Paleo Diet

Ah nutrition, a relatively new science and one few people truly understand. Some people know parts but rarely the big picture. The metabolic processes that occur in the human body are complex and contain so many pathways few appreciate.

Carbs-important
Amino acids- important
Fats- important
Learn about metabolism...

Additionally, vitamins, antioxidants, minerals, phytochemocals...important

Eat a balanced meal, do not over indulge, exercise. There you go, live happily

Holy crap this is a lot of info for me to process. I am not looking for something super restrictive & I LOVE my carbs. I just not sure how to change my diet to achieve results. I know it needs to change and keep hearing about this diet. Thank you everyone for all the information.

Then this lifestyle is NOT for you. Until you get sick of being sick you likely will find it too "restrictive". I do not find it restrictive at all. If your sole focus is purely weight loss and you expect to continue eating a Standard American Diet and see no problem with that, then continue what you are doing. Personally, I did see a problem with eating highly processed food because it was killing me, and until recently, I didn't care that it was killing me. I would also suggest doing some indepth research into food politics, nutrition, biology, anthropology, agriculture (past and present), anthropology, ethnography, etc. Just asking opinions in an online forum isn't going to give you real information, especially when many of the people who are sharing their strong opinions have no first-hand experience with the subject.

D*** you really are angry aren't you? What makes you think the OP is sick?

I'm angry because I speak in a direct manner and from personal experience? Or am I "angry" just because you disagree with me and want to belittle my character? Brilliant.

I'm really not getting into this with people who haven't even tried Paleo. Newsflash: obesity is "sick". Acid reflux, indigestion, gas, bloating, tooth decay, depression, craving, over-eating etc is "sick". Instead of belittling and ridiculing why don't you try asking "what illnesses did you treat by changing your diet?". You might learn something interesting; or not, since you think we are all just "angry".

I would rather ask, why do you think a diet use to treat your personal illnesses should be tried by everyone, or anyone else?

I don't know who you are referring to when you say I think you "all" are angry, but I was actually only referring to you and your post telling the OP she was sick and suggesting you knew her plans for future eating and how wrong she was for having those plans. It certainly read as an angry post to me.

I appreciate your feedback. You definately have more experience with Paleo than I do. From what I understand, Paleo dieters do not eat starchy vegetables. Is that correct? Does this mean no yams or potatos? What else do you exclude? Dairy? Baked yams are one of my favorites when a high calorie, high nutrient, slow digesting carb is needed. As for dairy, I can't imagine why you'd cut out such a good protein source as non-fat milk or non-fat cottage cheese. They are so good for you!

Have no fear... You can certainly eat starchy vegetables like potatoes or yams. The Paleosphere is awash in debates about which potato is more or less healthy. I personally prefer the taste of yams. The only caveat is that If you're trying to lose weight, eating lots of them is probably not the best idea. And word on the street is they are best to eat post workout as a great recovery meal.

You said, "I'm not sure how grains (aka carbs), whether whole or refined, white or brown, won't have an effect on your insulin level. When I was diabetic, that whole grain bagel spiked my blood sugar as much as that white one. I'm no longer diabetic (but still at high risk) so I'm not checking my blood sugar anymore, but I definitely notice a difference in my blood sugar swings. Before Paleo, I felt blood sugar swings if I went more than a few hours between meals, and I would get seriously shaky. Now that I eat lower carbs and have eliminated most added sugars, I find I'm never shaky, even when I miss a meal. I believe this is related to lower carb, not specifically Paleo, though. "

All I am saying with refined vs unrefined carbs is that we should choose unrefined because all of the extra fiber that slows digestion. This causes our blood sugar to be more stable because it rises more slowly and falls more slowly. This reduces hunger (since the body doesn't sense a sharp drop in blood sugar), reduces fat storage (as the elimination of sugar spikes result in the elimination of insulin spikes which results in the reduction of insulin storing unused nutrients into fat storage) aids in healty intestines, and controls insulin levels (as insulin relase into the blood stream is triggered by sugar in the blood stream). That is how carbs have an effect on your insulin level. Processed carb digest more quickly causing you to lose out on all of the benefits mentioned about unrefined carbs. With that said, there is plenty of fiber to be had in all of those fibrous fruits and veggies you are eating. (You are eating fruit aren't you?)

Gotcha. But to me, a grain is a grain, many have gluten which I try to avoid, and I'd rather replace them with veggies. Most whole grain store breads also contain HFCS or added sugars, which I try to avoid also. So for me, whole grain isn't much better than refined. I'm not a crazy person... There are times when I consciously decide to enjoy bread. But very rarely, and only if it's fresh and warm and it's serving a really good purpose like transporting some burrata to my mouth.

