Cleanse

George_Baileys_Ghost

Well someone in this thread is doing an excellent job at putting words in people's mouths!

wwwsam

MinMin97
"So if you go to the dr, they will heal you and you won't have a problem anymore?"



No....I will rely on your pre-breakfast Green drink to heal me.

squishycatmew

There's no need to detox or cleanse your system and you also do not need to give your organs "a break".

Please see here:
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1159755-looking-for-a-detox-cleanse

Why doesn't your body need to detox or cleanse?

Because it's very very efficient at ridding itself of unwanted waste on it's own. When people feel down, low, "yucky", etc., it's usually because they are just LACKING nutrients. Add them and/or increase them and VOILA!

A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

What is the body cleansing? How do you know, comprehensively, what makes a person feel down and low?

The body removes waste that's uneeded. It's systematic at that, just like it attacks bacteria and viruses that invade it. Can you help it along? Sure, but one doesn't NEED to "detox or cleanse" to do it. Eating more nutritionally dense food and fiber is a great approach without having to spend extra money.
Comprehensively, people who state they are down and low basically come out and just say it. I guess I'll just take their word for it.

A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

So the body has systems that "remove waste (is that your term for "cleanse?"), and these systems always work at 100% efficiency? And your cleanse is to eat "more nutritionally dense food and fiber?" What if that person has constipation and IBS? What should they do in your opinion? Their colon is compromised, and is all that food/fiber going to help?

No, but a commercial "cleanse" isn't going to help, either (well, the fiber in a lot of them, plus increased fluid intake, might help the constipation, but you can do that, again, by eating foods rich in fiber and drinking water). If someone has/suspects they have IBS or some other actual gastrointestinal disorder, they should see their doctor and discuss diagnosis and treatment options. Those sometimes involve special diets or avoiding certain foods, but that's not a cleanse, that's medical treatment, for people with an actual disorder.

So if you go to the dr, they will heal you and you won't have a problem anymore?

Did anyone here say that? If you actually have a medical problem, going to a doctor can get you an actual diagnosis and treatment plan, which, unfortunately for most digestive disorders like IBS and Crohn's, means managing, not curing, as there are no real cures. You will still have "a problem", but the same will be true of a "cleanse" - and a commercial cleanse won't actually be targeting your specific disorder or trigger foods. If you don't have a medical problem, but you feel constipated, a one-time treatment with an over-the-counter laxative will generally fix that, and a diet high in fiber and fluid intake will help it from recurring (increased magnesium intake can help, too). If you lack energy, you probably aren't getting enough sleep, or exercise, or enough vitamins and minerals, or any of the above, or maybe, if it's chronic, you have an underlying medical or psychological condition. The one thing it *isn't* is your gut, unless you have an actual medical issue that prevents you from absorbing the nutrients from your food, which, again, not something that will be fixed by a cleanse.

whovian67

No

Wetcoaster

http://sciencebasedpharmacy.wordpress.com/2013/01/04/the-detox-delusion/

http://www.livescience.com/34845-detox-cleansing-facts-fallacies.html

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-detox-scam-how-to-spot-it-and-how-to-avoid-it/

http://www.reporterherald.com/ci_21015080/facts-dont-support-detox-diets



and

http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/detox-treatments-by-dr-oz-and-others-lack-evidence-benefit-1.2498910


Cleanses lack evidence

Detox cleanses, programs, supplements and scrubs line the shelves of health food and drug stores and fuel a multi-billion dollar industry.

Dr. Dresser, who is also a professor of toxicology and pharmacology at Western University, worked with Marketplace to test Dr. Oz’s cleanse and says that many detox treatments on the market are vague about what they do or how they work.

“It’s sometimes difficult to know exactly what toxins they’re talking about,” he says.

He says that hype about detoxifying “superfoods” is not supported by science. “There is no evidence that I can see that there are specific foods that are better at detoxifying than others. I think that the value of food is its nutrient value. And I think that we should all be consuming good-quality food. But in terms of one food being able to detoxify or enhance elimination of noxious substances in your body, I don’t think there’s any evidence for that.”

While the Dr. Oz cleanse had no medical benefit, Dr. Dresser says that it is not dangerous. “The good news, I suppose, is that the detox treatment didn’t result in a negative change in health status. But there was also no improvement.”

