Why do people seem to bash "healthy"eating?
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In...
for Pizzaups...
Fantastic! And I assume this turns the pizza into a "negative calorie food" since you're working out while eating it, right???
BTW, Wendyterry420, your profile picture is making me want cake - SABOTEUR!!! (Is that peanut butter cream in the middle? YUM!!!)
It's a peanut butter cream cheese frosting. This is the cake I made my son for his birthday. The top part is a genache, which turned out beautifully for my first time making it.0 -
Wait. Are you still mad because a Texan dared to call themselves a Southerner and pointed out that you were taking common words and trying to play a race card off of them? lol
Wait.............Texas isn't a southern state? Technically, I am from Louisiana and live in Texas. Either way, I'm a Southerner.
Yes, I know OT but I cannot get into a "healthy" pizza debate. Sometimes, I eat because it's tasty. :happy:
LOL Yeah, that was from another thread. I was informed that I am in fact, not a Southerner because Texas is a "western" state. We'll just forget that Texas is almost as far South as you can get, and the last of the Confederates to surrender.
All that is really far OT though. My apologies, everyone.0 -
I cannot even fathom how much "meat and green leafy things" you must be eating in order to fill you up more than a large pizza.
Everyone is different you know..
if you can eat an entire pizza and it fills you for hours, then that is great for you. Eating a large pizza will *empty* me, rather quickly, if you catch my drift and i'll be hungry soon thereafter. I am capable of eating an entire pizza in one sitting too.
Or I can make my HUGE dinner of "meat and green leafy things" and be full for a long time. More protein in my dinner versus the pizza, less fat, less carbs less calories and less grease in my dinner and full longer. That's so winning it almost needs a new category.
ETA: i'm assuming pizza you buy, not homemade pizza. Which can be very healthy and filling depending on how it's made. I've experienced both sides when eating homemade pizza.
Yep, fully aware that people are different. Some people have been saying for a couple of days that pizza and burrito bowls are unhealthy. When pressed to further define "unhealthy" it was then changed to "because it doesn't fill me up". I'm just honestly confused, and maybe this is because I'm a petite female, how a burrito bowl or an entire pizza (and I wasn't distinguishing between homemade or delivery) can not fill you up. I don't eat an entire pizza, because I am honestly too full after 2-3 slices. I get that people can eat a lot more than I do, I'm just trying to understand, if satiety is what you are looking for - how much volume of meat and vegetables one would have to consume to surpass the full feeling that comes from pizza.
As others have pointed out there are plenty of ways to modify pizza recipes to make them "healthier" by whatever definition you subscribe to. Completely eliminating pizza forever for your diet because you deem it "unhealthy", sounds like a miserable existence.
Miserable *for you*. I still cave to pizza occasionally. But i am very very picky about my pizza. If I'm going to "suffer" for eating it, it's going to be worth it. Maybe you or other do not suffer. Great. It's unhealthy food for me. It's also one of my favorite food. I am much more miserable when I eat it then when I forgo eating it.
I guess I don't see the issue??? Pizza for one person bad, Pizza for another person not bad. It's unhealthy because it does not fit into my diet of choice, it does not set well in my tummy and it does nothing to help me eat less.
At 250 calories or more per slice. I don't really see how this is a question. 2 slices do not fill me up either. Those 2 slices are the equivalent in calories (strictly speaking calories) as en entire huge plate of my super filling food. My son can eat 4-5 pieces with garlic bread if I let him. I make him eat salad and he begs for the cookie for dessert. He's always hungry about an hour later.WTF is your calorie goal set at for 2 pieces of pizza to screw it up?0 -
I cannot even fathom how much "meat and green leafy things" you must be eating in order to fill you up more than a large pizza.
Everyone is different you know..
if you can eat an entire pizza and it fills you for hours, then that is great for you. Eating a large pizza will *empty* me, rather quickly, if you catch my drift and i'll be hungry soon thereafter. I am capable of eating an entire pizza in one sitting too.
Or I can make my HUGE dinner of "meat and green leafy things" and be full for a long time. More protein in my dinner versus the pizza, less fat, less carbs less calories and less grease in my dinner and full longer. That's so winning it almost needs a new category.
ETA: i'm assuming pizza you buy, not homemade pizza. Which can be very healthy and filling depending on how it's made. I've experienced both sides when eating homemade pizza.
Yep, fully aware that people are different. Some people have been saying for a couple of days that pizza and burrito bowls are unhealthy. When pressed to further define "unhealthy" it was then changed to "because it doesn't fill me up". I'm just honestly confused, and maybe this is because I'm a petite female, how a burrito bowl or an entire pizza (and I wasn't distinguishing between homemade or delivery) can not fill you up. I don't eat an entire pizza, because I am honestly too full after 2-3 slices. I get that people can eat a lot more than I do, I'm just trying to understand, if satiety is what you are looking for - how much volume of meat and vegetables one would have to consume to surpass the full feeling that comes from pizza.
