guns or no guns?

fiveohmike

And Benjamin Franklin was such a wise man:



"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."

TheFitFireman

I am not sure why her's jams. I have to put slightly hot ammo through it for it to not jam. I thought it would have cleared up after she broke it in, but still no. Oh well...it just likes hot ammo.

Bad part is....she is a fantastic shot now....so I cant mess around with her...or its over ...hahahahaha

LOL better be on your best behavior! You should get your girl into 3-gun, if shes not already that is.

fiveohmike

I am not sure why her's jams. I have to put slightly hot ammo through it for it to not jam. I thought it would have cleared up after she broke it in, but still no. Oh well...it just likes hot ammo.

Bad part is....she is a fantastic shot now....so I cant mess around with her...or its over ...hahahahaha

LOL better be on your best behavior! You should get your girl into 3-gun, if shes not already that is.

She is working on it. She was SUPER anti-gun before we got together. I trained her over the last 3 years.

She is fantastic with a pistol and a rifle, however she has a hard time with the shotgun. Just a bit too much kick with 3" slugs in it.

TheFitFireman

I am not sure why her's jams. I have to put slightly hot ammo through it for it to not jam. I thought it would have cleared up after she broke it in, but still no. Oh well...it just likes hot ammo.

Bad part is....she is a fantastic shot now....so I cant mess around with her...or its over ...hahahahaha

LOL better be on your best behavior! You should get your girl into 3-gun, if shes not already that is.

She is working on it. She was SUPER anti-gun before we got together. I trained her over the last 3 years.

She is fantastic with a pistol and a rifle, however she has a hard time with the shotgun. Just a bit too much kick with 3" slugs in it.

Yeah a big 3" steel slug will give anyone a good kick ha. My shotgun is only 2 3/4", I'm looking at getting a Remington 870 eventually as well.

Sapporo

Wow, love the way this thread reinforces the ignorant gun toting redneck stereotype.
The ignorance of not understanding basic stats per capita (as in adjusted for population difference already) plus calling Canada a frozen wasteland? The racism is great too. Good job guys.

ScottyNoHotty

Wow, love the way this thread reinforces the ignorant gun toting redneck stereotype.
The ignorance of not understanding basic stats per capita (as in adjusted for population difference already) plus calling Canada a frozen wasteland? The racism is great too. Good job guys.

So are you pro-gun or anti?? that was the question....

swordsmith

I'm really neither.
I understand that Amurrica LOVES guns because guns are scary and dangerous and rebellious, which is everything America thinks it is. If Americans want guns, then goddammit they will have guns! And the Bill of Rights protects that.
At the same time, I feel like there needs to be some limitation there. If you're one individual and you have 50 functioning firearms, I'm going to be concerned. I can see having a handgun for protection and a couple shotguns or rifles for hunting, but there's no reason to have a collection of guns (unless they're an actual collection, like of WWII weapons). One person cannot fire more than two guns at once, and the chances he or she would need to fire more than one at once is really negligible, so what is the point of owning so many guns?

Guns are tools. Each one meant for a different task. What if I want to collect Modern firearms? Whats so special about WWII firearms? There's functionally no difference. Whats a couple for hunting? What about shooting sports, the different genres have individual requirements, some up to 3 or 4 different depending on the course.

I said an actual collection, LIKE of WWII weapons. Personally, I don't know anybody who collects modern weapons. Everyone I know with guns fires them, and items that are collected are generally not put to use. However, if you really want to collect modern weapons, fine. The WWII weapons was just an example.
A couple for hunting is a couple for hunting. Maybe you prefer a specific shotgun for one animal and a different shotgun for another and a different rifle for another.
And shooting is a whole different story. That's a sport, not hunting or killing. I'm not going to say somebody shouldn't own multiple types of running shoes, so why should they not have different guns for different courses?
All I was saying is that, personally, I feel that there should be some limitations on the kinds/amount of weapons an individual can own. I'm not saying NO GUNS or ONLY ONE GUN FOR YOU. I'm saying that somebody really has no use for 20 guns and no civilian ever has use for an assault rifle.

I collect modern weapons, another guy on here posted a full gun safe of modern weapons that could be considered a collection... Also, there's purposes to owning a variety of guns and sometimes that means over 20. There is uses for assault rifles as well; home protection not to mention shooting competitions like 3-gun that require the use of an assault rifle. No one type of fire should be banned, all firearms are capable of lethality so that would make no sense banning one over the other. Not to mention these assault rifles you speak of, nearly all of them are semi-automatic just like a pistol, it costs like 10k and a lot of government paperwork to be able to own a fully automatic assault rifle.

