Vegetarians - why?

doorki

Jesus, Doorki, you really REALLY want people to start considering the feelings of plants. This is like the 1984y638927t53 forum you have posted your plant argument in.

Don't you have like... working out... or a job... or something else besides your absurd argument to focus your attention on? Maybe you need a girlfriend. EHarmony is a wonderful site from what I have heard.

lol...Married, 2 kids, good job and healthy love for debate. The argument is not absurd because it pokes holes in some of the anti-meat crowd's perceived superiority because they do not harm things to eat. Everyone harms things to eat. Its the life and it is messy. Accept it

doorki

Why do people feel the need to try and convert people to become vegetarians or meat eaters? Every time I am aware of the fact that someone is a veg. it is because they feel the need to be convinced otherwise. (or vice versa) Why not just eat your vegetables or your meat and not worry about what other people are eating. You made a lifestyle choice, good for you. Now leave me to eat my lifestyle choice in peace.

The issue here is that the "lifestyle choice" of eating meat assumes that there is no "other", and that it doesn't only affect the person making the lifestyle choice - it involves the taking of another life. Aggressive activism definitely alienates people on both sides, and there are definitely more positive, peaceful ways to share beliefs than shoving them down others' throats, but the fact of the matter is that some people feel that they cannot simply stand by and watch injustice happen.

You are still taking another life when eating plants. They just aren't as cute.

This is a valid point, it is taking a life. But it's viewed differently to take the life of a sentient creature with a brain and nervous system as opposed to pulling a carrot out of the ground. Sure taking a plant's life is still taking a life, but animals have brains and nervous systems. They have the known capacity to suffer.

Plants fight for survival, avoid things that harm them, and react to external stimuli. While it does not have a nervous system (technically) it does have something that serves the same purpose.

Also, cows never see the bolt gun coming.

Heliotropism and other plant adaptations to their environment isn't proof they feel pain.

Pain motivates the individual to withdraw from damaging situations, to protect a damaged body part while it heals, and to avoid similar experiences in the future. Plants do this.

So do some man-made robots.

Yup. Which is where the discussions about the rights of artificial beings are coming from. But they also don't provide sustenance.

Haha! So are you saying that robots feel pain now? Since, their behavior is obstacle-avoidant just like the plants you cry for, I can see how it would offend your sensibilities.

Have you seen the latest robot AI technology?

Even something as unsophisticated as the Roomba makes my case for me. I really think someone as sensitive as you are--with your obvious concern for plants and robots--should go vegetarian. I worry for you.

no, a Roomba does not exercise self preservation like a plant does. Or some of the more sophisticated AI that is being developed.

amivox

Wait, wait... I get it. It even says you are a troll when you are bored in your profile. You must be bored a lot. There are far better ways to spend your time, in my opinion.

Things I would rather do than troll forums:

hang out with my kid (although she is napping right now...)
be in a band playing awesome badass music
eat
have sex
eat
have sex
take a walk
work out
eat
play with my dogs
have sex
watch the news
watch a documentary
eat
smoke herb
have sex

I mean, its a whole world of possibilities, man.

doorki

Wow, and here was me thinking there'd be at least 24 hours before the next round of Veggie. vs. Omni.

I haven't even gone to omni yet

doorki

Wait, wait... I get it. It even says you are a troll when you are bored in your profile. You must be bored a lot. There are far better ways to spend your time, in my opinion.

Things I would rather do than troll forums:

hang out with my kid (although she is napping right now...)
be in a band playing awesome badass music
eat
have sex
eat
have sex
take a walk
work out
eat
play with my dogs
have sex
watch the news
watch a documentary
eat
smoke herb
have sex

I mean, its a whole world of possibilities, man.

The only thing in that list I can do at work is eat and I'm not even allowed to do that since I joined this site.

_VoV

Why do people feel the need to try and convert people to become vegetarians or meat eaters? Every time I am aware of the fact that someone is a veg. it is because they feel the need to be convinced otherwise. (or vice versa) Why not just eat your vegetables or your meat and not worry about what other people are eating. You made a lifestyle choice, good for you. Now leave me to eat my lifestyle choice in peace.

