Vegetarians and vegans. Controversial Topic
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i didn't say anything about environmentalism. i agree that those with more environmental consciousness do tend to be liberal, but as veg*nism is generally more about ethics than the environment, environmental consciousness doesn't always translate to veg*nism.
well thats ur opinion.. where i think that the more environmentally conscious people are they are more inclined to be vegetarian, liberal, or both.no. it doesn't. it doesn't prove anything. it suggests that conservatives eat heavier food, both veg*n and non. it also suggests that liberals eat lighter or healthier foods, both veg*n and non.
for your earlier survey, i am a member of the green party and i am a vegetarian. i had a friend at work who was a republican and vegetarian. my uncle is more moderate and was a vegetarian for years. political party has nothing to do with whether or not you eat meat.
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u dont think ethics and the environment have any correlation? i bet veganism translates to environmental consciousness0 -
They're both types of social conscience. It's not any stretch to believe that someone who would be attracted to environmentalism would also be attracted to vegetarianism, even if they're not vegetarians for environmental reasons.
u dont think ethics and the environment have any correlation? i bet veganism translates to environmental consciousness
i didn't say anything about environmentalism. i agree that those with more environmental consciousness do tend to be liberal, but as veg*nism is generally more about ethics than the environment, environmental consciousness doesn't always translate to veg*nism.
well thats ur opinion.. where i think that the more environmentally conscious people are they are more inclined to be vegetarian, liberal, or both.no. it doesn't. it doesn't prove anything. it suggests that conservatives eat heavier food, both veg*n and non. it also suggests that liberals eat lighter or healthier foods, both veg*n and non.
for your earlier survey, i am a member of the green party and i am a vegetarian. i had a friend at work who was a republican and vegetarian. my uncle is more moderate and was a vegetarian for years. political party has nothing to do with whether or not you eat meat.0 -
my husband is a vegetarian and has been for 25 years, he doesn't eat any meat or fish but still eats dairy, he is well within his healthy weight range, but is really unfit. he genuinely doesn't like the texture or taste of meat and also doesn't want anything to die so he can eat, he has never tried to guilt trip or press his diet onto me or our kids, over the years i have altered many of our recipes so he can eat exactly the same as the rest of the family when it isn't a vegetarian meal.
he has no problem cooking meat for the rest of us and weirdly cooks THE best steak in the world0 -
I'm a vegetarianm, I concur with the many others' who have said she was just damn rude. Good for you on being so fit!
As for understanding - I don't eat meat because I think its gross dead flesh...my husband eats meat, I cook it for him. I only insist that he brush his teeth before kissing me.
PS I'm a conservative - who doesn't have an environmental perspective on this.0 -
People like her is why I don't tell people I man a vegitarian. Don't ask don't tell
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Honestly, I've seen it both ways. I've seen vegans (in particular a friend of mine) be obese. And I've seen them be fit (a friends sister.) same goes for meat eaters, I've seen some that are obese and others (like my trainer) who eat outrageous amounts of meet a day. In my opinion that has no baring on if someone's fit or not. Not in the least. You know what does tell all though? Calories in vs. calories out lol no matter if the come from a steak or tofu. You can find terrible foods that are made with meat and made without. You can find heathy foods that are the same way. A grilled chicken breast in very healthy. As is a eggplant dish. A hamburger can be made very unhealthy, but so can a veggie burger. Lol.0
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I'm a vegetarian and that lady was really rude, no matter what her diet was. My husband is omni and I hang out with people while they are eating meat and while I might tease them if I know them really well (like my husband), I don't talk about being veg unless asked. It's my choice. Health-wise, IMO meat is fine in moderation. I do it because I've never really liked anything but poultry -and once I started raising chickens they became like pets to me. Eating chicken would be like eating my cat :P. I have other reasons as well, but that's for another day. I am healthy and fit, but I'd never say an omnivore could not be the same!
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I'm vegan, I would never impose my beliefs on meat eating upon others the way this woman did to you, I live by the rule 'if you're not willing to kill it yourself then you shouldn't eat it'. Be a conscious eater and be aware that the meat you're eating didn't come from an animal that lived like an animal. 'Meet your meat'.0
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I became a vegetarian recently because of the way that animals are treated to get the meat to your plate. It's truely disgusting that we have become a world where demands for meat = allowing animal cruelty. People get arrested, banned from keeping PETS ( dogs, cats, rabbits etc.) if they do not treat them right, what makes the 'farming' industry any different? Especially at food chains and supermarkets where this type of cruelty is more apparent. If I buy meat for my partner it's from a local farmer, where I can see for myself how the animals are treated.
