Please stop saying everything is starvation mode...

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  • danmcgarrigle5
    danmcgarrigle5 Posts: 90
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    I think I read somewhere that starvation mode only happens when you hit <5% BF...

    basically if you do not eat for 72 hours you will start to see slight affect of starvation mode..i.e. body turning to muscle for energy but this is slight and you would have to continue fast for like another two days to really start suffering damage ...(I think that is the time frame)..

    not sure on the sub 5% body fat thing...

    I have a medical issue that causes me a great deal of pain, sometimes the only way to stop this pain, outside of Dilaudid in the hospital, was to not eat for 3-4 days. I would then not eat for a couple more days because I wasn't having my usual pain. The longest I went was 10 days. After the 72 hour mark it is kinda neat when you stop feeling hungry, and pretty soon you can start to smell acetone on your breath. I am 6'5" and 330 right now, I used to be 320 of muscle when I worked a very physical job. After a couple cycles of not eating I was having trouble putting a 25lb bag of cat litter into my shopping cart, this was less than 2 months after leaving the physical job.

    It is amazing how fast your body uses the muscle once it starts. It goes fast

    As far as the <5% body fat thing, I don't think it matters, your body will use as much fat as it can, but it will sacrifice as much muscle as it needs to keep your brain working and healthy
  • rosichick
    rosichick Posts: 80 Member
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    I'm picking up what you're putting down... I get frustrated when say one day I was just not feeling well, not hungry whatever and didn't eat all my calories for the day MFP will give me a warning about "starvation mode'. I am aware that if for some reason I skip a meal i will not be in starvation mode and MFP needs to shut up. lol

    But it will also congratulate you for finishing your diary and coming in under your calorie goal! It needs to shut up AND make up its mind!

    if i was a cat, id like to believe id look like the one in your pic!

    He's not fat, he's just got a lot of pressure per square inch!

    HAHAHA i love your kitty picture =)
  • funkycamper
    funkycamper Posts: 998 Member
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    augustawhysee's post just before mine is a classic example of the effects of repeated starvation. If Augusta will go on a normal calorie diet for a while their BMR will increase to a healthy level and stabilize, they will gain weight during this time and it will probably take a couple of months but once everything has normalized then healthy weight loss can occur. Until your hormones stabilize you are going to find it nearly impossible to loose weight in a healthy manner.

    I really wish it were that simple and cut-and-dried.
  • sseubers
    sseubers Posts: 29 Member
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    Amen to all of you! Starvation mode, come on! I discussed it with one of the trainers at the gym once, we're doing some circuittraining around 7am and just what I expected: he told me that I could eat before, but that it would not immediately do me any good. I would have to get up very early so that my body could process my breakfast before the training.. (not gonna do that!) I rather wait till after the training and have a great breakfast to refuel. Story short:

    Starvation mode... yeah right! and training without having breakfast first: Love it!
    To all you starvation mode fanactics..:explode: :grumble: :noway:
  • AnvilHead
    AnvilHead Posts: 18,344 Member
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    Amen to all of you! Starvation mode, come on! I discussed it with one of the trainers at the gym once, we're doing some circuittraining around 7am and just what I expected: he told me that I could eat before, but that it would not immediately do me any good. I would have to get up very early so that my body could process my breakfast before the training.. (not gonna do that!) I rather wait till after the training and have a great breakfast to refuel. Story short:

    Starvation mode... yeah right! and training without having breakfast first: Love it!
    To all you starvation mode fanactics..:explode: :grumble: :noway:
    Not that I do it, but a lot of people using the Intermittent Fasting (IF) protocol train fasted. From what I know of it, the only thing Martin Berkhan suggests is a dose of BCAAs prior to training. I've seen plenty of people who are getting very good results from IF. Not my thing, but I'm certainly not going to knock it.
  • nubian218
    nubian218 Posts: 16 Member
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    I agree because often i dont eat breakfast because i am just not hungry,however i do drink coffee before going to the gym i dont get hungry until noon,which i eat a meal, but yes that is stated alot on mfp great topic by the way!
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,136 Member
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    I'm not sure where you are getting your information from but it seems that you have misunderstood what starvation mode is.

    According to Segen starvation mode is defined as a physiologic response to a marked decrease in caloric intake where the basal metabolic rate falls to a minimum to conserve energy.

    If a person's BMR is 2000kcal per day and they reduce their caloric intake to 1000kcal per day their body will, after a period of glycogen and ketone burning, adjust it's metabolism to try and limit the potential loss of body tissue. This person is by definition in starvation mode until their BMR stabilizes.

