Skinny gossip
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I think what it comes down to is that everyone has a different opinion. There are many who think that their opinion is the only correct one and feel the need to have others agree with them. Therefore your goal weight of 165 may seem high to a person who has always been 100, but will seem insanely low to your overweight friend who doesn't want you to weigh less than her.
Both will tell you you're wrong and you should change your goal. My point I'm trying to make is that what is lacking in the MFP forums is respect of different opinions. I, along with many other members who have posted topics, have felt the need to defend themselves against other members.
I just want to address this with something you may not have thought of...
having been as heavy as 300 pounds, and having constantly struggled since my early 20s to get or stay under 200 pounds, I have a goal weight (for now) of 165. This still falls above "normal" on the BMI scale, and many people would still see that as overweight, especially those who have spent their entire life at a "healthy" weight. But for me??? If I can reach and maintain 165? I will be THRILLED. For me to combat genetics and close to 40 years of bad habits and get down to that weight would be a monumental accomplishment, and I am not going to feel the least bit unhealthy if I don't have it in me to go any lower.
Well, I understand where she is coming from. Just because I've always weighed 100 pounds, does not mean that I don't understand that I have a different body type from other people. I am an intelligent person and I know that many people have different sizes in their bone structure and that means more space for muscles, fat, larger organs, etc. When a person has a larger frame it translates to a larger weight for many reasons. And there is not just small and large. There is everything from extra small all the way up to large. I am very much aware that most people should not try to get to my weight because even I did not try to get to my weight, it's just the way I am. Particularly with women, we also have a variance in body shape for many many more reasons. I don't think people should be judgmental of weight whatever the weight is. I am supportive of everyone reaching their own healthy goals.
I'm the same way, I know that not everyone can be or should be 100 pounds. But I am surprised by the eagerness of some not very informed people to jump on others. And there is much more aggressiveness from overweight people towards normal weight people, especially towards people who are at the low end of the spectrum.
Some members are unwilling to take responsibility for themselves and are simply not open to other points of view. For example, there was the obese woman who sought sympathy after ordering three pizzas. I asked her what she expected to do with them? She was abusive.
I was invited to join a group and someone who probably has been fat for a very long time was repeating the usual "slow and steady is the only way" advice and I said that approach did not work for everyone (and it's been identified as a "myth" of weight loss.). That individual took umbrage. She said that as an always-thin person I couldn't understand. Yes, I do, that's why I'm not fat while everyone else in my family is.
So certain people are going to keep making the same mistakes no matter what you suggest.0 -
The trend in the US and many other western cultures is to be overfed. Being overweight is just as much a symptom of disordered eating as being underweight. Fat pride is seems to be more dangerous than Vlada's thigh gap when you really consider it...
:huh:0 -
Being nosy...I went over to the site.
Then I saw the thread on Kate Upton.
I could use a hug.0 -
I never heard of the site. Sounds like a group of people wrapped up in negativity. Maybe an eating disorder how-to site? Not a place I want to visit & I certainly don't care what they think or say.0
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Being nosy...I went over to the site.
Then I saw the thread on Kate Upton.
I could use a hug.
Hugs
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I've read that site before. As far as I remember they don't promote anything more extreme than intermittent fasting, and they're just a support group for people who like a particular aesthetic... I think they're pretty down on actual eating disorders.
Lots of their members are models who'd lose their jobs if they gained any weight, so it's good for them to have a place where they can talk about these things. I don't really approve of that kind of extreme in the average person, but then I don't approve of the bodybuilder look either. Your body, your choice.
It does suck that MFP have some people who can be quite negative about people aiming for certain low weight goals though.0 -
well ive never been fat and i would never refer to myself as "skinny" because 1 im not and 2 thats not healthy.0
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I've read that site before. As far as I remember they don't promote anything more extreme than intermittent fasting, and they're just a support group for people who like a particular aesthetic... I think they're pretty down on actual eating disorders.
Lots of their members are models who'd lose their jobs if they gained any weight, so it's good for them to have a place where they can talk about these things. I don't really approve of that kind of extreme in the average person, but then I don't approve of the bodybuilder look either. Your body, your choice.