Dr. Dresser says that the detox trend is fuelled by our desire for a quick-fix solution to health.
Dr. Dresser

On the topic of popular detox cleanses, Dr. George Dresser says, "there has never been a properly conducted scientific investigation of any of these treatments that I’ve been able to find." (CBC)

“From a health-behavior standpoint,” he says, “I think that if you read any claim that says, in two days or seven days, or thirty days, ‘I can substantially change your health status,’ I think you should be skeptical.”

“I think that there’s a lot of these things, like the detox treatments, where there isn’t substantial evidence for benefits,” he says. “And yet people are using them. And, in a way, that’s an indictment of us in the medical system for not communicating better what we know.”

In 2009, the UK group Voice of Young Scientists published The Detox Dossier, a report on popular detox treatments.

The group found companies that market detox products were unable to point to evidence that supported their claims, or even come up with a coherent definition of what “detox” means. In addition: “many of the claims about how the body works were wrong and some were even dangerous.”

As one of the report’s authors, biologist Harriet Ball, wrote: “Detox is marketed as the idea that modern living fills us with invisible nasties that our bodies can’t cope with unless we buy the latest jargon-filled remedy.”

Dr. Dresser says that our bodies already cleanse and detoxify our bodies quite effectively.

“The liver is incredibly efficient at getting rid of those noxious substances. The kidneys do a great job at eliminating many toxins that are soluble in water,” he says.

“We have everything we need inside of us right now.”

George_Baileys_Ghost

http://sciencebasedpharmacy.wordpress.com/2013/01/04/the-detox-delusion/

http://www.livescience.com/34845-detox-cleansing-facts-fallacies.html

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-detox-scam-how-to-spot-it-and-how-to-avoid-it/

http://www.reporterherald.com/ci_21015080/facts-dont-support-detox-diets



and

http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/detox-treatments-by-dr-oz-and-others-lack-evidence-benefit-1.2498910


Cleanses lack evidence

Detox cleanses, programs, supplements and scrubs line the shelves of health food and drug stores and fuel a multi-billion dollar industry.

Dr. Dresser, who is also a professor of toxicology and pharmacology at Western University, worked with Marketplace to test Dr. Oz’s cleanse and says that many detox treatments on the market are vague about what they do or how they work.

“It’s sometimes difficult to know exactly what toxins they’re talking about,” he says.

He says that hype about detoxifying “superfoods” is not supported by science. “There is no evidence that I can see that there are specific foods that are better at detoxifying than others. I think that the value of food is its nutrient value. And I think that we should all be consuming good-quality food. But in terms of one food being able to detoxify or enhance elimination of noxious substances in your body, I don’t think there’s any evidence for that.”

While the Dr. Oz cleanse had no medical benefit, Dr. Dresser says that it is not dangerous. “The good news, I suppose, is that the detox treatment didn’t result in a negative change in health status. But there was also no improvement.”

Dr. Dresser says that the detox trend is fuelled by our desire for a quick-fix solution to health.
Dr. Dresser

On the topic of popular detox cleanses, Dr. George Dresser says, "there has never been a properly conducted scientific investigation of any of these treatments that I’ve been able to find." (CBC)

“From a health-behavior standpoint,” he says, “I think that if you read any claim that says, in two days or seven days, or thirty days, ‘I can substantially change your health status,’ I think you should be skeptical.”

“I think that there’s a lot of these things, like the detox treatments, where there isn’t substantial evidence for benefits,” he says. “And yet people are using them. And, in a way, that’s an indictment of us in the medical system for not communicating better what we know.”

In 2009, the UK group Voice of Young Scientists published The Detox Dossier, a report on popular detox treatments.

The group found companies that market detox products were unable to point to evidence that supported their claims, or even come up with a coherent definition of what “detox” means. In addition: “many of the claims about how the body works were wrong and some were even dangerous.”

As one of the report’s authors, biologist Harriet Ball, wrote: “Detox is marketed as the idea that modern living fills us with invisible nasties that our bodies can’t cope with unless we buy the latest jargon-filled remedy.”

Dr. Dresser says that our bodies already cleanse and detoxify our bodies quite effectively.

“The liver is incredibly efficient at getting rid of those noxious substances. The kidneys do a great job at eliminating many toxins that are soluble in water,” he says.

“We have everything we need inside of us right now.”

waitwaitwait I've got this! Lemme try!

So you're saying that everything inside of us always works perfectly and never needs anything external in order to work as it should, and that everything that can be included in the broadly defined term "cleanse" is always incorrect under every circumstance?

MinMin97

There's no need to detox or cleanse your system and you also do not need to give your organs "a break".