As others have pointed out there are plenty of ways to modify pizza recipes to make them "healthier" by whatever definition you subscribe to. Completely eliminating pizza forever for your diet because you deem it "unhealthy", sounds like a miserable existence.
Personally, I eat to my numbers and mostly ignore satiety, so this whole "fills you up" aspect of various foods is mostly meaningless (to me). I honestly believe this is something that can be learned with practice (assuming overall calorie limits are reasonable and you're not fighting actual serious hunger). I believe that we are capable of adjusting to low volume, but adequate calorie eating since that is ultimately what our bodies dictate we need: sufficient calories (which is not synonymous with "feeling full").
(And when I had my calories set a little too low and I felt genuinely hungry for a few days in a row, I realized my calorie goal was less than ideal and I adjusted accordingly. Problem solved without consideration of satiety at all.)
But that's just me...and yeah, everyone is different and all that stuff, I suppose.0 -
Let me get down into bunker before I utter the words cauliflower crust. I know it's a horrible crime against pizza-humanity (pizzamanity? pizzanity?) but I personally find it delicious and enough to satisfy that pizza desire when I'm looking to save calories.
Maybe just call it a cauliflower recipe rather than a pizza recipe.
But you actually eat that and admit to it? And say you think it's tasty?
Courageous girl you are
You could survive a famine using grass recipes. And call it green salad
I proudly admit to eating it and enjoying it!
I think it's about expectation. The taste and texture are of course very different from traditional pizza crust, so I go in expecting that. And I found a great recipe that produces a flavorful faux-crust that is firm enough to pick up and eat. It's not for everyone, but it works for me from time to time.
I agree. I have not tried the cauliflower crust. But I have used eggplant as the base instead of traditional dough. If you expect it to taste like eggplant and not pizza crust, then it's pretty good. If you expect it to taste like traditional pizza you are in for a let down and will probably banish it from your diet. I sorta want to try making a pizza using a rice cake as a crust. Just for ****s and giggles. :drinker:0 -
I cannot even fathom how much "meat and green leafy things" you must be eating in order to fill you up more than a large pizza.
Everyone is different you know..
if you can eat an entire pizza and it fills you for hours, then that is great for you. Eating a large pizza will *empty* me, rather quickly, if you catch my drift and i'll be hungry soon thereafter. I am capable of eating an entire pizza in one sitting too.
Or I can make my HUGE dinner of "meat and green leafy things" and be full for a long time. More protein in my dinner versus the pizza, less fat, less carbs less calories and less grease in my dinner and full longer. That's so winning it almost needs a new category.
ETA: i'm assuming pizza you buy, not homemade pizza. Which can be very healthy and filling depending on how it's made. I've experienced both sides when eating homemade pizza.
Yep, fully aware that people are different. Some people have been saying for a couple of days that pizza and burrito bowls are unhealthy. When pressed to further define "unhealthy" it was then changed to "because it doesn't fill me up". I'm just honestly confused, and maybe this is because I'm a petite female, how a burrito bowl or an entire pizza (and I wasn't distinguishing between homemade or delivery) can not fill you up. I don't eat an entire pizza, because I am honestly too full after 2-3 slices. I get that people can eat a lot more than I do, I'm just trying to understand, if satiety is what you are looking for - how much volume of meat and vegetables one would have to consume to surpass the full feeling that comes from pizza.
As others have pointed out there are plenty of ways to modify pizza recipes to make them "healthier" by whatever definition you subscribe to. Completely eliminating pizza forever for your diet because you deem it "unhealthy", sounds like a miserable existence.
No kidding. That's why I don't plan to do that. You see right now, with my current calorie deficit, a couple pieces of pizza is a meal or actually a bit more. If I ate those two pieces, I would then find myself in a really horrible position of being ridiculously hungry and out of calories. Besides, I don't know if this is the same for everyone but my local PaPaJohns doesn't deliver two pieces of pizza. You know what happens when you put a ravenously hungry fat man in a room with a large pizza? Bad Things happen.
Now one day when utopia has arrived, I will be at maintenance, and I will fully enjoy those two pieces of pizza and then I will fill up on foods that don't just taste good and wave goodbye a few minutes later.
WTF is your calorie goal set at for 2 pieces of pizza to screw it up?
1600. I suppose if I had a lot less to lose or wanted to still be jackin around with the same cut years from now, I could set it up somewhere around where yours is.0 -
Personally, I eat to my numbers and mostly ignore satiety, so this whole "fills you up" aspect of various foods is mostly meaningless (to me). I honestly believe this is something that can be learned with practice (assuming overall calorie limits are reasonable and you're not fighting actual serious hunger). I believe that we are capable of adjusting to low volume, but adequate calorie eating since that is ultimately what our bodies dictate we need: sufficient calories (which is not synonymous with "feeling full").
