It's NOT Just Calories In VS Calories Out!!!

NoAdditives

No. It's not. It's a lot of different factors, including the female hormones. Anyone who says it's not, well, he hasn't gone through menopause. :laugh:

This is part of the "calories out" side of the equation.

How's that? (please do your best to not be snarky, thanks)

In terms of fat loss, hormonal changes effect metabolic efficiency.

Metabolic efficiency? Darn, i knew i forgot something! I also forgot to mention sleep/circadian rhythm. There are so many factors besides simple calories in/calories out!

"Metabolic efficiency" as in how many calories are burned, a.k.a. calories out. You're not really helping yourself.

And why do some people have a different metabolism than others? Is there anything you can do to change your own metabolic efficiency rate, i wonder? Eating a proper diet, and exercising regularly don't affect this rate? This rate is steadfast throughout life?

Hello children. Today's word is "strawman".

Can you say "strawman"?

I bet you can.

can you make it through a conversation without being rude?

Not likely.

tnqnt

My mom is proof that WHAT you eat affects your health. By diet modification (not calorie modification), she has stabilized her blood sugar, drastically lowered her blood pressure and her cholesterol markers and no longer requires medication. She has not lost weight and does not exercise. Living proof right there.

Look at all the studies on Mediterranean diet and how it helps your cholesterol, etc.

Sure, there is a study for everything, but living proof, my 68 yo mother, is all I need to know that WHAT you eat affects your blood and your health markers.

Babrao

BUMP

Rocbola

I can't speak for everyone but I have to agree with the original post. If I eat processed foods (even if they are supposedly healthy) and meat... my weight loss is so slow! The more I eat fresh, raw fruits and vegetables the weight just flies off! I honestly don't understand it because I'm eating the same amount of calories but I'll lose weight a gazzilion times faster. So interesting.

Thank you for sharing. People's personal experiences, like yours, mean 1000 times more than any one-liner opinion.

kmh0617

Because you naturally lose muscle mass as you age, your metabolic rate will decrease. A good way to increase your metabolic rate is to increase your mucle mass. Even at rest, muscle cells require more energy to simply exist (than do fat cells.) So, if you are strength training to increase lean muscle mass, it will increase metabolism. This means you're burning more calories even as you are sleeping, sitting, etc. than if you had less lean muscle. Also, strength training (especailly importany for menopausal women) increases your bone strength and density. This helps to ward off osteoporosis. Keeping active, resistance/strength training, and retaining lean muscle mass is super important as we age.

In other words: It's not about the hormones.

Rocbola

My mom is proof that WHAT you eat affects your health. By diet modification (not calorie modification), she has stabilized her blood sugar, drastically lowered her blood pressure and her cholesterol markers and no longer requires medication. She has not lost weight and does not exercise. Living proof right there.

Look at all the studies on Mediterranean diet and how it helps your cholesterol, etc.

Sure, there is a study for everything, but living proof, my 68 yo mother, is all I need to know that WHAT you eat affects your blood and your health markers.

Thank you for sharing.

Brunner26_2

No. It's not. It's a lot of different factors, including the female hormones. Anyone who says it's not, well, he hasn't gone through menopause. :laugh:

This is part of the "calories out" side of the equation.

How's that? (please do your best to not be snarky, thanks)

In terms of fat loss, hormonal changes effect metabolic efficiency.

Metabolic efficiency? Darn, i knew i forgot something! I also forgot to mention sleep/circadian rhythm. There are so many factors besides simple calories in/calories out!

"Metabolic efficiency" as in how many calories are burned, a.k.a. calories out. You're not really helping yourself.

And why do some people have a different metabolism than others? Is there anything you can do to change your own metabolic efficiency rate, i wonder? Eating a proper diet, and exercising regularly don't affect this rate? This rate is steadfast throughout life?

Nobody here argued that everyone has the same metabolic rate, that you can't change it, or that it's steadfast throughout your life. We're saying that weight loss does ultimately come down to calories in vs calories out. Whatever your own metabolic rate at any given time, if you eat less than that, you WILL lose weight of some form or another. Actually knowing your calories out is another thing altogether.

Rocbola

Because you naturally lose muscle mass as you age, your metabolic rate will decrease. A good way to increase your metabolic rate is to increase your mucle mass. Even at rest, muscle cells require more energy to simply exist (than do fat cells.) So, if you are strength training to increase lean muscle mass, it will increase metabolism. This means you're burning more calories even as you are sleeping, sitting, etc. than if you had less lean muscle. Also, strength training (especailly importany for menopausal women) increases your bone strength and density. This helps to ward off osteoporosis. Keeping active, resistance/strength training, and retaining lean muscle mass is super important as we age.