Please see here:
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1159755-looking-for-a-detox-cleanse

Why doesn't your body need to detox or cleanse?

Because it's very very efficient at ridding itself of unwanted waste on it's own. When people feel down, low, "yucky", etc., it's usually because they are just LACKING nutrients. Add them and/or increase them and VOILA!

A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

What is the body cleansing? How do you know, comprehensively, what makes a person feel down and low?

The body removes waste that's uneeded. It's systematic at that, just like it attacks bacteria and viruses that invade it. Can you help it along? Sure, but one doesn't NEED to "detox or cleanse" to do it. Eating more nutritionally dense food and fiber is a great approach without having to spend extra money.
Comprehensively, people who state they are down and low basically come out and just say it. I guess I'll just take their word for it.

A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

So the body has systems that "remove waste (is that your term for "cleanse?"), and these systems always work at 100% efficiency? And your cleanse is to eat "more nutritionally dense food and fiber?" What if that person has constipation and IBS? What should they do in your opinion? Their colon is compromised, and is all that food/fiber going to help?

No, but a commercial "cleanse" isn't going to help, either (well, the fiber in a lot of them, plus increased fluid intake, might help the constipation, but you can do that, again, by eating foods rich in fiber and drinking water). If someone has/suspects they have IBS or some other actual gastrointestinal disorder, they should see their doctor and discuss diagnosis and treatment options. Those sometimes involve special diets or avoiding certain foods, but that's not a cleanse, that's medical treatment, for people with an actual disorder.

So if you go to the dr, they will heal you and you won't have a problem anymore?

Did anyone here say that? If you actually have a medical problem, going to a doctor can get you an actual diagnosis and treatment plan, which, unfortunately for most digestive disorders like IBS and Crohn's, means managing, not curing, as there are no real cures. You will still have "a problem", but the same will be true of a "cleanse" - and a commercial cleanse won't actually be targeting your specific disorder or trigger foods. If you don't have a medical problem, but you feel constipated, a one-time treatment with an over-the-counter laxative will generally fix that, and a diet high in fiber and fluid intake will help it from recurring (increased magnesium intake can help, too). If you lack energy, you probably aren't getting enough sleep, or exercise, or enough vitamins and minerals, or any of the above, or maybe, if it's chronic, you have an underlying medical or psychological condition. The one thing it *isn't* is your gut, unless you have an actual medical issue that prevents you from absorbing the nutrients from your food, which, again, not something that will be fixed by a cleanse.

So if you've gone to the dr and what the dr suggests doesn't bring healing, (or if a person follows all the suggestions you have given and it doesn't resolve the problem), then you have reached the end of the line, can only manage your symptoms, and have no hope for healing?
What do you mean by "cleanse?" What does a "cleanse" do?

rivka_m

Cleanse is an ambiguous term used by proponents of pseudoscience as is the word "toxin". Typically they are used hand-in-hand because people cannot name a specific toxin that accumulates to dangerous levels and is removed by said detox product. In the traditional sense, this is the means by which cleanse/detox products are promoted.

I'm simply claiming that there is no need to use these pseudoscientific detox or cleansing products because your digestive system and organs remove unwanted waste products and in the event that they didn't, the solution to this wouldn't lie in a "detox" product, unless you're simply constipated in which case a laxative or other dietary interventions (fiber, a chipotle binge) may do the trick.

So we've established:
that "cleanse: is not a well defined term.
that the body does cleanse itself, and needs to cleanse.

And now your suggesting that the colon is an area that needs to be cleansed, and you recommend a laxative, more fiber, excessive spicy foods as a means of cleansing the colon?

This may work for you, but for a person with an already irritated digestive tract, this will only compound the existing problem.

And if you have intestinal irritation you ABSOLUTELY should not be doing cleanses. You think they will help an irritated digestive tract? Heck, I have UC, a form of IBD, and too many of the wrong flavor of snack chips or too much coffee and I'm miserable, let alone cayenne pepper and lemon juice or whatever the latest fad is.

(Maybe I should market the "Gatorade, saltines and Vernors" cleanse, I've done that one more than once)

SideSteel

There's no need to detox or cleanse your system and you also do not need to give your organs "a break".

Please see here:
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1159755-looking-for-a-detox-cleanse

Why doesn't your body need to detox or cleanse?

I'm not saying this to dodge your question, but please read the above link. There really is no need to cleanse, your body is designed to do this for you.

So your body always works at 100% efficiency and always does this job perfectly?

First of all you are making a strawman argument. Nowhere in my post did I claim anything about digestive efficiency or perfection.

