So, are carbs evil or not?

mmapags

It depends on what kind of carbohydrates we're talking about. Fruit and vegetables are the ideal way to get them, followed by grains. The problem with grains, however, is that many people are adversely affected by wheat. If you notice bloating and constipation when you eat grains, you may have an intolerance. Even if you can digest them okay, you may want to cut wheat out of your diet for a couple of weeks and just observe the results you get. The truth is, wheat can never be a "whole grain" food. It has been processed, it is not in it's original form. And if you have an intolerance to wheat, it's not going to matter if you buy the white bread or the brown. Also, most wheat is genetically modified, which is not a good thing for your body.

My advice; replace wheat with other grains that ARE truly whole grains - like quinoa, millet, corn, amaranth, wild rice ... There are so many gluten free alternatives nowadays, why not give it a go? Try it for two weeks, and if you like the results you're getting, there is no reason to eat wheat. All of the other grains I've listed provide way more nutritional value.

Bottom line; quality food (low quality and low calorie = disaster for your body! this is why many diet foods just make you hungrier and leave you feeling like crap), make sure you're eating a high protein diet if you want more muscle tone, get most of your carbs from fruits and vegetables, eat as close to 0g of sugar a day (best way to get it is from fruit! You can use Stevia to give coffee, tea, and bakes goods a "sweet" taste. you won't notice the difference after a while, promise!). I wouldn't worry too much about fiber, because if you're eating enough fresh produce, your digestive system will be happy. Try hormone free meats, cheeses, and milk (or dairy free alternatives - almond milk is AWESOME to shred pounds!) to ensure that your dairy intake isn't messing with your hormones that will in turn affect your weight loss.

You over complicate things, really.

and you advocate eating 2,000 calories of ice cream, cookies, pop tarts and other processed empty calories daily. to each his or her own. you do it your way, we'll do it ours.

happy?

I advocate allowing yourself 20-25% of your intake to whatever you want. In my case that's mostly simple sugar. Since my daily intake is north of 4,000 a day that gives me more than 800 calories to advocate to simple sugar.

As far as "empty" calories, that isn't what then thread is about and we know you have a radically different view as to what's "empty". As opposed to me as don't buy into the concept. A calories is a unit a measurement and in order to have any caloric value there must be a certain amount of macro (even micro) nutrients present, we'll say for the sake of discussion, per gram of weight.

To each their own, but your way doesn't grant you any additional or special rights to voice your opinion in open forums or disqualify me and mine.

QFT. Magerum, it seems to be open game for judgement of your eating habits. Based on your health markers and the amount of weight you have lost, I'd say more people might want to consider doing what you've done. Others may not see it that way and that is thier perogative but the criticism and judgementalism certainly seems inappropriate at best.

chymerra

i say no. carbs tend to be caloric dense which is why it's recommended to keep it to about 30% of your diet.

i need carbs for the workouts i do. also, it's important to remember that there are "bad" versions of a lot of things out there; carbs are one of them. switch from white/starchy carbs to whole wheat or brown; go from white potatoes to sweet potatoes or squash.

as long as you're within your caloric range for weight loss, you can eat carbs. i have carbs every day; not a lot and only early on in the day but i do eat carbs.

SanteMulberry

It depends on what kind of carbohydrates we're talking about. Fruit and vegetables are the ideal way to get them, followed by grains. The problem with grains, however, is that many people are adversely affected by wheat. If you notice bloating and constipation when you eat grains, you may have an intolerance. Even if you can digest them okay, you may want to cut wheat out of your diet for a couple of weeks and just observe the results you get. The truth is, wheat can never be a "whole grain" food. It has been processed, it is not in it's original form. And if you have an intolerance to wheat, it's not going to matter if you buy the white bread or the brown. Also, most wheat is genetically modified, which is not a good thing for your body.

My advice; replace wheat with other grains that ARE truly whole grains - like quinoa, millet, corn, amaranth, wild rice ... There are so many gluten free alternatives nowadays, why not give it a go? Try it for two weeks, and if you like the results you're getting, there is no reason to eat wheat. All of the other grains I've listed provide way more nutritional value.

Bottom line; quality food (low quality and low calorie = disaster for your body! this is why many diet foods just make you hungrier and leave you feeling like crap), make sure you're eating a high protein diet if you want more muscle tone, get most of your carbs from fruits and vegetables, eat as close to 0g of sugar a day (best way to get it is from fruit! You can use Stevia to give coffee, tea, and bakes goods a "sweet" taste. you won't notice the difference after a while, promise!). I wouldn't worry too much about fiber, because if you're eating enough fresh produce, your digestive system will be happy. Try hormone free meats, cheeses, and milk (or dairy free alternatives - almond milk is AWESOME to shred pounds!) to ensure that your dairy intake isn't messing with your hormones that will in turn affect your weight loss.

You over complicate things, really.

and you advocate eating 2,000 calories of ice cream, cookies, pop tarts and other processed empty calories daily. to each his or her own. you do it your way, we'll do it ours.

happy?

I agree with you Coach Reddy. I have never eaten like that in my life (nor would I want to--there are children starving in the world). I got queasy just reading it.