Thank you. Great point!

Biggipooh

I can't speak for others but I would not lose weight, if I would eat that.

Biggipooh

:laugh:

mhotch

Bump to read tonight. It's too nice outside right now!

RonSwanson66

Because you naturally lose muscle mass as you age, your metabolic rate will decrease. A good way to increase your metabolic rate is to increase your mucle mass. Even at rest, muscle cells require more energy to simply exist (than do fat cells.) So, if you are strength training to increase lean muscle mass, it will increase metabolism. This means you're burning more calories even as you are sleeping, sitting, etc. than if you had less lean muscle. Also, strength training (especailly importany for menopausal women) increases your bone strength and density. This helps to ward off osteoporosis. Keeping active, resistance/strength training, and retaining lean muscle mass is super important as we age.

Calories out

In other words: It's not about the hormones.

Our hormones affect our ability to add or maintain muscle mass.

Rocbola

No. It's not. It's a lot of different factors, including the female hormones. Anyone who says it's not, well, he hasn't gone through menopause. :laugh:

This is part of the "calories out" side of the equation.

How's that? (please do your best to not be snarky, thanks)

In terms of fat loss, hormonal changes effect metabolic efficiency.

Metabolic efficiency? Darn, i knew i forgot something! I also forgot to mention sleep/circadian rhythm. There are so many factors besides simple calories in/calories out!

"Metabolic efficiency" as in how many calories are burned, a.k.a. calories out. You're not really helping yourself.

And why do some people have a different metabolism than others? Is there anything you can do to change your own metabolic efficiency rate, i wonder? Eating a proper diet, and exercising regularly don't affect this rate? This rate is steadfast throughout life?

Nobody here argued that everyone has the same metabolic rate, that you can't change it, or that it's steadfast throughout your life. We're saying that weight loss does ultimately come down to calories in vs calories out. Whatever your own metabolic rate at any given time, if you eat less than that, you WILL lose weight of some form or another. Actually knowing your calories out is another thing altogether.

But you can increase your calories out and decrease your calories in by eating better food and by changing your metabolic rate. What i said in the OP was that there are other factors involved. I wanted to communicate that fact to newbies, because i see a lot of threads where newbies are saying "Why is my progress so slow?"

AllTehBeers

For those of you keeping score, it's crickets for the win.

Oh you didn't see?

Do blood markers of health generally improve or worsen when losing weight regardless of the composition of the diet?

I'd be interested to know. If you have any data, studies, or links, please share.

RonSwanson66

But you can increase your calories out and decrease your calories in by eating better food and by changing your metabolic rate. What i said in the OP was that there are other factors involved. I wanted to communicate that fact to newbies, because i see a lot of threads where newbies are saying "Why is my progress so slow?"

So it still boils down to calories in vs calories out.

taunto

The guy is encouraging to drink more, live a less stressful life and not eat crap loaded with chemicals. No need to bash on him for that.

Weight-loss comes from persistence. People have lost weight living on McD's but then there are anorexics who have lost weight denying themselves food too. calories in/out is ofcourse a major part of it but what good is weight-loss if you're left with no energy to enjoy it.

Once again, forums don't fail to disappoint me where wannabe e-thugs come in here. The self-righteousness in strong among them. I wonder if these are the people who walk up to strangers at gym who're doing long sessions of cardio and start telling how stupid they are for ignoring weight-training.

@OP: Thanks for putting this up. You have brought some good info to some of us who choose to listen. It must be so difficult for some folks here see somebody disagree with them

AllTehBeers

My mom is proof that WHAT you eat affects your health. By diet modification (not calorie modification), she has stabilized her blood sugar, drastically lowered her blood pressure and her cholesterol markers and no longer requires medication. She has not lost weight and does not exercise. Living proof right there.

Look at all the studies on Mediterranean diet and how it helps your cholesterol, etc.

Sure, there is a study for everything, but living proof, my 68 yo mother, is all I need to know that WHAT you eat affects your blood and your health markers.

So your mom is eating the exact same amout of calories as she did before and dropped the weight? Or the change in what she ate led to an automatic decrease in the amout of calories she was eating?

Brunner26_2

No. It's not. It's a lot of different factors, including the female hormones. Anyone who says it's not, well, he hasn't gone through menopause. :laugh:

This is part of the "calories out" side of the equation.

How's that? (please do your best to not be snarky, thanks)

In terms of fat loss, hormonal changes effect metabolic efficiency.

