Paleo Diet!

bcattoes

But let's ignore that overarching issue for a moment and look further at these studies anyhow. Aren't most/all of these studies ultimately comparing the benefits of eating *whole* grains vs. eating *refined* grains?

No, they are not.

Then I don't see how they could have controlled for other diet factors besides whole grains. And as a result, other confounding factors are clearly in play. I'm standing by my position that epidemiological studies do not/can not establish causation...(but they aren't designed for that purpose either). They are the genesis of further studies that *do* and *can* establish causation. One day, these studies will be conducted...but I do not believe that day has arrived yet.

But since there have been multiple epidemiological studies showing that people that eat whole grains have reduced incidence of heart disease, diabetes, stroke and other diseases, I choose to be one of those people. Conclusive science? No. Good science? Yes.

Is it good science because it is a stance that you agree and confirms your current beliefs?

No, it's good science because it provides valuable scientific data. And actually, it didn't so much confirm my beliefts as form them. Although, all subsequent studies that I've seen have confirmed them, I would be more than willing to read a study that conflicted with them. I would judge whether I considered the confilcting results good science by who conducted it and what the peer reviewers had to say.

For example, I eat and/or drink soy almost daily. I started doing so after reading a couple of studies showing health benefits. But, there have been subsequent conflicting study results and I consider most of the information valuable. Maybe it's contributing to my health and maybe not. But I've been consuming it regularly long enough to believe it's not doing me harm. Hopefully I'm right.

What do you think of the perception that whole grains are healthy/healthier, therefore people who already are pretty health conscious choose to eat more whole grains, and thus have better health outcomes, not because of whole grains but their lifestyle choices that whole grains may play a small role in or none at all

It's certianly a possibility. It's nearly impossible to eat a diet rich in whole grains and a diet rich in overly processed grains, making it nearly impossible to tell if it is the elimination of the overly processed grains and not the addition of whole grains that provides the health benefits. But, it certainly does suggest that whole grains do not increase risk of disease, so I see no reason to eliminate them from a diet as the Paleo Diet suggests.

Have you ever seen study results suggesting there is increased risk of disease or poor health from eating whole grains?

jofjltncb6

Read more about it, don't let the idea go and don't let other people talk you out of it because I guarantee they haven't given it a real chance. Read the research, the science behind it and the see the results for yourself.

My results - I lost all of my weight (39 lbs), decreased my overall cholesterol, and reduced my thyroid meds all within 6 months time. I eat 60% fat (including full-fat dairy), 25% protein (strength training) and 15% carbs from veggies and fruit.

Grok on!

Similar here. Overall, feel much better, and GERD almost completely gone. Lost all 30 pounds I wanted to lose in six months. Since then, have spent the past six months intentionally adding mostly lean mass (and am currently up around 14 pounds. I think my current ratios are around 60%F/20%P/20%C.

A major downside is that there are people out there who are very emotionally against the idea. They themselves usually claim that they believe it is too restrictive and that they could never give up their breads. (And many of these people will do whatever they can to convince you of the error of your ways.) My counter is that by completely giving up certain foods, I no longer crave them...or said another way, I have broken my addiction to certain foods. It is very liberating and makes it so much easier to make good, intentional dietary decisions. In other words, the more I stay "on plan", the easier it is to stay "on plan".

If you do decide to pursue it further, there are a lot of resources on the internet to help you. (whole9.org has a very helpful "induction phase" program that you may find helpful.)


EDIT: because grammar matters

Tried going to your link "whole9.org", it doesn't take you to any web page. You might want to check that out before posting.

Geesh...so grammar matters to me, but actual links apparently do not. Thanks for pointing that out.

The link is whole9life.com...(so I messed it up a whole lot and not just a little).

Acg67

But let's ignore that overarching issue for a moment and look further at these studies anyhow. Aren't most/all of these studies ultimately comparing the benefits of eating *whole* grains vs. eating *refined* grains?

No, they are not.

Then I don't see how they could have controlled for other diet factors besides whole grains. And as a result, other confounding factors are clearly in play. I'm standing by my position that epidemiological studies do not/can not establish causation...(but they aren't designed for that purpose either). They are the genesis of further studies that *do* and *can* establish causation. One day, these studies will be conducted...but I do not believe that day has arrived yet.

But since there have been multiple epidemiological studies showing that people that eat whole grains have reduced incidence of heart disease, diabetes, stroke and other diseases, I choose to be one of those people. Conclusive science? No. Good science? Yes.

Is it good science because it is a stance that you agree and confirms your current beliefs?

No, it's good science because it provides valuable scientific data. And actually, it didn't so much confirm my beliefts as form them. Although, all subsequent studies that I've seen have confirmed them, I would be more than willing to read a study that conflicted with them. I would judge whether I considered the confilcting results good science by who conducted it and what the peer reviewers had to say.

For example, I eat and/or drink soy almost daily. I started doing so after reading a couple of studies showing health benefits. But, there have been subsequent conflicting study results and I consider most of the information valuable. Maybe it's contributing to my health and maybe not. But I've been consuming it regularly long enough to believe it's not doing me harm. Hopefully I'm right.

What do you think of the perception that whole grains are healthy/healthier, therefore people who already are pretty health conscious choose to eat more whole grains, and thus have better health outcomes, not because of whole grains but their lifestyle choices that whole grains may play a small role in or none at all

It's certianly a possibility. It's nearly impossible to eat a diet rich in whole grains and a diet rich in overly processed grains, making it nearly impossible to tell if it is the elimination of the overly processed grains and not the addition of whole grains that provides the health benefits. But, it certainly does suggest that whole grains do not increase risk of disease, so I see no reason to eliminate them from a diet as the Paleo Diet suggests.

Have you ever seen study results suggesting there is increased risk of disease or poor health from eating whole grains?

Not increased risk, at least that was of significance

The high fiber group fared the worst, although not significantly so

http://www.animi-3.com/D75.full.pdf

No better outcomes for polyp prevention for the high fiber/whole grain diet

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM200004203421601

bcattoes

Have you ever seen study results suggesting there is increased risk of disease or poor health from eating whole grains?

Not increased risk, at least that was of significance

The high fiber group fared the worst, although not significantly so

http://www.animi-3.com/D75.full.pdf

No better outcomes for polyp prevention for the high fiber/whole grain diet

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM200004203421601

Am I missing something? I don't see how either of these shows grains to cause increased risk of disease.

Acg67

Have you ever seen study results suggesting there is increased risk of disease or poor health from eating whole grains?

Not increased risk, at least that was of significance

The high fiber group fared the worst, although not significantly so

http://www.animi-3.com/D75.full.pdf

No better outcomes for polyp prevention for the high fiber/whole grain diet

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM200004203421601

Am I missing something? I don't see how either of these shows grains to cause increased risk of disease.

Didn't have the time to find any that showed an increase of risk for disease, if there are any. Just posted two that didn't show any increased benefit to them