Survey time: Should a guy pay on a first date?

heyitsmegxx

Yes, he should.

Rae6503

Everyone should calm down a bit about what men and women "should" and "shouldn't" do. We are individuals. We can all do different things. If I want to be equal on every thing with my partner then chances are I can find a partner who feels the same. If I want my partner to pay for everything and kill bugs, yup, I bet I could find one of those too. Lets not get our panties in a twist over what someone we'd never date anyway prefers.

crisanderson27

Everyone should calm down a bit about what men and women "should" and "shouldn't" do. We are individuals. We can all do different things. If I want to be equal on every thing with my partner then chances are I can find a partner who feels the same. If I want my partner to pay for everything and kill bugs, yup, I bet I could find one of those too. Lets not get our panties in a twist over what someone we'd never date anyway prefers.

*calmly untwists his panties while turning his nose up at the other side*

You're right.../sigh!

HMonsterX

It's just an amusing double standard. Women want equal rights in everything, yet want the man to "be a man" and pay?! Sexist!

Equality should apply to all things, not just certain things.

I've seen women who when a man hold a door open for them, they say "I can do it myself thank you!".

Chivalry is dead...and who killed it?




Women.

*ducks from all the flames*

sunnyday789

@chrisanderson

"I wasn't judging you hun, I was judging the rationality of your argument, and its bearing on the validity of any future discussion. so, here's my logic"

You said/implied
Majority of people think men should pay
Therefore, because of this I am right to insist to pay.

I replied:
A societal norm does not necessarily mean it's the right way do do things.
I used women's right to vote as an example.

This is not irrational so not sure where you think the logic is flawed. It is permissible in logic to use examples to argue for a point. To call me irrational after that was ironically irrational of you.

However, your response to my stance that they are comparable, left me scratching my head.
I use a type of gun to hunt (I assume animals)
The Navy used a different gun to kill people in world war 2.
Not sure how that is rational or what point you trying to make.

'Let' is a perfect example of this. I wouldn't 'let' (assuming normal circumstances) you pay on our first date, any more than I'd 'let' you walk in front of a moving bus."
Not sure what you mean by this. Would paying for dinner be the same as risking my life?

Red flags go up when person states absolutes like " I would never" in regards to perfectly normal thing like treating someone to dinner. Yes, woman can show appreciation a different way, but why would you restrict it?

Yes, I did recall that your circumstances had changed but that you stated you had a really hard time accepting this, that you didn't like it. Kinda proves my point that with your insistence on being the provider, it will create a difficult situation. If your masculinity is determined by you being the provider, you may have struggles with your self esteem which almost always has a detrimental effect on relationships.


edit to add, ha ha you called me hun:laugh:

foodfight247

If the situation was different. Lets say you made dinner for your guy thinking it would be a sweet gesture but instead he responded to it like "No thanks but I can make my own food" How would you feel?

Hmmm - not sure what to think here, as this happens quite a fair bit in my house.... in fairness, cos he's worked real late. So rather than cook something I know he aint gonna eat, I just cook for me and my little one and let him sort himself out. Which I would like to point out, he would much rather he do. Which is fine by me. That doesn't mean he's being rude or disrespectful to me....its just him being independent. Great....BUT...yes, it would be nice to sit down all of us just a bit more often to a family meal. I probably do more for him than he does for me, but at the moment, I'm fine with that. I'd love it if things were a little different - can't deny that. Every relationship is different I guess and every male and femaile will view things differently depending on circumstance. .

AS for the question at hand - I personally would offer to pay but I certainly would not be offended if the guy was insistent on paying on a first date.....but then I'm so used to my partner paying for everything. But I still like to offer.

I could droan on for hours and go completely off topic.....but I won't. lol!

retunks

I'm old school. The man always pays, period.

shannoninBC

No clue. I haven't been on a date in 17 years.

sunnyday789

It's just an amusing double standard. Women want equal rights in everything, yet want the man to "be a man" and pay?! Sexist!

Equality should apply to all things, not just certain things.

I've seen women who when a man hold a door open for them, they say "I can do it myself thank you!".

Chivalry is dead...and who killed it?




Women.

*ducks from all the flames*

Sometimes, when appropriate (e.g. someone coming not far behind me, men carrying stuff, etc) I hold doors for men.
Maybe we can reincarnate chivalry and define it as people doing nice things for other people?

MrEmoticon

Most guys that I know don't mind this actually. Now if you embarrass them in public, then its different. I've known guys who just honestly don't know any better. Or sometimes the last girl they dated was an "ultra feminist independent type" so it left a bad taste in their mouth and now they think girls hate when they do nice things.

If a guy treats you in a way that you don't like, even if its something small like he didn't hold the door for you, you should let him know. If he actually gives a damn about you, he'll correct the behavior.

So, if I don't hold the door open for a girl, or worship her every breath, I need to correct my behavior?

the last girl I was with stayed at home, didn't work. I paid for everything. She was a dirty *kitten*. But hey, she was traditional!

