Sugar and processed food good or bad?

LolBroScience

One week worth of cheesecake isn't going to turn you into a diabetic or give you high triglycerides. It happens over many years. Sure, you may be fine now, but that's not to say you'll be fine in 10-15 years.

1/6 of Sara Lee NY style cheesecake: 490 calories, 30 g fat, 48 g carbs, 32 g sugar. A slice of original cheesecake from The Cheesecake Factory: 710 calories, 48 g fat, 62 g carbs, 36 g sugar. Full of fat and full of sugar. If you don't see what's wrong with that, I suggest taking a nutrition course. I'd much rather eat an avocado or pistachios that actually have nutritional benefits.

Unfortunately you base this off of your caloric needs and your goals. What if someone requires 5,000 calories or so in order to just maintain their weight? Is it just as bad?

Didn't Martin Berkham aka leangains, write many blog posts about his copious amounts of cheesecake consumption? He also kept at ~5% body fat year round...............so that proves cheesecake is not fattening lol.

He did. She will continue to keep overlooking my logical posts in reference to context of goals and moderation as well.... Selective reading ftw.

lindsey1979

I admit that I havent followed the entire thread, so I cannot be sure that she wasnt bandying her education about to prove her knowledge, but it is pretty ****ty to divert into ad hominems.

Attack the argument. I KNOW most of you are capable of that.

However, Berkley is known for producing hippies, so shame on you, lindsey.

Hippie connection seems to be changing. When I was an undergrad, you know what the largest campus group was? The campus Republican group -- not kidding.

JessG11

OP you sneaky little bugger you! You created all this madness on purpose didn't you?!

QueenBishOTUniverse

Eh. She's using her degree as evidence of her knowledge and understanding in this thread.

:laugh:

Look, I've taught those undergrad classes. I had a 5th year pre-med student (who had already been accepted in to a med school *shudders*) in a functional morphology class shocked to learn that the muscles we were studying were the same things she was eating in her hamburger. Having a degree doesn't necessarily mean you actually know jack.

Furthermore, it's the damn internet, people can lay claim to whatever degrees and qualifications they want, so when someone says, I know because blah blah blah, that's absolutely worthless in my book. (not that I haven't used it myself when someone is pissing me off, but we all have our failings)

Strokingdiction

I just believe that you'll get to your nutrient intake with less empty calories and unnecessary, potentially harmfully additives opting for "better ingredients" in home cooked meals than with a bunch of highly processed foods -- at least as a general rule.

Now this all came from the MFP Databases...

Delmonte Canned Green Beans
Calories 20
Sodium 10
Potassium 95
Carbs 4
Fiber 2
Sugars 2
Protein 1

Fresh Green Beans
Calories 17
Sodium 4
Potassium 115
Carbs 4
Fiber 2
Sugar 2
Protein 1

Honestly, not much difference.

But, do most processed foods contain just the fruit/vegetable, salt and water? I think it is likely a significant outlier.

nope, not an outlier.

Abstract: The first of a two-part review of the recent and classical literature reveals that loss of nutrients in fresh products during storage and cooking may be more substantial than commonly perceived. Depending on the commodity, freezing and canning processes may preserve nutrient value

Rickman JC, Barrett DM, and Bruhn CM (2007). Nutritional comparison of fresh, frozen and canned fruits and vegetables. Part I. Vitamins C and B and phenolic compounds. Journal of the Science of Food and Agriculture, 87, 930-944.

Rickman JC, Barrett DM, and Bruhn CM (2007). Nutritional comparison of fresh, frozen and canned fruits and vegetables. Part II. Vitamin A and carotenoids, vitamin E, minerals and fiber. Journal of the Science of Food and Agriculture, 87, 1185-1196.

Agreed. I think people need to do a bit more research about processed foods, particularly fruit and veggies, if they think this is an outlier. I regularly purchase store brand frozen veggies (Wegmans). They have a "rainbow blend" of green beans, red bell peppers, yellow carrots, and orange carrots. The ingredient list per the package: "Green beans, orange carrots, yellow carrots, red bell pepper." That's it. Straight up frozen veggies, no additives or preservatives. Costs $0.99 a package. I couldn't purchase those fresh veggies for that price, nor do they even carry yellow carrots in the store. Takes a few minutes to heat and serve. We rarely eat out, but even cooking at home I don't have time to cut up all those veggies and steam them in the evenings. Removing those extra steps is often the difference between having veggies with dinner or not in our house. So I do agree that canned/frozen foods can be a healthy choice and can also help people enjoy a variety of fruits and veggies they would not otherwise be able to find fresh where they live or even know how to prepare if they did have access to them.

