Am I being rude by not going to dinner with my family?
Replies
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I am confused about your family's statements. I am a Christian and although I CAN eat meat it is perfectly acceptable for me not to eat meat if I don't want to. I don't know of any place in the Bible that says thou must eat meat.
I was thinking the same thing. I eat meat and am a Christian, however I know there is nothing in the Bible that suggests you have to eat meat. Nor is there anything that says I shouldn't. it doesn't mean anything either way spiritually. But that's not the point. Even if the Bible said I was supposed to eat meat, that doesn't mean I should tell you to, because it means nothing to you. I am not holding you submit to my standards, and I feel your family should be mindful of that concept.
I think you and your family have an opportunity to understand each other better. They may have dropped the ball here, but you could still go and make the best of it.0 -
Seriously. Yes, it is rude if you care about family and it's important to your family. They will have salad or spinach or bread some such thing.Do you want to see your family? If so, go. it is a restaurant. There will be sides and salads. I know many vegetarians that go to steakhouses. Don't make a big production out of your food choice.
Are you using being a vegetarian as an excuse to not hang out?
I didn't see this late notice thing. If you already had plans, that's legit but it sounds like you didn't. If the vegetarian thing is the only reason, just go.See, for me it would have been "no I already made plans tonight because I was't aware this was happening so sorry but I can't make it" and I wouldn't feel bad about it at all.0 -
You sound like you have already made up your mind that you don't want to go and are now coming up with excuses that you want people here to validate for you. I have yet to go to a seafood restaurant that did not have veggies, salads and/or baked potatoes. I'm sure there are items on the menu that you could eat.0
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Get over yourself. Im surprised they even considered inviting you. Look up the definition of "Passive-Aggressive"
"Passive-aggressive behavior is behavior that expresses aggression in an indirect, passive way. This includes procrastination, hostile jokes (though jokes in general are recognized as a method of expressing veiled hostility),[citation needed] stubbornness, resentment, sullenness, or deliberate/repeated failure to accomplish requested tasks for which one is (often explicitly) responsible." - Wikipedia
I couldn't care less what they eat. When I heard a couple of weeks ago that they were going to a fish restaurant (I wasn't invited at the time) I thought nothing of it. I don't care if my family or anyone else eats meat. I choose not to.
There was no procrastination, I gave an immediate answer, and then second-guessed myself. I've made no hostile jokes, I'm not being stubborn (or I wouldn't have looked up the menu and then spent over an hour trying to find a review from someone who had found something non-fish to eat there). I don't resent them and I'm not sullen. Going to a dinner I was invited to with only a couple of hours notice when everyone else knew and had given answers a few weeks in advance is not a task I was assigned, nor is it one for which I'm responsible.
How am I being passive-aggressive?0 -
You procrastinated by not making a decision for the whole morning, you sound like you resent their not inviting you a few weeks ago and you sound rather stubborn and sullen so....procrastination, stubbornness, resentment, sullenness
If you hate your family and don't want to spend time with them, fine. You may regret that one day but it's up to you.
But this is not about whether the stupid fish place has any french fries or salad or vegetarian friendly options.0 -
I don't think it's rude by not going. I am so grateful my family doesn't suck ie call me rude for not being able to go to dinner one time. What a hassle. Ultimately it's your choice and you can think of it like this: which will get cause you more grief - going and dealing with family commenting on your dinner choice or not going and then commenting to you later on your absence.0
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I am confused about your family's statements. I am a Christian and although I CAN eat meat it is perfectly acceptable for me not to eat meat if I don't want to. I don't know of any place in the Bible that says thou must eat meat.
I was thinking the same thing. I eat meat and am a Christian, however I know there is nothing in the Bible that suggests you have to eat meat. Nor is there anything that says I shouldn't. it doesn't mean anything either way spiritually. But that's not the point. Even if the Bible said I was supposed to eat meat, that doesn't mean I should tell you to, because it means nothing to you. I am not holding you submit to my standards, and I feel your family should be mindful of that concept.
