Meat & non-eat meaters (READ ME)
Replies
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<--- Body made by meat.. Meat works. Just stick to meat. It's what our ancestors ate thousands of years ago. We're not meant to eat processed, frozen veggie burgers. Rather than substitute a fatty beef burger for a veggie burger, why not just substitute it for a leaner healthier type of meat?
I'm also sure our ancestors didn't go down to whole foods to buy their food either. ;P
His point stands alot more than your's does. At least he is still eating the same type foods our ancestors did.
I'm sure our ancestors ate prepackaged meats.
He didnt say he eats at whole foods? That's your assumption. Some of us but our meat from the farm and buy our vegetables from farm shops. Grok most certainly did not live on vegetation alone.
Not to split hairs, but I think these ancestors everyone is referring to usually only lived to about 30 years of age.
Common misconception. In prehistoric times, people routinely lived to be 70 or more.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_expectancy#Human_life_expectancy_patterns
You'd better let wikipedia know.
Because wikipedia is the best source of information? Moot point though, where it the proof that our ancestors died form meat consumption?0 -
i would if it werent for the sodium content. i dont like to eat foods with too much sodium in them. but other than that they look delicious.
then again im not picky lol0 -
"How do you know when someone's a vegetarian? Don't worry they'll tell you."
*snarf*.0 -
<--- Body made by meat.. Meat works. Just stick to meat. It's what our ancestors ate thousands of years ago. We're not meant to eat processed, frozen veggie burgers. Rather than substitute a fatty beef burger for a veggie burger, why not just substitute it for a leaner healthier type of meat?
I'm also sure our ancestors didn't go down to whole foods to buy their food either. ;P
His point stands alot more than your's does. At least he is still eating the same type foods our ancestors did.
I'm sure our ancestors ate prepackaged meats.
Nice job assuming. For all you know he hunts or raises his own food. Doesn't matter either way, meat is meat. And you question why meat eaters get grouchy at the superior attitude of vegans on these threads. You are a shining example.
You know I'm better than you. Not because I'm vegetarian but because I was making a joke, you got all booty hurt and missed the ;P from my post which made it a playful.
Fail again. You have been crying the whole thread about how mean us meat eaters are. Get over yourself already.
lol I never said all meat eaters are mean, some are nice. Then there's other who think it's their cue to say "mmmm bacon" or "OMG ALL VEGETARIANS EATS IS PROCRESSED CRAP!" If that doesn't apply to you then you don't have to respond because I'm not talking to you.
Ohhhhs noooosss! They said bacon!0 -
Two reasons:
1. Extensive use of soy. Soy is no bueno.
2. They just aren't filling. One burger leaves me satisfied. Takes a whole box of Moningstar Farms grillers to do that.0 -
I've heard of those. They look nasty.I'm sure most all of you have heard of Morning Star foods.
Why would I want processed fake food when I can get the real thing? Heck, I can pick the cow out from granddad's herd and I know a good butcher to break it down for me too. :PWhy not substitute?
I actually don't have burgers very often. I've tried the veggie ones before because I love veggies, but generally I prefer a nice all beef one! If I want a "veggie" burger I'm not going to buy one that's pretending to be beef. If I want a veggie "burger" I'll grill a portabella mushroom. If I want a real good burger, I'll have beef one.On a night you're going to have burgers, why not have a vege burger? They are so delicious.
I'm not 5 years old. I like my chicken without nuggets thank you very much.Chicken nuggets, why not Morning Stars?
Actually, I'm pretty sure my normal chicken is less fatty or greasy than those processed fake meat things.So much less fat, no grease, all entirely healthy & delicious.
Why would I want pricey? I'm on a budget because I only spend extra on the things that are important. Fake meat is not important to me.Yes, pricey.
Yuck.But who has burgers every night? Who has chicken nuggets every night? I know I don't. Though Morning Star is delicious.. & It does tempt me to make one. Yummy yummy substitution
Heh. I like you. :happy:0 -
I'm sure most all of you have heard of Morning Star foods.
Why not substitute?
On a night you're going to have burgers, why not have a vege burger? They are so delicious.
Chicken nuggets, why not Morning Stars?
So much less fat, no grease, all entirely healthy & delicious.
