Smokers – selfish scum or persecuted minority?
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There's always a group of smokers right in front of the entrance of my University.
Has always annoyed me like crazy.
We have a huge square in front of our University, and they all have to go stand in a huge group right in front of the entrance.
You actually have to push your way through the group to get into the building and by then you are coughing and smelling of smoke.
When I was in college, there was a smoking area inside, rather than at the entrance. That made it a LOT easier to avoid the smoke. Smoking bans make things worse instead of better.0 -
My best friend and my boyfriend both smoke. Neither do it in my house <I have a screened in porch, and if it's really cold there is the garage>. I don't hate smokers, but your addiction infringes on my breathing. If I am in an enclosed space with a smoker, my throat starts to close up and I have trouble breathing. I grew up with a smoker, I had problems with allergies for my entire childhood and was hospitalized with pneumonia twice. I cannot say these things are directly related but I will never know.
Smoking bans have made it possible and comfortable to eat in public again. If smokers could trade places with someone like me I think they would see this issue differently. Addiction is a terrible thing, but I do NOT understand how anyone under the age of 50 started smoking. It's not like we didn't know smoking kills people. I am 43 years old and do not remember a time when I didn't know smoking was bad for you. It's expensive, it stinks, and it causes cancer. What is the appeal?0 -
MDWilliams: This, along with a gazillion other things easily searched on the internet should provide you with the proof you need that second-hand smoke is deadly and dangerous to everyone. I hope that you will do a small amount or reading and realize that you should change your tune on this issue. If not... then I don't know what to tell you. I'm bowing out before things get mean spirited. I feel like the arguments are just going in circles at this point.
http://www.epa.gov/smokefre/healtheffects.html
There's no citation of any scientific study on that page.0 -
Smoking is way more healthy than diet coke.0
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I'm an ex-smoker and I have to say that I absolutely LOVE the smoking bans that they have put in place every where. I can finally go to a bar/restaurant and actually see and taste what I'm eating. When I go out to a club I don't have to play "Dodge the Cigarette" on the dance floor. Not only that but I don't come home smelling like an ash tray or feeling like I smoked a carton of cigs that night.0
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I am going through this thread and I am not sure it's been brought up but, in my experience, smokers tend to litter. A LOT. In that respect, I would say they are selfish scum.0
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Here in the town I live in I have seen businesses go out of business due to the smoking ban. Bowling allies are getting crushed. Smokers are not going to spend their money at a place, spend 4-5 hours there and not be able to smoke.
I find this very hard to believe... i live in the UK weve had a smoking ban here for several 4? years now, I remember being afraid i was going to get burnt when i went to the bar in a club, and the smell of clothing when i got home, blegh!. I saw NO businesses suffering from the smoking ban... if its the same rule anywhere people are still going to go...every smoker hasnt become some kind of recluse, not daring to leave their home because they wont be able to smoke *rolls eyes*
So true. That is just drama and exaggeration. The smokers I know just altered their behavior and adapted to the new rules. They didn't stop going out and doing things.
In my city, most of the restaurants on the west side of town closed down, and all but one bar, and it has a patio where you can take your drink with you. It is illegal to step outside with your drink, and it's illegal to smoke your cigarette while inside. So what's the point of a bar at this point? House parties have increased on this side of town, for sure.
On the east side of town, it is a lot of national chains and their corporate money has helped them stay afloat. (Interestingly, these same chains have received TIF as well so they aren't even paying taxes. It's no wonder the city is going bankrupt.)
I know in some places, people are fine to just finish their drink, then go outside for a cigarette, then back inside and order a new drink, but those are the ones with no vehicles that live in the inner-city and Midtown. The suburbanites trek over to the towns without bans, towns that AREN'T going bankrupt right now, btw.0 -
I don't see why they have to be one or the other. How about they like to smoke? It's their vice, and their choice! I don't really care what someone wants to do with their own body. That's the problem with America, people think its their job to be in other people business, when it is in fact, none of their business. As long as they follow the laws, about where to smoke (sorry, thats out of my hands) then who f**king cares!?!?0
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It is air pollution that kills...they and others in proximity. Should others not be protected from an environmental TOXIN that they do not desire. AFTER ALL THIS COUNTRY BANNED DDT FROM BEING SPRAYED IN THE STREETS TO KILL INSECTS WHEN IT WAS DISCOVERED THAT IT WAS TOXIC TO HUMANS!!!