(And when I had my calories set a little too low and I felt genuinely hungry for a few days in a row, I realized my calorie goal was less than ideal and I adjusted accordingly. Problem solved without consideration of satiety at all.)
But that's just me...and yeah, everyone is different and all that stuff, I suppose.
I think there is a big difference between feeling full and feeling stuffed. I eat when i'm not hungry, so I rarely feel real hunger. But I like to know that I eat enough and the "i'm full" signal tells me that. If I eat too much I become lethargic and feel bloated and yucky. I think listening to your body is important. I don't know how else to do that without feeling the "i'm full" signal from your body.
That is my BMR.. are you sure you have your calories set right? i'm a 5'10" woman and I weight 191 with about 30% BF1600. I suppose if I had a lot less to lose or wanted to still be jackin around with the same cut years from now, I could set it up somewhere around where yours is.0 -
I cannot even fathom how much "meat and green leafy things" you must be eating in order to fill you up more than a large pizza.
Everyone is different you know..
if you can eat an entire pizza and it fills you for hours, then that is great for you. Eating a large pizza will *empty* me, rather quickly, if you catch my drift and i'll be hungry soon thereafter. I am capable of eating an entire pizza in one sitting too.
Or I can make my HUGE dinner of "meat and green leafy things" and be full for a long time. More protein in my dinner versus the pizza, less fat, less carbs less calories and less grease in my dinner and full longer. That's so winning it almost needs a new category.
ETA: i'm assuming pizza you buy, not homemade pizza. Which can be very healthy and filling depending on how it's made. I've experienced both sides when eating homemade pizza.
Yep, fully aware that people are different. Some people have been saying for a couple of days that pizza and burrito bowls are unhealthy. When pressed to further define "unhealthy" it was then changed to "because it doesn't fill me up". I'm just honestly confused, and maybe this is because I'm a petite female, how a burrito bowl or an entire pizza (and I wasn't distinguishing between homemade or delivery) can not fill you up. I don't eat an entire pizza, because I am honestly too full after 2-3 slices. I get that people can eat a lot more than I do, I'm just trying to understand, if satiety is what you are looking for - how much volume of meat and vegetables one would have to consume to surpass the full feeling that comes from pizza.
As others have pointed out there are plenty of ways to modify pizza recipes to make them "healthier" by whatever definition you subscribe to. Completely eliminating pizza forever for your diet because you deem it "unhealthy", sounds like a miserable existence.
No kidding. That's why I don't plan to do that. You see right now, with my current calorie deficit, a couple pieces of pizza is a meal or actually a bit more. If I ate those two pieces, I would then find myself in a really horrible position of being ridiculously hungry and out of calories. Besides, I don't know if this is the same for everyone but my local PaPaJohns doesn't deliver two pieces of pizza. You know what happens when you put a ravenously hungry fat man in a room with a large pizza? Bad Things happen.
Now one day when utopia has arrived, I will be at maintenance, and I will fully enjoy those two pieces of pizza and then I will fill up on foods that don't just taste good and wave goodbye a few minutes later.
WTF is your calorie goal set at for 2 pieces of pizza to screw it up?
1600. I suppose if I had a lot less to lose or wanted to still be jackin around with the same cut years from now, I could set it up somewhere around where yours is.
Ohhhh...wow. That is awfully low. I would feel like I was dying. But still. Make it a thin crust and pile on the veggies and low fat cheese. Just a suggestion.0 -
Let me get down into bunker before I utter the words cauliflower crust. I know it's a horrible crime against pizza-humanity (pizzamanity? pizzanity?) but I personally find it delicious and enough to satisfy that pizza desire when I'm looking to save calories.
Maybe just call it a cauliflower recipe rather than a pizza recipe.
But you actually eat that and admit to it? And say you think it's tasty?
Courageous girl you are
You could survive a famine using grass recipes. And call it green salad
This thread is going in soooo many different directions - pizza recipes, borscht gifs, who's a Southerner? and now....
Cauliflower hating!
Personally, I love cauliflower, roasted with a little olive oil and topped with a little parm cheese. I haven't tried the cauliflower pizza crust. Sounds yummy if you like cauliflower.
Here's a new twist, Paleo cheesecake. Healthy and Paleo!0 -
I cannot even fathom how much "meat and green leafy things" you must be eating in order to fill you up more than a large pizza.
Everyone is different you know..
if you can eat an entire pizza and it fills you for hours, then that is great for you. Eating a large pizza will *empty* me, rather quickly, if you catch my drift and i'll be hungry soon thereafter. I am capable of eating an entire pizza in one sitting too.
Or I can make my HUGE dinner of "meat and green leafy things" and be full for a long time. More protein in my dinner versus the pizza, less fat, less carbs less calories and less grease in my dinner and full longer. That's so winning it almost needs a new category.
ETA: i'm assuming pizza you buy, not homemade pizza. Which can be very healthy and filling depending on how it's made. I've experienced both sides when eating homemade pizza.
