Why do people seem to bash "healthy"eating?
Replies
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I've been going through lots of posts, and I see this very often: "It doesn't matter what you eat, losing weight is a matter of taking in fewer calories than you use" or "If it fits your macros, then all is fine". Isn't losing weight a part of getting healthy (or healthier) for most people? If that assumption is true (and after reading some of these posts, I'm not sure it is), then why does everyone say it is OK to eat all the processed foods that are in the American diet and has lead us, as a nation, to be the fattest industrialized nation on earth? And we know obesity contributes to diabetes, heart disease, stroke....not exactly what I would call healthy.
I'm not advocating not having a treat if you want it (this from someone who had some chocolate ice cream last night). But I don't see how eating fast foods and processed foods in the quantities offered out there can possibly be healthy. And so many people on MFP don't just say it is OK, but seem to encourage their consumption.
Just wondering.....
To be brutally honest, I think some people find it threatening for some reason. I find it pretty bizarre that any mention of healthy eating gets so attacked; I've never come across a similar response in life that didn't have at least some fear behind it.
I think you are on to something!0 -
To be brutally honest, I think some people find it annoying for some reason. I find it pretty bizarre that any mention of healthy eating gets so attacked; I've never come across a similar response in life that didn't have at least some fear behind it.
FTFY
no one likes their food being judged for arbitrary reasons- especially completely unscientific - fear mongering trend reasons.0 -
It's usually the clean eaters that seem to feel "threatened." I always find it bizarre that someone telling a poster that it's OK to eat a serving of ice cream if it fits their plan gets interpreted by clean eaters as, "STOP TELLING THAT PERSON THEY CAN EAT ICE CREAM ALL DAY!" Go ahead, read through the threads, you'll find that sort of thing happens all more often than anything else.I've been going through lots of posts, and I see this very often: "It doesn't matter what you eat, losing weight is a matter of taking in fewer calories than you use" or "If it fits your macros, then all is fine". Isn't losing weight a part of getting healthy (or healthier) for most people? If that assumption is true (and after reading some of these posts, I'm not sure it is), then why does everyone say it is OK to eat all the processed foods that are in the American diet and has lead us, as a nation, to be the fattest industrialized nation on earth? And we know obesity contributes to diabetes, heart disease, stroke....not exactly what I would call healthy.
I'm not advocating not having a treat if you want it (this from someone who had some chocolate ice cream last night). But I don't see how eating fast foods and processed foods in the quantities offered out there can possibly be healthy. And so many people on MFP don't just say it is OK, but seem to encourage their consumption.
Just wondering.....
To be brutally honest, I think some people find it threatening for some reason. I find it pretty bizarre that any mention of healthy eating gets so attacked; I've never come across a similar response in life that didn't have at least some fear behind it.0 -
I don't think anyone bashes healthy eating.
What they bash is dietary extremism (and rightly so.)
Unfortunately sometimes those bashing dietary extremism become extreme and then they get bashed for extremism and then things go round...and...round...and round...like joggers.
Fortunately nobody to date has mentioned the band "Extreme" and their popular ditty "Get the Funk Out". That would be sick.
No, they do not have the 'right' to bash what they have deemed as a dietary extremism. They are being judgmental over a dietary choice and lifestyle they do not agree with. It's none of their business.
Yes, they certainly can do if that dietary extremism is actually harmful and perpetuates false and unsupportable beliefs which makes other people miserable and proponents of a certain way of eating insist it must be done in that way. It's everyone's business in that scenario.
I do not take issue with anyone's personal preferences when it comes to eating but rather when they insist others must follow that way for no good reason other than an unfounded belief.
So, healthy eating is actually harmful? Oh WOW <slaps forehead, shaking head, then sits on fingers to prevent typing a suitable response...>0 -
I think the main concern people have is when people go to extremes. Some people, will label certain foods as "bad" and completely deny themselves those items. The end result is that a few days/weeks later they end up binge eating that food item.
Exactly.
It is the traditional dieting mindset and it has a spectacularly high failure rate over the long term.
If a person likes clean eating / low carb / vegan or whatever and they do not feel excessively deprived or restricted then let them have at it. More power to them.