I mean, if somebody breaks into my home, I'm not going to put 30 holes into them... If you really feel the need to kill the poor soul who breaks into your home, you can do it with one bullet from a handgun.
And that cost and paperwork are assuming you're buying a fully assembled weapon, right? Wasn't there a series on the History Channel about some guys in Montana or Wyoming who are selling assault rifles that are missing one piece so they aren't considered complete and the government can't do anything about it?

I am trained to shoot multiple rounds into a threat. Why? two main reason- the first is the human body is very very good at "resetting" itself and carrying on when a single traumatic incident occurs to it. Multiple rounds, one on top of the other, tends to overwhelm the bodies reset ability and cause traumatic shock and a shut down. Second is that handgun rounds are extremely poor at actually stopping and killing the threat. Around 85% of people survive pistol gun shots even multiple ones (this is due to the low energy that pistol rounds have in them). Rifle rounds are another matter and your survival rate significantly drops.

Quite frankly if you break into my home you are not a "poor soul"- you are a thief at best and possibly a violent home invader. In any event you are not there because you decided you need to use my bathroom. A threat in my house will be met with lethal force- I do not "shoot to wound" as this does nothing to stop the threat. Putting multiple rounds into them as quickly as possible is what stops the threat- I do not care about a piece of human vermin when my life or my familys life is at stake.

Next lets talk the fallacy of full auto- there is NO legal weapon currently sold that is simply missing "one piece" that can be bought and tossed in to make it full auto. An AR-15 will need a very specific hole drilled into the receiver (the "third pin" to accept the full auto sear. Then almost all of the internals and maybe the bolt needs to be replaced. One could put a lightning link or RDIAS into the weapon but these are controlled and require paperwork as any other full auto does. Shockingly- the semi-auto versions of full-auto weapons are constructed internally to make it impossible to just add a piece and go rock (if it was this easy you WOULD see spree shooters and others with illegal full-autos- logic dictated because you dont then it cant be that easy).

If the guys in Montana were selling modified receivers that would accept full auto parts then guess what- that is illegal. Can someone make an illegal full auto? Yep. Is it easy? Nope- one misdrilled hole, etc and you ruin the receiver and need a new one.

jppd47

I mean, if somebody breaks into my home, I'm not going to put 30 holes into them... If you really feel the need to kill the poor soul who breaks into your home, you can do it with one bullet from a handgun.
And that cost and paperwork are assuming you're buying a fully assembled weapon, right? Wasn't there a series on the History Channel about some guys in Montana or Wyoming who are selling assault rifles that are missing one piece so they aren't considered complete and the government can't do anything about it?

Really, one bullet, form a handgun?!? I take if you have never been in a situation that you had to find that out, if only it were so. Ill give you with proper placement its possible but highly I'm probable.

cherrybomb_77

Secondly, a standard 9mm semi-automatic pistol is a "military-style" weapon. It's called the Beretta M9. In fact the 9mm is a NATO spec cartridge, originally called the 9mm parabellum. Parabellum is latin for war. Furthermore, the most important point is that our gun rights are not about hunting; they are about defending ourselves from criminals and tyrants.

Actually, just bellum is Latin for war. Para would something like to ready or prepare for. So parabellum=prepare for war.

Hellbent_Heidi

If you really feel the need to kill the poor soul who breaks into your home,

Wait.... the POOR SOUL who breaks into your home?? Are we now supposed to be sympathetic to the criminal who has broken the law, trespassed into your bedroom and may or may not plan to rape and kill you?

jaymek92

How did this thread deteriorate from simply stating whether or not you are a fan of guns to posting "gun porn" and attacking everybody who is not all OH MY GOD YES GUNS I LOVE GUNS ALL GUNS EVERY GUN EVERYBODY SHOULD HAVE 39028302387298 GUNS INCLUDING SHOTGUNS AND RIFLES AND FULLY AUTOMATICS BECAUSE THERE IS A SITUATION FOR EVERY TYPE OF GUN AND GODDAMMIT I WILL BE PREPARED! ?
Yeah, I called somebody who breaks into a home a "poor soul." You don't know why they're breaking into your home, and if you shoot to kill, you could be killing a homeless person with a mental problem who really just wanted to raid your fridge. Whoever breaks into your home could be a potential rapist or murderer, but there is a guy in my neighborhood who has something wrong with him and will break into homes to take shoes. I don't really see the need to kill him for that.
Also, I said you can kill with one shot. Not that you will. But honestly, if you're going to be one of those people who really loves guns, you should probably be trained to hit your target anyway.
The fact that there are so many angry people with guns is f*cking scary. You all have your damn guns rights. Nobody is going to take them away from you. Calm your tits.