Yep, fully aware that people are different. Some people have been saying for a couple of days that pizza and burrito bowls are unhealthy. When pressed to further define "unhealthy" it was then changed to "because it doesn't fill me up". I'm just honestly confused, and maybe this is because I'm a petite female, how a burrito bowl or an entire pizza (and I wasn't distinguishing between homemade or delivery) can not fill you up. I don't eat an entire pizza, because I am honestly too full after 2-3 slices. I get that people can eat a lot more than I do, I'm just trying to understand, if satiety is what you are looking for - how much volume of meat and vegetables one would have to consume to surpass the full feeling that comes from pizza.
As others have pointed out there are plenty of ways to modify pizza recipes to make them "healthier" by whatever definition you subscribe to. Completely eliminating pizza forever for your diet because you deem it "unhealthy", sounds like a miserable existence.
No kidding. That's why I don't plan to do that. You see right now, with my current calorie deficit, a couple pieces of pizza is a meal or actually a bit more. If I ate those two pieces, I would then find myself in a really horrible position of being ridiculously hungry and out of calories. Besides, I don't know if this is the same for everyone but my local PaPaJohns doesn't deliver two pieces of pizza. You know what happens when you put a ravenously hungry fat man in a room with a large pizza? Bad Things happen.
Now one day when utopia has arrived, I will be at maintenance, and I will fully enjoy those two pieces of pizza and then I will fill up on foods that don't just taste good and wave goodbye a few minutes later.
WTF is your calorie goal set at for 2 pieces of pizza to screw it up?
1600. I suppose if I had a lot less to lose or wanted to still be jackin around with the same cut years from now, I could set it up somewhere around where yours is.
Wow, that's surprising. I'm 5'4" and when I was cutting (started around 160), I was eating 1700 calories a day. It took a year to get down to 135, my current weight. You look considerably taller and male. Are you maintaining much of your lean body mass with that sort of deficit?0 -
Wait. Are you still mad because a Texan dared to call themselves a Southerner and pointed out that you were taking common words and trying to play a race card off of them? lol
Wait.............Texas isn't a southern state? Technically, I am from Louisiana and live in Texas. Either way, I'm a Southerner.
Yes, I know OT but I cannot get into a "healthy" pizza debate. Sometimes, I eat because it's tasty. :happy:
LOL Yeah, that was from another thread. I was informed that I am in fact, not a Southerner because Texas is a "western" state. We'll just forget that Texas is almost as far South as you can get, and the last of the Confederates to surrender.
All that is really far OT though. My apologies, everyone.
Honestly, it's just ridiculous to say that you aren't southern because you're from Texas. This topic is totally derailed anyway. It'd be safe to say that certain parts of Florida aren't Southern, but Texas? C'mon. Nowadays you don't even need to live in a state that is stereotypically southern (or northern) to practice the cultural things that we practice.0 -
That is my BMR.. are you sure you have your calories set right? i'm a 5'10" woman and I weight 191.
Yeah, it's low but it's set right. As long as I stick to my plan I'm plenty full on that, and have more than enough fuel to exercize on.0 -
I cannot even fathom how much "meat and green leafy things" you must be eating in order to fill you up more than a large pizza.
Everyone is different you know..
if you can eat an entire pizza and it fills you for hours, then that is great for you. Eating a large pizza will *empty* me, rather quickly, if you catch my drift and i'll be hungry soon thereafter. I am capable of eating an entire pizza in one sitting too.
Or I can make my HUGE dinner of "meat and green leafy things" and be full for a long time. More protein in my dinner versus the pizza, less fat, less carbs less calories and less grease in my dinner and full longer. That's so winning it almost needs a new category.
ETA: i'm assuming pizza you buy, not homemade pizza. Which can be very healthy and filling depending on how it's made. I've experienced both sides when eating homemade pizza.
Yep, fully aware that people are different. Some people have been saying for a couple of days that pizza and burrito bowls are unhealthy. When pressed to further define "unhealthy" it was then changed to "because it doesn't fill me up". I'm just honestly confused, and maybe this is because I'm a petite female, how a burrito bowl or an entire pizza (and I wasn't distinguishing between homemade or delivery) can not fill you up. I don't eat an entire pizza, because I am honestly too full after 2-3 slices. I get that people can eat a lot more than I do, I'm just trying to understand, if satiety is what you are looking for - how much volume of meat and vegetables one would have to consume to surpass the full feeling that comes from pizza.
As others have pointed out there are plenty of ways to modify pizza recipes to make them "healthier" by whatever definition you subscribe to. Completely eliminating pizza forever for your diet because you deem it "unhealthy", sounds like a miserable existence.
