Cows milk vs almond milk

Aaron_K123

I'll admit I assumed incorrectly that almond milk had protein in it because, you know...almonds.

So now that I look it up nutritionally and see that it is mostly carbohydrates...which is a bit odd considering almonds, I have to ask....how much of "almond milk" is actually from almonds and/or how much post-processing is involved?

How do you mulch a food that is pretty much mostly protein and fat (nuts), mix it with water and end up with something that is mostly carbs? I guess you do that then you boil it or something to denature the protein and separate the fat? But then you basically just have sugar water.

I'm confused. What exactly is almond milk? Have to go look this up now.

Alright yeah so they grind up almonds in water...then they strain that out removing much of the protein and fat (you know, what is actually making up almonds) and then they add a lot of sweetener...hence the carbohydrates.

Wierd.

So how is this a substitute for milk? Milk is calorically mostly protein and fat with some carbs, this is calorically mostly carbs with some protein and fat...they seem like nutritional polar opposites.

Because someone erroneously labeled it milk and due to that, we now have to compare the two, pretending that one can substitute the other.

I find if ironic that the added nutrients to almond milk are heralded ( calcium, vit d, vit A) while they are poopooed by even the Harvard School of Public Health for vit a in milk and added nutrients are poopooed in wheat and cereal products.

I personally am of the opinion that "fortification" is a valuable tool to ensure an adequately nourished population which may not consume "ideal" foods. I just find some things ironic.

Yeah, I don't get why some folks think it's bad to add vitamins to your food.

Because everything natural ia good and perfect and impossible to improve. Nature loves you and cares for you, it wants you to come into its van so it can give you a treat.

Strokingdiction

I know it's a bit of a gross-factor thing, but if you look at what's in milk (... pus) it can be rather nice to switch to non-dairy alternatives.

There is no pus in milk. All commercially sold milk is heavily tested and if any sample doesn't meet those standards, the whole tank is discarded.

I am inclined to agree. I grew up on a dairy farm. the milk is tested and if anything is found to be contaminated (a cow may have had a mild infection, etc...) the whole tank is drained. period. i remember it well, because when that happened...it would be a very meager week for us.

I grew up on a dairy farm as well. The pus comment is totally ridiculous. The rare times the tank had to be drained, my dad would be completely disheartened as it was the means for our survival. We worked very hard to produce grade A milk and ran a very clean facility.

What happened to the calves that were born from the dairy cows?

On my uncle's farm, the calves stayed with their mother until they were ready to be weaned.

This happens at the majority of milk producers I personally know here in Texas, too. Then once they're weaned, they just keep getting milked. I don't know what benefit is had from taking a calf away from its mother anyway. You'd still have to give it milk; it may as well be direct from mom.

Goodness...cows have calves...they nurse for a few days, then are bottle fed. Those calves - the females are raised as the next generation of dairy cows. The males are usually sold off the farm since they are cost prohibitive to raise.

They are rarely bottle fed. It's more expensive both in materials (formula) and labor (having to bottle feed dozens of calves 2-3 times a day) to purposely pull calves from the cows before they are ready to be weaned.

FireOpalCO

Because everything natural ia good and perfect and impossible to improve. Nature loves you and cares for you, it wants you to come into its van so it can give you a treat.

I nearly choked on a strawberry.

WendyTerry420

Because everything natural ia good and perfect and impossible to improve. Nature loves you and cares for you, it wants you to come into its van so it can give you a treat.

The more you know... :drinker:

bcattoes

I prefer cows milk for the high protein content, which you won't get from milk substitutes. But if you're meeting your protein goals elsewhere then use whichever milk you enjoy most.

Some soy milk is comparable in protein to cow's milk.

Holly_Roman_Empire

I know it's a bit of a gross-factor thing, but if you look at what's in milk (... pus) it can be rather nice to switch to non-dairy alternatives.

There is no pus in milk. All commercially sold milk is heavily tested and if any sample doesn't meet those standards, the whole tank is discarded.

I am inclined to agree. I grew up on a dairy farm. the milk is tested and if anything is found to be contaminated (a cow may have had a mild infection, etc...) the whole tank is drained. period. i remember it well, because when that happened...it would be a very meager week for us.

