It should be required by federal law...

KseRz

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

The biggest problem here is people eating at Buffalo Wild Wings ...

Wings are delicious !!!

I used to eat about 18-24 on avg ...... Ive cut that in half since MFP.....because the info was available on MFP, not on their menu or website. I suspect that the nutrition info came from someone in California (where they are required by law to provide that) who entered it into the database ? So I thank them.

sjohnny

I shared a desert at Chili's with a friend recently. After dinner I learned that that desert was 1,400 calories. I think it would be great to have a break down of calories, fat, protein and carbs. I would have made a better choice. I feel more strongly about providing real food and eliminating processed stuff.

You didn't make a better choice because you didn't bother to look. More info would definitely have helped you there . . .lol

Not eating at Chili's would've been a better choice . . . . . . ..

But but but......

El Nino is such a delicious cocktail

rml_16

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

The biggest problem here is people eating at Buffalo Wild Wings ...

Wings are delicious !!!

I used to eat about 18-24 on avg ...... Ive cut that in half since MFP.....because the info was available on MFP, not on their menu or website. I suspect that the nutrition info came from someone in California (where they are required by law to provide that) who entered it into the database ? So I thank them.

I'm not saying wings aren't delicious (though I gave them up with all meat a long time ago). I'm saying if you're going to BWW for wings, you're doing it wrong. ;-)

KseRz

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

The biggest problem here is people eating at Buffalo Wild Wings ...

Wings are delicious !!!

I used to eat about 18-24 on avg ...... Ive cut that in half since MFP.....because the info was available on MFP, not on their menu or website. I suspect that the nutrition info came from someone in California (where they are required by law to provide that) who entered it into the database ? So I thank them.

I'm not saying wings aren't delicious (though I gave them up with all meat a long time ago). I'm saying if you're going to BWW for wings, you're doing it wrong. ;-)

Should I be going there for their wheat grass and sushi?

Galatea_Stone

Wings are delicious !!!

I know there were a bunch of other words above and below this, but I didn't read them. I just saw the bolded part and now I want wings. Mango Habanero, please.

sjohnny

I'm not saying wings aren't delicious (though I gave them up with all meat a long time ago). I'm saying if you're going to BWW for wings, you're doing it wrong. ;-)

You sure do seem to be an expert on how people should do ........ everything.

rml_16

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

The biggest problem here is people eating at Buffalo Wild Wings ...

Wings are delicious !!!

I used to eat about 18-24 on avg ...... Ive cut that in half since MFP.....because the info was available on MFP, not on their menu or website. I suspect that the nutrition info came from someone in California (where they are required by law to provide that) who entered it into the database ? So I thank them.

I'm not saying wings aren't delicious (though I gave them up with all meat a long time ago). I'm saying if you're going to BWW for wings, you're doing it wrong. ;-)

Should I be going there for their wheat grass and sushi?

No, no. You should be getting your wings elsewhere!

I grew up in new York state and lived in Buffalo. I've even had the original wings, though a lot of people prefer Duff's to Anchor Bar. There's a bar around the corner from my house even here in Florida that has wings to rival the best Buffalo has. In fact, had I not gone vegetarian, my proximity to that bar would probably have resulted in me gaining 300 pounds just from the wings ...

Chain restaurant wings? NO!

Commander_Keen

Seriously? You are attacking THIS of all things? The government regulates MANY things, including spending a half a trillion dollars on welfare and PROMOTING it through advertisement, and you are attacking my suggestion to mandate that all food have nutrition facts listed on it? alright then...

If your not part of the solution then its part of the problem. We do not need more government regulations, since the government can not regulate anything successfully.

Moving right along. When food is packaged and distributed it has to be lab tested for nutritional value. When it is a matter of assembling a meal out of items that have been lab tested for nutritional value you do not have to re-test them, you just have to add them up.

So really what you need to do is bring a food scale with you.
4oz of salmon is going to be 4oz of salmon,
and 1/2 cup of veggies will be half a cup of veggies..

SunofaBeach14

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

The biggest problem here is people eating at Buffalo Wild Wings ...

Wings are delicious !!!

I used to eat about 18-24 on avg ...... Ive cut that in half since MFP.....because the info was available on MFP, not on their menu or website. I suspect that the nutrition info came from someone in California (where they are required by law to provide that) who entered it into the database ? So I thank them.

I'm not saying wings aren't delicious (though I gave them up with all meat a long time ago). I'm saying if you're going to BWW for wings, you're doing it wrong. ;-)

Doesn't eat meat but has strong opinions on wings . . . It's okay, I have strong opinions about tofu

EvgeniZyntx

But someday I might, and if that happens, yes, I would like profitable businesses to provide me with nutrition information, and in my opinion it's reasonable to make them do so.

