Raw Milk Anyone?
Replies
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According to the CDC: "1,837 illnesses, 195 hospitalizations, and 2 deaths" of which, 82% were from raw milk. This is between 1998 and 2009.
now THAT's an interesting statistic. 1837 illnesses and 82% of them were from raw milk? What were the others from? Compared to what? Only 2 deaths between 1998 and 2009? Really? I mean, I thought more than 2 people died A DAY!!!!
context please context. That statistic means nothing.
I'm surprised the entire french population isn't extinct considering the consumption of unpasteurised dairy products they consume......
That statistic means a lot. Less than 3% of the US Population drinks raw milk. (So, that 3% accounting for 82% of illnesses shows a huge risk).
But, it also shows that while the risk is incredibly significantly higher, its not like it will immediately kill you the second you sip raw milk lol. Simply drinking pasteurized milk GREATLY reduces the risks with milk consumption, and is incredibly easy to do (harder to find raw milk!).
If you find the statistics meaningless, you should take a few math classes.
It is an OUT OF CONTEXT statistic. what are the 1837 illnesses referred to? I mean, surely more than that many people get sick during an 11 year period?
Exactly. And we all know the CDC, FDA and USDA never skew any statisistics.
That is what is wrong with America. There are so many sheep that believe the data that the FDA, USDA, and CDC put out. Unbelievable blind sheep. (biggest roll eye)0 -
According to the CDC: "1,837 illnesses, 195 hospitalizations, and 2 deaths" of which, 82% were from raw milk. This is between 1998 and 2009.
now THAT's an interesting statistic. 1837 illnesses and 82% of them were from raw milk? What were the others from? Compared to what? Only 2 deaths between 1998 and 2009? Really? I mean, I thought more than 2 people died A DAY!!!!
context please context. That statistic means nothing.
I'm surprised the entire french population isn't extinct considering the consumption of unpasteurised dairy products they consume......
That statistic means a lot. Less than 3% of the US Population drinks raw milk. (So, that 3% accounting for 82% of illnesses shows a huge risk).
But, it also shows that while the risk is incredibly significantly higher, its not like it will immediately kill you the second you sip raw milk lol. Simply drinking pasteurized milk GREATLY reduces the risks with milk consumption, and is incredibly easy to do (harder to find raw milk!).
If you find the statistics meaningless, you should take a few math classes.
So, according to the 2010 Census, there are 311,591,917 people in the United States. If you are correct and 3% drink raw milk; that is 9,347,757 people consuming raw milk. In roughly 10 years there were only 1506 raw milk related illnesses (82% of 1506). So, less than 2% of raw milk drinkers ever even got sick in 10 years, right? Now, I know this isn't the best, but given my limited time, let's divide the 1506 cases over 10 years; approximately 150 cases per year. I know the US population has changed, but keeping the figure of raw milk drinkers constant; that means that 0.16% of raw milk drinkers in the US even gets ill from it each year.
Let's look at something like regular old eggs. Let's assume that 90% of the US population are egg eaters (280,432,725). The CDC also says that there are 1.4 salmonella cases each year and that eggs are responsible for 75% of those; so 1,050,000 cases each year. So, that's nearly 4% of egg eaters in the US getting sick from salmonella each year!
So, while your statistic is mildly interesting, it must be taken into context. If the average egg eater finds the 4% salmonella rate an acceptable risk; it's not a stretch for the average raw milk consumer to feel safe with a tenth of a percent illness rate. Sure, pasteurized milk is safer, but IMO, if you like raw milk, go for it.0 -
Scroll down to the heading of Milk
http://www.foodmatters.tv/articles-1/dirty-secrets-of-the-food-processing-industry0 -
Raw milk is way less dangerous than that crap stuff they sell in the grocery store. That is NOT milk.
People drank raw milk for eons before the whole pasturization and homogenization process started.
All the hoopla about it being dangerous is a big pile of turds. Also, I grew up on raw milk and had never had store bought milk until I went into the military and found it to be disgustingly gross.Raw milk tastes good - that is the real reason. I used to drink it every once in a while when I could get it from a small farm that is land-held by my MIL. But honestly, it is dangerous. Especially for kids. If you want to take the risk personally - fine. Giving it to children is criminal unless you really know the source.
Pregnant women or those near pregnant women should avoid it too - the real risks, especially in America, around salmonella can be catastrophic. Other risks include listeriosis, E. coli infection, Q-fever and tuberculosis. All nice.
Raw milk is one of the most dangerous food products and is responsible for many more hospitalizations than any other food-related disease outbreak - so take that into consideration.