I grew up on a dairy farm as well. The pus comment is totally ridiculous. The rare times the tank had to be drained, my dad would be completely disheartened as it was the means for our survival. We worked very hard to produce grade A milk and ran a very clean facility.

What happened to the calves that were born from the dairy cows?

On my uncle's farm, the calves stayed with their mother until they were ready to be weaned.

This happens at the majority of milk producers I personally know here in Texas, too. Then once they're weaned, they just keep getting milked. I don't know what benefit is had from taking a calf away from its mother anyway. You'd still have to give it milk; it may as well be direct from mom.

Goodness...cows have calves...they nurse for a few days, then are bottle fed. Those calves - the females are raised as the next generation of dairy cows. The males are usually sold off the farm since they are cost prohibitive to raise.

They are rarely bottle fed. It's more expensive both in materials (formula) and labor (having to bottle feed dozens of calves 2-3 times a day) to purposely pull calves from the cows before they are ready to be weaned.

^^^Yes, this is the point I was trying to make. It's not cost-effective to take calves away from mothers before they are weaned.

Aaron_K123

As far as the pus in milk is concerned I totally believe there is pus in cows milk. In fact, its hard for me to believe that there wouldn't be pus in cows milk. That said it doesn't concern me in the slightest. Why? Well to know you'd have to know what pus actually is.

Pus is dead leukocytes, that is it...that is what it is. If there is dead leukocytes in something then there is pus in there. So what are leukocytes. Well leukocytes are the bodies cell based innate immune system colloquially referred to as "white blood cells". Pus gets a bad rep because when you get an infection its the leukocytes job to rush in there, start phagocytosing the invading organisms and then dying off themselves leaving pus. As a result people associate pus with disease, infection, bad stuff, ickiness etc etc. Fact is though all pus is is dead leukocytes and guess what, there are leukocytes in milk.

Those leukocytes aren't going to survive pasteurization which will kill them and therefore make them pus because by definition pus is just dead leukocytes. This is not gross, this is not unexpected.

So my suspicion is some marketer for anti-dairy at some point realized this, realized the knee-jerk response the public would have to hearing there was icky icky pus in something and so they truthfully but disingenuously put out there that there was pus in milk.

Here is the thing though, if that is how we are using pus then there is also plenty of pus in breast milk which of course also has leukocytes...both alive and dead. Of course when that milk hits your stomach acid at that point they are all dead and therefore all pus.

There is nothing wrong with pus anymore than there is anything wrong with dead red blood cells. Animal products are going to have dead animal cells in them. If that bothers you you are probably vegan and this is a moot point for you anyways. Complaining that there is pus in your milk is like complaining there are dead red blood cells in your steak.

arabianhorselover

I'll admit I assumed incorrectly that almond milk had protein in it because, you know...almonds.

So now that I look it up nutritionally and see that it is mostly carbohydrates...which is a bit odd considering almonds, I have to ask....how much of "almond milk" is actually from almonds and/or how much post-processing is involved?

How do you mulch a food that is pretty much mostly protein and fat (nuts), mix it with water and end up with something that is mostly carbs? I guess you do that then you boil it or something to denature the protein and separate the fat? But then you basically just have sugar water.

I'm confused. What exactly is almond milk? Have to go look this up now.

Alright yeah so they grind up almonds in water...then they strain that out removing much of the protein and fat (you know, what is actually making up almonds) and then they add a lot of sweetener...hence the carbohydrates.

Wierd.

So how is this a substitute for milk? Milk is calorically mostly protein and fat with some carbs, this is calorically mostly carbs with some protein and fat...they seem like nutritional polar opposites.

Because someone erroneously labeled it milk and due to that, we now have to compare the two, pretending that one can substitute the other.

I find if ironic that the added nutrients to almond milk are heralded ( calcium, vit d, vit A) while they are poopooed by even the Harvard School of Public Health for vit a in milk and added nutrients are poopooed in wheat and cereal products.

I personally am of the opinion that "fortification" is a valuable tool to ensure an adequately nourished population which may not consume "ideal" foods. I just find some things ironic.

Yeah, I don't get why some folks think it's bad to add vitamins to your food.

