Water intake, Does Tea count and Coffee???

SueInAz

Water is a diuretic too, though. Not true? Go drink 2 gallons of water and then try to avoid peeing.

This made me LOL.

I was also thinking after my original post about putting sugar into water, something we did in a middle school chemistry class. The teacher was making the point that when you add sugar to water, that the sugar is suspended into the water, not a part of it. You can't see it until you added too much sugar and the solution "collapsed" and the sugar started reforming at the bottom of the glass. If you let the solution evaporate, you were left with... sugar! It's how they make rock candy, after all, you just add a string to the solution for the sugar to form around while the water evaporates.

Sugar + water = sugar + water not some strange new chemical compound. The same is true of tea, coffee, Crystal Light or whatever you choose to add to your water.

kmorganlfc

Sugar + water = sugar + water not some strange new chemical compound. The same is true of tea, coffee, Crystal Light or whatever you choose to add to your water.

Of course. That's because there is a PHYSICAL PROCESS taking place and not a CHEMICAL REACTION.

I'n 50 years of age and I knew this at the age of eleven. I'm astounded by some peoples absolute lack of understanding basic scientific principles. I think what may be confusing people can also be linguistic. Because we call the solution of coffee+water simply coffee (which masks the water component) it becomes, in their minds, a new entity = coffee.

You can filter out the coffee from the water using paper filters and be left with coffee powder and pure water, and guess what? Your intestines can do the same thing too, and they do it all the time.

babeinthemoon

Okay, so I just laughed so hard reading this whole thread that I got my ab workout in for the day.

I also drank 16 oz of tea (meyer lemon from Stash), and 20 oz of water w/ a very small amount of crystal light "pure" added to it... Oh, and don't forget my breakfast smoothie that had 10 oz of water too. So.... I either drank 0 water, or over 5 cups worth...

Hmmm. I guess I'll just go update my water tracker and call it good! Besides, it's time for lunch! Gotta go put some food ontop of the water that is in my stomach. :laugh: :laugh:

FredDoyle

Gotta go put some food ontop of the water that is in my stomach. :laugh: :laugh:

Don't!!
You'll die of dehydration donchaknow.

kaklos

I don't see any reason why you couldn't add coffee and tea to your water intake, as long as you're logging the coffee and tea into your daily calories, and being sure to add any milk, sugars, creamer, etc. as well.

I drink coffee every morning with protein powder added as a creamer and SF syrup. I log each item and I count it as water. Throughout the day, I drink water with flavor packs added to it. I log the flavor packs and I count it as water! I feel as long as I am counting the added calories I am still getting the liquid intake!

Blondie_05

Water = Water.
I log everything else as the actual item.

Coffee is logged as coffee, tea is logged as tea, etc.

Water is logged as water.

^ Same..

kmorganlfc

Just realised, there are some posts on here that say that OXIDATION takes place between chemicals in tea and the oxygen in the water. If this is true, then hydrogen would be left over. Wow!!! we've solved a major world energy problem. Car engines have been designed to run on hydrogen, which can be very environmentally friends as the only waste product is water (oops, I think that may confuse some people). The primary reason why these engines havent really taken off is because there isnt a geat abundance of hydrogen floating around the atmosphere that can be used as fuel. It can be seperated from water which sounds great given all the water there is on the planet. But the only problem with that is the seperation procedure requires far more energy to perform that can ever be gained from the resulting hydrogen.

But after reading this thread, I'm going to make sure I get that patent off first for simply extracting hydrogen from water by mixing it with tea or coffee. Something tellsme this isnt quite right, though. As hydrogen is naturally very volatile and I've never seen a kitchen explode after brewing a cup.

SueInAz

Just realised, there are some posts on here that say that OXIDATION takes place between chemicals in tea and the oxygen in the water. If this is true, then hydrogen would be left over. Wow!!! we've solved a major world energy problem. Car engines have been designed to run on hydrogen, which can be very environmentally friends as the only waste product is water (oops, I think that may confuse some people). The primary reason why these engines havent really taken off is because there isnt a geat abundance of hydrogen floating around the atmosphere that can be used as fuel. It can be seperated from water which sounds great given all the water there is on the planet. But the only problem with that is the seperation procedure requires far more energy to perform that can ever be gained from the resulting hydrogen.

But after reading this thread, I'm going to make sure I get that patent off first for simply extracting hydrogen from water by mixing it with tea or coffee. Something tellsme this isnt quite right, though. As hydrogen is naturally very volatile and I've never seen a kitchen explode after brewing a cup.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

barkin43

I've said it before on these debates, but I'll throw my two cents in again - I only count water as water. Big picture, I might look at other stuff I drink during the day as "fluid intake", but only water gets logged as water in my book, and I drink black coffee & unsweetened iced tea, no significant calories.

But drinking coffee & tea all day does not make my urine light yellow or clear like water does. And the first time I donated blood, it was spur of the moment at a blood drive, and I had had nothing but cereal and coffee that morning. They had a rough time finding my vein, and when they finally got it, filling that pint took forEVER! They asked if I'd had any water to drink that morning, and I told them no, just coffee. They all nodded knowingly and said a-ha!