I think you and your family have an opportunity to understand each other better. They may have dropped the ball here, but you could still go and make the best of it.
Every moving thing that lives shall be food for you. And as I gave you the green plants, I give you everything. - Genesis 9:3
And the Lord spoke to Moses and Aaron, saying to them, “Speak to the people of Israel, saying, These are the living things that you may eat among all the animals that are on the earth. Whatever parts the hoof and is cloven-footed and chews the cud, among the animals, you may eat. Nevertheless, among those that chew the cud or part the hoof, you shall not eat these: The camel, because it chews the cud but does not part the hoof, is unclean to you. And the rock badger, because it chews the cud but does not part the hoof, is unclean to you. ... - from Leviticus are two of the ones, as well as others that they like to reference.
As I'm sure you know, there are many, many, many denominations of Christianity, all of which believe slightly to drastically different things. You may interpret these verses differently from how he does. He interprets them as God wouldn't bother telling us that he provided animals for us to eat nor would he go through the trouble of explaining which are clean to eat and in which conditions if we weren't supposed to eat them, and that's essentially how he presents that in his sermons. It's a bit more complicated than that, of course, but that's the gist of it.0 -
Not rude just selfish, its about the time you spend with your family they WUV yooooo........0
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Is it dinner time yet?0
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No, tell them to F**k off if need be.0
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I think it was just a dumbass person on the phone. You tried to be nice, but you should have told him pescatarian =/= vegeterian.0
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I am confused about your family's statements. I am a Christian and although I CAN eat meat it is perfectly acceptable for me not to eat meat if I don't want to. I don't know of any place in the Bible that says thou must eat meat.
I was thinking the same thing. I eat meat and am a Christian, however I know there is nothing in the Bible that suggests you have to eat meat. Nor is there anything that says I shouldn't. it doesn't mean anything either way spiritually. But that's not the point. Even if the Bible said I was supposed to eat meat, that doesn't mean I should tell you to, because it means nothing to you. I am not holding you submit to my standards, and I feel your family should be mindful of that concept.
I think you and your family have an opportunity to understand each other better. They may have dropped the ball here, but you could still go and make the best of it.
Every moving thing that lives shall be food for you. And as I gave you the green plants, I give you everything. - Genesis 9:3
And the Lord spoke to Moses and Aaron, saying to them, “Speak to the people of Israel, saying, These are the living things that you may eat among all the animals that are on the earth. Whatever parts the hoof and is cloven-footed and chews the cud, among the animals, you may eat. Nevertheless, among those that chew the cud or part the hoof, you shall not eat these: The camel, because it chews the cud but does not part the hoof, is unclean to you. And the rock badger, because it chews the cud but does not part the hoof, is unclean to you. ... - from Leviticus are two of the ones, as well as others that they like to reference.
As I'm sure you know, there are many, many, many denominations of Christianity, all of which believe slightly to drastically different things. You may interpret these verses differently from how he does. He interprets them as God wouldn't bother telling us that he provided animals for us to eat nor would he go through the trouble of explaining which are clean to eat and in which conditions if we weren't supposed to eat them, and that's essentially how he presents that in his sermons. It's a bit more complicated than that, of course, but that's the gist of it.
But again, these are things you may eat, not you must eat. It is forbidding certain types of meat, not telling you that you must eat the others. Secondly, this is old testament and in the new testament it says that nothing provided by God is unclean, so it doesn't really apply here.
I could understand the argument if they were saying you couldn't have something you were eating, but I don't know of anything that says you must eat something (unless you are talking about the host for Catholics receiving communion,)
For the future maybe you can find a couple of verses in the new testament to use to shut down the argument. Or go all of the way back to the garden of Eden and show that they ate the fruits from every tree and (supposedly) didn't eat meat.0 -
Sounds like a non-issue, really... other than to make an excuse to feel righteous indignation about being a vegetarian in an omnivore world even though the OP swears that's not the case. But, whatev.