Yes, pricey. But who has burgers every night? Who has chicken nuggets every night? I know I don't. Though Morning Star is delicious.. & It does tempt me to make one. Yummy yummy substitution
1) Because meat tastes better
2) Meat is cheaper
3) Because fresh tastes better
4) Because there's no downside to meat
The implication in "why not substitute" is "this frozen meat-free product, made with about 35 ingredients, is inherently better in some undefined way than ground beef."
My question to you is:
Why substitute?
because I'm a vegetarian.
BOOM.
And yes, I did just say I was a vegetarian, but that is why I "substitute"... actually...I just need something that I can smother in hot sauce so I have an excuse to lick hot sauce off my fingers (this is specifically about boca's vegan chicken patties). Other than that, I don't really "substitute" anything. Ok. I have boca burgers occasionally to... that's just to add protein to my delicious ketchup sandwhich.0 -
Blood--doesn't bother me.blood, feces, hormones, injected hormones, antibiotics, ect....in meat.....tell me again how morningstar sounds gross?
Feces--actually probably more common on veggies than in my meat. If it's properly slaughtered there really isn't any reason for that to make it into my burger.
Injected hormones--Like GMO plants, I'm ok with these as long as they have been tested and approved by the appropriate overseeing bodies of health and government. They should be reevaluated periodically.
Antibiotics--Well, again if they are "safe" then I'm ok with that. I don't really want to eat a sick cow anymore than I want to eat a fungus infested plant.0 -
<--- Body made by meat.. Meat works. Just stick to meat. It's what our ancestors ate thousands of years ago. We're not meant to eat processed, frozen veggie burgers. Rather than substitute a fatty beef burger for a veggie burger, why not just substitute it for a leaner healthier type of meat?
I'm also sure our ancestors didn't go down to whole foods to buy their food either. ;P
His point stands alot more than your's does. At least he is still eating the same type foods our ancestors did.
I'm sure our ancestors ate prepackaged meats.
He didnt say he eats at whole foods? That's your assumption. Some of us but our meat from the farm and buy our vegetables from farm shops. Grok most certainly did not live on vegetation alone.
Not to split hairs, but I think these ancestors everyone is referring to usually only lived to about 30 years of age.
Common misconception. In prehistoric times, people routinely lived to be 70 or more.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_expectancy#Human_life_expectancy_patterns
You'd better let wikipedia know.
When people who made it to 18 have an expectancy of living into their 50s a lot of people make it to 70. That means it's routine.0 -
A lot of "meat replacers" are full of GMOs and un-natural ingredients to try and make them taste better. That's why I don't eat anything by Boca or Morningstar. Unless they are non-GMO project verified.
THIS BIG TIME0 -
"Meat & non-eat meaters (READ ME)"
...why do people often miss their misspellings in the titles?
...also WTF is up with the (READ ME) bit?0 -
"Meat & non-eat meaters (READ ME)"
...why do people often miss their misspellings in the titles?
...also WTF is up with the (READ ME) bit?
It means "hey, look at me! I'ts not that I "think" you should check this out but that you "should" check this out so get in here NOW NOW NOW"...0 -
Fail again. You have been crying the whole thread about how mean us meat eaters are. Get over yourself already.
To be fair, a lot of meat eaters can act in rather unkind ways at times. Sometimes all it takes is, "no thank you, I don't eat meat" to set off a lecture on how I'm inferior and committing dietary suicide. Not to mention the tired jokes... if I don't laugh at them people act like I'm horribly sensitive with no sense of humor, but many of them really aren't funny anymore (if they ever were). Honestly, that "for every animal you don't eat I'll eat 3" knee-slapper has been around for at least 10 years and I still hear it on a regular basis. And holding your food an inch away from my face whilst mooing isn't funny, it's just poor manners (and also quite tired and overdone). Get some new material, omnivores!
(edited to cut down the size of the quote box... which strikes me as a sign that this thread has gone on way too long, lol)0 -
Because I raise my own pastured chickens and I eat them. I raise heritage breed Dominiques. They are naturally breeding, and I'm always going to have excess roosters. Always. I only need one rooster for every five to six hens to have maximum fertility. It's not really possible to rehome boys. Everyone wants girls for the eggs, but no one wants a bunch of roosters around that are going to fight. I kill them myself as humanely as possible. I know what they've had to eat their entire lives, I know where they've lived. I take responsibility for feeding myself and my family, and I feel good knowing that our food is clean. When we eat other meat, I buy from local farmers that I know and I approve of their standards.