If a person doesn't like any of those methods (or the "eat in moderation" method for that matter) but are told they must keep suffering, it has to be hard, it has to feel like punishment, you need lots of willpower to be successful then things start derailing. None of those things are true.0 -
I like this phrase "Everytime you eat you are either feeding disease or preventing it." I think that's good food for thought. I remind myself of this when I want something processed and relatively unhealthy.0
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I know the lower on the food chain I eat the healthier I am and feel. That said, I'm not opposed to a stack of pancakes and bacon drenched in maple syrup occasionally.0
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I try to eat cleaner, but this argument isn't one I normally engage in - it's just sort of pointless, you know? I know that eating a certain way makes me feel better, so that's what I do and I worry about myself and my own goals. I feel like I *do* eat what fits into my macros, too. And fast food or Twinkies don't fit into them. That's my prerogative and I don't really care what others think of it
If what works for me doesn't work for others, that's fine too. 0 -
I don't think anyone bashes healthy eating.
What they bash is dietary extremism (and rightly so.)
Unfortunately sometimes those bashing dietary extremism become extreme and then they get bashed for extremism and then things go round...and...round...and round...like joggers.
Fortunately nobody to date has mentioned the band "Extreme" and their popular ditty "Get the Funk Out". That would be sick.
No, they do not have the 'right' to bash what they have deemed as a dietary extremism. They are being judgmental over a dietary choice and lifestyle they do not agree with. It's none of their business.
Yes, they certainly can do if that dietary extremism is actually harmful and perpetuates false and unsupportable beliefs which makes other people miserable and proponents of a certain way of eating insist it must be done in that way. It's everyone's business in that scenario.
I do not take issue with anyone's personal preferences when it comes to eating but rather when they insist others must follow that way for no good reason other than an unfounded belief.
So, healthy eating is actually harmful? Oh WOW <slaps forehead, shaking head, then sits on fingers to prevent typing a suitable response...>
No extremism and fanaticism are.
But tell me what you really think and I will address it. Open dialogue is good.0 -
Orthorexia nervosa is a thing. Eating an overall healthy diet isn't harmful (and is actually what IIFYM proponents push for.) Obsessing over the "health"of individual foods, without regard for the overall diet, is unhealthy. Lots of people call carrots "healthy," however, is eating 500 calories worth of carrots every day, with nothing else, "healthy?" Unfortunately, far too many people think it is, which is how we end up with eating disorders like orthorexia and anorexia.I don't think anyone bashes healthy eating.
What they bash is dietary extremism (and rightly so.)
Unfortunately sometimes those bashing dietary extremism become extreme and then they get bashed for extremism and then things go round...and...round...and round...like joggers.
Fortunately nobody to date has mentioned the band "Extreme" and their popular ditty "Get the Funk Out". That would be sick.
No, they do not have the 'right' to bash what they have deemed as a dietary extremism. They are being judgmental over a dietary choice and lifestyle they do not agree with. It's none of their business.
Yes, they certainly can do if that dietary extremism is actually harmful and perpetuates false and unsupportable beliefs which makes other people miserable and proponents of a certain way of eating insist it must be done in that way. It's everyone's business in that scenario.
I do not take issue with anyone's personal preferences when it comes to eating but rather when they insist others must follow that way for no good reason other than an unfounded belief.
So, healthy eating is actually harmful? Oh WOW <slaps forehead, shaking head, then sits on fingers to prevent typing a suitable response...>0 -
I like this phrase "Everytime you eat you are either feeding disease or preventing it." I think that's good food for thought. I remind myself of this when I want something processed and relatively unhealthy.
That is certainly a terrible mindset to have but to each his or her own0 -
eat clean religiously, then have cheat-binge day. lol
I dont have a cheat day, if I feel like eating a chocopie, I do eat one minding the portions. I even have a box of 50 chocopies I.got.from costco.
as for food, I tend to look at them based.on macro AND micronutrients...not if theyre clean or not.Probably because clean eaters put all sorts of adjectives on their diet and food that make other food out to look like "the bad guy"
What is seems to be shocking to so many people is that the IIFYM folks- we actually eat "clean" quiet a bit Iof the time- but we don't cal lit that because it just is what it is and we work everything in the way we want to. (IF IT FITS IT FITS!!!)- But because we have no problem "admitting" that we eat "junk" food- the perception is that we eat crap ALL the time- we don't. We eat "clean" quiet a bit- because it's easier to eat the amount of food needed to feel full and still accomplish goals- but the reality is we eat all sorts of things.