1. Who is going to determine which business are profitable and so should be providing said information?
2. Who is going to pay for the person who is going to run this kind of analysis?
3. Are you willing to pay higher prices for the additional expenses that businesses, especially small businesses, will incur as a result of this mandate?
4. What is reasonable? If a business has a profit margin of 1% and your need for nutritional information makes them unprofitable, is that reasonable?

And....

Here is the kicker....

5. Why can't you assume some personal responsibility and do some research for yourself to make your own choices? Are you that busy? Is it that hard? If you order a cheeseburger with french fries and dessert, you can pretty much assume it's going to have a high calorie count. If you order a salad will a number of high calorie items on it, guess what? High calorie count.

Good lord.

If the nutrition info is available online, I'm willing to see it as a reasonable compromise. If it isn't available anywhere, I can't take proper personal responsibility for myself if I don't have the correct information, except of course to avoid any place that doesn't provide it. There goes the power luncheon I had planned to participate in. Darn, was so looking forward to it. Guess I could sip ice water while my future colleagues stuff their faces?

If it's not a huge burden for food companies to put nutritional info on the packaging it shouldn't be for restaurants, either. But silly me! I haven't asked you: Would you agree that forcing anyone to label their food with ingredients and calorie counts is just big government overstepping their bounds? Should we put a stop to that as well? After all, it costs money to regulate, enforce, and carry out.

Next you'll want cooks to weigh your food as they prepare it. Lol.

It isn't that there isn't info out there, it is that mandating more info isn't necessarily more valuable and has many costs.

I posted about this awhile back. Food manufactures have a huge leeway of %20 in their package estimations, so no, the cook shouldn't have to go nuts weighing and measuring. A decent estimate for %90 or so of available dishes would be fine, thus even excluding dishes that change regularly from day to day or week to week. And only for large and profitable companies, exclude the mom and pops, what few remain.

Actually there are more small restaurants than you think. I spent a week in California eating exclusively in restaurants (my father liked taking me out) and we only ate at small places - from the local bagel shop to the sushi place to the fancy pants French restaurant.

The already proposed requirements aren't just guess and put it out there. There are pretty explicit and heavy...

A restaurant or similar retail food establishment must provide
to FDA, within a reasonable period of time upon request, information
substantiating nutrient values including the method and data used to
derive these nutrient levels. This information must include the
following:
(i) For nutrient databases:
(A) The identity of the database used.
(B) The recipe or formula used as a basis for the nutrient
declarations. The recipe posted on the database must be identical to
that used by the restaurant or similar retail food establishment to
prepare the menu item.
(C) For the specified amounts of each ingredient identified in the
recipe, a detailed listing (e.g., printout) of the amount of each
nutrient that that ingredient contributes to the menu item.
(D) If this information is not available because the nutrition
information was derived from a computer program, which is designed to
provide only a final list of nutrient values for the recipe, a
certificate of validation attesting to the accuracy of the computer
program.
(E) A detailed listing (e.g., printout) of the nutrient values
determined for each menu item.
(F) If this information is not derived through the aid of a
computer program

Page 19236

which provides a final nutrient analysis for the menu item, worksheets
used to determine the nutrient values for each of these menu items.
(G) Any other information pertinent to the final nutrient levels of
the menu item (e.g., information about what might cause slight
variations in the nutrient profile such as moisture variations).
(H) A statement signed by a responsible individual employed by the
covered establishment that can certify that the information contained
in the nutrient analysis is complete and accurate and that the recipe
used to prepare the menu item is identical to that used for the
nutrient analysis.
(ii) For published cookbooks that contain nutritional information
for recipes in the cookbook:
(A) The name, author and publisher of the cookbook used.
(B) If available, information provided by the cookbook about how
the nutrition information for the recipes was obtained.
(C) A copy of the recipe used to prepare the menu item and a copy
of the nutrition information for that menu item as provided by the
cookbook.
(D) A statement signed by a responsible individual employed by the
covered establishment certifying that the recipe used to prepare the
menu item by the restaurant or similar retail food establishment is the
same recipe provided in the cookbook. (Recipes may be divided as
necessary to accommodate differences in the portion size derived from
the recipe and that are served as the menu item but no changes may be
made to the proportion of ingredients used.)
(iii) For analyses:
(A) A copy of the recipe for the menu item used for the nutrient
analysis.
(B) The identity of the laboratory performing the analysis.
(C) Copies of analytical worksheets used to determine and verify
nutrition information.
(D) A statement signed by a responsible individual employed by the
covered establishment that can certify that the information contained
in the nutrient analysis is complete and accurate and an additional
signed statement certifying that the recipe used to prepare the menu
item is identical to that used for the nutrient analysis.
(iv) For nutrition information provided by other reasonable means:
(A) A detailed description of the method used to determine the
nutrition information.
(B) Documentation of the validity of that method.
(C) A recipe or formula used as a basis for the nutrient
determination. The recipe used in determining these nutrient values
must be the same recipe used by the restaurant and similar retail food
establishment to prepare the item.
(D) Any data derived in determining the nutrient values for the
menu item.
(E) A statement signed by a responsible individual employed by the
covered establishment that can certify that the information contained
in the nutrient analysis is complete and accurate and that the recipe
used to prepare the menu item is identical to that used for the
nutrient analysis.

