Fat Positivity?
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The people who have issues with this "movement" don't have a problem with people being happy with their bodies. The problem is when people inside the group begin discriminating against those outside the group, in this case, thin or average people being called out and bashed online and in real life. I have witnessed this happening.
I'm all for body love, whatever, but I don't think the example these "Tumblr fatspo bloggers" is in any way helpful for their cause. When was the last time you listened to or learned something positive from a man screaming on the street? I see no difference between this and ranting, disgruntled bloggers, who attack others with words. They need to figure out the right way to deliver their message without being so hateful and angry.
Now, that's just tone policing.
Conveniently enough, it's also not true.
I actually run a body positive blog (I can link it here, if anyone's interested) and I promise that it's never been used to perpetuate "thin hate" or whatever it is that people are supposedly worried about. I can't say that no-one has ever just out and out hated on thin people, but I /can/ say that's not what this movement is about.
That said, who wouldn't be angry? Who wouldn't yell? People (thin ones in particular) have been telling me my whole life "Sweetie you'd look /so good/ if you just dropped, you know, 15-20lbs." They've told me I'm not allowed to wear what I want. (Should you really wear those shorts?) They've told me I'm not allowed to eat what I want. (Maybe you should, you know, skip the bread. All those calories...) They've called me names. (Cow. Fat slut.)
We can't all be Ghandi. Sometimes, it takes anger to make things happen. The goal of fat positive and body positive bloggers is to create safe spaces online for people who have body types that don't fit mainstream beauty ideals. That means people of color, people who are fat, people with disabilities, trans* individuals, etc. These spaces NEED to exist. People need places to learn to love themselves. Society won't be providing them. There's too much money in making people hate themselves. (Too fat? Too ugly? Buy OUR product and we can make you acceptable) Because of that, we have to create them for ourselves.
And actually, people do have a problem with fat people loving themselves. I hear all kinds of horrible comments all day long about how so-and-so really needs to drop some confidence because she's "way too fat" to be as pretty as she thinks she is, or whatever. I've seen it make people genuinely angry. Hell, it used to make /me/ angry, once. When I was, y'know, in the middle of my ed.
The reason for that anger is because it's threatening. It's scary to see someone who's the embodiment of what you've been taught to believe is unloveable loving themselves. It's scary because someone isn't suffering the same fear of fat that you are. It feels unfair that they get to love themselves when you work SO HARD to be the "right" kind of body, and still have trouble.
Yes, but many of them aren't doing as well as they think they are. Nobody was destined to be 300 lbs.0 -
The stories in this thread about overweight people who got slammed or insulted over their weight is truly sad. When I was in school, my best friend and her mother was overweight and they got slammed unmercifully. This happened throughout school. It happened in our neighborhood, at the malls, movies, and restaurants. It was a never ending cycle of snickering, whispering, slur tossing, and outright disrespect. Those experiences have left a very bad taste in my mouth. I am at a total loss for words when it comes to parents who do it to their children. Some people are so miserable in their lives they just have to project the vile onto other people including their children. It doesn't matter how good someone looks on the outside they are still ugly as hell on the inside if they image slam other people, under or overweight. Dingbats!0
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The people who have issues with this "movement" don't have a problem with people being happy with their bodies. The problem is when people inside the group begin discriminating against those outside the group, in this case, thin or average people being called out and bashed online and in real life. I have witnessed this happening.
I'm all for body love, whatever, but I don't think the example these "Tumblr fatspo bloggers" is in any way helpful for their cause. When was the last time you listened to or learned something positive from a man screaming on the street? I see no difference between this and ranting, disgruntled bloggers, who attack others with words. They need to figure out the right way to deliver their message without being so hateful and angry.
Now, that's just tone policing.
Conveniently enough, it's also not true.
I actually run a body positive blog (I can link it here, if anyone's interested) and I promise that it's never been used to perpetuate "thin hate" or whatever it is that people are supposedly worried about. I can't say that no-one has ever just out and out hated on thin people, but I /can/ say that's not what this movement is about.
That said, who wouldn't be angry? Who wouldn't yell? People (thin ones in particular) have been telling me my whole life "Sweetie you'd look /so good/ if you just dropped, you know, 15-20lbs." They've told me I'm not allowed to wear what I want. (Should you really wear those shorts?) They've told me I'm not allowed to eat what I want. (Maybe you should, you know, skip the bread. All those calories...) They've called me names. (Cow. Fat slut.)