Yes, I do eat fruit. But since I'm trying to lose a few more pounds, I generally eat only a serving or two a day. Berries and apples, mostly. My downfall are dried mango slices. Pure sugar bombs that definitely get over eaten.

You being prone to diabetes throws a wrench into things. I am happy for you to have found something that has improved your health and helped with diabetes. Obviously, your body responds very well to Paleo.

Out of curiosity, what is a typical meal for you? What are a couple of your favorite meals?

You can check out my diary. It's open. I had gestational diabetes twice and have patents and sibs with it. So high risk.

I'm going to answer your question about nutrition alternatives to bread in a different post.

Edited because I hit save mid-sentence.

Personally, I'd rather just eat healthy foods. I stay mostly organic, lowered my meat consumption a bit and avoid the processed crap at the supermarket and restaurants. And I have that same 'clean' feeling that Paleo claims is exclusive to them. But you know what they don't get that I do? When I did my 11 mile long run on Sunday, I get a donut. 8)

^this

After having it constantly bashed into my skull about this "miracle diet" that completely omits gluten and casein on autism forums because it supposedly helps with symptoms of autism spectrum disorders, I decided to give it a shot. My experience so far (and I'm not 100% compliant because I do keep my supplements, including whey protein, and I do occasionally have a piece of cheese) is as follows:

-Energy levels are through the roof.

-Busted through the weight loss plateau that kept me from getting below 200 lbs

-I stopped becoming reliant on pre-workout supplements for my cardio sessions (I now only use them for lifting/resistance sessions)

-Balance has noticeably improved (a weak point of mine due to neurological dysfunction)

That being said, the traits that associate with my autism spectrum disorder have not gotten better. In fact in some ways they've worsened. Speech has gotten worse (more stuttering), stimming is more frequent and more drastic, motor skills (which are particularly bad) are unaffected as they vary in severity depending on day, and sensory problems are also varying by the day so more than likely unaffected.

Really interesting self-experiment. There are lots of people who claim the diet helps improve things like ADHD and autism-spectrum behaviors. I'm always skeptical. I definitely believe there's a link between our diet and our brain health, but its hard to prove that what works for one person will have any effect on another, especially with something as complex and poorly understood as neurological issues. Good luck to you.

Holy crap this is a lot of info for me to process. I am not looking for something super restrictive & I LOVE my carbs. I just not sure how to change my diet to achieve results. I know it needs to change and keep hearing about this diet. Thank you everyone for all the information.

Then this lifestyle is NOT for you. Until you get sick of being sick you likely will find it too "restrictive". I do not find it restrictive at all. If your sole focus is purely weight loss and you expect to continue eating a Standard American Diet and see no problem with that, then continue what you are doing. Personally, I did see a problem with eating highly processed food because it was killing me, and until recently, I didn't care that it was killing me. I would also suggest doing some indepth research into food politics, nutrition, biology, anthropology, agriculture (past and present), anthropology, ethnography, etc. Just asking opinions in an online forum isn't going to give you real information, especially when many of the people who are sharing their strong opinions have no first-hand experience with the subject.

D*** you really are angry aren't you? What makes you think the OP is sick?

I'm angry because I speak in a direct manner and from personal experience? Or am I "angry" just because you disagree with me and want to belittle my character? Brilliant.

I'm really not getting into this with people who haven't even tried Paleo. Newsflash: obesity is "sick". Acid reflux, indigestion, gas, bloating, tooth decay, depression, craving, over-eating etc is "sick". Instead of belittling and ridiculing why don't you try asking "what illnesses did you treat by changing your diet?". You might learn something interesting; or not, since you think we are all just "angry".

I would rather ask, why do you think a diet use to treat your personal illnesses should be tried by everyone, or anyone else?

I don't know who you are referring to when you say I think you "all" are angry, but I was actually only referring to you and your post telling the OP she was sick and suggesting you knew her plans for future eating and how wrong she was for having those plans. It certainly read as an angry post to me.

Did I say everyone should try this? Look again at the Title of this thread and at the original post. The information/opinions were requested. (I'm pretty sure that I came to the conclusion that the OP would not find Paleo a good fit; I had assumed that she knew more about what she was asking than she did.)

So, my illnesses are unique to me... really, interesting...

Yes, obese/over-weight is sick. I may be wrong in assuming that this person is over-weight but then why the thread?

