Should men get paternity leave from work?

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  • cabaray
    cabaray Posts: 971 Member
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    The American government could probably afford maternity and paternity leave if we would cut other spending. I wonder how much a year the government spends on Social Security Disability for people with mysterious back problems (not that there aren't legitimate ones) or ex-cons who have PTSD from their time in prison (yes, it happens). How about the money spent on food stamps for people who sell them and buy drugs or for women who pop out 5 kids and refuse to work. How about this...a tax refund should never be for more than was paid in...that is not a refund, it is welfare! I could go on all day...

    Fixing loopholes or people who take advantage of the system is a very difficult task.
    So I guess that means we shouldn't try? And tax "refunds" larger than the amount of tax paid in is not a loophole. That could easily be written in when they change tax code, which is often. Our neighbor paid in $500 of federal tax last year and got a $10,000 "refund". I wonder how often that happens and how much our government could save with that one legislation change? The american government has more than enough employees to work on these problems.
  • cabaray
    cabaray Posts: 971 Member
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    The American government could probably afford maternity and paternity leave if we would cut other spending. I wonder how much a year the government spends on Social Security Disability for people with mysterious back problems (not that there aren't legitimate ones) or ex-cons who have PTSD from their time in prison (yes, it happens). How about the money spent on food stamps for people who sell them and buy drugs or for women who pop out 5 kids and refuse to work. How about this...a tax refund should never be for more than was paid in...that is not a refund, it is welfare! I could go on all day...

    Fixing loopholes or people who take advantage of the system is a very difficult task.

    Also, simply because loopholes exist does not outweigh the benefit of a workable system as a whole.

    In economic terms there will always be the problem of the "free rider" which maybe unpalatable on a moral or ethical level. However, to let that small minority dictate how the greater overall policy should operate is flawed in my view.

    As to the OP, the answer is yes, without question.
    I question how many of these systems should actually be considered workable...
  • tashjs21
    tashjs21 Posts: 4,584 Member
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    The American government could probably afford maternity and paternity leave if we would cut other spending. I wonder how much a year the government spends on Social Security Disability for people with mysterious back problems (not that there aren't legitimate ones) or ex-cons who have PTSD from their time in prison (yes, it happens). How about the money spent on food stamps for people who sell them and buy drugs or for women who pop out 5 kids and refuse to work. How about this...a tax refund should never be for more than was paid in...that is not a refund, it is welfare! I could go on all day...

    Fixing loopholes or people who take advantage of the system is a very difficult task.
    So I guess that means we shouldn't try? And tax "refunds" larger than the amount of tax paid in is not a loophole. That could easily be written in when they change tax code, which is often. Our neighbor paid in $500 of federal tax last year and got a $10,000 "refund". I wonder how often that happens and how much our government could save with that one legislation change? The american government has more than enough employees to work on these problems.


    I am one of those families that "got back" more than I put in. I agree, it is not right. How is that paying taxes?? Changing that might put a dent in our debt and might also discourage some of those people that pop out kids they can't afford just because they get a bigger 'refund'. :explode:
  • grinch031
    grinch031 Posts: 1,679
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    There's obviously a difference between "leave" and "paid leave". Men are already untitled to paternity leave without pay. I think the issue is whether its fair to give only women paid leave. I think if you're only looking at physical recovery, than 6-12 weeks of paid leave to women-only is unfair. I think 2-4 weeks is more reasonable.

