The Food Industry and Obesity

ninerbuff

Is whole food better? I don't know, and can't tell you. It seems like both sides of the debate go out of their ways to cloud up the facts, because they're trying to get one over on the other guy.

I will say that it is better, however..............

Sadly, unless the world population is drastically reduced... and I mean drastically... factory farming is here to stay. There just aren't enough mom and pop farmers to support the amount of people that are already here.

You hit the nail on the head here! You know how many starving people there are that would be glad to eat a processed pizza?

In closing... (I learned that in the persuasive writing unit of English in high school :bigsmile: ) why don't we just quit arguing about it? No one is going to convince the other person that is dead set in their beliefs that their way is better.

We debate it because there will be some that will read it that may be stuck on the fence.
I am part of the fitness industry, but despise a lot about it. Lots of "broscience" is still hanging around even in the face of actual peer reviewed clinical study that totally debunks some of what is being stated by it. So personally I like to debate it because I am on the other side, but with a more practical view.

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Respectfully disagreeing and debating is one thing but trolling for an argument and to flex you ego muscle is quite another.

Trolling? I've respectfully debated and disagreed. Please show me proof that what I've stated is WRONG according to SCIENTIFC STUDY. If not, then please hold your "opinion" to yourself. You can disagree too, but it has nothing to do with "flexing my ego muscle" as you state.

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ctooch99

Lol Hyman, lol Huffpo

Industrial processing has given rise to an array of addictive, fattening, metabolism-jamming chemicals and compounds including aspartame, MSG (monosodium glutamate), high-fructose corn syrup and trans fats, to name the biggest offenders.

^ typical garbage spouted by Hyman

What is garbage about it??? It is the truth.

Do you like just falling in line with the government and believe what they tell you?

Tell me how the listed compounds are fattening and in what dosages make them fattening? Metabolically how are MSG and naturally occurring glutamate different, same goes for HFCS and sucrose.

Do you like just listening to quacks and tin foil hat wearers and falling in line and believing what they tell you?

Enjoy!

http://www.diabeteshealth.com/read/2008/08/20/4274/the-dangers-of-high-fructose-corn-syrup/

http://www.organicconsumers.org/articles/article_11361.cfm

http://www.livestrong.com/article/195953-risks-of-gmo/

Let's try some peer-reviewed and/or academic articles, rather than more pseudoscientific tripe.

Same for the opposing view? Point is the science is in debate based on who is sponsoring the study... I am sure If I spent more that 3 seconds I could find tons of studies as could you...

ninerbuff

Thank you for posting this article. Obviously, our current way of eating in the U.S. is killing us. Obesity and diabetes rates are out of control. Example...my family has always been overweight...even going back in teh generations to when they ate real foods, but now that we are eating all processed junk, we are even bigger. My sister took a summer job in China a few years ago. She left at about 260 pounds. She came back about 30-40 pounds lighter after only 2-3 months! She reported that they ate out every night. The difference is that they do NOT have all the additives, chemicals, and processed foods there. They were eating REAL foods. She has been back in the U.S. for about 2 years and has put on about 60 pounds...she is a teacher and eats school lunches...she also stops at fast-food a lot as she works an hour from home. Obviously, she is responsible for what she puts in her mouth, but I would bet my bottom dollar that she did not magically gain willpower while in China and then come back and lose it all.

The BBC has a good series going right now called "The Men Who Made Us Fat." It is a 3 part series...I think the third installment comes out this week. I found it very interesting.

That's great to hear about your sister. But you should add that MSG is used in cooking in practically all households in China too.

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ctooch99

Here's one for ya:
"if it grows on a plant, eat it. If its made in a plant, dont"

Hemlock grows on a plant, cheese is made in a plant. Which would you rather eat?

Hmmm - yeah I am still thinkin; hemlock has more health benefits than cheese - good try though!

http://herbs-treatandtaste.blogspot.com/2011/09/hemlock-socrates-nemesis-health.html

LOL, go ahead and eat equal sized portions of hemlock and cheese, see which one causes more health issues.

Omg calm down really. This was just a quote I saw in an organic pizza shop me and my friends went to after a night of drinking. Just meant to be silly and cute not a freaking commandment to live by. Seriously lighten up. Or has all that msg and hfcs taken away your sense of humor???

It's all good - there are two views on everything - I personally thing Hemlock has more (non edible) benefits than processed cheese, but everyone is entitled to their opinion...

tigersword

HFCS is NOT different metabolically in the body. It's split into sucrose and fructose, just like any other polysaccharide that contains glucose and fructose, and processed just like any other sugar. There are thousands of different molecular combinations of sugar out there, HFCS is certainly not unique. The human body has specific enzymes specifically for digesting these different combinations.