Again, there is no need for smaller places to do this stuff, and that should be fine.

rml_16

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

The biggest problem here is people eating at Buffalo Wild Wings ...

Wings are delicious !!!

I used to eat about 18-24 on avg ...... Ive cut that in half since MFP.....because the info was available on MFP, not on their menu or website. I suspect that the nutrition info came from someone in California (where they are required by law to provide that) who entered it into the database ? So I thank them.

I'm not saying wings aren't delicious (though I gave them up with all meat a long time ago). I'm saying if you're going to BWW for wings, you're doing it wrong. ;-)

Doesn't eat meat but has strong opinions on wings . . . It's okay, I have strong opinions about tofu

Ate meat for 32 years.

Commander_Keen

It's a problem because I don't want to stop eating at certain restaurants I like. I don't want to quit eating their food, I want them to provide Nutrition information.

Bring a food scale and then google what you are eating.

Jestinia

Already got my nose buried in it, and will be branching out. Bogged down already because there are different forms of copper. You didn't have to get cute about the chem trails, though. If something isn't in a peer reviewed abstract, I don't chase it, unless I was skimming and picked a bad source or I'm just bored and having fun with popular conspiracy theories.

Well, good luck to you (seriously). May you come out the wiser and not overly worried about the minor stuff. Knowing stuff and then knowing to let it go is also a process and that is why I was "being cute" about that stuff.

I edited the post you quoted, a secondary point is we already have rules and laws that cover a lot of this for chains, asking smaller restaurants to provide equivalent info has a culinary, economic and quality cost, if enforced. Or one can recognize that the calorie info published at most places will be a fantasy.

Thanks, I learn what I can. I'm not a believer in keeping information from us 'regular' people for fear we'll misunderstand and misuse it, that justification has been used too many times by the powerful to keep the rest of us in line. But I don't pretend I have the education background I need to jump right on any piece of information and get it right the first time. I just do the best I can. Also, I could use a few less things to worry about! But never out of ignorance. Ignorance is only bliss until it gets you killed.

Meanwhile, I don't advocate forcing smaller, less profitable businesses to label their calories at a high cost to them. Just the big, profitable chains. Although a tax break on small businesses willing to voluntarily do so could sweeten the deal enough to make it worthwhile to them. I could go for that.

Well, that's all ready in place in many states and there already is an FDA level law since 2010 but the implementation is still full of issues.

http://www.fda.gov/Food/IngredientsPackagingLabeling/LabelingNutrition/ucm248732.htm

Again there is NO further legislation need, just the execution of current rules. And again, there are real reasons why it makes sense to exclude them for non-large chain restaurants if you want them to be tested and valid.

Implementation and enforcement do seem to be an issue (this is only for chains with 20 or more stores from what I read, so the mom and pop outfits are perfectly free to list or not list).

I found an interesting article on it that makes me wonder what is making the grocery stores kick up a fuss. Always more reading leads to more questions.

http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle/health/256654611.html

FDA Commissioner Margaret Hamburg told Congress earlier this month that writing the rules has been "much more challenging than expected." The agency issued proposed rules in 2011 but has faced pressure to revise them to exclude retail outlets like grocery and convenience stores.


Okay, nevermind, found it:

The supermarket and convenience store industries were perhaps the most unhappy with the rules that the FDA proposed in 2011. The agency proposed requiring those stores to label calories for prepared foods on menu boards and displays.

SunofaBeach14

...To have printed "Nutrition Facts" for every menu item in every restaurant in the country. It should be required to have it available either in print, at the front of the restaurant, or online for anyone to read. Does anyone else get as frustrated as I do when they go out to eat?

Buffalo Wild Wings did this for a short time.

What happened? Well they started losing sales to their higher calorie dense foods to items that were healthier options. Either A) People chose a different option or They ate less of the things they liked because they were finally given the information they have been needing to make positive choices about what they stuff in their face.

So what was BW3s response?

They removed all caloric/nutrition info from all their menus (where it wasnt required by law) so that they could sell more food to unsuspecting people that wont go out of their way to seek that info themselves. Its a shame an establishment like that has to appear deceitful in its business practice. Bottom line is most businesses do it because they are forced to by law. Not because they want to be helpful to its patrons and offer the information freely.

