Cleanse

124

Replies

  • Velum_cado
    Velum_cado Posts: 1,608 Member
    I use Persil Non-Bio for the laundry, Fairy for the dishes, and Nivea body wash for myself. They all work pretty well.
  • MinMin97
    MinMin97 Posts: 2,674 Member
    So "we don't need to cleanse, the body cleanses itself" and yet, you say, "there is no detoxifying or cleansing going on in the body?"
    I haven't mentioned anything about the body "cleansing" itself. I gave you the straight up answer of "waste excrement". And stand by my statement that there is no "detoxing or cleansing" on the body going on.
    What about the lymph system?
    In layman's terms, it's the circulatory system of the body.
    What is it's function?
    To circulate fluids throughout the body.
    Does it always operate perfectly?
    Not if someone is suffering from a disease like lymphoma or disorders like lymphedema. Where does this have to do with "detoxing or cleansing"?
    You're looking to argue about "detoxing or cleansing". So please enlighten me on what your definitions of these two words are when relating to physiology. And how the body systematically goes about "detoxing and cleansing".
    I can't seem to answer whatever understanding you have of how physiology works.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    What is "waste excrement?"
    Feces.
    Do you think the body only expels waste from the colon?
    No because people also urinate.
    When you hear the word "cleanse" do you only think of colon cleansing?
    Nope. I think of how people are duped into believing that "cleansing" removes toxins from the body.
    Don't the body's cells rid themselves of waste?
    Krebs cycle.
    Where does the waste go?
    Filtered through liver and/or kidneys.
    What is the main function of the lymph system?
    Circulation
    If a system is not working perfectly, does that mean it is diseased?
    Not necessarily. There are disorders and deficiencies that can impede efficiency.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    "The lymphatic system parallels the cardiovascular system. The lymphatic system is unique in that it is a 1-way system that returns lymph fluid via vessels to the cardiovascular system for the eventual ELIMINATION OF TOXIC BY-PRODUCTS BY END ORGANS SUCH AS KIDNEY, LIVER, COLON, SKIN AND LUNGS. The lymph [fluid] contains nutrients, oxygen, hormones and fatty acids, as well as TOXINS AND CELLULAR WASTE PRODUCTS, THAT ARE TRANSPORTED TO AND FROM CELLULAR TISSUES."
    ^^^^^The above quote is taken from http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1899053-overview
    Another article, factual, but in more of a magazine article format http://www.livescience.com/26983-lymphatic-system.html

    You have repeatedly said "there is no detoxifying or cleansing going on in the body." In fact, the body IS detoxifying and cleansing!
    Does it always perform perfectly, with 100% efficiency?
    I don't think so! That's a really big job, I'm sure it can get overloaded some times, especially with the food and lifestyle choices people make, or simply the stressful circumstances folks can find themselves in.
    Does this mean they should see the dr and that dr will help them feel better? Maybe to get information/his opinion?
    If systems in the body are not working well, does that mean they are diseased?
    I don't think so!
    So if a person is feeling poorly, using terms (which you may hate) such a toxic, want to cleanse, sluggish, or whatever, you just might see them in the forums, asking questions on the matter.
  • Iron_Feline
    Iron_Feline Posts: 10,750 Member
    *SNIP*

    "The lymphatic system parallels the cardiovascular system. The lymphatic system is unique in that it is a 1-way system that returns lymph fluid via vessels to the cardiovascular system for the eventual ELIMINATION OF TOXIC BY-PRODUCTS BY END ORGANS SUCH AS KIDNEY, LIVER, COLON, SKIN AND LUNGS. The lymph [fluid] contains nutrients, oxygen, hormones and fatty acids, as well as TOXINS AND CELLULAR WASTE PRODUCTS, THAT ARE TRANSPORTED TO AND FROM CELLULAR TISSUES."
    ^^^^^The above quote is taken from http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1899053-overview
    Another article, factual, but in more of a magazine article format http://www.livescience.com/26983-lymphatic-system.html

    You have repeatedly said "there is no detoxifying or cleansing going on in the body." In fact, the body IS detoxifying and cleansing!
    Does it always perform perfectly, with 100% efficiency?
    I don't think so! That's a really big job, I'm sure it can get overloaded some times, especially with the food and lifestyle choices people make, or simply the stressful circumstances folks can find themselves in.
    Does this mean they should see the dr and that dr will help them feel better? Maybe to get information/his opinion?
    If systems in the body are not working well, does that mean they are diseased?
    I don't think so!
    So if a person is feeling poorly, using terms (which you may hate) such a toxic, want to cleanse, sluggish, or whatever, you just might see them in the forums, asking questions on the matter.