The human body really isn't as stupid as these fear mongerers want you to believe it is. It has a very good understanding of chemistry and biology, even if you don't.

As for MSG, it's naturally occurring in just about every natural food on the planet. It's in meat, mushrooms, asparagus, nori, kelp, fish, etc. Hell, glutamate is an amino acid MADE BYTHE HUMAN BODY. Yes, it's obviously poison. :huh:

From article on Diabetis Health:

"Leptin tells your body to stop eating when it’s full by signaling the brain to stop sending hunger signals. Since fructose doesn’t stimulate glucose levels and insulin release, there’s no increase in leptin levels or feeling of satiety. This can leave you ripe for unhealthy weight gain.

Fructose requires a different metabolic pathway than other carbohydrates because it basically skips glycolysis (normal carbohydrate metabolism). Because of this, fructose is an unregulated source of “acetyl CoA,” or the starting material for fatty acid synthesis. This, coupled with unstimulated leptin levels, is like opening the flood gates of fat deposition"

http://www.diabeteshealth.com/read/2008/08/20/4274/the-dangers-of-high-fructose-corn-syrup/

HFCS isn't free fructose. It's fructose paired with glucose (along with maltose, which is a double glucose molecule,) just like fructose is in nature. Fructose doesn't trigger lepton, but glucose does, just like when you eat fruit. HFCS is about 55% fructose to 41% glocose to 4% maltose. Most fresh fruits have a higher ratio of fructose to glucose, so trying to use this argument against HFCS actually condemns fruit as unhealthy.

I am not a biochemist by any means, but your logic just is - well "not logical" (no offense) - So you are basically saying whether I eat two apples with naturally occurring Fructose or I drink a Big Gulp with a ton of HFCS, both are equally going to affect my body the same way and it really does not matter which one I choose on a daily basis? That is what I am hearing as the cruxt of your points... Hmmmm.

Maybe at a molecular level, the sugar is the same (but from what I am reading it seems the science is in debate on that - enough for me to be skeptical in favor of my health), but the issue here is how our foods are marketed and sold to us, not necessarily how the body processes them at a molecular level.

I have said several times in this thread - yeah Fructose is natural - hooray - I will give you a science star for proving that to us. Arsenic is natural too. Concentrating fructose, processing and jamming it into an OJ bottle and selling it to the public as "natural" is purely deceptive and for those who choose to blindly buy the marketing (aka the non Tin Foil Hat wearers) - enjoy the obesity and health issues - I will eat my two apples grown at the local farm and pass.

So your argument is that context and dosage doesn't mean anything? Let's compare the sugar in an apple to the sugar in a regular sized Snickers bar. Both have roughly 25 grams of sugar. The Apple has a much higher percentage of fructose by weight (72%, or 18 grams, compared to 55%, or 14 grams in the Snickers bar.) So just looking strictly at the sugar portion, since you are demonizing fructose, you'd be better off eating the Snickers bar, as you'd get less fructose in it.

My point is simply the fact that there is no one "evil" food or ingredient that's causing the obesity epidemic, it's a lot more complex than saying "HFCS is bad," or, "Don't eat X." It's really more about portion control and physical activity than it is about any particular food.

Just look at all the countries that consume all these same ingredients that are supposedly being demonized in this particular article (MSG and HFCS) that don't have problems with obesity. Do they have some magical ability to not be fat? Or are they just better at controlling portions and being more physically active than the average lazy American who has no education or knowledge of basic nutrition (since basic nutrition isn't even really taught in schools?)

ninerbuff

But ya know what? Who's fault is this really? I mean, if you are an individual trying to educate yourself on ANYTHING now days you are immediately labeled "conspiracy nut", "tin foil hat wearer" etc. As someone who worked for the (absolutely insidious, greedy, criminal) pharma industry, I know first hand that THE number one priority of large corporations is stock price - period.

That's fine - I accept that - but the zealotry you speak of is created by these companies - not by individuals who are looking to educate themselves, improve their lives or the lives of those they love and care about. I honestly could care less if anyone changes their mind because of my posts on here - the reason I choose to share is because I have the freedom to do so and because I do not feel that all of the information being put out here is accurate or at the very least un-biased.

If people feel that commercially produced, processed food is fine and healthy - then I say have at it, gorge yourself on Soda, Hot Pockets, pink slime burgers and Ring Dings... I know that I have eliminated 85 percent of this stuff from my diet and the results are non debatable to me - my weight is down lower than it ever has been, my strength and fitness are the highest they have ever been, I am mentally sharper and more focused - I have more energy.

