Fatism
Replies
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I teach my kids that when they see something that is wrong and they don't stand up to do what's right, they are just as guilty. The attitude that someone else should have said something is just not right.0
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People have allergies and sensitivities to smoke, cigarettes, whatever. What harms do obesity cause in a society? What about society's need to be thin, and not healthy? I think most people don't understand how to eat properly, what nutrition is, and what actually it takes to make your body healthy, and strong. That's society's harm - causing obesity.
Also, who to say these people were overeating? They may have made room in their "allowance" or buying it for someone else - their work, a party, something.
People have the same sensitivities to peanut dust, shall we continue banning those? Already many kids and airline flyers aren't allowed nuts because some people are allergic. How far shall we take this?
And as was said above obese people raise insurance premiums for everyone else. The same argument used against smokers. So we can continue this trend, blaming everyone else for their own personal choices affecting insurance rates, OR remember that freedom to live our lives as we choose is actually a pretty important thing. Even if it means some people are momentarily inconvenienced or annoyed.
What? Where is "peanut dust" or "banning" even coming from? Two people walking down the street holding pizza doesn't harm anyone like someone walking down the street smoking a cigarette could harm them. That was the argument, not about magical peanut dust floating around.
There's a difference between being "momentarily annoyed" that someone is smoking and being annoyed that you see an overweight person holding a pizza. The whole health insurance point is COMPLETELY off topic. If you really think making a joke about someone being a "whale" or making fun of a stranger is acceptable then that's really disgusting, and hateful.
Once again, it's NOT OK to make fun of someone for a problem that they have. I would find offense in the described facebook posting. I don't like things like that and I certainly don't make fun of others for a problem that I struggle with myself.
The reason the discussion has taken this turn is because the OP described obesity as a "lifestyle" and compared it to being gay or Muslim. She is saying it's inherently part of who you are and not a series of decisions that you have made. That's what sparked the discussion.
I don't agree with the relating obesity to sexuality, religion or race. I agree that it's completely not the same. I think there's a lot of "wandering" off topic talking about health insurance.0 -
Perhaps, but both are societal health concerns. Both cause my health care premiums to go up.
Ah I love this argument!
Because overweight people think you should be accepting of them and not say a negative word. But non-smokers want all the smokers to just go away and die already.
Everyone wants tolerance and respect for however they personally choose to live their lives, and they want whatever they don't like to be banned entirely.
OR we could all just let each other live in peace already.
I have said it many times, usually those screaming "Tolerance" the loudest don't have any for anyone else. Rock on.
You're wrong this time, sorry Brute - Brett is plenty tolerant.
Silly woman I'm pretty sure he was agreeing with me...
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Everyone has an opinion. Take the higher road with yours.0
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I teach my kids that when they see something that is wrong and they don't stand up to do what's right, they are just as guilty. The attitude that someone else should have said something is just not right.
Yup. I speak up when I see/hear things like this. I don't care if it's family, friends, stranger. Silence can be perceived as acceptance or agreement.0 -
Don't click on these links then
http://bmdarchives.xfitflaws.com/2011/11/09/fat-acceptance-is-unacceptable/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eTKpVM5jpE
That first one is hilarious. I've always hated the "big is beautiful" mentality if nothing else because those words are almost always followed skinny bashing. I definitely don't think people should like me because I'm big. I'm just me, no matter the size, but I'll live longer if I'm healthier and skinnier. Working on it.0 -
I pose this question: why is it more acceptable to criticize people who smoke but not people who overeat?
Uh. Second hand smoke. Some stranger's choice to eat pizza doesn't harm you.
Not to be rude, but you haven't flown lately?
Look, jack***es are going to be there and to try to say "why is this acceptable and not this" is a bit of a silly game. FB and social media in general are full of racist, sexist, homophobic, anti-fat, anti-everything rants. Either say something or let it go. Stewing about it won't help anyone, and least of all you. And no, I'm certainly not defending the FB post.