    What is your actual point?

    And just because you don't think something is true doesn't make it so. And just because people ask the questions using those terms doesn't make the answer any different.
  • ILiftHeavyAcrylics
    ILiftHeavyAcrylics Posts: 27,732 Member
    So "we don't need to cleanse, the body cleanses itself" and yet, you say, "there is no detoxifying or cleansing going on in the body?"
    I haven't mentioned anything about the body "cleansing" itself. I gave you the straight up answer of "waste excrement". And stand by my statement that there is no "detoxing or cleansing" on the body going on.
    What about the lymph system?
    In layman's terms, it's the circulatory system of the body.
    What is it's function?
    To circulate fluids throughout the body.
    Does it always operate perfectly?
    Not if someone is suffering from a disease like lymphoma or disorders like lymphedema. Where does this have to do with "detoxing or cleansing"?
    You're looking to argue about "detoxing or cleansing". So please enlighten me on what your definitions of these two words are when relating to physiology. And how the body systematically goes about "detoxing and cleansing".
    I can't seem to answer whatever understanding you have of how physiology works.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    What is "waste excrement?"
    Feces.
    Do you think the body only expels waste from the colon?
    No because people also urinate.
    When you hear the word "cleanse" do you only think of colon cleansing?
    Nope. I think of how people are duped into believing that "cleansing" removes toxins from the body.
    Don't the body's cells rid themselves of waste?
    Krebs cycle.
    Where does the waste go?
    Filtered through liver and/or kidneys.
    What is the main function of the lymph system?
    Circulation
    If a system is not working perfectly, does that mean it is diseased?
    Not necessarily. There are disorders and deficiencies that can impede efficiency.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    "The lymphatic system parallels the cardiovascular system. The lymphatic system is unique in that it is a 1-way system that returns lymph fluid via vessels to the cardiovascular system for the eventual ELIMINATION OF TOXIC BY-PRODUCTS BY END ORGANS SUCH AS KIDNEY, LIVER, COLON, SKIN AND LUNGS. The lymph [fluid] contains nutrients, oxygen, hormones and fatty acids, as well as TOXINS AND CELLULAR WASTE PRODUCTS, THAT ARE TRANSPORTED TO AND FROM CELLULAR TISSUES."
    ^^^^^The above quote is taken from http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1899053-overview
    Another article, factual, but in more of a magazine article format http://www.livescience.com/26983-lymphatic-system.html

    You have repeatedly said "there is no detoxifying or cleansing going on in the body." In fact, the body IS detoxifying and cleansing!
    Does it always perform perfectly, with 100% efficiency?
    I don't think so! That's a really big job, I'm sure it can get overloaded some times, especially with the food and lifestyle choices people make, or simply the stressful circumstances folks can find themselves in.
    Does this mean they should see the dr and that dr will help them feel better? Maybe to get information/his opinion?
    If systems in the body are not working well, does that mean they are diseased?
    I don't think so!
    So if a person is feeling poorly, using terms (which you may hate) such a toxic, want to cleanse, sluggish, or whatever, you just might see them in the forums, asking questions on the matter.

    You have evidence that these "cleanses" remove toxins that wouldn't be removed otherwise by the body's natural processes?
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 49,024 Member
    "The lymphatic system parallels the cardiovascular system. The lymphatic system is unique in that it is a 1-way system that returns lymph fluid via vessels to the cardiovascular system for the eventual ELIMINATION OF TOXIC BY-PRODUCTS BY END ORGANS SUCH AS KIDNEY, LIVER, COLON, SKIN AND LUNGS. The lymph [fluid] contains nutrients, oxygen, hormones and fatty acids, as well as TOXINS AND CELLULAR WASTE PRODUCTS, THAT ARE TRANSPORTED TO AND FROM CELLULAR TISSUES."
    ^^^^^The above quote is taken from http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1899053-overview
    Another article, factual, but in more of a magazine article format http://www.livescience.com/26983-lymphatic-system.html