I don't see the relevance of starving children and me eating pop tarts. If I stop eating Pop Tarts will that help starving children in 3rd world countries?

It might if you stopped eating so much and contributed the money you saved to a save-the-children charity. Hope you don't mind my asking but did you have gastric banding or something? How is it than you can eat like that and maintain your weight? MFP puts you in a much lower calorie range than you are apparently eating.

Same logic could be applied to only eating cheap refined carbs or telling someone who purchases organic foods to purchase cheaper food and donate the savings to a charity

People who eat organic food are eating it to promote their health (whether it actually does or not is topic for another day). Eating 2000 calories of sugary nutrient-deficient junk food a day is not being done to promote health.

CoachReddy

It depends on what kind of carbohydrates we're talking about. Fruit and vegetables are the ideal way to get them, followed by grains. The problem with grains, however, is that many people are adversely affected by wheat. If you notice bloating and constipation when you eat grains, you may have an intolerance. Even if you can digest them okay, you may want to cut wheat out of your diet for a couple of weeks and just observe the results you get. The truth is, wheat can never be a "whole grain" food. It has been processed, it is not in it's original form. And if you have an intolerance to wheat, it's not going to matter if you buy the white bread or the brown. Also, most wheat is genetically modified, which is not a good thing for your body.

My advice; replace wheat with other grains that ARE truly whole grains - like quinoa, millet, corn, amaranth, wild rice ... There are so many gluten free alternatives nowadays, why not give it a go? Try it for two weeks, and if you like the results you're getting, there is no reason to eat wheat. All of the other grains I've listed provide way more nutritional value.

Bottom line; quality food (low quality and low calorie = disaster for your body! this is why many diet foods just make you hungrier and leave you feeling like crap), make sure you're eating a high protein diet if you want more muscle tone, get most of your carbs from fruits and vegetables, eat as close to 0g of sugar a day (best way to get it is from fruit! You can use Stevia to give coffee, tea, and bakes goods a "sweet" taste. you won't notice the difference after a while, promise!). I wouldn't worry too much about fiber, because if you're eating enough fresh produce, your digestive system will be happy. Try hormone free meats, cheeses, and milk (or dairy free alternatives - almond milk is AWESOME to shred pounds!) to ensure that your dairy intake isn't messing with your hormones that will in turn affect your weight loss.

You over complicate things, really.

and you advocate eating 2,000 calories of ice cream, cookies, pop tarts and other processed empty calories daily. to each his or her own. you do it your way, we'll do it ours.

happy?

I advocate allowing yourself 20-25% of your intake to whatever you want. In my case that's mostly simple sugar. Since my daily intake is north of 4,000 a day that gives me more than 800 calories to advocate to simple sugar.

As far as "empty" calories, that isn't what then thread is about and we know you have a radically different view as to what's "empty". As opposed to me as don't buy into the concept. A calories is a unit a measurement and in order to have any caloric value there must be a certain amount of macro (even micro) nutrients present, we'll say for the sake of discussion, per gram of weight.

To each their own, but your way doesn't grant you any additional or special rights to voice your opinion in open forums or disqualify me and mine.

QFT. Magerum, it seems to be open game for judgement of your eating habits. Based on your health markers and the amount of weight you have lost, I'd say more people might want to consider doing what you've done. Others may not see it that way and that is thier perogative but the criticism and judgementalism certainly seems inappropriate at best.

you guys judge me right back. lol i feel as if i've been called orthorexic once or fifty times.

and hey, good for the dude for doing what he's done, and i'm not against eating foods you enjoy, i just personally don't feel (and any nutritionist would agree) that 50% of your calories as "junk foods" is a good rule of thumb. 10-20%? sure! why the hell not?

mmapags

It depends on what kind of carbohydrates we're talking about. Fruit and vegetables are the ideal way to get them, followed by grains. The problem with grains, however, is that many people are adversely affected by wheat. If you notice bloating and constipation when you eat grains, you may have an intolerance. Even if you can digest them okay, you may want to cut wheat out of your diet for a couple of weeks and just observe the results you get. The truth is, wheat can never be a "whole grain" food. It has been processed, it is not in it's original form. And if you have an intolerance to wheat, it's not going to matter if you buy the white bread or the brown. Also, most wheat is genetically modified, which is not a good thing for your body.

My advice; replace wheat with other grains that ARE truly whole grains - like quinoa, millet, corn, amaranth, wild rice ... There are so many gluten free alternatives nowadays, why not give it a go? Try it for two weeks, and if you like the results you're getting, there is no reason to eat wheat. All of the other grains I've listed provide way more nutritional value.

Bottom line; quality food (low quality and low calorie = disaster for your body! this is why many diet foods just make you hungrier and leave you feeling like crap), make sure you're eating a high protein diet if you want more muscle tone, get most of your carbs from fruits and vegetables, eat as close to 0g of sugar a day (best way to get it is from fruit! You can use Stevia to give coffee, tea, and bakes goods a "sweet" taste. you won't notice the difference after a while, promise!). I wouldn't worry too much about fiber, because if you're eating enough fresh produce, your digestive system will be happy. Try hormone free meats, cheeses, and milk (or dairy free alternatives - almond milk is AWESOME to shred pounds!) to ensure that your dairy intake isn't messing with your hormones that will in turn affect your weight loss.