I am always baffled by the phrase "humane killing".
I'm always baffled by people that think if they stop eating meat it will stop the inhumane treatment of animals on factory farms instead of actively trying to change it.
I am really confused by this comment.
Is your point that we should just eat meat because it won't put a stop to animal cruelty?
That seems like pretty broken logic...
If your point is that you think no one should be a vegetarian without waging some active war against animal cruelty, you still don't make any sense to me. People do what they can and shouldnt' be expected to give every last ounce they have for what they can do to be considered an effort.
Weirdness.0 -
"Meat & non-eat meaters (READ ME)"
...why do people often miss their misspellings in the titles?
...also WTF is up with the (READ ME) bit?
It means "hey, look at me! I'ts not that I "think" you should check this out but that you "should" check this out so get in here NOW NOW NOW"...
It's especially annoying when it's the same old crap over and over. How many times have we gone here on MFP? Like a million??
I'm gonna go grab some more coffee, bark a few times, do a couple of handstand pushups, and then come back swinging!0 -
I just don't understand why anyone would want to eat the stuff they use to make veggie burgers.
Vegetarianism should be clean, not pumped with chemicals. Oh of course once in a while it's ok...but daily? omg.
As a gluten free veg-head myself, I make things from scratch or close there to. I make burgers from black beans and rice and other such things...it's not difficult.
I like the brand Quorn. WAY BETTER than Morningstar Farms or Boca. Quorn has no soy so it's better for me and my kids. Although, I'm not sure if it has wheat...I haven't had it in a while...since I had to stop eating gluten.0 -
Vegetarianism should be clean, not pumped with chemicals.
apparently I have been failing at vegetarianism for 18 years now! I should just go get a tbone and make sure i eat something clean!0 -
And pus, don't forget the pus. lolGMO and chemicals and addiditives.. oh yum!!!
Bacon anyone?? mmmmmm bacon...
Also.. soy is not really good for you..
LOl I LOVE when people bring up the "soy is bad" argument. It's so funny! I'm sure eating meat pumped full of antibiotics, hormones, blood, pus, and feces is MUCH healthier for me! As long as it's "lean" right?
meat full of feces?
what kind of meat are you having?0 -
Haha! I didn't even notice the title, and I'm usually pretty eagle eye about those things. It's a pretty stealth typo, I give it an A."Meat & non-eat meaters (READ ME)"
...why do people often miss their misspellings in the titles?
...also WTF is up with the (READ ME) bit?
I appreciate that you are as offended by the (READ ME) as I am. Everyone got so excited with their MOAR MEAT GMO SOY RAWR that they ignored the most terriblest awfulest very baddest thing. It made me all >:( for like, literal MINUTES.0 -
Vegetarianism should be clean, not pumped with chemicals.
apparently I have been failing at vegetarianism for 18 years now! I should just go get a tbone and make sure i eat something clean!
I always find the "you should do this" or "you shouldn't do that" and "eat this way and only this way" so irritating when it comes to the types of foods I choose to ingest. :grumble: Just because I might eat something not in its raw form doesn't mean I'm doing it wrong.
ETA: I'm not a vegetarian..just find it irritating. Also, I think that if you choose to be a vegetarian, that's great. If you like Morningstar or Boca..that's great too. I like both and love veggie burgers (my fav is from Fuddruckers).
But what I don't like is the insinuation that meat is unhealthy, so much so that when making "healthier" choices, you have to turn to meat substitutes. No...just no.0 -
Because I raise my own pastured chickens and I eat them. I raise heritage breed Dominiques. They are naturally breeding, and I'm always going to have excess roosters. Always. I only need one rooster for every five to six hens to have maximum fertility. It's not really possible to rehome boys. Everyone wants girls for the eggs, but no one wants a bunch of roosters around that are going to fight. I kill them myself as humanely as possible. I know what they've had to eat their entire lives, I know where they've lived. I take responsibility for feeding myself and my family, and I feel good knowing that our food is clean. When we eat other meat, I buy from local farmers that I know and I approve of their standards.