No, I haven't - ever in fact. Making fun of anyone for doing anything is never acceptable - smoking, being fat, or whatever else. But, I do think if someone came up and stood next to me, and lit up a cigarette that it would be rude or unacceptable of me to ask them to please stop, or to walk away from them and feel a bit hurt, or annoyed. I don't think it'd be acceptable for me to tell someone to put down a pizza because they're fat and they "shouldn't be eating it." There is a difference there.
Congratulations on completely missing the point. Try a 15 hour trip where you are being sat upon by the person next to you. I'll take second hand smoke any day. That said, you failed to read past my first sentence.0 -
*KNOCK KNOCK KNOCK*
"Helloooo! OP! Anyone home?"0 -
I want to throw drinking into the ring! (Not drinking a driving, just drinking.)
I have yet to see over-drinking criticized unless the person is one of those super-alcoholics who weighs 8 lbs and is trying to trade their 2 year old's pampers for a bottle of Boone's Farm. More often than not it is celebrated. Yet it follows the same poor impulse control pattern as over-eating and smoking. Food for thought! Also fat isn't really a good indicator of health. Eating excessive pizza might be though.
Also speak up when someone is being a jerk! I successfully stopped my old co-workers from using "gay" as a pejorative. (Well around me anyway.) I do think sometimes it's easier to speak up when the issue isn't a personal one though. As a mostly white (part native) straight woman it's easier for me to say something if the issue is about gay, black, latino, etc people. When you try to point out issues that a are personal to you eg. gender issues, or why "dressing up as an indian" is racist you can be perceived as overly sensitive. Making fun of people isn't cool. Well except for bigots since they made the choice to be anuses.0 -
I pose this question: why is it more acceptable to criticize people who smoke but not people who overeat?
Because people can die from second hand smoke. I never heard of anyone dying because I was fat.
Good point, however eating habits are often passed on to the next generation then blamed on genes.
but i don't believe that public humiliation is funny or useful.
I would use that "unfriend" option0 -
The reason the discussion has taken this turn is because the OP described obesity as a "lifestyle" and compared it to being gay or Muslim. She is saying it's inherently part of who you are and not a series of decisions that you have made. That's what sparked the discussion.
Agreed. My thoughts exactly. For the most part I can't change my gender, skin colour, sexuality, and religion is a whole other topic. But when I was fat, I knew I could change that. I also knew I looked like an idiot when I was goth for a month in high school. Lifestyle choices....0 -
One of the many reasons I abandoned my facebook. I would have said something though because I don't like people being pricks to others, and then I would have unfriended before a *kitten*-storm resulted.0
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I pose this question: why is it more acceptable to criticize people who smoke but not people who overeat?
If you're smoking in your home or your car, you won't hear anything from me, unless you are smoking where your small children can breathe it (I work in a pediatric pulmonary clinic; please folks, don't smoke around children with asthma or Cystic Fibrosis).
If you're smoking in my space, though, I'm getting secondhand smoke and I will criticize your inability to smoke in appropriate places.*
A person who is fat in your vicinity is not causing you harm; a person who smokes in your vicinity may cause you harm.
*Please note the difference between this and actually calling someone a "whale". I don't see people posting pictures of smokers and making fun of them. They are simply asking that smokers not smoke where nonsmokers are affected. This is not that difficult. You have a car, you have a house, and even our tobacco-free medical campus has a smoking area.0 -
People have allergies and sensitivities to smoke, cigarettes, whatever. What harms do obesity cause in a society? What about society's need to be thin, and not healthy? I think most people don't understand how to eat properly, what nutrition is, and what actually it takes to make your body healthy, and strong. That's society's harm - causing obesity.
Also, who to say these people were overeating? They may have made room in their "allowance" or buying it for someone else - their work, a party, something.
People have the same sensitivities to peanut dust, shall we continue banning those? Already many kids and airline flyers aren't allowed nuts because some people are allergic. How far shall we take this?
