#3 Why calorie in calorie out ALONE isnt enough.
Replies
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I'm gonna be honest, you guys are kind of being jerks.
Dude has a point. A good one. Calorie counting helps. He's made that clear. But it's not an end all be all. That's true for most people. Anyone who thinks calories in calories out alone works for most people is sorely mistaken. There's ALWAYS other factors at play. Be it people who have difficulty doing anything but obsessing over calories (thereby causing serious problems in the future and potential for ED).
Seriously, I tried counting calories a couple years ago, before joining MFP. Didn't work AT ALL. I didn't lose any weight. I didn't feel any better. Now that I'm doing, thinking about how I'm spending my calories (on a full meal salad vs a few fries and a small burger), learning how to eat better, reducing carbs and fatty foods, how to control portions, etc. I've actually lost weight and felt a ton healthier then when I didn't think about it beyond limiting caloric intake. I counted the same way, but the changes I made were choosing better foods, finding enjoyable exercise, and feeling good about myself. Counting is a tool to help me learn better portions and eating habits; it's also convenient in that it let's me record my food and see how I'm eating. But counting won't help everyone, and for some, it deals negative effects.
Not to mention, if you eat better overall and do good exercise, you'll have greater long term success. Your body will be healthier overall (because you really should be focusing more on your nutrients, not your calories). Calorie counting is great and all, but long term success comes from improvement in multiple categories, not just one.
He insulted several members yesterday, one even saying that he'd better put his shirt back on because the man was too gross to look at. He also said that one member was "too loose" (vagina-wise, I believe) to hit, though he was gracious enough to mention were he desperate, he'd hit it anyways.
Also said that anyone who used the social aspects of calorie counting sites was lacking in intelligence and likely to fail. Those who track exercise, by Zaxx's recommendations, are also doomed to the same fate. Thread was deleted eventually.
Dude gets being jerkafied in return after all that.
It was me he told to put a shirt on. I'm not a man! :sad:
His insults to my bellybutton cut me deep, too.0 -
I believe that people can count calories and not be able to lose weight. BECAUSE THEY AREN'T COUNTING ACCURATELY.
I've been here, lost, gained it back, and now I'm losing again. If you look at my diary, you can tell exactly what was happening with my body. Hell, I'm not even consistent with exercise.
Let's just shoot straight:
I haven't read anything rude. I've read posts about people who are confused about how somebody with damn near 60lbs to lose, who came here for HELP with losing, can post all of his "knowledge" which totally spits on science AND the very real stories of people who have lost weight doing what he swears won't work.0 -
Counting calories isn't bad. It had taught me a lot and has forced me to reach for more veggies, fruits, whole grains, protein, etc. Does this person think that we don't know that we need to eat healthy? Is anyone on here really just eating 3 donuts a day and being like "YAY! I am under my calories!" ??? No. Are we children who have no idea what we are doing? NO. Proper nutrition, portion control, water, exercise, rest, etc. HEALTHY LIFESTYLE. We get it.0
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I agree--those who are saying "calorie in calorie out" are saying the (real world) equivalent of "if you weren't fat, you wouldn't be so fat". "Move more and eat less" doesn't really explain anything very well because the obvious next question is: "Eat less than what? (I was only eating 1200 calories when I was morbidly obese) Move more than what? I have arthritis and my joints can only handle so much stress and strain. Until I discovered water exercise I didn't think I could exercise (and I still have days when it feels like I am climbing a mountain). I am fifty pounds smaller now and no longer morbidly obese, but until I cut out sugar and wheat, I was going nowhere and the advice to "just eat less and move more" was very unhelpful.
And did you get morbidly obese eating 1200 cals a day? Most likely not.
No, but the weight came on very gradually and I'm sure that you know that just 200 calories more than you need on a daily basis adds a lot of fat over five to ten years or so. And as I gained, my arthritis got worse, so I moved less. I'm not trying to tell anyone that calorie counting doesn't work, but I am telling you that the experience for me and a number of other people is that there are certain foods that trigger problems controlling appetite and contribute to overeating (even if it isn't by much).