fiveohmike

How did this thread deteriorate from simply stating whether or not you are a fan of guns to posting "gun porn" and attacking everybody who is not all OH MY GOD YES GUNS I LOVE GUNS ALL GUNS EVERY GUN EVERYBODY SHOULD HAVE 39028302387298 GUNS INCLUDING SHOTGUNS AND RIFLES AND FULLY AUTOMATICS BECAUSE THERE IS A SITUATION FOR EVERY TYPE OF GUN AND GODDAMMIT I WILL BE PREPARED! ?
Yeah, I called somebody who breaks into a home a "poor soul." You don't know why they're breaking into your home, and if you shoot to kill, you could be killing a homeless person with a mental problem who really just wanted to raid your fridge. Whoever breaks into your home could be a potential rapist or murderer, but there is a guy in my neighborhood who has something wrong with him and will break into homes to take shoes. I don't really see the need to kill him for that.
Also, I said you can kill with one shot. Not that you will. But honestly, if you're going to be one of those people who really loves guns, you should probably be trained to hit your target anyway.
The fact that there are so many angry people with guns is f*cking scary. You all have your damn guns rights. Nobody is going to take them away from you. Calm your tits.

How/when do you make the determination if someone is there to break in and raid your fridge or rape you 13 times? Do you strike up a conversation, ask them if they want a beer and determine if they want to kill your son or not?

Hellbent_Heidi

Yeah, I called somebody who breaks into a home a "poor soul." You don't know why they're breaking into your home, and if you shoot to kill, you could be killing a homeless person with a mental problem who really just wanted to raid your fridge. Whoever breaks into your home could be a potential rapist or murderer, but there is a guy in my neighborhood who has something wrong with him and will break into homes to take shoes. I don't really see the need to kill him for that.

Unfortunately, you're not able to make that decision in the dark if you're woken in the middle of the night to an intruder in your private home. I'm NOT advocating 'shoot to kill" at all costs, and if you know gun laws, in most States, you actually have to be (or be able to prove that you had reason to believe you were) in mortal danger to defend shooting someone for stealing your property. Another side to this is that if you don't shoot to kill...say you aim for the kneecaps and want to wound them...you're taking a big gamble that they aren't armed and planning to kill you.

Maybe I'm jaded because I live somewhere between the top two most dangerous cities in the country, but I simply wouldn't want to take that chance that they're just "some poor harmless mental patient". It must be nice to still be so young and naive though....you are lucky!

JustJennie1

How did this thread deteriorate from simply stating whether or not you are a fan of guns to posting "gun porn" and attacking everybody who is not all OH MY GOD YES GUNS I LOVE GUNS ALL GUNS EVERY GUN EVERYBODY SHOULD HAVE 39028302387298 GUNS INCLUDING SHOTGUNS AND RIFLES AND FULLY AUTOMATICS BECAUSE THERE IS A SITUATION FOR EVERY TYPE OF GUN AND GODDAMMIT I WILL BE PREPARED! ?
Yeah, I called somebody who breaks into a home a "poor soul." You don't know why they're breaking into your home, and if you shoot to kill, you could be killing a homeless person with a mental problem who really just wanted to raid your fridge. Whoever breaks into your home could be a potential rapist or murderer, but there is a guy in my neighborhood who has something wrong with him and will break into homes to take shoes. I don't really see the need to kill him for that.
Also, I said you can kill with one shot. Not that you will. But honestly, if you're going to be one of those people who really loves guns, you should probably be trained to hit your target anyway.
The fact that there are so many angry people with guns is f*cking scary. You all have your damn guns rights. Nobody is going to take them away from you. Calm your tits.

I really don't give a s*it if he's a mentally unstable homeless guy breaking into my house to steal shoes or he's there to rape and kill me. I have no idea what this person's intentions are. If I am home alone and someone is breaking into MY house I am going to do whatever I have to do to protect myself because I have NO IDEA who they are or what they are up to.

Why don't you go ahead and tell that to the Petit family who's house was invaded by two men and they raped the mother and daughters and then proceeded to tie them to their beds AND SET THE ****ING HOUSE ON FIRE AND LET THEM BURN ALIVE! Go ahead and tell the man who lost everything in that day that the men who broke down their front door that they were "Just a little mentally unstable and probably there to raid your fridge and steal your shoes."

I don't care WHO'S breaking into my house the fact of the matter is that it is MY house and YOU are unlawfully entering it. Enter at your own ****ing risk because I can not say what you're going to see when you walk up those stairs.

If YOU feel perfectly fine with your family in your house and letting some "harmless" person break in and take whatever they want then power to you. I prefer to protect myself no matter what.