YES, Selfish is not the right word (s) for them.
Dont even get me started on DDT. Do you kow how many millions of people have died because of the ban on DDT. Research it. But again, if you dont want to breathe smoke, dont go to places that allow smoking. Why do so many people think they are special?
Why are smokers so special that their deadly disgusting habbit becomes a right to bother others?0 -
If you aren't a selfish scum smoker, then you will go out of your way to not inflict your smoke on others who do not want it, regardless of what studies you choose to quote. The fact that others don't want to be around it should be enough, for the considerate smoker, to be considerate.
If you are a persecuted smoker, perhaps it's because you or your brethren are selfish scum, and society needs to compensate by passing laws forcing you to be considerate.0 -
Can't stand when people smoke in front of kids. It should be a form of child abuse, if not attempted murder. Makes me sick to think any PARENT would put there child in harms way.
That is absolute insanity. First of all, a persons kids are their kids not yours. Second, there is not a single study anywhere in the world that proves that second hand smoke is as dangerous as people try to make it out to be. My advice, worry about your own kids and stay out of other peoples business.
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Tobacco/ETS
Actually, there are quite a few studies. Many of them done by the government. If they weren't worried about it, why would they be banning it in so many establishments? It's obvious you have a very firm point of view about this, but there are 2 sides for everyone's view.0 -
I don't smoke. But I don't understand people that feel like they have the right to tell other people how to live their life or raise their children. Loving caring families can include smokers. I personally don't see someone walking by me smoking as having more impact than the polluted air I breath, and surely less than the exhaust fumes I suck in everyday running.
I have many family members who smoke, and I love them very much.
There is a grey area in this discussion. If you don't see it, you're part of the problem.0 -
Can't stand when people smoke in front of kids. It should be a form of child abuse, if not attempted murder. Makes me sick to think any PARENT would put there child in harms way.
But drinking in front of kids, or verbal/physical/emotional abuse of your SO in front of them (such as I experienced) is PERFECTLY acceptable, right?
I don't smoke, I don't like the smell or taste of it, and it makes me sick. However, I'm not going to tell someone else they can't do it just because *I* don't like it.0 -
Non smoker here .. My mom and her husband are smokers and most of my friends for that matter so it doesn't bother me much. I agree that the anti-smoking campaigns are out of control. Until the government tells us "we can't" then exercise your right to smoke! Just be mindful of the people who don't around you please
Cheers!0 -
I totally agree also with people who say it is their own business.... I am a smoker and I do not have kids at home (they are all grown). when My grandkids come over I do not smoke in the house or anywhere near them. I am so sick of people griping about smokers when there are so many other ILLEGAL things people do and they are not the minority like smokers are.0
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Bottom line is this. You cant have it both ways. You can not say that the government should ban this and that and then say they should stay out of your life. If you think the government should have the right to tell me that I cant smoke, then dont be upset when the same government tells you what you can and cant eat. Or who you can and cant marry. Dont tell me that you have a right to an abortion because its your body but I dont have a right to smoke. It makes zero sense. Wake up people. Eventually, something you enjoy is going to be banned and youre going to be pissed. And guess what? Nobody will care because we allow the government and the busy bodies to dictate what we can and cant do. If I want to allow smoking in my house, that my business, you dont like it, too bad, dont come over. If I want to allow smoking in my place of business thats my choice, you dont like it? Too bad, go somehwere else.
You can't be this dumb. NONE of those other things affect the health of other people, smoking does.0 -
I think smoking is selfish and disgusting, and I am 100% behind any moves to have it banned in certain areas.0
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Bottom line is this. You cant have it both ways. You can not say that the government should ban this and that and then say they should stay out of your life. If you think the government should have the right to tell me that I cant smoke, then dont be upset when the same government tells you what you can and cant eat. Or who you can and cant marry. Dont tell me that you have a right to an abortion because its your body but I dont have a right to smoke. It makes zero sense. Wake up people. Eventually, something you enjoy is going to be banned and youre going to be pissed. And guess what? Nobody will care because we allow the government and the busy bodies to dictate what we can and cant do. If I want to allow smoking in my house, that my business, you dont like it, too bad, dont come over. If I want to allow smoking in my place of business thats my choice, you dont like it? Too bad, go somehwere else.