IIFYM =/= twinkie diet- which is what "clean eaters" seem to think it means.
We just don't go around demonizing twinkies- we eat chicken and veggies- then have our oreo's/ice cream for dinner.
So what big deal- no need to make a big thing about it.
I have a feeling that people.too attached to labelling their food as clean just do it.for the sake.of having labels attached to.them. after all,it's the "hip thing" nowadays0 -
I think the main concern people have is when people go to extremes. Some people, will label certain foods as "bad" and completely deny themselves those items. The end result is that a few days/weeks later they end up binge eating that food item. Calories in vs calories out is very important. Of course, if someone eats the "processed foods at the quantities offered" they are most likely going to end up going over their calories but that doesn't mean they can't get the processed food and just cut down on the portion they'd normally eat. There was a science teacher that managed to lose weight only eating McDonald's and it was precisely because he kept track of his caloric intake vs expenditure.
I have found for myself that it's important to keep "treats" around to satisfy any cravings. Otherwise, I might find myself eating a whole container instead of just enough to satisfy me.
I am on the eating clean spectrum and have been for numerous years yet I don't label any food as good or bad. In my opinion, some foods are healthier (aka more nutritious) than others. I do label certain food additives as non-desirable. However, the good food/bad food labels have been used in the weight loss industry for as long as I can remember. I currently have two apps on my phone that classify foods as good or bad that aim to teach the user healthier choices. The book series Eat This Not That is based on the same principles. The food pyramid and dinner plate recommendations for healthy eating are based on the good and bad food model.0 -
I like this phrase "Everytime you eat you are either feeding disease or preventing it." I think that's good food for thought. I remind myself of this when I want something processed and relatively unhealthy.
Any excellent point of reference :drinker:0 -
eat clean religiously, then have cheat-binge day. lol
I dont have a cheat day, if I feel like eating a chocopie, I do eat one minding the portions. I even have a box of 50 chocopies I.got.from costco.
as for food, I tend to look at them based.on macro AND micronutrients...not if theyre clean or not.
...snip snip...
I have a feeling that people.too attached to labelling their food as clean just do it.for the sake.of having labels attached to.them. after all,it's the "hip thing" nowadays
precesily- that's how I eat mostly. I have oreo's ice cream and beer/wine in my house quiet a bit- when I'm bulking- I eat a lot more of them- when I'm cutting- I add them when I want to or need extra calories.
Agreed with the labels- I don't understand the need for a label on everything- and I don't understand why I need a label to describe my eating patterns either- I think we should start a bathroom/pooping label habit... I mean- if everything needs a label right???0 -
Orthorexia nervosa is a thing. Eating an overall healthy diet isn't harmful (and is actually what IIFYM proponents push for.) Obsessing over the "health"of individual foods, without regard for the overall diet, is unhealthy. Lots of people call carrots "healthy," however, is eating 500 calories worth of carrots every day, with nothing else, "healthy?" Unfortunately, far too many people think it is, which is how we end up with eating disorders like orthorexia and anorexia.I don't think anyone bashes healthy eating.
What they bash is dietary extremism (and rightly so.)
Unfortunately sometimes those bashing dietary extremism become extreme and then they get bashed for extremism and then things go round...and...round...and round...like joggers.
Fortunately nobody to date has mentioned the band "Extreme" and their popular ditty "Get the Funk Out". That would be sick.
No, they do not have the 'right' to bash what they have deemed as a dietary extremism. They are being judgmental over a dietary choice and lifestyle they do not agree with. It's none of their business.
Yes, they certainly can do if that dietary extremism is actually harmful and perpetuates false and unsupportable beliefs which makes other people miserable and proponents of a certain way of eating insist it must be done in that way. It's everyone's business in that scenario.
I do not take issue with anyone's personal preferences when it comes to eating but rather when they insist others must follow that way for no good reason other than an unfounded belief.