    I don't think my company offers either paid paternity or maternity leave, but only women can benefit by using short term disability to get a payout. I didn't get squat when we had children, I used a week of paid vacation.
  • unmitigatedbadassery
    unmitigatedbadassery Posts: 653 Member
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    I think men should get a week. Not the 6 weeks women get so their bodies can recover

    What if he's doing all the work? (taking care of the newborn)

    For sure - I took care of my son when he was born 24/7 (as any good dad should). Fortunately I was unemployed at the time so I could sleep when he did.
  • Swissmiss
    Swissmiss Posts: 8,754 Member
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    Yes, just as soon as they begin giving birth.
  • blv0267
    blv0267 Posts: 150 Member
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    I think so. They both need bonding time and they both need help, especially Mom. I think a couple weeks when the baby is first born and then another 2 weeks after Mom goes back to work if she works.
  • WhiteCoc0
    WhiteCoc0 Posts: 192 Member
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    My man will probably take the whole paternity leave for me, when we decide to have childern. In Canada, its 52 weeks. I am not a fan of childern and I have a career where I have to work to get to the top. So if he wants kids, he will be the Stay at home Dad.
  • cabaray
    cabaray Posts: 971 Member
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    The American government could probably afford maternity and paternity leave if we would cut other spending. I wonder how much a year the government spends on Social Security Disability for people with mysterious back problems (not that there aren't legitimate ones) or ex-cons who have PTSD from their time in prison (yes, it happens). How about the money spent on food stamps for people who sell them and buy drugs or for women who pop out 5 kids and refuse to work. How about this...a tax refund should never be for more than was paid in...that is not a refund, it is welfare! I could go on all day...

    Fixing loopholes or people who take advantage of the system is a very difficult task.
    So I guess that means we shouldn't try? And tax "refunds" larger than the amount of tax paid in is not a loophole. That could easily be written in when they change tax code, which is often. Our neighbor paid in $500 of federal tax last year and got a $10,000 "refund". I wonder how often that happens and how much our government could save with that one legislation change? The american government has more than enough employees to work on these problems.


    I am one of those families that "got back" more than I put in. I agree, it is not right. How is that paying taxes?? Changing that might put a dent in our debt and might also discourage some of those people that pop out kids they can't afford just because they get a bigger 'refund'. :explode:
    Did you also know that if an american (or permanant resident) has parents that live in Mexico or Canada and provide half of their financial support (hard to disprove), they can count both parents as dependents on their taxes? There's all sort of crazy stuff in our tax code. So crazy that some companies (I believe GE was one of them) end up paying no taxes!
  • KelliMourer87
    KelliMourer87 Posts: 12
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    My husband got 10 days, thank you Navy!! :D And Chief said if he needed more time to just let him know too. The leave isn't just for them to re-coop after the long hours of labor and comforting their wife it's also because the first week is hell for the wife especially if she's breastfeeding!! LOL That was hell!!! ok end vent!
  • ArroganceInStep
    ArroganceInStep Posts: 6,239 Member
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    The American government could probably afford maternity and paternity leave if we would cut other spending. I wonder how much a year the government spends on Social Security Disability for people with mysterious back problems (not that there aren't legitimate ones) or ex-cons who have PTSD from their time in prison (yes, it happens). How about the money spent on food stamps for people who sell them and buy drugs or for women who pop out 5 kids and refuse to work. How about this...a tax refund should never be for more than was paid in...that is not a refund, it is welfare! I could go on all day...

    Fixing loopholes or people who take advantage of the system is a very difficult task.

    So I guess that means we shouldn't try? And tax "refunds" larger than the amount of tax paid in is not a loophole. That could easily be written in when they change tax code, which is often. Our neighbor paid in $500 of federal tax last year and got a $10,000 "refund". I wonder how often that happens and how much our government could save with that one legislation change? The american government has more than enough employees to work on these problems.

    I wasn't implying that we shouldn't try to improve the situation, I just think that it's an extremely massive undertaking. I agree that there are things that could be done to make improvements, but I also think that even small changes take tremendous effort and, at the end of the day, don't have as much of an impact as we might like.
  • QueenJayJay
    QueenJayJay Posts: 1,139
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    Paternity leave is not needed.

    Child care is woman's work.

    :squint:

    Can't tell if joking.
  • ArroganceInStep
    ArroganceInStep Posts: 6,239 Member
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    Did you also know that if an american (or permanant resident) has parents that live in Mexico or Canada and provide half of their financial support (hard to disprove), they can count both parents as dependents on their taxes? There's all sort of crazy stuff in our tax code. So crazy that some companies (I believe GE was one of them) end up paying no taxes!