I agree about the woman though, she was rude. People can make their own adult choices of what food to eat given they have the information, they can make what they want of it at the end of the day.0 -
I'm a vegetarian, but it's my choice and would never force it on anyone. I don't believe it's healthier to be veg. Eat what you want.0
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I am vegetarian. I don't bother people about what they eat. What happens to me is the other way around. Some people who do eat meat get on me about not eating it. What does it matter? I never really liked meat so I just don't include it now. I do it for my health, animals and the planet. My choice not yours. Consume what you want.
She was rude in my opinion.0 -
Today, after I left the gym I stopped at Jimmy Johns to get a snack. I ordered a #1 which is Applewood Smoked Ham and provolone cheese garnished with lettuce, tomato, and mayo. I sat down minding my own business enjoying my snack.
DAMNNNN! If that's a "snack" --what's a meal? Eating like a boss. **love it** haha0 -
i have seen some videos and i wasnt pleased by how their treated. so in ur opinion since you think we are animals do you think it is natural to eat eachother than that is was animals do. or is it the fact that you hold humans more accountable then animals to make a choice not to eat meat.just curious what you think
Uh. Animals are humanely killed, they are not "tortured to death". I have been to slaughterhouses and have seen it firsthand.if you dont mind my input id like to say. that yes overall in America vegetarians may be healthier than most, but thats because a lot of Americans are over weight like me and made a choice not to combine the right meat and fruit?vegetables to make them healthy. you can be healthy and eat meat like yourself. i get that most vegetarians/vegans want to save animals. i was vegetarian for a few months, but i like meat. the real problem is the way they are killed. GOD put the animals on earth to eat. if we could just treat the animals better and not torture them to death then there would probably be less vegetarians. just saying!
P.Speople dont realize that you shouldnt it to much meat. skip out like twice a week on meat. Dr oz says you shouldnt eat animal with for legs more then 3-5 days a week.
I take exception, too, to your claim that animals were put here by God for us to eat.
We are animals. We love to imagine that we're special, but I think that's bull****. We are no different and have evolved in the same way as anything else.
If you really believe what happens to these animals before & during their death isn't considered torture I encouraged you to watch some of the undercover slaughterhouse videos, egg hatchery videos, dairy cow videos... That is cruel, inhumane disgusting torture, I couldn't care less if others eat meat but you cannot honestly think what happens to these poor creatures is 'okay'.0 -
If I dropped friends because they didn't share my political views, I'd lose probably 75% of my friends. I don't share my political views with many of them, because I've had other friends like them drop me for the same reason. That's one of the differences between people on this side of the aisle and that side. They *think* they're more tolerant, but are actually less so.
So glad to have you as a friend
I hope not. If so, I might have to rethink my diet.Quick Poll: any republican vegetarians/vegans out there?
Nope. Don't care what my friends are either. I love having something in common with friends, so that's why I stated that. I've got plenty of other friends who I have much in common just not veganism, religion, or politics and we still get along great.
I think you just took my comment wrong but with internet that's just a common problem.0 -
If I dropped friends because they didn't share my political views, I'd lose probably 75% of my friends. I don't share my political views with many of them, because I've had other friends like them drop me for the same reason. That's one of the differences between people on this side of the aisle and that side. They *think* they're more tolerant, but are actually less so.
So glad to have you as a friend
I hope not. If so, I might have to rethink my diet.Quick Poll: any republican vegetarians/vegans out there?
Nope. Don't care what my friends are either. I love having something in common with friends, so that's why I stated that. I've got plenty of other friends who I have much in common just not veganism, religion, or politics and we still get along great.
I think you just took my comment wrong but with internet that's just a common problem.
I'm a conservative vegatarian. I registered republican because I didn't want Romney....and I haven't lost any friends over my political beliefs because I'm willing to have discussions over them as long as neither side resort to anger or name calling.0 -
i do think it's funny that veg*ns get all kind of crap for being uppity at omnivores, because i am a vegan and i have NEVER just come out of nowhere and started ragging on someone for what they're eating, but it happens to me coming from meat-eaters ALL. THE. TIME.
makes it a little hard for me to understand this reputation that veg folks supposedly have, because i have only observed it in reverse.
Actually, it makes sense. The meat-eaters who confront vegetarians about their food choices, are also likely to complain about them to others.
Every group will have some members who behave badly. It's impossible not to. The mistake is generalizing to the whole group, assuming all or most members are like the one you encountered. Also people who hold their opinions dear are more likely to pay attention to and generalize from the people whose behavior supports their view and not notice, or consider as a rare exception, the ones who contradict it.0 -
I admit I didn't read all seven pages of this thread, but I just wanted to chime in briefly. I have been vegan for 11 years for many reasons. Like the lady above, I at first fell in love with a pet and then extended that sympathy to all animals. But I now remain vegan for more reasons than that: environmental and health. The benefits just seem to keep on coming. I think it's unfortunate that that individual approached you in that way. I hate hearing things like that because I think that that person reflects badly on all veg/vegans and I'm sorry that one of your first encounters with a vegan diet had to be a negative one.0
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I'm a contended omnivore and it would never occur to me to stick my nose into what someone else chooses to eat at a restaurant, it sounds like you handled this far more politely than I would have.0
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I'm a contended omnivore and it would never occur to me to stick my nose into what someone else chooses to eat at a restaurant, it sounds like you handled this far more politely than I would have.