I am always baffled by the phrase "humane killing".
I'm always baffled by people that think if they stop eating meat it will stop the inhumane treatment of animals on factory farms instead of actively trying to change it.
I am really confused by this comment.
Is your point that we should just eat meat because it won't put a stop to animal cruelty?
That seems like pretty broken logic...
If your point is that you think no one should be a vegetarian without waging some active war against animal cruelty, you still don't make any sense to me. People do what they can and shouldnt' be expected to give every last ounce they have for what they can do to be considered an effort.
Weirdness.
Thank you. Love this response.0 -
If eliminating all cholesterol from your diet would ensure not having the condition/disease, that would be one thing. But, alas, it can still come about even if you don't eat cholesterol. You can, perhaps, lower your risk... but new research is suggesting that causal link between consuming dietary cholesterol and serum cholesterol is not as dire as originally thought. I don't know whether the old research or the new research is more correct, but I'm pretty sure that you don't either. Choosing to eat less or no meat to be on the safe side is cool, and I get that, but your post came across as being well beyond the safe side, on over into the radical area.Except for the causal link between dietary cholesterol raising serum cholesterol. And elevated serum cholesterol causing atherosclerosis. So yeah, if you are happy with having a little atherosclerosis, eat cholesterol. If you don't want the condition/disease, eliminate it from your diet. Everyone has the choice.
But don't argue that consuming animal products doesn't contribute towards atherosclerosis, because you're deluding yourself.
You better look at www.heartattackproof.com. Caldwell Esselstyn, who was head of cardiology at the Cleveland Clinic (where heart bypass surgery was invented) and a former surgeon, presents "irrefutable evidence that all CHD can be prevented", or words to that effect. I'm not claiming that you can completely avoid heart disease. Caldwell Esselstyn is. I'm just an idiot wasting some time on a pathetic forum. Dr Esselstyn is the expert with the expert opinion.0 -
Because I raise my own pastured chickens and I eat them. I raise heritage breed Dominiques. They are naturally breeding, and I'm always going to have excess roosters. Always. I only need one rooster for every five to six hens to have maximum fertility. It's not really possible to rehome boys. Everyone wants girls for the eggs, but no one wants a bunch of roosters around that are going to fight. I kill them myself as humanely as possible. I know what they've had to eat their entire lives, I know where they've lived. I take responsibility for feeding myself and my family, and I feel good knowing that our food is clean. When we eat other meat, I buy from local farmers that I know and I approve of their standards.
I am always baffled by the phrase "humane killing".
I'm always baffled by people that think if they stop eating meat it will stop the inhumane treatment of animals on factory farms instead of actively trying to change it.
I am really confused by this comment.
Is your point that we should just eat meat because it won't put a stop to animal cruelty?
That seems like pretty broken logic...
If your point is that you think no one should be a vegetarian without waging some active war against animal cruelty, you still don't make any sense to me. People do what they can and shouldnt' be expected to give every last ounce they have for what they can do to be considered an effort.
Weirdness.
Thank you. Plus, sometimes the loudest things you can say in our culture are the things you say with your dollars. Not purchasing meat/animal products IS a form of activism.0 -
Why not substitute your veggie burger for meat? It's natural, full of protein, and DELICIOUS!!0
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It should also be noted that the average meat consumption of the entire US population has gone down on a per capita basis. Less demand reduces supply. We are having a cumulative impact.0
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Ok, I bit and took a look.You better look at www.heartattackproof.com. Caldwell Esselstyn, who was head of cardiology at the Cleveland Clinic (where heart bypass surgery was invented) and a former surgeon, presents "irrefutable evidence that all CHD can be prevented", or words to that effect. I'm not claiming that you can completely avoid heart disease. Caldwell Esselstyn is. I'm just an idiot wasting some time on a pathetic forum. Dr Esselstyn is the expert with the expert opinion.
It appears to be based on 17 compliant patients.
I didn't dive too far into the sales site to see how many patients there were originally, nor what exactly caused a patient to be deemed non-compliant. I will say that it's certainly good news for those 17 individuals though.
Additionally, I sincerely doubt you're an idiot, but I do think you are something of a true believer. Which, you know, is cool and all, but is sometimes hard for those of us with a little skepticism running through our blood to take.