We can't all be Ghandi. Sometimes, it takes anger to make things happen. The goal of fat positive and body positive bloggers is to create safe spaces online for people who have body types that don't fit mainstream beauty ideals. That means people of color, people who are fat, people with disabilities, trans* individuals, etc. These spaces NEED to exist. People need places to learn to love themselves. Society won't be providing them. There's too much money in making people hate themselves. (Too fat? Too ugly? Buy OUR product and we can make you acceptable) Because of that, we have to create them for ourselves.
And actually, people do have a problem with fat people loving themselves. I hear all kinds of horrible comments all day long about how so-and-so really needs to drop some confidence because she's "way too fat" to be as pretty as she thinks she is, or whatever. I've seen it make people genuinely angry. Hell, it used to make /me/ angry, once. When I was, y'know, in the middle of my ed.
The reason for that anger is because it's threatening. It's scary to see someone who's the embodiment of what you've been taught to believe is unloveable loving themselves. It's scary because someone isn't suffering the same fear of fat that you are. It feels unfair that they get to love themselves when you work SO HARD to be the "right" kind of body, and still have trouble.
that response was perfect omfg
My reaction as well.
Everything that you said was on point, but especially the bolded part.
100% agree. I used to obsess about being 'thin' and never gave a thought about my health. I tried all sorts of crash diets, and one of the ones that worked, made me sick.
It wasn't until I read a few articles of plus-sized models that I changed my thought process. These women worked out, ate healthy, and were beautiful and comfortable in their own skin. They were healthy, and not a size 2. It took 'fat positivity' for me to finally realize a few things:
*The old me had the mindset of 'it has to work, and it has to work fast'. I would crash and become discouraged, because if I wasn't dropping weight and dress sizes ridiculously quickly, then it wasn't working at all. I needed to have some 'fat positivity' in my life to accept that the process is a long one, and requires an entire lifestyle overhaul. I'm 24 lbs into a 52lb journey, and I have to be comfortable and positive with myself through the entirety of the process.
*I can't spend my life feeling like s*** if I don't get to the size I want to be. I'd love to be a size 6, but if 10-12 is all that my body will let me be, I can't mentally put myself down for that anymore.
*Nobody gains anything from putting someone down, even if it is out of concern for their 'health'. Telling someone who wants to own what they have that they are foolish is basically bullying. Nobody benefits from negative judgement.0 -
The fat acceptance movement is fine in my opinion until they start using the term "glorify obesity". That's when you've lost me.
The fat acceptance movement DOES NOT use the term "glorify obesity"!!! That is a phrase thrown at them about what people THINK they are doing.
If they are bashing thin people and saying that they "love their beautiful fat bodies" then it's glorifying obesity. Case closed.0 -
Aha, I found the link to this study's abstract about the impact of body acceptance on health: http://www.journals.elsevierhealth.com/periodicals/yjada/article/S0002-8223(05)00322-6/abstract
Here is what the abstract says:
Abstract
Objective
Examine a model that encourages health at every size as opposed to weight loss. The health at every size concept supports homeostatic regulation and eating intuitively (ie, in response to internal cues of hunger, satiety, and appetite).
Design
Six-month, randomized clinical trial; 2-year follow-up.
Subjects
White, obese, female chronic dieters, aged 30 to 45 years (N=78).
Setting
Free-living, general community.
Interventions
Six months of weekly group intervention (health at every size program or diet program), followed by 6 months of monthly aftercare group support.
Main outcome measures
Anthropometry (weight, body mass index), metabolic fitness (blood pressure, blood lipids), energy expenditure, eating behavior (restraint, eating disorder pathology), and psychology (self-esteem, depression, body image). Attrition, attendance, and participant evaluations of treatment helpfulness were also monitored.
Statistical analysis performed
Analysis of variance.
Results
Cognitive restraint decreased in the health at every size group and increased in the diet group, indicating that both groups implemented their programs. Attrition (6 months) was high in the diet group (41%), compared with 8% in the health at every size group. Fifty percent of both groups returned for 2-year evaluation. Health at every size group members maintained weight, improved in all outcome variables, and sustained improvements. Diet group participants lost weight and showed initial improvement in many variables at 1 year; weight was regained and little improvement was sustained.
Conclusions
The health at every size approach enabled participants to maintain long-term behavior change; the diet approach did not. Encouraging size acceptance, reduction in dieting behavior, and heightened awareness and response to body signals resulted in improved health risk indicators for obese women.
TL;DR size acceptance helps lose weight and sustain long term healthy behaviors.0 -
Car analogies aren't the best. A Ferrari with a bad fuel line would be less efficient than a '71 Pinto in excellent shape. What's the point? Cars don't have genetics.My body is like a brand new Ferrari 458. I absolutely love it and I need to take care of it. My "Ferrari" has to last me until I die. I don't want my "Ferrari" to turn into a "1971 Ford Pinto" by the time I am 45.
