It should be required by federal law...

Jestinia

Already got my nose buried in it, and will be branching out. Bogged down already because there are different forms of copper. You didn't have to get cute about the chem trails, though. If something isn't in a peer reviewed abstract, I don't chase it, unless I was skimming and picked a bad source or I'm just bored and having fun with popular conspiracy theories.

Well, good luck to you (seriously). May you come out the wiser and not overly worried about the minor stuff. Knowing stuff and then knowing to let it go is also a process and that is why I was "being cute" about that stuff.

I edited the post you quoted, a secondary point is we already have rules and laws that cover a lot of this for chains, asking smaller restaurants to provide equivalent info has a culinary, economic and quality cost, if enforced. Or one can recognize that the calorie info published at most places will be a fantasy.

Thanks, I learn what I can. I'm not a believer in keeping information from us 'regular' people for fear we'll misunderstand and misuse it, that justification has been used too many times by the powerful to keep the rest of us in line. But I don't pretend I have the education background I need to jump right on any piece of information and get it right the first time. I just do the best I can. Also, I could use a few less things to worry about! But never out of ignorance. Ignorance is only bliss until it gets you killed.

Meanwhile, I don't advocate forcing smaller, less profitable businesses to label their calories at a high cost to them. Just the big, profitable chains. Although a tax break on small businesses willing to voluntarily do so could sweeten the deal enough to make it worthwhile to them. I could go for that.

EvgeniZyntx

But someday I might, and if that happens, yes, I would like profitable businesses to provide me with nutrition information, and in my opinion it's reasonable to make them do so.

1. Who is going to determine which business are profitable and so should be providing said information?
2. Who is going to pay for the person who is going to run this kind of analysis?
3. Are you willing to pay higher prices for the additional expenses that businesses, especially small businesses, will incur as a result of this mandate?
4. What is reasonable? If a business has a profit margin of 1% and your need for nutritional information makes them unprofitable, is that reasonable?

And....

Here is the kicker....

5. Why can't you assume some personal responsibility and do some research for yourself to make your own choices? Are you that busy? Is it that hard? If you order a cheeseburger with french fries and dessert, you can pretty much assume it's going to have a high calorie count. If you order a salad will a number of high calorie items on it, guess what? High calorie count.

Good lord.

If the nutrition info is available online, I'm willing to see it as a reasonable compromise. If it isn't available anywhere, I can't take proper personal responsibility for myself if I don't have the correct information, except of course to avoid any place that doesn't provide it. There goes the power luncheon I had planned to participate in. Darn, was so looking forward to it. Guess I could sip ice water while my future colleagues stuff their faces?

If it's not a huge burden for food companies to put nutritional info on the packaging it shouldn't be for restaurants, either. But silly me! I haven't asked you: Would you agree that forcing anyone to label their food with ingredients and calorie counts is just big government overstepping their bounds? Should we put a stop to that as well? After all, it costs money to regulate, enforce, and carry out.

Next you'll want cooks to weigh your food as they prepare it. Lol.

It isn't that there isn't info out there, it is that mandating more info isn't necessarily more valuable and has many costs.

PRMinx

Well. I only read the first two or three pages and all I can conclude is the OP should make sure his mommy is weighing the crusts she cuts off of his PB&J sammich every morning so he knows how many calories are in his lunch.

LOL. I die.

KseRz

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

MonaLisaLianne

Sounds like a first world problem to me.

Where is the "Like" button for this post? The last thing we need is more laws protecting people from their own laziness or refusal to educate themselves.

Sun_Wukong

The premise of this thread is sad really as it is indicative of people who have taken calorie counting (MFP) and nutritional values to the extreme.

It is meant as a tool to keep you on track to help you live a longer, healthier and hopefully happier life, but people seem so committed to the concept that everything has to have a nutritional/calorie value applied to, labeled and stamped on it.

Seriously are people so insecure about their adherence that they can no longer enjoy a meal at a restaurant, a friend's house or cake at a birthday, living in the moment and just enjoying themselves.

Is self-imposed moderation and a fragment of common sense beyond people nowadays.

A night out enjoying yourself and *gasp* even going over your calorie goal or not hitting your macros is not going to undo all the work you have put in.

This is meant as a tool to develop a healthy relationship with food and your body but the level of obsession displayed in this thread denotes a different relationship altogether.

Time to reassess your eating habits for some people and I am not talking about nutritional values...

...each to their own of course! Me I shall enjoy the company of my friends and family whilst out eating while others can stress about finding a franchise that caters to their fanaticism and insecurities about food values.

Jestinia

But someday I might, and if that happens, yes, I would like profitable businesses to provide me with nutrition information, and in my opinion it's reasonable to make them do so.