And as was said above obese people raise insurance premiums for everyone else. The same argument used against smokers. So we can continue this trend, blaming everyone else for their own personal choices affecting insurance rates, OR remember that freedom to live our lives as we choose is actually a pretty important thing. Even if it means some people are momentarily inconvenienced or annoyed.
I understand what you are saying Brett - but at what point does personal freedom to make bad decisions outweigh the needs/concerns of the majority?
I honestly don't have an answer on where that line gets drawn, but it would have to at some point right? Otherwise, we wouldn't have laws to protect the majority against the decisions of the few (child molestation for example). How are smoking and obesity so different? Where does their societal impact become enough that it's okay to desire a change in those behaviors?
I don't know what country you are in, but I'm in the USA, where each individual has the right to pursue happiness as long as that doesn't interfere with anyone else's right to life and liberty. Child molestation, really? We are talking about forced conformity not victimizing others. The dangers of second hand smoke, sketchy research on that one unless you are a child living in the home of a smoker. The rising cost of health insurance premiums - optional, live without insurance if you don't want to pay for the risks of the entire group.0 -
So, let me see if I've got this straight - people still use facebook?0
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Or maybe they were going to eat 2 pizzas each. It doesn't really matter. I have a friend who is heavily obese and she feels happy just the way she is. Do I make fun of her? No. But we all make fun of people we don't like. Maybe we do it in a more private situation, maybe we don't target specific ethnic group, gender or any other group, maybe we're not so cruel.
My advice: don't let this get in the way of your progress. You're getting healthier and you're doing it for yourself and your loved ones. And try to laugh as well to fat-jokes. Well... maybe not in this case, because it seems to me they tried to be hurtful instead of just funny. But, honestly, learn to laugh about that thing you don't like about yourself. It's a kind of healthy self-acceptance without falling into self-indulgence because, after all, you consider your weight to be a problem and you're here, doing something about your it, right?
Let the haters hate, and laugh with those who are only trying to make a silly joke.
Remember that most haters are born from envy, and the rest of them are just brainless. In this case, I think most "fat-haters" envy the fact that some people prefer eating whatever they want and be obese (or just fat) instead of dieting and working out. I bet they would LOVE to eat 2 entire pizzas (I know I do) but they don't, and instead of being proud of their own effort, they attack those who do eat like they would like to out of frustration and envy.
Keep on going! Don't be discouraged!0 -
Wasn't Mussolini a Fatist?0
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I'm here, just intrigued to see how this discussion would unfold - it's been very interesting!
I guess the point I was trying to make was that it seems more socially acceptable to judge/tease/taunt/hurt/insult fat people than it is to be racist, homophobic etc ... at least in some parts of society. The Facebook post proves it.
I agree that something should be said to the person that posted the photo, but think it would be better done in a private conversation to the young man face-to-face. I don't want to embarrass him or open myself up to criticism from others on his friends list.
Last time I did that, I was attacked for being a fat girl defending her own.
Yes, I am a big girl. But I am trying to do something about it. I do eat healthy. I do exercise.
But like most, I could make more effort, which is why I am here. I won't lose weight overnight, and my lifestyle won't change overnight.
I also suffer from PCOS, and one of the symptoms is weight gain, thus making it harder for me to lose weight and I accept that.
It's a shame that when people do have a go about me being over-weight they don't realise that it hurts on another level because it's not just because of the food I eat, it's because of a condition I have that may mean I will never have children.0 -
I pose this question: why is it more acceptable to criticize people who smoke but not people who overeat?
Because people can die from second hand smoke. I never heard of anyone dying because I was fat.
Edited to correct spelling.
Well, technically, one could say that the inflated health care costs due to obesity could cause someone to die due to them not being able to afford insurance.
technically.0 -
I'm here, just intrigued to see how this discussion would unfold - it's been very interesting!
I guess the point I was trying to make was that it seems more socially acceptable to judge/tease/taunt/hurt/insult fat people than it is to be racist, homophobic etc ... at least in some parts of society. The Facebook post proves it.