Metabolic efficiency? Darn, i knew i forgot something! I also forgot to mention sleep/circadian rhythm. There are so many factors besides simple calories in/calories out!

"Metabolic efficiency" as in how many calories are burned, a.k.a. calories out. You're not really helping yourself.

And why do some people have a different metabolism than others? Is there anything you can do to change your own metabolic efficiency rate, i wonder? Eating a proper diet, and exercising regularly don't affect this rate? This rate is steadfast throughout life?

Nobody here argued that everyone has the same metabolic rate, that you can't change it, or that it's steadfast throughout your life. We're saying that weight loss does ultimately come down to calories in vs calories out. Whatever your own metabolic rate at any given time, if you eat less than that, you WILL lose weight of some form or another. Actually knowing your calories out is another thing altogether.

But you can increase your calories out and decrease your calories in by eating better food and by changing your metabolic rate. What i said in the OP was that there are other factors involved. I wanted to communicate that fact to newbies, because i see a lot of threads where newbies are saying "Why is my progress so slow?"

That's valid, and a great thing to do. The wording is what's causing so much disagreement. I think a better way of putting it is:

While ultimately weight loss boils down to calories in vs calories out, there are a number of factors one can take into consideration to tip the energy balance scale in your favor, including [insert some of the things you mentioned in the OP here].

BostonMatt

Sometimes the more simple we keep things the better we are. It all comes down to In vs Out.

Hezzietiger1

I have to exercise a lot in order to lose weight. Even at a deficit I just don't lose unless I'm exercising.

Me either!

Astro_ferret

Because the Twinkie Diet article is required in all of these threads:

http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08/twinkie.diet.professor/index.html

Hezzietiger1

I see people all the time say that weight loss is just as simple as "calories in/calories out" but, that is a serious oversimplification!!!! I want to share what i have learned about the OTHER FACTORS involved so others don't make the same mistakes i have made in the past. There are a variety of factors involved with why we all became overweight, and stayed that way, despite great efforts.

Factor 1: STRESS
Stress releases stress hormones within our bodies that not only make us desire more food, they make our bodies go into a storage state. Google "Cortisol"

Factor 2: HYDRATION
Most of us don't drink enough water. In addition, most of the man-made foods we eat have low water content, compared with the foods we would eat in nature. This makes our water requirements even greater. Water is necessary for almost every function of the body, including flushing out toxins from cells. You should be peeing clear.

Factor 3: UN-NATURALLY CONCENTRATED FOODS
Most man-made foods that we eat have a high concentration of calories, without much or any fiber or water. They don't fill up our stomachs, but they do provide us with a lot of calories. They are also stripped of most mirco nutrients. It is very easy to eat too many calories without our bodies telling us to stop eating. As Doug Lisle says, "Our mechanisms of satiation are being fooled". Even when we have had ENOUGH calories, we desire MORE because our stomachs aren't full.
Google "Dr. Doug Lisle, Pleasure Trap"

Factor 3: UNDERNOURISHMENT
ALL processed food has been stripped of at least some of it's nutrients. ALL cooked food has had at least some of it's nutrients destroyed. Most of the minerals that are found in normal plants are not replaced in the soil each year, so most commercial produce is deficient in proper minerals. Plus, once a plant is picked, the nutrients start degrading. By the time we pick it up on the grocery store shelf, it's already at least a week old. All of these factors combined mean that we are not getting enough nutrients. Despite getting more than enough MACRO-NUTRIENTS (calories), we are not getting enough MICRO-NUTRIENTS (vitamins, minerals, phytochemicals, etc). When we don't get the micro nutrients we need, we are starving internally, and the hunger signal remains strong, so we continue to eat. Unfortunately, most people continue to eat foods that have high calories, and low micro nutrients, further exacerbating the problem.

FACTOR 4: TOXICITY/FOOD CHEMICALS
Most of the food that we eat contains preservatives, artificial flavorings, artificial colorings, etc. The body is not made to process this stuff. The body sees these chemicals as irritants, and acts to remove them from the blood stream. It either creates mucus to flush them out, or stores them in fat cells. When the body takes on these chemicals in the fat, they alter the body's ability to utilize the fat stored in the cell properly. This is very over-simplified. Research this topic. Seriously.
Google "Dr. Joel Fuhrman: Toxic Hunger"
Google "Jon Gabriel Method"

Factor 5: MSG
Several of the food chemicals in most of today's food make you want to continue eating, even when you are full.