    You have repeatedly said "there is no detoxifying or cleansing going on in the body." In fact, the body IS detoxifying and cleansing!
    Does it always perform perfectly, with 100% efficiency?
    I don't think so! That's a really big job, I'm sure it can get overloaded some times, especially with the food and lifestyle choices people make, or simply the stressful circumstances folks can find themselves in.
    Does this mean they should see the dr and that dr will help them feel better? Maybe to get information/his opinion?
    If systems in the body are not working well, does that mean they are diseased?
    I don't think so!
    So if a person is feeling poorly, using terms (which you may hate) such a toxic, want to cleanse, sluggish, or whatever, you just might see them in the forums, asking questions on the matter.
    The human body doesn't produce "toxins". Overdose of just about anything ingested can become "toxic", but that's due to intake and dosage and not production.
    Please enlighten me to one toxin PRODUCED by the body. Because according to the Journals of Medicine, science, physiology, biology, etc. I haven't encountered one yet.
    Sounds like you're caught up more in the semantics. We have a natural "filtering" system that coordinates systematically to remove "waste" from the body. You call it "detoxing and cleansing". Cool. I'll stick to the scientific terminology.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • ksy1969
    ksy1969 Posts: 700 Member
    *SNIP
    "The lymphatic system parallels the cardiovascular system. The lymphatic system is unique in that it is a 1-way system that returns lymph fluid via vessels to the cardiovascular system for the eventual ELIMINATION OF TOXIC BY-PRODUCTS BY END ORGANS SUCH AS KIDNEY, LIVER, COLON, SKIN AND LUNGS. The lymph [fluid] contains nutrients, oxygen, hormones and fatty acids, as well as TOXINS AND CELLULAR WASTE PRODUCTS, THAT ARE TRANSPORTED TO AND FROM CELLULAR TISSUES."
    ^^^^^The above quote is taken from http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1899053-overview
    Another article, factual, but in more of a magazine article format http://www.livescience.com/26983-lymphatic-system.html

    You have repeatedly said "there is no detoxifying or cleansing going on in the body." In fact, the body IS detoxifying and cleansing!
    Does it always perform perfectly, with 100% efficiency?
    I don't think so! That's a really big job, I'm sure it can get overloaded some times, especially with the food and lifestyle choices people make, or simply the stressful circumstances folks can find themselves in.
    Does this mean they should see the dr and that dr will help them feel better? Maybe to get information/his opinion?
    If systems in the body are not working well, does that mean they are diseased?
    I don't think so!
    So if a person is feeling poorly, using terms (which you may hate) such a toxic, want to cleanse, sluggish, or whatever, you just might see them in the forums, asking questions on the matter.

    I think you are mistaken, I am pretty sure he, as well as others, said in the very beginning, that the body does a good enough job on ITS own removing toxins/waste. In fact pretty sure that was abundantly clear but then you come along.

    The bottom line is supposed cleansing products that claim they removes toxins from your body are a marketing scam. In fact some of your responses almost read like you don't believe in cleanses either but you still keep asking questions that make some of us think your are arguing for cleanses.

    I am in to see if this keeps going :drinker:
  • angf0679
    angf0679 Posts: 1,120 Member
    *grabs popcorn*


    I was thinking the exact same thing.
  • IamMCM
    IamMCM Posts: 122
    I highly recommend the placebo cleanse myself.
  • leggup
    leggup Posts: 2,942 Member
    Detox/cleanses are a scam. If you are concerned that your kidneys, liver, etc. are not functioning adequately, see a doctor. No amount of green tea pills or smoothie fasts will make your critical organs function better.
  • MinMin97
    MinMin97 Posts: 2,674 Member
    "The lymphatic system parallels the cardiovascular system. The lymphatic system is unique in that it is a 1-way system that returns lymph fluid via vessels to the cardiovascular system for the eventual ELIMINATION OF TOXIC BY-PRODUCTS BY END ORGANS SUCH AS KIDNEY, LIVER, COLON, SKIN AND LUNGS. The lymph [fluid] contains nutrients, oxygen, hormones and fatty acids, as well as TOXINS AND CELLULAR WASTE PRODUCTS, THAT ARE TRANSPORTED TO AND FROM CELLULAR TISSUES."
    ^^^^^The above quote is taken from http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1899053-overview
    Another article, factual, but in more of a magazine article format http://www.livescience.com/26983-lymphatic-system.html