Because everything natural ia good and perfect and impossible to improve. Nature loves you and cares for you, it wants you to come into its van so it can give you a treat.

Everything that is "natural" is not good for you.

Aaron_K123

Everything that is "natural" is not good for you.

and not everyone can correctly identify sarcasm

FireOpalCO

Everything that is "natural" is not good for you.

If having those words in the wrong order was intentional, it's freaking hilarious.

Aaron_K123

Everything that is "natural" is not good for you.

If having those words in the wrong order was intentional, it's freaking hilarious.

I think they meant "Not everything that is "natural" is good for you"

Mygsds

As far as the pus in milk is concerned I totally believe there is pus in cows milk. In fact, its hard for me to believe that there wouldn't be pus in cows milk. That said it doesn't concern me in the slightest. Why? Well to know you'd have to know what pus actually is.

Pus is dead leukocytes, that is it...that is what it is. If there is dead leukocytes in something then there is pus in there. So what are leukocytes. Well leukocytes are the bodies cell based innate immune system colloquially referred to as "white blood cells". Pus gets a bad rep because when you get an infection its the leukocytes job to rush in there, start phagocytosing the invading organisms and then dying off themselves leaving pus. As a result people associate pus with disease, infection, bad stuff, ickiness etc etc. Fact is though all pus is is dead leukocytes and guess what, there are leukocytes in milk.

Those leukocytes aren't going to survive pasteurization which will kill them and therefore make them pus because by definition pus is just dead leukocytes. This is not gross, this is not unexpected.

So my suspicion is some marketer for anti-dairy at some point realized this, realized the knee-jerk response the public would have to hearing there was icky icky pus in something and so they truthfully but disingenuously put out there that there was pus in milk.

Here is the thing though, if that is how we are using pus then there is also plenty of pus in breast milk which of course also has leukocytes...both alive and dead. Of course when that milk hits your stomach acid at that point they are all dead and therefore all pus.

There is nothing wrong with pus anymore than there is anything wrong with dead red blood cells. Animal products are going to have dead animal cells in them. If that bothers you you are probably vegan and this is a moot point for you anyways. Complaining that there is pus in your milk is like complaining there are dead red blood cells in your steak.

Nope, sorry but you are wrong. As I have stated in a earlier post milk IS NOT ACCEPTED into a grade A dairy plant that has a high SCC . This is called somatic cell count. There is 4000 lbs of milk on a tanker. A direct mic is done on the sample of milk from this tanker and if there is more than 20 parts per million on the slide, it is not accepted. I'm sure there are other plants in other parts of the world that have that problem but not in the US.. I did this for 37 years so feel I have first hand experience. This is a food source and when this is of course for the public, it is one of the most scrutinized foods by the government. Unbelievable guidelines have to be followed by farmers and cows tested weekly by these plants to make sure the level is very low. So drink your milk and know there is no pus..

eric_sg61

Still waiting on that study. Guessing its not coming.

Yeah, where is that study?

Aaron_K123

As far as the pus in milk is concerned I totally believe there is pus in cows milk. In fact, its hard for me to believe that there wouldn't be pus in cows milk. That said it doesn't concern me in the slightest. Why? Well to know you'd have to know what pus actually is.

Pus is dead leukocytes, that is it...that is what it is. If there is dead leukocytes in something then there is pus in there. So what are leukocytes. Well leukocytes are the bodies cell based innate immune system colloquially referred to as "white blood cells". Pus gets a bad rep because when you get an infection its the leukocytes job to rush in there, start phagocytosing the invading organisms and then dying off themselves leaving pus. As a result people associate pus with disease, infection, bad stuff, ickiness etc etc. Fact is though all pus is is dead leukocytes and guess what, there are leukocytes in milk.

Those leukocytes aren't going to survive pasteurization which will kill them and therefore make them pus because by definition pus is just dead leukocytes. This is not gross, this is not unexpected.

So my suspicion is some marketer for anti-dairy at some point realized this, realized the knee-jerk response the public would have to hearing there was icky icky pus in something and so they truthfully but disingenuously put out there that there was pus in milk.