You can't be this dumb. NONE of those other things affect the health of other people, smoking does.
Well, one could argue that abortion does.0 -
I guess I am selfish scum.
I don't blow my smoke in someone’s face. When kids come around in a public place I move away from them or put my cigarette out. I have this nifty thing called an ashtray, so I tend to not litter.
I understand why people don’t want to be around it, so I move myself away from them. Looks like most people have been around a lot of ahole smokers.0 -
With any group you have responsible, curtious folks that care if you are or aren't and take your feelings into consideration.
Then there's others who don't care and will do what they are going to do.
This is with anything in our society. I grew up in a house with chain smokers, I chose not to smoke because of constant sinus infections and such. That doesn't mean I don't step foot back in my parents home or visit them... it just means that when I get home I put my clothes directly in the wash. They also know it bothers me and try to take it outside or in another room while i'm there... curtious!
What I don't like is when there is a posted sign at work for folks to be 25 feet away and when you go on break they are all right by the door... especially on bad weather days... 20 brands is not cool.0 -
I smoke. No i do not smoke anywhere near my children and I always have a hoodie or something over my clothing so I can take it off and not have smoke on my clothing. Also I agree with the no smoking in public places. People who have asthma and such it could really harm them. I dont smoke near anyone who doesnt smoke. My neighbor doesnt smoke, and I will go down the driveway away from her because she has breathing problems so I dont want to cause any harm to her or her kiddos.0
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As someone who feels ill around cigarette smoke, I consider smoking to be a public nuisance. Your addiction should not trump my ability to breathe. So, yes, I am in favor banning smoking in public places, just like I am in favor public noise ordinances and open bottle laws. That said, I don't understand people who feel the need to "enlighten" smokers about the dangers of their habit.
So you think you have the right to tell me I cant allow smoking in my own restaurant?
I see your point. BUT- there are more non smokers in the world than smokers. There is an Irish Pub that opened up very close to where we used to live. I was so excited, we could WALK to a bar, and both drink, and have good beer, and chill. AWESOME. Then I found out it was attached to a cigar shop, and you were allowed to smoke in there. So we didn't go. And a LOT of people don't go. I personally think their business would be better if they kept the 2 separate.
That being said, when I was younger, there was a smoking section (the bar), with doors that always remained closed, and the non smoking section (usually the tables) at the restaurant. I personally think that was a happy medium. It stunk when the door opened, yes, but usually that door was far away from tables etc.
I think the hiccup comes in at the "bar" scene. You can't have 2 bars, one for smoking, and one for not smoking. And because there are more nonsmokers, they went that route. Should it be a law? That I can't speak to. I personally appreciate it being a law, but once again, I don't necessarily know if it should be. I can make an informed decision on where I go, just like everyone else.
We walked by a smoker on the sidewalk in a big open shopping plaza last week. I saw them coming, and I held my breath. No need to be obnoxious. She was away from the door to a shop. I personally think smoking is gross, but I'm not going to stop anyone from doing it. It is their body.0 -
Smoking causes more cancer than people believe. It is not only lung, but it is also the number one reason for bladder cancer. I am nurse, and have you seen anyone die from lung cancer. It is horrible.
My biggest pet peeve is seeing a smoker toss their butts out of the car windows, the earth is not your freaking ashtray...and keep your windows rolled up so I do not have to breathe any of that in.
Thats all.0 -
Wow, just a ton of ignorant statements bundling all smokers as 'scum' and 'selfish'.
That's pretty sad and immature.0 -
Definitely depends on the person. I used to smoke and did feel persecuted against. While I haven't smoked in years (and no plans to start), my husband is still a smoker (about 2 packs a day) and I feel he is very selfish. He's taken vacation savings money to buy cigarettes. He's bounced my car payment check because he'd rather buy his 2 packs a day and gas station starbucks drinks and beer than be responsible (he spends about $15 per day between cigarettes and junk food). I stopped working out last winter because he would come into the garage and smoke while I was doing my workouts - making it hard to breath with all that smoke. He leaves cigarette butts EVERYWHERE - including one that melted a huge hole in my workout mat in the garage.