It wasn't intended as an angry post. I am very direct and honest. What I can't stand though is people talking against something that they have no first-hand experience with and riduculing/belittling others that do. That DOES bother me, but I better grow some thicker skin because that seems to be the norm here.

My nutritionist mentioned that I should try the Paleo diet. So, I ordered the book on line at Amazon. This diet is not for me! It just doesn't make sense to me. I would have to take a lot of things out of my diet, and I am not willing to do that~especially that they are good for me! It's not for everyone, but it may work for you! I guess it's great for people with diabetes!

LMAO So even a nutritionist (someone educated exactly on the subject at hand) is wrong if they recommend the Paleo diet? So the nutritionist doesn't know what is healthy and is giving you advice to make you less healthy? Is it possible that the nutritionist might know something that you don't? WHY is it great for people with diabetes? Are you aware that Type 2 diabetes is caused by diet/lifestyle and can be prevented by diet/lifestyle??? I suppose it makes more sense to wait until one has full blown diabetes, loses a foot, maybe their eyesight, before taking action to change; I've lost count of how many times I've encountered that "logic". (No I am NOT saying that the Paleo way of eating is the only answer for everything for everyone.)

I totally accept your choice to not want to change to the Paleo way of eating. What I don't accept, and what I am seeing so often in this thread and others, is the notion that "I don't agree with this, so it is wrong" attitude (which you allude to by suggesting that the nutritionist is telling you to exclude food that is "good for you".)

Holy crap this is a lot of info for me to process. I am not looking for something super restrictive & I LOVE my carbs. I just not sure how to change my diet to achieve results. I know it needs to change and keep hearing about this diet. Thank you everyone for all the information.

Then this lifestyle is NOT for you. Until you get sick of being sick you likely will find it too "restrictive". I do not find it restrictive at all. If your sole focus is purely weight loss and you expect to continue eating a Standard American Diet and see no problem with that, then continue what you are doing. Personally, I did see a problem with eating highly processed food because it was killing me, and until recently, I didn't care that it was killing me. I would also suggest doing some indepth research into food politics, nutrition, biology, anthropology, agriculture (past and present), anthropology, ethnography, etc. Just asking opinions in an online forum isn't going to give you real information, especially when many of the people who are sharing their strong opinions have no first-hand experience with the subject.

D*** you really are angry aren't you? What makes you think the OP is sick?

I'm angry because I speak in a direct manner and from personal experience? Or am I "angry" just because you disagree with me and want to belittle my character? Brilliant.

I'm really not getting into this with people who haven't even tried Paleo. Newsflash: obesity is "sick". Acid reflux, indigestion, gas, bloating, tooth decay, depression, craving, over-eating etc is "sick". Instead of belittling and ridiculing why don't you try asking "what illnesses did you treat by changing your diet?". You might learn something interesting; or not, since you think we are all just "angry".

I would rather ask, why do you think a diet use to treat your personal illnesses should be tried by everyone, or anyone else?

I don't know who you are referring to when you say I think you "all" are angry, but I was actually only referring to you and your post telling the OP she was sick and suggesting you knew her plans for future eating and how wrong she was for having those plans. It certainly read as an angry post to me.

Did I say everyone should try this? Look again at the Title of this thread and at the original post. The information/opinions were requested. (I'm pretty sure that I came to the conclusion that the OP would not find Paleo a good fit; I had assumed that she knew more about what she was asking than she did.)

So, my illnesses are unique to me... really, interesting...

Yes, obese/over-weight is sick. I may be wrong in assuming that this person is over-weight but then why the thread?

It wasn't intended as an angry post. I am very direct and honest. What I can't stand though is people talking against something that they have no first-hand experience with and riduculing/belittling others that do. That DOES bother me, but I better grow some thicker skin because that seems to be the norm here.

Most of us have experience eating grains, dairy and legumes. And it is almost exclusively the things Paleo excludes because someone decided they were unhealthy that is talked against. You don't have to exclude something to know it can be part of a healthy diet. You just have to eat it and be healthy.

Also, obese/overweight is not necessarily "sick". Sick means illness. Not everyone that is overweight has an illness.

It's precisely because of our society's assurance and promotion that grains and legumes are healthy that I spent so long sick and suffering. So, knowing I was eating all those healthy foods did NOT manifest in good health for me; quite the opposite. In fact, I shouldn't even still be alive. So, yup, I ate it, all my life and why wasn't I healthy, as promised? "You just have to eat it and be healthy".... read that sentence again... LOL (It sounds like: don't ask questions; keep taking your medicine! (evil laugh...))