So, healthy eating is actually harmful? Oh WOW <slaps forehead, shaking head, then sits on fingers to prevent typing a suitable response...>
Well that would be an extreme, wouldn't it? The normal healthy eating 99.9% of the members here talk about has nothing to do with orthorexia or anorexia or any other eating disorder. You are clouding the argument. There are likely some out there trying to live on nothing but Twinkies but you don't see bashing of those who eat Twinkies even though they might develop Twinkexia. The vast majority of the threads on MFP are not discussing dietary extremes at all.0 -
eat clean religiously, then have cheat-binge day. lol
I dont have a cheat day, if I feel like eating a chocopie, I do eat one minding the portions. I even have a box of 50 chocopies I.got.from costco.
as for food, I tend to look at them based.on macro AND micronutrients...not if theyre clean or not.
...snip snip...
I have a feeling that people.too attached to labelling their food as clean just do it.for the sake.of having labels attached to.them. after all,it's the "hip thing" nowadays
precesily- that's how I eat mostly. I have oreo's ice cream and beer/wine in my house quiet a bit- when I'm bulking- I eat a lot more of them- when I'm cutting- I add them when I want to or need extra calories.
Agreed with the labels- I don't understand the need for a label on everything- and I don't understand why I need a label to describe my eating patterns either- I think we should start a bathroom/pooping label habit... I mean- if everything needs a label right???
Already done...0 -
The vast majority of the threads on MFP are not discussing dietary extremes at all.
But the mindset is exactly that on most threads - all or nothing / perfectionist / on or off diet.
And there lies the problem in many cases and why people are asked to justify their beliefs when giving advice.0 -
The vast majority of the threads on MFP are not discussing dietary extremes at all.
But the mindset is exactly that on most threads - all or nothing / perfectionist / on or off diet.
And there lies the problem in many cases and why people are asked to justify their beliefs when giving advice.
I think you'll find that it is the Mod crew - questioning people for not eating to extremes.
In fact there are certain members that cannot get their heads around people eating primal doing an 80/20 split - so who's go the issue with the extremism?
Most people eating their own style be it Clean, Paleo LCHF seem to be quite happy with it and not that inflexible.0 -
The vast majority of the threads on MFP are not discussing dietary extremes at all.
But the mindset is exactly that on most threads - all or nothing / perfectionist / on or off diet.
And there lies the problem in many cases and why people are asked to justify their beliefs when giving advice.
I think you'll find that it is the Mod crew - questioning people for not eating to extremes.
In fact there are certain members that cannot get their heads around people eating primal doing an 80/20 split - so who's go the issue with the extremism?
because those people eating primal aren't eating primal. they just gave it a label for no good reason- and that label is often demonizing other foods for no good reason.
you don't NEED a label.
I tired paleo-ish/primal-ish whatever for a while. Then I realize nothing was THAT different and stopped saying it because there was no need.
Food today
2 H.B.eggs
meat sauce/spaghetti squash
plain greek yogurt + protein + fresh fruit
lamb
fresca soda.
pretty "clean" but I don't call it that.0 -
I've been going through lots of posts, and I see this very often: "It doesn't matter what you eat, losing weight is a matter of taking in fewer calories than you use" or "If it fits your macros, then all is fine". Isn't losing weight a part of getting healthy (or healthier) for most people? If that assumption is true (and after reading some of these posts, I'm not sure it is), then why does everyone say it is OK to eat all the processed foods that are in the American diet and has lead us, as a nation, to be the fattest industrialized nation on earth? And we know obesity contributes to diabetes, heart disease, stroke....not exactly what I would call healthy.
I'm not advocating not having a treat if you want it (this from someone who had some chocolate ice cream last night). But I don't see how eating fast foods and processed foods in the quantities offered out there can possibly be healthy. And so many people on MFP don't just say it is OK, but seem to encourage their consumption.
Just wondering.....
I didn't read all of the comments here so I'm sure this has already been said to death.
IRL I know a lot of people who approach weight loss from the standpoint of what foods they feel they need to cut out. They either do "challenges" of cutting out one or more foods, find success during the challenge and re-gain the wait after; or they cut out one or more foods altogether only to binge-eat to sickness or exhaustion when there's a one-day free pass which leads guilt and "falling off the wagon."