You over complicate things, really.

and you advocate eating 2,000 calories of ice cream, cookies, pop tarts and other processed empty calories daily. to each his or her own. you do it your way, we'll do it ours.

happy?

I advocate allowing yourself 20-25% of your intake to whatever you want. In my case that's mostly simple sugar. Since my daily intake is north of 4,000 a day that gives me more than 800 calories to advocate to simple sugar.

As far as "empty" calories, that isn't what then thread is about and we know you have a radically different view as to what's "empty". As opposed to me as don't buy into the concept. A calories is a unit a measurement and in order to have any caloric value there must be a certain amount of macro (even micro) nutrients present, we'll say for the sake of discussion, per gram of weight.

To each their own, but your way doesn't grant you any additional or special rights to voice your opinion in open forums or disqualify me and mine.

QFT. Magerum, it seems to be open game for judgement of your eating habits. Based on your health markers and the amount of weight you have lost, I'd say more people might want to consider doing what you've done. Others may not see it that way and that is thier perogative but the criticism and judgementalism certainly seems inappropriate at best.

you guys judge me right back. lol i feel as if i've been called orthorexic once or fifty times.

and hey, good for the dude for doing what he's done, and i'm not against eating foods you enjoy, i just personally don't feel (and any nutritionist would agree) that 50% of your calories as "junk foods" is a good rule of thumb. 10-20%? sure! why the hell not?

Who exactly are "you guys"? This is an open public forum with lot of members. Who would you be refering to?

And I don't recall anyone in this thread attacking your diary or eating habits. Quite the opposite. It has been respectfully acknowledged that you have a different point of view. I'd say what Magerum is doing is working and is his business.

SanteMulberry

In any case, we have hi-jacked the thread and apologies are due to the OP. One of the things that is being missed in this latest dust-up is the fact that individuals are different based on levels of obesity, gender, etc. There really is NOT a one-size-fits-all formula for loss of body fat. For some people, carbohydrate restriction is a necessity.

SanteMulberry

It depends on what kind of carbohydrates we're talking about. Fruit and vegetables are the ideal way to get them, followed by grains. The problem with grains, however, is that many people are adversely affected by wheat. If you notice bloating and constipation when you eat grains, you may have an intolerance. Even if you can digest them okay, you may want to cut wheat out of your diet for a couple of weeks and just observe the results you get. The truth is, wheat can never be a "whole grain" food. It has been processed, it is not in it's original form. And if you have an intolerance to wheat, it's not going to matter if you buy the white bread or the brown. Also, most wheat is genetically modified, which is not a good thing for your body.

My advice; replace wheat with other grains that ARE truly whole grains - like quinoa, millet, corn, amaranth, wild rice ... There are so many gluten free alternatives nowadays, why not give it a go? Try it for two weeks, and if you like the results you're getting, there is no reason to eat wheat. All of the other grains I've listed provide way more nutritional value.

Bottom line; quality food (low quality and low calorie = disaster for your body! this is why many diet foods just make you hungrier and leave you feeling like crap), make sure you're eating a high protein diet if you want more muscle tone, get most of your carbs from fruits and vegetables, eat as close to 0g of sugar a day (best way to get it is from fruit! You can use Stevia to give coffee, tea, and bakes goods a "sweet" taste. you won't notice the difference after a while, promise!). I wouldn't worry too much about fiber, because if you're eating enough fresh produce, your digestive system will be happy. Try hormone free meats, cheeses, and milk (or dairy free alternatives - almond milk is AWESOME to shred pounds!) to ensure that your dairy intake isn't messing with your hormones that will in turn affect your weight loss.

You over complicate things, really.

and you advocate eating 2,000 calories of ice cream, cookies, pop tarts and other processed empty calories daily. to each his or her own. you do it your way, we'll do it ours.

happy?

I advocate allowing yourself 20-25% of your intake to whatever you want. In my case that's mostly simple sugar. Since my daily intake is north of 4,000 a day that gives me more than 800 calories to advocate to simple sugar.

As far as "empty" calories, that isn't what then thread is about and we know you have a radically different view as to what's "empty". As opposed to me as don't buy into the concept. A calories is a unit a measurement and in order to have any caloric value there must be a certain amount of macro (even micro) nutrients present, we'll say for the sake of discussion, per gram of weight.

To each their own, but your way doesn't grant you any additional or special rights to voice your opinion in open forums or disqualify me and mine.

QFT. Magerum, it seems to be open game for judgement of your eating habits. Based on your health markers and the amount of weight you have lost, I'd say more people might want to consider doing what you've done. Others may not see it that way and that is thier perogative but the criticism and judgementalism certainly seems inappropriate at best.

you guys judge me right back. lol i feel as if i've been called orthorexic once or fifty times.

and hey, good for the dude for doing what he's done, and i'm not against eating foods you enjoy, i just personally don't feel (and any nutritionist would agree) that 50% of your calories as "junk foods" is a good rule of thumb. 10-20%? sure! why the hell not?

Who exactly are "you guys"? This is an open public forum with lot of members. Who would you be refering to?