I agree with you on the frozen veggies in particular. Canned I'm not so sure about -- I'd have to look into it more. It was my understanding that a lot of canned veggies and fruits had extra additives and often sugar (especially fruits) -- but I may be very off on this.

But, the original statement went beyond just canned veggies and fruits -- to processed frozen dinners (which I do believe have a lot of additives), processed foods (ditto) and eating at restaurants (additives -- maybe, maybe not depending on where you are -- but often extremely large portions if you find a place that doesn't use the additives) versus just making home-cooked meals with better nutrient values.

I can veggies at home. The only difference from freezing is added salt, acid, and longer cook time.

This has been my experience with home canning as well. It has added flavor as well. Well not so much added flavor but better flavor.

Fullsterkur_woman

I admit that I havent followed the entire thread, so I cannot be sure that she wasnt bandying her education about to prove her knowledge, but it is pretty ****ty to divert into ad hominems.

Attack the argument. I KNOW most of you are capable of that.

However, Berkley is known for producing hippies, so shame on you, lindsey.

Yes, shame on you, you dirty, dirty hippie! :smokin: :laugh: That's the only ad hominem I think I've resorted to... except I almost said someone else on another thread "shouldn't be a grade-a *kitten*" but then I remembered the rules about name calling and rephrased it.

Locavore, organic, free-range kale is a fine way to get nutrients. I just so happen to think that canned three bean salad and/or Splenda-sweetened fruit cocktail is too.

geebusuk

Newsflash: You think everyone's wrong unless they agree with you.

Maybe you should pave the way by coming up with citations to support your claims?

wheird

I admit that I havent followed the entire thread, so I cannot be sure that she wasnt bandying her education about to prove her knowledge, but it is pretty ****ty to divert into ad hominems.

Attack the argument. I KNOW most of you are capable of that.

However, Berkley is known for producing hippies, so shame on you, lindsey.

Hippie connection seems to be changing. When I was an undergrad, you know what the largest campus group was? The campus Republican group -- not kidding.

It was a liberal sleeper cell.

LolBroScience

Newsflash: You think everyone's wrong unless they agree with you.

Maybe you should pave the way by coming up with citations to support your claims?

nah, it's easier to be the person from the back of the room who is a just a cheerleader.

Fullsterkur_woman

I had a 5th year pre-med student (who had already been accepted in to a med school *shudders*) in a functional morphology class shocked to learn that the muscles we were studying were the same things she was eating in her hamburger.

No. Nonononono. I refuse to believe this. Where did I put that gasoline and book of matches?!

QueenBishOTUniverse

I had a 5th year pre-med student (who had already been accepted in to a med school *shudders*) in a functional morphology class shocked to learn that the muscles we were studying were the same things she was eating in her hamburger.

No. Nonononono. I refuse to believe this. Where did I put that gasoline and book of matches?!

To be fair, we were in Los Angeles at the time....

lindsey1979

I admit that I havent followed the entire thread, so I cannot be sure that she wasnt bandying her education about to prove her knowledge, but it is pretty ****ty to divert into ad hominems.

Attack the argument. I KNOW most of you are capable of that.

However, Berkley is known for producing hippies, so shame on you, lindsey.

Hippie connection seems to be changing. When I was an undergrad, you know what the largest campus group was? The campus Republican group -- not kidding.

It was a liberal sleeper cell.

Actually, we used to joke that a specific far left organizations was actually far right organizations attempting to discredit the left (because they did some completely nutty things).

fificrazy

Processed foods are the most easily digestible foods, while sugar provides the most readily available energy. That's why kids have no limit to the amount of sweetness they can handle, for example- their bodies crave sugar because they need that quick accessible energy to grow and support their activity level. It's because of these qualities that both types of food have contributed to our evolution and growth as a species!

That's why the only foods I define as bad are the ones that contain non-food items... like dyes, sand, wax... *shudders*.

QuietBloom

JD and bachelors in integrative biology.

"The Department of Integrative Biology (IB) offers Undergradate and Graduate academic programs as well as Faculty Research that focuses on the integration of structure and function that influences the biology, ecology, and evolution of organisms. It investigates integration at all levels of organization from molecules to the biosphere, and in all branches of the tree of life: plants, animals, fungi, and microbes."