That's called lack of self control, foods aren't forcing themselves down your throat, but it makes for a convenient scapegoat for those that lack will power
America went from 11 million people with "no self control" to 85 million or something...all in the span of a few decades and all while maintaining insane productivity gains as the economic engine of the world?
Cool Story brah.....
Tell me how that works again.
p.s. You obviously didn't read any of the OP bc I SPECIFICALLY talked about how what I was posting wasn't pertinent to folks with a few lbs to lose who hadn't been significantly overweight before.
In your own profile you describe yourself as someone who watches what they eat for vanity, not health and only was skinny fat at his worst.....
But yo, all the cool kids are piling on, so keep the mindless posting up.
Yup i've never been significantly overweight before, way to make things up, just like most of your other posts0 -
Keep eating poptarts in moderation; that will have you thin and happy for life, lol.
I actually sit on the other side of the aisle with this one.... I'm one of the people that think Toaster Strudel's are superior to Pop Tarts.
I've got a box of cherry ones in the freezer. mmmmm!
You look awesome - but you're wrong. I'm going to assume you have never eaten a brown sugar cinnamon pop tart.
I agree, she is wrong. Lovely but terribly terribly wrong.0 -
That's unfortunate, but if you don't like him, then don't react badly back. Especially when he has good points. Because other people might walk in here, see it, then see you guys being difficult for the sake of being difficult, and then ignore the good points he's made. Why not focus on actually trying to be educational? Agree when things are good, or if you disagree, provide good reason why instead of calling the dude an idiot.
Even if he is, you can still try and keep this an educational environment otherwise.
The only good point he made was counting calories works.0 -
I agree--those who are saying "calorie in calorie out" are saying the (real world) equivalent of "if you weren't fat, you wouldn't be so fat". "Move more and eat less" doesn't really explain anything very well because the obvious next question is: "Eat less than what? (I was only eating 1200 calories when I was morbidly obese) Move more than what? I have arthritis and my joints can only handle so much stress and strain. Until I discovered water exercise I didn't think I could exercise (and I still have days when it feels like I am climbing a mountain). I am fifty pounds smaller now and no longer morbidly obese, but until I cut out sugar and wheat, I was going nowhere and the advice to "just eat less and move more" was very unhelpful.
And did you get morbidly obese eating 1200 cals a day? Most likely not.
No, but the weight came on very gradually and I'm sure that you know that just 200 calories more than you need on a daily basis adds a lot of fat over five to ten years or so. And as I gained, my arthritis got worse, so I moved less. I'm not trying to tell anyone that calorie counting doesn't work, but I am telling you that the experience for me and a number of other people is that there are certain foods that trigger problems controlling appetite and contribute to overeating (even if it isn't by much).
That's called lack of self control, foods aren't forcing themselves down your throat, but it makes for a convenient scapegoat for those that lack will power
But..but.. IT'S THE FOODZ FALT!!0 -
I'm gonna be honest, you guys are kind of being jerks.
Dude has a point. A good one. Calorie counting helps. He's made that clear. But it's not an end all be all. That's true for most people. Anyone who thinks calories in calories out alone works for most people is sorely mistaken. There's ALWAYS other factors at play. Be it people who have difficulty doing anything but obsessing over calories (thereby causing serious problems in the future and potential for ED).
Seriously, I tried counting calories a couple years ago, before joining MFP. Didn't work AT ALL. I didn't lose any weight. I didn't feel any better. Now that I'm doing, thinking about how I'm spending my calories (on a full meal salad vs a few fries and a small burger), learning how to eat better, reducing carbs and fatty foods, how to control portions, etc. I've actually lost weight and felt a ton healthier then when I didn't think about it beyond limiting caloric intake. I counted the same way, but the changes I made were choosing better foods, finding enjoyable exercise, and feeling good about myself. Counting is a tool to help me learn better portions and eating habits; it's also convenient in that it let's me record my food and see how I'm eating. But counting won't help everyone, and for some, it deals negative effects.