And I don't recall anyone in this thread attacking your diary or eating habits. Quite the opposite. It has been respectfully acknowledged that you have a different point of view. I'd say what Magerum is doing is working and is his business.

No one "attacked" Magerum. He tried to deny that carbohydrate-restriction is necessary and used himself as an example. I told him that I could never eat like that and said that I would not even want to (with the half-joking reference to starving children). You just confuse people when you insist that calorie restriction alone is the answer to losing body fat. It just isn't.

magerum

It depends on what kind of carbohydrates we're talking about. Fruit and vegetables are the ideal way to get them, followed by grains. The problem with grains, however, is that many people are adversely affected by wheat. If you notice bloating and constipation when you eat grains, you may have an intolerance. Even if you can digest them okay, you may want to cut wheat out of your diet for a couple of weeks and just observe the results you get. The truth is, wheat can never be a "whole grain" food. It has been processed, it is not in it's original form. And if you have an intolerance to wheat, it's not going to matter if you buy the white bread or the brown. Also, most wheat is genetically modified, which is not a good thing for your body.

My advice; replace wheat with other grains that ARE truly whole grains - like quinoa, millet, corn, amaranth, wild rice ... There are so many gluten free alternatives nowadays, why not give it a go? Try it for two weeks, and if you like the results you're getting, there is no reason to eat wheat. All of the other grains I've listed provide way more nutritional value.

Bottom line; quality food (low quality and low calorie = disaster for your body! this is why many diet foods just make you hungrier and leave you feeling like crap), make sure you're eating a high protein diet if you want more muscle tone, get most of your carbs from fruits and vegetables, eat as close to 0g of sugar a day (best way to get it is from fruit! You can use Stevia to give coffee, tea, and bakes goods a "sweet" taste. you won't notice the difference after a while, promise!). I wouldn't worry too much about fiber, because if you're eating enough fresh produce, your digestive system will be happy. Try hormone free meats, cheeses, and milk (or dairy free alternatives - almond milk is AWESOME to shred pounds!) to ensure that your dairy intake isn't messing with your hormones that will in turn affect your weight loss.

You over complicate things, really.

and you advocate eating 2,000 calories of ice cream, cookies, pop tarts and other processed empty calories daily. to each his or her own. you do it your way, we'll do it ours.

happy?

I agree with you Coach Reddy. I have never eaten like that in my life (nor would I want to--there are children starving in the world). I got queasy just reading it.

I don't see the relevance of starving children and me eating pop tarts. If I stop eating Pop Tarts will that help starving children in 3rd world countries?

It might if you stopped eating so much and contributed the money you saved to a save-the-children charity. Hope you don't mind my asking but did you have gastric banding or something? How is it than you can eat like that and maintain your weight? MFP puts you in a much lower calorie range than you are apparently eating.

Same logic could be applied to only eating cheap refined carbs or telling someone who purchases organic foods to purchase cheaper food and donate the savings to a charity

People who eat organic food are eating it to promote their health (whether it actually does or not is topic for another day). Eating 2000 calories of sugary nutrient-deficient junk food a day is not being done to promote health.

A couple things:

My nutrition needs are more than met with the rest of my diet. Typically hitting several hundred to 700 percent of minimum RDAs. I eat the rest to meet my caloric needs with deliciousness.

Secondly, I would love to see how my surgary food is nutrient dficient. Please show me in detail. Set me right. I log everything and their nutritional values are easily found online. For instance there's 14g of sugar in one 200 cal Pop Tart. That leaves 144 calories of "other stuff". Is this other stuff air or is it fats/carbs/protein (even 10% of the RDA of 7 micronutrients) that are required nutrients?

SanteMulberry

It depends on what kind of carbohydrates we're talking about. Fruit and vegetables are the ideal way to get them, followed by grains. The problem with grains, however, is that many people are adversely affected by wheat. If you notice bloating and constipation when you eat grains, you may have an intolerance. Even if you can digest them okay, you may want to cut wheat out of your diet for a couple of weeks and just observe the results you get. The truth is, wheat can never be a "whole grain" food. It has been processed, it is not in it's original form. And if you have an intolerance to wheat, it's not going to matter if you buy the white bread or the brown. Also, most wheat is genetically modified, which is not a good thing for your body.

My advice; replace wheat with other grains that ARE truly whole grains - like quinoa, millet, corn, amaranth, wild rice ... There are so many gluten free alternatives nowadays, why not give it a go? Try it for two weeks, and if you like the results you're getting, there is no reason to eat wheat. All of the other grains I've listed provide way more nutritional value.

Bottom line; quality food (low quality and low calorie = disaster for your body! this is why many diet foods just make you hungrier and leave you feeling like crap), make sure you're eating a high protein diet if you want more muscle tone, get most of your carbs from fruits and vegetables, eat as close to 0g of sugar a day (best way to get it is from fruit! You can use Stevia to give coffee, tea, and bakes goods a "sweet" taste. you won't notice the difference after a while, promise!). I wouldn't worry too much about fiber, because if you're eating enough fresh produce, your digestive system will be happy. Try hormone free meats, cheeses, and milk (or dairy free alternatives - almond milk is AWESOME to shred pounds!) to ensure that your dairy intake isn't messing with your hormones that will in turn affect your weight loss.