It does suck that MFP have some people who can be quite negative about people aiming for certain low weight goals though.
I'm not sure what posts you have read on the site, but I just read the one on avoiding food and pretending you are sick on Thanksgiving. I'm no doctor/nutritionist, but pretty sure that's not healthy advice to give anyone and it seems a bit disordered.0 -
I havent looked at that site, but about your question on MFP..
I have actually seen people here being somewhat hostile towards people whose goals are to gain weight. The LARGE majority of comments though are encouraging and helpful.
The only times Ive seen people getting on someones case for having a low goal weight were times that I also thought the person was aiming for something unhealthy and possibly had body dysmorphic disorder or an eating disorder. The comments were meant to be helpful, though the person receiving them might not have perceived them that way.0 -
I can kind of see their point. People on this forum claim not to take BMI seriously, mainly the larger ones. They dismiss its validity for themselves being overweight but as soon as someone has a slightly underweight BMI, people freak out. "EATING DISORDER EATING DISORDER."0
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I went there when it made the news because owner of the site was bashing Kate Upton.
Then the owner of the site went on and on about how she was sorry and everyone should accept their bodies, blah blah.
It's like seriously, the only reason why you did that is because you made the news and you got attacked by everyone under the sun. Had that not happened, she would have still been calling everyone fatties and acting like the site isn't one for anorexics when it really is.
I think the whole the site is stupid, and should be shut down.. but that's just my opinion.0 -
I'm not sure what posts you have read on the site, but I just read the one on avoiding food and pretending you are sick on Thanksgiving. I'm no doctor/nutritionist, but pretty sure that's not healthy advice to give anyone and it seems a bit disordered.
I agree that it sounds a bit unhealthy, but I don't think that's the kind of advice which would give someone an ED who didn't have one. Also, if you job is to look like that, then you can't afford to have cheat days/meals because you can't afford to be carrying water weight for the following week. I can imagine advice on how to avoid thanksgiving overindulgence being useful to those people!0 -
And yes, at times I'm surprised by the weights people give as their goal weights -- they look quite high -- but its their health not mine.
I just want to address this with something you may not have thought of...
having been as heavy as 300 pounds, and having constantly struggled since my early 20s to get or stay under 200 pounds, I have a goal weight (for now) of 165. This still falls above "normal" on the BMI scale, and many people would still see that as overweight, especially those who have spent their entire life at a "healthy" weight. But for me??? If I can reach and maintain 165? I will be THRILLED. For me to combat genetics and close to 40 years of bad habits and get down to that weight would be a monumental accomplishment, and I am not going to feel the least bit unhealthy if I don't have it in me to go any lower.
I second this, and wanted to add that for people with a lot of weight to lose (myself included), setting smaller, short-term goals is a lot more attainable and encouraging. For me, setting my first goal at a 15% loss is where I want to start. I will reset my goal once I get there.
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I'm not sure what posts you have read on the site, but I just read the one on avoiding food and pretending you are sick on Thanksgiving. I'm no doctor/nutritionist, but pretty sure that's not healthy advice to give anyone and it seems a bit disordered.
[/quote]
RIGHT?!?0 -
I've read that site before. As far as I remember they don't promote anything more extreme than intermittent fasting, and they're just a support group for people who like a particular aesthetic... I think they're pretty down on actual eating disorders.
Lots of their members are models who'd lose their jobs if they gained any weight, so it's good for them to have a place where they can talk about these things. I don't really approve of that kind of extreme in the average person, but then I don't approve of the bodybuilder look either. Your body, your choice.
It does suck that MFP have some people who can be quite negative about people aiming for certain low weight goals though.
I think you're being reasonable and not taking the site too seriously. You are right, they do not support eating disorders.0 -
The trend in the US and many other western cultures is to be overfed. Being overweight is just as much a symptom of disordered eating as being underweight. Fat pride is seems to be more dangerous than Vlada's thigh gap when you really consider it...