No kidding. That's why I don't plan to do that. You see right now, with my current calorie deficit, a couple pieces of pizza is a meal or actually a bit more. If I ate those two pieces, I would then find myself in a really horrible position of being ridiculously hungry and out of calories. Besides, I don't know if this is the same for everyone but my local PaPaJohns doesn't deliver two pieces of pizza. You know what happens when you put a ravenously hungry fat man in a room with a large pizza? Bad Things happen.
Now one day when utopia has arrived, I will be at maintenance, and I will fully enjoy those two pieces of pizza and then I will fill up on foods that don't just taste good and wave goodbye a few minutes later.
WTF is your calorie goal set at for 2 pieces of pizza to screw it up?
1600. I suppose if I had a lot less to lose or wanted to still be jackin around with the same cut years from now, I could set it up somewhere around where yours is.
Wow, that's surprising. I'm 5'4" and when I was cutting (started around 160), I was eating 1700 calories a day. It took a year to get down to 135, my current weight. You look considerably taller and male. Are you maintaining much of your lean body mass with that sort of deficit?
That's what I was thinking. My brother started off at 290. He's 5'11" and eats 1900-2000 calories. He lost 100 pound the first year, and only has about 30 pounds to go. And his deficit and loss was still large enough and fast enough that he is considering outpatient surgery for all the loose skin. It's also why I keep my deficit close to 300-500 and am trying to lose slowly. I share the same genes with him and do NOT want loose skin. (and he doesn't even lift, haha)0 -
1600. I suppose if I had a lot less to lose or wanted to still be jackin around with the same cut years from now, I could set it up somewhere around where yours is. [/quote]
That is my BMR.. are you sure you have your calories set right? i'm a 5'10" woman and I weight 191.[/quote]
There's nothing inherently wrong with eating below your BMR. What is "too much" of a deficit depends on how much fat you're carrying around on your body and how you feel eating at that deficit. If your deficit is so low that your body has to tap into your lean mass for energy (which I'd wager is way more aggressive of a caloric deficit than most people think), that's too low. If you're constantly starving and lacking energy, that's probably too low of a deficit. But below your BMR? That's largely irrelevant.0 -
That is my BMR.. are you sure you have your calories set right? i'm a 5'10" woman and I weight 191.
Yeah, it's low but it's set right. As long as I stick to my plan I'm plenty full on that, and have more than enough fuel to exercize on.
But what about LBM loss and loose skin?0 -
That is my BMR.. are you sure you have your calories set right? i'm a 5'10" woman and I weight 191.
Yeah, it's low but it's set right. As long as I stick to my plan I'm plenty full on that, and have more than enough fuel to exercize on.
Ok.. just sounds really low.. I'm often "full" before I hit 1600. but I want to be healthy, and a lot of that is eating right, not just eating less. I have TDEE of 2300 on a fairly non-active day and my active days will push it to 3500-4000. I try my best to eat more on those days. With varied success.
Is 1600 your net calories?? Or just your goal before exercise?0 -
Let me get down into bunker before I utter the words cauliflower crust. I know it's a horrible crime against pizza-humanity (pizzamanity? pizzanity?) but I personally find it delicious and enough to satisfy that pizza desire when I'm looking to save calories.
Maybe just call it a cauliflower recipe rather than a pizza recipe.
But you actually eat that and admit to it? And say you think it's tasty?
Courageous girl you are
You could survive a famine using grass recipes. And call it green salad
This thread is going in soooo many different directions - pizza recipes, borscht gifs, who's a Southerner? and now....
Cauliflower hating!
Personally, I love cauliflower, roasted with a little olive oil and topped with a little parm cheese. I haven't tried the cauliflower pizza crust. Sounds yummy if you like cauliflower.
Here's a new twist, Paleo cheesecake. Healthy and Paleo!
What's unhealthy about regular cheesecake (as part of a calorie-controlled, nutritionally appropriate diet)?
:huh:
(And yes, your use of "healthy" in this context implies that regular cheesecake is "unhealthy", so we're once again back to the labels of "good" and "bad" food.)0 -
Let me get down into bunker before I utter the words cauliflower crust. I know it's a horrible crime against pizza-humanity (pizzamanity? pizzanity?) but I personally find it delicious and enough to satisfy that pizza desire when I'm looking to save calories.
Maybe just call it a cauliflower recipe rather than a pizza recipe.
But you actually eat that and admit to it? And say you think it's tasty?
Courageous girl you are
You could survive a famine using grass recipes. And call it green salad
This thread is going in soooo many different directions - pizza recipes, borscht gifs, who's a Southerner? and now....
Cauliflower hating!
Personally, I love cauliflower, roasted with a little olive oil and topped with a little parm cheese. I haven't tried the cauliflower pizza crust. Sounds yummy if you like cauliflower.
Here's a new twist, Paleo cheesecake. Healthy and Paleo!
I once googled "paleo cornbread" and found a muffin recipe that was nothing like cornbread but was really freaking delicious. Used coconut flour and coconut oil; it was like a macaroon.