So that left a bad taste in my mouth, not women who make me think, "I think she'll be alive next time I come around, since she's an adult and all." Because you know, nothing like having a big, spoiled kid to take care of before you even date! And that's exactly how you seem like you would be.

Then it's your fault for putting up with it. It works both ways, you should have let her know you didn't like it and either gave her a chance to correct her behavior or walk away. No need to take your sour relationship out on me.

Wait, so it's my fault for paying for everything and not making her work and pay for stuff? Doesn't that go against everything you just said?

You said she did nothing, was a spoiled kid, and a dirty *kitten*. I'm saying its your fault for allowing her to treat you so badly and take advantage of you. You shouldn't have to make her do anything but you should also know and respect your own worth and be able to move on when you realize that you deserve better. Its fine if you wanted to take care of her financially but she should take care of you in other ways whether its just being supportive emotionally, taking care of the house, or being there when you need her.

Now if she's going behind your back being a *kitten*, being selfish, and overall just using you, then you should never stay with a person like that at all. There needs to be some kind of balance.

She did nothing as far as going to work. She cleaned, I cooked because I'm a better cook. I say she's a *kitten* because she cheated on me. I say she was a spoiled kid because like you, she believed the man was the provider, and as long as she cleaned at home, she was entitled to everything.

indiedoll

Proper etiquette dictates that whoever asks the other person on a date pays.

victoria4321

Most guys that I know don't mind this actually. Now if you embarrass them in public, then its different. I've known guys who just honestly don't know any better. Or sometimes the last girl they dated was an "ultra feminist independent type" so it left a bad taste in their mouth and now they think girls hate when they do nice things.

If a guy treats you in a way that you don't like, even if its something small like he didn't hold the door for you, you should let him know. If he actually gives a damn about you, he'll correct the behavior.

So, if I don't hold the door open for a girl, or worship her every breath, I need to correct my behavior?

the last girl I was with stayed at home, didn't work. I paid for everything. She was a dirty *kitten*. But hey, she was traditional!

So that left a bad taste in my mouth, not women who make me think, "I think she'll be alive next time I come around, since she's an adult and all." Because you know, nothing like having a big, spoiled kid to take care of before you even date! And that's exactly how you seem like you would be.

Then it's your fault for putting up with it. It works both ways, you should have let her know you didn't like it and either gave her a chance to correct her behavior or walk away. No need to take your sour relationship out on me.

Wait, so it's my fault for paying for everything and not making her work and pay for stuff? Doesn't that go against everything you just said?

You said she did nothing, was a spoiled kid, and a dirty *kitten*. I'm saying its your fault for allowing her to treat you so badly and take advantage of you. You shouldn't have to make her do anything but you should also know and respect your own worth and be able to move on when you realize that you deserve better. Its fine if you wanted to take care of her financially but she should take care of you in other ways whether its just being supportive emotionally, taking care of the house, or being there when you need her.

Now if she's going behind your back being a *kitten*, being selfish, and overall just using you, then you should never stay with a person like that at all. There needs to be some kind of balance.

She did nothing as far as going to work. She cleaned, I cooked because I'm a better cook. I say she's a *kitten* because she cheated on me. I say she was a spoiled kid because like you, she believed the man was the provider, and as long as she cleaned at home, she was entitled to everything.

I said a man should plan and pay for the first date, not cater to his womens every whim. I provide for myself quite well, better than many women, and maybe men too, that i know actually. like I said before, no need to be bitter towards me cause you chose a bad partner.

EpiGaiaRepens

It's just an amusing double standard. Women want equal rights in everything, yet want the man to "be a man" and pay?! Sexist!

Equality should apply to all things, not just certain things.

I've seen women who when a man hold a door open for them, they say "I can do it myself thank you!".

Chivalry is dead...and who killed it?




Women.

*ducks from all the flames*

Ahhhhhhhhh. How adorable it is to be lumped in with every other human being with a vagina. Because, clearly, we are all exactly the same!

Rhea30

It's just an amusing double standard. Women want equal rights in everything, yet want the man to "be a man" and pay?! Sexist!

Equality should apply to all things, not just certain things.

I've seen women who when a man hold a door open for them, they say "I can do it myself thank you!".

Chivalry is dead...and who killed it?





Women.

*ducks from all the flames*

Sometimes, when appropriate (e.g. someone coming not far behind me, men carrying stuff, etc) I hold doors for men.
Maybe we can reincarnate chivalry and define it as people doing nice things for other people?

I never understood the holding the door open thing for women. I just think its polite to do and I hold the door for others if its a man or women if they are behind me or what not. Its a polite gesture that all people should do.

atjays

On one side I think society is far past the whole "Traditional" dating concepts of man should be expected to pay blah blah... However I will always pay on dates. Maybe I over analyze things too much, but I feel like I'm being judged if I let the girl pay her half or let her pay if she offers to, the others around aren't in on the deal so they just think I'm a cheap jerk... can't let that happen hahaha

manda1002

So in mostly reading most of these, something I've noticed.