    You have repeatedly said "there is no detoxifying or cleansing going on in the body." In fact, the body IS detoxifying and cleansing!
    Does it always perform perfectly, with 100% efficiency?
    I don't think so! That's a really big job, I'm sure it can get overloaded some times, especially with the food and lifestyle choices people make, or simply the stressful circumstances folks can find themselves in.
    Does this mean they should see the dr and that dr will help them feel better? Maybe to get information/his opinion?
    If systems in the body are not working well, does that mean they are diseased?
    I don't think so!
    So if a person is feeling poorly, using terms (which you may hate) such a toxic, want to cleanse, sluggish, or whatever, you just might see them in the forums, asking questions on the matter.
    The human body doesn't produce "toxins". Overdose of just about anything ingested can become "toxic", but that's due to intake and dosage and not production.
    Please enlighten me to one toxin PRODUCED by the body. Because according to the Journals of Medicine, science, physiology, biology, etc. I haven't encountered one yet.
    Sounds like you're caught up more in the semantics. We have a natural "filtering" system that coordinates systematically to remove "waste" from the body. You call it "detoxing and cleansing". Cool. I'll stick to the scientific terminology.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    I don't mind that you don't like the medical definition given above. Nor do I mind that you don't like the topic here. It's also okay if you don't agree with me. I think you contradict the truth, and I don't agree with you, but I don't hate you for it, nor accuse you of anything evil. But this topic is open for discussion and if cleansing/toxicity is on a person's mind and they want to open up a topic about it, that's their privilege. I think a person can help their own process of cleansing, and definitely think that harsh or expensive "cleansing programs" are usually not the way to go. I definitely give an OP the freedom to talk about it and would like to give feedback to them. Hope you have a great day!
  • Iron_Feline
    Iron_Feline Posts: 10,750 Member
    "The lymphatic system parallels the cardiovascular system. The lymphatic system is unique in that it is a 1-way system that returns lymph fluid via vessels to the cardiovascular system for the eventual ELIMINATION OF TOXIC BY-PRODUCTS BY END ORGANS SUCH AS KIDNEY, LIVER, COLON, SKIN AND LUNGS. The lymph [fluid] contains nutrients, oxygen, hormones and fatty acids, as well as TOXINS AND CELLULAR WASTE PRODUCTS, THAT ARE TRANSPORTED TO AND FROM CELLULAR TISSUES."
    ^^^^^The above quote is taken from http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1899053-overview
    Another article, factual, but in more of a magazine article format http://www.livescience.com/26983-lymphatic-system.html

    You have repeatedly said "there is no detoxifying or cleansing going on in the body." In fact, the body IS detoxifying and cleansing!
    Does it always perform perfectly, with 100% efficiency?
    I don't think so! That's a really big job, I'm sure it can get overloaded some times, especially with the food and lifestyle choices people make, or simply the stressful circumstances folks can find themselves in.
    Does this mean they should see the dr and that dr will help them feel better? Maybe to get information/his opinion?
    If systems in the body are not working well, does that mean they are diseased?
    I don't think so!
    So if a person is feeling poorly, using terms (which you may hate) such a toxic, want to cleanse, sluggish, or whatever, you just might see them in the forums, asking questions on the matter.
    The human body doesn't produce "toxins". Overdose of just about anything ingested can become "toxic", but that's due to intake and dosage and not production.
    Please enlighten me to one toxin PRODUCED by the body. Because according to the Journals of Medicine, science, physiology, biology, etc. I haven't encountered one yet.
    Sounds like you're caught up more in the semantics. We have a natural "filtering" system that coordinates systematically to remove "waste" from the body. You call it "detoxing and cleansing". Cool. I'll stick to the scientific terminology.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    I don't mind that you don't like the medical definition given above. Nor do I mind that you don't like the topic here. It's also okay if you don't agree with me. I think you contradict the truth, and I don't agree with you, but I don't hate you for it, nor accuse you of anything evil. But this topic is open for discussion and if cleansing/toxicity is on a person's mind and they want to open up a topic about it, that's their privilege. I think a person can help their own process of cleansing, and definitely think that harsh or expensive "cleansing programs" are usually not the way to go. I definitely give an OP the freedom to talk about it and would like to give feedback to them. Hope you have a great day!