I bet a paleo cheesecake would use a lot of cashews and be insanely high in calories.0 -
That is my BMR.. are you sure you have your calories set right? i'm a 5'10" woman and I weight 191.
Yeah, it's low but it's set right. As long as I stick to my plan I'm plenty full on that, and have more than enough fuel to exercize on.
Ok.. just sounds really low.. I'm often "full" before I hit 1600. but I want to be healthy, and a lot of that is eating right, not just eating less. I have TDEE of 2300 on a fairly non-active day and my active days will push it to 3500-4000. I try my best to eat more on those days. With varied success.
Is 1600 your net calories?? Or just your goal before exercise?
Disclaimer: I am not promoting my deficit for anyone else, just answering questions. It works for me, and that's all.
1600 is my goal, period. I don't go over and I don't eat back exercise calories. I generally get around 100g of carbs and 140g or more of protein off of that. Do lots of cardio and lift several times a week. I'm averaging around 3-4 pounds lost per week.0 -
That is my BMR.. are you sure you have your calories set right? i'm a 5'10" woman and I weight 191.
Yeah, it's low but it's set right. As long as I stick to my plan I'm plenty full on that, and have more than enough fuel to exercize on.
But what about LBM loss and loose skin?
Provided he lifts and eats ample protein, he won't lose more LBM unless he eats at such an aggressive deficit that his body can't pull enough energy from his fat stores - at 1600 net calories, he'd likely have to be in the single digits for body fat to even be at risk of that happening. If he can cut faster and then look to recomp/bulk, he'll probably come out with more LBM over the next few years by cutting more quickly, versus if he cut at 0.5-1.0lb/week unnecessarily. The only good reason (IMO) to cut at a very slow rate when you have a good amount of weight to lose is if you cannot suppress your appetite in any other way and you just have to eat those extra calories to stick with your cut - but that's almost never the case.
As for loose skin, there's really nothing to suggest that cutting very slowly is any better than cutting quickly, other than in the "slow" cut your body has more time for your skin to adjust. People typically compare someone who cuts over 2 years with someone who cut within 1 year, but that's not apples to apples, since you're comparing a time period of 2 years with a time period of 1 year (as an example). For instance, if you compare a male who cuts quickly to single digit BF %'age in one year and maintains single digit BF %'age for another year, to another male who cuts slowly over the course of 2 years, I suspect you'd see very little difference in loose skin.
You also have to consider that it's much better from a health perspective to drop the weight sooner rather than later. In short, all signs point to an aggressive cut, provided you can see it through.0 -
Let me get down into bunker before I utter the words cauliflower crust. I know it's a horrible crime against pizza-humanity (pizzamanity? pizzanity?) but I personally find it delicious and enough to satisfy that pizza desire when I'm looking to save calories.
Maybe just call it a cauliflower recipe rather than a pizza recipe.
But you actually eat that and admit to it? And say you think it's tasty?
Courageous girl you are
You could survive a famine using grass recipes. And call it green salad
This thread is going in soooo many different directions - pizza recipes, borscht gifs, who's a Southerner? and now....
Cauliflower hating!
Personally, I love cauliflower, roasted with a little olive oil and topped with a little parm cheese. I haven't tried the cauliflower pizza crust. Sounds yummy if you like cauliflower.
Here's a new twist, Paleo cheesecake. Healthy and Paleo!
What's unhealthy about regular cheesecake (as part of a calorie-controlled, nutritionally appropriate diet)?
:huh:
(And yes, your use of "healthy" in this context implies that regular cheesecake is "unhealthy", so we're once again back to the labels of "good" and "bad" food.)
No, it implies the Paleo cheesecake is healthy :drinker:0 -
That is my BMR.. are you sure you have your calories set right? i'm a 5'10" woman and I weight 191.
Yeah, it's low but it's set right. As long as I stick to my plan I'm plenty full on that, and have more than enough fuel to exercize on.
But what about LBM loss and loose skin?
Provided he lifts and eats ample protein, he won't lose more LBM unless he eats at such an aggressive deficit that his body can't pull enough energy from his fat stores - at 1600 net calories, he'd likely have to be in the single digits for body fat to even be at risk of that happening. If he can cut faster and then look to recomp/bulk, he'll probably come out with more LBM over the next few years by cutting more quickly, versus if he cut at 0.5-1.0lb/week unnecessarily. The only good reason (IMO) to cut at a very slow rate when you have a good amount of weight to lose is if you cannot suppress your appetite in any other way and you just have to eat those extra calories to stick with your cut - but that's almost never the case.
As for loose skin, there's really nothing to suggest that cutting very slowly is any better than cutting quickly, other than in the "slow" cut your body has more time for your skin to adjust. People typically compare someone who cuts over 2 years with someone who cut within 1 year, but that's not apples to apples, since you're comparing a time period of 2 years with a time period of 1 year (as an example). For instance, if you compare a male who cuts quickly to single digit BF %'age in one year and maintains single digit BF %'age for another year, to another male who cuts slowly over the course of 2 years, I suspect you'd see very little difference in loose skin.