Now when I donate blood (and since I've made it a habit to drink water before I even get to my coffee in the morning), I make sure I've had plenty of water first, and I'm often in and out of the chair before people who started their pint before I did.

So yeah, drinking fluids is important, and we get water from other sources (food, other drinks, etc), but for logging, just water is water. And 8 glasses a day isn't a magic number, but a guideline - as others have said, drink enough to keep your pee the right color - if its dark yellow, you need more water, if it's clear, you could probably back off. If it's hot out, you'll need more, if it's cold, you might need less. If you're thirsty, by all means, have a glass of water. :bigsmile:

whatever you are doing is obviously working great cuz you look mahvelous! :drinker: :drinker: :drinker:

ArroganceInStep

Just realised, there are some posts on here that say that OXIDATION takes place between chemicals in tea and the oxygen in the water. If this is true, then hydrogen would be left over. Wow!!! we've solved a major world energy problem. Car engines have been designed to run on hydrogen, which can be very environmentally friends as the only waste product is water (oops, I think that may confuse some people). The primary reason why these engines havent really taken off is because there isnt a geat abundance of hydrogen floating around the atmosphere that can be used as fuel. It can be seperated from water which sounds great given all the water there is on the planet. But the only problem with that is the seperation procedure requires far more energy to perform that can ever be gained from the resulting hydrogen.

But after reading this thread, I'm going to make sure I get that patent off first for simply extracting hydrogen from water by mixing it with tea or coffee. Something tellsme this isnt quite right, though. As hydrogen is naturally very volatile and I've never seen a kitchen explode after brewing a cup.

You clearly haven't been at my home on the mornings I make myself a cup of coffee and forget to make my wife one.

0utrider

I just poured a gallon of brewed tea over my head and I am completely dry! Tea is not water.

Graelwyn75

Think about this logically: Adding tea (or any flavoring) to water does not change the water into anything else.

Many people choose not to count those things, but their bodies still recognize the water.

And LMAO at classifying tea as "garbage."

Yes. I've given up trying to convince people of this obvious fact. The logically challenged will still spout their nonsense.

and spend their lives fretting about the dangerous qualities of tea and other non 'pure' fluids.
Good grief, do people want to spend what little time they have here, fussing over things like that?
I can understand when it comes to soda or too many milky, sugary drinks, but tea?

Lake_Po

Decaf tea and coffee are not water, but they are hydrants for your body. Regular are not because caffeine dehydrates you.

kmorganlfc

Decaf tea and coffee are not water, but they are hydrants for your body. Regular are not because caffeine dehydrates you.

When you look at a cup of hot coffee or tea, what is that thin, white misty stuff that rises from the top of it. I'l tell you. It's STEAM, and STEAM is water. If you let it drift onto something cool,it will condense into WATER.

This is basic, basic science.

Yogi_Carl

9 pages and still raging! I'm going for a cuppa!

edit: sorry - now 10 pages!

kmorganlfc

9 pages and still raging! I'm going for a cuppa!

edit: sorry - now 10 pages!

lol, I've begun to cry for the world


A new example:

If someone takes some cooked chicken and some cooked potatoes and blitzed them together in a food mixer, it's still ok to log them seperately as potatoes and cooked chicken.

This is pretty much what happens when you add tea or coffee to water. The coffee molecules float around the water molecules. They dont react chemically with one another; they just stay in solution. This is what a solution is. It' not a new chemical compount. It's a bit like having 10 white pool balls and 10 black pool balls and mixing them up in a bag. They dont turn into grey pool balls. They are just white and black ones mixed together.

I'm not sure if this can be made any simpler to understand.

agthorn

Decaf tea and coffee are not water, but they are hydrants for your body. Regular are not because caffeine dehydrates you.

Does anyone read the thread before they post anymore? This has been debunked in this thread at least 10 times. Caffeine is not a diuretic in reasonable amounts that 95%+ of us drink!!!

Matt_Wild

It contains 99% water. Yes.

fromnebraska

I think we can all agree that water is water...it's just sometimes my water has tea particles floating in it.

Briko3

If you want to get really technical, Chemistry wise, water can only equal water. Tea has over 2,000 chemical compounds in it. So, by adding tea to your water, you are changing the chemical make-up of the water thus making it no longer water but tea.

So, tea is NOT water.

Note: (added) MFP doesn't ask for "liquids", it asks for "Water".

But the water in which you brew the tea does not cease to be water when you add tea, on a molecular level. So, while the tea is not water, the water it's in is still water.

Lol, wrong again. Yes, I'm in college chemistry. It is actually a chemical reaction because it relies on the chemical properties of water and of the substances in the tea leaf. These substances-tannins, caffeine, and many others-dissolve in the hot water. The heat accelerates the reaction, but it is not a physical change. (Try steeping a tea bag in cold water-eventually you will get tea, although it will taste a bit different, probably because heat affects the dissolution of the various substances at different rates.) It's a chemical reaction therefore it does change the molecular properties of the water. Don't you just love how people try to sound smart, when they have no clue what they are talking about?