1. Who is going to determine which business are profitable and so should be providing said information?
2. Who is going to pay for the person who is going to run this kind of analysis?
3. Are you willing to pay higher prices for the additional expenses that businesses, especially small businesses, will incur as a result of this mandate?
4. What is reasonable? If a business has a profit margin of 1% and your need for nutritional information makes them unprofitable, is that reasonable?

And....

Here is the kicker....

5. Why can't you assume some personal responsibility and do some research for yourself to make your own choices? Are you that busy? Is it that hard? If you order a cheeseburger with french fries and dessert, you can pretty much assume it's going to have a high calorie count. If you order a salad will a number of high calorie items on it, guess what? High calorie count.

Good lord.

If the nutrition info is available online, I'm willing to see it as a reasonable compromise. If it isn't available anywhere, I can't take proper personal responsibility for myself if I don't have the correct information, except of course to avoid any place that doesn't provide it. There goes the power luncheon I had planned to participate in. Darn, was so looking forward to it. Guess I could sip ice water while my future colleagues stuff their faces?

If it's not a huge burden for food companies to put nutritional info on the packaging it shouldn't be for restaurants, either. But silly me! I haven't asked you: Would you agree that forcing anyone to label their food with ingredients and calorie counts is just big government overstepping their bounds? Should we put a stop to that as well? After all, it costs money to regulate, enforce, and carry out.

Next you'll want cooks to weigh your food as they prepare it. Lol.

It isn't that there isn't info out there, it is that mandating more info isn't necessarily more valuable and has many costs.

I posted about this awhile back. Food manufactures have a huge leeway of %20 in their package estimations, so no, the cook shouldn't have to go nuts weighing and measuring. A decent estimate for %90 or so of available dishes would be fine, thus even excluding dishes that change regularly from day to day or week to week. And only for large and profitable companies, exclude the mom and pops, what few remain.

rml_16

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

The biggest problem here is people eating at Buffalo Wild Wings ...

MonaLisaLianne

Do I like when a restaurant has the nutritional information YES, do I think we need the government mandating yet another area of our lives NO! One meal isn't making a difference estimate what you had and move on, and if you are so worried about it don't go out to eat at that establishment.

Amen!

SunofaBeach14

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

I just like BWW more and more. Great wings and a good selection of beers. And, if you're eating there for the salads then you're doing it wrong.

SapiensPisces

The premise of this thread is sad really as it is indicative of people who have taken calorie counting (MFP) and nutritional values to the extreme.

It is meant as a tool to keep you on track to help you live a longer, healthier and hopefully happier life, but people seem so committed to the concept that everything has to have a nutritional/calorie value applied to, labeled and stamped on it.

Seriously are people so insecure about their adherence that they can no longer enjoy a meal at a restaurant, a friend's house or cake at a birthday, living in the moment and just enjoying themselves.

Is self-imposed moderation and a fragment of common sense beyond people nowadays.

A night out enjoying yourself and *gasp* even going over your calorie goal or not hitting your macros is not going to undo all the work you have put in.

This is meant as a tool to develop a healthy relationship with food and your body but the level of obsession displayed in this thread denotes a different relationship altogether.

Time to reassess your eating habits for some people and I am not talking about nutritional values...

...each to their own of course! Me I shall enjoy the company of my friends and family whilst out eating while others can stress about finding a franchise that caters to their fanaticism and insecurities about food values.

So much this.

EvgeniZyntx

Already got my nose buried in it, and will be branching out. Bogged down already because there are different forms of copper. You didn't have to get cute about the chem trails, though. If something isn't in a peer reviewed abstract, I don't chase it, unless I was skimming and picked a bad source or I'm just bored and having fun with popular conspiracy theories.

Well, good luck to you (seriously). May you come out the wiser and not overly worried about the minor stuff. Knowing stuff and then knowing to let it go is also a process and that is why I was "being cute" about that stuff.

I edited the post you quoted, a secondary point is we already have rules and laws that cover a lot of this for chains, asking smaller restaurants to provide equivalent info has a culinary, economic and quality cost, if enforced. Or one can recognize that the calorie info published at most places will be a fantasy.

Thanks, I learn what I can. I'm not a believer in keeping information from us 'regular' people for fear we'll misunderstand and misuse it, that justification has been used too many times by the powerful to keep the rest of us in line. But I don't pretend I have the education background I need to jump right on any piece of information and get it right the first time. I just do the best I can. Also, I could use a few less things to worry about! But never out of ignorance. Ignorance is only bliss until it gets you killed.