Here is the thing though, if that is how we are using pus then there is also plenty of pus in breast milk which of course also has leukocytes...both alive and dead. Of course when that milk hits your stomach acid at that point they are all dead and therefore all pus.

There is nothing wrong with pus anymore than there is anything wrong with dead red blood cells. Animal products are going to have dead animal cells in them. If that bothers you you are probably vegan and this is a moot point for you anyways. Complaining that there is pus in your milk is like complaining there are dead red blood cells in your steak.

Nope, sorry but you are wrong. As I have stated in a earlier post milk IS NOT ACCEPTED into a grade A dairy plant that has a high SCC . This is called somatic cell count. There is 4000 lbs of milk on a tanker. A direct mic is done on the sample of milk from this tanker and if there is more than 20 parts per million on the slide, it is not accepted. I'm sure there are other plants in other parts of the world that have that problem but not in the US.. I did this for 37 years so feel I have first hand experience. This is a food source and when this is of course for the public, it is one of the most scrutinized foods by the government. Unbelievable guidelines have to be followed by farmers and cows tested weekly by these plants to make sure the level is very low. So drink your milk and know there is no pus..

I very well may be wrong, I have no expertise in the dairy industry. Also note that I was not considering this to somehow be a failing of quality control rather just the nature of the product. I'm not sure why anyone would care how many dead leukocytes are in milk and why they would bother to QC them out, what possible harm could a dead leukocyte do? I'm also not sure by what means you would separate dead leukocytes (which at that point are just lipids and proteins essentially) from everything else.

You mention looking at a slide but a slide is not going to give you a count of dead cells, especially apoptotic ones that have essentially liquified. I am not familiar with the "mic sample" you refer to though perhaps you can describe that (i am a microbiologist with some limited tissue culture experience).

Again I wish to emphasis this is in NO WAY a criticism of milk or the dairy industry or their QC practices. In no way do I think this is somehow a legitimate complaint or reason to not think milk completely safe and healthy. I'd just think that milk would have leukocytes in it because milk has leukocytes in it and I'm not sure why anyone would consider that a problem or even bother to try to remove them. Clearly the pasteurization process would kill all of them so none would be active and even if they were they'd be toast as soon as they hit your stomach acid.

I just can't help but feel that its a knee-jerk to the word "pus". Does the milk industry really try to seperate out leukocytes from milk? If so I have two questions about that. How and why? Like I said earlier I feel that trying to QC out leukocytes from milk would be like trying to QC out red blood cells from a piece of steak...incredibly difficult and also pointless since there is no threat there.

LoupGarouTFTs

Milk is a mammal's secret weapon. A total super food.

Of course we are being very Euro-centric and focusing on cow's milk, even though humans also regularly drink sheep, goat, and horse milk. I believe even reindeer milk in ingested in parts of the world. I wonder what the response would be in parts of the world where people still live in traditional societies and drink milk straight from their own reindeer/yak/whatever to someone walking up and telling them that "humans aren't supposed to drink milk".

I've stopped buying cow's milk from the store because I've started working with a herd of dairy goats and find I enjoy that milk more. I don't find anything wrong with cow's milk, though, and will go back to drinking it if I have to leave the farm work--at least until I can get a few goats of my own. Goat's milk is pretty awesome and it makes terrific cheese.

What happened to the calves that were born from the dairy cows?

I can't personally speak to what happens with calves, but we leave most of the kids with their mothers until they are ready to be weaned. After a couple of weeks they might be separated from their mothers overnight so that the does can make more milk and stretch their udders--the does will produce enough milk to accommodate the kid(s) and milking both. If the doe is in the show herd and she is being nursed on so that her udder is uneven (one side larger than the other) the kid(s) is(are) moved to a smaller pen and are bottle fed. Bottle feeding is done with the milk produced on the farm and is never done before the kid's mother has stopped producing colostrum.

tracydr

I drink unsweetened almond milk for smoothies and cereal. Real, whole milk n my coffee. Fake milks screw up the taste.
Almond milk is higher in calcium than cows milk.

RllyGudTweetr

I prefer cows milk for the high protein content, which you won't get from milk substitutes. But if you're meeting your protein goals elsewhere then use whichever milk you enjoy most.

Some soy milk is comparable in protein to cow's milk.

