone. I am kinda thin (BMI 20)and I am constantly called names (biafrin, anorexic), told to eat a hamburger and people totally misjudge my strength (I am a heavy lifter and am much stronger than people think... everyone assumes I am weak!
I am all for body acceptance and I think everyone should love their body no matter their size (even though I am not happy with mine) but I hate how body acceptance trends tend to put people down like "real women have curves" (luckily I have hips so I am a "real woman" though I know plenty of lean people without curves who are women ) and that thin is gross and disgusting. That does not help the cause at all. I also hate the pro ana movement too for villianizing body fat but they are obviously seriously mentally ill
Thank you for saying this, as I have similar experiences and it really hurts my feelings. Surprise surprise, thin people have feelings too. One family member pushed me to tears with the things he said about me, and I'm constantly being bullied by my family even though I'm a normal weight.
I also hate it when people speak so cruelly of thin people, words like, "rail-thin, body like a boy, real men like curves, boys don't like bones, etc.". You know, most women who become thin do so for themselves and don't give a rats *kitten* about "boys". And what about those women who are naturally thin? They must feel awful constantly reading that...
I know there's a lot more bullying of overweight people, but the attitude people take lately is that it's okay to thin-bash because they're thin so who cares? Bullying is never okay! No matter what Don't forget: you never know what people are going through so don't say mean things because they could already be in a very bad place. Some times your "advice" could make things worse.
Really, because I can tell you that I walk into interviews with my business professional suit on with a more impressive resume than the majority of my peers and I can't tell you how many times the interview ended as soon as I walked in the room and it wasn't anything I said or did, it was my size. How many times do you see an overweight woman in a position of authority in the business world?
Not to mention how long it took me to even find a business suit in my size and how much more I had to pay for it compared to a "normal" size person.
I mean seriously, even to make someone pay extra on an airline because of their size.
You know what everyone's resumes are like? Weird.
Its not even remotely possible that somewhere, in the field of all applicants, someone might have more experience/better qualifications than you?
Also, even if all of this stuff is due solely to your weight and not anything else, why do you think it excuses the bullying of thin people? Is it some kind of twisted 'pay it forward' scenario?
Wow.
To the person that think they are being not hired because of their weight.
First off, the hiring process is NOT about who is MOST qualified.
It's a question of qualification/personality/organizational fit. Often over qualified individuals are not hired if they don't fit in terms of attitude, presentation, etc., etc. to an organization. If I am looking for an individual contributor with strong technical skills and the person coming in is much more qualified - senior manager level qualified - I will ask why is this overqualified person looking for this job, clearly not a long term fit and not waste the company time in hiring them.
Yes, there are all sorts of "discriminations" going on in the hiring process - looks, height, weight, health, smell, diction, accent, smoking, tattoos, unrelated subject knowledge, network are all part of the picture but usually minor - how long you are going to stay, history, attitude can all be red lights. I do not know of a single instance of "she's perfect for the job but she's fat so let's go with the lesser candidate" being the reality.
So, while weight might be a factor it isn't the deciding factor except in a few jobs and roles.
(...and both my current boss, her boss and my former boss are all obese women...)
Weight discrimination does exist, as do a lot of others, some legal, some not so - you can focus on these and yell "aha, discrimination!" and frankly, that comes across in an interview - we can sense attitude a mile away - or you can focus on the idea that there was someone with an overall better fit.
On a related subject, most large companies have programs that look at cost of employment and consider long term modifiable factors like work balance, fitness to employee satisfaction and costs like insurance. So while it isn't a significant part of the hiring process, you can expect comapnies to be more pressured to look at employee health as something the get more involved in.
You can choose to perceive this as an enlightened movement where employers are creating opportunities for people to get healthier and work longer in a more satisfactory work and health conidtion or you can see this as a big brother movement where employers are sticking their collective noses in a very personal area of health and life choices. I personally am all for it, as long as companies do it correctly and respectfully.
Being highly overweight has an economic cost to companies due to comorbid health issues - don't expect them to not try to influence costs where they think they can.0 -
Yes, but as a medicine student, I know what I'm talking about. They're usually kidding themselves. It puts so much strain on their organs and is extremely damaging to their joints. Yet they claim to be healthy.