What is on that blog (differentiating between the blog and the forums, which I did not read) is hate, pure and simple. If the subject was not being fat, but being black or being gay, you'd pick that up pretty quick. It is NOT okay.
I've never heard it referred to as "fat pride" but there is a growing movement towards body acceptance. The fact that you think that is dangerous tells me that you have a very narrow and skewed definition of health, especially considering what passes for "fat" on that site.
Tell me, what does glorifying things like thigh gaps and hip bones do to encourage people to love their bodies and therefore keep them healthy? When your only motivation is to look a certain way (specifically, a certain way that the majority of people cannot obtain healthfully) considerations for one's health rarely play a part.
Praising Vlada's thigh gap as a goal to be aspired to is WAY more harmful than loving oneself (including one's fat) ever could be!!0 -
Some of the things other people saw on the site sound crazy, but I just popped over and saw a thread about working out and the girl was posting her workout diary - seemed like a healthy exercise plan, nothing extreme. There was another thread on how to be taller (I kind of chuckled at that), so it makes me think it's a site for models. It's sad, but seems to be true, that models really do have to have a certain look to be hired by some of the big agencies and companies (like VS) or, like someone else said, they'd lose their job.
I'm sure there are plenty of unhealthy things on there, as others mentioned, but I just wanted to throw it out there that not ALL of the articles/forum posts there are crazy, unhealthy or pro-ED.0 -
Been having a quick look for the last 30 minutes out of curiousity....not nice at all. The individual who runs the site and many of the individuals who use the forums clearly think the way to make yourself feel better is to put others down. Ridiculously so.0
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What is on that blog (differentiating between the blog and the forums, which I did not read) is hate, pure and simple. If the subject was not being fat, but being black or being gay, you'd pick that up pretty quick. It is NOT okay.
No. Being fat is a lifestyle choice. Being black and being gay aren't. That's why we're here. That's why this site exists.Praising Vlada's thigh gap as a goal to be aspired to is WAY more harmful than loving oneself (including one's fat) ever could be!!
74% of Americans are overweight. If everyone "loved themselves, including their fat", 74% of Americans would stay overweight and risk dying young. Hundreds of people die young from obesity for every one that does from anorexia. From a pure utilitarian point of view, if there's a button that made everyone in the USA 10% more critical of their appearance, I would press it, because it would result in fewer people dying young.
I appreciate that it was just a figure of speech, but I just want to point out how wrong that statement is.0 -
ETA: sorry, but purposely being under 100 pounds is simply not healthy unless you are under 4'10". Thought I'd mention that.
You are actually wrong about that.
Yep. According to the BMI chart, 100lbs is considered a healthy weight for people 5'2'' and under.
Sorry loves, must have looked at an incorrect chart
But my point still stands! 0 -
What is on that blog (differentiating between the blog and the forums, which I did not read) is hate, pure and simple. If the subject was not being fat, but being black or being gay, you'd pick that up pretty quick. It is NOT okay.
No. Being fat is a lifestyle choice. Being black and being gay aren't. That's why we're here. That's why this site exists.
Based on what? Your own prejudice?
Being fat is not a conscious lifestyle choice. We live in a society that sets us up for it. Most people find themselves at an unhealthy weight completely unawares just by living in this place. We're taught early to turn to unhealthy foods as a source of comfort. Our cultural foods are unhealthy to an extreme and set people up for overeating. The vast majority of people live sedentary lives, because our pursuits are sedentary, our transportation is sedentary, our jobs are sedentary. Being raised here and ending up thin without making a choice to NOT be is extremely rare. Start reading the threads where people talk about the sources of their weight problems. What you are saying now comes from a place of pure ignorance.
ETA: This is not about blaming society and absolving oneself of responsibility, it's about recognizing the role that society plays in our choices and learning to overcome them when they prove to be detrimental.74% of Americans are overweight. If everyone "loved themselves, including their fat", 74% of Americans would stay overweight and risk dying young. Hundreds of people die young from obesity for every one that does from anorexia. From a pure utilitarian point of view, if there's a button that made everyone in the USA 10% more critical of their appearance, I would press it, because it would result in fewer people dying young.