There's a lot of women who say the man is the provider, and the man should hold my door open, it's "tradition", etc. If that's the case, are you at home, barefoot and pregnant, keeping the house tidy, the yard clean, his laundry washed, ironed and away, are his meals cooked when he walks in the door after a long day at work? Do you wear clothes that don't show off all your goods and always smile no matter how bad you may want to punch him in the face sometimes? Why should men hold on to said "traditions" while women just get to do whatever they want?

And at what point do we cut a guy a little slack on the first date. He likes you, maybe he thinks you're into him, so he asks you on a date, PURELY to get to know you, not even really thinking "oh **** I might not be able to afford this date" and then at the date too embarrassed to admit that he's just not got enough money. If that's his only fault at the date, why should that be a deal breaker? The poor guy just wanted to get to know you better.

Also, why can a guy not come out of "friend zone"? What if that guy actually is your "perfect" guy?

EpiGaiaRepens

Men should pay.. period.. No matter who asked who on the date...

Ster81...i'm a little short on cash these days.

Want to go out for some mexican food? My treat! *wink* *wink*

darn. I will take your silence as a "no." I thought it was my lucky day to get a free meal AND a six pack!!!!!!

crisanderson27

@chrisanderson

"I wasn't judging you hun, I was judging the rationality of your argument, and its bearing on the validity of any future discussion. so, here's my logic"

You said/implied
Majority of people think men should pay
Therefore, because of this I am right to insist to pay.

I replied:
A societal norm does not necessarily mean it's the right way do do things.
I used women's right to vote as an example.

This is not irrational so not sure where you think the logic is flawed. It is permissible in logic to use examples to argue for a point. To call me irrational after that was ironically irrational of you.

However, your response to my stance that they are comparable, left me scratching my head.
I use a type of gun to hunt (I assume animals)
The Navy used a different gun to kill people in world war 2.
Not sure how that is rational or what point you trying to make.

Umm...a 'comparable' societal norm would be holding doors open.

As for my analogy...

I hunt with a 30-06.
In ww2, the navy used a much larger M1 cannon to bring aircraft out of the sky.

I pay for dates.
100yrs ago women were oppressed and they weren't allowed to vote.

I think that the point is pretty clear. Both of my examples are guns, but are so drastically different in purpose and overall effect as to be incomparable.

Both of your examples are societal norms, but are so drastically different in purpose and overall effect...as to be...you guessed it.

Incomparable.

'Let' is a perfect example of this. I wouldn't 'let' (assuming normal circumstances) you pay on our first date, any more than I'd 'let' you walk in front of a moving bus."
Not sure what you mean by this. Would paying for dinner the same as risking my life?

I asked you which of those threw up the red flag...because that's what you were saying.

Red flags go up when person states absolutes like " I would never" in regards to perfectly normal thing like treating someone to dinner. Yes, woman can show appreciation a different way, but why would you restrict it?

Yes, I did recall that your circumstances had changed but that you stated you had a really hard time accepting this, that you didn't like it. Kinda proves my point that with your insistence on being the provider, it will create a difficult situation. If your masculinity is determined by you being the provider, you may have struggles with your self esteem which almost always has a detrimental effect on relationships.

I was unhappy accepting it mostly because...due to other issues (unrelated to this specific topic), the relationship was in doubt. Had we been together longer, and been more sure of ourselves overall, it would have been the next logical step, and completely accepted. I thought i made that clear in the final statement of that post...but again, my words have been picked apart to mean something they weren't intended to.

My masculinity isn't determined by anything but my own sense of self. Any feelings of insecurity I may or may not have...come from real issues that impact real parts of my life. For example, Arizona is a mother's rights state. My children, that I have sole custody of as we speak...are in very real danger of being forced to live with a woman who has never put their needs before her own, and has proven this time and again, due to that simple fact. All because no one asked me if I wanted to give birth to them.

THAT is something that makes me feel insecure.

Not whether I pay for a date. What not being allowed to pay for a date does, is puts up a red flag (I really dislike that term) that the woman who is refusing to allow this has an overblown sense of her own 'feminist self'...and in the end, it will cause problems for us. Because the definition of 'independence' is counter to the definition of 'together'. If I wanted independence, I'd stay single.

Anyhow, as I said...TotallyTasha gets it. It harms her in NO WAY to give her man the things he needs to be the man she loves...and the fact that she is able to do so without any loss of 'self'...proves that she is truly her own person. I gave my ex girlfriend what she wanted (to help with the bills, and pay for our time together when I wasn't capable) because she felt she needed to, and to not allow it would have been a slap in her face...at the worst possible time for her and us. No, I wasn't happy about it...but the fact that I did it anyway, and appreciated her for it...meant the world to her. And so...by giving up that 'masculinity' you mentioned...I didn't give up anything of my 'self'.

I was able to put her first...which in the end is always more important to me.

nnylee

Whoever initiated the date first, pays.