Still think your 1200 or less diet is a good idea?

Those are not examples. They are people that are struggling with their diet for various reasons other than being below a magical caloric number.

Most people don't know how, or understand how to count calories and set macro-nutrient goals.

There are plenty of examples of people successful eating at a steep caloric deficit and losing heaps of fat and getting cut and shredded.

Diet/heath/fitness t is a **** load more complicated than some magical caloric number.

It's actually quite simple. It's just not easy since it does take some dedication and discipline. However, playing the numbers game with calories and exercise isn't difficult considering most of your diet is coming from nutritious foods.

I agree, It's not difficult to find some sort of calculator. It's also not difficult to learn some basics about macro nutrients. It's not difficult to set a reachable goal. People jumping on a VLCD are often in a diet mindset way out in left field. That's why they fail. Their whole approach is bad. I doubt people are tracking their food correctly, and are often eating 2-3x as much as they think.

Does metabolic slowdown happen when on a strict cut? Yep, not but not nearly as much as people think. 1200 calories or below should easily allow for sustained fat loss regardless of some metabolic downturn. Even then, that's easy to come out of. Failure is often not the diets fault, it's often the fault of the dieter.

I've done both eating under 1200 and significantly more than 1200, and lost weight both ways.

However, under 1200, weight loss was painfully slow... so much so that I thought there was something really wrong with me. And it was demoralizing. By the math, I should have been losing 2 pounds a week, and in reality, it was a half pound every other weak. I was tired, cranky, and by the time I got to my goal weight, I was still dissatisfied with my body. Still had muffin top, back fat, huge thighs, etc. More demoralization. It got to the point where I (mistakenly) believed that in order to get thinner, I'd have to cut my calories even MORE, and I just couldn't do it. I honestly decided I'd rather be overweight and eat what I want than skinny and hungry. So I put the weight back on.

Over 1200 (typically 1350-1700 plus exercise calories, or up to 2200+ total), the weight came off as predicted, I was completely satisfied with everything I ate. Still able to fit in pizza at least once a week. Cheeseburgers. Bagels for breakfast almost daily. Pasta, garlic bread, potatoes. Ice cream. Chocolate milk at bedtime every night. And way more than satisfied with the way my body looked and felt. The stereotypical "I'm 40 and in the best shape of my life" infomercial cheese.

And I've been maintaining close to two years.

love it

if you undereat long enough you'll lose weight, I mean people with eating disorders do even the ones that don't purge, such as anorexia restricting type.

Good point. We wouldn't want to spend all this hard work and discipline and end up looking like an anorexic, now would we?

I've been down that road. I was never one of the extreme cases like the pics you see all over the web. Got there and maintained for several years eating under 1200/day. When that was over, I gained weight faster than I ever believed was possible just eating like a normal person, I guess because my body was so unaccustomed to it. It was just STUPID. Not to mention how effed up my mind had to remain for me to keep my focus through the hunger. And, when I regained all the weight I had lost (plus an extra 20 or so), the distribution of it on my body was completely different. When I came to this site and started trying to lose it, hopefully for the last time, my goal all along has been to eat as MUCH as possible and still lose weight. I want to eat right up to the limit where that can happen because I do not ever want to go down that road again.

two wins:this thread and fifth element

At the risk of pissing off some of my friends here...
Why is it so hard to believe that people eat at 1200 calories and are resistant to change this?

Most people came to MFP because they needed a tool to get started. That tool set them at 1200 calories a day. I started off there as well. Over time I made excellent friends who were very tolerant with me during the learning process. There were times where I went back and forth until I finally found a balance between what MFP set for me and my TDEE.

However, telling someone they are wrong and what they are doing is wrong over and over again rarely works. Especially when it is oozing with sarcasm and even disdain at times. People come here and wonder 'hey why should I listen to you? The website that we are all members of and therefore supporting is telling me I should do the exact opposite of what you, a complete stranger is telling me'. I lucked out and found friends that were successful and those are the people I ended up following.
I totally understand the resistance to change because the choir singing the praises of the 'roadmap' approach are not only going against what this whole website is built on, but some of us are doing it with an unnecessary amount of hostility.

I would second BondBomb. I think quite a few MFP members have become reluctant to post to the message boards, because if their opinion differs just slightly from the majority, people seriously jump on them! And the comments can come across as (or are sometimes purposefully) condescending and childishly mean.

Just because someone is new, or takes a different view, doesn't mean they're being stupid or making the 'wrong choices'. Believe it not, not everyone has enough time in the day to look up macros of food, to calculate they're BMR - or realise that MFP's calculation may be inadequate.

I'm just sayin' these boards seem pretty hostile recently, and I've seen more than a few people say the same.

I couldn't personally live on that. I'd eat my own arm in a week.

It is so frustrating when the 1200 calorie defenders seem to never have open diaries. I just want to see what their macros are like . I appreciate that the petite 1200 calorie woman earlier in the thread did leave her diary open. That was refreshing to see.

I am not defending the 1200 way of life, in fact, I can't seem to always stick to it - however, I thought that it was what I was supposed to be doing since it is what MFP put me at.
If I work out, I try to eat protein before and after. I JUST started working out again so I am sure my calorie intake will go up once I change that info.
It just suc*ks because when I was eating more, I was STUCK for years at 150 and feeling like crap.
I think healthy eating, working out and higher, quality calories maybe are the trick.
My diary is open.. and I am open to advice.