You over complicate things, really.

and you advocate eating 2,000 calories of ice cream, cookies, pop tarts and other processed empty calories daily. to each his or her own. you do it your way, we'll do it ours.

happy?

I agree with you Coach Reddy. I have never eaten like that in my life (nor would I want to--there are children starving in the world). I got queasy just reading it.

I don't see the relevance of starving children and me eating pop tarts. If I stop eating Pop Tarts will that help starving children in 3rd world countries?

It might if you stopped eating so much and contributed the money you saved to a save-the-children charity. Hope you don't mind my asking but did you have gastric banding or something? How is it than you can eat like that and maintain your weight? MFP puts you in a much lower calorie range than you are apparently eating.

Same logic could be applied to only eating cheap refined carbs or telling someone who purchases organic foods to purchase cheaper food and donate the savings to a charity

People who eat organic food are eating it to promote their health (whether it actually does or not is topic for another day). Eating 2000 calories of sugary nutrient-deficient junk food a day is not being done to promote health.

A couple things:

My nutrition needs are more than met with the rest of my diet. Typically hitting several hundred to 700 percent of minimum RDAs. I eat the rest to meet my caloric needs with deliciousness.

Secondly, I would love to see how my surgary food is nutrient dficient. Please show me in detail. Set me right. I log everything and their nutritional values are easily found online. For instance there's 14g of sugar in one 200 cal Pop Tart. That leaves 144 calories of "other stuff". Is this other stuff air or is it fats/carbs/protein (even 10% of the RDA of 7 micronutrients) that are required nutrients?

I would if I cared--I do not. Do your own research.

magerum

It depends on what kind of carbohydrates we're talking about. Fruit and vegetables are the ideal way to get them, followed by grains. The problem with grains, however, is that many people are adversely affected by wheat. If you notice bloating and constipation when you eat grains, you may have an intolerance. Even if you can digest them okay, you may want to cut wheat out of your diet for a couple of weeks and just observe the results you get. The truth is, wheat can never be a "whole grain" food. It has been processed, it is not in it's original form. And if you have an intolerance to wheat, it's not going to matter if you buy the white bread or the brown. Also, most wheat is genetically modified, which is not a good thing for your body.

My advice; replace wheat with other grains that ARE truly whole grains - like quinoa, millet, corn, amaranth, wild rice ... There are so many gluten free alternatives nowadays, why not give it a go? Try it for two weeks, and if you like the results you're getting, there is no reason to eat wheat. All of the other grains I've listed provide way more nutritional value.

Bottom line; quality food (low quality and low calorie = disaster for your body! this is why many diet foods just make you hungrier and leave you feeling like crap), make sure you're eating a high protein diet if you want more muscle tone, get most of your carbs from fruits and vegetables, eat as close to 0g of sugar a day (best way to get it is from fruit! You can use Stevia to give coffee, tea, and bakes goods a "sweet" taste. you won't notice the difference after a while, promise!). I wouldn't worry too much about fiber, because if you're eating enough fresh produce, your digestive system will be happy. Try hormone free meats, cheeses, and milk (or dairy free alternatives - almond milk is AWESOME to shred pounds!) to ensure that your dairy intake isn't messing with your hormones that will in turn affect your weight loss.

You over complicate things, really.

and you advocate eating 2,000 calories of ice cream, cookies, pop tarts and other processed empty calories daily. to each his or her own. you do it your way, we'll do it ours.

happy?

I advocate allowing yourself 20-25% of your intake to whatever you want. In my case that's mostly simple sugar. Since my daily intake is north of 4,000 a day that gives me more than 800 calories to advocate to simple sugar.

As far as "empty" calories, that isn't what then thread is about and we know you have a radically different view as to what's "empty". As opposed to me as don't buy into the concept. A calories is a unit a measurement and in order to have any caloric value there must be a certain amount of macro (even micro) nutrients present, we'll say for the sake of discussion, per gram of weight.

To each their own, but your way doesn't grant you any additional or special rights to voice your opinion in open forums or disqualify me and mine.

QFT. Magerum, it seems to be open game for judgement of your eating habits. Based on your health markers and the amount of weight you have lost, I'd say more people might want to consider doing what you've done. Others may not see it that way and that is thier perogative but the criticism and judgementalism certainly seems inappropriate at best.

you guys judge me right back. lol i feel as if i've been called orthorexic once or fifty times.

and hey, good for the dude for doing what he's done, and i'm not against eating foods you enjoy, i just personally don't feel (and any nutritionist would agree) that 50% of your calories as "junk foods" is a good rule of thumb. 10-20%? sure! why the hell not?

Who exactly are "you guys"? This is an open public forum with lot of members. Who would you be refering to?

And I don't recall anyone in this thread attacking your diary or eating habits. Quite the opposite. It has been respectfully acknowledged that you have a different point of view. I'd say what Magerum is doing is working and is his business.

No one "attacked" Magerum. He tried to deny that carbohydrate-restriction is necessary and used himself as an example. I told him that I could never eat like that and said that I would not even want to (with the half-joking reference to starving children). You just confuse people when you insist that calorie restriction alone is the answer to losing body fat. It just isn't.

