What will make you fatter...?

Elizabeth_C34

Somebody got butthurt: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/552262-this-guy-just-love-to-start-things

grinch031

If body fat mass is regulated (which we know it is) and stays consistent over a long period of time, why does protein intake make a difference? Are you suggesting that dieters who have success doing low-carb only gain weight off the diet because they automatically reduce protein? If that is the case, what is special about protein? Why does this throw off the body's set point over the long term?

It's about calories, not protein as far as weight gain/loss is concerned and I don't believe in set points.

If you don't believe in set points, then there is no reason for us to discuss this any further with you, however I'll further discuss with you the interpretation of the results of this study.

delilah47

I guess if you eat 1000 calories, you eat 1000 calories. I don't think it matters.

Changed my mind:

But, if you were eating less than 20g of carbs a day, you would lose weight if you ate the 1000 additional calories of just fat. Been there, done that. Dr Adkins

I'm not sure you understood the original question, you'd be eating in a surplus. So even if you were consuming 20g of carbs a day, do you still think you'd lose weight consuming 1,000 cals over your maintenance requirement

Yes, it's the premise of Dr Adkins' diet. As long as you keep your carbs to less than 20g, you can eat thousands and thousands of calories of meat and fat and you will still lose weight. I did it years ago and lost 30 pounds in about 6 weeks. Your body needs sugar (carbs) to metabolize protein and fat, so your body does not recognize the protein and fat as useable nutrition and ignores it. Now, if you eat more than 20 grams of carbs a day, you would be in big trouble. You would gain weight very rapidly. You must, diligently, account for every single carb that you consume.

First, it is DR ATKINS, not Adkins.

Secondly, who told you that your body ignores the protein and fat as usable nutrition? It gets digested the same as carbs when it hits the stomach.

Also, I have successfully lost weight on The Atkins nutritonal approach going through all 4 phases and add in the foods according to the carb ladder and I continued losing weight and then went on to maintenance.

The only people that gain weight back rapidly are those that do the induction (20 grams of carbs) for a time period and then REVERT back to their old eating habits. That holds to be true with any eating plan when you return to your old habits.

I agree with you on some points.. like I don't know why I would spell Adkins when I know it's Atkins (and I did it more than once), but other points, I totally disagree. Another I agree with is when people revert back to old eating habits they gain weight back. That's not news to most people here, because most people here, trying to lose weight, are not on their "first" (or even second) weight loss attempt. Why people gain back the weight they lost varies, some grossly overeat and some don't get exercise, and some it's a little of both. I detect a little "judgement poke" in your last sentence. For me; I would never have been in the up-down cycle if it weren't for a 5-foot fall off a ladder which all but broke my back and, at times, my emotional resolve to continue to eat healthy. I won't debate how Atkins works, but when your body is in ketosis, it uses its own fat for energy. Of course your body digests it, I didn't say othewise. I said the body doesn't use it like it would if you ate high carbs as well as high protein/fat. Your scientific quotes and "quizzes" are up for debate, no matter which side you are promoting.

Acg67

But did you not find it interesting that despite the greater CHO in the CHO overfeeding diet and therefore more insulin, there wasn't a significant amount more fat gained by the high CHO diet?

What I found interesting is that CHO led to more increased EE, but the net result was equivalent fat gain. Does this mean the CHO eater expended more energy but also gained the same amount of weight as the fat eater?

Here's another one that dealt with overfeeding

Lammert O, et al. Effects of isoenergetic overfeeding of either carbohydrate or fat in young men. British Journal of Nutrition, 2000; 84: 233-245.

http://cnr.berkeley.edu/hellerstein-lab/pdfs/grunnet.pdf

hannahbanana0480

The extra calories would make you fatter...no matter where they come from.

grinch031

But did you not find it interesting that despite the greater CHO in the CHO overfeeding diet and therefore more insulin, there wasn't a significant amount more fat gained by the high CHO diet?

What I found interesting is that CHO led to more increased EE, but the net result was equivalent fat gain. Does this mean the CHO eater expended more energy but also gained the same amount of weight as the fat eater?

Here's another one that dealt with overfeeding

Lammert O, et al. Effects of isoenergetic overfeeding of either carbohydrate or fat in young men. British Journal of Nutrition, 2000; 84: 233-245.

http://cnr.berkeley.edu/hellerstein-lab/pdfs/grunnet.pdf

But dude what am I missing on this? Why does it say there was more storage from overefeeding of fat, but at the same time they say the weight gain was the same among both?

Brandongood

Somebody got butthurt: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/552262-this-guy-just-love-to-start-things

they should start a haters group

Radcliffe83

I think the carbs will make you fatter. I think this because your body works harder to burn fat and not as hard to burn protein. Harder than both to burn protein...

joejccva71

It depends on who you are; how active you are; how much metabolic damage is in your body; your genetics and your parents genetics; the quality of the food you eating.

the question cannot be answered because there really is no correct answer. It depends entirely on the individual.

It doesn't matter how active you are.

It doesn't matter how much "metabolic damage" is in your body.

And it CERTAINLY doesn't matter about the quality of food you are eating. (OMG)

Carbs RARELY get transformed into fat. (De Novo Lipogenesis)

stephenatl09

1000 calories is 1000 calories..eat 1000 caloies over what you should have (what you use) for 7 days 1000x7=7000/3500=2 you will gain 2 lbs of fat....period.

Acg67

But did you not find it interesting that despite the greater CHO in the CHO overfeeding diet and therefore more insulin, there wasn't a significant amount more fat gained by the high CHO diet?

