Bob Harper was WRONG last night about Soy

purrrr

I have no problem making up protein in a day, and most days I don't drink milk. But I have a hard time finding good sources of calcium. I have had the lactose intolerance checked at several points in my life and it is indeed the case. However, with lactaid pills I do eat small amounts of dairy products.

Dairy is not a good resource of calcium... Humans over the age of 4 do not have an enzyme called renin or something and cannot process the calcium... Try to guess why bone diseas like osteoporosis are widest spread in the top dairy consuming countries?

Here are some good resources of calcium from a site i googled, i'm pretty sure there's more to it:

* Salmon
* Rhubarb
* Sardines
* Collard greens
* Spinach
* Turnip greens
* Okra
* White beans
* Baked beans
* Broccoli
* Peas
* Brussel sprouts
* Sesame seeds
* Bok choy
* Almonds

AJCM

Thanks for bringing this up Banks...

It has been disappearning from health food store shelves in the past few years (Whole Foods has a huge reduction, local stores around Toronto have reduced it, even GNC carries very very little soy protein).

My Naturopathic Doctor says absolutely no soy, for anyone. Not to be confused with fermented prodcuts, such as miso, which is healthful. She also doesn't much like a lot meat in one's diet, however she said the negative affects of soy are worse than grocery store meats.

Did you also mention that it's genetically modified?
:sick:

aymie24

I have no problem making up protein in a day, and most days I don't drink milk. But I have a hard time finding good sources of calcium. I have had the lactose intolerance checked at several points in my life and it is indeed the case. However, with lactaid pills I do eat small amounts of dairy products.

Dairy is not a good resource of calcium... Humans over the age of 4 do not have an enzyme called renin or something and cannot process the calcium... Try to guess why bone diseas like osteoporosis are widest spread in the top dairy consuming countries?

Here are some good resources of calcium from a site i googled, i'm pretty sure there's more to it:

* Salmon
* Rhubarb
* Sardines
* Collard greens
* Spinach
* Turnip greens
* Okra
* White beans
* Baked beans
* Broccoli
* Peas
* Brussel sprouts
* Sesame seeds
* Bok choy
* Almonds

PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE everyone read up on everything discussed on MFP for yourself!

There have been studies that indicate bone mass in women is actually higher post breastfeeding than it was pre-pregnancy. The assumptions science has made for many years are being debunked. Just because something makes logical sense, doesn't make it true.

In countries with low dairy consumption and high extended breastfeeding rates, osteoporosis is not an issue.

OUR OVERALL HEALTH IS NOT SIMPLY A MATTER OF WHAT WE CONSUME, IT IS LIFESTYLE AS A WHOLE!

aymie24

Did you also mention that it's genetically modified?
:sick:

"13.3 million farmers — 90 percent of who farm in developing countries – choose to plant biotech crops.
Farmers in 25 countries on six continents are using plant biotechnology to solve difficult crop production challenges and conserve the environment. Over the past decade, they’ve increased area planted in genetically modified (GM) crops by more than 10 percent each year, increased their farm income by more than US$44 billion (1996-2007), and achieved economic, environmental and social benefits in crops such as soybeans, canola, corn and cotton.

To date, total acres of biotech crops harvested exceed more than 2 billion with a proven 13-year history of safe use. Over the next decade, expanded adoption combined with current research on 57 crops in 63 countries will broaden the advantages of genentically modified foods for growers, consumers and the environment."

From Monsanto's website. If you don't know what Monsanto is, please google it.

KZOsMommy

So what is your suggestion for people like me that live on Soy because I can't have dairy. I haven't been able to have it since I was a newborn and have been using soy products all my life.


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you might want to confirm that you are truely lactose intolerant, or just COW milk intolerant. Many times, the allergy is mis-diagnosed as a lactose intolerance, when in fact, it's the type of protein that cows milk contains that they are truely intolerant of, and other types of milk would be ok. For instance goat's milk.

Besides that, there's no reason to HAVE to have milk, or other dairy. It's a good complete protein source, and good fat and vitamin source, but you can get those vitamins and protein in many other ways.

There is a difference in being lactose intolerant and being allergic to milk. My daughter has a dairy allergy she can not even have goats milk. She dr has told me they are not the same thing. People that are lactose intolerant will get an upset stomach where my daughter could die having dairy.

We do not do much soy at all here. She will have the soy milk in her cereal but she does not drink what is left. Other then that we do no other soy. She is also allergic to nuts and eggs so we do not have much options with here lol

I was really surprised too that Bob did that. I have heard a lot of neg. things about soy and young boys (which I do have a son also).

I guess all we can do it hope that we are following the right information about things!

Amanda

purrrr

"13.3 million farmers — 90 percent of who farm in developing countries – choose to plant biotech crops.
Farmers in 25 countries on six continents are using plant biotechnology to solve difficult crop production challenges and conserve the environment. Over the past decade, they’ve increased area planted in genetically modified (GM) crops by more than 10 percent each year, increased their farm income by more than US$44 billion (1996-2007), and achieved economic, environmental and social benefits in crops such as soybeans, canola, corn and cotton.