    Most people "starve themselves" while dieting and can't figure out why they stop losing weight so they stop their diet only to gain more weight back than when they started. This happens because the body's first response to caloric excess while it is in starvation mode is to horde all excess glycogen into fat cells.

    You do NOT need to stop all caloric intake to enter into starvation mode. You will enter starvation mode if you consistently consume less than what is required for bodily operation for a prolonged period of time.

    You are correct that missing a meal will not put you into starvation mode but the effects of prolonged caloric deficit should not be ignored. Starvation is a real concern for people trying to loose weight and everyone eating at a caloric deficit should be aware of it and take care not to get to that point.

    i posted where i got all my information from in my original post - www.leangains.com. where did you get YOUR information from? Its pretty much a fact that you body does not go into true starvation mode unless you do not eat for 72 hours...you want to post a study to the contrary I will look at it.
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,136 Member
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    I didn't know when I read the initial post about the starvation mode that I was going to be subjected to bacon and ice cream porn, lol.

    mmm bacon and ice cream porn!
  • fit4lifeUcan2
    fit4lifeUcan2 Posts: 1,458 Member
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    Does starvation mode lead to body parts turning blue? :wink:
    not on women but I hear men have this problem now and then lol

    Kidding aside I"m glad to see someone finally say this and say it well.
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,136 Member
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    Amen to all of you! Starvation mode, come on! I discussed it with one of the trainers at the gym once, we're doing some circuittraining around 7am and just what I expected: he told me that I could eat before, but that it would not immediately do me any good. I would have to get up very early so that my body could process my breakfast before the training.. (not gonna do that!) I rather wait till after the training and have a great breakfast to refuel. Story short:

    Starvation mode... yeah right! and training without having breakfast first: Love it!
    To all you starvation mode fanactics..:explode: :grumble: :noway:
    Not that I do it, but a lot of people using the Intermittent Fasting (IF) protocol train fasted. From what I know of it, the only thing Martin Berkhan suggests is a dose of BCAAs prior to training. I've seen plenty of people who are getting very good results from IF. Not my thing, but I'm certainly not going to knock it.

    I train fasted and take two scoops of BCAA's prior training. For some crazy reason I actually have MORE energy then when I would eat prior to training..maybe it is mental but it works for me...
  • quirkytizzy
    quirkytizzy Posts: 4,052 Member
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    There is a member here who says that the phrase "starvation mode" is a bit of a misnomer, that's it's more "malnutrition mode" than anything else. Just that prolonged periods (say weeks at a time) of eating below BMR can weaken your body and make it start processing things wonky.

    I know for me that hunger can actually be a build-up process. I did just fine on 1200 for two and a half weeks. Day by day, didn't feel too hungry at all, until WHAM that third week and I was suddenly sick with hunger ALL THE TIME. One of those "it has to catch up to you" things. Turns out that for me, that calorie goal wasn't coming in even close to covering my daily activity needs, which might not have been "starvation mode", but definitely malnutrition mode.
  • Gunsentry
    Gunsentry Posts: 121 Member
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    Starvation mode is a state in which the body is responding to prolonged periods of low energy intake levels. During short periods of energy abstinence, the human body will burn primarily free fatty acids from body fat stores. After prolonged periods of starvation the body has depleted its body fat and begins to burn lean tissue and muscle as a fuel source.

    Ordinarily, the body responds to reduced energy intake by burning fat reserves first, and only consumes muscle and other tissues when those reserves are exhausted. Specifically, the body burns fat after first exhausting the contents of the digestive tract along with glycogen reserves stored in muscle and liver cells. After prolonged periods of starvation, the body will utilize the proteins within muscle tissue as a fuel source. People who practice fasting on a regular basis, such as those adhering to energy restricted diets, can prime their bodies to abstain from food without burning lean tissue.

    Resistance training (such as weight lifting) can also prevent the loss of muscle mass while a person is energy-restricted.
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,136 Member
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    Mmmmm bacon... Okay back on topic, so I'm confused.. I read all the posts for noobs and they say I shouldn't be cutting too many calories, and mfp says i should be eating 1200 and my exercise kcals. So if I want to drop a significant amt (trying to fit nicely into my bday dress March 2nd, but also am serious about changing lifestyle yadayada, how many can i cut safely while exercising 5 times a week? Thanks for any help.

    what is your height, weight, and age ....

    hte basic method is to calculate your TDEE and deduct about 20 to 30% depending on how many cals you want to lose.

    what is your work out regimen like?

    I'm 5'4", 162, and 31.