Also, I could go for some good crab cake sandwiches and hush puppies right about now.
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What? I was a veggie for about 4 years, and frankly this is ridiculous. Fish is not poisonous and it does not violate her religious beliefs. If you don't want to be involved in the purchase of an animal because it goes against your ethics, I totally get that. But being afraid of well-cooked animal material sitting next to your food is orthorexia.
Some members of OP's extended family sound like a huge PITA. There's always the option to quietly opt out of any occasions requiring their presence. (Aside from weddings and funerals.) There's also the option to not so quietly opt out of their presence for the foreseeable future, including weddings and funerals, if need be. But it would be obnoxious to do that today.You sound like a right pain, and a drama queen. You say you don't want the night to be about you but its already all about you, isn't it! Making a drama about not going is making it about you. Show some manners and go, order a fish dish , eat the sides and leave the fish with absolutely no comment to anyone.
if you are going to make a stand on food choices like this you need to find a way to still have some manners and social skills!!!!
I can see you are not, nor have ever been a vegetarian. A true veggie cannot have meat or fish touch their own food.
Watch a veggie at a BBQ and see how they fare for instance. It isn't a matter of just leaving the animal on the plate and not saying anything, the problem comes when the animal has touched the veg, rice, potatoes, fruit etc.0 -
I am confused about your family's statements. I am a Christian and although I CAN eat meat it is perfectly acceptable for me not to eat meat if I don't want to. I don't know of any place in the Bible that says thou must eat meat.
I was thinking the same thing. I eat meat and am a Christian, however I know there is nothing in the Bible that suggests you have to eat meat. Nor is there anything that says I shouldn't. it doesn't mean anything either way spiritually. But that's not the point. Even if the Bible said I was supposed to eat meat, that doesn't mean I should tell you to, because it means nothing to you. I am not holding you submit to my standards, and I feel your family should be mindful of that concept.
I think you and your family have an opportunity to understand each other better. They may have dropped the ball here, but you could still go and make the best of it.
Every moving thing that lives shall be food for you. And as I gave you the green plants, I give you everything. - Genesis 9:3
And the Lord spoke to Moses and Aaron, saying to them, “Speak to the people of Israel, saying, These are the living things that you may eat among all the animals that are on the earth. Whatever parts the hoof and is cloven-footed and chews the cud, among the animals, you may eat. Nevertheless, among those that chew the cud or part the hoof, you shall not eat these: The camel, because it chews the cud but does not part the hoof, is unclean to you. And the rock badger, because it chews the cud but does not part the hoof, is unclean to you. ... - from Leviticus are two of the ones, as well as others that they like to reference.
As I'm sure you know, there are many, many, many denominations of Christianity, all of which believe slightly to drastically different things. You may interpret these verses differently from how he does. He interprets them as God wouldn't bother telling us that he provided animals for us to eat nor would he go through the trouble of explaining which are clean to eat and in which conditions if we weren't supposed to eat them, and that's essentially how he presents that in his sermons. It's a bit more complicated than that, of course, but that's the gist of it.
That's not saying you must eat meat, it's saying it's ok to eat meat if you want to.0 -
Your "uncle's girlfriend's dad"? That's a pretty attenuated relationship. I wouldn't worry about not going, especially since they gave you no notice. I assume you can meet him later.0
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You procrastinated by not making a decision for the whole morning, you sound like you resent their not inviting you a few weeks ago and you sound rather stubborn and sullen so....procrastination, stubbornness, resentment, sullenness
If you hate your family and don't want to spend time with them, fine. You may regret that one day but it's up to you.
But this is not about whether the stupid fish place has any french fries or salad or vegetarian friendly options.