To date, total acres of biotech crops harvested exceed more than 2 billion with a proven 13-year history of safe use. Over the next decade, expanded adoption combined with current research on 57 crops in 63 countries will broaden the advantages of genentically modified foods for growers, consumers and the environment."

From Monsanto's website. If you don't know what Monsanto is, please google it.

so if all crops are being genetically modified, we have to avoid them as well... then what's left to eat that's really healthy... :explode:

MTGirl

Banks- my daughter was looking at me all big eyed last night after Bob's little blurb about soy. I was hollering at the TV - "Yes and it has phytoestrogen that can mess up male functions big time" and a few other things. I think she thought I lost my mind yelling at the tv - but soy is really not healthy. Yes, people, do some research. Bob did a diservice with his little announcement and ignored some facts about soy that make it not a good choice. Sure, you can find a study that will back up any claim. But if you look deep enough into the truth what you will find about soy is not good. Phytoestrogens are not good for men and can a lot of breast cancers feed on excess estrogen. Most naturopathic docs will tell you no soy products - with the exception of fermented stuff in moderation.

aymie24

"13.3 million farmers — 90 percent of who farm in developing countries – choose to plant biotech crops.
Farmers in 25 countries on six continents are using plant biotechnology to solve difficult crop production challenges and conserve the environment. Over the past decade, they’ve increased area planted in genetically modified (GM) crops by more than 10 percent each year, increased their farm income by more than US$44 billion (1996-2007), and achieved economic, environmental and social benefits in crops such as soybeans, canola, corn and cotton.

To date, total acres of biotech crops harvested exceed more than 2 billion with a proven 13-year history of safe use. Over the next decade, expanded adoption combined with current research on 57 crops in 63 countries will broaden the advantages of genentically modified foods for growers, consumers and the environment."

From Monsanto's website. If you don't know what Monsanto is, please google it.

so if all crops are being genetically modified, we have to avoid them as well... then what's left to eat that's really healthy... :explode:

Food you grow yourself from seeds you know for certain are true hierloom, in soil you know has not been contaiminated, watered with water you collected in rain barrels....good luck with that, lol...

My point in posting that was that people read things like "genetically modified" and freak out, yet we are all eating GM food. There is almost no way around it. People think the Amish are all natural and organic, lol, that's not true either. My hubby has a saying, "assumption is the mother of all $%*@ ups"....

msarro

I have to argue with you on one thing Banks, while the Japanese may not eat as much soy as is often claimed, the Indonesians, Indians, Vietnamese, Laotians, Javanese, and the rest of East Asia do (Japan being an island tends to get a large amount of its agricultural products from the sea, as you would expect from an island nation). It has long been a staple of Buddhists in lieu of meat and so the higher the percentage of strict Buddhists, the more common the use of soy products. Further, in Java the eating of tempeh is so common that it is often regionally referred to as "Javanese Meat." But there are definitely some countries where soy products are a staple and their regular use has not caused issue.

Note that there is a big difference between regular use, and overuse as many vegans do. Eating a soy burger, topped with soy cheese on bread with soy nuts in it, and chasing it with a big glass of soy milk is bad for you, no question. However having some tofu with a salad every day I personally believe will not harm you. The evidence simply is not there in countries where soy is eaten as a protein staple.

Further the studies so far about the phytoestrogens (to my knowledge) have yet to show any conclusive evidence one way or another that there is an effect on adult males. The last I read, the main focus of those concerns was on developing infants and the overuse of soy-based formulas - especially on developing boys.

That's why soy formula should only be used as a very last resort when all other alternatives fail.

The rest I won't argue about, you're spot on

newlifestyle36

It didnt surprise me but it does piss me off.

And big Ron the dad? he thought olive oil has trans fat in it. After months on the show he doesnt know about that? The show should be ashamed he was so stupid

The misinformation on such a show is just absurd and is dangerous.

I have long been a foe of soy. It is not for men period and women should not rely on it for protein.

Calling soy protein the same as any other protein is another indication of how much wrong information is out there and sadly in here

The blind emphasis on calorie amounts and not on calorie quality is also driving me crazy.

Yet another thread this morning glorifying skinny cow becuase it is low calorie. Skinny cow (not the laughing cow) is chemical junk. But....since it is low cal...the blind masses are buying in bulk

like the women from good house keeping said on TBL read the label's ... I say if i can't pronoune whats in the food don't buy it and don't eat it!!!! :bigsmile:

pettmybunny

Dang... And edamame is one of my favorite snacks! lol

I'm still eatin' it :laugh:

Phoenixflame

Jillian Michaels gave a really logical reason to stay away from soy--yeah, our bodies can handle a lot of crap we put in it, so in a perfect world moderate amounts of soy wouldn't be THAT bad. But in fact, soy is in a huge amount of the foods we eat. It's used in a billion products. So we are already consuming quite a bit--we don't need any more.

And tempeh is fermented, like miso, so it is healthier than, say, tofu.

But I'm anti-soy in general. For one, I realized that it does not agree with me. It makes me bloat.