Sockimobi

How did this thread deteriorate from simply stating whether or not you are a fan of guns to posting "gun porn" and attacking everybody who is not all OH MY GOD YES GUNS I LOVE GUNS ALL GUNS EVERY GUN EVERYBODY SHOULD HAVE 39028302387298 GUNS INCLUDING SHOTGUNS AND RIFLES AND FULLY AUTOMATICS BECAUSE THERE IS A SITUATION FOR EVERY TYPE OF GUN AND GODDAMMIT I WILL BE PREPARED! ?
Yeah, I called somebody who breaks into a home a "poor soul." You don't know why they're breaking into your home, and if you shoot to kill, you could be killing a homeless person with a mental problem who really just wanted to raid your fridge. Whoever breaks into your home could be a potential rapist or murderer, but there is a guy in my neighborhood who has something wrong with him and will break into homes to take shoes. I don't really see the need to kill him for that.
Also, I said you can kill with one shot. Not that you will. But honestly, if you're going to be one of those people who really loves guns, you should probably be trained to hit your target anyway.
The fact that there are so many angry people with guns is f*cking scary. You all have your damn guns rights. Nobody is going to take them away from you. Calm your tits.

JustJennie1

You all have your damn guns rights. Nobody is going to take them away from you. Calm your tits.

Actually this statement couldn't be further from the truth.

If our current President can pass a healthcare bill that no one in the House or Senate read -- Nancy Pelosi even said "You'll have to pass the bill in order to see what's in it!" -- who's to say they won't take away any or all of our rights? America is turning into a very scary place and I honestly fear for our future.

JustJennie1

And just so you know, I am not a gun nut.

I am the follwing:

1) A competition sport 3 gun shooter

2) I am prepared for when California has the "Big One". If we have a magnitude 9.0+ earthquake we will be on our own for a good long while. You can laugh all you want, but it can/will happen. Need to be prepared for the looter thugs.


3) Zombies

Don't forget when the dollar collapses and people go ape **** because they can't buy anything and they're trying to raid your house because you were smart and stocked up.

MrsLVF

Pro gun & conceal & carry

swordsmith

Also, I said you can kill with one shot. Not that you will. But honestly, if you're going to be one of those people who really loves guns, you should probably be trained to hit your target anyway.
The fact that there are so many angry people with guns is f*cking scary. You all have your damn guns rights. Nobody is going to take them away from you. Calm your tits.

First off- most gun carriers I have met are actually the most mellow people- very few are angry. The foaming at the mouth angry ones seem, by and large, to be the anti-gunners. Those of us that carry recognize the awesome responsibility strapped to our hip- quite carrying a gun has made me less angry, more understanding and much more likely to defuse or avoid potential situations.

Yes- you can kill with one shot but it's damn difficult. Life is not the movies- the only way to truly kill with one shot is a round to the head ina specific area which is the hardest target to hit on a human. For a true one stop shot you must go through the thin part of head- which is the triangle formed by the eyes and nose or a 2" diameter around the ears. Anywhere else and you risk a non-lethal shot. And distance = a geometric progression of difficulty. Add in moverment of both myself and the threat and the difficulty inreases even more. This is why we shoot center mass (i.e. the body or chest cavity)- its a bigger target full of things needed to keep you going. But even a lethal hit here through the heart would still give the threat roughly 15 seconds to act before he became incapacitated- a LOT of damage can still be done in 15 seconds (see Platt from the 1986 Miami FBI shootout).

Hollywood makes it seem like "bang" your dead. That is not real life - I can head shot a target all day long out to about 12 yards consistently with my pistol. This will help if- God forbid- I ever have a lethal force encounter but I know that in such an encounter my on target rounds percentage will probably drop to the 12% average in a gun fight due to movement, environmental conditions, adrenaline, stress, cover/concealment, background, innocents in the area, and so on.

And sorry- but I still disagree with you. Someone uninvited in my house I am not asking their intentions- the intentions would be pretty damn clear. It takes a special kind of criminal to rob an occupied dwelling- most that do are typically prepared to meet homeowners with force either right off the bat or if they are encountered. I am not stopping to ask and I am not going to try and "arrest them"- they can get on the ground by bleeding out (preferably not on my newly refinished hardwood floors)

swordsmith

Don't forget when the dollar collapses and people go ape **** because they can't buy anything and they're trying to raid your house because you were smart and stocked up.

This ^^

My father owned a gun store and people FLOCKED to it after 9/11 and when riots occurred in a nearby city. It was amazing how many "anti-gun" liberals wanted an AR-15, high cap pistol, etc RIGHT NOW! And they were pissed off when told there would be a two week wait because they did not have a permit- I can still here them wailing "But how am I supposed to protect myself now?"

Should have thought of that before buddy.