But still need to take care of oneself regardless of what shape one is in. Those that have it worse need to pay more attention.
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Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition0 -
The fat acceptance movement is fine in my opinion until they start using the term "glorify obesity". That's when you've lost me.
The fat acceptance movement DOES NOT use the term "glorify obesity"!!! That is a phrase thrown at them about what people THINK they are doing.
If they are bashing thin people and saying that they "love their beautiful fat bodies" then it's glorifying obesity. Case closed.
You just proved my damn point. I'm so done with this thread. A bunch of you are former fatties I'm sure, or you're choosing to do the same thing society tells fat people to do (lose weight) and you want to make other fatties feel like *kitten* for loving their bodies when in actuality it HELPS SO MUCH SO MUCH SO MUCH to LOVE YOURSELF and CARE ABOUT YOURSELF--which includes diet and exercise!!!
I hated myself pretty much my whole life because of my fat. Once I felt accepted in my body by people who could understand this, I felt positive about my life's outcome. Social acceptance is so important and I don't understand why everyone are being d!cks about it.
Just let people do what they WAAAAAAAAAAANTTTTTTT!0 -
My body is like a brand new Ferrari 458. I absolutely love it and I need to take care of it. My "Ferrari" has to last me until I die. I don't want my "Ferrari" to turn into a "1971 Ford Pinto" by the time I am 45.
What's wrong with a '71 Pinto?
Everything in the world. :laugh:0 -
Car analogies aren't the best. A Ferrari with a bad fuel line would be less efficient than a '71 Pinto in excellent shape. What's the point? Cars don't have genetics.My body is like a brand new Ferrari 458. I absolutely love it and I need to take care of it. My "Ferrari" has to last me until I die. I don't want my "Ferrari" to turn into a "1971 Ford Pinto" by the time I am 45.
But still need to take care of oneself regardless of what shape one is in. Those that have it worse need to pay more attention.
A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
A '71 Pinto in excellent shape can still blow up and kill you after 4 miles. A bad fuel line in a Ferrari can be replaced. :laugh:0 -
The fat acceptance movement is fine in my opinion until they start using the term "glorify obesity". That's when you've lost me.
The fat acceptance movement DOES NOT use the term "glorify obesity"!!! That is a phrase thrown at them about what people THINK they are doing.
If they are bashing thin people and saying that they "love their beautiful fat bodies" then it's glorifying obesity. Case closed.
please for the love of medicine educate yourself about the extant studies on bodyweight set points, the differences in diet between fat people and thin people, what metabolism is, and the value of shame and stigmatization in "helping" people lose weight, health outcomes for people who are underweight, average/normal weight, overweight, and obese.
honestly you don't understand what fat people are talking about when they say they love their bodies. in this case, the love is the opposite of the shame that society heaps upon fat people.is that clear? it's really important: loving our fat bodies is rejecting the destructive shame that society tries to force on us. fat acceptance advocates are about *accepting* your body, not about promoting one type of body over the other. and as many community members are telling you in this thread, fat people have bodies that are capable of lots of the same things thin bodies and that is something to be celebrated when your existence is mocked constantly.
and i'll tell you another thing: weight shame comes from the diet industries and people who want to put someone down to make themselves feel better.
please try to use this thread to gain compassion, cultivate empathy, and appreciate nuance.0 -
The fat acceptance movement is fine in my opinion until they start using the term "glorify obesity". That's when you've lost me.
The fat acceptance movement DOES NOT use the term "glorify obesity"!!! That is a phrase thrown at them about what people THINK they are doing.
If they are bashing thin people and saying that they "love their beautiful fat bodies" then it's glorifying obesity. Case closed.
HOW DARE THEY LOVE & SEE BEAUTY IN THEIR FAT BODIES HOW DARE THEY!!!!!
YOU see their bodies as not beautiful or acceptable YOU see their bodies as something to be hidden , something to be ashamed of YOU see their love for their bodies as something wrong...because how dare someone love something you think is disgusting/ugly/gross/unhealthy how dare they be okay with themselves
think about how sad it is that it bothers you so much that someone can love themselves no matter what size...it bothers you soo much you cannot stand the thought of fat bodies being seen as acceptable, beautiful & deserving of respect .eh?
that is really reallllly sad0 -
The fat acceptance movement DOES NOT use the term "glorify obesity"!!! That is a phrase thrown at them about what people THINK they are doing.
If they are bashing thin people and saying that they "love their beautiful fat bodies" then it's glorifying obesity. Case closed.
I seriously feel sorry for any overweight person who ends up with you as their doctor (or nurse, or whatever it is you're studying to be).