The issue here is that the "lifestyle choice" of eating meat assumes that there is no "other", and that it doesn't only affect the person making the lifestyle choice - it involves the taking of another life. Aggressive activism definitely alienates people on both sides, and there are definitely more positive, peaceful ways to share beliefs than shoving them down others' throats, but the fact of the matter is that some people feel that they cannot simply stand by and watch injustice happen.

You are still taking another life when eating plants. They just aren't as cute.

This is a valid point, it is taking a life. But it's viewed differently to take the life of a sentient creature with a brain and nervous system as opposed to pulling a carrot out of the ground. Sure taking a plant's life is still taking a life, but animals have brains and nervous systems. They have the known capacity to suffer.

Plants fight for survival, avoid things that harm them, and react to external stimuli. While it does not have a nervous system (technically) it does have something that serves the same purpose.

Also, cows never see the bolt gun coming.

Heliotropism and other plant adaptations to their environment isn't proof they feel pain.

Pain motivates the individual to withdraw from damaging situations, to protect a damaged body part while it heals, and to avoid similar experiences in the future. Plants do this.

So do some man-made robots.

Yup. Which is where the discussions about the rights of artificial beings are coming from. But they also don't provide sustenance.

Haha! So are you saying that robots feel pain now? Since, their behavior is obstacle-avoidant just like the plants you cry for, I can see how it would offend your sensibilities.

Have you seen the latest robot AI technology?

Even something as unsophisticated as the Roomba makes my case for me. I really think someone as sensitive as you are--with your obvious concern for plants and robots--should go vegetarian. I worry for you.

no, a Roomba does not exercise self preservation like a plant does. Or some of the more sophisticated AI that is being developed.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

amivox

Wait, wait... I get it. It even says you are a troll when you are bored in your profile. You must be bored a lot. There are far better ways to spend your time, in my opinion.

Things I would rather do than troll forums:

hang out with my kid (although she is napping right now...)
be in a band playing awesome badass music
eat
have sex
eat
have sex
take a walk
work out
eat
play with my dogs
have sex
watch the news
watch a documentary
eat
smoke herb
have sex

I mean, its a whole world of possibilities, man.

The only thing in that list I can do at work is eat and I'm not even allowed to do that since I joined this site.

Well, your work is a lot nicer than mine. If we got caught on the interwebz we got reprimanded. And you can too eat. :-P Just workout more when you get home or eat a healthy snack, man!!

_VoV

Wait, wait... I get it. It even says you are a troll when you are bored in your profile. You must be bored a lot. There are far better ways to spend your time, in my opinion.

Things I would rather do than troll forums:

hang out with my kid (although she is napping right now...)
be in a band playing awesome badass music
eat
have sex
eat
have sex
take a walk
work out
eat
play with my dogs
have sex
watch the news
watch a documentary
eat
smoke herb
have sex

I mean, its a whole world of possibilities, man.

Brilliant. I'm going to close my eyes, point to the screen, and do the one that shows up. All of those are way better than arguing about pain sensitivity in plants, robots and trolls.

doorki

Wait, wait... I get it. It even says you are a troll when you are bored in your profile. You must be bored a lot. There are far better ways to spend your time, in my opinion.

Things I would rather do than troll forums:

hang out with my kid (although she is napping right now...)
be in a band playing awesome badass music
eat
have sex
eat
have sex
take a walk
work out
eat
play with my dogs
have sex
watch the news
watch a documentary
eat
smoke herb
have sex

I mean, its a whole world of possibilities, man.

The only thing in that list I can do at work is eat and I'm not even allowed to do that since I joined this site.

Well, your work is a lot nicer than mine. If we got caught on the interwebz we got reprimanded. And you can too eat. :-P Just workout more when you get home or eat a healthy snack, man!!

I am surrounded by 5 computer monitors hooked up to four computers. Times can be busy and they can be slow. I eat snacks and the like but only on a schedule. I exercise at a boxing gym 4 times a week after my kids go to sleep or before they wake up and the rest of the time is spent enjoying my family

doorki

Wait, wait... I get it. It even says you are a troll when you are bored in your profile. You must be bored a lot. There are far better ways to spend your time, in my opinion.

Things I would rather do than troll forums:

hang out with my kid (although she is napping right now...)
be in a band playing awesome badass music
eat
have sex
eat
have sex
take a walk
work out
eat
play with my dogs
have sex
watch the news
watch a documentary
eat
smoke herb
have sex

I mean, its a whole world of possibilities, man.