I suspect we can compare the protein in cow's milk to virtually any other source of protein, really. "Comparable" here isn't really a big qualifier or selling point.

Mygsds

The reason that it was taken out of the plant that I worked at was because ours was a powder plant. 90% of the end product was made into baby formula. I never looked into this any more than the testing but it had something to do,with the immune system of a infant. This plant dried about a million lbs. in a 24 hour period. Most was sent to Australia, Philippines and China. Such strong regulations especially when sold internationally. I totally know you were not bashing the milk industry but when people read pus it's kind of a turn off without reading your example which was spot on..

WendyTerry420

Everything that is "natural" is not good for you.

and not everyone can correctly identify sarcasm

The bird struggles with that, as seen on other threads.

arabianhorselover

Everything that is "natural" is not good for you.

and not everyone can correctly identify sarcasm

The bird struggles with that, as seen on other threads.

Is that so?????????????

WendyTerry420

Everything that is "natural" is not good for you.

and not everyone can correctly identify sarcasm

The bird struggles with that, as seen on other threads.

Is that so?????????????

Obviously. Aaron was being sarcastic. It is difficult to tell in text sometimes. *shrugs*

RHachicho

Milk is a mammal's secret weapon. A total super food. Anyone who want's to omit it from their diet or go for inferior low fat versions is just being stupid. I'm sorry but what? Even whole milk doesn't have THAT many calories. And pretty much all the calories are packed full of nutritional goodness. Unless you are intolerant to dairy there is literally no sensible reason to avoid cows milk.

Well this is just silly.
People can omit milk from their diet for all sorts of valid reasons.

Yes milk is a mammals 'secret weapon' - for nourishment of their young.
I have no issues with cows milk for human children/ adults - but that's not to say anyone who doesn't use it is stupid.

But perhaps i am just too stupid to understand, you know, being someone who uses the inferior low fat version.

Yes you are.

WendyTerry420

Milk is a mammal's secret weapon. A total super food.

Of course we are being very Euro-centric and focusing on cow's milk, even though humans also regularly drink sheep, goat, and horse milk. I believe even reindeer milk in ingested in parts of the world. I wonder what the response would be in parts of the world where people still live in traditional societies and drink milk straight from their own reindeer/yak/whatever to someone walking up and telling them that "humans aren't supposed to drink milk".

I've stopped buying cow's milk from the store because I've started working with a herd of dairy goats and find I enjoy that milk more. I don't find anything wrong with cow's milk, though, and will go back to drinking it if I have to leave the farm work--at least until I can get a few goats of my own. Goat's milk is pretty awesome and it makes terrific cheese.

What happened to the calves that were born from the dairy cows?

I can't personally speak to what happens with calves, but we leave most of the kids with their mothers until they are ready to be weaned. After a couple of weeks they might be separated from their mothers overnight so that the does can make more milk and stretch their udders--the does will produce enough milk to accommodate the kid(s) and milking both. If the doe is in the show herd and she is being nursed on so that her udder is uneven (one side larger than the other) the kid(s) is(are) moved to a smaller pen and are bottle fed. Bottle feeding is done with the milk produced on the farm and is never done before the kid's mother has stopped producing colostrum.

I used to buy goat's milk at my local grocer from a local dairy. For some reason they quit selling it. I miss the goat's milk. Loved it~!

paperpudding

Milk is a mammal's secret weapon. A total super food. Anyone who want's to omit it from their diet or go for inferior low fat versions is just being stupid. I'm sorry but what? Even whole milk doesn't have THAT many calories. And pretty much all the calories are packed full of nutritional goodness. Unless you are intolerant to dairy there is literally no sensible reason to avoid cows milk.

Well this is just silly.
People can omit milk from their diet for all sorts of valid reasons.

Yes milk is a mammals 'secret weapon' - for nourishment of their young.
I have no issues with cows milk for human children/ adults - but that's not to say anyone who doesn't use it is stupid.

But perhaps i am just too stupid to understand, you know, being someone who uses the inferior low fat version.

Yes you are.

Well there you go.

Please Continue on with your intelligent contributions to this debate.

Aaron_K123

Still waiting on that study. Guessing its not coming.