You may not think obesity is illness. I do. Our bodies do not get obese when fed properly. Our bodies do not suffer many common illnesses when fed properly. That's my understanding and experience based on research and trial and error. Feel free to replace "our" with "my".

Nope, I wouldn't have believed what I'm saying 10 years ago either so I understand our inability to come to common ground. However, I might not have believed it, but I wouldn't have argued against it without having tried it first.

You said, "Yup, that's true, because there's nothing grains do for me that adds to my health... there's no nutritional value in grains that I can't get elsewhere from a more nutritious source. For me, grains add to my carb load... and when I have them, it's very easy to overeat them... and gain weight, and f*** up my blood sugar."

I am acutally genuinely interested in what types of foods you can get the same types of nutirients that are more nutritious.

I pieced that quote up... Probably some forum faux pas, but I wanted to cut to your question. Ok, here's my thinking. What's good about whole-grain bread? It is generally low-fat. It has fiber. It has vitamin E, some folate, probably some other good vitamins. But... I can get fiber and lots more vitamins from eating plenty of veggies and fruits, like avocados, carrots, apples, kale, broccoli, etc. and, they are more filling generally than the caloric equivalent of bread. I tried to find some sort of chart that shows nutritional value of whole-grain bread along with fruit and veg, but my google skills failed me.

You also asked what else Paleo eliminates, so here's the general yes/no list. But... There's no one version of Paleo. These are the generally accepted guidelines followed by many, but there's not really any one person or group defining the diet. Lots of bloggers, a handful of books and cookbooks make up the "rules".

"Yes" foods:
- All veggies... Moderate potatoes/yams if trying to lose weight.
- Protein - preference to best quality you can find and afford. Local grass-fed/pastured is best, and wild-caught seafood.
- Fruits - but moderate if trying to lose weight
- Nuts and seeds - but not too many... High cal and potentially high omega 6 if you chow down on lots every day
- Healthy fats, such as olive oil, butter or ghee, macadamia or avocado oil, tallow, lard
- good sea salt. Since I don't eat salt-laden processed foods, I happily flavor my food with sea salt.
- lots of spices.

"No" foods:
- Grains... Because of the havoc that gluten and gliadins wreak on many people, the minimal nutritional bang for the carb buck, and for me, the tendency to over eat. I never knew I was sensitive to gluten until I eliminated it. Thankfully, I'm not celiac so I don't have to worry about contamination and I don't get terribly ill, but enough to make me think twice before eating grains.
- legumes (beans)... eliminated because of the anti-nutrients. For me, it's the minimal nutritional bang for the carb buck. I'm not a huge bean fan anyway. Green beans and peas are A-OK because they're more pod than bean, and don't have the same digestibility issues as other beans.
- added sugars. We get all the sugar we really need from fruit and veg. I think reducing sugar consumption is a no-brainer. Using limited amounts of honey, maple syrup, or sugar fom dates or figs is fine, but sugar=sugar=sugar, and best not to overdo it. I've found that limiting sugars helped me slay my sugar cravings.
- oils like vegetable oil, canola, Safflower, sunflower. PUFAS.
- soy... The science on soy is all over the place. It has estrogenic properties... But is that really bad? Some think so, some not. I avoid it generally, but don't worry if I get some when eating Chinese food. At home, I substitute coconut aminos and fish sauce for soy sauce in recipes. Soy is in LOTS of processed foods too, which I try to avoid, because they have so many other "no" stuff.
- corn... Cuz... It's a grain. And it's in an evil plot to take over the earth. Oh, but it hurts so good. I avoid it, but will enjoy some chips at a Mexican joint. If the salsa is good. And... Bonus... No gluten in corn!
- alcohol. As Mel Joulwan says, "Because you have a drink, then your drink has a drink, and then your drink is chowing down on cheese fries". Seriously, not much nutritionally redeeming about alcohol. It's toxic. I don't drink at home, but I will drink red wine when I'm out with friends. Gotta be a little bad.
- dairy. If you're "Paleo" by most definitions... I forget the exact evils of casein, plus lots of people are lactose intolerant or allergic. But, many people say they follow the "Primal Blueprint" version of Paleo, which was coined by Mark Sisson, and says cheese and fermented dairy is cool. I am lactose intolerant, but I can drink cream and eat cheese and yogurt with no issues, so I do.

General Paleo rule of thumbs... Eat real food. Eliminate foods that can have harmful affects on you body. Move a lot. Do sprints. Lift heavy things. Walk. Get lots of sleep. Repeat.