This arrogance will make you a bad doctor. You are 20, so likely 2nd or 3rd year of college or, if not in the US you still have 3-6 year to be a doctor. Most good doctors know that at best they have an educated guess and that their "knowledge" base can and will be overturned time and time again.
Being slightly overweight is often a long term statistical indicator of better health than being slightly underweight. There are now many epidemiological studies that demonstrate this; it also highlights that weight isn't the only health factor.
People that have joint issues know it, they aren't usually kidding themselves, they are quite aware of the issue. Perhaps a few people are in denial but my professional experience (as a hip prosthetic designer/biomaterials researcher for 6 years in which I saw hundreds of patients) is that the overweight person with joint pain is well aware of the weight contribution to the issue. If they could wave a magic wand and magically reduce their weight they would. It's a pretty easily litmus test question.
For many people who are overweight, having a positive attitude about themselves can be an essential step to losing weight. Feel good and you might have the energy to change while negativity about the body, depression may lead some down the path of fatalism and giving up. In this sense accepting yourself, being happy may be factors of success in weight loss.
Thank you for pointing out what I was going to mention about the arrogance. As a student, it is your job to learn, not assume that you already know.
That's fair, and back in Toronto we get to practise actually being "doctors" and sitting in on/helping out with people's appointments. I've seen a few overweight people in the past few months who are fit and healthy. But the majority aren't. I've even seen a few who support fat acceptance, which in itself isn't a bad thing, but a lot of them have the mindset that if they don't like what their doctor says, they will find a new one. It's not good.
Completely off topic for which I apologise but going back to your first post you need a serious reality check. A medical student, in any country, knows nothing except how to pass exams. When you qualify you will know almost nothing. In about ten to fifteen years you might have an idea of what you are talking about but by then you will also be aware of the enormous amount you don't know. Lose the arrogance now and you might just stand a chance of understanding patients better.
Unless you are planning a career as an orthopaedic doctor in which case carry on.0 -
Like many said before, any discriminating (about weight, religion, sexuality etc) is wrong.
However, I often sense that it is tremoundously wrong to tell an overweight person it might be better for them to lose weight, but it is totally acceptable to bash on rather thin people.
If someone loves their body how it is, let them love it! It's none of your business.0 -
The people who have issues with this "movement" don't have a problem with people being happy with their bodies. The problem is when people inside the group begin discriminating against those outside the group, in this case, thin or average people being called out and bashed online and in real life. I have witnessed this happening.
I'm all for body love, whatever, but I don't think the example these "Tumblr fatspo bloggers" is in any way helpful for their cause. When was the last time you listened to or learned something positive from a man screaming on the street? I see no difference between this and ranting, disgruntled bloggers, who attack others with words. They need to figure out the right way to deliver their message without being so hateful and angry.
Now, that's just tone policing.
Conveniently enough, it's also not true.
I actually run a body positive blog (I can link it here, if anyone's interested) and I promise that it's never been used to perpetuate "thin hate" or whatever it is that people are supposedly worried about. I can't say that no-one has ever just out and out hated on thin people, but I /can/ say that's not what this movement is about.
That said, who wouldn't be angry? Who wouldn't yell? People (thin ones in particular) have been telling me my whole life "Sweetie you'd look /so good/ if you just dropped, you know, 15-20lbs." They've told me I'm not allowed to wear what I want. (Should you really wear those shorts?) They've told me I'm not allowed to eat what I want. (Maybe you should, you know, skip the bread. All those calories...) They've called me names. (Cow. Fat slut.)
We can't all be Ghandi. Sometimes, it takes anger to make things happen. The goal of fat positive and body positive bloggers is to create safe spaces online for people who have body types that don't fit mainstream beauty ideals. That means people of color, people who are fat, people with disabilities, trans* individuals, etc. These spaces NEED to exist. People need places to learn to love themselves. Society won't be providing them. There's too much money in making people hate themselves. (Too fat? Too ugly? Buy OUR product and we can make you acceptable) Because of that, we have to create them for ourselves.