    Sadly thanks to your ridiculously pointless and unnessesary thread jack I doubt the op will ever come back. :noway:
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    This content has been removed.
  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
    Does anyone have any evidence that the digestive system becomes compromised sans any medical disorders?

    Does anyone have any evidence that this compromise in digestive efficiency NEEDS to be addressed?

    Finally, if the answer to the above is yes in both cases, does anyone have evidence as to the solution to this problem?

    I posed these on page one when I was strawmanned with the digestive efficiency claim, but it went ignored.
  • sakuragreenlily
    sakuragreenlily Posts: 334 Member
    There's no need to detox or cleanse your system and you also do not need to give your organs "a break".

    Please see here:
    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1159755-looking-for-a-detox-cleanse
    Why doesn't your body need to detox or cleanse?
    Because it's very very efficient at ridding itself of unwanted waste on it's own. When people feel down, low, "yucky", etc., it's usually because they are just LACKING nutrients. Add them and/or increase them and VOILA!

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    What is the body cleansing? How do you know, comprehensively, what makes a person feel down and low?
    The body removes waste that's uneeded. It's systematic at that, just like it attacks bacteria and viruses that invade it. Can you help it along? Sure, but one doesn't NEED to "detox or cleanse" to do it. Eating more nutritionally dense food and fiber is a great approach without having to spend extra money.
    Comprehensively, people who state they are down and low basically come out and just say it. I guess I'll just take their word for it.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    So the body has systems that "remove waste (is that your term for "cleanse?"), and these systems always work at 100% efficiency? And your cleanse is to eat "more nutritionally dense food and fiber?" What if that person has constipation and IBS? What should they do in your opinion? Their colon is compromised, and is all that food/fiber going to help?

    No, but a commercial "cleanse" isn't going to help, either (well, the fiber in a lot of them, plus increased fluid intake, might help the constipation, but you can do that, again, by eating foods rich in fiber and drinking water). If someone has/suspects they have IBS or some other actual gastrointestinal disorder, they should see their doctor and discuss diagnosis and treatment options. Those sometimes involve special diets or avoiding certain foods, but that's not a cleanse, that's medical treatment, for people with an actual disorder.
    So if you go to the dr, they will heal you and you won't have a problem anymore?

    Did anyone here say that? If you actually have a medical problem, going to a doctor can get you an actual diagnosis and treatment plan, which, unfortunately for most digestive disorders like IBS and Crohn's, means managing, not curing, as there are no real cures. You will still have "a problem", but the same will be true of a "cleanse" - and a commercial cleanse won't actually be targeting your specific disorder or trigger foods. If you don't have a medical problem, but you feel constipated, a one-time treatment with an over-the-counter laxative will generally fix that, and a diet high in fiber and fluid intake will help it from recurring (increased magnesium intake can help, too). If you lack energy, you probably aren't getting enough sleep, or exercise, or enough vitamins and minerals, or any of the above, or maybe, if it's chronic, you have an underlying medical or psychological condition. The one thing it *isn't* is your gut, unless you have an actual medical issue that prevents you from absorbing the nutrients from your food, which, again, not something that will be fixed by a cleanse.
    So if you've gone to the dr and what the dr suggests doesn't bring healing, (or if a person follows all the suggestions you have given and it doesn't resolve the problem), then you have reached the end of the line, can only manage your symptoms, and have no hope for healing?
    What do you mean by "cleanse?" What does a "cleanse" do?

    Rather than asking questions in the guise of "clarifying" what others are saying (i.e., "So what you're saying is...") and having them come back and say "No! That's not what I'm saying at all." could you please make a point?
  • sakuragreenlily
    sakuragreenlily Posts: 334 Member
    Does anyone have any evidence that the digestive system becomes compromised sans any medical disorders?