Trying to stop confusion actually. Caloric deficit IS all that is needed. The science and math is there.

magerum

It depends on what kind of carbohydrates we're talking about. Fruit and vegetables are the ideal way to get them, followed by grains. The problem with grains, however, is that many people are adversely affected by wheat. If you notice bloating and constipation when you eat grains, you may have an intolerance. Even if you can digest them okay, you may want to cut wheat out of your diet for a couple of weeks and just observe the results you get. The truth is, wheat can never be a "whole grain" food. It has been processed, it is not in it's original form. And if you have an intolerance to wheat, it's not going to matter if you buy the white bread or the brown. Also, most wheat is genetically modified, which is not a good thing for your body.

My advice; replace wheat with other grains that ARE truly whole grains - like quinoa, millet, corn, amaranth, wild rice ... There are so many gluten free alternatives nowadays, why not give it a go? Try it for two weeks, and if you like the results you're getting, there is no reason to eat wheat. All of the other grains I've listed provide way more nutritional value.

Bottom line; quality food (low quality and low calorie = disaster for your body! this is why many diet foods just make you hungrier and leave you feeling like crap), make sure you're eating a high protein diet if you want more muscle tone, get most of your carbs from fruits and vegetables, eat as close to 0g of sugar a day (best way to get it is from fruit! You can use Stevia to give coffee, tea, and bakes goods a "sweet" taste. you won't notice the difference after a while, promise!). I wouldn't worry too much about fiber, because if you're eating enough fresh produce, your digestive system will be happy. Try hormone free meats, cheeses, and milk (or dairy free alternatives - almond milk is AWESOME to shred pounds!) to ensure that your dairy intake isn't messing with your hormones that will in turn affect your weight loss.

You over complicate things, really.

and you advocate eating 2,000 calories of ice cream, cookies, pop tarts and other processed empty calories daily. to each his or her own. you do it your way, we'll do it ours.

happy?

I agree with you Coach Reddy. I have never eaten like that in my life (nor would I want to--there are children starving in the world). I got queasy just reading it.

I don't see the relevance of starving children and me eating pop tarts. If I stop eating Pop Tarts will that help starving children in 3rd world countries?

It might if you stopped eating so much and contributed the money you saved to a save-the-children charity. Hope you don't mind my asking but did you have gastric banding or something? How is it than you can eat like that and maintain your weight? MFP puts you in a much lower calorie range than you are apparently eating.

Same logic could be applied to only eating cheap refined carbs or telling someone who purchases organic foods to purchase cheaper food and donate the savings to a charity

People who eat organic food are eating it to promote their health (whether it actually does or not is topic for another day). Eating 2000 calories of sugary nutrient-deficient junk food a day is not being done to promote health.

A couple things:

My nutrition needs are more than met with the rest of my diet. Typically hitting several hundred to 700 percent of minimum RDAs. I eat the rest to meet my caloric needs with deliciousness.

Secondly, I would love to see how my surgary food is nutrient dficient. Please show me in detail. Set me right. I log everything and their nutritional values are easily found online. For instance there's 14g of sugar in one 200 cal Pop Tart. That leaves 144 calories of "other stuff". Is this other stuff air or is it fats/carbs/protein (even 10% of the RDA of 7 micronutrients) that are required nutrients?

I would if I cared--I do not. Do your own research.

You blindly claim my food is nutrient deficient then. This is what I'm trying to help the OP and many others with. They don't need to over complicate things by listening to unsubstantiated claims. Weight loss and control is hard enough for some without extra worry.

mmapags

You just confuse people when you insist that calorie restriction alone is the answer to losing body fat. It just isn't.

I haven't offered an opinion in this thread as yet. I will now though. Calorie restriction along with balanced macros is the answer for the vast majority of people. For some people with health issues that are not normative like, say, you for instance, different strategies may be nessesary including carb restriction. For most is is not. You likely don't agree. You've made your point of view abundantly clear.

Intelligent people will make good decisions with discernment. I don't believe they will get confused. I have more faith in them than that.

OP, no carbs are not evil. Just one macronutrient to balance appropriately.

SanteMulberry

It depends on what kind of carbohydrates we're talking about. Fruit and vegetables are the ideal way to get them, followed by grains. The problem with grains, however, is that many people are adversely affected by wheat. If you notice bloating and constipation when you eat grains, you may have an intolerance. Even if you can digest them okay, you may want to cut wheat out of your diet for a couple of weeks and just observe the results you get. The truth is, wheat can never be a "whole grain" food. It has been processed, it is not in it's original form. And if you have an intolerance to wheat, it's not going to matter if you buy the white bread or the brown. Also, most wheat is genetically modified, which is not a good thing for your body.

My advice; replace wheat with other grains that ARE truly whole grains - like quinoa, millet, corn, amaranth, wild rice ... There are so many gluten free alternatives nowadays, why not give it a go? Try it for two weeks, and if you like the results you're getting, there is no reason to eat wheat. All of the other grains I've listed provide way more nutritional value.