Maybe cholesterol causes skepticism! Hehe. 0 -
Maybe cholesterol causes skepticism! Hehe.
Snort :laugh:0 -
If eliminating all cholesterol from your diet would ensure not having the condition/disease, that would be one thing. But, alas, it can still come about even if you don't eat cholesterol. You can, perhaps, lower your risk... but new research is suggesting that causal link between consuming dietary cholesterol and serum cholesterol is not as dire as originally thought. I don't know whether the old research or the new research is more correct, but I'm pretty sure that you don't either. Choosing to eat less or no meat to be on the safe side is cool, and I get that, but your post came across as being well beyond the safe side, on over into the radical area.Except for the causal link between dietary cholesterol raising serum cholesterol. And elevated serum cholesterol causing atherosclerosis. So yeah, if you are happy with having a little atherosclerosis, eat cholesterol. If you don't want the condition/disease, eliminate it from your diet. Everyone has the choice.
But don't argue that consuming animal products doesn't contribute towards atherosclerosis, because you're deluding yourself.
You better look at www.heartattackproof.com. Caldwell Esselstyn, who was head of cardiology at the Cleveland Clinic (where heart bypass surgery was invented) and a former surgeon, presents "irrefutable evidence that all CHD can be prevented", or words to that effect. I'm not claiming that you can completely avoid heart disease. Caldwell Esselstyn is. I'm just an idiot wasting some time on a pathetic forum. Dr Esselstyn is the expert with the expert opinion.
Can the esteemed experts of this thread explain exactly why my non drinking, non smoking, vegan ex has it then? And how he can improve his diet in order to cure himself when he already consumes zero animal products? Considering there are no inherited high cholesterol genetic markers anywhere in his family or himself?
The logic of the argument is that ALL CHD can be prevented. The existence of one person - my ex - who has got it - disproves the entire argument.
Who'da thunk it? My ratbag ex being such a special snowflake that he alone disproved one fruitbat theory that he would love to be true.0 -
Vegetarianism should be clean, not pumped with chemicals.
apparently I have been failing at vegetarianism for 18 years now! I should just go get a tbone and make sure i eat something clean!
Yea, because that is EXACTLY what I said. Duh.0 -
If eliminating all cholesterol from your diet would ensure not having the condition/disease, that would be one thing. But, alas, it can still come about even if you don't eat cholesterol. You can, perhaps, lower your risk... but new research is suggesting that causal link between consuming dietary cholesterol and serum cholesterol is not as dire as originally thought. I don't know whether the old research or the new research is more correct, but I'm pretty sure that you don't either. Choosing to eat less or no meat to be on the safe side is cool, and I get that, but your post came across as being well beyond the safe side, on over into the radical area.Except for the causal link between dietary cholesterol raising serum cholesterol. And elevated serum cholesterol causing atherosclerosis. So yeah, if you are happy with having a little atherosclerosis, eat cholesterol. If you don't want the condition/disease, eliminate it from your diet. Everyone has the choice.
But don't argue that consuming animal products doesn't contribute towards atherosclerosis, because you're deluding yourself.
You better look at www.heartattackproof.com. Caldwell Esselstyn, who was head of cardiology at the Cleveland Clinic (where heart bypass surgery was invented) and a former surgeon, presents "irrefutable evidence that all CHD can be prevented", or words to that effect. I'm not claiming that you can completely avoid heart disease. Caldwell Esselstyn is. I'm just an idiot wasting some time on a pathetic forum. Dr Esselstyn is the expert with the expert opinion.
Can the esteemed experts of this thread explain exactly why my non drinking, non smoking, vegan ex has it then? And how he can improve his diet in order to cure himself when he already consumes zero animal products? Considering there are no inherited high cholesterol genetic markers anywhere in his family or himself?
The logic of the argument is that ALL CHD can be prevented. The existence of one person - my ex - who has got it - disproves the entire argument.
Who'da thunk it? My ratbag ex being such a special snowflake that he alone disproved one fruitbat theory that he would love to be true.
Theres this little thing called heredity, I know cholesterol can be affected by it. To what extent I don't know, but diet isn't always a cure all for everything. Vegan, Paleo, whatever type of diet, it will not always cure all illness. Can diets that cut out or reduce certain foods aid in prevention of some diseases, sure.0
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