The issue with raw milk in America is that since it is illegal in about half the states there is limited control or testing in these states. It would be possible to develop a better industry today given the quality of microbial testing but not in that legal and economic environment of volume.
Europe has a different position and raw milk is available in almost all countries. Cheese from raw milk? I would not like to live without it. Love my Comte.0 -
One of the local dairy farms will sell it if you ask....they just have to label it "not for human consumption."
You know you think writing that on the container would be a clue for some people...0 -
One of the local dairy farms will sell it if you ask....they just have to label it "not for human consumption."
You know you think writing that on the container would be a clue for some people...
The label just allows the government to hold dominion over us.
The United States is the most NON-Free country that claims to their citizens to be a free country.
If we were a free country, we would be able to consume raw milk without the government stepping their foot into our business.0 -
Any one here drink it? Do you have any pro/cons?
Just be aware that it does have more of a chance of having bacteria in it compare to pasteurize milk that limits the bacteria in it. I've never tried it but from what I've heard is that if you're not use to, like didn't grow up drinking it, it can upset your stomach and make you feel ill but its suppose to taste better. This is just word of mouth.0 -
I love raw milk and drink it when I can find it....even after a bout of TB as a kid (which I'm still not convinced it was from raw milk even if that was the going theory 40 some odd years ago).0
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One of the local dairy farms will sell it if you ask....they just have to label it "not for human consumption."
You know you think writing that on the container would be a clue for some people...
The label just allows the government to hold dominion over us.
The United States is the most NON-Free country that claims to their citizens to be a free country.
If we were a free country, we would be able to consume raw milk without the government stepping their foot into our business.
They just do what they can to try to save the lives of people who are often too dumb or ill informed to save their own.
I am no less free drinking pasteurized milk. Well that's not true. I'm free from pathogens. I appreciate that.
But we don't need to continue this discussion. You keep thinking the FDA, USDA and CDC are all out to get you. I'll appreciate the work they do to keep people safe. Neither of us will change our minds. One of us is right.
I just need to also add that Louis Pasteur was a genius and the world owes him an eternal debt of gratitude.0 -
I find all milk disgusting...just personal taste. That said.....
As a child, my grandpa would shoot a stream of milk directly from the cows teat into my mouth and I'm still breathing, so I'm pretty sure raw milk doesn't pose some huge health risk. Added to that, raw milk is all my great grandparents ever drank. Grandpa was 98 when he died and grandma was 95, so.....there ya go.0 -
One of the local dairy farms will sell it if you ask....they just have to label it "not for human consumption."
You know you think writing that on the container would be a clue for some people...
The label just allows the government to hold dominion over us.
The United States is the most NON-Free country that claims to their citizens to be a free country.
If we were a free country, we would be able to consume raw milk without the government stepping their foot into our business.
I do think we should be allowed to buy raw milk as long its labeled properly so we know what we are drinking. If they can allow tobacco for purchase they can allow raw milk (I would take my chances with the milk over a cigerrate any day). Allow people to make their own choices as long we are informed properly.0 -
One of the local dairy farms will sell it if you ask....they just have to label it "not for human consumption."
You know you think writing that on the container would be a clue for some people...
The label just allows the government to hold dominion over us.
The United States is the most NON-Free country that claims to their citizens to be a free country.
If we were a free country, we would be able to consume raw milk without the government stepping their foot into our business.
They just do what they can to try to save the lives of people who are often too dumb or ill informed to save their own.
I am no less free drinking pasteurized milk. Well that's not true. I'm free from pathogens. I appreciate that.
But we don't need to continue this discussion. You keep thinking the FDA, USDA and CDC are all out to get you. I'll appreciate the work they do to keep people safe. Neither of us will change our minds. One of us is right.
I just need to also add that Louis Pasteur was a genius and the world owes him an eternal debt of gratitude.
Not that anyone asked, but if the government really gave a *kitten* about what we eat, Monsanto would be out of business.......
That is all.....0 -
Selling of raw milk is currently regulated (read illegal) in MN. Dairy farmers are going to be very reluctant to give or sell you any or even talk to you about it. I would suggest talking to health food stores or local co-ops and trying to find a private supplier that way. You can find people with one or two milk cows willing to trade.
Read this if you're curios as to why: http://minnesota.publicradio.org/display/web/2012/05/11/crime/freeport-raw-milk-case/0 -
In defense of my government, they only enact these laws because some whiny citizen complained about getting sick by drinking raw milk.