I intend to support my local food producers and small markets because they are members of the community where I live - not some multinational food conglomerate who's only concern is their share price. They produce great products for me and my family that increase our health and vitality and I want that to continue.

Whatever your opinion - educate yourself to the facts on both sides - responsible large companies who produce good products and market them honestly certainly should exist in our society along with small independents. If educating yourself means you are a "tin foil hat wearer" then give me some polish so I can shine mine up! Peace

BTW - what is the origin of Tin Foil Hat wearer anyway? Isn't that like a UFO thing?

I don't think that indulging in processed foods will deter weight loss or health IF it's in moderation. Like you I eat good 80% of the time and the other 20% whatever I feel like as long as I've made sure that I've met my macro/micro nutrients that day and stay within calorie limits. Somedays I have processed, some I don't (with the exception of my Diet Pepsi daily). I think what's being debated here is HOW MUCH of processed foods is being eaten. Obviously if it's the bulk of someone's diet, it probably is the reason they are overweight, but for those that have it in moderation, they may feel that the "only organic" crowd may be harping that any eating of it at all is taboo.
Culturally my ethnic background makes food that is high in salt, fat, MSG, etc. and I REFUSE not to be able to enjoy it with family IN MODERATION. In fact yesterday I had Longanisa (Filipino sausage) with eggs for dinner and enjoyed every bite. Is it processed? Well yes, but it's food I was raised on and have good memories with (my grandmother was really good at making it).
Health isn't just about what food you ingest. It's about food, exercise, rest, lower stress, environment, genetics, and happiness. You can eat perfect, but if you don't exercise, get enough rest, have high stress, live in a crappy environment, then chances are health won't be as good as one who does all the rest with a little processed foods being ingested.

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ndmain1977

Trolling? I've respectfully debated and disagreed. Please show me proof that what I've stated is WRONG according to SCIENTIFC STUDY. If not, then please hold your "opinion" to yourself. You can disagree too, but it has nothing to do with "flexing my ego muscle" as you state.

Wasn't my comment....

Regardless, yes, there are people debating(so far) and disagreeing inside this thread itself. My point is that the person that started this thread seems to be trolling... beating the dead horse... whatever you want to call it... by starting a thread that's been beat to death, over and over on these forums. I honestly think the creators of the threads dealing with this debate keep starting these threads because they want to stir up drama on the forums.

yarwell

When a French fry has more than 20 ingredients and almost all of them are not potato

That was as far as I got, I've personally followed the production process for fries bound for McDonalds and that is utter BS.

yarwell

Here's one for ya:
"if it grows on a plant, eat it. If its made in a plant, dont"

So do I eat the sucrose that grows in sugar cane and sugar beet and is extracted in a plant, and why ?

Sabine_Stroehm

Thank you for posting this article. Obviously, our current way of eating in the U.S. is killing us. Obesity and diabetes rates are out of control. Example...my family has always been overweight...even going back in teh generations to when they ate real foods, but now that we are eating all processed junk, we are even bigger. My sister took a summer job in China a few years ago. She left at about 260 pounds. She came back about 30-40 pounds lighter after only 2-3 months! She reported that they ate out every night. The difference is that they do NOT have all the additives, chemicals, and processed foods there. They were eating REAL foods. She has been back in the U.S. for about 2 years and has put on about 60 pounds...she is a teacher and eats school lunches...she also stops at fast-food a lot as she works an hour from home. Obviously, she is responsible for what she puts in her mouth, but I would bet my bottom dollar that she did not magically gain willpower while in China and then come back and lose it all.

The BBC has a good series going right now called "The Men Who Made Us Fat." It is a 3 part series...I think the third installment comes out this week. I found it very interesting.

That's great to hear about your sister. But you should add that MSG is used in cooking in practically all households in China too.

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And that she likely walked everywhere in China.

ninerbuff

Trolling? I've respectfully debated and disagreed. Please show me proof that what I've stated is WRONG according to SCIENTIFC STUDY. If not, then please hold your "opinion" to yourself. You can disagree too, but it has nothing to do with "flexing my ego muscle" as you state.

Wasn't my comment....

Regardless, yes, there are people debating(so far) and disagreeing inside this thread itself. My point is that the person that started this thread seems to be trolling... beating the dead horse... whatever you want to call it... by starting a thread that's been beat to death, over and over on these forums. I honestly think the creators of the threads dealing with this debate keep starting these threads because they want to stir up drama on the forums.

My response wasn't directed at you (rather someone accusing me of trolling). But yeah, the topic has been covered, recovered and will be covered again in the future as new members, lurkers or even trolls come out. The drama is part of the internet though and not too much can be done about it except to not get involved.