Not to mention, if you eat better overall and do good exercise, you'll have greater long term success. Your body will be healthier overall (because you really should be focusing more on your nutrients, not your calories). Calorie counting is great and all, but long term success comes from improvement in multiple categories, not just one.
He insulted several members yesterday, one even saying that he'd better put his shirt back on because the man was too gross to look at. He also said that one member was "too loose" (vagina-wise, I believe) to hit, though he was gracious enough to mention were he desperate, he'd hit it anyways.
Also said that anyone who used the social aspects of calorie counting sites was lacking in intelligence and likely to fail. Those who track exercise, by Zaxx's recommendations, are also doomed to the same fate. Thread was deleted eventually.
Dude gets being jerkafied in return after all that.
It was me he told to put a shirt on. I'm not a man! :sad:
His insults to my bellybutton cut me deep, too.
Pay no attention. Less shirt! you look great0 -
I eat pop tarts in moderation. And ice cream.
Me too. :happy:0 -
I eat pop tarts in moderation. And ice cream.
Me too. :happy:
A warm pop tart a la mode. perfection. :flowerforyou:0 -
It was me he told to put a shirt on. I'm not a man! :sad:
Oooops. Now I'm the jerk. Sorry.
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Ok, so you didnt read the post....no problem.
Keep eating poptarts in moderation; that will have you thin and happy for life, lol.
Oh I read it. Wish I hadn't.
I will. And it'll still work. I've done exactly that, lost a bunch of weight, and gotten in great shape. I've used MFP to count my calories, haven't eliminated any food groups, and learned the benefits of exercise. It's changed my life and I've even inspired a few others to do the same.
What you got?
Oh yeah, you read a Taubes book. That's right. Great work you!
Lets count the fail on your post shall we:
No one ever talked about "eliminating food groups"....if you can show me where I talked about eliminating one of the major food groups ill quit the forum now.
No one ever trivialized exercise; my OP talks about how it is important not to be sucked into claims of avoiding exercise/time devoted to activity and then you act as if I somehow discount it.
I have no idea who Mr. Taube is....
WITHIN THE POST ITSELF it talks about how possible it is to lose weight through CI/CO and how it thinking about CO/CI is a good tool for weight management...just not the only/main tool that should be used for a lifetime of effective weight management FOR A CERTAIN TYPE OF PERSON.
Dear lord.....0 -
Are you not reading the posts?That's unfortunate, but if you don't like him, then don't react badly back. Especially when he has good points. Because other people might walk in here, see it, then see you guys being difficult for the sake of being difficult, and then ignore the good points he's made. Why not focus on actually trying to be educational? Agree when things are good, or if you disagree, provide good reason why instead of calling the dude an idiot.
Even if he is, you can still try and keep this an educational environment otherwise.
A number of people ARE giving reasons why they refute his claims. Very few people are being difficult for the sake of being difficult. Also, some of us don't appreciate misinformation spreading, The idea that calories in vs. calories out isn't *enough* for anyone to lose weight is ludicrous. The only exception to this are people with diagnosed medical conditons that slow down or prohibit weight loss.
Also, some of us don't take kindly to someone who just joined with a substantial amount of weight to lose belittling members who have had proven weight loss success.0 -
It was me he told to put a shirt on. I'm not a man! :sad:
Oooops. Now I'm the jerk. Sorry.
I'm just teasing you. I don't expect anyone to be able to keep straight all the individual insults he slung around. We're cool.0 -
I really don't see the problem with your post. Other than the people getting up in arms are possibly (maybe not all of them) the people that fill up on McDonalds and 100 cal packs from Walmart every day (still in their calorie allowance of course). Yes that absolutely works to get the weight off... But what happens when you dont want to count calories for the rest of your life? Wouldn't it be better and easier to be able to set down at the table to a full meal of healthy foods and not worry about the refined sugars and preservatives and "how many calories am I taking in" when you are 60, 70 or 80? Learn to eat healthy foods and make it a lifestyle change NOT a diet. I am not on a diet I have made a lifestyle change. My calorie counting is a temporary helper, not a life long thing. As far as eating multiple meals throughout the day. That has been proven over and over to work fantastically for a lot of people, myself included. If I wait 4 hours until the next meal, I feel sick and like I am starving. If I space my meals out into 4-5 smaller meals through the day, I have more energy and feel much better. I also don't grab the "bad" stuff as much when I do this.0
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That's unfortunate, but if you don't like him, then don't react badly back. Especially when he has good points. Because other people might walk in here, see it, then see you guys being difficult for the sake of being difficult, and then ignore the good points he's made. Why not focus on actually trying to be educational? Agree when things are good, or if you disagree, provide good reason why instead of calling the dude an idiot.