Like I said, you will find just as many scientific articles that are PRO raw milk as you do AGAINST raw milk. I think we should be able to have a choice, personally. If we can choose to kill ourselves with tobacco/alcohol, why not milk?0 -
I find all milk disgusting...just personal taste. That said.....
As a child, my grandpa would shoot a stream of milk directly from the cows teat into my mouth and I'm still breathing, so I'm pretty sure raw milk doesn't pose some huge health risk. Added to that, raw milk is all my great grandparents ever drank. Grandpa was 98 when he died and grandma was 95, so.....there ya go.
Cognitive dissonance at its best.0 -
I'm sure raw milk tastes GREAT, it still has all the fat in it from the heavy cream and such that hasn't been separated out.
But I prefer NOT getting sick from milk.0 -
I find all milk disgusting...just personal taste. That said.....
As a child, my grandpa would shoot a stream of milk directly from the cows teat into my mouth and I'm still breathing, so I'm pretty sure raw milk doesn't pose some huge health risk. Added to that, raw milk is all my great grandparents ever drank. Grandpa was 98 when he died and grandma was 95, so.....there ya go.
Cognitive dissonance at its best.
How, exactly, does this demonstrate cognitive dissonance?0 -
I'm sure raw milk tastes GREAT, it still has all the fat in it from the heavy cream and such that hasn't been separated out.
But I prefer NOT getting sick from milk.
Generally speaking it's not the milk exactly that makes a person sick but rather the handling of that milk that causes the problem. Unless you milk an obviously sick cow, or take milk from a tainted teet the milk is fine. Raw milk is like raw meat, it is a bacteria magnet. If it's not cooled properly, stored properly or handled properly it become easily contaminated. This is what the pasteurization process was designed to prevent.
And yes, that is why raw milk has the robust flavor, it has not been skimmed of all the tasty stuff.
This is what always irritates me with these threads, someone asks a simple question and other people have to turn it into a freakin debate or a political soap box instead of providing an educated and informed answer to the question.0 -
buy a cow, raw milk is illigal in some places0
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I find all milk disgusting...just personal taste. That said.....
As a child, my grandpa would shoot a stream of milk directly from the cows teat into my mouth and I'm still breathing, so I'm pretty sure raw milk doesn't pose some huge health risk. Added to that, raw milk is all my great grandparents ever drank. Grandpa was 98 when he died and grandma was 95, so.....there ya go.
Cognitive dissonance at its best.
How, exactly, does this demonstrate cognitive dissonance?
You chose the experience that best fits the conclusion you want to express.
The reality is that in you granparent's time the average life expectancy, partially due to food hygiene, was significantly lower. There ya go.0 -
i have no axe to grind on this but why would you want raw milk over pastuerised milk?
Below is from the FDA
Raw Milk & Pasteurization: Debunking Milk Myths
While pasteurization has helped provide safe, nutrient-rich milk and cheese for over 120 years, some people continue to believe that pasteurization harms milk and that raw milk is a safe healthier alternative.
Here are some common myths and proven facts about milk and pasteurization:
Pasteurizing milk DOES NOT cause lactose intolerance and allergic reactions. Both raw milk and pasteurized milk can cause allergic reactions in people sensitive to milk proteins.
Raw milk DOES NOT kill dangerous pathogens by itself.
Pasteurization DOES NOT reduce milk's nutritional value.
Pasteurization DOES NOT mean that it is safe to leave milk out of the refrigerator for extended time, particularly after it has been opened.
Pasteurization DOES kill harmful bacteria.
Pasteurization DOES save lives.
Better question, why would you let the FDA decide what food to eat or medicines to take?0 -
One of the local dairy farms will sell it if you ask....they just have to label it "not for human consumption."
You know you think writing that on the container would be a clue for some people...
The label just allows the government to hold dominion over us.
The United States is the most NON-Free country that claims to their citizens to be a free country.
If we were a free country, we would be able to consume raw milk without the government stepping their foot into our business.
I do think we should be allowed to buy raw milk as long its labeled properly so we know what we are drinking. If they can allow tobacco for purchase they can allow raw milk (I would take my chances with the milk over a cigerrate any day). Allow people to make their own choices as long we are informed properly.
Exactly! How the hell are we in a free country if you can't choose what you put in your own body?0 -
I find all milk disgusting...just personal taste. That said.....
As a child, my grandpa would shoot a stream of milk directly from the cows teat into my mouth and I'm still breathing, so I'm pretty sure raw milk doesn't pose some huge health risk. Added to that, raw milk is all my great grandparents ever drank. Grandpa was 98 when he died and grandma was 95, so.....there ya go.
Cognitive dissonance at its best.
