If it's as simple as calories in vs calories out....
catecholamine
Posts: 71 Member
How come I didn't lose weight when I ate 945 calories? And here's the real kicker: I had weight loss surgery that makes me only absorb 20% fat, 60% protein, 60% complex carbs. So my absorbed calories was closer to 400. And I gained a pound. This is the regular thing for me - eat less than 1,600, I gain or don't lose. Eat more, I lose. I see people post all the damn time that it's as simple as calories in VS calories out. My BMR is 2,000 cals a day. So if I eat less than 2,000 absorbable calories, by that statement I should lose weight. But I do not when I drop too low.
Soooo....maybe it's not that simple. Just sayin'
Soooo....maybe it's not that simple. Just sayin'
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It takes more than a day or two.0
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To lose weight It is that simple. Otherwise there would be no pictures of starving children in Africa. There would be no pictures of emaciated ED sufferers. The Majority of people who say they are eating '1000' calories and not losing weight when you dig deeper you find that they are eating far more than they say they are due to inaccurate logging and mistakes etc.
There are a few metabolic disorders that mean people do have problems losing weight but those are pretty rare. Though according to some people on MFP it seems 90% of people have these things wrong with them. As for your pound weight gain well that could just be some normal fluctuation due to water etc as most peoples weight can vary up to 5 pounds a day due to this.
As for your personal situation looking at your diary the day you say you ate 945 calories I would bet you ate more as the way you have logged it is pretty inaccurate. Cups are not accurate for solids so you need to weigh those. Other peoples generic recipes will not be accurate to yours.
As for your medical issues I cannot comment as I know very little about that. I would ask that why on the day that you say you only ate 945 why did you think that was sufficient?
So yes weightloss for the majority of the population is as simple as calories in and calories out. For overall health though it is best to make sure those calories supply the correct nutrition and a good mixture of vitamins,minerals, Carbs fat and protein to keep healthy.
You may find this link useful to make your logging more accurate
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1234699-logging-accurately-step-by-step-guide
Good luck0 -
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It takes more than a day or two.
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I should explain-- I'm guessing since one calorie level (945?) and one gain (one lb.) was mentioned, we were talking one or maybe two days. The body is not that predictable.It takes more than a day or two.
I agree with asking your doctor.
This part here sounds like a dream situation, and am surprised someone with this 'problem' would choose WLS: "This is the regular thing for me - eat less than 1,600, I gain or don't lose. Eat more, I lose."0 -
Weight loss surgery is handled differently than someone who doesn't need it, and is losing weight without surgery. In this class we are all required to eat 1200 calories a day, otherwise we go into what is known as starvation mode. Meaning any calories that we eat are turned into fat, our metabolic rate slows down making it harder to lose weight.
If you just had surgery, and your doctor has put you on a specific diet, I would stick with it, until he/she tells you otherwise. You are eating less calories--because your stomach has been reduced to a small pouch--whereas the rest of us are still dealing with a full sized stomach. Your surgery was to keep you from getting hungry, you're full after a couple of bites--whereas the rest of us aren't.
So stick with what diet your doctor wants you on, don't up your calorie intake based upon a sudden weight gain or loss--otherwise your surgery may not work. You definitely don't want to expand your stomach--(which it will do) by ignoring your doctors advise and eating more.
A great show for you to download on your computer--is my 600 pound life, and watch the show called Penny who refused to do as her doctor wished.0 -
How come I didn't lose weight when I ate 945 calories? And here's the real kicker: I had weight loss surgery that makes me only absorb 20% fat, 60% protein, 60% complex carbs. So my absorbed calories was closer to 400. And I gained a pound. This is the regular thing for me - eat less than 1,600, I gain or don't lose. Eat more, I lose. I see people post all the damn time that it's as simple as calories in VS calories out. My BMR is 2,000 cals a day. So if I eat less than 2,000 absorbable calories, by that statement I should lose weight. But I do not when I drop too low.