Bottom line; quality food (low quality and low calorie = disaster for your body! this is why many diet foods just make you hungrier and leave you feeling like crap), make sure you're eating a high protein diet if you want more muscle tone, get most of your carbs from fruits and vegetables, eat as close to 0g of sugar a day (best way to get it is from fruit! You can use Stevia to give coffee, tea, and bakes goods a "sweet" taste. you won't notice the difference after a while, promise!). I wouldn't worry too much about fiber, because if you're eating enough fresh produce, your digestive system will be happy. Try hormone free meats, cheeses, and milk (or dairy free alternatives - almond milk is AWESOME to shred pounds!) to ensure that your dairy intake isn't messing with your hormones that will in turn affect your weight loss.

You over complicate things, really.

and you advocate eating 2,000 calories of ice cream, cookies, pop tarts and other processed empty calories daily. to each his or her own. you do it your way, we'll do it ours.

happy?

I advocate allowing yourself 20-25% of your intake to whatever you want. In my case that's mostly simple sugar. Since my daily intake is north of 4,000 a day that gives me more than 800 calories to advocate to simple sugar.

As far as "empty" calories, that isn't what then thread is about and we know you have a radically different view as to what's "empty". As opposed to me as don't buy into the concept. A calories is a unit a measurement and in order to have any caloric value there must be a certain amount of macro (even micro) nutrients present, we'll say for the sake of discussion, per gram of weight.

To each their own, but your way doesn't grant you any additional or special rights to voice your opinion in open forums or disqualify me and mine.

QFT. Magerum, it seems to be open game for judgement of your eating habits. Based on your health markers and the amount of weight you have lost, I'd say more people might want to consider doing what you've done. Others may not see it that way and that is thier perogative but the criticism and judgementalism certainly seems inappropriate at best.

you guys judge me right back. lol i feel as if i've been called orthorexic once or fifty times.

and hey, good for the dude for doing what he's done, and i'm not against eating foods you enjoy, i just personally don't feel (and any nutritionist would agree) that 50% of your calories as "junk foods" is a good rule of thumb. 10-20%? sure! why the hell not?

Who exactly are "you guys"? This is an open public forum with lot of members. Who would you be refering to?

And I don't recall anyone in this thread attacking your diary or eating habits. Quite the opposite. It has been respectfully acknowledged that you have a different point of view. I'd say what Magerum is doing is working and is his business.

No one "attacked" Magerum. He tried to deny that carbohydrate-restriction is necessary and used himself as an example. I told him that I could never eat like that and said that I would not even want to (with the half-joking reference to starving children). You just confuse people when you insist that calorie restriction alone is the answer to losing body fat. It just isn't.

Trying to stop confusion actually. Caloric deficit IS all that is needed. The science and math is there.

But determining what is a calorie deficit for any individual has many parameters and is not easy to determine. My macros are set for one pound a week and I faithfully follow my plan to a "t" . I also exercise what I have determined is a safe level for me and I faithfully record that. Yet, I only lose about a half-pound per week. I can tell you that if I ate half of my calories in "empty calories" (and sugar is, by anyone's measure, empty calories) I would not only stop losing weight altogether but I would also become ill. You can't slap your maxims on everyone and expect not to do real harm to people who don't know any better.

mmapags

deleted double post.

CyberEd312

Carbs have a direct correlation to leptin levels (hormone that regulates metabolism) carbs are good and should be where the majority of your cals come from.

Yes, that is true in non-obese individuals (particularly men). But leptin is already elevated in obese individuals and the blood level of leptin that women have is already, 2 to 3 times that of men at the same level of body fat. The problem is leptin-resistance and that is curbed the same way that insulin resistance is curbed, by cutting carbs. In fact, leptin-resistance predicts insulin-resistance. It just isn't so simple. http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/707432_7

At 560 lbs. I was insulin resistant with full blown type 2 diabetes running A1c over 10.0..... I worked with a dietician from day one who set my carb intake as my main macro followed by protein and then fats... I ate 2500 calories a day in the beginning with a 40/30/30 ratio for the first 6 months (250 grams of carbs a day) and then kept upping my calories and changed my ratio's over the next couple years to where I am today 50/25/25 and eat 3000 calories on none exercise days and 4000 on exercise days (which to be honest I workout 6 days on with 1 rest day a week so 4000 a day is the norm). My Diabetes is in remission (A1c averaging 5.3 now) and my lipid panels are excellent, matter of fact I just did my fasting lab work friday and go to the endo dr. on Tuesday for my 6 months checkup and don't expect to hear anything but good news... So either I somehow am an exception to the rule are carbs are not evil because I have somehow managed to lose a few pounds eating them and kicking Diabetes to the curb. (Yes I still am and always will be a diabetic but I have reversed all traces of it and my Endo and Dietician both rave about my hardwork and to not change a single thing that I am doing). Yes I am with Magerum on this and totally agree that there is no bad carbs, I ate Pop tarts and Peanut butter and honey for breakfast and plowed through 3 big fillets of wild cod and a whole head of baked cabbage for supper.... Are you healthier than me or vise versa well that can only be answered in another 30 or 40+ years to see who is still here.... My grandmother baked with a bucket of lard beside her stove and the woman lived independently to the age of 97 and ended up dying of natural causes so I am going to take my chances and keep doing what I am doing and let the man upstairs sort out the rest because on all accounts I should already be dead had I kept going down the road I was heading..... Best of Luck to you on your Journey......