Loving your body in any state that it's in is NOT glorifying that state. Loving yourself is so much more healthy than hating yourself, no matter what your size is.
The majority of people who support HAES/fat acceptance DO NOT hate on people with other body sizes. Much in the same way that most thin/average weight people DO NOT hate on fat people... though I would say the hatred/lack of respect towards people who are overweight VASTLY outnumbers any negativity toward thin/average size people.0 -
Nothing wrong with loving your body. Hell, I had to learn to love mine before I could even think about trying to lose weight. Have you ever tried cutting calories while you shudder every time you look in the mirror? Not only are you hungry, but it's hard to see the point in even trying to lose pounds when all you can think about is how ugly you look with those love handles and back fat. In my experience, it's much easier to press on when you are thinking: "Man, I am looking cute today! All curvy and *kitten*...I can't wait until I can look even better in my swimsuit in a couple months!"
Of course, when you start bashing skinny people, that's not good. But I think that is just a response from all the negativity overweight people get from others. Kind of like how bullies act out because they're actually being bullied at home...Just my thoughts anyway.0 -
I generally have a hard time with the 'fat acceptance' movement. I mean, I don't think being an *kitten* to overweight people is ok, but I have a hard time believing anyone who is so desperately screaming "I am happy!!! I DEMAND YOU RECOGNIZE MY HAPPINESS!!!!!" It always comes off kind of angry and weird and...something else I can't put my finger on.0
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I get it. It's hard to be fat. No one gives a **** about your character, they only care about your size. This is just people's way of fighting back. Do I think that it's okay to hate thin people? No, but everyone has their own journey that leads them to where they are. And to be honest, I am tired of living in a "have to be thin to be somebody" world.0
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And to be honest, I am tired of living in a "have to be thin to be somebody" world.
Other than hollywood I don't think you have to be thin to be someone. I am kinda thin (BMI 20)and I am constantly called names (biafrin, anorexic), told to eat a hamburger and people totally misjudge my strength (I am a heavy lifter and am much stronger than people think... everyone assumes I am weak!
I am all for body acceptance and I think everyone should love their body no matter their size (even though I am not happy with mine) but I hate how body acceptance trends tend to put people down like "real women have curves" (luckily I have hips so I am a "real woman" though I know plenty of lean people without curves who are women ) and that thin is gross and disgusting. That does not help the cause at all. I also hate the pro ana movement too for villianizing body fat but they are obviously seriously mentally ill0 -
And to be honest, I am tired of living in a "have to be thin to be somebody" world.
Other than hollywood I don't think you have to be thin to be someone. I am kinda thin (BMI 20)and I am constantly called names (biafrin, anorexic), told to eat a hamburger and people totally misjudge my strength (I am a heavy lifter and am much stronger than people think... everyone assumes I am weak!
I am all for body acceptance and I think everyone should love their body no matter their size (even though I am not happy with mine) but I hate how body acceptance trends tend to put people down like "real women have curves" (luckily I have hips so I am a "real woman" though I know plenty of lean people without curves who are women ) and that thin is gross and disgusting. That does not help the cause at all. I also hate the pro ana movement too for villianizing body fat but they are obviously seriously mentally ill
Thank you for saying this, as I have similar experiences and it really hurts my feelings. Surprise surprise, thin people have feelings too. One family member pushed me to tears with the things he said about me, and I'm constantly being bullied by my family even though I'm a normal weight.
I also hate it when people speak so cruelly of thin people, words like, "rail-thin, body like a boy, real men like curves, boys don't like bones, etc.". You know, most women who become thin do so for themselves and don't give a rats *kitten* about "boys". And what about those women who are naturally thin? They must feel awful constantly reading that...
I know there's a lot more bullying of overweight people, but the attitude people take lately is that it's okay to thin-bash because they're thin so who cares? Bullying is never okay! No matter what
Don't forget: you never know what people are going through so don't say mean things because they could already be in a very bad place. Some times your "advice" could make things worse. 0 -
The thin bashing in this thread is appalling.0
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So much raging against strangers' thoughts that almost certainly don't even exist.
Here's something to consider: random people care far less about every single one of you (regardless of size) than you think they do. I know that realization probably scares some of you, but it's the truth.
But if this is the boogeyman you need to get through your day, then who am I to point out that he doesn't exist?0 -
So much raging against strangers' thoughts that almost certainly don't even exist.
Here's something to consider: random people care far less about every single one of you (regardless of size) than you think they do. I know that realization probably scares some of you, but it's the truth.
But if this is the boogeyman you need to get through your day, then who am I to point out that he doesn't exist?
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