    Does anyone have any evidence that this compromise in digestive efficiency NEEDS to be addressed?

    Finally, if the answer to the above is yes in both cases, does anyone have evidence as to the solution to this problem?

    I posed these on page one when I was strawmanned with the digestive efficiency claim, but it went ignored.

    Hope someone answers you this time rather than just asking a bunch of useless questions. ("Can you PROVE that there's NOT a teapot orbiting Jupiter?! No? Well then how do you know for sure?...")
  • 1princesswarrior
    1princesswarrior Posts: 1,242 Member
    So the body has systems that "remove waste (is that your term for "cleanse?"), and these systems always work at 100% efficiency? And your cleanse is to eat "more nutritionally dense food and fiber?" What if that person has constipation and IBS? What should they do in your opinion? Their colon is compromised, and is all that food/fiber going to help?

    No, but a commercial "cleanse" isn't going to help, either (well, the fiber in a lot of them, plus increased fluid intake, might help the constipation, but you can do that, again, by eating foods rich in fiber and drinking water). If someone has/suspects they have IBS or some other actual gastrointestinal disorder, they should see their doctor and discuss diagnosis and treatment options. Those sometimes involve special diets or avoiding certain foods, but that's not a cleanse, that's medical treatment, for people with an actual disorder.
    So if you go to the dr, they will heal you and you won't have a problem anymore?

    I've had IBS all my life. Let me say the last thing I would do is try some expensive "cleanse" that I don't know what all the ingredients do or what they are. That is not smart at all and a sure fire way to set off an episode.

    The only way to treat IBS is through diet and in some cases medication to treat the symptoms (at least in my case). Through 40 years of trial and error I've learned what my trigger foods are and how to avoid them or how much of them I can eat.
  • JoelleAnn78
    JoelleAnn78 Posts: 1,492 Member
    <snip>
    I don't mind that you don't like the medical definition given above. Nor do I mind that you don't like the topic here. It's also okay if you don't agree with me. I think you contradict the truth, and I don't agree with you, but I don't hate you for it, nor accuse you of anything evil. But this topic is open for discussion and if cleansing/toxicity is on a person's mind and they want to open up a topic about it, that's their privilege. I think a person can help their own process of cleansing, and definitely think that harsh or expensive "cleansing programs" are usually not the way to go. I definitely give an OP the freedom to talk about it and would like to give feedback to them. Hope you have a great day!

    enough.gif
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 49,024 Member
    I don't mind that you don't like the medical definition given above. Nor do I mind that you don't like the topic here. It's also okay if you don't agree with me. I think you contradict the truth, and I don't agree with you, but I don't hate you for it, nor accuse you of anything evil. But this topic is open for discussion and if cleansing/toxicity is on a person's mind and they want to open up a topic about it, that's their privilege. I think a person can help their own process of cleansing, and definitely think that harsh or expensive "cleansing programs" are usually not the way to go. I definitely give an OP the freedom to talk about it and would like to give feedback to them. Hope you have a great day!
    No one's questioned the OP's intent. Feedback was just given on "cleansing". Don't know why you think that giving them accurate information is deterring them from participating.
    Whether you agree on terminology is a matter of choice. As I've mentioned, I'll refer to actual Journals of Medicine rather than articles on alternative medicine. Don't know why you think I contradicted anything, but POV is the probable reason.
    I'd still like to know of at least one actual "toxin" that's PRODUCED by the body though.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • MKEgal
    MKEgal Posts: 3,250 Member
    Anyone know of any easy cleanses that actually work?
    Soap and water.
    The eat a balanced diet and let your body do it's job cleanse.
    Lysol does wonders.
    Eat Fiber, Drink Water. Your butt does the rest
    Colonoscopy prep. That'll clean you right the hell out.
    The most truthful and helpful answers ever.
    I love you guys!
  • MKEgal
    MKEgal Posts: 3,250 Member
    MinMin poses yet another strawman, showing yet again that s/he isn't interested in science & truth, only in promoting her/his ideas (scam of 'cleansing').
    So the body has systems that "remove waste (is that your term for "cleanse?"), and these systems always work at 100% efficiency? And your cleanse is to eat "more nutritionally dense food and fiber?" What if that person has constipation and IBS? What should they do in your opinion? Their colon is compromised, and is all that food/fiber going to help?
    Yes, the body removes its own waste. You can call that 'cleansing' if you choose, but the generally agreed-upon medical term is waste elimination.
    Nothing ever works at 100% efficiency, but that doesn't mean that you should put a slurry of coffee (or unknown chemicals, bought off the internet) up your butt.
    No, his suggestion of eating better food & more fiber & water is the common-sense solution to constipation which works for most people.
    If someone has a disease they should see their doctor & follow her recommendations, not put coffee up their butt.
    So we've established:
    that "cleanse: is not a well defined term.
    that the body does cleanse itself, and needs to cleanse.
    And now your suggesting that the colon is an area that needs to be cleansed, and you recommend a laxative, more fiber, excessive spicy foods as a means of cleansing the colon?
    Correct that 'cleanse' is not well-defined, and in fact not defined at all as you're using it (ridding the body of filthy nasty toxins).
    The body does remove waste material. That's what the liver & kidneys & colon are designed to do. They don't need any special help in most healthy people.
    If someone has a disorder/constipation, yes, drinking more water and eating more fiber will usually be enough to set things right again.
    I see nowhere that someone recommended spicy foods, or 'cleansing' the colon, except you.
    I don't think the term cleanse has been defined here yet
    So tell us what you're using it to mean.
    Or are you just here to argue and make strawman arguments & show off your other logical fallacies.
    (Pardon, your fallacy is showing.)
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 49,024 Member
    Does anyone have any evidence that the digestive system becomes compromised sans any medical disorders?