I initially did make my decision immediately. When my grandfather asked me if I wanted to go, I immediately said "No thanks, it's cool, I'll just find something here," and I hoped everyone would drop it and move on with their day. The no was emotionless and simple. It was only later, after he'd spent the majority of the morning telling me I was being rude for not going, asking me repeatedly why I wasn't going, and pestering me about it that I kind of caved and thought "maybe I should see what they have to offer." I then looked, and couldn't find anything, so I said again "I'd really rather not. Don't worry about it, I'll be fine. I've been looking forward to some alone time. You lot go and have fun," and I meant it. There was no malice behind it. It was straight forward and to the point, but my grandfather and uncle wouldn't just let it die. He (my grandfather) doesn't like that I don't eat meat. He thinks I'm overly picky, and I don't see why he cares what I do and don't eat. He doesn't have to share my meals, nor does he purchase them. My eating this way actually saves him money, and I wish he'd just give it a rest and not huff and roll his eyes when we're all out and I order a veggie patty or something as if asking for a veggie patty is putting the cook out or something to do.
And it's a pretty ridiculous assertion that I hate my family. If I did, I wouldn't be worrying so much that they might perceive my not going as being rude.0 -
At first, I thought you were being silly. Of course you can eat the sides, of course a restaurant can accommodate the needs of a veggie.
But then I read your next update and I realized this isn't *really* about being a veggie, it's about not wanting to spend time with people who you are related to, but who make you feel uncomfortable.
So, my advice is:
Don't go. Don't spend time with anyone who makes you feel bad about yourself and is rude to you. DNA doesn't trump self-dignity. There a whole bunch of people with whom I share DNA, but that make me feel bad. They don't get ANY of my time.
Life is short.
Don't waste it by doing stuff you don't want to do, with people who make you feel bad, whether you are related to them or not.
^^ THIS ^^
I roll with some vegans - we somehow manage to get through a meal in public without drama. But if I were facing not only badgering about my dietary choices but my spirituality and the sheer RUDENESS of being invited as an afterthought? Hun, you get a pass from me. You can meet 'em at the wedding.0 -
That's not saying you must eat meat, it's saying it's ok to eat meat if you want to.
That's not how he interprets it, and I'm not a Christian, so I don't really have a personal interpretation, myself.0 -
The way of the 16-year-old: "Sorry, I already ate. I'll just have a coffee. Doesn't <uncle's girlfriend-or-better> look lovely today?"0
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I'm a Christian and here's what I would do:
1. Eat something before you go, but leave a little room just in case they actually do have food that doesn't have fish in it. You might get there and discover their menu has stuff you can eat. If so, you can order something and all is well.
2. I'd be dying of curiosity to see their secretive menu. Ask the wait person: "So what do you have that a pure vegetarian can eat?" If they come back with "Vegetarians can eat fish" look them right in the eye and repeat, "So what do you have that a pure vegetarian can eat?" Repeat as many times as necessary until they admit they have nothing.. If they don't have ANYTHING, I'd pull out the righteous indignation card and play it, "What? You've got nothing on the menu for a vegetarian?" Pull out your phone and take pictures of their menu. When you get home, go back to the restaurant review sites you visited doing your initial research and post your findings.
3. If you start getting the third degree from the preachers about not eating meat, if you feel up to it, ask them why God forbade pre-Noahic humanity from eating meat. Variation on this theme: Explain (humorously, as your preacher friends know better) that you are going back to the simplicity of Genesis and the garden of Eden and only eat vegetables. (I can't see them haranguing you about that!)
4. If they absolutely don't have ANYTHING without fish in it, have a dessert. No way do they have fish in desserts. If they have fish in all their desserts, play the righteous indignation card again.0 -
Uncle's girlfriend's Dad? Nah if it was like a long lost family member than yes, but who is this person to you. I still think you would have options, but dont see the importance of the dinner.