Even if he is, you can still try and keep this an educational environment otherwise.
I sure hope people come in here and see many of our responses to him. I'd hate for them to join a site about counting calories and think, "Oh, this entire website with thousands of successful people, and the basic science of the human body, are wrong because one or two users "disagreed.'"
By the way, no one called him an idiot. In case you missed the ten people pointing it out, he called other people idiots (specifically "morons" at one point). And everyone keeps supporting with good reasons.0 -
I eat pop tarts in moderation. And ice cream.
Me too. :happy:
A warm pop tart a la mode. perfection. :flowerforyou:
My husband ate all my poptarts, but I bought more
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I read it, and I still can't figure out what you're trying to say. Calories in calories out work, but were all going to get fat again if we don't eat "clean"? You talk in circles.0
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Keep eating poptarts in moderation; that will have you thin and happy for life, lol.
I actually sit on the other side of the aisle with this one.... I'm one of the people that think Toaster Strudel's are superior to Pop Tarts.
I've got a box of cherry ones in the freezer. mmmmm!
You look awesome - but you're wrong. I'm going to assume you have never eaten a brown sugar cinnamon pop tart.
I agree, she is wrong. Lovely but terribly terribly wrong.
You've got me. I must confess. I have not eaten a Pop Tart in YEARS.
I only eat the Strudels. The warm, flaky, golden brown strudels.
While it is possible that I have forgotten the taste of a tart so sweet, my heart belongs to the Strudel.0 -
I eat pop tarts in moderation. And ice cream.
Me too. :happy:
Friggin love pop tarts is a box a moderate amount cuz I could suck that down i one gulp. And the OP was being a big mean bully when calorie in vs calorie out was called a moronic method.
My answer is lets all meet back in 50years and we will still see who is alive, the healthiest, who lives independently, who has dementia, who can still change his/her poopy pants, who has he best quality of life, and who looks most like sophia loren or sean connery. That person will be declared the MFP weiner and get a cool crown.0 -
Nevermind.
If you all want to pretend that we're being mean to him because we're all some sort of "cool clique" fine. Go ahead. Start thinking you need to eat small meals several times a day and bread is your enemy. "No it's not that I've been eating too much, it's pop tarts. Pop tarts make my sugar spike and I can't ever ever lose weight or be healthy because of pop tarts."
I guess I just got lucky, don't know how I ever lost weight following MFP. You all listen to your new friend with the great information. I mean you can see the results he's gotten, right? He's been around, he's proven he knows what he's talking about. Myself, Sidesteel, ACG, Sara...we're just bullies picking on the guy trying to help. It can't be because he's posting bad info. How on Earth could we possibly know what we're talking about? Just because we all lost weight and got in great shape using MFP... bunch of jerks. Why would you ever listen to guys like that?
Don't worry. Soon we'll all be banned and you'll be able to purchase your raspberry keytones without anyone saying a bad word against you.0 -
Keep eating poptarts in moderation; that will have you thin and happy for life, lol.
I actually sit on the other side of the aisle with this one.... I'm one of the people that think Toaster Strudel's are superior to Pop Tarts.
I've got a box of cherry ones in the freezer. mmmmm!
You look awesome - but you're wrong. I'm going to assume you have never eaten a brown sugar cinnamon pop tart.
I agree, she is wrong. Lovely but terribly terribly wrong.
You've got me. I must confess. I have not eaten a Pop Tart in YEARS.