    Does anyone have any evidence that this compromise in digestive efficiency NEEDS to be addressed?

    Finally, if the answer to the above is yes in both cases, does anyone have evidence as to the solution to this problem?

    I posed these on page one when I was strawmanned with the digestive efficiency claim, but it went ignored.
    I wait patiently as you wait for a response.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • jessilee119
    jessilee119 Posts: 444 Member
    Coffee helps too.
  • MKEgal
    MKEgal Posts: 3,250 Member
    I'd still like to know of at least one actual "toxin" that's PRODUCED by the body though.
    http://www.webmd.com/hepatitis/tc/what-the-liver-does-topic-overview
    A healthy liver does the following:
    It removes bilirubin, ammonia, and other toxins from the blood.
    So even the medical establishment is using the term, but they use it very narrowly & specifically and give examples of what they mean by it.

    From this link posted earlier:
    http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-detox-scam-how-to-spot-it-and-how-to-avoid-it/
    The skin, kidneys, lymphatic system, our gastrointestinal system, and most importantly, the liver make up our astoundingly complex and sophisticated intrinsic detoxification system.
  • QueenBishOTUniverse
    QueenBishOTUniverse Posts: 14,121 Member
    Does anyone have any evidence that the digestive system becomes compromised sans any medical disorders?

    Does anyone have any evidence that this compromise in digestive efficiency NEEDS to be addressed?

    Finally, if the answer to the above is yes in both cases, does anyone have evidence as to the solution to this problem?