My nutritionist mentioned that I should try the Paleo diet. So, I ordered the book on line at Amazon. This diet is not for me! It just doesn't make sense to me. I would have to take a lot of things out of my diet, and I am not willing to do that~especially that they are good for me! It's not for everyone, but it may work for you! I guess it's great for people with diabetes!

LMAO So even a nutritionist (someone educated exactly on the subject at hand) is wrong if they recommend the Paleo diet? So the nutritionist doesn't know what is healthy and is giving you advice to make you less healthy? Is it possible that the nutritionist might know something that you don't? WHY is it great for people with diabetes? Are you aware that Type 2 diabetes is caused by diet/lifestyle and can be prevented by diet/lifestyle??? I suppose it makes more sense to wait until one has full blown diabetes, loses a foot, maybe their eyesight, before taking action to change; I've lost count of how many times I've encountered that "logic". (No I am NOT saying that the Paleo way of eating is the only answer for everything for everyone.)

I totally accept your choice to not want to change to the Paleo way of eating. What I don't accept, and what I am seeing so often in this thread and others, is the notion that "I don't agree with this, so it is wrong" attitude (which you allude to by suggesting that the nutritionist is telling you to exclude food that is "good for you".)

Seriously, you need to take a step away from the computer and chill. If you calmly re-read the post to which you replied you will see that it does not say "I don't agree with this, so it is wrong" . It says "I am not willing to do that~especially that they are good for me! It's not for everyone, but it may work for you!"

Stress and anger are very bad for you health. Don't get so worked up just because others want to eat something you don't, or are able to be healthy while eating things that make you sick. It's not something you can change with words.

I can't eat truly paleo as a vegan, but for me personally, I feel way better when I have no grains and lots of protein. It could be worth a try if you are interested, OP, you can always change your mind. No commitment necessary, free trial :flowerforyou:

The "paleo" diet is a valid diet, regardless of the naysayers. The basis of the "lifestyle" as some call it, is one basically avoids processed foods and ingest only "real" food: fresh vegetables and meat from ruminants such as beef, goat, lamb, etc. One can get all the vitamins and nutrients one requires from actually small amounts of such real food.

I have lost 60 pounds in three years just by being paleo-ish. In the last five months I've lost 20 pounds by paying attention to the rules: no sugar, abolutely no grain products such as bread, pasta, oatmeal, etc. (These items have lots of quickly metabolised energy but no real nutrition.

Another benefit is that in the last three years I have not needed to visit the doctor's office at all. I used to be cursed with the flu every year and a cold almost every month of the winter months. I've suffered from gout for the last 25 years, a truly painful malady. However, since having gone paleo, I have not suffered any of these problems. My diagnosed pre-diabetes has completely, repeat COMPLETELY, disappeared. My blood pressure, formerly 140/110, is now steady at 105/65. (I am 60 years old.)

Fat is not our enemy as the government, et. al., would have us believe. We evolved eating animals known for their ability to carry visceral fat and, if fortunate, high intra-muscular fat. If you look at a graph, since 1975 when our oh-so-smart politicans decided saturated fat was bad, diabetes and obesity, a.k.a., diabesity, has steadily climbed.

Many naysayers claim this menu is too restrictive. My answer to that is an unequivacal "bull****." There are now many paleo cookbooks on the market not to mention many, many more blogs with recipes. How can a diet using all the various fresh veggies and all the various meats be restrictive? I drink a coconut shake made with coconut milk, egg yolks, nutmeg, cinnamon, vanilla, and a pureed date for sweetness three or four times per week. Like hamburgers or cheeseburgers? Slap one together and scarf it down, just don't eat the bun. French fries cooked in duck fat are simply to die for. In the winter months I regularly cook a stew using a variety of veggies with a variety of meats, including offal. Restrictive? Nope, not at all. Those tossing that word around haven't a frickin' clue what they are talking about.

OFG

Please stop calling this diet paleo, you cannot eat paleo in modern society. It is impossible.

Sure, it's rather difficult to hunt down a mammoth these days but that's not what paleo means today. It means to eat real food, not boxed or canned crud containing all those yummy chemicals. Fresh veggies, meat, and quality fat, all available in our modern society.

That is all.

OFG

Neanderthin said:
[/quote]
Yeah................ the paleo diet also saved my dog and paid my mortgage.....j/k.
[/quote]

You may be joking but it did save my dog. She had a skin disease that would not go away and was costing a small fortune in meds and vet visits. I tried "paleo" on her and the disease went away in two months, her coat is shiny, and she no longer constantly whines and scratches herself all day long.

Processed foods, no matter the intended consumer, or victim, should be avoided.

OFG