Soooo....maybe it's not that simple. Just sayin'
If what you're saying is true for you, weight loss surgery doesn't seem like it was a good idea
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I don't believe it is that simple. I have the same problem as you do. I eat far less than I ought to. This is mainly due to some extreme stress I went through several years ago. At first I was losing weight like crazy. It was great. But now, I have dealt with that major stress in my life and I'm down to "normal" stress, I still don't eat very much (I tend to simply forget to eat) yet I am no longer losing weight. In fact, I have put on a few pounds judging from how my clothes fit
Metabolism has a huge role to play in how many calories our body needs and therefore, how may calories it will take to lose more weight.
I know this pattern is bad for me (and you I'm sure) which is why I have this tracking app on m phone. I am trying to be in the frame of mind that says when I do eat, make it something healthy; make it something that will be a benefit to my body.
It's a strange predicament to be in I think, and a rough one to overcome. I really think tracking meals will help a lot.
Good Luck!0 -
You had weight loss surgery. Obviously you are going to have other factors impacting the energy balance equation than people without medical issues on both the calories in and calories out sides. That doesn't make calories in vs calories out any less true.0
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I'm rather new here but I like to creep and read what others post since often its of some value. I'll say what at least is working for me.
You will lose weight with that big of a deficit but its going to be VERY slow and its probably very unsatisfying (in many ways). You don't "gain weight" off a true 1200 calories.... You can't create matter out of nothing. I was eating like 1000 calories at first, sometimes lower, thinking that's what I had to do-- but I was creeping along (even going back up) in the 'loss' category'.
Some of the 'weight' you see isn't actually real lbs. Eating 945 calories, no way will make you gain a lb in a day. You probably had too much sodium and retained more water than normal. You should be drinking 140oz a day from what I've gathered on here and others and keeping my sodium below that suggested amount as much as possible (If I go over I drink more water). Sometimes on these hot summer days some water will stick around but it isn't much as it was before.
You need to bump up your calorie intake so that your body can have fuel to actually burn the weight. I bumped mine to 1500 on non work out days and 1650-1700 (ish) for work out days and already 1 week of that change and I've lost 3 lbs this week. Your 'sweet numbers' can be different, and probably are. I've read on here many success stories at all different amounts, just have to keep messing with it till you find it. I'm sure there's a better number for me too, I'm new so still working on it.
Make sure you're tracking your food correctly as well. Track everything-- salt, pepper, butter, any seasonings, sauces etc. They all add up real fast. Anything you put in your mouth try and find it on the database to add in. Make sure the weights/proportions are correct as well you may be eating more than you think. I'm still working on being OCD about sizes atm. And you can work in good treats/snacks you don't want to give up but don't make your whole day 1500 calories of chocolate etc. Try and balance in veggies in every meal, get fiber, and LOTS of protein.
Try and add in strength and cardio 3 times a week even if its around your house or something. Could definitely help. (Diet is the more important part to losing weight though).
Most important thing I learned was that it takes time. It doesn't happen over night. I got real bummed multiple times but just stay positive. As long as you took to gain the weight its going to take it to come off (or more). Its more of a lifestyle and journey more than anything and it takes patience of a saint. I'm only a month in and got a ways to go.
Now I'm not 100% sure on how the surgery factors but from how you describe it " makes me only absorb 20% fat, 60% protein, 60% complex carbs" sounds like you'd need to eat actually more in order to absorb your actual goal if your absorption is cut by more than half. Maybe someone has a similar experience to help on that front but you definitely shouldn't be living on 900 calories/day.0 -
Come on now. You couldn't be more wrong. So somehow our bodies are magically going to convert all the calories we eat into fat. Do you even realize how little sense that makes as you read me write it??Weight loss surgery is handled differently than someone who doesn't need it, and is losing weight without surgery. In this class we are all required to eat 1200 calories a day, otherwise we go into what is known as starvation mode. Meaning any calories that we eat are turned into fat, our metabolic rate slows down making it harder to lose weight.