I bet you go in to vegetarian restaurants and tell herbivoires how disgusting and unhealthy tofu is. :laugh:0 -
Here's one Vegetarian Republican, for 30 years. It's everyone's personal choice, and not a big deal in our family. My husband sometimes eats chicken and seafood, and our 2 college kids are vegetarian.0
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I would have had a fistful of teeth. There are some things you just don't do unless you want a severe beating and that's one of them. Another one would be vandalizing someone's car or house.0
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you should have slapped her in the face with your salami :O0
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Violet, it is difficult to tell if this is a question to me based on how the post is quoted, but I will assume it is:i have seen some videos and i wasnt pleased by how their treated. so in ur opinion since you think we are animals do you think it is natural to eat eachother than that is was animals do. or is it the fact that you hold humans more accountable then animals to make a choice not to eat meat.just curious what you think
Uh. Animals are humanely killed, they are not "tortured to death". I have been to slaughterhouses and have seen it firsthand.if you dont mind my input id like to say. that yes overall in America vegetarians may be healthier than most, but thats because a lot of Americans are over weight like me and made a choice not to combine the right meat and fruit?vegetables to make them healthy. you can be healthy and eat meat like yourself. i get that most vegetarians/vegans want to save animals. i was vegetarian for a few months, but i like meat. the real problem is the way they are killed. GOD put the animals on earth to eat. if we could just treat the animals better and not torture them to death then there would probably be less vegetarians. just saying!
P.Speople dont realize that you shouldnt it to much meat. skip out like twice a week on meat. Dr oz says you shouldnt eat animal with for legs more then 3-5 days a week.
I take exception, too, to your claim that animals were put here by God for us to eat.
We are animals. We love to imagine that we're special, but I think that's bull****. We are no different and have evolved in the same way as anything else.
If you really believe what happens to these animals before & during their death isn't considered torture I encouraged you to watch some of the undercover slaughterhouse videos, egg hatchery videos, dairy cow videos... That is cruel, inhumane disgusting torture, I couldn't care less if others eat meat but you cannot honestly think what happens to these poor creatures is 'okay'.
like I said, I have been to slaughterhouses many times, and my undergrad degree is in animal agricultural science. I made it a point to become very well informed about how food animals are raised and slaughtered.i have seen some videos and i wasnt pleased by how their treated. so in ur opinion since you think we are animals do you think it is natural to eat eachother than that is was animals do. or is it the fact that you hold humans more accountable then animals to make a choice not to eat meat.just curious what you think
Let me start out by saying that I fully respect someone's decision to become vegan or vegetarian. There are a lot of reasons to do so, and all of them valid. Killing an animal for your own survival is a heady and emotional thing at least. That is an individual's decision. I have a lot of vegetarians in my own family and have spent years as one myself on and off.
As to your question, yes, I certainly think that's the way we evolved. Animals eat animals, and we are animals. There is a lot of debate surrounding whether humans need meat or if it is natural for us to do so. I am not a nutritionist, so am not qualified to get into that. My own opinion is that we are omnivores who probably eat a lot more meat than we need.
As humans who raise animals for food, I feel it is an EXTREMELY important responsibility to do right by these animals. Anyone who mistreats animals as in those videos should be prosecuted, and the fact that people can get away with it sickens me.
Those videos exist because those things happen. I appreciate those whistleblowers who distribute them. That kind of thing should absolutely never happen. What is construed as mistreatment by some is debatable IMO. It's considered cruel to keep cattle in feedlots my many, and I certainly do not agree with that, having raised cattle in that manner myself. The simple fact is that if stressed out and unhappy, they will not produce as efficiently, and that hurts the bottom line. Keeping cattle happy is absolutely in the best interest of the cattle AND the producer. Anyone who does not should not be in the business, and probably won't be for long.
The problem I have is that people tend to think that is the norm rather than the rare exception since that is what they seen in those videos and what PeTA reports. (kind of like how they only show the crashes in NASCAR races). This is not the case. As I mentioned more than once, I have been there physically and have witnessed how things are NORMALLY done firsthand. I have a pretty thorough understanding of the processes of raising, shipping and slaughtering animals for food.
And like I said before, a lot of people have a fundamental problem with that, and that I respect. It is a very personal choice.