Brilliant. I'm going to close my eyes, point to the screen, and do the one that shows up. All of those are way better than arguing about pain sensitivity in plants, robots and trolls.

I am actually not trolling with this topic because I do have a belief in it because I get offended with falsified superiority.

Polly758

I just don't get it, and never will.

First off, that's a lousy attitude to start a discussion with.

What exactly do you mean by "get it"? You really don't understand that some people have a different opinion from you? You don't have to agree. Some people think meat is flesh, or they don't want to be responsible for a creature's death, or they JUST DON'T LIKE MEAT.

What's not to "get"? That vegetarians are people, too?

Inacay

I am a pescatarian. This means I eat fish, but not chicken, beef, or other mammals. I am a vegetarian because I was diagnosed with gout. After I changed my diet, I lost weight, felt better, and was able to stop taking my gout medication. To date, no gout attacks. My life is awesome. I am pain free an increasing my activities.

At first I thought this would be difficult. I love to cook. On the contrary, it was fun finding new ways to cook food. Today, I do not crave meat. If I consume a dish that has beef broth or any other type of meat product, I will have an allergic type reaction so not even a temptation. Plus, it helps me keep my meals to raw vegetables (I try to eat 50% raw foods daily), which helps my weight and control my food allergies.

Thank you for asking. Either way, our relationship to food and our expression of it's consumption is definitely personal. Follow your own path. Be blessed. Tiki

amivox

Wait, wait... I get it. It even says you are a troll when you are bored in your profile. You must be bored a lot. There are far better ways to spend your time, in my opinion.

Things I would rather do than troll forums:

hang out with my kid (although she is napping right now...)
be in a band playing awesome badass music
eat
have sex
eat
have sex
take a walk
work out
eat
play with my dogs
have sex
watch the news
watch a documentary
eat
smoke herb
have sex

I mean, its a whole world of possibilities, man.

The only thing in that list I can do at work is eat and I'm not even allowed to do that since I joined this site.

Well, your work is a lot nicer than mine. If we got caught on the interwebz we got reprimanded. And you can too eat. :-P Just workout more when you get home or eat a healthy snack, man!!

I am surrounded by 5 computer monitors hooked up to four computers. Times can be busy and they can be slow. I eat snacks and the like but only on a schedule. I exercise at a boxing gym 4 times a week after my kids go to sleep or before they wake up and the rest of the time is spent enjoying my family

lol, even when times were slow at my old job, we were supposed to "find something work related to do" which usually meant helping other people with their jobs because they worked at a much slower pace

TheFitFireman

LOL I go to the gym and come back to See the Omnivore thread closed and now VergingOnVega is working on getting this one closed as well.

Rhea30

Jesus, Doorki, you really REALLY want people to start considering the feelings of plants. This is like the 1984y638927t53 forum you have posted your plant argument in.

Don't you have like... working out... or a job... or something else besides your absurd argument to focus your attention on? Maybe you need a girlfriend. EHarmony is a wonderful site from what I have heard.

lol...Married, 2 kids, good job and healthy love for debate. The argument is not absurd because it pokes holes in some of the anti-meat crowd's perceived superiority because they do not harm things to eat. Everyone harms things to eat. Its the life and it is messy. Accept it

I'm not vegetarian clearly to anyone who have seen my posts in these vegetarian debates but it is a silly argument to compare harming a plant to an animal. Many plants are even designed to get ate in order to spread their seeds.

doorki

Wait, wait... I get it. It even says you are a troll when you are bored in your profile. You must be bored a lot. There are far better ways to spend your time, in my opinion.

Things I would rather do than troll forums:

hang out with my kid (although she is napping right now...)
be in a band playing awesome badass music
eat
have sex
eat
have sex
take a walk
work out
eat
play with my dogs
have sex
watch the news
watch a documentary
eat
smoke herb
have sex

I mean, its a whole world of possibilities, man.

The only thing in that list I can do at work is eat and I'm not even allowed to do that since I joined this site.

Well, your work is a lot nicer than mine. If we got caught on the interwebz we got reprimanded. And you can too eat. :-P Just workout more when you get home or eat a healthy snack, man!!