What college is teaching you that crap? That along with your comment about how you can become dehydrated by drinking coffee makes you sound like a genius. So what you're saying, is if I drink 8 ounces of coffee, I will pee out more than 8 ounces in response? You really believe that?

Briko3

Just adding a tea bag to water, will of course not change the molecular structure of water, boiling the water while making tea will. The six catechin-derived polyphenols in tea leaves (C, EC, ECG, GC, EGC, and EGCG) are oxidized by the enzyme PPO (The firing of the leaves heats the enzymes to their peak activity rate). The catechins first form intermediate compounds called orthoquinones that are very unstable and reactive.The orthoquinones then combine in pairs in a series of condensation reactions. They can function as either hydrogen acceptors or hydrogen donors. The combinations can happen through C-O or C-C bonds. The compounds formed are called theaflavins (TF), which are larger molecules and are unique in chemistry. The catechins react in pairs to form six theaflavins. Some theaflavins are brighter and brisker than others showing that the quality of the tea depends not just on the polyphenol count, but the compostion of the catechins and the availability of PPO. The TFs are unstable and further oxidize through the action of PO. They then form thearubigins (TR). TRs are much larger and more complex. Their chemical structure is yet unknown . The compounds though, have a high complexation affinity with metals like Al and Mn, and alkaloids like caffeine. Thearubigins are largely responsible for the flavor, aroma, and color of the liqueur; some make it brighter and brisker, others dull.

Notice such words as "oxidation," "hydrogen acceptors," and "hydrogen donors." All indicate a chemical reaction between the tea and water. To simplify this, if it was a "physical" reaction, you could draw the tea out of the water by reverse osmosis like you could get the salt, sugar, or even lemon juice out of water.

Haha...you look at an angelfire.com site (http://www.angelfire.com/pro/chemist_emily_f/chemistsinabigworld.html) for your "college research"? Seriously?

RhineDHP

Is caffiene a diuretic? Yes.

Has it been proven you can live on tea, coffee, soda with no water intake at all? Yes.

Is arguing over how someone chooses to track their water itake stupid? Yes.

I don't care how others choose to log it. Where I have a problem is when those people who think "only water is water" insist that everyone log exactly the way they do. Someone asked a genuine question and deserves a genuine, true answer based on science.

If you don't want to log anything but water as water, don't. But don't tell me I'm wrong if I do.

I should say that can be turned around as well. If you do want to log other stuff besides water as water, then do. But don't tell people they're wrong if they don't.

RhineDHP

Also, to OP. I think you've seen some pretty.....heated debates on both sides. Ultimately its up to you to decide if you'd like to log beverages such as tea or coffee as water. It won't be the end of the world should you choose one side over the other!

rml_16

Is caffiene a diuretic? Yes.

Has it been proven you can live on tea, coffee, soda with no water intake at all? Yes.

Is arguing over how someone chooses to track their water itake stupid? Yes.

I don't care how others choose to log it. Where I have a problem is when those people who think "only water is water" insist that everyone log exactly the way they do. Someone asked a genuine question and deserves a genuine, true answer based on science.

If you don't want to log anything but water as water, don't. But don't tell me I'm wrong if I do.

I should say that can be turned around as well. If you do want to log other stuff besides water as water, then do. But don't tell people they're wrong if they don't.

I never have told people they were wrong for not. I have told them they were wrong for telling others who want to do so not to.

Brittany3914

If you really think about it, I'm sure tea and coffee could be considered water, but I always log them individually (I like seeing how much coffee/tea I drink on any given week and how it affected my weight loss). Some coffee has calories in it (minimal, but still). Do whatever is best for you

derkacs

Coffee dehydrates your body! Only tea and water should be recorded.

Matt_Wild

Coffee dehydrates your body! Only tea and water should be recorded.

Do you know how much caffeine is needed to dehydrate you?

Not in several cups of tea or coffee.

Pelly57

If coffee is such a great diuretic, explain to me why I have been drinking 6-8 cups of black coffee a day for years, but still have to take two different water pills because of extreme water retention in my lower extremities? (And yes, I have been put through a battery of tests to make sure nothing else is going on) And no, I don't log coffee or tea as long as its black.

jaygreen55

"Only water is water" - Everyone who doesn't have an elementary-school-level understanding of chemistry.

If you had any understanding of chemistry and/or nutrition you would know that tea and coffee are 99 percent + water and that any fluids you consume (including the water content of food you eat) work towards hydrating your body

AnvilHead

Coffee dehydrates your body! Only tea and water should be recorded.

Do you know how much caffeine is needed to dehydrate you?...

...or how many times that piece of false information (that caffeinated drinks will dehydrate you) has been parroted (and debunked) in this thread?

I guess it's like the "no eating after 7 pm" thing - an old wives' tale that just won't die.