If you just had surgery, and your doctor has put you on a specific diet, I would stick with it, until he/she tells you otherwise. You are eating less calories--because your stomach has been reduced to a small pouch--whereas the rest of us are still dealing with a full sized stomach. Your surgery was to keep you from getting hungry, you're full after a couple of bites--whereas the rest of us aren't.
So stick with what diet your doctor wants you on, don't up your calorie intake based upon a sudden weight gain or loss--otherwise your surgery may not work. You definitely don't want to expand your stomach--(which it will do) by ignoring your doctors advise and eating more.
A great show for you to download on your computer--is my 600 pound life, and watch the show called Penny who refused to do as her doctor wished.
lol at "any calories that we eat turn into fat" I literally laughed out loud.
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I'm talking about AFTER WLS. Before WLS, I ate 1,200 cals a day to lose weight pre-op and it worked.How come I didn't lose weight when I ate 945 calories? And here's the real kicker: I had weight loss surgery that makes me only absorb 20% fat, 60% protein, 60% complex carbs. So my absorbed calories was closer to 400. And I gained a pound. This is the regular thing for me - eat less than 1,600, I gain or don't lose. Eat more, I lose. I see people post all the damn time that it's as simple as calories in VS calories out. My BMR is 2,000 cals a day. So if I eat less than 2,000 absorbable calories, by that statement I should lose weight. But I do not when I drop too low.
Soooo....maybe it's not that simple. Just sayin'
If what you're saying is true for you, weight loss surgery doesn't seem like it was a good idea0 -
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And btw, anyone saying I'm lying about what's in my log...nope. Remember, I can't eat very much. It's not like I'm secretly stuffing myself with oreos. I can't. My butt would explode. There are consequences for high sugar or high carb with my WLS.
My nutritionist recommended 900 calories a day. Of course, that's ****ing stupid because everything on the internet and all the people with the surgery I had recommend much more. I am supposed to be getting 100-120g protein a day. Yesterday was a **** day for me. I didn't eat much and that was a mistake. Maybe the weight gain is water from my muscle being broken down, who knows? I just know that if calories in vs calories out was so universally true, I should be dropping a lot more weight.
I log everything
Every sauce. Even spices in the recipes I make.0 -
The doctor knows nothing of nutrition, so refers me to a nutritionist.
What did your doctor say?
I'm talking about AFTER WLS. Before WLS, I ate 1,200 cals a day to lose weight pre-op and it worked.How come I didn't lose weight when I ate 945 calories? And here's the real kicker: I had weight loss surgery that makes me only absorb 20% fat, 60% protein, 60% complex carbs. So my absorbed calories was closer to 400. And I gained a pound. This is the regular thing for me - eat less than 1,600, I gain or don't lose. Eat more, I lose. I see people post all the damn time that it's as simple as calories in VS calories out. My BMR is 2,000 cals a day. So if I eat less than 2,000 absorbable calories, by that statement I should lose weight. But I do not when I drop too low.
Soooo....maybe it's not that simple. Just sayin'
If what you're saying is true for you, weight loss surgery doesn't seem like it was a good idea
Who, incidentally, knows little of nutrition about my surgery, Duodenal Switch.0 -
A calories is a calorie.
If not tell me how the heck I lost 22 pounds?0 -
No one debated a calorie = a calorie. Only that I frequently eat way below my BMR and do not lose or lose very slow. I ate 900 calories a day for a month. Lost 10lbs. Ate 1,500-2,000 for a month with no change in exercise. Lost 17lbs.A calories is a calorie.
If not tell me how the heck I lost 22 pounds?
I've lost 70lbs.0 -
How long ago was your surgery? Maybe your body is still in recovery/adjustment mode if its pretty recent. And I wasn't inferring you were lying about your log, just stating what commonly happens and it could be something you didn't realize (aka covering the bases). If you aren't eating enough to actually gain weight then its not going to be real weight.