Oops didnt read the proposal part...yeah you better go eat before dinner and then just get a house salad. No meat or cheese. Oil/vinegar dressing.0 -
Go and jokingly order the camel and rock badger stew loud enough for your uncle to hear. They won't care what you really order after that one.0
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Not rude just selfish, its about the time you spend with your family they WUV yooooo........
I usually go when the family gets together. Everyone involved, save for the gf's dad, was there last week when we all went to lunch. It wasn't a problem, and we went to a steakhouse. I didn't create a topic about that because it wasn't a problem then in those circumstances.
If I'd known that all this was going to happen today, I would've just called in to work and asked them if they needed an extra hand so I could have a legit and graceful excuse not to go - "sorry, have to work."0 -
I don't think it's rude to turn them down. And, as someone with a gluten and soy intolerance, I know what a pain it is to go to a restaurant and ask a bunch of annoying questions about food preparation and ingredients.
And it's very unpleasant to sit at a table of people eating around you and not eat yourself. Even if there's a reason for it, it sets that person apart from the rest of the group.Family is overrated. Never put family before your ethics. If they don't tolerate you, don't tolerate them.
(Related to similar christian obnoxiousness)
To TurnipTorado: So it's okay to stop tolerating the intolerant, right? What exactly is intolerance anyway? Are you confusing it with disapproval? Judgment? Relationships are teeming with disapproval and judgement by the way, and also arguments, and the need for compromise, understanding, and to better ourselves. I don't know you all that well, but your ethics may be an excuse to be petulant and rebellious against those who want the best for you. You don't have to agree with them, but you should show them respect.
If you come from an abusive family, I support your need to get away from them. If you come from a family that sometimes offends you, you are luckier than you think. Living in the absence of judgement or expectations is a lot lonelier than people realize.0 -
I'm a Christian and here's what I would do:
1. Eat something before you go, but leave a little room just in case they actually do have food that doesn't have fish in it. You might get there and discover their menu has stuff you can eat. If so, you can order something and all is well.
2. I'd be dying of curiosity to see their secretive menu. Ask the wait person: "So what do you have that a pure vegetarian can eat?" If they come back with "Vegetarians can eat fish" look them right in the eye and repeat, "So what do you have that a pure vegetarian can eat?" Repeat as many times as necessary until they admit they have nothing.. If they don't have ANYTHING, I'd pull out the righteous indignation card and play it, "What? You've got nothing on the menu for a vegetarian?" Pull out your phone and take pictures of their menu. When you get home, go back to the restaurant review sites you visited doing your initial research and post your findings.
3. If you start getting the third degree from the preachers about not eating meat, if you feel up to it, ask them why God forbade pre-Noahic humanity from eating meat. Variation on this theme: Explain (humorously, as your preacher friends know better) that you are going back to the simplicity of Genesis and the garden of Eden and only eat vegetables. (I can't see them haranguing you about that!)
4. If they absolutely don't have ANYTHING without fish in it, have a dessert. No way do they have fish in desserts. If they have fish in all their desserts, play the righteous indignation card again.
lol I've said similar things to 3 before, actually.
ETA: They just left, I didn't go.
I'm staying in and making a hairstick for her like the one of mine she liked and borrowed, but wished was a different colour to match a certain dress she has, and making it in red, like she wished mine had been.0 -
So... Is dinner over yet? And this is now a non-issue?0
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I don't find it rude. You are a 24 year old adult. Do what you feel like you need to do.
THIS! if they REALLY wanted you to go they would have made it so you could eat. (or at least thats what my family does when we go out)0 -
So... Is dinner over yet? And this is now a non-issue?
I won't know if my grandfather's still upset with me until tonight or tomorrow morning... And they're not at the restaurant yet, the reservation's not for another half hour, they may or may not all come back here after dinner, so only time will tell.0 -
What on earth you do not have to eat meat to be a christian -.- thats ridiculous just go and order steamed veggies if you seriously dont want to deal with the headache then grow a pair and tell your family why you dont want to goz0
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