Yeah, where is that study?

Hard to post something that doesn't exist.

MelisaBegins

In cereal, I always choose skim (cow's) milk. Life is short and that's the taste I like in my cereal, which I don't eat often, so I'm not going to switch. For my smoothies, which I have daily, I use unsweetened coconut milk because it has the fewest calories and just adds a bit of substance/flavor (I use So Delicious vanilla flavor). As long as you're hitting your calories and marcos for the day, I'd say go with what you prefer!

RHachicho

Milk is a mammal's secret weapon. A total super food. Anyone who want's to omit it from their diet or go for inferior low fat versions is just being stupid. I'm sorry but what? Even whole milk doesn't have THAT many calories. And pretty much all the calories are packed full of nutritional goodness. Unless you are intolerant to dairy there is literally no sensible reason to avoid cows milk.

Well this is just silly.
People can omit milk from their diet for all sorts of valid reasons.

Yes milk is a mammals 'secret weapon' - for nourishment of their young.
I have no issues with cows milk for human children/ adults - but that's not to say anyone who doesn't use it is stupid.

But perhaps i am just too stupid to understand, you know, being someone who uses the inferior low fat version.

Yes you are.

Well there you go.

Please Continue on with your intelligent contributions to this debate.

Well what do you expect? You apparently don't even know that one of the reasons milk is so good for you is because of the fat in it. If you take that away you remove those calories yes but you are crippling it's nutritional quality. And it's not just about the fat itself. (Though that is believe it or not good for you) The fat aids in the uptake of the other nutrients in the milk. There is literally nothing more silly than low fat milk. If you want to reduce the calories a bit you can use semi skimmed like I do. But low fat milk just makes me face-palm. The key to a good diet is to eat good nutritionally packed calories. Not to minimize the calories in every piece of food so you can stuff yourself full of empty bumf.

benjaminjosephcollins

I've recently swapped cows milk for almond milk in all my cereals and protein shakes, simply for the fact that difference in calorie content is massive when you're putting away a litre or more a day.

Not traded everywhere though - still have regular milk in tea & coffee though, as there's no worthy substitute for that!

ritan7471

or even The Jungle by Upton Sinclair - learn how your food is made.

I don't think that The Jungle is a timely, cutting edge expose on current food production practices.

Also, Almond milk isn't natural either. You have to process almonds to make them into something you can call "milk".

paperpudding

Milk is a mammal's secret weapon. A total super food. Anyone who want's to omit it from their diet or go for inferior low fat versions is just being stupid. I'm sorry but what? Even whole milk doesn't have THAT many calories. And pretty much all the calories are packed full of nutritional goodness. Unless you are intolerant to dairy there is literally no sensible reason to avoid cows milk.

Well this is just silly.
People can omit milk from their diet for all sorts of valid reasons.

Yes milk is a mammals 'secret weapon' - for nourishment of their young.
I have no issues with cows milk for human children/ adults - but that's not to say anyone who doesn't use it is stupid.

But perhaps i am just too stupid to understand, you know, being someone who uses the inferior low fat version.

Yes you are.

Well there you go.

Please Continue on with your intelligent contributions to this debate.

Well what do you expect? You apparently don't even know that one of the reasons milk is so good for you is because of the fat in it. If you take that away you remove those calories yes but you are crippling it's nutritional quality. And it's not just about the fat itself. (Though that is believe it or not good for you) The fat aids in the uptake of the other nutrients in the milk. There is literally nothing more silly than low fat milk. If you want to reduce the calories a bit you can use semi skimmed like I do. But low fat milk just makes me face-palm. The key to a good diet is to eat good nutritionally packed calories. Not to minimize the calories in every piece of food so you can stuff yourself full of empty bumf.

Wow settle down. :huh:

I don't stuff myself full of every piece of food full of empty bumf, whatever that is.

I like low fat milk.

There are many variations on 'good diets' - mine is doing fine for me, thanks.

If other people prefer full fat milk, almond milk, soy milk, any other milk, no milk at all, that's fine too.

Yes I could use semi skimmed milk like you do, everyone could do as you do - or they could do something different.
Doing differently to you isn't necessarily silly, you know.