The problem is that restricting certain foods does not work for a lot of people. Works for some, but I have personally seen more failure than success. And I have done challenges and restrictions only to "fall of the wagon."
I don't think people are bashing so much as discrediting statements like yours bolded above. We're the fattest nation because we eat too much, simple as that. It's not because a food is processed or not processed. Demonizing food leads to those food challenges or restrictions that bring failure to so many people. The newbie comes to MFP and starts reading boards looking for advice, and sees all of these posts about sugar addiction and gluten is bad and don't eat this or that. If those ideas weren't constantly being challenged, the newbie would stop eating ____ to lose weight, binge or relapse, feel guilty about doing so, and wonder why they don't have it in them to "eat healthy" and live an endless cycle of nonsense. Instead, the newbie can say, hey there's a way I can still enjoy the foods I like AND lose weight! Awesome!0 -
I've been going through lots of posts, and I see this very often: "It doesn't matter what you eat, losing weight is a matter of taking in fewer calories than you use" or "If it fits your macros, then all is fine". Isn't losing weight a part of getting healthy (or healthier) for most people? If that assumption is true (and after reading some of these posts, I'm not sure it is), then why does everyone say it is OK to eat all the processed foods that are in the American diet and has lead us, as a nation, to be the fattest industrialized nation on earth? And we know obesity contributes to diabetes, heart disease, stroke....not exactly what I would call healthy.
I'm not advocating not having a treat if you want it (this from someone who had some chocolate ice cream last night). But I don't see how eating fast foods and processed foods in the quantities offered out there can possibly be healthy. And so many people on MFP don't just say it is OK, but seem to encourage their consumption.
Just wondering.....
Nothing about what you're saying equates to bashing healthy eating. At most, it constitutes a lack of bashing processed foods/foods you're labeling as "non-healthy."0 -
The vast majority of the threads on MFP are not discussing dietary extremes at all.
But the mindset is exactly that on most threads - all or nothing / perfectionist / on or off diet.
And there lies the problem in many cases and why people are asked to justify their beliefs when giving advice.
I think you'll find that it is the Mod crew - questioning people for not eating to extremes.
In fact there are certain members that cannot get their heads around people eating primal doing an 80/20 split - so who's go the issue with the extremism?
Most people eating their own style be it Clean, Paleo LCHF seem to be quite happy with it and not that inflexible.
Agreed! It is also the Mod crew that pressure others to justify why they eat the way they do even if the diet of choice is casually mentioned in passing. If the response doesn't meet their expectations (aka their narrow minded definition) then they start with the bashing. They also display black and white thinking when that is the furthest from what many of us are eating. I eat clean but that doesn't stop me from eating vegetarian, LCHF or Paleo dishes. I'm not diabetic and I don't eat gluten free but that doesn't stop me from using recipes meant for that purpose. I would think that those on other lifestyle choice diets do the same thing as long as the dish meets their requirements.0 -
LOL
I actually use those labels to help find new recipes- which is kind of fun.
Googling easy paleo is a nice way to get simple chicken (or any meat) based dish- or some cool variations.
so that is a big perk- same with veggie stuff- like looking up cool new twists on different food.0 -
I like this phrase "Everytime you eat you are either feeding disease or preventing it." I think that's good food for thought. I remind myself of this when I want something processed and relatively unhealthy.
Any excellent point of reference :drinker:
And you called tracking calories prone to developing an unhealthy relationship with food??? IMO, the false dichotomy of this statement is *far* more likely to be damaging than keeping a food log.
(ETA: And I'm still fascinated by how so many of the most vocal proponents of a "clean" eating label have their food diaries private. Why not share an example of your optimal way of eating with everyone else so they can benefit from your example? Oh, and my food diary is still public...like it was when I did a year of eating strict paleo in 2012 (and before and after then when I ate other foods). And yeah, I was recently publicly called out for the 19g of Hershey's syrup in my protein shakes as obviously being damaging to my health by one of the "clean eaters". *shrug*)0 -
I don't think either of you understand what the word "moderation" means.The vast majority of the threads on MFP are not discussing dietary extremes at all.