You also have to consider that it's much better from a health perspective to drop the weight sooner rather than later. In short, all signs point to an aggressive cut, provided you can see it through.
Thank you. This is all pretty much my view on things as well. You just laid it all out really nicely.0 -
Let me get down into bunker before I utter the words cauliflower crust. I know it's a horrible crime against pizza-humanity (pizzamanity? pizzanity?) but I personally find it delicious and enough to satisfy that pizza desire when I'm looking to save calories.
Maybe just call it a cauliflower recipe rather than a pizza recipe.
But you actually eat that and admit to it? And say you think it's tasty?
Courageous girl you are
You could survive a famine using grass recipes. And call it green salad
This thread is going in soooo many different directions - pizza recipes, borscht gifs, who's a Southerner? and now....
Cauliflower hating!
Personally, I love cauliflower, roasted with a little olive oil and topped with a little parm cheese. I haven't tried the cauliflower pizza crust. Sounds yummy if you like cauliflower.
Here's a new twist, Paleo cheesecake. Healthy and Paleo!
I once googled "paleo cornbread" and found a muffin recipe that was nothing like cornbread but was really freaking delicious. Used coconut flour and coconut oil; it was like a macaroon.
I bet a paleo cheesecake would use a lot of cashews and be insanely high in calories.
I would think the ingredients would put it right up there with the best of cheesecakes!0 -
That is my BMR.. are you sure you have your calories set right? i'm a 5'10" woman and I weight 191.
Yeah, it's low but it's set right. As long as I stick to my plan I'm plenty full on that, and have more than enough fuel to exercize on.
But what about LBM loss and loose skin?
Provided he lifts and eats ample protein, he won't lose more LBM unless he eats at such an aggressive deficit that his body can't pull enough energy from his fat stores - at 1600 net calories, he'd likely have to be in the single digits for body fat to even be at risk of that happening. If he can cut faster and then look to recomp/bulk, he'll probably come out with more LBM over the next few years by cutting more quickly, versus if he cut at 0.5-1.0lb/week unnecessarily. The only good reason (IMO) to cut at a very slow rate when you have a good amount of weight to lose is if you cannot suppress your appetite in any other way and you just have to eat those extra calories to stick with your cut - but that's almost never the case.
As for loose skin, there's really nothing to suggest that cutting very slowly is any better than cutting quickly, other than in the "slow" cut your body has more time for your skin to adjust. People typically compare someone who cuts over 2 years with someone who cut within 1 year, but that's not apples to apples, since you're comparing a time period of 2 years with a time period of 1 year (as an example). For instance, if you compare a male who cuts quickly to single digit BF %'age in one year and maintains single digit BF %'age for another year, to another male who cuts slowly over the course of 2 years, I suspect you'd see very little difference in loose skin.
You also have to consider that it's much better from a health perspective to drop the weight sooner rather than later. In short, all signs point to an aggressive cut, provided you can see it through.
But he doesn't eat back exercise calories so he's netting less than 1600. I'd consider that an aggressive deficit. It might be medically beneficial for him to lose the weight fast and forgo maintaining LBM. That seems like what he's doing because I suspect that the percentage of muscle to body fat lost is fairly high.0 -
That is my BMR.. are you sure you have your calories set right? i'm a 5'10" woman and I weight 191.
Yeah, it's low but it's set right. As long as I stick to my plan I'm plenty full on that, and have more than enough fuel to exercize on.
But what about LBM loss and loose skin?
Provided he lifts and eats ample protein, he won't lose more LBM unless he eats at such an aggressive deficit that his body can't pull enough energy from his fat stores - at 1600 net calories, he'd likely have to be in the single digits for body fat to even be at risk of that happening. If he can cut faster and then look to recomp/bulk, he'll probably come out with more LBM over the next few years by cutting more quickly, versus if he cut at 0.5-1.0lb/week unnecessarily. The only good reason (IMO) to cut at a very slow rate when you have a good amount of weight to lose is if you cannot suppress your appetite in any other way and you just have to eat those extra calories to stick with your cut - but that's almost never the case.
As for loose skin, there's really nothing to suggest that cutting very slowly is any better than cutting quickly, other than in the "slow" cut your body has more time for your skin to adjust. People typically compare someone who cuts over 2 years with someone who cut within 1 year, but that's not apples to apples, since you're comparing a time period of 2 years with a time period of 1 year (as an example). For instance, if you compare a male who cuts quickly to single digit BF %'age in one year and maintains single digit BF %'age for another year, to another male who cuts slowly over the course of 2 years, I suspect you'd see very little difference in loose skin.
You also have to consider that it's much better from a health perspective to drop the weight sooner rather than later. In short, all signs point to an aggressive cut, provided you can see it through.