A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
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Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

ninerbuff

Thank you for posting this article. Obviously, our current way of eating in the U.S. is killing us. Obesity and diabetes rates are out of control. Example...my family has always been overweight...even going back in teh generations to when they ate real foods, but now that we are eating all processed junk, we are even bigger. My sister took a summer job in China a few years ago. She left at about 260 pounds. She came back about 30-40 pounds lighter after only 2-3 months! She reported that they ate out every night. The difference is that they do NOT have all the additives, chemicals, and processed foods there. They were eating REAL foods. She has been back in the U.S. for about 2 years and has put on about 60 pounds...she is a teacher and eats school lunches...she also stops at fast-food a lot as she works an hour from home. Obviously, she is responsible for what she puts in her mouth, but I would bet my bottom dollar that she did not magically gain willpower while in China and then come back and lose it all.

The BBC has a good series going right now called "The Men Who Made Us Fat." It is a 3 part series...I think the third installment comes out this week. I found it very interesting.

That's great to hear about your sister. But you should add that MSG is used in cooking in practically all households in China too.

A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

And that she likely walked everywhere in China.

Lol, you mean that she didn't rickshaw?:laugh:

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Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

AbbsyBabbsy

I swear, you'd think this was a religious forum the way everyone tries to push their agenda and beliefs onto other people. Seriously, just replace a few words here and there, and you have the same zealotry as on any christian, atheist, muslim, etc... forum.

Is whole food better? I don't know, and can't tell you. It seems like both sides of the debate go out of their ways to cloud up the facts, because they're trying to get one over on the other guy.

Sadly, unless the world population is drastically reduced... and I mean drastically... factory farming is here to stay. There just aren't enough mom and pop farmers to support the amount of people that are already here.

In closing... (I learned that in the persuasive writing unit of English in high school :bigsmile: ) why don't we just quit arguing about it? No one is going to convince the other person that is dead set in their beliefs that their way is better.

At this point, I almost think you guys are deliberately trolling, because you want to argue.

If people feel that commercially produced, processed food is fine and healthy - then I say have at it, gorge yourself on Soda, Hot Pockets, pink slime burgers and Ring Dings... I know that I have eliminated 85 percent of this stuff from my diet and the results are non debatable to me - my weight is down lower than it ever has been, my strength and fitness are the highest they have ever been, I am mentally sharper and more focused - I have more energy.

Because it's definitely an all or nothing situation. You're either a clean eater or you're stuffing yourself with junk.

The olive oil I cooked my eggs in this morning, processed. The piece of toast, processed. The butter on that toast, processed. The salad dressing, cheddar cheese and greek yogurt I had with lunch, processed. And call me crazy, but I like not having to churn my own butter and squeeze out my own olive oil. Just because something is processed does not make it a nutritional nightmare.

tigersword

I thought everyone in China rode bicycles?

mirandamayhem

I thought everyone in China rode bicycles?

That's only in beijing, where there are, like, 5 million bicycles. That's a lot

tigersword

mcarter99

Jack Lalanne used to say 60 years ago and up until he died at age 96.
IF MAN MAKES IT, DON'T EAT IT
And that is the ideal I strive toward while making allowances for treats and just living life.
I eat that way 70% of the time.
Good Enough :bigsmile:

THIS!!!

"If man makes it, don't eat it." That means no protein powder, omega-3 supplements, multi-vitamins, bottled oils, seasoning blends, hot sauces, teas, coffees... there are a lot of great man-made foods.

Jack's other mantra was "If it tastes good, don't eat it." And he didn't! I wouldn't want to live to 96 under his conditions. 3 hours a day in the gym, eating nothing but egg whites, fish and produce, no sugar since 1929. He wasn't really that good of a role model.

'Processing' can correlate to 'nutritionally less dense' but it's not always so. I process the hell out of green smoothies in my blender. It removes/adds nothing.

I just read in a book that the world population exploded after the discovery/invention of ammonium nitrate as a fertilizer. It's something man makes, right? Without it, we'd be scrounging for potatoes and suffering famines. Well, we wouldn't be here because the population would never have exploded. Hunger would've stopped it. Not all industrial food production is bad.

veganbaum

"When it becomes a revolutionary act to eat real food, we are in trouble."



I love that quote.

AJ_Pete

I've been eating clean now since the beginning of the week and I can already feel a difference and I like it!!

I've been doing the same for a few weeks.... I, too, love how I feel.

AJ_Pete

"When it becomes a revolutionary act to eat real food, we are in trouble."



I love that quote.

YES. God bless you for putting that in my brain.