Meanwhile, I don't advocate forcing smaller, less profitable businesses to label their calories at a high cost to them. Just the big, profitable chains. Although a tax break on small businesses willing to voluntarily do so could sweeten the deal enough to make it worthwhile to them. I could go for that.

Well, that's all ready in place in many states and there already is an FDA level law since 2010 but the implementation is still full of issues.

http://www.fda.gov/Food/IngredientsPackagingLabeling/LabelingNutrition/ucm248732.htm

Again there is NO further legislation need, just the execution of current rules. And again, there are real reasons why it makes sense to exclude them for non-large chain restaurants if you want them to be tested and valid.

RGv2

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

I just like BWW more and more. Great wings and a good selection of beers. And, if you're eating there for the salads then you're doing it wrong.

Yep, swung in for lunch Saturday. Kid loves all the sports options on the TV's, kids meals are good sized for the price, I have no idea how many calories I had....still don't care.

sjohnny

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

I just like BWW more and more. Great wings and a good selection of beers. And, if you're eating there for the salads then you're doing it wrong.

I like their chili cheese dip. It's delicious AND healthy.

MassiveDelta

Sounds like a first world problem to me.

And many/most of us are in the first world nations . . . your point would be?

the point is if you are so spoiled to require this you wouldn't need it if you lived an ate like a 3rd world citizen. Wouldn't need to lose weight either.

PRMinx

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

So, people by their own free will decide to drink beer, eat wings and indulge in a bunch of fried food. BWW makes money serving these people who, by their own choice, are patrons of the restaurant. That money goes to providing jobs to employees, jobs to suppliers (who then in turn provide jobs to employees), taxes for all this regulation everyone wants and so one, and so forth.

BWW posted the calorie counts and their sales dropped. So, to protect their margins (and those jobs, and all that tax money you want), they reversed the order.

Are you actually suggesting that BWW should do things that have been proven to hurt their sales simply because some people are too lazy to Google information? Or too stupid to know that beer, wings and french fries are fattening? C'mon.

Edited to add: I love BWW. I drink beer, I eat wings and I have a great 'ol time. I know that this is a high calorie endeavor. Being personally responsible for myself, I go for a run before the shenanigans and then get right back to my good habits after. It's not hard.

athensguy

No? That's part of being conscious of what you put into your body. I'm not saying that you look at the nutrition facts and say "no i can never have that" or "This is what I have to eat every time I come here" but I am saying that if you know what you are eating then you can plan the rest of the meals during your day to line up with what you are eating at that particular meal. Because after all, the thing that all of us are doing here (on this site) is trying to keep up with calories.

Last time I looked the site was called "myfitnesspal" not "my'weigthlosspal"......not everyone here wants to lose weight

If you can't occasionally go out and enjoy a meal based solely on the quality of the food, the service / presentation and the ambiance of the restaurant you're overthinking it.......

Looks like the main feature of this site is calorie counting. I guess a lot of people are mainly here to troll the forums, though. If you think it's OK to eat an extra 3000 calories every time you go out to eat you're under-thinking it.

delicious_cocktail

I shared a desert at Chili's with a friend recently. After dinner I learned that that desert was 1,400 calories. I think it would be great to have a break down of calories, fat, protein and carbs. I would have made a better choice. I feel more strongly about providing real food and eliminating processed stuff.

You didn't make a better choice because you didn't bother to look. More info would definitely have helped you there . . .lol

Not eating at Chili's would've been a better choice . . . . . . ..

rml_16

I shared a desert at Chili's with a friend recently. After dinner I learned that that desert was 1,400 calories. I think it would be great to have a break down of calories, fat, protein and carbs. I would have made a better choice. I feel more strongly about providing real food and eliminating processed stuff.

You didn't make a better choice because you didn't bother to look. More info would definitely have helped you there . . .lol

Not eating at Chili's would've been a better choice . . . . . . ..

But he eats at Chili's because he wants "real, unprocessed food."

RivenV

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

So, people by their own free will decide to drink beer, eat wings and indulge in a bunch of fried food. BWW makes money serving these people who, by their own choice, are patrons of the restaurant. That money goes to providing jobs to employees, jobs to suppliers (who then in turn provide jobs to employees), taxes for all this regulation everyone wants and so one, and so forth.

BWW posted the calorie counts and their sales dropped. So, to protect their margins (and those jobs, and all that tax money you want), they reversed the order.

Are you actually suggesting that BWW should do things that have been proven to hurt their sales simply because some people are too lazy to Google information? Or too stupid to know that beer, wings and french fries are fattening? C'mon.

But, but, but... People can't be bothered to be held responsible for their food choices!! That's heinous and unreasonable. Besides, everyone knows that business only make money--they never stop making money. Ever.

(/sarc, in case there's any doubt)