There are considerate smokers out there - our neighbor waves away her smoke if it's going towards someone else and she always uses an ashtray, but there are the ones out there (i.e. my husband) who only cares about himself and his habit. BTW.....kissing a smoker is definitey the equivalent of licking an ashtray - we don't kiss much because it's nauseating to taste and smell his smoking.0 -
I love the smoking ban. I'm an ex-smoker and gave up after the ban came into place in the UK. The ban hasn't adversely affected the social lives of me or my friends - we all go out just as we did before and to most of the same places.
I do think that smokers get a far worse rap than they should. Everybody has a vice, we shouldn't be utterly vilified for it.0 -
I don't really think somebody is selfish or whatever if they smoke, and I don't generally take issue with it, unless I'm dating them (I wouldn't date a smoker). But I have plenty of friends and family members who smoke. I've said my piece about it to all of them, they're all aware of the side effects, the risks, and the unpleasant things that go along with smoking, and it's their choice if they wanna continue or not, no big deal. I don't allow people to smoke in my car or home, and there has been a smoking ban in place here for quite some time now. Nobody's really raised much of a fuss about it either, people don't seem to mind having to go outside to smoke (especially since most bars and restaurants here have patios where smoking is allowed, or they have an approved separate area with its own ventilation system for an indoor smoking area), and I know my dining/going out experience is significantly better not having to inhale smoke the entire time. I can't tell you the number of times I got burned by people's cigarettes at bars when I was younger and it was still legal here. I actually get confused when I go places that don't have smoking bans and people are smoking inside a restaurant or something!
While I understand the point of view that it should be the owner of whatever establishment's choice whether or not to allow smoking, I don't agree. Bars and restaurants have to abide by mandated health codes, licensing laws, etc, and I don't see this as any different. If somebody else wants to poison themselves, that's their choice, but I shouldn't be forced to do it too. I'm also not ok with smoking in close proximity to children, or in the car with a child (which is illegal here as well).
Growing up my dad smoked inside our house and in the car, and it was awful. I got teased at school because I smelled like smoke all the time. I would stuff a towel under my door frame and open my windows all the time when I was home in an attempt to vent my room of the smoke smell, but the entire house just smelled like an ash tray. Never smoked cigarettes in my life, but my signature scent in high school was "perfume and cigarette smoke" as one of my friends put it. Gross.
All of that said, I will tell y'all, that watching a close family friend die extremely quickly of stage 4 lung cancer, due to a 35 year smoking habit, was really heart breaking, especially since, as far as we could tell, it was preventable. No history of cancer in her family. She had been advised by her doctor to quit years ago because she was already dealing with emphysema, she never quit, and her cancer progressed so quickly we barely even had time to say goodbye. She left behind a 21 year old daughter, and a husband who doesn't even know what to do with himself now because he's so depressed. Maybe it was inevitable that she would get cancer, maybe it wasn't, but I hardly think her smoking habit was irrelevant.0 -
Definitely depends on the person. I used to smoke and did feel persecuted against. While I haven't smoked in years (and no plans to start), my husband is still a smoker (about 2 packs a day) and I feel he is very selfish. He's taken vacation savings money to buy cigarettes. He's bounced my car payment check because he'd rather buy his 2 packs a day and gas station starbucks drinks and beer than be responsible (he spends about $15 per day between cigarettes and junk food). I stopped working out last winter because he would come into the garage and smoke while I was doing my workouts - making it hard to breath with all that smoke. He leaves cigarette butts EVERYWHERE - including one that melted a huge hole in my workout mat in the garage.
THIS0 -
Cool I just wrote a novel. Don't worry, it won't hurt my feelings if y'all don't read all that.0
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I love the smoking ban. I'm an ex-smoker and gave up after the ban came into place in the UK. The ban hasn't adversely affected the social lives of me or my friends - we all go out just as we did before and to most of the same places.
I do think that smokers get a far worse rap than they should. Everybody has a vice, we shouldn't be utterly vilified for it.
I completely agree with you. Everyone has a vice, some are just more dangerous than others.0
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