And actually, people do have a problem with fat people loving themselves. I hear all kinds of horrible comments all day long about how so-and-so really needs to drop some confidence because she's "way too fat" to be as pretty as she thinks she is, or whatever. I've seen it make people genuinely angry. Hell, it used to make /me/ angry, once. When I was, y'know, in the middle of my ed.
The reason for that anger is because it's threatening. It's scary to see someone who's the embodiment of what you've been taught to believe is unloveable loving themselves. It's scary because someone isn't suffering the same fear of fat that you are. It feels unfair that they get to love themselves when you work SO HARD to be the "right" kind of body, and still have trouble.
This response is perfection. As are you.0 -
The fat acceptance movement is fine in my opinion until they start using the term "glorify obesity". That's when you've lost me.
The fat acceptance movement DOES NOT use the term "glorify obesity"!!! That is a phrase thrown at them about what people THINK they are doing.
Yes, some of them do. Look at the "glorify obesity" tag on Tumblr.0 -
for me I am of the opinion that by body is no one else's business
I should not *have* to lose weight to be treated like a human being by other people
I should not be denied healthcare or job opportunities because I'm fat
I should not be taxed for being fat
I should not be bullied for being fat
the problem is not that I am fat, the problem is that society treats fat people like crap.
and no one should judge anyone for being "too fat" or "too skinny"
I love my body, so much. and I am unapologetic for my fat. I have the right to be seen. I have the right to go out. I have the right to take up space.
I am so. much. more. than my fat
also let's not even get into the misogynistic/racist/classist implications of treating fatties as second class citizens.
It is not my job to look good, it is not my job to change my body for the aesthetic pleasure of others. I'm a person not a decoration.
http://fatgirlsshouldwear.tumblr.com0 -
The people who have issues with this "movement" don't have a problem with people being happy with their bodies. The problem is when people inside the group begin discriminating against those outside the group, in this case, thin or average people being called out and bashed online and in real life. I have witnessed this happening.
I'm all for body love, whatever, but I don't think the example these "Tumblr fatspo bloggers" is in any way helpful for their cause. When was the last time you listened to or learned something positive from a man screaming on the street? I see no difference between this and ranting, disgruntled bloggers, who attack others with words. They need to figure out the right way to deliver their message without being so hateful and angry.
Now, that's just tone policing.
Conveniently enough, it's also not true.
I actually run a body positive blog (I can link it here, if anyone's interested) and I promise that it's never been used to perpetuate "thin hate" or whatever it is that people are supposedly worried about. I can't say that no-one has ever just out and out hated on thin people, but I /can/ say that's not what this movement is about.
That said, who wouldn't be angry? Who wouldn't yell? People (thin ones in particular) have been telling me my whole life "Sweetie you'd look /so good/ if you just dropped, you know, 15-20lbs." They've told me I'm not allowed to wear what I want. (Should you really wear those shorts?) They've told me I'm not allowed to eat what I want. (Maybe you should, you know, skip the bread. All those calories...) They've called me names. (Cow. Fat slut.)
We can't all be Ghandi. Sometimes, it takes anger to make things happen. The goal of fat positive and body positive bloggers is to create safe spaces online for people who have body types that don't fit mainstream beauty ideals. That means people of color, people who are fat, people with disabilities, trans* individuals, etc. These spaces NEED to exist. People need places to learn to love themselves. Society won't be providing them. There's too much money in making people hate themselves. (Too fat? Too ugly? Buy OUR product and we can make you acceptable) Because of that, we have to create them for ourselves.
And actually, people do have a problem with fat people loving themselves. I hear all kinds of horrible comments all day long about how so-and-so really needs to drop some confidence because she's "way too fat" to be as pretty as she thinks she is, or whatever. I've seen it make people genuinely angry. Hell, it used to make /me/ angry, once. When I was, y'know, in the middle of my ed.
The reason for that anger is because it's threatening. It's scary to see someone who's the embodiment of what you've been taught to believe is unloveable loving themselves. It's scary because someone isn't suffering the same fear of fat that you are. It feels unfair that they get to love themselves when you work SO HARD to be the "right" kind of body, and still have trouble.