SanteMulberry

Carbs have a direct correlation to leptin levels (hormone that regulates metabolism) carbs are good and should be where the majority of your cals come from.

Yes, that is true in non-obese individuals (particularly men). But leptin is already elevated in obese individuals and the blood level of leptin that women have is already, 2 to 3 times that of men at the same level of body fat. The problem is leptin-resistance and that is curbed the same way that insulin resistance is curbed, by cutting carbs. In fact, leptin-resistance predicts insulin-resistance. It just isn't so simple. http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/707432_7

At 560 lbs. I was insulin resistant with full blown type 2 diabetes running A1c over 10.0..... I worked with a dietician from day one who set my carb intake as my main macro followed by protein and then fats... I ate 2500 calories a day in the beginning with a 40/30/30 ratio for the first 6 months (250 grams of carbs a day) and then kept upping my calories and changed my ratio's over the next couple years to where I am today 50/25/25 and eat 3000 calories on none exercise days and 4000 on exercise days (which to be honest I workout 6 days on with 1 rest day a week so 4000 a day is the norm). My Diabetes is in remission (A1c averaging 5.3 now) and my lipid panels are excellent, matter of fact I just did my fasting lab work friday and go to the endo dr. on Tuesday for my 6 months checkup and don't expect to hear anything but good news... So either I somehow am an exception to the rule are carbs are not evil because I have somehow managed to lose a few pounds eating them and kicking Diabetes to the curb. (Yes I still am and always will be a diabetic but I have reversed all traces of it and my Endo and Dietician both rave about my hardwork and to not change a single thing that I am doing). Yes I am with Magerum on this and totally agree that there is no bad carbs, I ate Pop tarts and Peanut butter and honey for breakfast and plowed through 3 big fillets of wild cod and a whole head of baked cabbage for supper.... Are you healthier than me or vise versa well that can only be answered in another 30 or 40+ years to see who is still here.... My grandmother baked with a bucket of lard beside her stove and the woman lived independently to the age of 97 and ended up dying of natural causes so I am going to take my chances and keep doing what I am doing and let the man upstairs sort out the rest because on all accounts I should already be dead had I kept going down the road I was heading..... Best of Luck to you on your Journey......

Unfortunately, Ed, individuals vary greatly. There is a distinct difference between men and women. What works for normal or even obese males, will not necessarily work for obese females--especially females "past their primes" (which, by nature's standards is past 35 and the child-bearing years). There is NOT just a one-size-fits all solution---that is much too simplistic.

mmapags

Trying to stop confusion actually. Caloric deficit IS all that is needed. The science and math is there.

But determining what is a calorie deficit for any individual has many parameters and is not easy to determine. My macros are set for one pound a week and I faithfully follow my plan to a "t" . I also exercise what I have determined is a safe level for me and I faithfully record that. Yet, I only lose about a half-pound per week. I can tell you that if I ate half of my calories in "empty calories" (and sugar is, by anyone's measure, empty calories) I would not only stop losing weight altogether but I would also become ill. You can't slap your maxims on everyone and expect not to do real harm to people who don't know any better.

So, instead everyone should take your anecdotal experience and apply it as a universal maxim? Any system of setting calories is only an estimate and needs to be fine tuned by the individual over time. How does that invalidate the energy balance equation and the benefit of balanced macros? Why are you trying to draw universal conclusions from your anecdotal experience? There is whole body of science that calorie restriction and balanced macros are based upon. Not just one person.

SanteMulberry

i say no. carbs tend to be caloric dense which is why it's recommended to keep it to about 30% of your diet.

i need carbs for the workouts i do. also, it's important to remember that there are "bad" versions of a lot of things out there; carbs are one of them. switch from white/starchy carbs to whole wheat or brown; go from white potatoes to sweet potatoes or squash.

as long as you're within your caloric range for weight loss, you can eat carbs. i have carbs every day; not a lot and only early on in the day but i do eat carbs.

So do I. I just must be VERY judicious about the way that I spend my calorie and carbohydrate allotment.

holothuroidea

I'm an ethical vegan and all of the whole foods I consume, with the exception of nuts and seeds, are full of carbohydrates. They're a big part of my diet and, evil or not, they always will be. Who wants to eat tofu and peanut butter all day!? Give me the fruits and starchy veggies.

SanteMulberry

Trying to stop confusion actually. Caloric deficit IS all that is needed. The science and math is there.

But determining what is a calorie deficit for any individual has many parameters and is not easy to determine. My macros are set for one pound a week and I faithfully follow my plan to a "t" . I also exercise what I have determined is a safe level for me and I faithfully record that. Yet, I only lose about a half-pound per week. I can tell you that if I ate half of my calories in "empty calories" (and sugar is, by anyone's measure, empty calories) I would not only stop losing weight altogether but I would also become ill. You can't slap your maxims on everyone and expect not to do real harm to people who don't know any better.

So, instead everyone should take your anecdotal experience and apply it as a universal maxim?

Not at all. I am the exception to your maxims as are many, many others---especially women.