I am surrounded by 5 computer monitors hooked up to four computers. Times can be busy and they can be slow. I eat snacks and the like but only on a schedule. I exercise at a boxing gym 4 times a week after my kids go to sleep or before they wake up and the rest of the time is spent enjoying my family

lol, even when times were slow at my old job, we were supposed to "find something work related to do" which usually meant helping other people with their jobs because they worked at a much slower pace

I'm an options trader. Slow for one, slow for all.

_VoV

Wait, wait... I get it. It even says you are a troll when you are bored in your profile. You must be bored a lot. There are far better ways to spend your time, in my opinion.

Things I would rather do than troll forums:

hang out with my kid (although she is napping right now...)
be in a band playing awesome badass music
eat
have sex
eat
have sex
take a walk
work out
eat
play with my dogs
have sex
watch the news
watch a documentary
eat
smoke herb
have sex

I mean, its a whole world of possibilities, man.

Brilliant. I'm going to close my eyes, point to the screen, and do the one that shows up. All of those are way better than arguing about pain sensitivity in plants, robots and trolls.

I am actually not trolling with this topic because I do have a belief in it because I get offended with falsified superiority.

Well, go back to the drawing board, and find something a bit more convincing. This isn't doing it for me, and I never claimed superiority, falsified or not.

doorki

Jesus, Doorki, you really REALLY want people to start considering the feelings of plants. This is like the 1984y638927t53 forum you have posted your plant argument in.

Don't you have like... working out... or a job... or something else besides your absurd argument to focus your attention on? Maybe you need a girlfriend. EHarmony is a wonderful site from what I have heard.

lol...Married, 2 kids, good job and healthy love for debate. The argument is not absurd because it pokes holes in some of the anti-meat crowd's perceived superiority because they do not harm things to eat. Everyone harms things to eat. Its the life and it is messy. Accept it

I'm not vegetarian clearly to anyone who have seen my posts in these vegetarian debates but it is a silly argument to compare harming a plant to an animal. Many plants are even designed to get ate in order to spread their seeds.

As are some insects.

_VoV

Jesus, Doorki, you really REALLY want people to start considering the feelings of plants. This is like the 1984y638927t53 forum you have posted your plant argument in.

Don't you have like... working out... or a job... or something else besides your absurd argument to focus your attention on? Maybe you need a girlfriend. EHarmony is a wonderful site from what I have heard.

lol...Married, 2 kids, good job and healthy love for debate. The argument is not absurd because it pokes holes in some of the anti-meat crowd's perceived superiority because they do not harm things to eat. Everyone harms things to eat. Its the life and it is messy. Accept it

I'm not vegetarian clearly to anyone who have seen my posts in these vegetarian debates but it is a silly argument to compare harming a plant to an animal. Many plants are even designed to get ate in order to spread their seeds.

Rhea30. I like.

doorki

Wait, wait... I get it. It even says you are a troll when you are bored in your profile. You must be bored a lot. There are far better ways to spend your time, in my opinion.

Things I would rather do than troll forums:

hang out with my kid (although she is napping right now...)
be in a band playing awesome badass music
eat
have sex
eat
have sex
take a walk
work out
eat
play with my dogs
have sex
watch the news
watch a documentary
eat
smoke herb
have sex

I mean, its a whole world of possibilities, man.

Brilliant. I'm going to close my eyes, point to the screen, and do the one that shows up. All of those are way better than arguing about pain sensitivity in plants, robots and trolls.

I am actually not trolling with this topic because I do have a belief in it because I get offended with falsified superiority.

Well, go back to the drawing board, and find something a bit more convincing. This isn't doing it for me, and I never claimed superiority, falsified or not.

I believe the bumper sticker you quoted was "I'm Vegan because I want to suck less." Suck less than who?

TheFitFireman

Well, go back to the drawing board, and find something a bit more convincing. This isn't doing it for me, and I never claimed superiority, falsified or not.

You might not have claimed superiority on this thread, but your husband VegesaurusRex was claiming superiority on the Omnivore thread...

Bilbobradshaw

I've tried to cut down my consumption of meat/meat products due to the fact that livestock maintenance and production causes a lot of CO2 emissions (particularly beef). I don't drive (unless I'm visiting my parents or something, at which point we [my boyfriend and I] drive a Prius to keep emissions low), I try to buy (mostly) local food, and try my best not to use anything that is overly processed.