It takes some time. You won't magically wake up and be 10-15 lbs less because of a surgery paired with 900-1000 calories. From the very little that I just looked up on WLS:
"Lose weight for 18-24 months after the procedure
Lose 30-50% of excess weight in the first six months and 77% of excess weight within 12 months of surgery
Maintain a 50-60% loss of excess weight 10-14 years after surgery"
^That's quite a bit of time to see results. (Like with most anything). Does your doctor say when you can see results/changes, what to expect or commonly when?
Edit: 70lbs is a big deal/accomplishment to have lost so far.0 -
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WLS can alter many things...metabolism, hormones, insulin resistance, water retention ect. It can not alter reality and change the laws of thermodynamics. If you had said you don't lose at 1000 calories a day, not knowing your TDEE after WLS, it could be (like .0001%) that your metabolism went so low that you are now eating above TDEE, but you stated you lose if you eat more than 1600. Scientifically gaining on 900 and losing on 1600 is against the laws of energy and thermodynamics, you would have the key to the best weight loss plan in human existence and I am sure your doctor will be conducting many studies on your unique situation.In this class we are all required to eat 1200 calories a day, otherwise we go into what is known as starvation mode. Meaning any calories that we eat are turned into fat, our metabolic rate slows down making it harder to lose weight.
This made me laugh out loud, in one thread we have found the answer to weight loss and world hunger.....awesome work for a Saturday.
Really metabolic adaption, slows the metabolism down but only an extremely small amount and NEVER starts adding fat/weight or even really stalling fat loss.
After seeing these posts daily, knowing that the people who post this nonsense have access and the ability to read the forums and know the truth....I am starting to believe these people just like the answer that makes them feel better about themselves. "I am fat because I eat too little", sounds much better than " I am fat because I love to stuff my face". To have sustainable weight loss, only seems to happen when the person can stand up and say..." I got fat because I ate too much and may have gotten lazier". Things slow down for many reasons, but you can adapt.
OP if you just had WLS, I am assuming your doctor has you on a strict diet and keeping track of you. Gaining a lb. tells you nothing, my weight moves 4lb everyday, unless I get a new number out of my range I have no clue if I gained or loss. I would also assume having an operation would cause inflammation through the body as it heals and adjusts, plus the physical stress of an operation can cause water retention. Honestly any weight loss you have had is probably hidden by many lbs of water.0 -
Were you a lot heavier (or younger) when you lost 17 lbs in a month? That can make a difference. Also, are you positive it was exactly like that? I tend to remember past weight loss as being easier and faster than it was.
No one debated a calorie = a calorie. Only that I frequently eat way below my BMR and do not lose or lose very slow. I ate 900 calories a day for a month. Lost 10lbs. Ate 1,500-2,000 for a month with no change in exercise. Lost 17lbs.A calories is a calorie.
If not tell me how the heck I lost 22 pounds?
I've lost 70lbs.
That's too bad if your surgery really made you lose more slowly at lower calories but I guess it's design is to force you to eat fewer calories and in that it 'worked'. 10 lbs lost in a month is nothing to sneeze at.
Do all WLS surgeons give no calorie level counseling post-surgery? I cringe when I even see the word "nutritionist". I'm beginning to think their training involves studying the old food pyramid or something.0 -
It is frustrating when the pounds don't come off at the same rate that we reduce caloric intake. There's a lag. It takes time for the body to adjust to new diet plans. Keep doing it anyway.
Carbohydrates are great for quick energy. But if it's not used, it gets stored more readily than protein.
Protein is a slow-burning energy. And it's slow to get stored up. And it's the first one the body goes to before stores to use up when we don't provide it with energy on demand. Because it's easier to break down protein for energy.
3500 calories equals 1 LB. Whether that's made up in protein, carbs on the go, or fat stores, well that's the trick to weight loss, isn't it.