What I found interesting is that CHO led to more increased EE, but the net result was equivalent fat gain. Does this mean the CHO eater expended more energy but also gained the same amount of weight as the fat eater?

Here's another one that dealt with overfeeding

Lammert O, et al. Effects of isoenergetic overfeeding of either carbohydrate or fat in young men. British Journal of Nutrition, 2000; 84: 233-245.

http://cnr.berkeley.edu/hellerstein-lab/pdfs/grunnet.pdf

But dude what am I missing on this? Why does it say there was more storage from overefeeding of fat, but at the same time they say the weight gain was the same among both?

What are you trying to say that increased EE due to CHO overfeeding + similar fat gains means?

grinch031

But did you not find it interesting that despite the greater CHO in the CHO overfeeding diet and therefore more insulin, there wasn't a significant amount more fat gained by the high CHO diet?

What I found interesting is that CHO led to more increased EE, but the net result was equivalent fat gain. Does this mean the CHO eater expended more energy but also gained the same amount of weight as the fat eater?

Here's another one that dealt with overfeeding

Lammert O, et al. Effects of isoenergetic overfeeding of either carbohydrate or fat in young men. British Journal of Nutrition, 2000; 84: 233-245.

http://cnr.berkeley.edu/hellerstein-lab/pdfs/grunnet.pdf

But dude what am I missing on this? Why does it say there was more storage from overefeeding of fat, but at the same time they say the weight gain was the same among both?

What are you trying to say that increased EE due to CHO overfeeding + similar fat gains means?

I'm asking why they are saying there was more fat storage from fat overfeeding and more EE from CHO overfeeding, if the end result of both diets was the same as far as weight gain?

myak623

1000 cal excess = 1000 cal excess .......bottom line

No need to explain any further than this!

Brandongood

1000 cal excess = 1000 cal excess .......bottom line

No need to explain any further than this!

^^ This. This thread is giving me a headache.

Acg67

But did you not find it interesting that despite the greater CHO in the CHO overfeeding diet and therefore more insulin, there wasn't a significant amount more fat gained by the high CHO diet?

What I found interesting is that CHO led to more increased EE, but the net result was equivalent fat gain. Does this mean the CHO eater expended more energy but also gained the same amount of weight as the fat eater?

Here's another one that dealt with overfeeding

Lammert O, et al. Effects of isoenergetic overfeeding of either carbohydrate or fat in young men. British Journal of Nutrition, 2000; 84: 233-245.

http://cnr.berkeley.edu/hellerstein-lab/pdfs/grunnet.pdf

But dude what am I missing on this? Why does it say there was more storage from overefeeding of fat, but at the same time they say the weight gain was the same among both?

What are you trying to say that increased EE due to CHO overfeeding + similar fat gains means?

I'm asking why they are saying there was more fat storage from fat overfeeding and more EE from CHO overfeeding, if the end result of both diets was the same as far as weight gain?

Carbohydrate overfeeding produced a very different picture. Progressive increases in both carbohydrate oxidation and total energy expenditure were seen with carbohydrate overfeeding. Both were evident on the first day of overfeeding and reached maximum by day 7. The increased energy expenditure seen with carbohydrate overfeeding was approximately double that which could be explained by the combination of increased TEF and increased body mass. Thus with carbohydrate overfeeding, more of the excess energy was oxidized and less stored in the body than was seen during fat overfeeding.

delilah47

1000 cal excess = 1000 cal excess .......bottom line

No need to explain any further than this!

^^ This. This thread is giving me a headache.

Me too. Mostly because I had to look up CHO, EE, TED. Why can't people just speak English unless they are trying to baffle ya with BS?

neanderthin

Carbohydrate overfeeding produced a very different picture. Progressive increases in both carbohydrate oxidation and total energy expenditure were seen with carbohydrate overfeeding. Both were evident on the first day of overfeeding and reached maximum by day 7. The increased energy expenditure seen with carbohydrate overfeeding was approximately double that which could be explained by the combination of increased TEF and increased body mass. Thus with carbohydrate overfeeding, more of the excess energy was oxidized and less stored in the body than was seen during fat overfeeding.

[/quote] Makes sense. Some of those excess carbs will always be used as immediate fuel where fat is always stored, then liberated in the abcense of sufficient caloric needs and when overfeeding is present, it's not happening sufficiently.

grinch031

Carbohydrate overfeeding produced a very different picture. Progressive increases in both carbohydrate oxidation and total energy expenditure were seen with carbohydrate overfeeding. Both were evident on the first day of overfeeding and reached maximum by day 7. The increased energy expenditure seen with carbohydrate overfeeding was approximately double that which could be explained by the combination of increased TEF and increased body mass. Thus with carbohydrate overfeeding, more of the excess energy was oxidized and less stored in the body than was seen during fat overfeeding.

Makes sense. Some of those excess carbs will always be used as immediate fuel where fat is always stored, then liberated in the abcense of sufficient caloric needs and when overfeeding is present, it's not happening sufficiently.

I'm still not getting it. Figure 1 and Figure 2 seem to contradict each other when looking at those and Table 2.

GoldspursX3

Just take a carb blocker and you can have all the pasta you want!

neanderthin

If you don't believe in set points, then there is no reason for us to discuss this any further with you.

I just don't believed is some kind of mystical being that controls my body weight and where dedicated exercise and dieting protocal doesn't exist. i remember the days when I believed I couldn't change how I look or felt, but thankfully those days are in the past.