I agree that something should be said to the person that posted the photo, but think it would be better done in a private conversation to the young man face-to-face. I don't want to embarrass him or open myself up to criticism from others on his friends list.
Last time I did that, I was attacked for being a fat girl defending her own.
Yes, I am a big girl. But I am trying to do something about it. I do eat healthy. I do exercise.
But like most, I could make more effort, which is why I am here. I won't lose weight overnight, and my lifestyle won't change overnight.
I also suffer from PCOS, and one of the symptoms is weight gain, thus making it harder for me to lose weight and I accept that.
It's a shame that when people do have a go about me being over-weight they don't realise that it hurts on another level because it's not just because of the food I eat, it's because of a condition I have that may mean I will never have children.
If they are friends of yours and know you are overweight, then why are you friends with them? I'm sorry but I have plenty of friends I disagree with on a variety of issues, and that's fine, but if they start openly mocking people that are similar to me, then I'd use the "defriend" button.0 -
I pose this question: why is it more acceptable to criticize people who smoke but not people who overeat?
Because people can die from second hand smoke. I never heard of anyone dying because I was fat.
Edited to correct spelling.
Well, technically, one could say that the inflated health care costs due to obesity could cause someone to die due to them not being able to afford insurance.
technically.
Actually, it's those people who aren't wearing seat belts or who are diving into shallow water who are really going to drive up your healthcare costs. Just sayin'.
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had I seen it, I would have commented... Once I had a friend "unfriend" me, because she took a picture of a larger guy on a plane in the seat in front of her and proceeded to make fun of him. To which I said "its a good thing we're all perfect, so no stranger takes a picture of us to mock us...." Apparently she did not like being told how rude that was.0
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Perhaps, but both are societal health concerns. Both cause my health care premiums to go up.
^This.
I'm on the insurance committee for my employer and I can tell you that I pay more for insurance because there are a lot of people with diabetes, high blood pressure, heart disease, etc. Coincidentally, there are a lot of overweight people where I work. Hmmm......
I'm not saying it's okay to make fun of people - for any reason. But to demand respect/acceptance for being fat - that's not ok. IT is a health concern and it does affect other people.
I agree0 -
I pose this question: why is it more acceptable to criticize people who smoke but not people who overeat?
*Jumps up and down* this this THIS! ^^0 -
prejudice is prejudice and should be addressed. i WOULD comment on that pic and say how offensive and rude it is.
we all have to step up - change doesnt come about on its own.0 -
Perhaps, but both are societal health concerns. Both cause my health care premiums to go up.
Ah I love this argument!
Because overweight people think you should be accepting of them and not say a negative word. But non-smokers want all the smokers to just go away and die already.
Everyone wants tolerance and respect for however they personally choose to live their lives, and they want whatever they don't like to be banned entirely.
OR we could all just let each other live in peace already.
I have said it many times, usually those screaming "Tolerance" the loudest don't have any for anyone else. Rock on.
You're wrong this time, sorry Brute - Brett is plenty tolerant.
Silly woman I'm pretty sure he was agreeing with me...
Oh... *puts sword away*0 -
I pose this question: why is it more acceptable to criticize people who smoke but not people who overeat?
Because I don't have to inhale people's food when I walk by.0 -
This is coming from a fat guy who is now at 260 from a start of over 320+.
They are fat people who should not be eating that!
Let's be honest, there is no defense for being fat. The people who say they are OK with being that way are lying to themselves.0 -
Why it is more acceptable in society to make fun of 'fatties' than other people that live a different lifestyle to you?
Fat is not a lifestyle. It's actually a choice, just like smoking. Nobody forced anyone to be fat, just like smoking. People die from being fat, just like smoking.
It's not a lifestyle choice. If people see it that way then they are doomed to fail.0 -
People are such *kitten**holes. I wonder what they think when I pick up 3 pizzas to feed my family. I think you should comment on his post and tag it so everyone sees what a prick he is.0
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