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I'm entitled to love myself despite the fact that I may never be perfectly thin. I'm allowed to love myself WITH my fat, rather than "in spite" of it. That will never be anyone's business but my own.
And anyway, being fat will never make anyone any less of a person. Being unhealthy (and these things should always be considered separately) will never make anyone any less of a person. What does make you more/less better/worse is how you treat people.
*claps*0 -
The people who have issues with this "movement" don't have a problem with people being happy with their bodies. The problem is when people inside the group begin discriminating against those outside the group, in this case, thin or average people being called out and bashed online and in real life. I have witnessed this happening.
I'm all for body love, whatever, but I don't think the example these "Tumblr fatspo bloggers" is in any way helpful for their cause. When was the last time you listened to or learned something positive from a man screaming on the street? I see no difference between this and ranting, disgruntled bloggers, who attack others with words. They need to figure out the right way to deliver their message without being so hateful and angry.
Now, that's just tone policing.
Conveniently enough, it's also not true.
I actually run a body positive blog (I can link it here, if anyone's interested) and I promise that it's never been used to perpetuate "thin hate" or whatever it is that people are supposedly worried about. I can't say that no-one has ever just out and out hated on thin people, but I /can/ say that's not what this movement is about.
That said, who wouldn't be angry? Who wouldn't yell? People (thin ones in particular) have been telling me my whole life "Sweetie you'd look /so good/ if you just dropped, you know, 15-20lbs." They've told me I'm not allowed to wear what I want. (Should you really wear those shorts?) They've told me I'm not allowed to eat what I want. (Maybe you should, you know, skip the bread. All those calories...) They've called me names. (Cow. Fat slut.)
We can't all be Ghandi. Sometimes, it takes anger to make things happen. The goal of fat positive and body positive bloggers is to create safe spaces online for people who have body types that don't fit mainstream beauty ideals. That means people of color, people who are fat, people with disabilities, trans* individuals, etc. These spaces NEED to exist. People need places to learn to love themselves. Society won't be providing them. There's too much money in making people hate themselves. (Too fat? Too ugly? Buy OUR product and we can make you acceptable) Because of that, we have to create them for ourselves.
And actually, people do have a problem with fat people loving themselves. I hear all kinds of horrible comments all day long about how so-and-so really needs to drop some confidence because she's "way too fat" to be as pretty as she thinks she is, or whatever. I've seen it make people genuinely angry. Hell, it used to make /me/ angry, once. When I was, y'know, in the middle of my ed.
The reason for that anger is because it's threatening. It's scary to see someone who's the embodiment of what you've been taught to believe is unloveable loving themselves. It's scary because someone isn't suffering the same fear of fat that you are. It feels unfair that they get to love themselves when you work SO HARD to be the "right" kind of body, and still have trouble.
I'm curious as to your comparison of "people who are fat" to "people of color" and "people with disabilities, trans* individuals, etc.". Do you see these as equivalences? For many, being fat isn't something that you are born with but the personal process of what you put in your mouth (with some genetics thrown in) and not really the same as the rest.
IMHO, it is likely that some of the dislike of the FP movement is the intrinsic fatalism that is perceived.
As to "people having a problem with fat people loving themselves" - again, in my opinion, perhaps a few do, most of us don't care. I don't care if you are fat or skinny or whatever as long as it does not impact my life - I will not necessarily invite someone on trip, a day out or a dinner depending on whether I consider the context/person appropriate or whether I want to change and modify my own practice - my daughter might not get invited on a high alt. climb, my vegetarian friend might not get invited to try out the new burger restaurant, or I might end up making concessions. But what you think of yourself? I don't care.
If it's positive, so much the better. If you are my child, I hope you love yourself despite "a weight". And so perhaps the issue isn't fat acceptance but self-love. If you are still focusing on self-love and fat inspiration you haven't reached the point were you just love yourself; it seems that you are focusing on this despite the weight, especially when it is placed as an opposing context to being a different body.
There is a kumbaya elightenement moment in there somewhere. Love yourself. Full stop.0 -
Fat poses so many health risks and people who claim to be happy how they are make me ANGRY!!!!! It's nothing to do with looks it's about your health! You will live a far more fulfilling life at a healthy weight.