I am not a vegetarian (I'll eat meat if, say, I'm visiting a friend and they've prepared it--I find it rude to decline), and I'll eat certain kinds of fish if they're a)local or b)not being overfished to death, as well as eggs if they're local. I don't do this to be snobby or healthy, I do this because it's something I can do as an individual to lower my carbon footprint and help the environment.

amivox

I am a vegetarian, but I have no quips about sucking less... I think my boyfriend enjoys my suckage. :-P

I'm sorry, I keep trying to diffuse this whole topic with sex.

No one is angry when its sexy time, unless its angry sex, which is still sex and still fun.

_VoV

Well, go back to the drawing board, and find something a bit more convincing. This isn't doing it for me, and I never claimed superiority, falsified or not.

You might not have claimed superiority on this thread, but your husband VegesaurusRex was claiming superiority on the Omnivore thread...

He isn't here; I am.

Truly, the thing that gets me about these boards are the meat-eaters who pound their chests and say something like "Dead animals are tasty. I don't care how the hell they died."

Meat-eaters who at least show some respect for the animals they eat are fine with me. But, I hate the entitlement, and 'you can't make me stop' attitude. Yeah...like I could.

veganbaum

Jesus, Doorki, you really REALLY want people to start considering the feelings of plants. This is like the 1984y638927t53 forum you have posted your plant argument in.

Don't you have like... working out... or a job... or something else besides your absurd argument to focus your attention on? Maybe you need a girlfriend. EHarmony is a wonderful site from what I have heard.

lol...Married, 2 kids, good job and healthy love for debate. The argument is not absurd because it pokes holes in some of the anti-meat crowd's perceived superiority because they do not harm things to eat. Everyone harms things to eat. Its the life and it is messy. Accept it

It is not about not harming - it is about ***reducing*** suffering and your impact on those who feel pain and the world around you as a whole. Of course we cannot live without harming some living thing to eat. But just because we cannot rid the world of suffering does not mean we should not reduce it where we can.

_VoV

Jesus, Doorki, you really REALLY want people to start considering the feelings of plants. This is like the 1984y638927t53 forum you have posted your plant argument in.

Don't you have like... working out... or a job... or something else besides your absurd argument to focus your attention on? Maybe you need a girlfriend. EHarmony is a wonderful site from what I have heard.

lol...Married, 2 kids, good job and healthy love for debate. The argument is not absurd because it pokes holes in some of the anti-meat crowd's perceived superiority because they do not harm things to eat. Everyone harms things to eat. Its the life and it is messy. Accept it

It is not about not harming - it is about ***reducing*** suffering and your impact on those who feel pain and the world around you as a whole. Of course we cannot live without harming some living thing to eat. But just because we cannot rid the world of suffering does not mean we should not reduce it where we can.

Well-stated.

TheFitFireman

He isn't here; I am.

Truly, the thing that gets me about these boards are the meat-eaters who pound their chests and say something like "Dead animals are tasty. I don't care how the hell they died."

Meat-eaters who at least show some respect for the animals they eat are fine with me. But, I hate the entitlement, and 'you can't make me stop' attitude. Yeah...like I could.

You clearly share the same elitist views if you chose to marry someone who speaks to people like he does...

Please show me where I'm pounding my chest and saying how I don't care how animals die? I believe that they should be humanely killed, I also believe animals like chickens shouldn't be stuck in tiny pens where they can hardly move from over crowding of other chickens. Just because I eat meat that does not mean that I believe animals should be mistreated and tortured before death. That's a very simple minded way of stereotyping omni/carnivores...

mfp_junkie

7 Billion ways to live your life. Move on.

EDesq

Ok, I am probably going to offend some, but its not my intention.

However, I just don't get it, and never will. There has never been a good argument presented to me. I figure because whenever I ask why, they almost always get offended. For the life of me, I don't understand why I can't ask for a reason?

So why?

And please remove all of the tofu answers. That stuff is just nasty.

I'm NOT a Vegetarian. But what about "Just Because They Want To Be!" Why do you have a Goatee? Do you REALLY feel that you need to justify it or give an excuse...No You just want one for YOUR reasons...WHO Cares!

_VoV

LOL I go to the gym and come back to See the Omnivore thread closed and now VergingOnVega is working on getting this one closed as well.

Really. And why would that be? For expressing an opinion that is different than yours?