    Claiming dependents is one of many angles people may use to take advantage of the system.

    And the argument against corporate tax breaks, which are massive, is that if they were not in place those companies would relocate to places with more favorable tax codes.
  • yesthistime
    yesthistime Posts: 2,051 Member
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    Sure. A couple weeks to make sure mom and baby are taken care of before the family settles back into regular life.
  • vancil01
    vancil01 Posts: 70 Member
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    Why shouldn't men get the same time off as the women do. I understand women's bodies need to recover, but I feel it will help everyone if both parent's had the same amount of time off with a newborn. I am going to take the same amount of time off when my wife and I have a baby, I want to be there for all of that.

    I think in Sweden both parent's get a year and a half off..that would be awesome and ideal...but that is not my reality.
  • regina2063
    regina2063 Posts: 203 Member
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    depends on the man...is he going to really take care of the child...seriously...or play....i would nt mind them having time off..if they are really going to help...other than that....i think NOT....ha ha ha
  • fteale
    fteale Posts: 5,310 Member
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    Here women get 6 months, men get 2 weeks. I think this is a bit unfair. I agree women need 6 months if they have had a caesarean and are breastfeeding. I wasn't human for the first 6 months after birth, my hormones were all over the place, I didn't sleep at all, and your body takes a good 9 months to recover from the trauma of pregnancy and birth. I couldn't lift anything or run for 3 months after having my first baby (by caesarean).

    However, if a woman wants to go back to work after the statutory 6 weeks off (it is actually illegal for an employer to accept a woman back in the workplace for 6 weeks after birth here) and she's not breastfeeding, I think the parental leave should be transferable to the father. I don't think it is ever acceptable for a child under 6 months to be in a nursery. They need one to one care.
  • QueenJayJay
    QueenJayJay Posts: 1,139
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    I don't think it is ever acceptable for a child under 6 months to be in a nursery. They need one to one care.

    That is most desirable, but not always an option.
  • fteale
    fteale Posts: 5,310 Member
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    Paternity leave is not needed.

    Child care is woman's work.

    I have no idea if you are being serious or not, but that is a stupid thing to say. Men don't get paternity leave to look after the baby. They get it to look after the mother who will for the first few days (or weeks in a surgical birth) not be able to do anything. I was in hospital for 5 days when our son was born, and that was after 2 days of labour. So that was a week my husband need off for a start. Then I wasn't allowed to lift anything for another 2 weeks, including the baby I had just given birth to. I had metal staples in my abdomen literally holding my insides in, and couldn't walk more than 10m without heavy bleeding and being at risk of fainting.

    Men should have a MINIMUM of 2 weeks off to make sure the mother of their child is well enough to start doing it on her own.
  • iuangina
    iuangina Posts: 691 Member
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    No employer is required to offer paid maternity leave. They are only required hold your job for 12 weeks of FMLA. Any extra leave is something they do by choice.

    That being said, I think that all father's deserve the same thing that mothers get. There is a big adjustment that goes into bringing home a new child. It's not just about healing your body from giving birth.
    In the US, men are eligible for Family Medical Leave (unpaid, unless they choose to use paid time off, which is not required by employers to offer/allow), the same as women. Part of that Act is not just to physically heal yourself, but also to take care of family members, or bond with a new baby. This is goes for either a direct-born child or an adopted child. Not to mention, (most) new dad are also adjusting physically to a new schedule and new demand in the household, which can affect ther ability to perform on the job. I think it is a good thing for both mom and dad to take the time to get used to the new baby and get into the new routine.

    Sorry... my HR hat slipped on there for a minute...

    But if women get PAID maternity leave, do you think men should get PAID paternity leave? That's what I'm asking, I guess.

    FMLA isn't paid.

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