    I posed these on page one when I was strawmanned with the digestive efficiency claim, but it went ignored.
    I wait patiently as you wait for a response.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    After more then a decade of teaching biological sciences in a particular geographic area, take my word for it, you're in a prove a negative feedback loop....:laugh: May whatever deity you ascribe to have mercy on whatever it is you believe animates your corpus.
  • VeryKatie
    VeryKatie Posts: 5,961 Member
    So "we don't need to cleanse, the body cleanses itself" and yet, you say, "there is no detoxifying or cleansing going on in the body?"
    I haven't mentioned anything about the body "cleansing" itself. I gave you the straight up answer of "waste excrement". And stand by my statement that there is no "detoxing or cleansing" on the body going on.
    What about the lymph system?
    In layman's terms, it's the circulatory system of the body.
    What is it's function?
    To circulate fluids throughout the body.
    Does it always operate perfectly?
    Not if someone is suffering from a disease like lymphoma or disorders like lymphedema. Where does this have to do with "detoxing or cleansing"?
    You're looking to argue about "detoxing or cleansing". So please enlighten me on what your definitions of these two words are when relating to physiology. And how the body systematically goes about "detoxing and cleansing".
    I can't seem to answer whatever understanding you have of how physiology works.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    What is "waste excrement?"
    Feces.
    Do you think the body only expels waste from the colon?
    No because people also urinate.
    When you hear the word "cleanse" do you only think of colon cleansing?
    Nope. I think of how people are duped into believing that "cleansing" removes toxins from the body.
    Don't the body's cells rid themselves of waste?
    Krebs cycle.
    Where does the waste go?
    Filtered through liver and/or kidneys.
    What is the main function of the lymph system?
    Circulation
    If a system is not working perfectly, does that mean it is diseased?
    Not necessarily. There are disorders and deficiencies that can impede efficiency.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    "The lymphatic system parallels the cardiovascular system. The lymphatic system is unique in that it is a 1-way system that returns lymph fluid via vessels to the cardiovascular system for the eventual ELIMINATION OF TOXIC BY-PRODUCTS BY END ORGANS SUCH AS KIDNEY, LIVER, COLON, SKIN AND LUNGS. The lymph [fluid] contains nutrients, oxygen, hormones and fatty acids, as well as TOXINS AND CELLULAR WASTE PRODUCTS, THAT ARE TRANSPORTED TO AND FROM CELLULAR TISSUES."
    ^^^^^The above quote is taken from http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1899053-overview
    Another article, factual, but in more of a magazine article format http://www.livescience.com/26983-lymphatic-system.html

    You have repeatedly said "there is no detoxifying or cleansing going on in the body." In fact, the body IS detoxifying and cleansing!
    Does it always perform perfectly, with 100% efficiency?
    I don't think so! That's a really big job, I'm sure it can get overloaded some times, especially with the food and lifestyle choices people make, or simply the stressful circumstances folks can find themselves in.
    Does this mean they should see the dr and that dr will help them feel better? Maybe to get information/his opinion?
    If systems in the body are not working well, does that mean they are diseased?
    I don't think so!
    So if a person is feeling poorly, using terms (which you may hate) such a toxic, want to cleanse, sluggish, or whatever, you just might see them in the forums, asking questions on the matter.

    Guys! Guys! She's answering her own questions!!!!
    I guess that means she had no purpose in posting ALL of those other messages and could have JUST PUT THIS in the first place.
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
    Does anyone have any evidence that the digestive system becomes compromised sans any medical disorders?

    Does anyone have any evidence that this compromise in digestive efficiency NEEDS to be addressed?

    Finally, if the answer to the above is yes in both cases, does anyone have evidence as to the solution to this problem?

    I posed these on page one when I was strawmanned with the digestive efficiency claim, but it went ignored.
    I wait patiently as you wait for a response.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    Scoot over, I am going to wait with you!
  • Ldonahue921
    Ldonahue921 Posts: 75 Member
    Perhaps OP would like to join the discussion?
  • Samstan101
    Samstan101 Posts: 699 Member
    I don't mind that you don't like the medical definition given above. Nor do I mind that you don't like the topic here. It's also okay if you don't agree with me. I think you contradict the truth, and I don't agree with you, but I don't hate you for it, nor accuse you of anything evil. But this topic is open for discussion and if cleansing/toxicity is on a person's mind and they want to open up a topic about it, that's their privilege. I think a person can help their own process of cleansing, and definitely think that harsh or expensive "cleansing programs" are usually not the way to go. I definitely give an OP the freedom to talk about it and would like to give feedback to them. Hope you have a great day!
    No one's questioned the OP's intent. Feedback was just given on "cleansing". Don't know why you think that giving them accurate information is deterring them from participating.
    Whether you agree on terminology is a matter of choice. As I've mentioned, I'll refer to actual Journals of Medicine rather than articles on alternative medicine. Don't know why you think I contradicted anything, but POV is the probable reason.
    I'd still like to know of at least one actual "toxin" that's PRODUCED by the body though.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    Agree! If 'alternative medicine' worked it'd just be called medicine.
  • j4nash
    j4nash Posts: 1,719 Member
    Perhaps OP would like to join the discussion?

    Something tells me she doesn't post much.
  • teenie_71
    teenie_71 Posts: 44
    just no

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