Doesn't sound all that relevant, especially considering it's an undergraduate degree.

Really? That doesn't sound all that relative to the general understanding of biology? Not to mention that if you knew much about the program, you'd know that people often take courses in both IB and MCB (molecular and cell biology). Had I had two more MCB course rather than IB courses, then I would have ended up with the MCB degree instead.

And IB courses cover all the major organ systems (if you choose to take them) -- general anatomy, endocrinolgy, histology, etc. You can also focus on other areas that are not related to the human body -- some focus on ecology, animal behavior, population genetics, macro/micro evolution, etc. I personally took a lot of the human body related courses in both IB and MCB as I was considering a MD at the time.

Not relevant at all...C'mon, that's sort of funny.

Well that's terrible. I used to think UC Berkeley was a decent institution. But, then again, I've learned over and over again that degrees generally mean very little, and that undergraduate degrees mean virtually nothing whatsoever. I'd never tout my degrees to back my arguments here, even though they are relevant.

UC Berkley DID used to be a decent institution. But the UC system is going with more and more of a liberal arts bent, no matter what they call the degree. While they feel they are broadening student's knowledge base, they fail to realize that they are significantly decreasing the depth of any particular subject.

Hmmm...#1 in Chemistry, #1 in Computer Science, #4 in Biological Sciences, #3 in Earth Sciences, #3 in Engineering, #1 in English,, #1 in History, #3 in Math, #1 Public School....and that's with the public school disadvantage of US News.

Yeah, sounds like it's going down the tubes. Another lesson in the reality disconnect on MFP.

#1 as compared to what? Another UC school? A Cal State? A german kindergarten?

QueenBishOTUniverse

I just believe that you'll get to your nutrient intake with less empty calories and unnecessary, potentially harmfully additives opting for "better ingredients" in home cooked meals than with a bunch of highly processed foods -- at least as a general rule.

Now this all came from the MFP Databases...

Delmonte Canned Green Beans
Calories 20
Sodium 10
Potassium 95
Carbs 4
Fiber 2
Sugars 2
Protein 1

Fresh Green Beans
Calories 17
Sodium 4
Potassium 115
Carbs 4
Fiber 2
Sugar 2
Protein 1

Honestly, not much difference.

But, do most processed foods contain just the fruit/vegetable, salt and water? I think it is likely a significant outlier.

nope, not an outlier.

Abstract: The first of a two-part review of the recent and classical literature reveals that loss of nutrients in fresh products during storage and cooking may be more substantial than commonly perceived. Depending on the commodity, freezing and canning processes may preserve nutrient value

Rickman JC, Barrett DM, and Bruhn CM (2007). Nutritional comparison of fresh, frozen and canned fruits and vegetables. Part I. Vitamins C and B and phenolic compounds. Journal of the Science of Food and Agriculture, 87, 930-944.

Rickman JC, Barrett DM, and Bruhn CM (2007). Nutritional comparison of fresh, frozen and canned fruits and vegetables. Part II. Vitamin A and carotenoids, vitamin E, minerals and fiber. Journal of the Science of Food and Agriculture, 87, 1185-1196.

Agreed. I think people need to do a bit more research about processed foods, particularly fruit and veggies, if they think this is an outlier. I regularly purchase store brand frozen veggies (Wegmans). They have a "rainbow blend" of green beans, red bell peppers, yellow carrots, and orange carrots. The ingredient list per the package: "Green beans, orange carrots, yellow carrots, red bell pepper." That's it. Straight up frozen veggies, no additives or preservatives. Costs $0.99 a package. I couldn't purchase those fresh veggies for that price, nor do they even carry yellow carrots in the store. Takes a few minutes to heat and serve. We rarely eat out, but even cooking at home I don't have time to cut up all those veggies and steam them in the evenings. Removing those extra steps is often the difference between having veggies with dinner or not in our house. So I do agree that canned/frozen foods can be a healthy choice and can also help people enjoy a variety of fruits and veggies they would not otherwise be able to find fresh where they live or even know how to prepare if they did have access to them.

I agree with you on the frozen veggies in particular. Canned I'm not so sure about -- I'd have to look into it more. It was my understanding that a lot of canned veggies and fruits had extra additives and often sugar (especially fruits) -- but I may be very off on this.