Next, are you aware of any evidence that:

a) Digestive efficiency is compromised in most people.
and
b) This is problematic and needs to be fixed.
and
c) A detox or cleanse will restore digestive efficiency and fix this problem

To m knowledge, this evidence does not exist.

A person says they feel the need to cleanse ( a broad, not-well-defined term), you say they don't need to cleanse, the body does this for you. Of what is the body cleansing itself?

Cleanse is an ambiguous term used by proponents of pseudoscience as is the word "toxin". Typically they are used hand-in-hand because people cannot name a specific toxin that accumulates to dangerous levels and is removed by said detox product. In the traditional sense, this is the means by which cleanse/detox products are promoted.

I'm simply claiming that there is no need to use these pseudoscientific detox or cleansing products because your digestive system and organs remove unwanted waste products and in the event that they didn't, the solution to this wouldn't lie in a "detox" product, unless you're simply constipated in which case a laxative or other dietary interventions (fiber, a chipotle binge) may do the trick.

So we've established:
that "cleanse: is not a well defined term.
that the body does cleanse itself, and needs to cleanse.

And now your suggesting that the colon is an area that needs to be cleansed, and you recommend a laxative, more fiber, excessive spicy foods as a means of cleansing the colon?

This may work for you, but for a person with an already irritated digestive tract, this will only compound the existing problem.

You enjoy making strawman arguments, don't you.

MinMin97

Cleanse is an ambiguous term used by proponents of pseudoscience as is the word "toxin". Typically they are used hand-in-hand because people cannot name a specific toxin that accumulates to dangerous levels and is removed by said detox product. In the traditional sense, this is the means by which cleanse/detox products are promoted.

I'm simply claiming that there is no need to use these pseudoscientific detox or cleansing products because your digestive system and organs remove unwanted waste products and in the event that they didn't, the solution to this wouldn't lie in a "detox" product, unless you're simply constipated in which case a laxative or other dietary interventions (fiber, a chipotle binge) may do the trick.

So we've established:
that "cleanse: is not a well defined term.
that the body does cleanse itself, and needs to cleanse.

And now your suggesting that the colon is an area that needs to be cleansed, and you recommend a laxative, more fiber, excessive spicy foods as a means of cleansing the colon?

This may work for you, but for a person with an already irritated digestive tract, this will only compound the existing problem.

And if you have intestinal irritation you ABSOLUTELY should not be doing cleanses. You think they will help an irritated digestive tract? Heck, I have UC, a form of IBD, and too many of the wrong flavor of snack chips or too much coffee and I'm miserable, let alone cayenne pepper and lemon juice or whatever the latest fad is.

(Maybe I should market the "Gatorade, saltines and Vernors" cleanse, I've done that one more than once)

I don't think the term cleanse has been defined here yet. I definitely don't blame you for not doing the "cleanses" your listed (I wouldn't want to do them, either!) I hope you find a solution for the UC (I'm not familiar with that)!

IHateThinkingOfAUsername

*snip*

waitwaitwait I've got this! Lemme try!

So you're saying that everything inside of us always works perfectly and never needs anything external in order to work as it should, and that everything that can be included in the broadly defined term "cleanse" is always incorrect under every circumstance?

rivka_m

Well you're the pro-cleanse one, what cleanses do you think are acceptable and useful for the body?

ninerbuff

So the body has systems that "remove waste (is that your term for "cleanse?"), and these systems always work at 100% efficiency? And your cleanse is to eat "more nutritionally dense food and fiber?" What if that person has constipation and IBS? What should they do in your opinion? Their colon is compromised, and is all that food/fiber going to help?

Nope I don't use the word "cleanse". That's what you're using. And if there are no inherent health problems with an individual, then yes the system should work efficiently at 100%.
If there are issues like you've mentioned, then seeing a SPECIALIST who deals in them is what I would suggest. Not going on some "detox and cleanse" program since eating food/drink hasn't been shown scientifically to remove any toxins or cleanse any "dirty" chemicals from the body.
You're reaching here. You want to convince the OP, then try by substantiating by providing peer reviewed clinical study showing that going on a "detox or cleanse" actually supports it's claims. You aren't going to convince me or others who are well versed in how body physiology actually works.

A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

145jd

Nothing cleanses like an enema!

:-)

earlnabby

Once a week I "cleanse". I am on a doctor prescribed high potency iron supplement that causes mild constipation. I have 2 days in a row that I don't take it and I eat extra almonds and my body cleanses itself.