Factor 6: ADDICTION
Many of the additives and processed foods today are physically addicting. Don't believe that big food companies would stoop to that level? Why not, the tobacco did it too. Think you are an "over eater"? Ever wonder why you can't seem to control yourself when food is concerned? Ever tell yourself, "I'll just have one" and then have more? ADDICTION.

YES, calories in, vs calories out is a big factor, but there are many other things to consider. You need high quality calories or you will be fighting with your hunger drive all the time.

High quality calories? You've heard it before. High quality calories come from:
High water content, high nutrient content, high fiber content, natural, unprocessed, local, fresh, organic, plant based foods. Yes, i'm talking about fruits and vegetables.

I agree.

Anayalata

Learn to do MATH people.

No matter how complicated you try to make it, a CALORIE DEFICIT is 100% of what losing weight is.

Unless you're talking about cardiovascular health, overall body composition, raising your BMR with muscle mass, etc.

AllTehBeers

Once again, forums don't fail to disappoint me where wannabe e-thugs come in here. The self-righteousness in strong among them. I wonder if these are the people who walk up to strangers at gym who're doing long sessions of cardio and start telling how stupid they are for ignoring weight-training.

@OP: Thanks for putting this up. You have brought some good info to some of us who choose to listen. It must be so difficult for some folks here see somebody disagree with them

I don't disagree with the info. I disagree that composition is different then weight loss.

johicks

All of this plus getting sleep!!!

http://www.webmd.com/sleep-disorders/excessive-sleepiness-10/lack-of-sleep-weight-gain

Sabine_Stroehm

Because you naturally lose muscle mass as you age, your metabolic rate will decrease. A good way to increase your metabolic rate is to increase your mucle mass. Even at rest, muscle cells require more energy to simply exist (than do fat cells.) So, if you are strength training to increase lean muscle mass, it will increase metabolism. This means you're burning more calories even as you are sleeping, sitting, etc. than if you had less lean muscle. Also, strength training (especailly importany for menopausal women) increases your bone strength and density. This helps to ward off osteoporosis. Keeping active, resistance/strength training, and retaining lean muscle mass is super important as we age.

In other words: It's not about the hormones.

You're in menopause?

tnqnt

My mom is proof that WHAT you eat affects your health. By diet modification (not calorie modification), she has stabilized her blood sugar, drastically lowered her blood pressure and her cholesterol markers and no longer requires medication. She has not lost weight and does not exercise. Living proof right there.

Look at all the studies on Mediterranean diet and how it helps your cholesterol, etc.

Sure, there is a study for everything, but living proof, my 68 yo mother, is all I need to know that WHAT you eat affects your blood and your health markers.

So your mom is eating the exact same amout of calories as she did before and dropped the weight? Or the change in what she ate led to an automatic decrease in the amout of calories she was eating?

Hello

Please re-read what I wrote. She did NOT lose weight in my post. She improved her blood/health markers by changing the types of foods she ate. I was responding to Mr. Crickets....

My point is 10 year ago, when she was skinnier (lower weight after doing weight watchers), she lost weight and had still had high bp, high blood sugar and high cholesterol. 10 years later, she made a decision to eat the right foods, not restricting calories. Her weight did not go up or down by any significant amount. If anything, it is higher now that it was then, when she had her poor blood health markers. About 6 months since she has changed the quality of the foods she eats, she has significantly improved her blood health markers so much that she no longer needs meds for cholesterol and her blood sugar is perfect. :)

My post was in response to someone asking OP to give a study of blood health markers.

My mom is living proof that losing weight did nothing for her blood health markers but changing her diet did... 10 years older, no less...

Rocbola

All of this plus getting sleep!!!

http://www.webmd.com/sleep-disorders/excessive-sleepiness-10/lack-of-sleep-weight-gain

Thank you! Great point!

thelovelyLIZ

While calories in vs calories out is a massive over simplification, it is true to an extent. I mean, many people will still lose weight eating 1200 calories of twinkies vs 1200 of healthy food. I've found the quality of the calories make the most difference for people concerned with fitness and overall healthy. Which is really the point of weight loss, in my opinion.

Rocbola

But you can increase your calories out and decrease your calories in by eating better food and by changing your metabolic rate. What i said in the OP was that there are other factors involved. I wanted to communicate that fact to newbies, because i see a lot of threads where newbies are saying "Why is my progress so slow?"

So it still boils down to calories in vs calories out.

Yes, among other factors. I said that calories in VS calories out is not the ONLY factor involved. There is important information for people who may need it, why you gotta split hairs? Ask yourself this, please, before posting: "Are my comments helpful to anyone?" I mean, other than the junk food industry's bottom line?