One key in here....It's not 1600 net, it's 1600 gross. I would venture net is closer to 1000-1200?0 -
Rant away it's ok but sorry I will take the title of terrible person because Papa Johns pizza is not in the same ballpark as pizza from the little Italian pizza shop
I love papajohn's pizza- it's almost the ONLY pizza I will order- every other single "mom and pop little italian place"- makes *kitten* pizza the way I like it- with green peppers and pepperoni.
I will eat "supreme" or meat lovers or whatever- actually- I've grown rather fond of "everything" pizza's but the reality is mom and pop stores- the green peppers come out looking like canned anchovies. They are so gross- even my die hard brooklyn old fashioned italian pizza place boyfriend finally ponied up and admitted the papa johns was a decent pizza- and it's CONSISTENT. He has a few places he prefers more- but he will eat papa johns with no wailing and gnashing of teeth. -
I gave up on trying to order from small chain's; their pizza blows- they only thing they are good at making are plain ole cheese pizza's and that's it- that's the ONLY thing that comes out consistent. And yes- I've had pizza in NYC. it's mediocre at best. Making it with anything 'extra' on it- is a recipe for disaster.
it's not sensible at all. 1600 is low for a man as it is- plus NOT eating back workout calories?That sounds very okay, sensible and doable.
And I'm sure you don't feel like you're dying.
I'm eating around 1400-1500 a day- and I DO eat back my calories- and I'm a girl- and I workout between 10-15 hrs a week.
That being said- I am at the bottom bottom end of healthy for weight loss numbers- and I'm willing to accept that I'm not "happy" (I'm hungry ALL the time- I'm tired- recover is suffering) but I'm trying to meet a hard dead line- so I can absolutely understand the drive to push harder- esp if you are getting results- but you have to be careful.0 -
Let me get down into bunker before I utter the words cauliflower crust. I know it's a horrible crime against pizza-humanity (pizzamanity? pizzanity?) but I personally find it delicious and enough to satisfy that pizza desire when I'm looking to save calories.
Maybe just call it a cauliflower recipe rather than a pizza recipe.
But you actually eat that and admit to it? And say you think it's tasty?
Courageous girl you are
You could survive a famine using grass recipes. And call it green salad
This thread is going in soooo many different directions - pizza recipes, borscht gifs, who's a Southerner? and now....
Cauliflower hating!
Personally, I love cauliflower, roasted with a little olive oil and topped with a little parm cheese. I haven't tried the cauliflower pizza crust. Sounds yummy if you like cauliflower.
Here's a new twist, Paleo cheesecake. Healthy and Paleo!
What's unhealthy about regular cheesecake (as part of a calorie-controlled, nutritionally appropriate diet)?
:huh:
(And yes, your use of "healthy" in this context implies that regular cheesecake is "unhealthy", so we're once again back to the labels of "good" and "bad" food.)
No, it implies the Paleo cheesecake is healthy :drinker:
False dichotomy is false...
...but I accept that you won't understand this.
(I replied only for the benefit of those who still might.)0 -
That is my BMR.. are you sure you have your calories set right? i'm a 5'10" woman and I weight 191.
Yeah, it's low but it's set right. As long as I stick to my plan I'm plenty full on that, and have more than enough fuel to exercize on.
Ok.. just sounds really low.. I'm often "full" before I hit 1600. but I want to be healthy, and a lot of that is eating right, not just eating less. I have TDEE of 2300 on a fairly non-active day and my active days will push it to 3500-4000. I try my best to eat more on those days. With varied success.
Is 1600 your net calories?? Or just your goal before exercise?
Disclaimer: I am not promoting my deficit for anyone else, just answering questions. It works for me, and that's all.
1600 is my goal, period. I don't go over and I don't eat back exercise calories. I generally get around 100g of carbs and 140g or more of protein off of that. Do lots of cardio and lift several times a week. I'm averaging around 3-4 pounds lost per week.
Ok.. I was just asking. I'm not trying to pick apart your diet or your choices. just seems so low. I eat over 200g of protein most days and just over 100g carbs right now. Not losing that much per week, but I only have 20 lbs left to go, so that's to be expected. I just find it interesting that your calories are set to the same as mine. Of course.. I started out wayyy under eating. So I've increased calories and still lost the weight.0 -
it's not sensible at all. 1600 is low for a man as it is- plus NOT eating back workout calories?
He'll be okay Jo. He'll be okay. Don't worry.
Thanks, doc.
Please keep us apprised of his health throughout this process...and please pay close attention to his transition from a deficit to maintenance, as I suspect that will be quite a challenge for your patient.0 -
it's not sensible at all. 1600 is low for a man as it is- plus NOT eating back workout calories?
I can only speak for myself, but I lost 50 pounds in about 8 months eating roughly 2500 calories per day and lifting 3-4 days per week with little cardio...
I am a "big" guy even lean though (I hit 10% body fat at about 5'10" 200 lbs).0
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