Yes, on occasion you have to make adjustments to let the body do what it is designed to do. Fancy and expensive detoxes and cleanses do nothing except separate fools from their gold. Unless you have a specific medical issue, trust your body. The systems that are present in the human body do a wonderful job all by themselves and these stupid cleanses do nothing to help it along and can, at times, interfere with the proper workings.

Wetcoaster

*snip*

waitwaitwait I've got this! Lemme try!

So you're saying that everything inside of us always works perfectly and never needs anything external in order to work as it should, and that everything that can be included in the broadly defined term "cleanse" is always incorrect under every circumstance?

"I'm" not saying anything.

People can read the science and draw thier own conclusions.

ninerbuff

I don't think the term cleanse has been defined here yet. I definitely don't blame you for not doing the "cleanses" your listed (I wouldn't want to do them, either!) I hope you find a solution for the UC (I'm not familiar with that)!

I'll make it easy for you then:

Cleanse in cleaning the bathroom usually entails using an industrial cleaner to remove things like soap scum, mold, and bacteria.

Cleanse in the diet and fitness world usually entails the ingestion of pricey products to consumers so they can feel better about themselves and drop a few pounds of water weight in a few days.

Hope that clears it up a little, so that strawman arguments don't continue.

A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

Wetcoaster

On a lighter note.......best cleanse ever......

The Moose Cleanse

http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2013/02/the-moose-cleanse/272788/


" When you moose, you'll be able to process way more birch through bark stripping than you could ever just eat at one time. This way you maximize the nutritional benefits of ingesting 10, even 15 pounds of roughage every day. Without the added burden of birch digestion - which takes a lot of time and energy - your body will be free to detoxify your liver and kidneys. Your digestive system will return to an ideal alkalized state. Best of all, your glands and hormonal levels will stabilize: no more wandering thymus!

That's not to say that birch will be the only thing you're allowed to consume on this program. Far from it! On the moose cleanse, about half of your food intake should come from aquatic plants. When you realize the extent of the abundant array of pondweeds, water lilies, algae, and watercress available to you, you won't feel deprived for a minute.

Because moose don't have upper front teeth, you'll want to make sure to avoid using yours whenever possible in order to extract the maximum possible benefits from your food. Instead, the moose has a very sensitive prehensile lip that helps them grab hard-to-reach plants and distinguish between twigs and shoots. You'll want to do the same. Whether you're grabbing water lilies up by the base roots and all or stripping an entire branch of leaves in a single mouthful, your prehensile upper lip is your best friend when it comes to maximizing plant matter intake.

Did you know that moose are the only member of the deer family that can eat while underwater? Take note: from now on, so do you. "

MinMin97

So the body has systems that "remove waste (is that your term for "cleanse?"), and these systems always work at 100% efficiency? And your cleanse is to eat "more nutritionally dense food and fiber?" What if that person has constipation and IBS? What should they do in your opinion? Their colon is compromised, and is all that food/fiber going to help?

Nope I don't use the word "cleanse". That's what you're using. And if there are no inherent health problems with an individual, then yes the system should work efficiently at 100%.
If there are issues like you've mentioned, then seeing a SPECIALIST who deals in them is what I would suggest. Not going on some "detox and cleanse" program since eating food/drink hasn't been shown scientifically to remove any toxins or cleanse any "dirty" chemicals from the body.
You're reaching here. You want to convince the OP, then try by substantiating by providing peer reviewed clinical study showing that going on a "detox or cleanse" actually supports it's claims. You aren't going to convince me or others who are well versed in how body physiology actually works.

A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

Actually, I am wanting the OP to define what she means by cleanse. Every time it's been used in here, I wonder what people mean by cleanse.
You are safe in saying "And if there are no inherent health problems with an individual, then yes the system should work efficiently at 100%." But who's to say that OP is experiencing that kind of health? If she were participating in the thread, it would be easier answer HER question from our own perspectives and experiences.

So you are an knowledgeable on the topic of cleanses/detoxification? You are the person for me to ask this, as you understand that the body does have those processes. Do you think those processes can be interruped/not run efficiently?

PikaKnight

MinMIn97 - Are you actually going to review the links provided in this thread? Or do you just like to blindly argue?

People are providing legit reasons, studies, and logic (to sum it up).

You have provided what evidence or sound argument in regards to cleanses being legit? Nothing. All you've done is nitpick at wording and created loopholes where there are none. (Or as Sidesteel said..you are grasping at straws..imaginary ones at that).