I appreciate that it was just a figure of speech, but I just want to point out how wrong that statement is.
Hating yourself is way worse for your health than being fat is.
Also, ironically, hating yourself is often a contributing factor to being overweight.
Do you think american's don't criticize themselves for being overweight? What do you think the mult-billion dollar diet industry is about?
It was not a figure of speech, and it's not wrong. The thing about facts are that they're true whether you believe them or not.0 -
Based on what? Your own prejudice?
Being fat is not a lifestyle choice. People usually don't choose to overeat, we live in a society that sets us up for it. Most people find themselves at an unhealthy weight completely unawares. Start reading the threads where people talk about the sources of their weight problems. What you are saying now comes from a place of pure ignorance.Hating yourself is way worse for your health than being fat is.
Also, ironically, hating yourself is often a contributing factor to being overweight.
Do you think american's don't criticize themselves for being overweight? What do you think the mult-billion dollar diet industry is about?
It was not a figure of speech, and it's not wrong. The thing about facts are that they're true whether you believe them or not.
Ok, since you're claiming it's a factual argument, I'm just going to point out that most overweight and the vast majority of obese people underestimate how fat they are, and leave this conversation at that, since otherwise we're heading into "somebody is wrong on the internet!!" territory.
http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/18/are-most-people-in-denial-about-their-weight/
Also, I never said people should hate themselves. I'm just saying that people shouldn't be pleased with being overweight.0 -
Some members are unwilling to take responsibility for themselves and are simply not open to other points of view. For example, there was the obese woman who sought sympathy after ordering three pizzas. I asked her what she expected to do with them? She was abusive.
I was invited to join a group and someone who probably has been fat for a very long time was repeating the usual "slow and steady is the only way" advice and I said that approach did not work for everyone (and it's been identified as a "myth" of weight loss.). That individual took umbrage. She said that as an always-thin person I couldn't understand. Yes, I do, that's why I'm not fat while everyone else in my family is.
So certain people are going to keep making the same mistakes no matter what you suggest.
I agree with this sentiment. I saw a thread once where a user basically starved themselves, and admitted it, yet were surprised when they started gaining weight again. People on here say all the time, through experiences of their own, that losing weight by severely restricting calories and exercising was not healthy. It worked for a while, but then for most people, it stops working.
It never ceases to amaze me the people that seek support and an "it will all be okay" attitude when they are doing poorly more often than not.
I applaud you for keeping your weight where it's healthy for you, especially if you are predisposed to be overweight! That comment I made earlier was not directed at you, by the way, it was something I saw on the skinny gossip blog about 100 pounds being a "good starting point" for anyone.0 -
Ok, since you're claiming it's a factual argument, I'm just going to point out that most overweight and the vast majority of obese people underestimate how fat they are, and leave this conversation at that, since otherwise we're heading into "somebody is wrong on the internet!!" territory.
http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/18/are-most-people-in-denial-about-their-weight/
Also, I never said people should hate themselves. I'm just saying that people shouldn't be pleased with being overweight.
I was under the impression that you think it's beneficial to hate yourself if you're "fat," because that's the ONLY thing that site promotes.
People underestimate how "fat" they are because being overweight is normal. Them being in denial proves my point about it not being a lifestyle choice, though.
I also edited my post since you quoted it.0 -
Being fat is not a conscious lifestyle choice. We live in a society that sets us up for it. Most people find themselves at an unhealthy weight completely unawares just by living in this place. We're taught early to turn to unhealthy foods as a source of comfort. Our cultural foods are unhealthy to an extreme and set people up for overeating. The vast majority of people live sedentary lives, because our pursuits are sedentary, our transportation is sedentary, our jobs are sedentary. Being raised here and ending up thin without making a choice to NOT be is extremely rare. Start reading the threads where people talk about the sources of their weight problems. What you are saying now comes from a place of pure ignorance.
ETA: This is not about blaming society and absolving oneself of responsibility, it's about recognizing the role that society plays in our choices and learning to overcome them when they prove to be detrimental.