SHBoss1673

I have to argue with you on one thing Banks, while the Japanese may not eat as much soy as is often claimed, the Indonesians, Indians, Vietnamese, Laotians, Javanese, and the rest of East Asia do (Japan being an island tends to get a large amount of its agricultural products from the sea, as you would expect from an island nation). It has long been a staple of Buddhists in lieu of meat and so the higher the percentage of strict Buddhists, the more common the use of soy products. Further, in Java the eating of tempeh is so common that it is often regionally referred to as "Javanese Meat." But there are definitely some countries where soy products are a staple and their regular use has not caused issue.

Note that there is a big difference between regular use, and overuse as many vegans do. Eating a soy burger, topped with soy cheese on bread with soy nuts in it, and chasing it with a big glass of soy milk is bad for you, no question. However having some tofu with a salad every day I personally believe will not harm you. The evidence simply is not there in countries where soy is eaten as a protein staple.

Further the studies so far about the phytoestrogens (to my knowledge) have yet to show any conclusive evidence one way or another that there is an effect on adult males. The last I read, the main focus of those concerns was on developing infants and the overuse of soy-based formulas - especially on developing boys.

That's why soy formula should only be used as a very last resort when all other alternatives fail.

The rest I won't argue about, you're spot on

The us consumes more soy per capita then any other nation, 25 million tons total, China consumes 50 million tons, but has almost 5 times as many people so that means they consume less then 1/2 per capita, and they have a much higher rate of fermented soy to unfermented (which is the main consumption in the US), fermented soy gets rid of the phytic acid problem, making it somewhat healthier to eat (although the estrogen levels are still there). India isn't even close per capita, consuming 11 million tons and having 1.1 billion people (the US has about 300 million, china has about 1.4 billion). Japan consumes 4.4 million tons, and they have 127 million people, so they aren't even in the ballpark.

So as you can see, we (the US) DO consume far more soy then any other country, per capita. Because all our processed foods are loaded with it. Face it, we have a soy problem.

AJCM

My Naturopathic Doctor (who is Vietnamese, trained in China, UK, and US) says that, in general, as North Americans, or of European descent, we do not have the sufficient enzymes to deal with it - that is why Asians have an easier time digesting/processing it.
:flowerforyou:

weaklink109

I just reviewed all the posts about soy and learned a few things. Now, can someone enlighten me as to who the heck "Bob Harper" is? At first I thought he was someone who posted, but it appears he must be on tv in some capacity, but I was wondering where. Just curious.

ivykivy

I was amazed that my tuna in water contained soy. I've been debating whether to stop eating it or not since I do have a thyroid problem. But it is cheap and handy so I try to eat no more than 2 or3 cans a week. I might have to switch though.

chrissyh

I just reviewed all the posts about soy and learned a few things. Now, can someone enlighten me as to who the heck "Bob Harper" is? At first I thought he was someone who posted, but it appears he must be on tv in some capacity, but I was wondering where. Just curious.

He's one of the two trainers on Biggest loser on NBC

chrissyh

I was amazed that my tuna in water contained soy. I've been debating whether to stop eating it or not since I do have a thyroid problem. But it is cheap and handy so I try to eat no more than 2 or3 cans a week. I might have to switch though.

In moderation you're ok - I wouldn't imagine there's that much in the tuna....maybe I am wrong

RachVR6

I was amazed that my tuna in water contained soy. I've been debating whether to stop eating it or not since I do have a thyroid problem. But it is cheap and handy so I try to eat no more than 2 or3 cans a week. I might have to switch though.

In moderation you're ok - I wouldn't imagine there's that much in the tuna....maybe I am wrong

I eat tuna in moderation, because it's higher in mercury than many types of fish...and I think it tastes gross. :laugh:

chellebelle315

there's soy in my tuna??? I'm going to go read its label again!!! craziness!!!!

Here's one of the things I love about MFP...it sparks my curiosity and LEARN things!!!

I had no idea, because I had never bothered to question, that maybe soy protein isn't the best option for me. i saw a thread about it a few months ago and did some research. I had no idea some of the issues concerning soy, and now I'm a little more educated, and can look for it in the labels on the foods I buy.

I guess my point is message boards are a great place for an exchange of ideas and thoughts, and a fabulous place to vent or get a little support. There's no reason to take anything anyone says at face value. If you're here you're already online. google (or your favorite search engine) is your friend. If you question something someone posts, google....read...learn...decide for yourself.

I still love edamame, and I don't feel bad about eating it...and I like tofu from time to time, but I definitely switched to whey protein for a protein boost in my smoothies, and I read the labels a little closer on the premade stuff I buy....I refuse to make my own crackers damnit.

and as always....thanks Boss, I love your posts....even if I don't agree I always find something to motivate me or learn something more to research.

I can't help it...I like Bob better than Jillian...I'm not a huge TBL fan, but (no one throw stuff at me) Jillian kind of scares the hell out of me....I know I'd punch her, and then she'd beat the crap out of me. She's a little too confrontational for me. However, I saw her on Rachel Ray yesterday, and she was very cool...outside the gym.