Metabolism is a tricky thing. It depends on gender, age, activity level, resting metabolic rate etc. The good news is, over time, metabolism can be changed. Over time, metabolism can speed up or slow down depending on what you do to effect the desired change. And it doesn't happen quickly. But it happens.
Now... you've had surgery. Your body is automatically going to go into safeguard mode. Why? Because it's essentially been assaulted. And it needs to recover. And that will affect your metabolism.
The average toddler uses 1400 calories a day to maintain their weight. That's a very young person with boundless energy with (one hopes) not much worry to their day. Adults are different.
I have struggled with weight loss all my life. Here's some things I have noted though;
- fewer calories eaten than what I use will result in weight loss (that doesn't mean healthy weight loss necessarily)
- if I starve myself to try to maintain a steady weight loss, my body will revolt and plateau. It will simply resist giving up calories if I don't give some in exchange for work performed. And it doesn't want much really, just enough to know that it's not starving. My body can outlast my mental will to starve myself. It always wins. So I've learned I'd better do as it says and not starve it.
- I have much better success eating processed carbs (anything that isn't the raw material) earlier in the day than later in the day; so breads and cereals are better in the first part of my day, and 'starchy' fruits and veggies compensate for carbs in the latter part
- diet pop will stall my weight loss and increase my blood pressure (sodium maybe?)
- less than 8 glasses a day in water results in a plateau and makes exercising a draining matter
- caffeine drinks are better in the early day than later as they too cause me to plateau but only if I continue them in the afternoon
- exercise is mandatory for sustained weight loss and body toning every single day
- a carb snack before exercise goes a long way
- fruits activate my salivary glands so I have to remind myself to limit them to 2 servings a day when I know I'll be having a main meal soon after... easier said than done... and yes, I need to have more servings of veggies to compensate
- fiber is my friend; I use Pgx granules to make sure I get 30g a day. or at least, I try to remember that. I find it really does make my yogurt parfait much more satisfying - as well as my white egg english muffin I favour for breakfast
- weight really does fluctuate throughout the day; as much as 5Lbs for me. So I take my best weight if I really must weigh myself daily, and sometimes I do; but I try to remember that what counts is that at the end of the week, I'm still looking at a downward trend. And I don't care if that means even an ounce - as long as its down.
And... I'm still learning. It can only get better with more knowledge and a good understanding on how to apply that knowledge. Did I mention I"m still learning?
Try to give yourself a break. You're making a good decision in making choices on how you eat and how you exercise. And if the weight isn't coming off as fast as you'd like it, well, that's just your body saying it's not ready to give it all up at once just yet. Take smaller steps in your regimen. This week it may show up in poundage, next week it may show up in measurements. If something is changing for the better, then your weight loss plan is working for you. Keep it up.
I believe in you. You will be successful.
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Duodenal Switch. There's only 3 surgeons in my whole state who do it. Few doctors know much on the nutrition front. And few nutritionists know much about the DS. It's not taught about in their education.I'm sorry but what exactly did you have done? Sleeve? Bypass? Where did you find these doctors, in the phone book?
For you to have such a major procedure and not have the right doctors is a little crazy.0 -
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Were you a lot heavier (or younger) when you lost 17 lbs in a month? That can make a difference. Also, are you positive it was exactly like that? I tend to remember past weight loss as being easier and faster than it was.
No one debated a calorie = a calorie. Only that I frequently eat way below my BMR and do not lose or lose very slow. I ate 900 calories a day for a month. Lost 10lbs. Ate 1,500-2,000 for a month with no change in exercise. Lost 17lbs.A calories is a calorie.
If not tell me how the heck I lost 22 pounds?
I've lost 70lbs.
That's too bad if your surgery really made you lose more slowly at lower calories but I guess it's design is to force you to eat fewer calories and in that it 'worked'. 10 lbs lost in a month is nothing to sneeze at.