But, the original statement went beyond just canned veggies and fruits -- to processed frozen dinners (which I do believe have a lot of additives), processed foods (ditto) and eating at restaurants (additives -- maybe, maybe not depending on where you are -- but often extremely large portions if you find a place that doesn't use the additives) versus just making home-cooked meals with better nutrient values.

Correction: the original statement ONLY, included processed frozen meals, YOU added in the part about eating at restaurants. The frozen meals may or may not have additives, but that would have to be evaluated on a case by case basis, but the point still remains that being processed or frozen does not mean that they are inherently worse.

lindsey1979

I had a 5th year pre-med student (who had already been accepted in to a med school *shudders*) in a functional morphology class shocked to learn that the muscles we were studying were the same things she was eating in her hamburger.

No. Nonononono. I refuse to believe this. Where did I put that gasoline and book of matches?!

To be fair, most doctors don't learn much about nutrition -- as I think many of us can attest as we've gotten a huge range of advice from medical professions on it. But, I also wouldn't accuse a doctor of having a general misunderstanding of biology.

QuietBloom

Eh. She's using her degree as evidence of her knowledge and understanding in this thread.

:laugh:

You can laugh but we all remember you touting educational history in a desperate attempt to back up your ridiculous, wrong claims about nutrition.

Don't forget about her extremely high IQ.

wheird

Processed foods are the most easily digestible foods, while sugar provides the most readily available energy. That's why kids have no limit to the amount of sweetness they can handle, for example- their bodies crave sugar because they need that quick accessible energy to grow and support their activity level. It's because of these qualities that both types of food have contributed to our evolution and growth as a species!

That's why the only foods I define as bad are the ones that contain non-food items... like dyes, sand, wax... *shudders*.

What foods have sand and wax?

lindsey1979

JD and bachelors in integrative biology.

"The Department of Integrative Biology (IB) offers Undergradate and Graduate academic programs as well as Faculty Research that focuses on the integration of structure and function that influences the biology, ecology, and evolution of organisms. It investigates integration at all levels of organization from molecules to the biosphere, and in all branches of the tree of life: plants, animals, fungi, and microbes."

Doesn't sound all that relevant, especially considering it's an undergraduate degree.

Really? That doesn't sound all that relative to the general understanding of biology? Not to mention that if you knew much about the program, you'd know that people often take courses in both IB and MCB (molecular and cell biology). Had I had two more MCB course rather than IB courses, then I would have ended up with the MCB degree instead.

And IB courses cover all the major organ systems (if you choose to take them) -- general anatomy, endocrinolgy, histology, etc. You can also focus on other areas that are not related to the human body -- some focus on ecology, animal behavior, population genetics, macro/micro evolution, etc. I personally took a lot of the human body related courses in both IB and MCB as I was considering a MD at the time.

Not relevant at all...C'mon, that's sort of funny.

Well that's terrible. I used to think UC Berkeley was a decent institution. But, then again, I've learned over and over again that degrees generally mean very little, and that undergraduate degrees mean virtually nothing whatsoever. I'd never tout my degrees to back my arguments here, even though they are relevant.

UC Berkley DID used to be a decent institution. But the UC system is going with more and more of a liberal arts bent, no matter what they call the degree. While they feel they are broadening student's knowledge base, they fail to realize that they are significantly decreasing the depth of any particular subject.

Hmmm...#1 in Chemistry, #1 in Computer Science, #4 in Biological Sciences, #3 in Earth Sciences, #3 in Engineering, #1 in English,, #1 in History, #3 in Math, #1 Public School....and that's with the public school disadvantage of US News.

Yeah, sounds like it's going down the tubes. Another lesson in the reality disconnect on MFP.

#1 as compared to what? Another UC school? A Cal State? A german kindergarten?

Per US News, according to their standards and comparison. I think they compare a rather large amount of institutions.

http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/university-of-california-berkeley-110635/overall-rankings

QueenBishOTUniverse

Eh. She's using her degree as evidence of her knowledge and understanding in this thread.

:laugh:

You can laugh but we all remember you touting educational history in a desperate attempt to back up your ridiculous, wrong claims about nutrition.

Don't forget about her extremely high IQ.

See, this is the only reason I've contemplated taking the MENSA exam, so that I could potentially throw down a membership card during an argument and yell, "shut up bish, I'm a genius!"