Umm...yes, being fat IS a conscious lifestyle choice. Did you never have health class growing up? I remember having to take it every year and in each one they taught us what was right and wrong, what was healthy and not. The fact of the matter is you ARE blaming society and removing personal responsibility. Is it easier to be fat than skinny? HELL YES. But nothing worth having is easy.0 -
Based on what? Your own prejudice?
Being fat is not a lifestyle choice. People usually don't choose to overeat, we live in a society that sets us up for it. Most people find themselves at an unhealthy weight completely unawares. Start reading the threads where people talk about the sources of their weight problems. What you are saying now comes from a place of pure ignorance.Hating yourself is way worse for your health than being fat is.
Also, ironically, hating yourself is often a contributing factor to being overweight.
Do you think american's don't criticize themselves for being overweight? What do you think the mult-billion dollar diet industry is about?
It was not a figure of speech, and it's not wrong. The thing about facts are that they're true whether you believe them or not.
Ok, since you're claiming it's a factual argument, I'm just going to point out that most overweight and the vast majority of obese people underestimate how fat they are, and leave this conversation at that, since otherwise we're heading into "somebody is wrong on the internet!!" territory.
http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/18/are-most-people-in-denial-about-their-weight/
The same can be said for those who are underweight. I guarantee that many of those girls don't see how dangerously underweight they are. There is nothing better about being underweight than being overweight. I was revived after going into cardiac arrest due to my low weight and nutrition levels. Despite being 30lbs underweight, I still thought I was fat. Fat phobia is setting a lot of young girls up for a lifetime of body hatred.
Regardless of what the norm is in America, extreme dieting and eating disorders should not be dismissed as being harmless.
ETA: I'm not talking about those who are naturally thin and healthy. I'm talking about those with screen names like "getthinordietrying" who covet hipbones and pictures of emaciated women.0 -
Also, maybe I've only come across nicer people on MFP, but I've not once seen someone outright attack a user or cry ED for someone having an "underweight" goal. I've seen people say that it wasn't healthy, or basically state their opinion like it is their right to do on a public forum, but I have never seen anyone be outright mean or insulting to thinner people. Perhaps I've not come across them.0
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For those of you saying being fat is a lifestyle choice...is being grossly underweight and unable to gain a pound also a lifestyle choice? How about the 8 year olds that are 200 pounds? Did they choose that lifestyle? Perhaps one should think before typing 0
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Skinny gossip can be really really harsh and does have a lot of hate on it. But I do agree with the original post in the sense that a lot of people here on MFP cannot relate to a skinny person, and actually do judge and hate skinny people on here. I have had several people tell me I need to gain weight (I am not underweight) and criticize my goals saying they are too low (my goals are in the healthy range). I have also had people tell me I need to eat more (I eat what MFP recommends). Whereas if I were to criticize someone saying their goals are too high and they will still be a fat *kitten*, I would get crucified on here!0
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Off topic, but did anyone else notice that this is a thread from March 2012?? :huh:0
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Umm...yes, being fat IS a conscious lifestyle choice. Did you never have health class growing up? I remember having to take it every year and in each one they taught us what was right and wrong, what was healthy and not. The fact of the matter is you ARE blaming society and removing personal responsibility. Is it easier to be fat than skinny? HELL YES. But nothing worth having is easy.
You're confused about what a lifestyle choice is.
Things that are lifestyle choices:
-Playing golf.
-Going to college.
-Being a banker, or a salesman, or a scientist, etc.
-Going clubbing every weekend.
Things that are NOT lifestyle choices:
-Being overweight.
-Being depressed.
-Having an unhealthy self-image.
-Having an eating disorder.
There are lifestyle choices you can make to change your health for the better or worse, and very often overweight people have made lifestyle choices that lead to obesity (sedentary jobs/hobbies, food choices), but they did not necessarily choose to be overweight.
To ignore the impact that culture/society has on the choices people make is just inane. There's a big difference between acknowledging the way things are and changing them when they're harmful, and resigning oneself to the way things are without any attempt to make changes.0
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