Do all WLS surgeons give no calorie level counseling post-surgery? I cringe when I even see the word "nutritionist". I'm beginning to think their training involves studying the old food pyramid or something.
No WLS surgeons really give any nutritional counselling. They have you see a nutritionist. Most of those are up on what people with gastric bypass or sleeve should eat, but not my surgery, Duodenal Switch. By the way, I was LIGHTER when I lost the 17lbs. The 2nd month I only lost 10lbs. 4th I lost 17lbs. 10lbs/month is way below average for my weight category. My overall weight loss is below average, or so the nutritionist said.0 -
How come I didn't lose weight when I ate 945 calories? And here's the real kicker: I had weight loss surgery that makes me only absorb 20% fat, 60% protein, 60% complex carbs. So my absorbed calories was closer to 400. And I gained a pound. This is the regular thing for me - eat less than 1,600, I gain or don't lose. Eat more, I lose. I see people post all the damn time that it's as simple as calories in VS calories out. My BMR is 2,000 cals a day. So if I eat less than 2,000 absorbable calories, by that statement I should lose weight. But I do not when I drop too low.
Soooo....maybe it's not that simple. Just sayin'
You gained a pound of what? Perhaps you gained 5 pounds of water weight due to retention from elevated cortisol levels due to the stress your putting your body through while at the same time losing 4 pounds of fat. Unless you are undergoing regular DEXA scanning there would be no way to tell.0 -
Um, are you Yes, it does cause me to malabsorb nutrients. That's like, the whole purpose of Duodenal Switch. They change where your digestive juices come in to come in at the end of the small intestines so food isn't broken down and macros aren't absorbed. Google it.i am sorry but WLS does not magically make you absorb percentages of macronutrients. Also, reading your profile it does not make you magically not absorb all of your calories. If you eat 100 calories of bread at 21 g of carbs you are absorbing 100 calories and 21g of carbs.
Just like everyone else. You should be EATING less calories because your portions are smaller because your stomach is smaller because well, you cheated the system and had surgery.
But you still absorb what you eat, just like the rest of us.
We cant explains why you lose/gain, but you know as well as we know the same denominator here is YOU.
'You arent being honest with yourself or us. You either arent being consistant, arent following doctors orders, arent excersizing, or are eating larger portions than you think.
Surgery or not, this is on YOU and with all the advice you just rebutt every thing so I doubt if you get it, but the problem is not the diet or calories it is YOU.
Fat malabsorption is so much that I have to take megadoses of fat soluable vitamins. I take 50,000iu of Vitamin D a day, for instance.0 -
According to you, you're unable to get appropriate advice from the "professionals," due to the fact they're not sufficiently trained for your particular situation (Was there no screening process? Did you have any control over this?).
I don't think it even needs to be said that you can't compare your "calories in / calories out" equation to the typical individual. You had a procedure with the intent of altering your body's natural function.
Of course, you could just be posting this as a vent, or as a cautionary tale against WLS. If the latter, you have succeeded exceedingly well, IMO.0 -
Duodenal Switch. There's only 3 surgeons in my whole state who do it. Few doctors know much on the nutrition front. And few nutritionists know much about the DS. It's not taught about in their education.I'm sorry but what exactly did you have done? Sleeve? Bypass? Where did you find these doctors, in the phone book?
For you to have such a major procedure and not have the right doctors is a little crazy.
Your doctor not having nutrition training is insane doing this surgery. The malabsorption part of it not only hinders calorie absorption but vital nutrients too. This could lead to extreme malnutrition.
Quote from an article...
"DS patients require lifelong and extensive blood tests to check for deficiencies in life critical vitamins and minerals. Without proper follow up tests and lifetime supplementation RNY and DS patients can become ill. This follow-up care is non-optional and must continue for as long as the patient lives."
If he is not doing this, it would be malpractice. More than weight, at this point you concern should be malnutrition.
*Laws of energy still stand, you must burn more than you process (instead of consume for your case)0
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