    Thanks for your help, I'm horrible with anything that has to do with calculating, which is why I like this tracker that does it for me!

    I workout 4-6 days a week doing group fitness classes such as zumba, kickboxing, and aerobics. I also do some strength training with bands and weights during those classes, I am working on getting a HRM, but for now mfp says I'm burning ~500-650 kcals per workout. Thanks again. The fitness pal says starvation mode, and it's scareing me lol

    *I didn't weigh myself when I initially started, so not sure how much I've lost. I just weighed myself finally a few days ago, so it says 0.

    i calculated your TDEE at moderatly active = 3-5 days a week of exercise, which is 2348 calories a day. If you want to eat in a 30% deficit that would be 1643 calories a day (about 707 a day deficit). Set your calorie settings on this in MFP custom settings and try it for four to six weeks and see how it goes....

    you can combine this with leangains if you want..www.leangains.com...but IF is not for everyone.

    You should also consider building a total body strength work out around deadlifts, squats, overhead press, chinups/pullups, bench press etc and throw in two days a week of cardio. once the weight starts to melt off you can go more strength training and less cardio...
  • oregonzoo
    oregonzoo Posts: 4,251 Member
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    I agree i get sick of hearing this and this road map **** from Dan that every one tries to preach to u!!!!! Im not saying he is wrong but come on let people do their own thing with out criticizing i got treated like crap because of this and its not right if i was doing so crappy why have i lost so much weight just saying!
    I really also dislike it when those mean educated people who have done a lot of research are kind enough to share it. The nerve.
  • ILiftHeavyAcrylics
    ILiftHeavyAcrylics Posts: 27,732 Member
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    so now im also confused........how many calories should I be eating then because I really do want to drop this weight.....I am also exercising so im just not sure how to do this....I thought I wasn't losing a lot since I wasn't eating enough but now am unsure.....gah

    You should eat between your BMR and TDEE to lose weight. There are a lot of reasons not to eat too little. Starvation mode, as it is used here, is not one of them.
  • rjmudlax13
    rjmudlax13 Posts: 900 Member
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    Another example of a poorly worded phrase. Kind of like when people freak out over the "muscle weighs more than fat" saying. The general principle is true, but if taken literally, it can be misleading.

    OK, let’s stop using "starvation mode" (hahaha..not a snowballs chance) and maybe use "metabolic adjustment." But that can be misleading.

    Oh, I got it. How about you listen to other people, do some (real, aka not internet, aka library aka work) research and come up with your own, I don't know, let’s call it "hypothesis." "Test" that "hypothesis" and compare the results against a well-known example or maybe we can call it a "control." Analyze the results (let’s try to be objective or "empirical"), use some - gulp - "critical thinking" and draw a conclusion which can become part of your...uhh...I don't know... "theory?" Adjust that "theory" to make another "hypothesis" and repeat. Eventually, you might even get closer to what I am going to call "truth."

    If only we had a name for this "method." Surely, it will be understood and embraced by the general public. Egos, beliefs, dogma, etc. would never get in the way.
  • avasano
    avasano Posts: 487 Member
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    Starvation mode, Oh! That is why the crew from a Christian outreach network showed up to film me at the office. I should have had breakfast to avoid this problem. Shame!
  • rybo
    rybo Posts: 5,424 Member
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    I went into starvation mode just reading thru this thread.
  • mazdauk
    mazdauk Posts: 1,380 Member
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    Now I need a biscuit
  • Dfracassa
    Dfracassa Posts: 318 Member
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    I swear if I see one more thread where someone says that someone is in "starvation mode" because they missed snack 2 or are eating 1200 calories a day I am going to have a melt down.

    You have to not eat ANYTHING for 72 hours for your body to to into starvation mode and start turing to muscle to for energy. And even then the effect is pretty minima. Martin Beckham does a great job of laying out all the research on his web site www.leangains.com.

    so if you skip breakfast you are not in starvation mode...if you do not eat an apple at 2pm you are not in starvation mode.

    There are plenty of people out there (myself included) who skip breakfast, train fasted, and have our largest meal post workout and we are not in starvation mode. I have lost 3% body fat using leangains 18/6 which is an 18 hour fast and a six hour eating window.

    Under eating can lead to a possible plateau but it does not mean you are in starvation mode.


    THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU. God I'm sick of people on here telling me that I'm doing every damn thing wrong. I want to eat a 1 oz. bag of Cheetos with my lunch, and I don't feel hungry till 6 p.m. Am I in "starvation mode"? NO! I'm just not hungry and I wanted some damn Cheetos instead of an apple.

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