You won't require a seatbelt extension on the plane. You won't be too big for the rides at the theme park. You can shop in normal stores. You have energy and good health. How much happier would you be?!!!
That's total BS at 291, my bloodwork, vitals, sodium, sugar, all excellent. My doctor was baffled how I could be so healthy and so fat. so this notion that you can not be healthy and fat is total bull ****.0 -
The fat acceptance movement is fine in my opinion until they start using the term "glorify obesity". That's when you've lost me.
The fat acceptance movement DOES NOT use the term "glorify obesity"!!! That is a phrase thrown at them about what people THINK they are doing.
If they are bashing thin people and saying that they "love their beautiful fat bodies" then it's glorifying obesity. Case closed.
HOW DARE THEY LOVE & SEE BEAUTY IN THEIR FAT BODIES HOW DARE THEY!!!!!
YOU see their bodies as not beautiful or acceptable YOU see their bodies as something to be hidden , something to be ashamed of YOU see their love for their bodies as something wrong...because how dare someone love something you think is disgusting/ugly/gross/unhealthy how dare they be okay with themselves
think about how sad it is that it bothers you so much that someone can love themselves no matter what size...it bothers you soo much you cannot stand the thought of fat bodies being seen as acceptable, beautiful & deserving of respect .eh?
that is really reallllly sad
THIS!!!0 -
The fat acceptance movement is fine in my opinion until they start using the term "glorify obesity". That's when you've lost me.
The fat acceptance movement DOES NOT use the term "glorify obesity"!!! That is a phrase thrown at them about what people THINK they are doing.
If they are bashing thin people and saying that they "love their beautiful fat bodies" then it's glorifying obesity. Case closed.
HOW DARE THEY LOVE & SEE BEAUTY IN THEIR FAT BODIES HOW DARE THEY!!!!!
YOU see their bodies as not beautiful or acceptable YOU see their bodies as something to be hidden , something to be ashamed of YOU see their love for their bodies as something wrong...because how dare someone love something you think is disgusting/ugly/gross/unhealthy how dare they be okay with themselves
think about how sad it is that it bothers you so much that someone can love themselves no matter what size...it bothers you soo much you cannot stand the thought of fat bodies being seen as acceptable, beautiful & deserving of respect .eh?
that is really reallllly sad
THIS!!!
+10 -
Fat poses so many health risks and people who claim to be happy how they are make me ANGRY!!!!! It's nothing to do with looks it's about your health! You will live a far more fulfilling life at a healthy weight.
You won't require a seatbelt extension on the plane. You won't be too big for the rides at the theme park. You can shop in normal stores. You have energy and good health. How much happier would you be?!!!
That's total BS at 291, my bloodwork, vitals, sodium, sugar, all excellent. My doctor was baffled how I could be so healthy and so fat. so this notion that you can not be healthy and fat is total bull ****.
I agree with this. I have no issues. Never had high blood pressure, never had any health issues due to my weight. God forbid I be HAPPY with myself even if I can't fit into a size 6.
Am I getting healthier and losing weight? Yes. But it is because there are things that I...note I...want to do in MY...note MY life that I can't do because I have no energy and because of my weight. BUT this is my journey. I have no right to look down in disdain at another person because of their body size.0 -
Fat poses so many health risks and people who claim to be happy how they are make me ANGRY!!!!! It's nothing to do with looks it's about your health! You will live a far more fulfilling life at a healthy weight.
You won't require a seatbelt extension on the plane. You won't be too big for the rides at the theme park. You can shop in normal stores. You have energy and good health. How much happier would you be?!!!
That's total BS at 291, my bloodwork, vitals, sodium, sugar, all excellent. My doctor was baffled how I could be so healthy and so fat. so this notion that you can not be healthy and fat is total bull ****.
Congrats on your biomarkers, however, you probably recognize that this weight affects your ability to do things and it is intrinsically healthier to be at a lower weight.
So while I'm not the person suggesting that you'd be happier (you might not be - I don't link happier with weight) you would be more fit and perhaps healthier.0 -
And to be honest, I am tired of living in a "have to be thin to be somebody" world.