I only eat the Strudels. The warm, flaky, golden brown strudels.
While it is possible that I have forgotten the taste of a tart so sweet, my heart belongs to the Strudel.
The brown sugar ones are da bomb.com - they have to be toasted though.0 -
TLDR: Just joined this month - knows more than anyone. Okay.
he / she could have been researching nutrition and exercising for decades for all you know. I only joined 3 months ago and i've been working out and studying nutrition for coming on 4 years now. I would say I have a better idea of how human physiology works better than most people on MFP.0 -
Keep eating poptarts in moderation; that will have you thin and happy for life, lol.
I actually sit on the other side of the aisle with this one.... I'm one of the people that think Toaster Strudel's are superior to Pop Tarts.
I've got a box of cherry ones in the freezer. mmmmm!
You look awesome - but you're wrong. I'm going to assume you have never eaten a brown sugar cinnamon pop tart.
I agree, she is wrong. Lovely but terribly terribly wrong.
You've got me. I must confess. I have not eaten a Pop Tart in YEARS.
I only eat the Strudels. The warm, flaky, golden brown strudels.
While it is possible that I have forgotten the taste of a tart so sweet, my heart belongs to the Strudel.
A little information please. The Strudel? Can you eat two for one serving? My pop tarts are 2 to a packet and yet, sadly, you can only have one in a serving. Another reason why some may be overweight. The misinterpretation of serving size.0 -
I agree--those who are saying "calorie in calorie out" are saying the (real world) equivalent of "if you weren't fat, you wouldn't be so fat". "Move more and eat less" doesn't really explain anything very well because the obvious next question is: "Eat less than what? (I was only eating 1200 calories when I was morbidly obese) Move more than what? I have arthritis and my joints can only handle so much stress and strain. Until I discovered water exercise I didn't think I could exercise (and I still have days when it feels like I am climbing a mountain). I am fifty pounds smaller now and no longer morbidly obese, but until I cut out sugar and wheat, I was going nowhere and the advice to "just eat less and move more" was very unhelpful.
And did you get morbidly obese eating 1200 cals a day? Most likely not.
No, but the weight came on very gradually and I'm sure that you know that just 200 calories more than you need on a daily basis adds a lot of fat over five to ten years or so. And as I gained, my arthritis got worse, so I moved less. I'm not trying to tell anyone that calorie counting doesn't work, but I am telling you that the experience for me and a number of other people is that there are certain foods that trigger problems controlling appetite and contribute to overeating (even if it isn't by much).
That's called lack of self control, foods aren't forcing themselves down your throat, but it makes for a convenient scapegoat for those that lack will power
But..but.. IT'S THE FOODZ FALT!!
So, do you believe simple sugars affect everyone's body in a near identical way vis a vis hunger?
Very simple question with a Y or N answer?
In order for you to judge someone's level of "self control" or lack thereof wouldn't there have to be a standard level of hunger experienced between you and that other person?0 -
TLDR: Just joined this month - knows more than anyone. Okay.
he / she could have been researching nutrition and exercising for decades for all you know. I only joined 3 months ago and i've been working out and studying nutrition for coming on 4 years now. I would say I have a better idea of how human physiology works better than most people on MFP.
Ah, be patient. Soon you too, will understand.0 -
A little information please. The Strudel? Can you eat two for one serving? My pop tarts are 2 to a packet and yet, sadly, you can only have one in a serving. Another reason why some may be overweight. The misinterpretation of serving size.
They're so divine, you only need one. 0 -
I wish I could get my 15 min back 0
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Ok, so you didnt read the post....no problem.
Keep eating poptarts in moderation; that will have you thin and happy for life, lol.
uh. I actually know some totally buff body builders who just go on and on about how great pop tarts are.0 -
A little information please. The Strudel? Can you eat two for one serving? My pop tarts are 2 to a packet and yet, sadly, you can only have one in a serving. Another reason why some may be overweight. The misinterpretation of serving size.
They're so divine, you only need one.
Thank you. Perhaps I will try them when the pop tarts are all gone. I did like the little icing packs.0
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