The biggest problem here is people eating at Buffalo Wild Wings ...

Wings are delicious !!!

I used to eat about 18-24 on avg ...... Ive cut that in half since MFP.....because the info was available on MFP, not on their menu or website. I suspect that the nutrition info came from someone in California (where they are required by law to provide that) who entered it into the database ? So I thank them.

I'm not saying wings aren't delicious (though I gave them up with all meat a long time ago). I'm saying if you're going to BWW for wings, you're doing it wrong. ;-)

Doesn't eat meat but has strong opinions on wings . . . It's okay, I have strong opinions about tofu

Ate meat for 32 years.

Forgive me. You're clearly an expert on all things wings now. Check that. You're clearly an expert on everything everything . . .

MassiveDelta

Seriously? You are attacking THIS of all things? The government regulates MANY things, including spending a half a trillion dollars on welfare and PROMOTING it through advertisement, and you are attacking my suggestion to mandate that all food have nutrition facts listed on it? alright then...

If your not part of the solution then its part of the problem. We do not need more government regulations, since the government can not regulate anything successfully.

Moving right along. When food is packaged and distributed it has to be lab tested for nutritional value. When it is a matter of assembling a meal out of items that have been lab tested for nutritional value you do not have to re-test them, you just have to add them up.

So really what you need to do is bring a food scale with you.
4oz of salmon is going to be 4oz of salmon,
and 1/2 cup of veggies will be half a cup of veggies..

Bingo!!...

Oh you don't know how much a double whopper with extra cheese is supposed to weigh? ... Well eat something you can weigh something that is quantitative

esaucier17

I agree!!

mzbek24

The problem is, how do they regulate how accurate it is? I could see smaller, non franchise businesses understating calories and nutrients either directly for strategic reasons, or indirectly because they might forget to account for stuff like cooking oil, seasonings, flavourings etc.

CA_Underdog

{deleted}

PRMinx

Already got my nose buried in it, and will be branching out. Bogged down already because there are different forms of copper. You didn't have to get cute about the chem trails, though. If something isn't in a peer reviewed abstract, I don't chase it, unless I was skimming and picked a bad source or I'm just bored and having fun with popular conspiracy theories.

Well, good luck to you (seriously). May you come out the wiser and not overly worried about the minor stuff. Knowing stuff and then knowing to let it go is also a process and that is why I was "being cute" about that stuff.

I edited the post you quoted, a secondary point is we already have rules and laws that cover a lot of this for chains, asking smaller restaurants to provide equivalent info has a culinary, economic and quality cost, if enforced. Or one can recognize that the calorie info published at most places will be a fantasy.

Thanks, I learn what I can. I'm not a believer in keeping information from us 'regular' people for fear we'll misunderstand and misuse it, that justification has been used too many times by the powerful to keep the rest of us in line. But I don't pretend I have the education background I need to jump right on any piece of information and get it right the first time. I just do the best I can. Also, I could use a few less things to worry about! But never out of ignorance. Ignorance is only bliss until it gets you killed.

Meanwhile, I don't advocate forcing smaller, less profitable businesses to label their calories at a high cost to them. Just the big, profitable chains. Although a tax break on small businesses willing to voluntarily do so could sweeten the deal enough to make it worthwhile to them. I could go for that.

Well, that's all ready in place in many states and there already is an FDA level law since 2010 but the implementation is still full of issues.

http://www.fda.gov/Food/IngredientsPackagingLabeling/LabelingNutrition/ucm248732.htm

Again there is NO further legislation need, just the execution of current rules. And again, there are real reasons why it makes sense to exclude them for non-large chain restaurants if you want them to be tested and valid.

Implementation and enforcement do seem to be an issue (this is only for chains with 20 or more stores from what I read, so the mom and pop outfits are perfectly free to list or not list).

I found an interesting article on it that makes me wonder what is making the grocery stores kick up a fuss. Always more reading leads to more questions.

http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle/health/256654611.html

FDA Commissioner Margaret Hamburg told Congress earlier this month that writing the rules has been "much more challenging than expected." The agency issued proposed rules in 2011 but has faced pressure to revise them to exclude retail outlets like grocery and convenience stores.

Because grocery stores already operate with some of the tightest margins in business - 1-2%. They started making prepared foods as a way to save the money they were losing on stuff near expiration that they had to throw away. The take off of prepared foods is one of the sole reasons why many grocery store chains haven't buckled - and taken their employees with them.

If they have to go through the process of providing nutrition counts, their already tight margins will be squeezed and they will have to run an analysis on whether it's even worth it anymore to offer prepared foods. Especially if they change them on a regular basis...

delicious_cocktail

Not eating at Chili's would've been a better choice . . . . . . ..

But he eats at Chili's because he wants "real, unprocessed food."