How, exactly, does this demonstrate cognitive dissonance?
You chose the experience that best fits the conclusion you want to express.
The reality is that in you granparent's time the average life expectancy, partially due to food hygiene, was significantly lower. There ya go.
Thanks for the psychoanalysis.....here I just thought I was expressing an opinion. 0 -
In California you can get it. Mother's sells it and I am sure Whole Foods does. I do not eat dairy but my family does and they have never gotten sick from raw organic milk (or raw butter.) I've had it in the past and never gotten sick either. This is the brand I get: http://organicpastures.com/0
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Thanks for the psychoanalysis.....here I just thought I was expressing an opinion.
No you made a statement. You said that you once tried a small amount of raw milk and that your great-grandparents drank it and lived a long life. Therefore raw milk can't be harmful.
When discussing things like this, important things where bad information can lead to people getting sick and even dying, it's important to really use our brains and listen to the right people.
To use an example you may as well have said, "I drove to the store once and didn't crash my car, my great-grandparents were never in a car accident in their lives. So I guess car accidents don't happen."
Raw milk can and will make people very ill. It really is similar to raw meat. You properly cook any meat before eating it, correct? The same should be done with milk.
I'm happy to let all of you freely drink whatever you would like, none of my business. But when/if you get ill don't clog up a hospital bed that someone with a working brain might need. And don't sue the government for not preventing you from doing what they're trying to prevent you from doing in the first place.0 -
I prefer to be a government brainwashed sheeple on this one and use pasteurized dairy products. I cook meat before I eat it, so have my milk heated before I drink it hardly seems like some dangerous conspiracy to me.
And this has never been a country where you are free to do whatever you want. Ever. That has never been the definition of what a free society means. Laws and taxes, anyone?0 -
Thanks for the psychoanalysis.....here I just thought I was expressing an opinion.
No you made a statement. You said that you once tried a small amount of raw milk and that your great-grandparents drank it and lived a long life. Therefore raw milk can't be harmful.
When discussing things like this, important things where bad information can lead to people getting sick and even dying, it's important to really use our brains and listen to the right people.
To use an example you may as well have said, "I drove to the store once and didn't crash my car, my great-grandparents were never in a car accident in their lives. So I guess car accidents don't happen."
Raw milk can and will make people very ill. It really is similar to raw meat. You properly cook any meat before eating it, correct? The same should be done with milk.
I'm happy to let all of you freely drink whatever you would like, none of my business. But when/if you get ill don't clog up a hospital bed that someone with a working brain might need. And don't sue the government for not preventing you from doing what they're trying to prevent you from doing in the first place.
Actually, no....I eat sushi regularly and when I have a steak or a burger I eat it rare to medium rare.
And I'm not convinced the government is out to get me or steal my rights, but again.....if they honestly gave a damn about what the citizens of this country consumed, there would be no Monsanto or any other genetically engineered seed, meat, whatever.
My statement was my opinion, based on watching not only my great grandparents, but all 13 of their children and all THEIR children grow up on a farm, drinking milk straight from the bucket, eating butter made from that milk, eating cheese made from that milk........for many, many generations back. As another poster said, MY OPINION is that it's not the raw milk, it's the handling of the raw milk, that causes the health concerns.0 -
I love raw milk! Sooo good! I think you should be able to get it at any natural food store in your area. As someone above posted already, there are possible risks with this but there are risks with everything you eat/drink. If you think about it mothers have been breastfeeding their babies with raw, unpasteurized milk since the beginning of time so whats the problem. I dont believe its the raw milk, but the handling of it that could cause a problem It seems only right and natural to drink it raw.0
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Well said!0
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Thanks for the psychoanalysis.....here I just thought I was expressing an opinion.
No you made a statement. You said that you once tried a small amount of raw milk and that your great-grandparents drank it and lived a long life. Therefore raw milk can't be harmful.
When discussing things like this, important things where bad information can lead to people getting sick and even dying, it's important to really use our brains and listen to the right people.
To use an example you may as well have said, "I drove to the store once and didn't crash my car, my great-grandparents were never in a car accident in their lives. So I guess car accidents don't happen."
Raw milk can and will make people very ill. It really is similar to raw meat. You properly cook any meat before eating it, correct? The same should be done with milk.
I'm happy to let all of you freely drink whatever you would like, none of my business. But when/if you get ill don't clog up a hospital bed that someone with a working brain might need. And don't sue the government for not preventing you from doing what they're trying to prevent you from doing in the first place.
Yes, and dairy farmers are keeling over left and right as proof. :noway:0
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