But the mindset is exactly that on most threads - all or nothing / perfectionist / on or off diet.
And there lies the problem in many cases and why people are asked to justify their beliefs when giving advice.
I think you'll find that it is the Mod crew - questioning people for not eating to extremes.
In fact there are certain members that cannot get their heads around people eating primal doing an 80/20 split - so who's go the issue with the extremism?
Most people eating their own style be it Clean, Paleo LCHF seem to be quite happy with it and not that inflexible.
Agreed! It is also the Mod crew that pressure others to justify why they eat the way they do even if the diet of choice is casually mentioned in passing. If the response doesn't meet their expectations (aka their narrow minded definition) then they start with the bashing. They also display black and white thinking when that is the furthest from what many of us are eating. I eat clean but that doesn't stop me from eating vegetarian, LCHF or Paleo dishes. I'm not diabetic and I don't eat gluten free but that doesn't stop me from using recipes meant for that purpose. I would think that those on other lifestyle choice diets do the same thing as long as the dish meets their requirements.0 -
My goodness... every one is entitled to their own opinions! I think it is wonderful how people are dropping their pounds off; even recognizing the pounds have to come off is worthy of praise. If people did what they felt was right for them in their own hearts, we would all be better off. Who is to say YOUR way is ALWAYS right? Medically proven? Tested? We all know that those have made mistakes along the way. Testing not always correct. Margarine is better than butter. What??? Years later, we were wrong? It's unhealthy???? It has harmful trans fats???? OMG.... all I have to say is let people live the best for THEM and you live the best for YOU. Support is not telling someone HOW they need to keep changing everything but it is being there for them when they need encouragement, strength, love. For myself, I just want to say WTG for all those on here who are losing the pounds they came here to do. How you choose to do it is your decision. If you want advice, no problem, just ask for it and its yours but if you don't need the advice and just want the cheering on, you've certainly got that. Life is never going to be the way we all think it should be, our diversity prevents the same way of thinking from us all... but that is what makes it so wonderful...the fact that we are diverse and have so many glorious ways of doing things; not just one!0
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Slowly I am realizing that's it's not so much the diet itself, but the labeling of the diet.. saying you eat healthy, will get no backlash, but when you label it, people come out in mass to "correct" your thinking or to request you explain in detail why you eat that way.
I'm pretty sure most of us on most diets, practice moderation. Some just don't eat certain foods or food types for whatever reason they deem fit. That just doesn't sit well with some people.
I also think there are lot of overly sensitive people. If I say I eat this way (enter label here) I'm not implying my way is better then yours, even if you take ti that way. That's their issue, not mine. I'm not going to defend my diet anymore. I'm going to eat the way I like that works for me. Even if a lot of people think I have food issues, which I don't.. (well other then occasional over indulging. LOL)0 -
That's not really it. People can eat whatever they want. The problem comes in when someone eating a specific diet comes in and tells a poster "YOU MUST EAT THIS WAY, YOU CAN'T EAT THAT FOOD, I DON'T EAT IT, THEREFORE NOBODY ELSE SHOULD!" It's a trap that people who adhere to specific exclusionary diets tend to fall into. They eat a certain way, and suddenly insist that it's the ONLY way anyone else can eat. In all honesty, what you eat is 100% personal preference. There's no right or wrong answer. And that's where the "[insert demonized food category here] crowd" goes off the rails.Slowly I am realizing that's it's not so much the diet itself, but the labeling of the diet.. saying you eat healthy, will get no backlash, but when you label it, people come out in mass to "correct" your thinking or to request you explain in detail why you eat that way.
I'm pretty sure most of us on most diets, practice moderation. Some just don't eat certain foods or food types for whatever reason they deem fit. That just doesn't sit well with some people.0 -
Slowly I am realizing that's it's not so much the diet itself, but the labeling of the diet.. saying you eat healthy, will get no backlash, but when you label it, people come out in mass to "correct" your thinking or to request you explain in detail why you eat that way.
I'm pretty sure most of us on most diets, practice moderation. Some just don't eat certain foods or food types for whatever reason they deem fit. That just doesn't sit well with some people when it is espoused as being nutritionally/morally/ethically/clearly superior to other diets that do not also exclude the same foods or food types.
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