Other than hollywood I don't think you have to be thin to be someone. I am kinda thin (BMI 20)and I am constantly called names (biafrin, anorexic), told to eat a hamburger and people totally misjudge my strength (I am a heavy lifter and am much stronger than people think... everyone assumes I am weak!
I am all for body acceptance and I think everyone should love their body no matter their size (even though I am not happy with mine) but I hate how body acceptance trends tend to put people down like "real women have curves" (luckily I have hips so I am a "real woman" though I know plenty of lean people without curves who are women ) and that thin is gross and disgusting. That does not help the cause at all. I also hate the pro ana movement too for villianizing body fat but they are obviously seriously mentally ill
Thank you for saying this, as I have similar experiences and it really hurts my feelings. Surprise surprise, thin people have feelings too. One family member pushed me to tears with the things he said about me, and I'm constantly being bullied by my family even though I'm a normal weight.
I also hate it when people speak so cruelly of thin people, words like, "rail-thin, body like a boy, real men like curves, boys don't like bones, etc.". You know, most women who become thin do so for themselves and don't give a rats *kitten* about "boys". And what about those women who are naturally thin? They must feel awful constantly reading that...
I know there's a lot more bullying of overweight people, but the attitude people take lately is that it's okay to thin-bash because they're thin so who cares? Bullying is never okay! No matter what Don't forget: you never know what people are going through so don't say mean things because they could already be in a very bad place. Some times your "advice" could make things worse.
Really, because I can tell you that I walk into interviews with my business professional suit on with a more impressive resume than the majority of my peers and I can't tell you how many times the interview ended as soon as I walked in the room and it wasn't anything I said or did, it was my size. How many times do you see an overweight woman in a position of authority in the business world?
Not to mention how long it took me to even find a business suit in my size and how much more I had to pay for it compared to a "normal" size person.
I mean seriously, even to make someone pay extra on an airline because of their size.
You know what everyone's resumes are like? Weird.
Its not even remotely possible that somewhere, in the field of all applicants, someone might have more experience/better qualifications than you?
Also, even if all of this stuff is due solely to your weight and not anything else, why do you think it excuses the bullying of thin people? Is it some kind of twisted 'pay it forward' scenario?
Wow.
To the person that think they are being not hired because of their weight.
First off, the hiring process is NOT about who is MOST qualified.
It's a question of qualification/personality/organizational fit. Often over qualified individuals are not hired if they don't fit in terms of attitude, presentation, etc., etc. to an organization. If I am looking for an individual contributor with strong technical skills and the person coming in is much more qualified - senior manager level qualified - I will ask why is this overqualified person looking for this job, clearly not a long term fit and not waste the company time in hiring them.
Yes, there are all sorts of "discriminations" going on in the hiring process - looks, height, weight, health, smell, diction, accent, smoking, tattoos, unrelated subject knowledge, network are all part of the picture but usually minor - how long you are going to stay, history, attitude can all be red lights. I do not know of a single instance of "she's perfect for the job but she's fat so let's go with the lesser candidate" being the reality.
So, while weight might be a factor it isn't the deciding factor except in a few jobs and roles.
(...and both my current boss, her boss and my former boss are all obese women...)
Weight discrimination does exist, as do a lot of others, some legal, some not so - you can focus on these and yell "aha, discrimination!" and frankly, that comes across in an interview - we can sense attitude a mile away - or you can focus on the idea that there was someone with an overall better fit.
On a related subject, most large companies have programs that look at cost of employment and consider long term modifiable factors like work balance, fitness to employee satisfaction and costs like insurance. So while it isn't a significant part of the hiring process, you can expect comapnies to be more pressured to look at employee health as something the get more involved in.
You can choose to perceive this as an enlightened movement where employers are creating opportunities for people to get healthier and work longer in a more satisfactory work and health conidtion or you can see this as a big brother movement where employers are sticking their collective noses in a very personal area of health and life choices. I personally am all for it, as long as companies do it correctly and respectfully.
Being highly overweight has an economic cost to companies due to comorbid health issues - don't expect them to not try to influence costs where they think they can.
+10
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