I eat very little meat myself. It is not so much because of the way animals are processed, it is the fact that I just don't like it very much, don't feel I need very much, and the fact that over-consumption of meat has a serious environmental impact that I don't think is right.0 -
No matter what it is in life there will always be people who feel so passionate about something they take it into fanatic territory. Thus giving everyone else of the same lifestyle or whatever a bad name. It happenes in everything from religion,to eating habits to sports. These people get the most attention so thats what we remeber,the crazy vegan,or the fanatical relgious person,ect ect.0
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Uh. Animals are humanely killed, they are not "tortured to death". I have been to slaughterhouses and have seen it firsthand.
Firstly I am a vegetarian of 25 years. I am not particularly fit and healthy, but I'm trying and I don't force my views on vegetarianism. It's my choice. My Husband and Children eat meat and they hunt. My first paid job was in a butchers. But I do have to raise an objection to the above comment. Not all animals are humanely killed. Certainly not in the UK. There are some slaughterhouses which slit the throats of scared animals (they are not stunned) and leave the animals to bleed to death. It is not painless and highly distressing. Unless you buy from a butcher who can trace his meat there is no way of knowing how the animal was killed and meats served in schools and hospitals more often than not come from the less humane slaughterhouses.0 -
What you consider cruel, I do not. Caging chickens is not generally done with meat birds, they are raised in floor pens. Egg laying chickens are the ones often in battery cages. That, I can agree with to a degree, is not humane. I therefore purchase free range eggs, these are pricier, but are produced by hens that are housed in floor pens.
Reply: Uh, no I disagree. I am a food scientist & clinical nutritionist currently working on my masters degree in food science & industry. That being said, a lot of meats that consumers buy are from "the industry" not the farm (where, as I'm sure you're aware, things are done differently and often more humanely). The horror stories I could tell you. I honestly couldn't sleep at night after taking my meat production class. Yes, you do have some companies out there that have moral and ethical values that they enforce while raising & slaughtering their livestock. Then you have the not so nice companies who DO "torture" their animals. Being fed hormones, steroids and by-product of my fellow livestock friends is not what I would call humane. Not to mention living in my own feces, being crammed in a tiny cage that I can't even turn around in, having my legs and/or wings broke, being electrocuted... and I'll stop there. I would call that torture. I am all for buying my produce, dairy & meat (for my husband, since I am a veg because meat grosses me out) from the local farmers.
Cattle are not fed steroids, ever. They received a steroid hormone ear implant. Dairy cattle often receive an injection of BST growth hormone periodically. Chickens are not treated with any hormones, ever. Neither are pigs. Most of these animals are often fed some medicated feeds that contain antibiotics and/or ionophores at some point in their life, for either disease prevention or improved feed efficiency, or a little of both. I disagree that it's "torture" to keep animals in pens that contain packs of manure. It's difficult to separate ourselves from that since feces is so vile to us. I think it's very important to understand the reality of these things before getting on a soapbox about it.
And as I said before, I respect the choices of people who choose not to eat meat.0 -
Man, I hate preachy vegetarians and vegans! I've been vegetarians for 8 years now and I've never judged someone for eating meat. Just because I personally don't agree with it doesn't mean its right to shove my views and opinions down someone elses throat.
My partner is a meat eater and I've never asked him to stop eating meat for me. I won't cook it for him though, mostly because I don't know how to cook meat properly, wouldn't want to poison him!!
As for vegetarians being more fit and healthy than meat eaters, she hasn't met me! I'm neither of those things.0 -
That is how animals are killed for kosher meats. They do that in the US as well. A very small percentage of meats, which are far more pricey than "regular" meat. I respect your opinion of kosher slaughter and share it to a degree.
Uh. Animals are humanely killed, they are not "tortured to death". I have been to slaughterhouses and have seen it firsthand.
Firstly I am a vegetarian of 25 years. I am not particularly fit and healthy, but I'm trying and I don't force my views on vegetarianism. It's my choice. My Husband and Children eat meat and they hunt. My first paid job was in a butchers. But I do have to raise an objection to the above comment. Not all animals are humanely killed. Certainly not in the UK. There are some slaughterhouses which slit the throats of scared animals (they are not stunned) and leave the animals to bleed to death. It is not painless and highly distressing. Unless you buy from a butcher who can trace his meat there is no way of knowing how the animal was killed and meats served in schools and hospitals more often than not come from the less humane slaughterhouses.0 -
I am a vegetarian but I eat 1 gram of protein per lb of body weight, recently ran a half marathon, lift weights and am certainly not puny. But I also don't have a problem with people who choose to get their protein from meat.0
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What was she doing at Jimmy Johns in the first place? Sounds fishy to me. My gut tells me this is a bull**** story.0
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